as for its relation to bans/unbans, i think you could loosely connect it if you wanted to. like if perception of fairness is dealing with playstyles, then its in the realm of play patterns; which is in turn dealing with diversity.
I think that fair decks absolutely get more leeway when it comes to bans than unfair decks do. I would say the fair decks kind of need to be more consistent than the unfair decks, because they can't exist the other way around. If the unfair decks were more consistent than the fair decks, there would be no reason to play a fair deck. If the fair decks are more consistent, you play a fair deck if you want to have lower variance, but you play an unfair deck if you're hoping to run hot for a tournament. So unfair decks become a problem when they become as consistent as the fair decks, which is why you'll see them get banned at lower meta percentages than fair decks do. For instance, Dredge and Amulet Bloom were only at like 6% when they got banned in 2016, while both GDS and Humans have been near 12% in the past two years.
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Modern UBR Grixis Shadow UBR UR Izzet Phoenix UR UW UW Control UW GB GB Rock GB
Commander BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
Can someone explain this deck to me.
It looks like a creature toolbox deck with a game ending combo. It really doesnt seem that great when I watched the video, but its put up some good results with the pilot who created the deck. Do you guys think its good?
Can someone explain this deck to me.
It looks like a creature toolbox deck with a game ending combo. It really doesnt seem that great when I watched the video, but its put up some good results with the pilot who created the deck. Do you guys think its good?
It's reasonable. Certainly able to 5-0 leagues, but I doubt we'll see it at the top tables any time soon. It has a lot of aggro elements that allow it to pressure decks while having access to toolbox cards to delay combo decks. Then it has that Imperious Greatwurm combo aspect to just hit for 16 if you set it up right.
Modern GP this weekend! I predict much Humans, much Tron, UW fighting to keep down Dredge and KCI. No major breakouts as I dont think Arclights are refined enough.
Isn't Infect very nicely positioned for what the SCG meta has represented? While both GP meta and SCg may vary I still look at Infect and see it is tyhe combo deck to slay other combo decks. Speaking of Unfair, Infect is one of my favorite decks, and I still get players who tell me, "Infect sucks play against". I ask them if they'd like to test against "tron" and they promptly stop complaining
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Standard Arena: Eh? Gruul or Die
Modern: Decks I'm playing right now: G Mono Green Tron (34-10-3 paper record, only SCG/Regionals/PPTQ record) C Eldrazi Tron (9-5) UG Infect RW Burn
Modern GP this weekend! I predict much Humans, much Tron, UW fighting to keep down Dredge and KCI. No major breakouts as I dont think Arclights are refined enough.
I'd put money on Living End having a show in the Top8 since nobody's talked about it for a while and all focus is on those you just listed.
Modern GP this weekend! I predict much Humans, much Tron, UW fighting to keep down Dredge and KCI. No major breakouts as I dont think Arclights are refined enough.
I'd put money on Living End having a show in the Top8 since nobody's talked about it for a while and all focus is on those you just listed.
Modern GP this weekend! I predict much Humans, much Tron, UW fighting to keep down Dredge and KCI. No major breakouts as I dont think Arclights are refined enough.
I'd put money on Living End having a show in the Top8 since nobody's talked about it for a while and all focus is on those you just listed.
How's it's Humans match?
I would imagine it's fairly poor. But that's kinda what I mean. Everybody's banking on Humans, Tron, UW and will bring tons of hate for those. If something like Living End can make a late run into Day 2 it should have a great shot of beating the decks that are hating on those top 3.
I would say Dredge is the top thing on people's minds. People are increasing their sideboard graveyard hate, which certainly isn't good for Living End.
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Modern UBR Grixis Shadow UBR UR Izzet Phoenix UR UW UW Control UW GB GB Rock GB
Commander BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
I would say Dredge is the top thing on people's minds. People are increasing their sideboard graveyard hate, which certainly isn't good for Living End.
Yeah I wouldnt play anything GY based really right now.
I think the field is wide enough, the power-level flat enough, and the quantity of top 8 small enough that people are reading results and making prediction based on what is mostly noise.
If all decks were absolutely equals, the sample size is low enough that there'd be outliers and that would be "the predicted metagame". Obviously in this idealized case, the fact that it's all noise is self-evident. I think the current state of modern is close enough to this that using past recent results is misleading.
I'd say play what you master.
OTOH, enough people use recent results to set the sideboard, so the advice would be to play whatever has not won recently.
PS: so, to give advice where I said one shouldn't, I'd play valakut. It's hard to completely block, fast enough to combo and resilient even if they surgical extraction your scapeshift. Sideboard plan is easy: blow up enchantments and artifacts.
Also it seems that Humans is just super popular despite how well it does. Its appeal and power level, real or not, makes so many people want to paly it. Reminds me of GDS when it was the top deck. Might not be #1 in the meta, but you better be playing a deck that has a reasonable mu against it.
With that said, most decks have managed to deal with Humans. Even storms mu post board is pretty close nowadays
Can someone explain this deck to me.
It looks like a creature toolbox deck with a game ending combo. It really doesnt seem that great when I watched the video, but its put up some good results with the pilot who created the deck. Do you guys think its good?
I went 3-1 with the deck tonight at FNM, beating Burn 2-1, losing to Bant Spirits 1-2, beating Grixis Shadow 2-0, and beating UR Delver 2-1. I also wondered what the **** was up with this deck. I literally assumed that all of his opponents scooped so that a Troll deck would win.
But the deck has a bit of game. It has certain cards that are solid in some matchups, the element of surprise, and sometimes just a 16 damage spell to your dome. Fetch shock into fetch in Modern puts you at 16, so it should be okay vs. many of those type decks.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Also it seems that Humans is just super popular despite how well it does. Its appeal and power level, real or not, makes so many people want to paly it. Reminds me of GDS when it was the top deck. Might not be #1 in the meta, but you better be playing a deck that has a reasonable mu against it.
With that said, most decks have managed to deal with Humans. Even storms mu post board is pretty close nowadays
As I've mentioned before in many threads, this one included, Humans is good because all of its matchups are more favorable to Humans than any opponent believes. All of its matchups are about 5%+ closer to 50/50 (or 55/45 in Humans' favor) than everyone estimates. That's why my advice to anyone who says "My Humans matchup is X/Y" needs to subtract about 5% from X. This makes it a great choice in any field.
I know it doesn't necessarily destroy diversity like Twin did, but being THAT 50/50 isn't ban worthy down the road? (Not that I'm implying it needs one).
I know it doesn't necessarily destroy diversity like Twin did, but being THAT 50/50 isn't ban worthy down the road? (Not that I'm implying it needs one).
Why do you have to say that...I know you've been on a break but....bruh.
I've put off buying into Humans because it's not my style but man does it feel great to shut down various combo decks and still go toe to toe with the control/ midrange decks of the format. It's one Achilles's heel is Tron. The Tron vs Humans match ups favors tron, it's worse if the Tron deck has 3-4 Ballista's.
Aside from that, Humans is quite good. While Spirits is able to operate better on the tempo axis, Humans isn't far behind in that category. If we had to chose between Spirits and Humans right now, what's the better deck atm?
For those of you who have tested Humans vs Spirits (I haven't yet) what's that like? Who's favored in the head to head?
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Standard Arena: Eh? Gruul or Die
Modern: Decks I'm playing right now: G Mono Green Tron (34-10-3 paper record, only SCG/Regionals/PPTQ record) C Eldrazi Tron (9-5) UG Infect RW Burn
I would say Dredge is the top thing on people's minds. People are increasing their sideboard graveyard hate, which certainly isn't good for Living End.
Yeah I wouldnt play anything GY based really right now.
yeah my bad guys. I meant Ad Naus, not Living End. I don't face either very often and am prone to getting them mixed up, even though they're barely anything alike.
I got wrecked at FNM by a friend on Ad Nauseam a couple of weeks back. He was using Dasneakypete's online list and got a sideboard sheet, along with tips on how to sideboard. It could very well be well positioned. The last thing a big mana player wants to see is a freaking Ad Nauseam opponent across from them.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
I know it doesn't necessarily destroy diversity like Twin did, but being THAT 50/50 isn't ban worthy down the road? (Not that I'm implying it needs one).
Its GP and PT prevalence just isn't very high. By all accounts on MTGO (Challenges and PTQs/MOCS), it isn't too high there either. This suggests to me that there's nothing bannable about the deck. It's just one of many strong Modern strategies, as we have seen over almost literally 3 years at this point. Remember that this is a period where none of the ban mania towards any decks has ever panned out, because the format has always self-corrected after a few months time.
I got wrecked at FNM by a friend on Ad Nauseam a couple of weeks back. He was using Dasneakypete's online list and got a sideboard sheet, along with tips on how to sideboard. It could very well be well positioned. The last thing a big mana player wants to see is a freaking Ad Nauseam opponent across from them.
I bought it online and had a 20-4 run in leagues. Two losses were to Tron; 1 was to Bogles. I understand those are supposed to be highly favored, but it just didn’t shake out that way for me. I lost one Tron game 3 because my Spoils Of the Vault dug down 24 cards to find the first Ad Nauseam and exiled all my wincons.
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UBR Grixis Shadow UBR
UR Izzet Phoenix UR
UW UW Control UW
GB GB Rock GB
Commander
BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG
BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
Can someone explain this deck to me.
It looks like a creature toolbox deck with a game ending combo. It really doesnt seem that great when I watched the video, but its put up some good results with the pilot who created the deck. Do you guys think its good?
URStormRU
GRTitanshift[mana]RG/mana]
It's reasonable. Certainly able to 5-0 leagues, but I doubt we'll see it at the top tables any time soon. It has a lot of aggro elements that allow it to pressure decks while having access to toolbox cards to delay combo decks. Then it has that Imperious Greatwurm combo aspect to just hit for 16 if you set it up right.
Spirits
Modern: Decks I'm playing right now:
G Mono Green Tron (34-10-3 paper record, only SCG/Regionals/PPTQ record)
C Eldrazi Tron (9-5)
UG Infect
RW Burn
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
How's it's Humans match?
Spirits
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
UBR Grixis Shadow UBR
UR Izzet Phoenix UR
UW UW Control UW
GB GB Rock GB
Commander
BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG
BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
Yeah I wouldnt play anything GY based really right now.
Spirits
If all decks were absolutely equals, the sample size is low enough that there'd be outliers and that would be "the predicted metagame". Obviously in this idealized case, the fact that it's all noise is self-evident. I think the current state of modern is close enough to this that using past recent results is misleading.
I'd say play what you master.
OTOH, enough people use recent results to set the sideboard, so the advice would be to play whatever has not won recently.
PS: so, to give advice where I said one shouldn't, I'd play valakut. It's hard to completely block, fast enough to combo and resilient even if they surgical extraction your scapeshift. Sideboard plan is easy: blow up enchantments and artifacts.
I feel like titanshift and tron are poised to do well if they dodge burn
Something like storm or kci seems well positioned too.
I wonder how long humans will be a police deck. It certainly wasn't the flash in a pan. Humans is such a common tribe in every set too.
With that said, most decks have managed to deal with Humans. Even storms mu post board is pretty close nowadays
URStormRU
GRTitanshift[mana]RG/mana]
I went 3-1 with the deck tonight at FNM, beating Burn 2-1, losing to Bant Spirits 1-2, beating Grixis Shadow 2-0, and beating UR Delver 2-1. I also wondered what the **** was up with this deck. I literally assumed that all of his opponents scooped so that a Troll deck would win.
But the deck has a bit of game. It has certain cards that are solid in some matchups, the element of surprise, and sometimes just a 16 damage spell to your dome. Fetch shock into fetch in Modern puts you at 16, so it should be okay vs. many of those type decks.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)As I've mentioned before in many threads, this one included, Humans is good because all of its matchups are more favorable to Humans than any opponent believes. All of its matchups are about 5%+ closer to 50/50 (or 55/45 in Humans' favor) than everyone estimates. That's why my advice to anyone who says "My Humans matchup is X/Y" needs to subtract about 5% from X. This makes it a great choice in any field.
I know it doesn't necessarily destroy diversity like Twin did, but being THAT 50/50 isn't ban worthy down the road? (Not that I'm implying it needs one).
Why do you have to say that...I know you've been on a break but....bruh.
Spirits
I am salty I bough the deck and sold it off very quickly before the new tech was found after Mullens.
Aside from that, Humans is quite good. While Spirits is able to operate better on the tempo axis, Humans isn't far behind in that category. If we had to chose between Spirits and Humans right now, what's the better deck atm?
For those of you who have tested Humans vs Spirits (I haven't yet) what's that like? Who's favored in the head to head?
Modern: Decks I'm playing right now:
G Mono Green Tron (34-10-3 paper record, only SCG/Regionals/PPTQ record)
C Eldrazi Tron (9-5)
UG Infect
RW Burn
My point was, Twin didnt destroy diversity. Thats a myth perpetuated by people who didnt look at the facts.
Spirits
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Its GP and PT prevalence just isn't very high. By all accounts on MTGO (Challenges and PTQs/MOCS), it isn't too high there either. This suggests to me that there's nothing bannable about the deck. It's just one of many strong Modern strategies, as we have seen over almost literally 3 years at this point. Remember that this is a period where none of the ban mania towards any decks has ever panned out, because the format has always self-corrected after a few months time.