The banlist update forced me to go through all of my MTGO lists and remove DRS from them, and this inspired me to really give my black deck a working over.
The biggest changes are the addition of Stinger for early beats, which is a bit of a test, and the addition of the Loam/Crime engine. That engine can be really strong even though there is still plenty of grave hate left in the format because I should have no trouble dealing with the most common offenders with my removal.
I also think that Engineered Explosives may be a top notch way to deal with fast aggro since a two color deck can cast it with one or two counters and make the sweep one sided against most of Zoo's creatures. Like any BG deck I will miss not having a good mana accelerator, but the rest I can deal with. I thought about just adding birds, but I simply did not feel that it would be a good turn one play for this deck so why look only at 1 cmc mana accelerators. I think if I end up wanting a mana dork again I will try Sylvan Caryatid, which I think may be better in Modern than people think.
If I owned some Sword of Feast and Famine on MTGO I might try and add three in place of Vines, but I don't and Vines will at least protect my attacker from red removal once.
with the unbanning of bitterblossom, this deck to me can't stand on a competitive level anymore. most of its wins were coming by the evasion of inkmoth nexus and the protection of crusader, now the opponent just needs to find a bitterblossom and he has blockers to chump block with all day.
making a green splash for abrupt decay seems a good way to go, as is adding the new -3/-3 removal from born of the gods; smallpox maindeck seems a necessity too. if tron disappears from the format, that might be a good reason to remove the ghost quarters maindeck to help with the mana.
with the unbanning of bitterblossom, this deck to me can't stand on a competitive level anymore. most of its wins were coming by the evasion of inkmoth nexus and the protection of crusader, now the opponent just needs to find a bitterblossom and he has blockers to chump block with all day.
making a green splash for abrupt decay seems a good way to go, as is adding the new -3/-3 removal from born of the gods; smallpox maindeck seems a necessity too. if tron disappears from the format, that might be a good reason to remove the ghost quarters maindeck to help with the mana.
This deck has a ton of discard. Shouldn't be hard to take the Bitterblossom from their hand.
with the unbanning of bitterblossom, this deck to me can't stand on a competitive level anymore. most of its wins were coming by the evasion of inkmoth nexus and the protection of crusader, now the opponent just needs to find a bitterblossom and he has blockers to chump block with all day.
making a green splash for abrupt decay seems a good way to go, as is adding the new -3/-3 removal from born of the gods; smallpox maindeck seems a necessity too. if tron disappears from the format, that might be a good reason to remove the ghost quarters maindeck to help with the mana.
Well, clearly I think that a green splash is the best way to go, as it answers BB pretty handily- making Abrupt Decay even more important in Modern. Pox is a really solid card that I use in my loampox build, but I couldn't find room for it MD and since I am only running 10 creatures there are not as many I am comfortable sacking, so it might limit when I am okay casting it. That said it might be good SB.
I used to run this list about a year ago, was curious how it would hold up. I'm having a lot of fun playing against various tabletop decks, and I'm gonna take it back to the modern circuit if I can.
I used to run this list about a year ago, was curious how it would hold up. I'm having a lot of fun playing against various tabletop decks, and I'm gonna take it back to the modern circuit if I can.
I like having Beseech in here because it allows you to go long if need be, basically acting as a tutor for Batterskull once you get to 5 Swamps. It can also tutor up Pike.
I like Dakmor Salvage plus Raven's Crime. Dredging it back also helps fuel Runechanter's Pike.
I like having Beseech in here because it allows you to go long if need be, basically acting as a tutor for Batterskull once you get to 5 Swamps. It can also tutor up Pike.
I like Dakmor Salvage plus Raven's Crime. Dredging it back also helps fuel Runechanter's Pike.
Since you are almost never going to kill your opponent with normal damage, Night's Whisper makes more sense than Sign in Blood in this deck.
Since you are almost never going to kill your opponent with normal damage, Night's Whisper makes more sense than Sign in Blood in this deck.
that is probably true, though I myself kinda like Read the Bones if you can hold the board well enough.
One note I would say about these decks I that I have always found that I was fine with only running two copies of Vatmommy since I almost never want to see it in my opening hand.
I just picked this up on Modo, something to play while building BGx. I'm having some trouble figuring out what is a "keep-able" opening hand. What do you consider a great opening hand?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: Lingering RockBGW - Patriot FlashURW - Mono Black InfectB(MTGO)
I just picked this up on Modo, something to play while building BGx. I'm having some trouble figuring out what is a "keep-able" opening hand. What do you consider a great opening hand?
That is such a hard question to answer, but I'll do my best. I think this deck can do just fine on a two land hand (preferably swamps). I am not concerned about racing out my permanents, I want to spend the early game disrupting my opponent with discard and removal. If I have Inkmoth in play I might not play Crusader or P-Mama until I have enough mana to drop them and leave some untapped for control. Too much land in the opening hand is another story- I think I would mulligan some four land hands that did not include Inkmoth and definitely mull 5 land hands. 2-3 lands really is a sweet spot, but you want to make sure you have plenty of plays even if you stall at two lands, so make sure your control game is cheap.
I'm thinking about making one of those decks as well. Do you think this list could do well at FNMs? What would you change? I'm a noob btw. so advice is much appreciated. What do you think of the Lands, especially Howltooth Hollow and Cathedral of War? Are they even worth running in my deck?
I've been trying out this deck for a little while now and I'm quite pleased with the main deck so far. I don't really know what to run in the sideboard though. I've even been thinking about splashing white for cards like Rest in Peace, Stony Silence, Disenchant and Path to Exile. Do you guys think I's worth the splash or do we have all we need in black already?
i can say for sure that a bicolor base (fetches + shocklands) usually ended up in taking too much damn life and opened up to a blood moon vulnerability this deck can't handle. i'd be wary to run too many threats, the main aim of the deck should be disruption and only when the game is under control go with infect to seal the deal.
the last version of this deck i used had 4 inkmoth, 4 crusaders and 2 vatmothers just because it doesn't die to bolt.
i then switched to 8 rack because 1 mana is less than 3 or 4 regarding threats (which means you can keep disrupting AND drop a threat, which is no small deal), and because i found out i preferred to steadily chip away at an opponent life total instead of going all in in just one attack phase.
@Attractor:
Why the Erebos, God of the Dead? You don't care about your oponent's life total.
Also, with the number of instants and sorceries you run, I'm not sure if Runechanter's Pike is worth it.
That's very true. How stupid of me! As I said, I don't Really know what to run in the sideboard =)
Since I get do draw a lot of card off of the Dark Confidants, and most of them are very cheap to cast, and also get do discard a cards to Liliana, I still think the Pike's are worth it thought.
I imagine ad Nauseam, Storm and Twin to be decent matchups because of hand-disruption. I think the worst matchups for this deck is Tron, as our hand-disruption can't target their lands (Academy Ruins and the Tronlands) - That's why I'm currently thinking about including either Leyline of the Void (graveyard hate) or Damping Matrix into the sideboard.
Affinity also looks like a very bad matchup, which Damping Matrix and Drown in Sorrow might be able to improve.
i used to play this deck against tron for testing, ended up finding space for 3-4 smallpox to deal with the lands (especially vs gr tron they might get greedy if they don't know you have it). surgical extraction in the sb is an autowin if they somehow discard a tron land (easier with smallpox, but also with raven's crime or funeral charm - wrench minds need to be sided out here because of all the eggs they run). also, i mained 2 ghost quarter.
i tried to find space in the sideboard for 3 plague stinger, the rationale is, as soon as they see that pyroclasm isn't going to destroy nexuses or crusaders, they should side them out, and you could get a win by just aggroing. when i tested this i swapped the ghost quarters with cathedral of war, as it can be a blowout using a funeral charm to make a nexus a 4/1.
What do you think about Spellskite in the SB?
It seems to be good against Twin (steals Splinter Twin), Tron (eats removal and Karn Liberated's exile ability), Affinity (steals the counters from Arcbound Ravager when it gets removed) Scapeshift (you just take 2 damage instead of 3 from Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle)and Burn.
spellskite is a staple sideboard card, no doubt about that.
that said, i wouldn't side it in vs tron, as i would try and strip their hand in the first turns. also, most of tron's removal isn't single target, unless they board in dismember or beast within. essentially, t2 spellskite isn't as good as 2 raven's crime or even a smallpox.
it is really good vs the stompy version of infect for sure.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
Does anyone mind explaining why people are running Dark Confidant over Phyrexian Arena? I am slowly putting together one of these decks and for budget reasons I am not running Dark Confidant, but I do have a Phyrexian Arena that I am running as a one-off in the deck. If I were to ever move into acquiring more expensive cards, is a play set of Dark Confidant's really worth the price difference over Phyrexian Arena?
Also, what do people think of Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon? I see some people are running one and others are not. For those of you running one what are your experiences with him in your decks?
And finally, do you guys think Waste Not deserves a spot in the deck when it gets released? I'm really liking the card and I feel like we have enough discard in the deck to make it worth it. Thanks!
@Chalubasfasdf: Yes, sadly Hand of the Praetors dies to Bolt, which is by far the most used spell in Modern. I would love to run him over Vatmother if that were not the case.
@Crescit: I think this deck can do fine without Bob. He's not nearly as strong in this deck as he is in Jund for example (because you don't care about your opponent's life total, making him useless as an attacker). I'm not sure about Phyrexian Arena, because you want to cast your creatures turn three and possibly four, making arena too slow I think. I prefer just running Night's Whisper (or Read the Bones) instead. Waste Not looks like a very good card, but the fact that the zombies are just going to be blockers makes it somewhat less valuable for this build - it might be an interesting sideboard-card, though.
I'm not sure what to think about Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon. I played a GPT yesterday (went 4-2) and he was really only useful in one game. In some matchups he's great, but if you're playing against Burn or Aggro you don't want to see him in your hand.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
4 Plague Stinger
4 Phyrexian Crusader
2 Phyrexian Vatmother
Other Spells 27
4 Phyrexian Arena
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Life from the Loam
3 Raven's Crime
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Victim of Night
2 Liliana of the Veil
2 Sickening Shoal
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Inkmoth Nexus
3 Overgrown Tomb
1 Godless Shrine
7 Swamp
3 Forest
2 Tectonic Edge
4 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pithing Needle
4 Extirpate
3 Engineered Explosives
2 Dismember
The biggest changes are the addition of Stinger for early beats, which is a bit of a test, and the addition of the Loam/Crime engine. That engine can be really strong even though there is still plenty of grave hate left in the format because I should have no trouble dealing with the most common offenders with my removal.
I also think that Engineered Explosives may be a top notch way to deal with fast aggro since a two color deck can cast it with one or two counters and make the sweep one sided against most of Zoo's creatures. Like any BG deck I will miss not having a good mana accelerator, but the rest I can deal with. I thought about just adding birds, but I simply did not feel that it would be a good turn one play for this deck so why look only at 1 cmc mana accelerators. I think if I end up wanting a mana dork again I will try Sylvan Caryatid, which I think may be better in Modern than people think.
If I owned some Sword of Feast and Famine on MTGO I might try and add three in place of Vines, but I don't and Vines will at least protect my attacker from red removal once.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
making a green splash for abrupt decay seems a good way to go, as is adding the new -3/-3 removal from born of the gods; smallpox maindeck seems a necessity too. if tron disappears from the format, that might be a good reason to remove the ghost quarters maindeck to help with the mana.
This deck has a ton of discard. Shouldn't be hard to take the Bitterblossom from their hand.
Sales Thread!
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
MoreHumblethanU's MBI
4x Cathedral of War
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
12x Swamp
4x Phyrexian Crusader
4x Phyrexian Vatmother
2x Runechanter's Pike
1x Deathpact
3x Inquisition Of the Kozilek
4x Funeral Charm
3x Raven's Crime
3x Disfigure
2x Darkblast
2x Devour Flesh
2x Doomblade
3x Illness in the Ranks
3x Dismember
2x Plague Stinger
3x Pithing Needle
2x Ratchet Bomb
2x Topor Orb
I'd be running maindeck Dismembers instead of Disfigures.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
4 Phyrexian Crusader
2 Runechanter's Pike
1 Batterskull
4 Funeral Charm
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Wrench Mind
3 Raven's Crime
1 Beseech the Queen
4 Victim of Night
4 Dismember
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Inkmoth Nexus
3 Howltooth Hollow
2 Dakmor Salvage
12 Swamp
2 Lashwrite
1 Mutilate
2 Drown in Sorrow
3 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Torpor Orb
3 Vampire Nighthawk
I like having Beseech in here because it allows you to go long if need be, basically acting as a tutor for Batterskull once you get to 5 Swamps. It can also tutor up Pike.
I like Dakmor Salvage plus Raven's Crime. Dredging it back also helps fuel Runechanter's Pike.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
Since you are almost never going to kill your opponent with normal damage, Night's Whisper makes more sense than Sign in Blood in this deck.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
One note I would say about these decks I that I have always found that I was fine with only running two copies of Vatmommy since I almost never want to see it in my opening hand.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
2 Disfigure
3 Funeral Charm
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Raven's Crime
4 Thoughtseize
3 Devour Flesh
2 Go for the Throat
4 Wrench Mind
4 Read the Bones
2 Liliana of the Veil
Creature
4 Phyrexian Crusader
2 Phyrexian Vatmother
1 Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
Land
4 Cathedral of War
4 Inkmoth Nexus
15 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Torpor Orb
4 Drown in Sorrow
2 Imi Statue
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
3 Funeral Charm
4 Wrench Mind
4 Read the Bones
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
3 Victim of Night
2 Disfigure
2 Raven's Crime
1 Doom Blade
1 Devour Flesh
1 Slaughter Pact
2 Runechanter's Pike
Creature
4 Phyrexian Crusader
3 Phyrexian Vatmother
1 Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
Land
14 Swamp
4 Inkmoth Nexus
2 Cathedral of War
2 Howltooth Hollow
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Bile Blight
2 Drown in Sorrow
4 Extirpate
2 Pithing Needle
1 Raven's Crime
1 Thoughtseize
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Damnation
4 Dark Confidant
4 Phyrexian Crusader
2 Phyrexian Vatmother
1 Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
SORCERIES (11)
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
2 Raven’s Crime
3 Wrench Mind
4 Disfigure
4 Funeral Charm
2 Victim of Night
PLANESWALKERS (3)
3 Liliana of the Veil
ARTIFACTS (3)
2 Runechanter’s Pike
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
LANDS (22)
16 Swamp
4 Inkmoth Nexus
2 Howltooth Hollow
4 Duress
2 Pithing Needle
2 Bile Blight
2 Dismember
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Erebos, God of the Dead
the last version of this deck i used had 4 inkmoth, 4 crusaders and 2 vatmothers just because it doesn't die to bolt.
i then switched to 8 rack because 1 mana is less than 3 or 4 regarding threats (which means you can keep disrupting AND drop a threat, which is no small deal), and because i found out i preferred to steadily chip away at an opponent life total instead of going all in in just one attack phase.
Why the Erebos, God of the Dead? You don't care about your oponent's life total.
Also, with the number of instants and sorceries you run, I'm not sure if Runechanter's Pike is worth it.
That's very true. How stupid of me! As I said, I don't Really know what to run in the sideboard =)
Since I get do draw a lot of card off of the Dark Confidants, and most of them are very cheap to cast, and also get do discard a cards to Liliana, I still think the Pike's are worth it thought.
Any other thoughts on the contents of the board?
Yeah, you're probably right about the life loss of off the fetch- and shocklands. I do think I'll stick with the Infect theme though.
Any thoughts on the sideboard?
Affinity also looks like a very bad matchup, which Damping Matrix and Drown in Sorrow might be able to improve.
i tried to find space in the sideboard for 3 plague stinger, the rationale is, as soon as they see that pyroclasm isn't going to destroy nexuses or crusaders, they should side them out, and you could get a win by just aggroing. when i tested this i swapped the ghost quarters with cathedral of war, as it can be a blowout using a funeral charm to make a nexus a 4/1.
It seems to be good against Twin (steals Splinter Twin), Tron (eats removal and Karn Liberated's exile ability), Affinity (steals the counters from Arcbound Ravager when it gets removed) Scapeshift (you just take 2 damage instead of 3 from Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle)and Burn.
that said, i wouldn't side it in vs tron, as i would try and strip their hand in the first turns. also, most of tron's removal isn't single target, unless they board in dismember or beast within. essentially, t2 spellskite isn't as good as 2 raven's crime or even a smallpox.
it is really good vs the stompy version of infect for sure.
Dumb Question: I'm guessing Phyrexian Vatmother is played over Hand of the Praetors because of resiliency to burn?
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Also, what do people think of Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon? I see some people are running one and others are not. For those of you running one what are your experiences with him in your decks?
And finally, do you guys think Waste Not deserves a spot in the deck when it gets released? I'm really liking the card and I feel like we have enough discard in the deck to make it worth it. Thanks!
Modern: Green Stompy
Commander: Omnath, Locus of Mana
Legacy: UR Delver
@Crescit: I think this deck can do fine without Bob. He's not nearly as strong in this deck as he is in Jund for example (because you don't care about your opponent's life total, making him useless as an attacker). I'm not sure about Phyrexian Arena, because you want to cast your creatures turn three and possibly four, making arena too slow I think. I prefer just running Night's Whisper (or Read the Bones) instead.
Waste Not looks like a very good card, but the fact that the zombies are just going to be blockers makes it somewhat less valuable for this build - it might be an interesting sideboard-card, though.
I'm not sure what to think about Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon. I played a GPT yesterday (went 4-2) and he was really only useful in one game. In some matchups he's great, but if you're playing against Burn or Aggro you don't want to see him in your hand.