Mardu has the best removal suite in the entire format, push doesn't do a thing for the deck. It's lacking win cons. If a Goyf like creature could be played in Mardu, Jund and Junk would absolutely not be the better decks
Mardu needs more 2 CMC bombs, as of now Bob is their only great creature in the decks. They also can't play Flayer, so that also dodged the creatures they're starved for
Junk is not going to go down if dredge does. What is your reasoning for this? I'd rather be casting anger of fires all day.
Currently Junk/Jund is mostly from the SB options you get with a premium against Dredge. Jund's removal and SB options are just not as good against Dredge and it's rise has been congruent with the rise of Dredge and resulting decline in Jund. Abzan has a better Dredge match up and is favored in the BGx mirrors.
I actually think that Junk has a generally better removal suite to Mardu in the current meta-game. While Bolt will always be a MD worthy card lots of the decks that are giving mid-range fits are having fits precisely because the aggro-combo decks are better against bolt than any other removal spell. Infect, DRzoo, URprowess all have more answers to damage based removal than other conditional removal. Adding FPush to it will just improve those match ups.
It could also be that there's the beta leak and it always spoils things before they announce it anyway, that's what happened with Twin and Bloom last year
Something Emrakul related is getting banned in standard, I think, the format is doing very poorly and has come down to cheating Emrakul or dropping Gideon down. I imagine WOTC is unhappy reading all these articles about what a slump their most focused format is performing
Nightmare scenario, they didn't realize a twin combo would happen for standard and they're preemptively banning something. That's more a lolidoubt it scenario though.
I hope modern changes are being announced, I'll be very sad if no changes are announced
There's no way they are preemptively banning something in Standard. Stoddard recently (last 6 months) talked about how preemptive bans make people really upset. This ban is 80% going to be Emrakul in Standard, 15% Marvelworks in Standard, and 5% "No changes" in Standard. Regardless of the outcome, they are announcing it today instead of next week so pros don't have it hanging over their head and affecting their preparations.
The only question is if they'll do the Modern announcement too. I think they will do it for all formats to avoid more mania over the next week.
We could've pre-banned Eye of Ugin or Eldrazi Temple, but I think that would've also made people pretty unhappy.
Likeliest scenario is an Emrakul unban announced early to give PT players time to prepare. It's also possible they are trying to get ahead of a potential beta leak, which has definitely happened before.
I can imagine there being an Emrakul ban and a 'goodwill' unban of something for the modern community for pr purposes. Either way, should be an interesting day.
It could also be that there's the beta leak and it always spoils things before they announce it anyway, that's what happened with Twin and Bloom last year
Something Emrakul related is getting banned in standard, I think, the format is doing very poorly and has come down to cheating Emrakul or dropping Gideon down. I imagine WOTC is unhappy reading all these articles about what a slump their most focused format is performing
Nightmare scenario, they didn't realize a twin combo would happen for standard and they're preemptively banning something. That's more a lolidoubt it scenario though.
I hope modern changes are being announced, I'll be very sad if no changes are announced
There's no way they are preemptively banning something in Standard. Stoddard recently (last 6 months) talked about how preemptive bans make people really upset. This ban is 80% going to be Emrakul in Standard, 15% Marvelworks in Standard, and 5% "No changes" in Standard. Regardless of the outcome, they are announcing it today instead of next week so pros don't have it hanging over their head and affecting their preparations.
The only question is if they'll do the Modern announcement too. I think they will do it for all formats to avoid more mania over the next week.
If Emrakul was to get banned in standard, it would (well, should) indicate very clearly how cards that are too good for standard can be borderline unplayable (or at least average) in modern.
Clear examples are the "banned before modern began" cards like sfm and jace. Despite some no-bans modern, there isn't any real evidence to damn those two cards to the extent where they should remain banned. There's very much a lingering fear of these cards because of their domination in standard. Yes, they see play in legacy, however as we should all recognise, legacy is a different sort of animal. Delver, for example, is far better in legacy than in modern. Jace himself is better in legacy than he would be in modern, due to FoW, counterbalance, actual brainstorm, miracles effects and other powerful blue spells.
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
So 2pm EST this thread is going to change from a "they should ban/unban this" to "I told you so!" and "I quit!".
I can't wait to see if my SFM speculation paid XD.
If they ban something from dredge I'll have to accept that wotc is a bit more aggressive with the banned list than I would be. I don't think it would be crazy, just not really necessary.
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Modern Decks
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
Since I only buy foils, Im worried a Preordain unban will make those 50$ preordain foils shoot up. I wasn't ready to pull the trigger on them. I hope someone is hoarding 1000 of them and will release them if it gets unbanned
I thought this was the Modern thread so why are people talking about an Emrakul ban in Standard?
Many are explaining the context around an unprecedented bumped ban update, which is certainly relevant to Modern players who are all waiting anxiously for 2 more hours to see what happens. It's also relevant because, as purkle said, an Emrakul ban in Standard would underscore how broken Standard cards may suck in Modern. That helps us revisit old bans like SFM and JTMS, amongst others. Finally, it's possible (but unlikely) that Wizards would link an Emrakul ban to a Modern unban for PR reasons. I don't find that likely but I can see why one would speculate about it.
As long as people aren't debating Standard ban rationales and link their content back to Modern within the thread rules, the topic is fine.
It could also be that there's the beta leak and it always spoils things before they announce it anyway, that's what happened with Twin and Bloom last year
Something Emrakul related is getting banned in standard, I think, the format is doing very poorly and has come down to cheating Emrakul or dropping Gideon down. I imagine WOTC is unhappy reading all these articles about what a slump their most focused format is performing
Nightmare scenario, they didn't realize a twin combo would happen for standard and they're preemptively banning something. That's more a lolidoubt it scenario though.
I hope modern changes are being announced, I'll be very sad if no changes are announced
There's no way they are preemptively banning something in Standard. Stoddard recently (last 6 months) talked about how preemptive bans make people really upset. This ban is 80% going to be Emrakul in Standard, 15% Marvelworks in Standard, and 5% "No changes" in Standard. Regardless of the outcome, they are announcing it today instead of next week so pros don't have it hanging over their head and affecting their preparations.
The only question is if they'll do the Modern announcement too. I think they will do it for all formats to avoid more mania over the next week.
If Emrakul was to get banned in standard, it would (well, should) indicate very clearly how cards that are too good for standard can be borderline unplayable (or at least average) in modern.
Clear examples are the "banned before modern began" cards like sfm and jace. Despite some no-bans modern, there isn't any real evidence to damn those two cards to the extent where they should remain banned. There's very much a lingering fear of these cards because of their domination in standard. Yes, they see play in legacy, however as we should all recognise, legacy is a different sort of animal. Delver, for example, is far better in legacy than in modern. Jace himself is better in legacy than he would be in modern, due to FoW, counterbalance, actual brainstorm, miracles effects and other powerful blue spells.
I don't know.... We all found out about bans and unbans early in the past because of MTGO if there is a move looking to happen they want everyone to find out at the same time.
There is a reason the banlist date is normally set at a specific date. To move that date also requires a reason. If emmy was bad enough it required an emergency ban it would have been done before a week before the B&R announcement.
Now i am not speculating on whether or not standard cards will get axed i am just saying Bans happen at specific dates for a reason, and the Modern banlist is far more active than the standard banlist.
Since I only buy foils, Im worried a Preordain unban will make those 50$ preordain foils shoot up. I wasn't ready to pull the trigger on them. I hope someone is hoarding 1000 of them and will release them if it gets unbanned
Jesus, I just looked up the prices on foil preordains, thats nuts
I'm hyped
I bought 3x foil BBE's last year in anticipation
I want something big unbanned, even if its preordain and wouldn't effect the decks I play
the ONLY reason i can see moving up a B&R update is due to Standard bans since it hasn't happened since JTMS and SFM if i'm remembering correctly and wil be extremely relevant to those in PT testing. However that said i imaging this will still be for all formats and my guesses are as follows.
Standard: Emrakul Banned
Modern: Most likely no changes (Though I'd prefera SFM or pre-ordain unban).
Legacy: Top Banned
This is still the january announcement and even without a modern PT this is still the most likely time in my mind for big shakeups in modern besides just the printing of Fatal Push
Seems unlikely, since it just got a reprint in Eternal Masters. If they were considering banning it, they must have been thinking about it for a while, and I can't imagine them going ahead with something they thought they might turn around and immediately ban.
This is still the january announcement and even without a modern PT this is still the most likely time in my mind for big shakeups in modern besides just the printing of Fatal Push
Don't forget that while they did shake things up for Modern in the January 2016 banlist announcement, it was April when they unbanned Sword of the Meek and Ancestal Vision. Personally I think that's more likely for a big bombshell announcement.
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Playing UX Mana Denial until Modern gets the answers it needs.
WUBRG Humans BRW Mardu Pyromancer UW UW "Control" UR Blue Moon
Seems unlikely, since it just got a reprint in Eternal Masters. If they were considering banning it, they must have been thinking about it for a while, and I can't imagine them going ahead with something they thought they might turn around and immediately ban.
This is still the january announcement and even without a modern PT this is still the most likely time in my mind for big shakeups in modern besides just the printing of Fatal Push
Don't forget that while they did shake things up for Modern in the January 2016 banlist announcement, it was April when they unbanned Sword of the Meek and Ancestal Vision. Personally I think that's more likely for a big bombshell announcement.
That's fair, but I was one who was burned on getting twins in MM2015 and top is one of the most played cards in commander which was also a focus of EMA so i wouldn't put it or counterbalance past wotc.
And i do hope we get changes but like i posted i imagine modern will say no changes.
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Currently Junk/Jund is mostly from the SB options you get with a premium against Dredge. Jund's removal and SB options are just not as good against Dredge and it's rise has been congruent with the rise of Dredge and resulting decline in Jund. Abzan has a better Dredge match up and is favored in the BGx mirrors.
I actually think that Junk has a generally better removal suite to Mardu in the current meta-game. While Bolt will always be a MD worthy card lots of the decks that are giving mid-range fits are having fits precisely because the aggro-combo decks are better against bolt than any other removal spell. Infect, DRzoo, URprowess all have more answers to damage based removal than other conditional removal. Adding FPush to it will just improve those match ups.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
There's no way they are preemptively banning something in Standard. Stoddard recently (last 6 months) talked about how preemptive bans make people really upset. This ban is 80% going to be Emrakul in Standard, 15% Marvelworks in Standard, and 5% "No changes" in Standard. Regardless of the outcome, they are announcing it today instead of next week so pros don't have it hanging over their head and affecting their preparations.
The only question is if they'll do the Modern announcement too. I think they will do it for all formats to avoid more mania over the next week.
I doubt it. I think R&D knows pre-bans/emergency bans need to be reserved for serious problems. They also know how much they make players unhappy:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/latest-developments/modern-musings-2016-06-03
Likeliest scenario is an Emrakul unban announced early to give PT players time to prepare. It's also possible they are trying to get ahead of a potential beta leak, which has definitely happened before.
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
If Emrakul was to get banned in standard, it would (well, should) indicate very clearly how cards that are too good for standard can be borderline unplayable (or at least average) in modern.
Clear examples are the "banned before modern began" cards like sfm and jace. Despite some no-bans modern, there isn't any real evidence to damn those two cards to the extent where they should remain banned. There's very much a lingering fear of these cards because of their domination in standard. Yes, they see play in legacy, however as we should all recognise, legacy is a different sort of animal. Delver, for example, is far better in legacy than in modern. Jace himself is better in legacy than he would be in modern, due to FoW, counterbalance, actual brainstorm, miracles effects and other powerful blue spells.
If they ban something from dredge I'll have to accept that wotc is a bit more aggressive with the banned list than I would be. I don't think it would be crazy, just not really necessary.
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
RGTron
UGInfect
URStorm
WUBRAd Nauseam
BRGrishoalbrand
URGScapeshift
WBGAbzan Company
WUBRGAmulet Titan
BRGLiving End
WGBogles
Many are explaining the context around an unprecedented bumped ban update, which is certainly relevant to Modern players who are all waiting anxiously for 2 more hours to see what happens. It's also relevant because, as purkle said, an Emrakul ban in Standard would underscore how broken Standard cards may suck in Modern. That helps us revisit old bans like SFM and JTMS, amongst others. Finally, it's possible (but unlikely) that Wizards would link an Emrakul ban to a Modern unban for PR reasons. I don't find that likely but I can see why one would speculate about it.
As long as people aren't debating Standard ban rationales and link their content back to Modern within the thread rules, the topic is fine.
Very nicely put
I don't know.... We all found out about bans and unbans early in the past because of MTGO if there is a move looking to happen they want everyone to find out at the same time.
There is a reason the banlist date is normally set at a specific date. To move that date also requires a reason. If emmy was bad enough it required an emergency ban it would have been done before a week before the B&R announcement.
Now i am not speculating on whether or not standard cards will get axed i am just saying Bans happen at specific dates for a reason, and the Modern banlist is far more active than the standard banlist.
Jesus, I just looked up the prices on foil preordains, thats nuts
I'm hyped
I bought 3x foil BBE's last year in anticipation
I want something big unbanned, even if its preordain and wouldn't effect the decks I play
Standard: Emrakul Banned
Modern: Most likely no changes (Though I'd prefera SFM or pre-ordain unban).
Legacy: Top Banned
This is still the january announcement and even without a modern PT this is still the most likely time in my mind for big shakeups in modern besides just the printing of Fatal Push
I literally can't focus in class right now
C: Affinity, WUB: Esper Draw-Go
UR: Blood Moon Delver, UBR: Grixis Control/Delver
GWUR: Allies, UBR: Cruel Control
RGB: Living End, GWB: Wilt-Leaf Abzan
GU: Infect, GWR: Naya Liege
WU: Emeria Control
Spirits
Seems unlikely, since it just got a reprint in Eternal Masters. If they were considering banning it, they must have been thinking about it for a while, and I can't imagine them going ahead with something they thought they might turn around and immediately ban.
Don't forget that while they did shake things up for Modern in the January 2016 banlist announcement, it was April when they unbanned Sword of the Meek and Ancestal Vision. Personally I think that's more likely for a big bombshell announcement.
WUBRG Humans
BRW Mardu Pyromancer
UW UW "Control"
UR Blue Moon
thank you
I forgot the big unbans were in April
And i do hope we get changes but like i posted i imagine modern will say no changes.