The first mode is also useful even if one Knight Exemplar is aboard.
Please elaborate on this. If you're going to use Valorous Stance to protect the one Knight Exemplar that isn't indestructible, I still would argue for using Brave the Elements or one of the other "protection from color" spells instead. Brave the Elements and similar spells cost 1 mana, while Valorour Stance costs 2 mana.
Did you have another reason you want to use Valorous Stance when only one Knight Exemplar is on your board?
I'm not suggesting Valorous Stance as a replacement for Brave the Elements. Someone suggested Knight Exemplar made the first mode of Valorous Stance irrelevant; that's not the case because a single Exemplar is not indestructible.
The second mode makes the thing more palatable than a generic protection spell. I'm sure I'll give it a try in the side-board at least and I may very well test a copy or two main-deck.
Brave the Elements and similar spells are also useless against things like Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle as well as any artifact or colorless creature. Apostle's Blessing works against the artifacts but none of the one-cmc spells do.
Personally, I use Brave the Elements more to get damage through than to protect creatures so these cards aren't meant to be used in exactly the same way.
I would say Valorous Stance has some versatility over it, since it can serve as a protection spell against non-exile spells/effects or be used as a limited removal spell - so I guess it is a trade off between choosing a spell with more versatility or having a more focused solution.
I would say Valorous Stance has some versatility over it, since it can serve as a protection spell against non-exile spells/effects or be used as a limited removal spell - so I guess it is a trade off between choosing a spell with more versatility or having a more focused solution.
I was also concerned about the mana trade-off too. Sure, Apostle's Blessing and Valorous Stance have their uses, but I don't think it is worth main-boarding in most metas. If the local meta is heavy on artifact damage, or non-exile spells and effects, then those cards have their uses. If it's colored non-exile damage or destroy effects, Brave the Elements and other 1-mana spells work great. I am not sure what artifact can cause damage that Apostle's Blessing is needed (Tron?). As for Valukut, that's a land, so I don't know of any protection spell that would protect against that. You'd have to prevent the damage instead.
Lastly, using Thalia main-deck (which someone was asking) is a factor too. Your 2-mana Valorous Stance now costs 3 versus 2-mana Brave the Elements. That "tempo" is important too.
A factor in favor of more removal these days is the proliferation of Siege Rhino. Trample is bad news. The only question in my mind is what's the next best removal spell. A removal spell that doubles as a protection spell is doubly appealing and can be used in more match-ups. Valorous Stance is certainly worth testing.
Too bad he was not a knight or else it would have been easier to include him in the deck. However there was a discussion much earlier on Puresteel Knights variants centered around Puresteel Paladin that could have used Porcelain Legionnaire due to its card type helping to achieve metacraft.
R1: Delver (2-0)
Dude seemed like he was either new or a bit out of it. In any case, I never saw a counterspell, and got a T1 Vial both games. It's worth mentioning that I had 2 paths in hand in G1, and decided not to path his pyromancer, as I was suspecting an exarch-twin, and because I had first strikers on the board. Needless to say, he didn't do much.
R2: Cruel Control (2-0)
His deck was really slow. Noteable memory was where he snapcaster'ed his Termniate to kill my Exemplar in response to a sword equip, which I responded to by vialing in another Exemplar.
R3: Hatebears (2-0)
First strikers are pretty good against weenies. Student really got him good, and I had a Path for his Hero of Bladehold in both games.
R4: Merfolk (2-0)
G1, he uses Spreading Seas on two of my lands, but luckily I had an early Vial to get my guys out. G2 was pretty crazy - I kept an one-lander, and ended up with an island and three Vials on the board. He cast double Master of Waves for seven tokens, but luckily, I topdecked a plains to cast Brave the Elements, and attack for the win. Dude seemed pretty salty about not winning, and made me announce all the steps of combat and priority.
R5: Abzan Midrange (1-2) Siege Rhinos are a mess. I won game 1 off of getting all of the lategame (Two Hero of Bladehold and three Elspeth, Knight-Errant. Game 2 and 3, his Lingering Souls blocked somewhere around 20 damage in each game. Relic of Progenitus did some work in G3 against his goyfs, but he had a Batterskull, and I couldn't deal with a 5/5 flying, lifelink, vigilance Spirit token. Saw no Mirran Crusaders in either game.
Memoriable quote from the player next to me: "You're 4-0? Haven't faced up against combo yet?"
R6: Ad Nauseam (0-2)
G1, he gets Lotus Bloom and stuff, and I couldn't kill him anywhere fast enough. G2, I mull to 5, see no SB-cards, and lose T4. He was a pretty cool guy though, we had some fun.
Observations:
I won three or four games, in which I kept an one-lander, simply because of Vial. Card is the nuts. Knight Exemplar sticks more often than one would believe.
I'm going to finally succumb and play Thalia, Guardian of Thraben mainboard. Card is just too good, even if it's not a knight. Relic of Progenitus is probably gonna take the spot of Rest in Peace in my SB. I want the card in in way more MUs, because it cycles itself.
Combo is an auto-loss as always. I'll have to spend some money on Leyline of Sanctity. Any other recommendations against combo decks of any kind?
I want to try out Mana Tithe. I think it could be good, but it would need to be sided out after the opponent sees it once. Lightning Greaves did some major work last FNM because all the decks had red in them, but it didn't next to nothing this once - Granted, I only drew it twice. I'll probably keep it in the SB. Still testing.
They left out the part where Yawgmoth is resurrected,but has been cleansed as Yawgmoth the Redeemed,and now must awaken Chromium so that Karn can fuse with him and create what can only be known as : the ultimate taco.
Combo is an auto-loss as always. I'll have to spend some money on Leyline of Sanctity. Any other recommendations against combo decks of any kind?
Mono-W hasn't the greatest selection of tools for combating combo. Aven Mindcensor is one of the best; obviously not a knight. Neither is Leonin Arbiter.
Stave Off is actually anti-Twin tech; we don't have a Twin player so I've not tried it.
Angel's Grace can sometimes beat combo decks by buying you an extra turn. I suppose Silence can basically do the same thing.
Spellskite can beat Twin, Boggles, and can help against other combo decks such as Scapeshift. A U splash would make it more effective.
Celestial Purge is good against Twin as well and Worship can beat some decks as well. Worship is probably too slow for most combo, but maybe not for Scapeshift or Tron.
Mana Tithe is amazing. I recommend 2-3 of it maindeck. They don't necessarily need to be sided out, as the opponent may or may not play around it. As even a player playing it is unlikely to run a full set (or even 3, it's a high number, but they work well in multiples, so...), it's almost always correct to not play around it, as against a Knights deck tempo is crucial. My best advice is to run a good amount of 1 mana instants, like path and brave, then, showing your 1 untapped plains is not a telegraph saying "hey, I have tithe here!". And even if they play around it, your tempo gain is well worth it. Playing around both path, brave and tithe can be really difficult (I like to include harm's way as well, it really screws Red). My actual instants distribution is 3 Path to Exile, 3 Brave the Elements, 3 Harm's Way and 2 Mana Tithe.
One could simply try playing Nevermore for Combo. Name one of their pieces.. if it sticks then well.. ya..
Here's my MB. I havn't posted in a while. I've been working on getting the pieces to make my deck more competitive. Tested a few rounds last night and I must say, Aether Vial is a helluva card. And so is Baneslayer Angel. I love having her at my top end, and shes just a personal favorite.
Looks pretty good! How useful has Noble Hierarch been? I don't run a G/W knights list myself but she seems a little less relevant here since you aren't necessarily racing for that 3cmc sweet spot on turn 2 (as you would in a junk/hatebears list). This is just an initial observation, but I would consider dropping them and running a few Qasali Pridemage instead. You get the added versatility of artifact / enchant removal (which can be a game-changer against many top-tier decks today), you could add another knight (you probably only need two Pridemages) and you have further synergy with Brave the Elements, Honor of the Pure and even Aether Vial for surprise blocks/removal. Only suggesting this because you already have a solid manabase and 4 vials. A Hierarch also isn't that ideal to draw later on.
My suggestion is to try cutting the Hierarchs and instead running 2 Pridemage, and 1 Knight of the White Orchid. You may even be able to swing 20 land and run 2 Orchid, although this approach is a little more ambitious.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard WRG Naya Blitz WR Boros Aggro W White Lightning
Modern W Death and Taxes WKnights R Red Deck Wins RG Zoo WG Hatebears WG Aura Hexproof WU Luminarch Ascension WB Tokens WUB Esper Control
'Tact' is the art of making a point without making an enemy. - Sir Isaac Newton
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
Combo is an auto-loss as always. I'll have to spend some money on Leyline of Sanctity. Any other recommendations against combo decks of any kind?
A lot of anti-combo cards have been mentioned, but these are my all-stars that have saved the day again and again:
Disenchant - classic removal and still as reliable as ever. It has saved me countless times. I now run 3 at any given time (and usually keep one Leonin Relic-Warder in the main). I find this usually provides the right number I am after. If you can run Sundering Growth even better, but I wouldn't count on it if you are using Cavern.
Pithing Needle - you're already using it, so hats off right there. Remember it can name planeswalkers, combo pieces, artifacts, etc. When facing twin, remember not to name Splinter Twin itself but instead its targets.
Celestial Purge - I run one of these in the side. I always seem to find games where I can side it in. It even takes out Siege Rhino. So many great permanents that have a red or black splash these days.
Rest in Peace - Its purpose is removing the concept of a graveyard from the game. Cards are simply gone, and graveyard/death triggers don't active. This is the best defense against the Delve mechanic and it hits storm + loam pretty good too. With Treasure Cruise and Dig Through Time finally banned, though, Relic of Progenitus may be the more economical card for dealing with Snapcaster.
Spellskite - As pzbw7z already mentioned, this is a great all-around card. Stops numerous combo engines.
You already seem aware of other anti-top tier cards (Kataki, Canonist, etc..)
Some other considerations:
Nevermore - Slow, but it obviously works. Colours black and red have literally 0 response to deal with enchantments.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben - You need to run at least 3. She is most relevant if you are pushing for an aggro win.
Surgical Extraction - Obviously is an anti-combo card, but you have the added challenge of getting a combo piece into the grave first. More relevant with discard to help you out.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard WRG Naya Blitz WR Boros Aggro W White Lightning
Modern W Death and Taxes WKnights R Red Deck Wins RG Zoo WG Hatebears WG Aura Hexproof WU Luminarch Ascension WB Tokens WUB Esper Control
'Tact' is the art of making a point without making an enemy. - Sir Isaac Newton
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
Thanks for the suggestions, I haven't had time to test the deck in an actual fight, I may just keep 1 Noble and put in 2 Pridemages, thus far from testing I find the exhalted to be pretty relevant in combat a lot of the times. In fact I thought about adding Mutagenic Growth / Rancor but I'm not sure if it's a good idea.
I have Rancor as a 1-of in the maindeck to push a large Knight of the Reliquary through. I think Rancor is especially relevant if you use Exalted cards, since the opponent could conceivably just chump block one of your solitary Knights attacking with Exalted.
I like to use Rancor too, the trample works well with a buffed up Knight of Reliquary and also with lifelink, I could get plenty of life quickly, usually putting those decks working on a clock out of range. Additionally, the +2 power to a first strike creature makes it difficult for opponents to combat block, as knights typically have first strike.
I'm trying to figure out which to add to my knights deck: mirran crusader or silverblade. I am aware of the pros and cons of both such as how silverblade can make other creatures such my knight of meadowgrain to proc twice due to doublestrike. That allows the deck to have a faster clock. However, I'm also all to familiar with the weaknesses of soulbond and have lost many combat phases due to a well-timed removal spell. Mirran crusader is said to be more resilient to removal while also having the advantage of having doublestrike initially, which silverblade doesn't. When facing an unknown meta, which is the better choice?
I'm trying to figure out which to add to my knights deck: mirran crusader or silverblade. I am aware of the pros and cons of both such as how silverblade can make other creatures such my knight of meadowgrain to proc twice due to doublestrike. That allows the deck to have a faster clock. However, I'm also all to familiar with the weaknesses of soulbond and have lost many combat phases due to a well-timed removal spell. Mirran crusader is said to be more resilient to removal while also having the advantage of having doublestrike initially, which silverblade doesn't. When facing an unknown meta, which is the better choice?
I'm trying to figure out which to add to my knights deck: mirran crusader or silverblade. . .
With the popularity of GBx these days, Mirran Crusader has to be available in one's 75. If it's one or the other, I'd go with Crusader.
I gotta go with pzbw7z too, I prefer Mirran Crusader usually, even in an unknown meta. And especially since GBx is popular recently, Mirran Crusader's protection is more relevant than ever.
Game 1: I got pissed off because I took out from my SB this morning 2x Rest in peace. But is was quite funny, because even cascading into a Living End, he had already killed a few dudes. And he casted Living end two times, and my dudes were just going and coming back. His weak creatures couldnt stand in front of even a single knight equipped.
Game 2: Second turn I casted Chalice of the Void in my first turn for 0 mana, he couldnt do anything.
Second round: Bogles (1-2)
Game 1: He got a slow hand without lifelink and my Crusader finished the game for me (I had a basilisk equipped, so I was gaining some time/life).
Game 2: I had a slow hand, mulligan and got mana screwed. He was fast and he won quickly.
Game 3: He had a huge dude with lifelink (like 18/18) and I got a few dudes on board and a huge crusader (like 8/6 with lifelink). It was funny because we were hitting like almost 20 damage per turn and gaining all life back. I would win next turn (I casted more dudes ftw) and he top decked that aura that gives +1+1 for each aura. I had like 30 life and he hit for 34)
Thir round: Merfolk (1-1-1)
Game 1: T1 Vial followed by a lot of Lords. He won like T4.
Game 2: I side in Disenchant and destroyed his T1 Vial. He was really slow. I smashed him.
Game 3: A reaaaaally long match. He had sided in lots of Vapor Snag and Echoing Truth, returning my attacking equipped dudes all the time, what delayed me a lot and gave him some time. He casted the master of waves for a lot of tokens, the time went out and we couldnt finish the game.
Game 2: Had to mulligan and got a slow hand. He got a fast hand, 2 enchants and like T4-5 he assembled the combo and I took 429842949 damage.
Game 3: He almost assembled the combo, but failed. We were both on topdeck and I got a O-Naginata FTW.
General comments: Im pretty happy with the deck. Puresteel Paladin draw engine and metalcraft is simply nuts. After G1 he was always a target of removal whenever possible. Knight of the White Orchid never helped me out, he all matches was a 2/2 first strike dude. Knight of Meadowgrain is amazing, I won several matches because of her and of crusade. I never drew Godsend but I would rather cast a 3cmc dude than it. I usually dont have spare mana for it. The swords are great, but sometimes it get stuck on my hand. Steelshaper's Gift is awesome and I think 2 is the right number.
Game 1: I got pissed off because I took out from my SB this morning 2x Rest in peace. But is was quite funny, because even cascading into a Living End, he had already killed a few dudes. And he casted Living end two times, and my dudes were just going and coming back. His weak creatures couldnt stand in front of even a single knight equipped.
Game 2: Second turn I casted Chalice of the Void in my first turn for 0 mana, he couldnt do anything.
Second round: Bogles (1-2)
Game 1: He got a slow hand without lifelink and my Crusader finished the game for me (I had a basilisk equipped, so I was gaining some time/life).
Game 2: I had a slow hand, mulligan and got mana screwed. He was fast and he won quickly.
Game 3: He had a huge dude with lifelink (like 18/18) and I got a few dudes on board and a huge crusader (like 8/6 with lifelink). It was funny because we were hitting like almost 20 damage per turn and gaining all life back. I would win next turn (I casted more dudes ftw) and he top decked that aura that gives +1+1 for each aura. I had like 30 life and he hit for 34)
Thir round: Merfolk (1-1-1)
Game 1: T1 Vial followed by a lot of Lords. He won like T4.
Game 2: I side in Disenchant and destroyed his T1 Vial. He was really slow. I smashed him.
Game 3: A reaaaaally long match. He had sided in lots of Vapor Snag and Echoing Truth, returning my attacking equipped dudes all the time, what delayed me a lot and gave him some time. He casted the master of waves for a lot of tokens, the time went out and we couldnt finish the game.
Game 2: Had to mulligan and got a slow hand. He got a fast hand, 2 enchants and like T4-5 he assembled the combo and I took 429842949 damage.
Game 3: He almost assembled the combo, but failed. We were both on topdeck and I got a O-Naginata FTW.
General comments: Im pretty happy with the deck. Puresteel Paladin draw engine and metalcraft is simply nuts. After G1 he was always a target of removal whenever possible. Knight of the White Orchid never helped me out, he all matches was a 2/2 first strike dude. Knight of Meadowgrain is amazing, I won several matches because of her and of crusade. I never drew Godsend but I would rather cast a 3cmc dude than it. I usually dont have spare mana for it. The swords are great, but sometimes it get stuck on my hand. Steelshaper's Gift is awesome and I think 2 is the right number.
PS: I know that Stony Silence ruin my artifact based build, but affinity scares me. And it may lock their game.
Nice run! I have won Living End matches the same way you have -- all you have to do is pace yourself. Nice job using Chalice of the Void.
I have a few questions/suggestions for your deck:
1. How has Bladed Bracers worked for you? It seems largely overlooked but would work well here as an enabler for O-Naginata. Too bad it doesn't put your creatures out of bolt-range.
--
2. Do you find Student to be a little mana-intensive in this [puresteel] deck? It seems you will almost always have something to play instead of leveling him. With 4 Students AND 4 Caverns, there is also a bit of a level-up liability IMO.
--
3. I would recommend subbing out 2 Crusaders for 2 Fiendslayer Paladin. UR may be dented a bit with Treasure Cruise and Dig through Time being banned, but Lightning Bolt is still the most-played spell in modern.
--
4. I know you are thinking of cutting Knight of the White Orchid. My advice: don't. You may not have had a game during these matches were his ability triggered, but you WILL have later matches where you pray to draw him or drop him on T2-T3 for that extra land to set you ahead. This is not to mention the early game ramp combo of Path + Orchid.
--
5. Don't use Stony Silence in your SB. It neuters half of your deck. Instead, load up on Disenchant and run 4. You won't regret doing this. Not only does it help solve affinity matches but it gives you greater odds against combo and control decks. It is very reliable spot removal, and relevant in probably 50-70% of all games you play.
--
6. Finally, if you are having trouble targeting your creatures with equipment (i.e. bolt), consider loading up on creatures with colour protection or bolt/destroy resilience. Fiendslayer Paladin and Knight of the Holy Nimbus are both humans, while Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers (or Brimaz, King of Oreskos if you have the funds) is just a solid creature.
Good call on taking out Godsend. It's cool as hell but far too cumbersome for any sort of competitive play. I think another Basilisk Collar would be a good choice. OHKOing anything your opponent throws at you with first strike + deathtouch is just too good to pass up.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard WRG Naya Blitz WR Boros Aggro W White Lightning
Modern W Death and Taxes WKnights R Red Deck Wins RG Zoo WG Hatebears WG Aura Hexproof WU Luminarch Ascension WB Tokens WUB Esper Control
'Tact' is the art of making a point without making an enemy. - Sir Isaac Newton
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
1) I havent faced any Burn on that day, so no bolt-range for me Usually u get a lot of artifacts on one dude and attack, but is nice when u have a blocker the same way. Some matches I really wish I draw one, sometimes not. I think Im gonna keep only one MB.
2) Agree with you. The decks I faced Student was a star, because he is fast, and against combo it is the way for the win. Depending of the match, I take 1-2 of him SB, like burn (if I level up him, he will die anyway). So Im gonna keep 4of MB, but sometimes he will be the first to go out of the deck.
3) Crusader can finish several matches, while Paladin is too specific and only "good". Im gonna try 1of MB and see what happens.
4) You cannot cast him T2 unless you cast a Path before. I was thinking the same of you, it is a great card, combo with path and blabla. First, I keep path to strong threats, so not often I cast it soon (and to have Path, White Orchid AND an early threat is too situational). Second, if everything is perfect, I cast him T2, put a land on BF, put another from my hand, and so I have 2 open lands, while I could have 3 open lands and cast something more cool, like Knight Exemplar, Puresteel Paladin + 1cmc artifact and so on. Really, we need to be fast, to have more small dudes on board on this build wont help that much.
5) Agree
6) I have Knight of the Holy Nimbus but the lack of first strike is what dont let me use him. Im gonna try 1of Brimaz and 1of Paladin.
7) I realised that 3 Steelshaper's Gift maybe a good call, Im gonna give it a try.
Thx for the feedback! Here is my updated list (Im gonna give a try to Worship. Most of decks simply dont have the answer to it, a 4cmc enchant, and a lot of my dudes (will)have protection)
Im new to playing Knights tomorrow will be my 3rd time playing knights and modern. Need some sideboard help. These are the decks i have played against so far
UR Delver
UWR Control
Storm
BW Tron
RG Tron
Im new to playing Knights tomorrow will be my 3rd time playing knights and modern. Need some sideboard help. These are the decks i have played against so far
UR Delver
UWR Control
Storm
BW Tron
RG Tron
Some sideboard suggestions (not an exhaustive list):
You can sometimes gang up with first strikers to defend against a wurmcoil (stop from attacking), and Basilisk Collar is amazing here (with first strike). Use of flyers, i.e. Leonin Skyhunter are great in these gridlocks, especially for Sword connections.
I'm not suggesting Valorous Stance as a replacement for Brave the Elements. Someone suggested Knight Exemplar made the first mode of Valorous Stance irrelevant; that's not the case because a single Exemplar is not indestructible.
The second mode makes the thing more palatable than a generic protection spell. I'm sure I'll give it a try in the side-board at least and I may very well test a copy or two main-deck.
Brave the Elements and similar spells are also useless against things like Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle as well as any artifact or colorless creature. Apostle's Blessing works against the artifacts but none of the one-cmc spells do.
Personally, I use Brave the Elements more to get damage through than to protect creatures so these cards aren't meant to be used in exactly the same way.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I was also concerned about the mana trade-off too. Sure, Apostle's Blessing and Valorous Stance have their uses, but I don't think it is worth main-boarding in most metas. If the local meta is heavy on artifact damage, or non-exile spells and effects, then those cards have their uses. If it's colored non-exile damage or destroy effects, Brave the Elements and other 1-mana spells work great. I am not sure what artifact can cause damage that Apostle's Blessing is needed (Tron?). As for Valukut, that's a land, so I don't know of any protection spell that would protect against that. You'd have to prevent the damage instead.
Lastly, using Thalia main-deck (which someone was asking) is a factor too. Your 2-mana Valorous Stance now costs 3 versus 2-mana Brave the Elements. That "tempo" is important too.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
I haven't really posted much in this thread lately, because honestly, I haven't really seen anything significant to add to this deck since [NPH] outside of the occasional sideboard tech (Stony Silence, Renounce the Guilds, Rest in Peace, Blind Obedience, Grafdigger's Cage) or fringe playable creature (Silverblade Paladin and Fiendslayer Paladin) -- and even a good chunk of those are a stretch. Someday they'll throw us a bone!
He is a soldier, not a knight ... and we have much better dudes to work out with
Too bad he was not a knight or else it would have been easier to include him in the deck. However there was a discussion much earlier on Puresteel Knights variants centered around Puresteel Paladin that could have used Porcelain Legionnaire due to its card type helping to achieve metacraft.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
4 Student of Warfare
4 Knight of Meadowgrain
4 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Mirran Crusader
2 Hero of Bladehold
Noncreature
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
2 Brave the Elements
1 Lightning Greaves
2 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
3 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 Mutavault
2 Cavern of Souls
17 Plains
2 Pithing Needle
1 Relic of Progenitus
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Rest in Peace
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Hushwing Gryff
R1: Delver (2-0)
Dude seemed like he was either new or a bit out of it. In any case, I never saw a counterspell, and got a T1 Vial both games. It's worth mentioning that I had 2 paths in hand in G1, and decided not to path his pyromancer, as I was suspecting an exarch-twin, and because I had first strikers on the board. Needless to say, he didn't do much.
R2: Cruel Control (2-0)
His deck was really slow. Noteable memory was where he snapcaster'ed his Termniate to kill my Exemplar in response to a sword equip, which I responded to by vialing in another Exemplar.
R3: Hatebears (2-0)
First strikers are pretty good against weenies. Student really got him good, and I had a Path for his Hero of Bladehold in both games.
R4: Merfolk (2-0)
G1, he uses Spreading Seas on two of my lands, but luckily I had an early Vial to get my guys out. G2 was pretty crazy - I kept an one-lander, and ended up with an island and three Vials on the board. He cast double Master of Waves for seven tokens, but luckily, I topdecked a plains to cast Brave the Elements, and attack for the win. Dude seemed pretty salty about not winning, and made me announce all the steps of combat and priority.
R5: Abzan Midrange (1-2)
Siege Rhinos are a mess. I won game 1 off of getting all of the lategame (Two Hero of Bladehold and three Elspeth, Knight-Errant. Game 2 and 3, his Lingering Souls blocked somewhere around 20 damage in each game. Relic of Progenitus did some work in G3 against his goyfs, but he had a Batterskull, and I couldn't deal with a 5/5 flying, lifelink, vigilance Spirit token. Saw no Mirran Crusaders in either game.
Memoriable quote from the player next to me: "You're 4-0? Haven't faced up against combo yet?"
R6: Ad Nauseam (0-2)
G1, he gets Lotus Bloom and stuff, and I couldn't kill him anywhere fast enough. G2, I mull to 5, see no SB-cards, and lose T4. He was a pretty cool guy though, we had some fun.
Observations:
I won three or four games, in which I kept an one-lander, simply because of Vial. Card is the nuts.
Knight Exemplar sticks more often than one would believe.
I'm going to finally succumb and play Thalia, Guardian of Thraben mainboard. Card is just too good, even if it's not a knight.
Relic of Progenitus is probably gonna take the spot of Rest in Peace in my SB. I want the card in in way more MUs, because it cycles itself.
Combo is an auto-loss as always. I'll have to spend some money on Leyline of Sanctity. Any other recommendations against combo decks of any kind?
I want to try out Mana Tithe. I think it could be good, but it would need to be sided out after the opponent sees it once.
Lightning Greaves did some major work last FNM because all the decks had red in them, but it didn't next to nothing this once - Granted, I only drew it twice. I'll probably keep it in the SB. Still testing.
Mono-W hasn't the greatest selection of tools for combating combo. Aven Mindcensor is one of the best; obviously not a knight. Neither is Leonin Arbiter.
Stave Off is actually anti-Twin tech; we don't have a Twin player so I've not tried it.
Angel's Grace can sometimes beat combo decks by buying you an extra turn. I suppose Silence can basically do the same thing.
Ghost Quarter or Tectonic Edge have some anti-combo value.
Spellskite can beat Twin, Boggles, and can help against other combo decks such as Scapeshift. A U splash would make it more effective.
Celestial Purge is good against Twin as well and Worship can beat some decks as well. Worship is probably too slow for most combo, but maybe not for Scapeshift or Tron.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Here's my MB. I havn't posted in a while. I've been working on getting the pieces to make my deck more competitive. Tested a few rounds last night and I must say, Aether Vial is a helluva card. And so is Baneslayer Angel. I love having her at my top end, and shes just a personal favorite.
4 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Knight of Meadowgrain
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Mirran Crusader
3 Hero of Bladehold
1 Baneslayer Angel
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
3 Honor of the Pure
3 Path to Exile
3 Brave the Elements
3 Aether Vial
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Cavern of Souls
2 Windswept Heath
17 Plains
15 TBD
I'll be playing this at my next Modern queue.
3x Fiendslayer Paladin
4x Knight Exemplar
4x Knight of Meadowgrain
3x Knight of the Reliquary
3x Leonin Skyhunter
3x Noble Hierarch
4x Student of Warfare
Enchantment (2)
2x Honor of the Pure
Planeswalker (2)
2x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2x Arid Mesa
4x Cavern of Souls
2x Horizon Canopy
4x Marsh Flats
3x Plains
2x Temple Garden
4x Windswept Heath
Artifact (4)
4x AEther Vial
Instant (7)
3x Brave the Elements
4x Path to Exile
3x Disenchant
3x Kor Firewalker
2x Mark of Asylum
3x Mirran Crusader
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Wrath of God
RDW
Zoo
CoCo Elves
My suggestion is to try cutting the Hierarchs and instead running 2 Pridemage, and 1 Knight of the White Orchid. You may even be able to swing 20 land and run 2 Orchid, although this approach is a little more ambitious.
WRG Naya Blitz
WR Boros Aggro
W White Lightning
Modern
W Death and Taxes
W Knights
R Red Deck Wins
RG Zoo
WG Hatebears
WG Aura Hexproof
WU Luminarch Ascension
WB Tokens
WUB Esper Control
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
Disenchant - classic removal and still as reliable as ever. It has saved me countless times. I now run 3 at any given time (and usually keep one Leonin Relic-Warder in the main). I find this usually provides the right number I am after. If you can run Sundering Growth even better, but I wouldn't count on it if you are using Cavern.
Pithing Needle - you're already using it, so hats off right there. Remember it can name planeswalkers, combo pieces, artifacts, etc. When facing twin, remember not to name Splinter Twin itself but instead its targets.
Celestial Purge - I run one of these in the side. I always seem to find games where I can side it in. It even takes out Siege Rhino. So many great permanents that have a red or black splash these days.
Rest in Peace - Its purpose is removing the concept of a graveyard from the game. Cards are simply gone, and graveyard/death triggers don't active. This is the best defense against the Delve mechanic and it hits storm + loam pretty good too. With Treasure Cruise and Dig Through Time finally banned, though, Relic of Progenitus may be the more economical card for dealing with Snapcaster.
Spellskite - As pzbw7z already mentioned, this is a great all-around card. Stops numerous combo engines.
You already seem aware of other anti-top tier cards (Kataki, Canonist, etc..)
Some other considerations:
Nevermore - Slow, but it obviously works. Colours black and red have literally 0 response to deal with enchantments.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben - You need to run at least 3. She is most relevant if you are pushing for an aggro win.
Surgical Extraction - Obviously is an anti-combo card, but you have the added challenge of getting a combo piece into the grave first. More relevant with discard to help you out.
WRG Naya Blitz
WR Boros Aggro
W White Lightning
Modern
W Death and Taxes
W Knights
R Red Deck Wins
RG Zoo
WG Hatebears
WG Aura Hexproof
WU Luminarch Ascension
WB Tokens
WUB Esper Control
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
RDW
Zoo
CoCo Elves
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
With the popularity of GBx these days, Mirran Crusader has to be available in one's 75. If it's one or the other, I'd go with Crusader.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
I gotta go with pzbw7z too, I prefer Mirran Crusader usually, even in an unknown meta. And especially since GBx is popular recently, Mirran Crusader's protection is more relevant than ever.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
1x Basilisk Collar
2x Bladed Bracers
3x Bonesplitter
1x Godsend
2x O-Naginata
1x Swiftfoot Boots
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Sword of War and Peace
Instant (4)
4x Path to Exile
4x Knight Exemplar
4x Knight of Meadowgrain
2x Knight of the White Orchid
4x Mirran Crusader
4x Puresteel Paladin
4x Student of Warfare
Land (20)
4x Cavern of Souls
16x Plains
Sorcery (2)
2x Steelshaper's Gift
2x Chalice of the Void
2x Disenchant
2x Ghost Quarter
3x Kor Firewalker
2x Nevermore
1x Pithing Needle
2x Stony Silence
1x Torpor Orb
First round: Living End (2-0)
Game 1: I got pissed off because I took out from my SB this morning 2x Rest in peace. But is was quite funny, because even cascading into a Living End, he had already killed a few dudes. And he casted Living end two times, and my dudes were just going and coming back. His weak creatures couldnt stand in front of even a single knight equipped.
Game 2: Second turn I casted Chalice of the Void in my first turn for 0 mana, he couldnt do anything.
Second round: Bogles (1-2)
Game 1: He got a slow hand without lifelink and my Crusader finished the game for me (I had a basilisk equipped, so I was gaining some time/life).
Game 2: I had a slow hand, mulligan and got mana screwed. He was fast and he won quickly.
Game 3: He had a huge dude with lifelink (like 18/18) and I got a few dudes on board and a huge crusader (like 8/6 with lifelink). It was funny because we were hitting like almost 20 damage per turn and gaining all life back. I would win next turn (I casted more dudes ftw) and he top decked that aura that gives +1+1 for each aura. I had like 30 life and he hit for 34)
Thir round: Merfolk (1-1-1)
Game 1: T1 Vial followed by a lot of Lords. He won like T4.
Game 2: I side in Disenchant and destroyed his T1 Vial. He was really slow. I smashed him.
Game 3: A reaaaaally long match. He had sided in lots of Vapor Snag and Echoing Truth, returning my attacking equipped dudes all the time, what delayed me a lot and gave him some time. He casted the master of waves for a lot of tokens, the time went out and we couldnt finish the game.
Fourth round: Storm (2-1)
Game 1: I was fast. T1 Student of Warfare, T2 level up, T3 Sword of Fire and Ice, T4 Bonesplitter and T5 for the win. He didnt have enough time to assembly his combo.
Game 2: Had to mulligan and got a slow hand. He got a fast hand, 2 enchants and like T4-5 he assembled the combo and I took 429842949 damage.
Game 3: He almost assembled the combo, but failed. We were both on topdeck and I got a O-Naginata FTW.
General comments: Im pretty happy with the deck. Puresteel Paladin draw engine and metalcraft is simply nuts. After G1 he was always a target of removal whenever possible. Knight of the White Orchid never helped me out, he all matches was a 2/2 first strike dude. Knight of Meadowgrain is amazing, I won several matches because of her and of crusade. I never drew Godsend but I would rather cast a 3cmc dude than it. I usually dont have spare mana for it. The swords are great, but sometimes it get stuck on my hand. Steelshaper's Gift is awesome and I think 2 is the right number.
Resume: Im gonna find out a replacement for Knight of the White Orchid. I have to think about the mana curve, maybe 2x Paladin may help. I think one more Basilisk Collar on place of Godsend
PS: I know that Stony Silence ruin my artifact based build, but affinity scares me. And it may lock their game.
I have a few questions/suggestions for your deck:
1. How has Bladed Bracers worked for you? It seems largely overlooked but would work well here as an enabler for O-Naginata. Too bad it doesn't put your creatures out of bolt-range.
--
2. Do you find Student to be a little mana-intensive in this [puresteel] deck? It seems you will almost always have something to play instead of leveling him. With 4 Students AND 4 Caverns, there is also a bit of a level-up liability IMO.
--
3. I would recommend subbing out 2 Crusaders for 2 Fiendslayer Paladin. UR may be dented a bit with Treasure Cruise and Dig through Time being banned, but Lightning Bolt is still the most-played spell in modern.
--
4. I know you are thinking of cutting Knight of the White Orchid. My advice: don't. You may not have had a game during these matches were his ability triggered, but you WILL have later matches where you pray to draw him or drop him on T2-T3 for that extra land to set you ahead. This is not to mention the early game ramp combo of Path + Orchid.
--
5. Don't use Stony Silence in your SB. It neuters half of your deck. Instead, load up on Disenchant and run 4. You won't regret doing this. Not only does it help solve affinity matches but it gives you greater odds against combo and control decks. It is very reliable spot removal, and relevant in probably 50-70% of all games you play.
--
6. Finally, if you are having trouble targeting your creatures with equipment (i.e. bolt), consider loading up on creatures with colour protection or bolt/destroy resilience. Fiendslayer Paladin and Knight of the Holy Nimbus are both humans, while Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers (or Brimaz, King of Oreskos if you have the funds) is just a solid creature.
Good call on taking out Godsend. It's cool as hell but far too cumbersome for any sort of competitive play. I think another Basilisk Collar would be a good choice. OHKOing anything your opponent throws at you with first strike + deathtouch is just too good to pass up.
WRG Naya Blitz
WR Boros Aggro
W White Lightning
Modern
W Death and Taxes
W Knights
R Red Deck Wins
RG Zoo
WG Hatebears
WG Aura Hexproof
WU Luminarch Ascension
WB Tokens
WUB Esper Control
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
2) Agree with you. The decks I faced Student was a star, because he is fast, and against combo it is the way for the win. Depending of the match, I take 1-2 of him SB, like burn (if I level up him, he will die anyway). So Im gonna keep 4of MB, but sometimes he will be the first to go out of the deck.
3) Crusader can finish several matches, while Paladin is too specific and only "good". Im gonna try 1of MB and see what happens.
4) You cannot cast him T2 unless you cast a Path before. I was thinking the same of you, it is a great card, combo with path and blabla. First, I keep path to strong threats, so not often I cast it soon (and to have Path, White Orchid AND an early threat is too situational). Second, if everything is perfect, I cast him T2, put a land on BF, put another from my hand, and so I have 2 open lands, while I could have 3 open lands and cast something more cool, like Knight Exemplar, Puresteel Paladin + 1cmc artifact and so on. Really, we need to be fast, to have more small dudes on board on this build wont help that much.
5) Agree
6) I have Knight of the Holy Nimbus but the lack of first strike is what dont let me use him. Im gonna try 1of Brimaz and 1of Paladin.
7) I realised that 3 Steelshaper's Gift maybe a good call, Im gonna give it a try.
Thx for the feedback! Here is my updated list (Im gonna give a try to Worship. Most of decks simply dont have the answer to it, a 4cmc enchant, and a lot of my dudes (will)have protection)
1x Basilisk Collar
1x Bladed Bracers
3x Bonesplitter
2x O-Naginata
1x Swiftfoot Boots
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Sword of War and Peace
Instant (4)
4x Path to Exile
Enchantment (1)
1x Worship
1x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1x Fiendslayer Paladin
4x Knight Exemplar
4x Knight of Meadowgrain
4x Mirran Crusader
4x Puresteel Paladin
4x Student of Warfare
Sorcery (3)
3x Steelshaper's Gift
Land (20)
4x Cavern of Souls
16x Plains
2x Chalice of the Void
4x Disenchant
2x Ghost Quarter
4x Kor Firewalker
2x Nevermore
1x Torpor Orb
UR Delver
UWR Control
Storm
BW Tron
RG Tron
UR Delver: Kor Firewalker, Rest in Peace/Relic of Progenitus, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, any bolt proof creatures. Given the number of decks using red you have included so far, I would consider adding a single Celestial Purge, and maybe a Mark of Asylum.
Twin: Kor Firewalker, Disenchant, Pithing Needle, Suppression Field, Torpor Orb, Hushwing Gryff, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Celestial Purge. You gotta totally change up your game in a twin match - it becomes more about you controlling the board until they run out of steam (and you have answers in hand ready for the [next] Twin drop while you apply pressure).
UWR Control: (Ensure you have Aether Vial in your main) Kor Firewalker, Rest in Peace, Sword of Fire and Ice, Nevermore (stop snapcaster) ~Pithing Needle (for Celestial Colonnade), any bulky creatures. You need creatures with staying power (bolt proof, i.e. Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers, Fiendslayer Paladin, Brimaz, maybe even Heliod, etc). If you can get a Sword on a creature, though, you will probably have a chance. This will be a hard game no matter what happens. I like Light from Within here - it breaks their game completely.
Storm: **Rest in Peace AND Kor Firewalker (you need to get these out in the first couple turns or its GG). Not much else you can offer will break them, maybe Chalice of the Void, Nevermore, Sword of Fire and Ice, etc.
**edit** Completely forgot to mention Ethersworn Canonist - obviously great against storm and decent against UR decks.
BW Tron: To be honest I can't recall if i've played against BW Tron. Maybe once or twice? Stony Silence, Disenchant and Suppression Field (suppression if you are doing an aggro deck) are your best friends here... Also Pithing Needle and Ghost Quarter. Maybe Sword of Light and Shadow?
RG Tron: As for RG Tron, this easily will be your hardest match. Constant sweepers and big monsters in a control deck. It's an antithesis to a knights deck. Pray that you don't have this match. Otherwise, the cards you would want (for all tron decks generally) are: **Stony Silence,** **Kor Firewalker,** **Disenchant,** Suppression Field, **Pithing Needle,** Oblivion Ring, Wrath of God, Nevermore, Mark of Asylum, Ghost Quarter.. all of these are viable. You want to get your guys out of Pyroclasm range, and possible Anger of the Gods range too. Again, this is another upside for Light from Within. Be prepared for ways to deal with lots of Wurmcoil Engine, Oblivion Stone and Karn Liberated, and possiblly expect Spellskite and Stormbreath Dragon in round 2! Get those Pithing Needles down targeting Oblivion Stone by priority, followed by Karn, ASAP!
You can sometimes gang up with first strikers to defend against a wurmcoil (stop from attacking), and Basilisk Collar is amazing here (with first strike). Use of flyers, i.e. Leonin Skyhunter are great in these gridlocks, especially for Sword connections.
WRG Naya Blitz
WR Boros Aggro
W White Lightning
Modern
W Death and Taxes
W Knights
R Red Deck Wins
RG Zoo
WG Hatebears
WG Aura Hexproof
WU Luminarch Ascension
WB Tokens
WUB Esper Control
And as water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War