Nice, I also own those but I also try to fit them in an Affinity Build... Do they work with Ninjas at all? Never tested it, besides you kinda have to build Erayo, correct?
YES!!!!!!!! NINJAS FTW!!!!!
On Erayo, I was thinking with Ornithopter, repeal, Ornithopter again follow by a a single discard spell should do the trick...
Otherwise we can do a - Zephyr Sprite in play, beat with Sprite & Ninjutsu, cast Sprite again, cast a spare Ornithopter from the hand, repeal and cast again and it will be 4 spells again....
And the easiest Erayo flip- we only need 3 mana.
Step one cast Erayo,
Step two cast Ornithopter
Step three cast Repeal
Step four cast Ornithopter
Repeal seems like the main tech to reach 4 spells here..Or heck, casting Erayo also counts as a spell. The hand disruption will help to ensure we can pull off the combo...heck again as Duress also counts as a spell.
Both scenarios doesn't look too difficult to pull off based on my experience with the Modern Ninjas deck so far, so flipping Erayo is not as far-fetch as you think...Opps, I did it again.
Do you all think that Ninjas just got more viable with the bannings???
Probably going to get lynched for this... but what about w/u Eyaro+ Quest for the Holy Relic??? Seems like it could be kinda dumb (of course... it probably wouldn't run ninjas...)
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so if i am that player do i get to sleep with his girlfriend ?
In my opinion, Ninjas were always viable, just don't expect them to be the next CawBlade.
But I must admit, not really interested in playing black for Discard spells, and as much as I like Throatslitter and Ink Eyes.... was starting down the U/G path without Erayo. I'm sure Invisible Stalker deserves some love.
Am currently trying to tie in Azorius Guildmage with Training Grounds, and something like Rhys the Redeemed, just don't know. Training Grounds really needs more targets that can actually use the ability : /
In my opinion, Ninjas were always viable, just don't expect them to be the next CawBlade.
But I must admit, not really interested in playing black for Discard spells, and as much as I like Throatslitter and Ink Eyes.... was starting down the U/G path without Erayo. I'm sure Invisible Stalker deserves some love.
Am currently trying to tie in Azorius Guildmage with Training Grounds, and something like Rhys the Redeemed, just don't know. Training Grounds really needs more targets that can actually use the ability : /
What can I say? I'm greedy
NINJAS FTW!!!!!111!!!1!1!!!one!!!!one
Haha, meet my ninja/melira/rhys/guildmage/emrakul deck.
I also never liked the black, but Discard is sooo powerful in Modern. The Stalker is only a onetime enabler. Distortion Strike is awesome!
Tarmogoyf, Ornithopter and Scryb Ranger takes the cake for the best Enablers.
Do you all think that Ninjas just got more viable with the bannings???
Probably going to get lynched for this... but what about w/u Eyaro+ Quest for the Holy Relic??? Seems like it could be kinda dumb (of course... it probably wouldn't run ninjas...)
True, playing Ninjas with a Quest deck seems more difficult to pull off and also less explosive than the traditional WW Quest deck that can attack with Argentum Armor by the second or third turns. However i can imagine it being more resilient than the original build as we can get card advantage from NoDH & Higure etc.
Spell Pierce to protect our Ninjutsu creatures and our Armor. Familiar Ruse has synergy with Ninjas and Quest as we should be able to hit UU by the third turn. Ninjas are mana intensive but we probably need only 3 or 4 mana to kick off the deck. NoDH is only Ninjustu 2 so we should still have leftover mana for spell pierce.
In my opinion, Ninjas were always viable, just don't expect them to be the next CawBlade.
But I must admit, not really interested in playing black for Discard spells, and as much as I like Throatslitter and Ink Eyes.... was starting down the U/G path without Erayo. I'm sure Invisible Stalker deserves some love.
Am currently trying to tie in Azorius Guildmage with Training Grounds, and something like Rhys the Redeemed, just don't know. Training Grounds really needs more targets that can actually use the ability : /
What can I say? I'm greedy
Yeah, totally. There is no way I can call Ninja Tier one but they are certainly no pushovers. Training Grounds is a little slow...I would rather pack more Ninja enablers & Ninjas which is what really matters. Even now there are times I don't end up with enough creatures and Training grounds really just take out the creature slots.
The discard spells are really to stop removals from targeting our Ninjas. It is not practical to keep open mana to counter removals and also have enough to use Ninjutsu at the same time during the early turns.
Basically the BU Ninjas work in this way:
Step One - Hand discard on their removal.
Step Two - Ninjutsu NoDH for a land/counterspell or discard
Step Three - Counter their spells.
Playing B allow us to ensure step 2 can go off smoothly, giving us immense tempo. This is something we cannot achieve with W.
BTW I'm keen to try to UG deck, especially after buying a playset of Erayo, but i'm too pre-occupied with the BU list at the moment.;)
Haha, meet my ninja/melira/rhys/guildmage/emrakul deck.
I also never liked the black, but Discard is sooo powerful in Modern. The Stalker is only a onetime enabler. Distortion Strike is awesome!
Tarmogoyf, Ornithopter and Scryb Ranger takes the cake for the best Enablers.
NINJAS FTW!!!!!!! WIN WIN WIN!!!!!!!!
@Necroticah - sorry i missed out completely on your post
Discard is so powerful it is crucial to so many decks. Ripping out opponents' strategies or protecting your own plays is so critical, plus it's always good to see what you opponent have in their hand.
I found 2 CC ninjas enablers to be really clumsy, since you rarely have the mana to drop them again after Ninjutsu. Therefore I'm not convinced 2CC creatures like Tarmogoyf or Stalker are efficient here. Stalker seems most suited to Swords rather than as a Ninja enabler.
Does anyone think we can add liliana of the veil and invisible stalker into a ninja deck? With card advantage from ninjas we could handle the +1 better, and forcing them to sacrifice creatures also allow our attackers to hit unblocked.
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
I'm not sure if Inivisible Stalker will work here, although they are a foolproof Ninjutsu tech but at 2cc it might be too costly to drop them into play on the same turn that you Ninjutsu. I still prefer the likes of Ornithopter or Zephyr Sprite.
I really haven't thought of how Liliana of the Veil will work in a Ninja build. I usually require mana to Ninjutu or flash a Spellstutter so I'm not sure if casting a Liliana will impede those plans. Don't get me wrong, Liliana is a massive card but I'm just not sure if I can utilise her better here.
I see a lot of lists running Ornithopter and Zephyr Sprite as their ninjutsu enablers and I have to wonder what Ornithopter is doing that Cloud Sprite can't (other than blocking nonflyers). The cost being higher isn't an issue imo because as far as I can tell Ornithopter's 0CMC isn't all that relevant. Cloud Sprite's 1CMC, on the other hand, is good for turn two ninjutsu shenanigans but also helps power up Spellstutter Sprite's ability.
Valonus88, that's likely a fairly workable deck. But the reasons for running Quest in standard were that it was cheap to build and that it was effective against the meta due to stealing wins when it worked. It lost popularity due to being inconsistent, and fairly weak to control.
Looks like I should hang around more often if I want to make a more meaningful contribution....
BlackIsBack, the 0CC is extremely relevant on Ornithopter and so is flying. It's due to that combination that it saw so much play, but as Modern has a larger card pool I suspect it would work as well to just run a 1CC flier. The issue with a 1CC is that it just can't trip quest as soon, and so costs more mana (and thus time) to go off.
BlackIsBack, the 0CC is extremely relevant on Ornithopter and so is flying. It's due to that combination that it saw so much play, but as Modern has a larger card pool I suspect it would work as well to just run a 1CC flier. The issue with a 1CC is that it just can't trip quest as soon, and so costs more mana (and thus time) to go off.
I'm not talking about for the quest versions. To be honest I don't much care for those versions as any plan based on sacrificing consistency for a large fast creature is, in my opinion, inherently weakened by the removal options available in a larger format like Modern. Otherwise I would be playing some of my rogue decks based on getting a turn two Demon of Death's Gate. It's fun when it works but it won't work often after the first go-round. No, I'm wondering why Ornithopter is the enabler of choice for the more consistent tempo/control versions closer to the beginning of the thread. 0CMC Flyer doesn't mean as much for a deck not built around trying to accommodate both Quest and Ninjas. In the first versions built around fae and ninjas, Cloud Sprite seems to be a more relevant choice as the 0CMC means less and it acts sort of like Zephyr Sprite 5-8 for Spellstutter Sprite.
I prefer Ornithopter simply because it allows me to do multiple things on the first turn.
With a 0Ornithopter, it allows me to drop a first turn ninja enabler and cast a hand discard spell on the opening turn. With Ninja of Deep Hours requiring 2 mana to Ninjutsu, the first turn discard enables us to take out his removal before NoDH comes in. After the Ninjutsu we can drop Ornithopter into play straight away(we can Ninjutsu next turn again if we have another Ninja). Using Cloud Sprite doesnt allow us the luxury of doing all this although it has better synergy with Spellstutter Sprite as a Faerie.
I prefer Ornithopter simply because it allows me to do multiple things on the first turn.
With a 0Ornithopter, it allows me to drop a first turn ninja enabler and cast a hand discard spell on the opening turn. With Ninja of Deep Hours requiring 2 mana to Ninjutsu, the first turn discard enables us to take out his removal before NoDH comes in. After the Ninjutsu we can drop Ornithopter into play straight away(we can Ninjutsu next turn again if we have another Ninja). Using Cloud Sprite doesnt allow us the luxury of doing all this although it has better synergy with Spellstutter Sprite as a Faerie.
Alright, I can see that. I think I'd prefer the Cloud Sprite for better counter chances on Spellstutter Sprite later on personally...but I can see where you're coming from.
Alright, I can see that. I think I'd prefer the Cloud Sprite for better counter chances on Spellstutter Sprite later on personally...but I can see where you're coming from.
I can understand where you are coming from regarding the Spellsutter lock, except for me I not too keen to relie too much on Spellstutter Sprite which will dilute my Ninjtsu strategy. Anyway I did managed to lock my opponent playing Mono-R Burn with the Spellstutter - Familiar Ruse - Ninjas lock.
I played against Mono G Elfball, Big R deck and Mono-R burn recently, i'll update on the matchups shortly.
I'm really not sure why this hasn't been pointed out yet... but why are you guys not running Kira, Great Glass-Spinner? Kira is absolutely amazing and will largely nullify removal all by herself, leaving you able to use your counter shenanigans on more important things.
As a final note, since Ninjutsu is about exploiting degenerate CIPT effects in conjunction with the Ninjutsu mechanic, you should consider the new Snapcaster Mage, which, in this deck, is pretty much the definition of degenerate.
The lists would need tweaked, but you guys are overlooking two amazing pieces of tech.
The thing is, Ninjutsu can't do its job without unblocked attackers. Ninja of the Deep Hours is only degenerate in Vintage because that format has nearly no creatures. In that format, the guy bounces 1-drops like Icatian Javelineers and Cursecatcher, as well as higher drops like Jotun Grunt, Spellstutter Sprite, Meddling Mage, and Snapcaster Mage. If anyone else has more ideas for evasive ETB effect creatures, we'd love them, but right now, I think focusing on evasive creatures and not ETB effect creatures is best.
Also worth noting: Since our typical problem is pushing damage over the top once we stabilize, Mirrorweave has great interactions here. In my testing I'm usually sporting a bunch of 1/1 faeries (using a ninjafae build), with no real threat on the table. Mirrorweave gives me the opportunity to do a couple of things:
Declare blockers against all of their creatures, transform everything into 1/1s and wipe the board.
After they declare attacks, activate Mutavault and Mirrorweave it, which has an interesting interaction which removes the attackers from attacking.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving their threat for huge beats.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving Ninja of the Deep Hours.
I'm really not sure why this hasn't been pointed out yet... but why are you guys not running Kira, Great Glass-Spinner? Kira is absolutely amazing and will largely nullify removal all by herself, leaving you able to use your counter shenanigans on more important things.
As a final note, since Ninjutsu is about exploiting degenerate CIPT effects in conjunction with the Ninjutsu mechanic, you should consider the new Snapcaster Mage, which, in this deck, is pretty much the definition of degenerate.
The lists would need tweaked, but you guys are overlooking two amazing pieces of tech.
For a Ninja deck, in order for the Ninjutsu strategy to work, we need evasion in the first place which both Kira and Snapmaster is unable to provide for. Ninjas are not overpowered and because you can never rely on them to consistently hit the player thus the need for enablers. And even with enablers they are still mana-intensive and relatively expensive to cheat into play.
I believe we should keep things simple so we can ninjutsu consistently, it doesnt help if we have have snapcaster or Kira around but we can't find a way to Ninjutsu in.
And you can only drop Kira on the third turn. Although Snapcaster can be incredibly degenerate when you can reuse his ability but he has to attack without being blocked first - which is unlikely he can pull it off unscathed.
The thing is, Ninjutsu can't do its job without unblocked attackers. Ninja of the Deep Hours is only degenerate in Vintage because that format has nearly no creatures. In that format, the guy bounces 1-drops like Icatian Javelineers and Cursecatcher, as well as higher drops like Jotun Grunt, Spellstutter Sprite, Meddling Mage, and Snapcaster Mage. If anyone else has more ideas for evasive ETB effect creatures, we'd love them, but right now, I think focusing on evasive creatures and not ETB effect creatures is best.
Absolutely, without unblocked attackers, NoDH is extremely costly and clumsy. Thus the need for the likes of one drop flyers and Ornithopter etc.
Also worth noting: Since our typical problem is pushing damage over the top once we stabilize, Mirrorweave has great interactions here. In my testing I'm usually sporting a bunch of 1/1 faeries (using a ninjafae build), with no real threat on the table. Mirrorweave gives me the opportunity to do a couple of things:
Declare blockers against all of their creatures, transform everything into 1/1s and wipe the board.
After they declare attacks, activate Mutavault and Mirrorweave it, which has an interesting interaction which removes the attackers from attacking.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving their threat for huge beats.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving Ninja of the Deep Hours.
Something to look into
I don't really get it - are you casting multiple mirrorweave? Your scenarios seems to call for many conditions before it works. Mirrorweave is also costly at 4cc which i'm afraid might be a dead card in most situations...Perhaps we need to wait for a card like Howl from Beyond(which can deal the last few points of damage) to be available in Modern.
By chance does anyone on this thread play MTGO and if so, have you tried running this deck through some queues or dailies? I have been playing a mono blue fae pauper deck and fell in love with NoDH. Now I want to take it to the next level and play a similar archtype in Modern.
Is version 3 a few pages back still the way to go? I also noticed that Okiba-Gang Shinobi isn't in there. He seems like a good fit, maybe a one of?
By chance does anyone on this thread play MTGO and if so, have you tried running this deck through some queues or dailies? I have been playing a mono blue fae pauper deck and fell in love with NoDH. Now I want to take it to the next level and play a similar archtype in Modern.
Is version 3 a few pages back still the way to go? I also noticed that Okiba-Gang Shinobi isn't in there. He seems like a good fit, maybe a one of?
NINJAS FTW!!!!!!!!!!
Unfortunately I'm not on MTGO, however i do playtest against some other modern or legacy decks once in a while. I personally adore NoDH and Higure. NoDH is a house here with his card-drawing ability, and Higure is also a bomb here with this ninja-tutoring & evasion ability.
Are you referring to DOLZero decklist below? Actually I couldnt even find the space for a single Throatslitter thus I couldnt really consider Okiba-gang shinobi. I felt at that Ninjutsu cost I would rather play Higure anytime.
By the way, that is a MASSIVE NINJA Signature and Avatar you have there!!!!
No one has mentioned Lightning Greaves yet? Perfect for ninja enablers
I'm not entirely sure about the rules, but I don't think we can return an equipped ninja enabler back to hand (due to shroud ability). Also opponent can still remove our Ninjas before damage is dealt since Greaves is not equipped on them. Because of this Lightning Greaves has failed in it's original function - we are better off running hand discard to pluck creature removals out of their hand so we can beat through successfully.
This is the one I was referring to. Is this the list you are currently running? If so I'm going to give it a go on MTGO and see how it does. So far I've been tooling around with a budget list and it's been a blast. Once I get the remaining cards, I'm going to try to run it in a daily and maybe some two man queues to see how it stacks up.
The sig and avatar are my first attempts photochopping, maybe I should resize them a bit.
For getting that last push of damage what about Hatred?
I'm a standard player looking into modern. From what I see with the ninja's I was wondering if Invisible Stalker would have a home here seeing has he is a 1U Hexproof/Unblockable by himself and should beable to enable the ninjutsu. Also just from the list quoted by shinob1 I am wondering about the lack of card draw or even a small counterspell suite seeing as we have rather controlling colors here, or am I off base?
Edit...Never mind didn't see familiar's ruse the first time around. Still curious about card draw.
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YES!!!!!!!! NINJAS FTW!!!!!
On Erayo, I was thinking with Ornithopter, repeal, Ornithopter again follow by a a single discard spell should do the trick...
Otherwise we can do a - Zephyr Sprite in play, beat with Sprite & Ninjutsu, cast Sprite again, cast a spare Ornithopter from the hand, repeal and cast again and it will be 4 spells again....
And the easiest Erayo flip- we only need 3 mana.
Both scenarios doesn't look too difficult to pull off based on my experience with the Modern Ninjas deck so far, so flipping Erayo is not as far-fetch as you think...Opps, I did it again.
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[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Probably going to get lynched for this... but what about w/u Eyaro+ Quest for the Holy Relic??? Seems like it could be kinda dumb (of course... it probably wouldn't run ninjas...)
About Mindslaver rulings:
But I must admit, not really interested in playing black for Discard spells, and as much as I like Throatslitter and Ink Eyes.... was starting down the U/G path without Erayo. I'm sure Invisible Stalker deserves some love.
Am currently trying to tie in Azorius Guildmage with Training Grounds, and something like Rhys the Redeemed, just don't know. Training Grounds really needs more targets that can actually use the ability : /
What can I say? I'm greedy
NINJAS FTW!!!!!111!!!1!1!!!one!!!!one
Haha, meet my ninja/melira/rhys/guildmage/emrakul deck.
I also never liked the black, but Discard is sooo powerful in Modern. The Stalker is only a onetime enabler. Distortion Strike is awesome!
Tarmogoyf, Ornithopter and Scryb Ranger takes the cake for the best Enablers.
True, playing Ninjas with a Quest deck seems more difficult to pull off and also less explosive than the traditional WW Quest deck that can attack with Argentum Armor by the second or third turns. However i can imagine it being more resilient than the original build as we can get card advantage from NoDH & Higure etc.
2x Higure, the Still Wind
4x Mistblade Shinobi
4x Ninja of the Deep Hours
Ninja & Quest Enablers [16]
4x Glint Hawk
4x Kor Skyfisher
4x Memnite
4x Ornithopter
4x Quest for the Holy Relic
2x Argentum Armor
1x Batterskull
Spells [8]
4 Familiar's Ruse
4 Spell Pierce
4 Seachrome Coast
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Marsh Flats
4 Islands
3 Plains
Spell Pierce to protect our Ninjutsu creatures and our Armor. Familiar Ruse has synergy with Ninjas and Quest as we should be able to hit UU by the third turn. Ninjas are mana intensive but we probably need only 3 or 4 mana to kick off the deck. NoDH is only Ninjustu 2 so we should still have leftover mana for spell pierce.
Yeah, totally. There is no way I can call Ninja Tier one but they are certainly no pushovers. Training Grounds is a little slow...I would rather pack more Ninja enablers & Ninjas which is what really matters. Even now there are times I don't end up with enough creatures and Training grounds really just take out the creature slots.
The discard spells are really to stop removals from targeting our Ninjas. It is not practical to keep open mana to counter removals and also have enough to use Ninjutsu at the same time during the early turns.
Basically the BU Ninjas work in this way:
Step One - Hand discard on their removal.
Step Two - Ninjutsu NoDH for a land/counterspell or discard
Step Three - Counter their spells.
Playing B allow us to ensure step 2 can go off smoothly, giving us immense tempo. This is something we cannot achieve with W.
BTW I'm keen to try to UG deck, especially after buying a playset of Erayo, but i'm too pre-occupied with the BU list at the moment.;)
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[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
NINJAS FTW!!!!!!! WIN WIN WIN!!!!!!!!
@Necroticah - sorry i missed out completely on your post
Discard is so powerful it is crucial to so many decks. Ripping out opponents' strategies or protecting your own plays is so critical, plus it's always good to see what you opponent have in their hand.
I found 2 CC ninjas enablers to be really clumsy, since you rarely have the mana to drop them again after Ninjutsu. Therefore I'm not convinced 2CC creatures like Tarmogoyf or Stalker are efficient here. Stalker seems most suited to Swords rather than as a Ninja enabler.
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[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I really haven't thought of how Liliana of the Veil will work in a Ninja build. I usually require mana to Ninjutu or flash a Spellstutter so I'm not sure if casting a Liliana will impede those plans. Don't get me wrong, Liliana is a massive card but I'm just not sure if I can utilise her better here.
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[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Is what I do.
Looks like I should hang around more often if I want to make a more meaningful contribution....
BlackIsBack, the 0CC is extremely relevant on Ornithopter and so is flying. It's due to that combination that it saw so much play, but as Modern has a larger card pool I suspect it would work as well to just run a 1CC flier. The issue with a 1CC is that it just can't trip quest as soon, and so costs more mana (and thus time) to go off.
I'm not talking about for the quest versions. To be honest I don't much care for those versions as any plan based on sacrificing consistency for a large fast creature is, in my opinion, inherently weakened by the removal options available in a larger format like Modern. Otherwise I would be playing some of my rogue decks based on getting a turn two Demon of Death's Gate. It's fun when it works but it won't work often after the first go-round. No, I'm wondering why Ornithopter is the enabler of choice for the more consistent tempo/control versions closer to the beginning of the thread. 0CMC Flyer doesn't mean as much for a deck not built around trying to accommodate both Quest and Ninjas. In the first versions built around fae and ninjas, Cloud Sprite seems to be a more relevant choice as the 0CMC means less and it acts sort of like Zephyr Sprite 5-8 for Spellstutter Sprite.
Is what I do.
I prefer Ornithopter simply because it allows me to do multiple things on the first turn.
With a 0 Ornithopter, it allows me to drop a first turn ninja enabler and cast a hand discard spell on the opening turn. With Ninja of Deep Hours requiring 2 mana to Ninjutsu, the first turn discard enables us to take out his removal before NoDH comes in. After the Ninjutsu we can drop Ornithopter into play straight away(we can Ninjutsu next turn again if we have another Ninja). Using Cloud Sprite doesnt allow us the luxury of doing all this although it has better synergy with Spellstutter Sprite as a Faerie.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Alright, I can see that. I think I'd prefer the Cloud Sprite for better counter chances on Spellstutter Sprite later on personally...but I can see where you're coming from.
Is what I do.
I can understand where you are coming from regarding the Spellsutter lock, except for me I not too keen to relie too much on Spellstutter Sprite which will dilute my Ninjtsu strategy. Anyway I did managed to lock my opponent playing Mono-R Burn with the Spellstutter - Familiar Ruse - Ninjas lock.
I played against Mono G Elfball, Big R deck and Mono-R burn recently, i'll update on the matchups shortly.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
As a final note, since Ninjutsu is about exploiting degenerate CIPT effects in conjunction with the Ninjutsu mechanic, you should consider the new Snapcaster Mage, which, in this deck, is pretty much the definition of degenerate.
The lists would need tweaked, but you guys are overlooking two amazing pieces of tech.
Modern:
Tokens
Declare blockers against all of their creatures, transform everything into 1/1s and wipe the board.
After they declare attacks, activate Mutavault and Mirrorweave it, which has an interesting interaction which removes the attackers from attacking.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving their threat for huge beats.
Swing all in with the team, Mirrorweaving Ninja of the Deep Hours.
Something to look into
Modern:
Tokens
For a Ninja deck, in order for the Ninjutsu strategy to work, we need evasion in the first place which both Kira and Snapmaster is unable to provide for. Ninjas are not overpowered and because you can never rely on them to consistently hit the player thus the need for enablers. And even with enablers they are still mana-intensive and relatively expensive to cheat into play.
I believe we should keep things simple so we can ninjutsu consistently, it doesnt help if we have have snapcaster or Kira around but we can't find a way to Ninjutsu in.
And you can only drop Kira on the third turn. Although Snapcaster can be incredibly degenerate when you can reuse his ability but he has to attack without being blocked first - which is unlikely he can pull it off unscathed.
Absolutely, without unblocked attackers, NoDH is extremely costly and clumsy. Thus the need for the likes of one drop flyers and Ornithopter etc.
I don't really get it - are you casting multiple mirrorweave? Your scenarios seems to call for many conditions before it works. Mirrorweave is also costly at 4cc which i'm afraid might be a dead card in most situations...Perhaps we need to wait for a card like Howl from Beyond(which can deal the last few points of damage) to be available in Modern.
And we finally have a Ninja banner!!!! YEAH!!!!!
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
By chance does anyone on this thread play MTGO and if so, have you tried running this deck through some queues or dailies? I have been playing a mono blue fae pauper deck and fell in love with NoDH. Now I want to take it to the next level and play a similar archtype in Modern.
Is version 3 a few pages back still the way to go? I also noticed that Okiba-Gang Shinobi isn't in there. He seems like a good fit, maybe a one of?
NINJAS FTW!!!!!!!!!!
Unfortunately I'm not on MTGO, however i do playtest against some other modern or legacy decks once in a while. I personally adore NoDH and Higure. NoDH is a house here with his card-drawing ability, and Higure is also a bomb here with this ninja-tutoring & evasion ability.
Are you referring to DOLZero decklist below? Actually I couldnt even find the space for a single Throatslitter thus I couldnt really consider Okiba-gang shinobi. I felt at that Ninjutsu cost I would rather play Higure anytime.
By the way, that is a MASSIVE NINJA Signature and Avatar you have there!!!!
I'm not entirely sure about the rules, but I don't think we can return an equipped ninja enabler back to hand (due to shroud ability). Also opponent can still remove our Ninjas before damage is dealt since Greaves is not equipped on them. Because of this Lightning Greaves has failed in it's original function - we are better off running hand discard to pluck creature removals out of their hand so we can beat through successfully.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
This is the one I was referring to. Is this the list you are currently running? If so I'm going to give it a go on MTGO and see how it does. So far I've been tooling around with a budget list and it's been a blast. Once I get the remaining cards, I'm going to try to run it in a daily and maybe some two man queues to see how it stacks up.
The sig and avatar are my first attempts photochopping, maybe I should resize them a bit.
For getting that last push of damage what about Hatred?
Edit...Never mind didn't see familiar's ruse the first time around. Still curious about card draw.