Thoughts on the card choices
Been playing this somewhat budget version of the deck on MTGO for the last week a fair bit and feel like I'm absolutely killing it. Bosk Banneret, Burning-Tree Emissary, and Beastcaller Savant are so good at dumping your hand for that turn 4 power play. The haste from Beastcaller Savant has been relevant in so many games, allowing me to get in 3 extra damage off of a Rage Forger. I started testing with only 2 Shaman of the Great Hunt but he has just been amazing. So far I have not had the dud opening hand full of him and always seem to draw a good amount. He is easily the second lord, and I couldn't imagine playing any other 4 drop unless it also had haste. The card draw is a bonus but rarely used.
Commune with Nature was excluded at first but after testing the card is exactly what we want. I've still got to pick up some other sideboard silver bullets like Fulminator Mage which is super pricey. But commune with nature makes game two a lot better when looking for silver bullets. Also hitting that Burning-Tree Emissary turn one with it is satisfying.
I continually side out Eternal Witness and I may end up removing it altogether. I'm trying to be pretty fast in general and it really offers nothing at the three many slot. I will probably also remove Anger of the Gods and Flames of the Firebrand from the sideboard. I thought the deck might struggle against tokens but it does fine.
I don't know why you would ever go down to three Flamekin Harbinger. It gives you assurance of hitting Rage Forger, and redundancy in getting multiple copies. Sometimes topdecking that Rage Forger is all you need to close out a game. I've won off triggers in board stalls several times now.
Cards I've tested that underperformed and removed. Birds of Paradise - not really needed at all when you have Beastcaller Savant. It also feels horrible to topdeck. Experiment One - Also feels absolutely horrible to topdeck. Might consider testing a 2 of again. Fauna Shaman - Just way to slow and clunky. Might put in the sideboard now that I have a little room for the grindier matchups. Oath of Nissa - I did a little goldfishing with this replacing Commune and feel its strictly worse. Digging 5 for that missing aggro piece is huge over digging for 3. Æther Vial - Don't really need help emptying your hand with the aforementioned cards that help you do so. Again another horrible top deck.
Non-budget updgrades Fulminator Mage - We can race tron fairly well but it would be a lot better to have this guy in the main and side. Cavern of Souls - Obvious reasons. So expensive though. Mutavault - Can't have too many colourless sources, but I would love to test a muta. Could make a world of difference.
Fetches/Shocks - Obvious helps our mana consistency. Atarka's Command - This card is close to 10 tix and to be honest I'm not sure it is what we want. I feel unblockable effect from Gruul charm would be more useful, however that gain control of permanents you control is such garbage. Collected Company - Obvious choice, I think it might be a 2 of in place of Shaman of the Great Hunt. Raging Ravine - Maybe a one of, cant really afford to have taplands, but manlands are always good against grindy decks.
I think you should try Firemantle Shaman in place of Shaman of the Great Hunt. It could help you gain that last bit of damage in. I have moved onto Elves or Slivers, but I recently got Aether Vials and I am itching to try them. I will see about Beastcaller Savant. I don't think it should replace Birds or Vial simply due to the fact that it can't cast turn 2 Blood Moon. I mean neither can Aether Vial, but the increased combat tricks might be worth it as well as the turn 3 explosiveness with Burning-Tree Emissary or other plays.
I use Shared Animosity as a 5th Rage Forger and Eternal Witness as a 6th Rage Forger. I think I have too many spells in the main deck, but Blood Moon is so good. I would love to go up to 2 Blood Moon and 3 Aether Vial, but I feel Vial would be very important in many grindier or faster matchups. I don't always have the mana and it will be more likely to be alive then Birds. I could try beasthunter savant in that spot, but I don't think he works as well save for some explosive turn 3 plays, but Aether Vial can get those expolosive turn 3 plays as well while providing more combat tricks. Fulminator Mage is distinctly better than Goblin Ruinblaster.
I'll give Firemantle Mage a shot. I did dismiss it in my first iteration and never had it as a card to test out, but yeah it could definitely help close out games.
After watching the Building on a Budget series on this deck, I decided to make this my 5th Modern deck. Already having a playset of Fulminator Mage from Living End makes it easier to upgrade the deck. With Tron being such a force right now... this deck mat surprise people.
What's the worst match up?
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Modern
Bogles / BW Tokens / Skred Red Legacy
Burn Pauper
Songs of the Damned / Elves Commander
Lin Sivvi
Coco Elves will generally have better match ups due to speed. They can win on turn 3. There wasn't a turn 3 win for shaman last time I checked.
Shamans are slowish and rely heavily on Rage Forger. They don't have the same hand refills that elves have and are more vulnerable to board wipes especially to pyroclasms and anger as well as targeted removal on rage forger.
I think it is a fine FNM deck, but it is slower than other faster Aggro based decks like infect, affinity, elves, even Merfolk. Unless you are playing with Blood Moon it can also be more vulnerable to midrange and control due the utter reliance on Rage Forger.
Hey guys, first post, I just put together a version of the deck this week and I was wondering: is there any consensus as to Skarrg Guildmage vs Tattermunge Witch vs Firemantle Mage in the sideboard? All 3 seem to counteract tokens/dudes that are in the deck's way for the turn 4 push, but I'm stumped as to which would be a better pick. Tattermunge and Skarrg seem better on paper as a potential mana-sink and for multiple activations, but Firemantle has the ability to avoid blockers altogether.
Here's the current list I've thrown together:
I ordered a playset of Beastcaller Savants to try out in place of Elvish Mystics, and I'll probably be cutting Eternal Witness to the sideboard (it's been a little too slow for my liking) for something else in the maindeck, maybe another Fauna Shaman eventually, but I'm building this on super-budget for now.
I'm trying to run a faster T4/T5-Kill oriented build rather than a more midrange one, so any comments or suggestions about card choice (main or sideboard) would be awesome; the primer and this whole thread have been really helpful.
I may have to try Beastcaller Savant in for Aether Vials and Birds.
I haven't tried it before, but it should be ok especially if we have a bosk banneret in play. It could be fast enough on the whole to make it work.
I tried a list a couple weeks ago and 1-2. Lost to Storm and Tron, but beat Jund. I don't think this is as good as Merfolk, Slivers, Elves, or Allies for your Tribal fix though. I love it to death though. I think he should play some number of Firemantle Mage even as a 1 of. It is certainly an interesting list on the whole. I think though the sideboard is just a mess with no blood moon.
Beastcaller Savant's been working out really well for me; dropping him with a Bosk already onboard is pretty nutso. I'm not running a build w/ CoCo or Vial, so maybe those decks would lose a lot more because of the creature spells only clause. Maybe I just like him because it's a lot more satisfying to be able to put a die on all of your cards. I've done pretty well so far, going 2-1 two weeks and 1-2 another week, losing out to Jund Obliterator valuethon, Mardu Superfriends valuefest, and bad hands.
So full spoiler dropped today. What do you guys think of Kessig Forgemaster? Think it's worth it even if it loses it's Shaman type when flipped? I think it still does since it's an acolyte of the Inferno in our tribe that turns into a better version of it (and still triggers Forger if it already has its counters.) It might make it a bit trickier to play Forger though as you might miss the Werewolf from time to time. Maybe better in a Vial/Sideboard Savage Summoning version where you can vial in Forger in response to him flipping?
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Current Decks:
MODERN: RG Shamanism RG WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
I don't think a 2/1 for 2 even with that ability will be all that great on the battlefield for us. All told, I believe. Would I want this over a bosk banneret, an elvish visionary, a fauna shaman, or any other 2 mana shaman at the end of a BTE chain.
One of my local shops is closing its doors. I want to bring an updated Shaman deck to that last day. It was the first deck that I built for modern to play at this store and I want to play it again.
I have Aether Vials, 3 Birds, and can acquire Beastcaller Savants.
I might cut the collected company from the deck and go with Oath of Nissa or Commune with Nature or even Lead the Stampede. I understand the value of collected company, but without mana dorks, it makes it tough to cast especially since we aren't going to cast it on turn 3. I feel I need to have a relic of progenitus in the sideboard as well as a Troll Ascetic since I don't have Thrun. This is my current thoughts, might even need another Goblin Ruinblaster and replace the Wolf-Skull Shaman in the main.
I don't think it is appropriate to remove lightning bolt. I have won a lot, a lot of Shamans games off the back of top decking a lightning bolt. It might just stand out in my mind, but lightening bolt is key I think to the deck.
"Playing on a budget" with Aether Vial x4. What a funny guy.
Nevermind the Aether Vial, what about that land base? That "budget" deck is about 600$ hahaha
And I´ll have to agree, I don't see the point in not playing lightning bolt in this deck, I´d add even more burn in the form of Atarka's Command if I wasn't so stinking poor.
Regarding the new set, it does not look very exciting does it?
Kessig Forgemaster is probably playable if you are on a tight budget, then again I think Ire Shaman probably is better in most cases and just as cheap. Lambholt Pacifist is a bit to slow and unreliable I´d say. Most of the time this will be a 3/3 Defender for 2 :/ Sage of Ancient Lore terrible, basically draw a card for 5 mana? Maybe sideboard tech against card drawing decks, now with the unban and what not? But good luck getting it to flip :/ Traverse the Ulvenwald Pretty neat card, I´ve however no clue how to reach delirium with our deck. Getting a land and a creatur into the graveyard is easy enough, if you play with fetches that is, what about the rest? It´s a good card to have, but once you have to adapt your deck to it don't think it´s worthwhile. Cryptolith Rite might be okayish? Not the mana dork we´ve been looking for though
And where did all the black shamans go? Not a single one among the vampires?
This isn't his "playing on a budget" series it's his Rogue's Alley series. He did a previous one that was actually budgeted cheaply. Both are pretty good for those who haven't seen the deck in action.
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Ancient Ziggurat
7 Mountain
7 Forest
Creatures (30)
4 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Bosk Banneret
4 Elvish Visionary
2 Eternal Witness
2 Skinshifter
4 Rage Forger
4 Shaman of the Great Hunt
4 Beastcaller Savant
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Lightning Bolt
Soceries(2)
2 Commune with Nature
3 Naturalize
4 Reclamation Sage
2 Wolf-Skull Shaman
2 Sensation Gorger
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Flames of the Firebrand
Thoughts on the card choices
Been playing this somewhat budget version of the deck on MTGO for the last week a fair bit and feel like I'm absolutely killing it. Bosk Banneret, Burning-Tree Emissary, and Beastcaller Savant are so good at dumping your hand for that turn 4 power play. The haste from Beastcaller Savant has been relevant in so many games, allowing me to get in 3 extra damage off of a Rage Forger. I started testing with only 2 Shaman of the Great Hunt but he has just been amazing. So far I have not had the dud opening hand full of him and always seem to draw a good amount. He is easily the second lord, and I couldn't imagine playing any other 4 drop unless it also had haste. The card draw is a bonus but rarely used.
Commune with Nature was excluded at first but after testing the card is exactly what we want. I've still got to pick up some other sideboard silver bullets like Fulminator Mage which is super pricey. But commune with nature makes game two a lot better when looking for silver bullets. Also hitting that Burning-Tree Emissary turn one with it is satisfying.
I continually side out Eternal Witness and I may end up removing it altogether. I'm trying to be pretty fast in general and it really offers nothing at the three many slot. I will probably also remove Anger of the Gods and Flames of the Firebrand from the sideboard. I thought the deck might struggle against tokens but it does fine.
I don't know why you would ever go down to three Flamekin Harbinger. It gives you assurance of hitting Rage Forger, and redundancy in getting multiple copies. Sometimes topdecking that Rage Forger is all you need to close out a game. I've won off triggers in board stalls several times now.
Cards I've tested that underperformed and removed.
Birds of Paradise - not really needed at all when you have Beastcaller Savant. It also feels horrible to topdeck.
Experiment One - Also feels absolutely horrible to topdeck. Might consider testing a 2 of again.
Fauna Shaman - Just way to slow and clunky. Might put in the sideboard now that I have a little room for the grindier matchups.
Oath of Nissa - I did a little goldfishing with this replacing Commune and feel its strictly worse. Digging 5 for that missing aggro piece is huge over digging for 3.
Æther Vial - Don't really need help emptying your hand with the aforementioned cards that help you do so. Again another horrible top deck.
Non-budget updgrades
Fulminator Mage - We can race tron fairly well but it would be a lot better to have this guy in the main and side.
Cavern of Souls - Obvious reasons. So expensive though.
Mutavault - Can't have too many colourless sources, but I would love to test a muta. Could make a world of difference.
Fetches/Shocks - Obvious helps our mana consistency.
Atarka's Command - This card is close to 10 tix and to be honest I'm not sure it is what we want. I feel unblockable effect from Gruul charm would be more useful, however that gain control of permanents you control is such garbage.
Collected Company - Obvious choice, I think it might be a 2 of in place of Shaman of the Great Hunt.
Raging Ravine - Maybe a one of, cant really afford to have taplands, but manlands are always good against grindy decks.
2 Mutavault
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
4 Copperline Gorge
4 Forest
1 Mountain
3 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Bosk Banneret
4 Rage Forger
2 Burning-Tree Shaman
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
1 Eternal Witness
2 Firemantle Shaman
2 Fauna Shaman
1 Beastcaller Savant
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Aether Vial
1 Blood Moon
2 Collected Company
1 Shared Animosity
2 Blood Moon
2 Reclamation Sage
3 Goblin Ruinblaster
3 Essence Warden
2 Dismember
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Destructive Revelry
I use Shared Animosity as a 5th Rage Forger and Eternal Witness as a 6th Rage Forger. I think I have too many spells in the main deck, but Blood Moon is so good. I would love to go up to 2 Blood Moon and 3 Aether Vial, but I feel Vial would be very important in many grindier or faster matchups. I don't always have the mana and it will be more likely to be alive then Birds. I could try beasthunter savant in that spot, but I don't think he works as well save for some explosive turn 3 plays, but Aether Vial can get those expolosive turn 3 plays as well while providing more combat tricks. Fulminator Mage is distinctly better than Goblin Ruinblaster.
What's the worst match up?
Bogles / BW Tokens / Skred Red
Legacy
Burn
Pauper
Songs of the Damned / Elves
Commander
Lin Sivvi
Anyone knows how it compares to Stompy abd CoCo Elves??? (Already own Stompy and have most of CoCo Elves minus the fetches, Chords, and CoCo)
And what are the overall matchups like in the Modern meta?
Im on the fence about whether I should pick this up or not (if money would be better spent upgradibg other stuff **** the two mentioned above)
How am I an Ascended Mage? I only play tabletop casual, and I dont even know if I'm playing the game correctly
Modern
GStompyG/UBNinjasUB
Legacy
UPhasenoughtU
EDH
RNorin the WaryR
UBRThraximundarUBR
Shamans are slowish and rely heavily on Rage Forger. They don't have the same hand refills that elves have and are more vulnerable to board wipes especially to pyroclasms and anger as well as targeted removal on rage forger.
I think it is a fine FNM deck, but it is slower than other faster Aggro based decks like infect, affinity, elves, even Merfolk. Unless you are playing with Blood Moon it can also be more vulnerable to midrange and control due the utter reliance on Rage Forger.
Here's the current list I've thrown together:
7 Forest
5 Mountain
4 Rootbound Crag
1 Wooded Foothills
4 Karplusan Forest
Creatures (32)
1 Skinshifter
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Rage Forger
4 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Wolf-Skull Shaman
1 Burning-Tree Shaman
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fauna Shaman
4 Bosk Banneret
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Commune with Nature
1 Firemantle Mage
2 Essence Warden
1 Rending Volley
1 Troll Ascetic
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Guttural Response
1 Eyes of the Wisent
2 Goblin Ruinblaster
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Destructive Revelry
I ordered a playset of Beastcaller Savants to try out in place of Elvish Mystics, and I'll probably be cutting Eternal Witness to the sideboard (it's been a little too slow for my liking) for something else in the maindeck, maybe another Fauna Shaman eventually, but I'm building this on super-budget for now.
I'm trying to run a faster T4/T5-Kill oriented build rather than a more midrange one, so any comments or suggestions about card choice (main or sideboard) would be awesome; the primer and this whole thread have been really helpful.
http://www.gatheringmagic.com/kevincrimin-video-01282015-rogues-alley-modern-shamans/
I haven't tried it before, but it should be ok especially if we have a bosk banneret in play. It could be fast enough on the whole to make it work.
I tried a list a couple weeks ago and 1-2. Lost to Storm and Tron, but beat Jund. I don't think this is as good as Merfolk, Slivers, Elves, or Allies for your Tribal fix though. I love it to death though. I think he should play some number of Firemantle Mage even as a 1 of. It is certainly an interesting list on the whole. I think though the sideboard is just a mess with no blood moon.
I kinda want to go down to 20 lands, 10 non-creature spells, and 30 creatures. It is very very hard to do I think.
Non-Creature spells I want to include - Aether Vial, Bolt, Company/Lead/Commune/Oath, Blood Moon, Shared Animosity, Sarkhan Vol/Arlinn Kord/Domri Rade.
I like having blood moon in the main deck. I can replace Aether Vial with Birds (best) or Beastcaller Savant.
I think it might be best if playing Arlinn Kord tolook for a turn 4 rage forger off of aether vial.
Turn 1, land - aether vial,
Turn 2, land - Shaman, vial in flamekin,
Turn 3, land - shaman, vial in shaman
turn 4, land Arlinn, vial in Rage forger.
I don't know if that even works.
MODERN:
RG Shamanism RG
WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
LEGACY:
WUBRG Cascabalance WUBRG
Made by the amazing Traproot
"Some say the clockwork doesn't speak... I say they are deaf to it's voice." -Daeren, Artificer Druid.
Archester Revival (Custom Steampunk set)
I have Aether Vials, 3 Birds, and can acquire Beastcaller Savants.
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Mutavault
2 Stomping Ground
4 Copperline Gorge
4 Forest
1 Mountain
Creatures
4 Rageforger
3 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Bosk Banneret
4 Elvish Visionary
2 Fauna Shaman
2 Firemantle Mage
2 Burning-Tree Shaman
1 Eternal Witness
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Wolf-Skull Shaman
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Collected Company
4 Aether Vial
1 Blood Moon
1 Shared Animosity
2 Blood Moon
2 Spellskite
1 Dismember
3 Destructive Revelry
3 Essence Warden
2 Lead the Stampede
2 Goblin Ruinblaster
I might cut the collected company from the deck and go with Oath of Nissa or Commune with Nature or even Lead the Stampede. I understand the value of collected company, but without mana dorks, it makes it tough to cast especially since we aren't going to cast it on turn 3. I feel I need to have a relic of progenitus in the sideboard as well as a Troll Ascetic since I don't have Thrun. This is my current thoughts, might even need another Goblin Ruinblaster and replace the Wolf-Skull Shaman in the main.
"Playing on a budget" with Aether Vial x4. What a funny guy.
This isn't his "playing on a budget" series it's his Rogue's Alley series. He did a previous one that was actually budgeted cheaply. Both are pretty good for those who haven't seen the deck in action.
Actually closer to $1,000 if you look into the SB. Playset of Fulminator Mages, 2 Blood Moons, Magus of the Moon...