Grixis and Jeskai Control in the Top 16. A little underrepresented but not horrible. Blue Mooon misses at 19th too. Also, interesting to see both Abzan and Jund in equal Top 32 representation.
It is pretty ambitious to call that jeskai list "control". Doesn't really matter though.
Maybe Company decks will replace twin as the go-to strategy that is versatile with the power to end games on the spot, albeit slower.
Now just need an optimized UR strategy to mop up these scrubs and the format will be in a great place.
green looking like the dominant color in modern. cantrips, value creatures, combos, tutors...
Seriously, I've got this Legacy project right now where I'm trying to make green decks that see as many cards or draw as much as blue. It's one of those things that most people haven't really come around to yet but they eventually will. Green now is what blue used to be when it comes to deck manipulation, and you get a bunch of creatures that create on board value too, card draw, tutoring, all you lack is removal. It's just as true in Modern as it is in Legacy, maybe even more so.
Grixis and Jeskai Control in the Top 16. A little underrepresented but not horrible. Blue Mooon misses at 19th too. Also, interesting to see both Abzan and Jund in equal Top 32 representation.
True, but there is also Taking Turns at 31st, how much more Blue could you get?! Oh, and Goblins in the top 32, which outside of Guides is certainly a powerful budget build for newer players to work with.
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The Modern Perspective - an article series all about Modern brought to you by PureMTGO.com
Wotc has repeatedly said that they want to provide green (and other colors) forms of unique card advantage.
It has always existed in some form or another, but the blue cantrip interactions are on a whole other level in legacy; not to mention providing the best forms of protection (fow, daze, etc).
The only long term problem I see for the game is that as they continue to improve creatures and print more balanced "spells" is that as time goes on that GB become the more prominant featured colors since they have a strangle on creatures + removal. It seems like every modern season that green style decks get more tools while everyone else is relying on the waning power of a bygone era.
Interested to see how it works out
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
Still no thopter combo deck? You know I really thought the sword of the meek unban would have a bigger impact on modern but so far I haven't seen any list do well using the thopter combo.
It might still be too early to call it a bust though.
Abzan Company is just gross. If it wouldn't have had the mirror in the quarters there would likely have been 3 in the semis. Tron essentially had a bye. Looking like abzan will win it all too. Kalitas showed some crazy value especially off of misplays.
Abzan Company runs at least two separate infinite combos in a deck full of value creatures and 8 spells that dig or tutor for free creatures at instant speed with Eternal Witness recursion backup. It's no wonder it's doing well.
It's notable that Abzan Company's historic police was the Snapcaster-Bolt deck. Will be interesting to see if such decks rise up for the massive Grand Prix Weekend on May 20 to beat back these Company decks.
I can't guarantee I'll actually do well, but I should be in LA representing Snap Bolt as best I can!
Will you decide to represent good or evil? Cpfusion Jekyll or Cpfusion Hyde? Cpfusion Harvey Dent or cpfusion Two Face? Will you want to succeed with your snap-bolt deck or lose so as to further languish in the misery that is post-Twin blue's irrelevance?
Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Well, it's certainly clear by this deck's performance that Birthing Pod will never again see the light of day in Modern, but I would very much hesitate to call for a Company ban. Even if it had numbers approaching Twin's, which it most certainly does not have, the elimination of Modern from the PT would probably save it.
Abzan Company is just gross. If it wouldn't have had the mirror in the quarters there would likely have been 3 in the semis. Tron essentially had a bye. Looking like abzan will win it all too. Kalitas showed some crazy value especially off of misplays.
Abzan Company runs at least two separate infinite combos in a deck full of value creatures and 8 spells that dig or tutor for free creatures at instant speed with Eternal Witness recursion backup. It's no wonder it's doing well.
It's notable that Abzan Company's historic police was the Snapcaster-Bolt deck. Will be interesting to see if such decks rise up for the massive Grand Prix Weekend on May 20 to beat back these Company decks.
I can't guarantee I'll actually do well, but I should be in LA representing Snap Bolt as best I can!
Will you decide to represent good or evil? Cpfusion Jekyll or Cpfusion Hyde? Cpfusion Harvey Dent or cpfusion Two Face? Will you want to succeed with your snap-bolt deck or lose so as to further languish in the misery that is post-Twin blue's irrelevance?
That's not even funny if you meant it as a joke, let alone if you were serious.
It's always the same thing after every tournament. If a deck shows good results the screaming for bans instantly happen. Ban this ban that! Just play the damn game and have some fun, I swear modern players are the biggest whiners I see in Magic.
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Legacy - Reanimator
Modern - Burn
EDH - Neheb the Eternal
Well, one of the exceptions that caused pod to hit the list is already being resurrected by company. It's gonna limit design space of 3 mana or less creatures. And yes I was joking but it was more in response to someone suggesting twin be unbanned as a response to it coming into prominence, when it does anyway. IDK, I don't have much faith in WotC printing non broken things when you consider that all broken is is something too popular or too format warping and when you realize that those terms are interchangeable. But we'll see. Maybe something can keep it in check.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
It's notable that Abzan Company's historic police was the Snapcaster-Bolt deck. Will be interesting to see if such decks rise up for the massive Grand Prix Weekend on May 20 to beat back these Company decks.
I notice you keep saying Snap-Bolt decks are what keeps Abzan Company in check. Do you have the data post-Twin ban to support this? I can't help but wonder whether it's the Snap, Bolt and counter-magic or if it was Twin itself that allowed the URx decks to be favoured over Abzan Company.
With little to no removal, Abzan Company couldn't stop Twin from going off easily. And even if Twin let Abzan Company slip their infinite life combo through their wall of removal and counter-magic, Twin could just deal infinite damage back to them.
I would love to hear that Abzan Company's bad matches are not just limited to Tron and Scapeshift because that would make the deck such a strong choice in today's meta, given it's already favoured against all forms of aggro. I have doubts it's weak to GBx too, since their very primer on this site indicates Jund and Abzan mid-range as favourable for Abzan Company.
Grixis and Jeskai Control in the Top 16. A little underrepresented but not horrible. Blue Mooon misses at 19th too. Also, interesting to see both Abzan and Jund in equal Top 32 representation.
It's notable that Abzan Company's historic police was the Snapcaster-Bolt deck. Will be interesting to see if such decks rise up for the massive Grand Prix Weekend on May 20 to beat back these Company decks.
I notice you keep saying Snap-Bolt decks are what keeps Abzan Company in check. Do you have the data post-Twin ban to support this? I can't help but wonder whether it's the Snap, Bolt and counter-magic or if it was Twin itself that allowed the URx decks to be favoured over Abzan Company.
With little to no removal, Abzan Company couldn't stop Twin from going off easily. And even if Twin let Abzan Company slip their infinite life combo through their wall of removal and counter-magic, Twin could just deal infinite damage back to them.
I would love to hear that Abzan Company's bad matches are not just limited to Tron and Scapeshift because that would make the deck such a strong choice in today's meta, given it's already favoured against all forms of aggro. I have doubts it's weak to GBx too, since their very primer on this site indicates Jund and Abzan mid-range as favourable for Abzan Company.
Abzan Company has access to the most powerful counters to the twin combo, including Abrupt Decay, Path, Spellskite, Thoughtseize, etc.
So Twin would mostly be boarded out the combo in sideboard games. However the ability to shut down the game (even through infinite life) with the 1-2 combo pieces you left in definitely was a factor.
All in all URx has a necessary control elements to stop Abzan company, but it is probably closer to a 60-40 advantage than a 70-30 (or better).
Add to this that URx has to fight super aggressive linear decks on top of big mana (or other miscellaneous over the top stuff), and you can see why URx has been in a poor position without a more settled metagame.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
There's no reason to do it after just one tournament although Abzan Company dominated it. Which is more said about this is what rcwraspy said that after such good performance of this deck and Collected Company itself there's no way Birthing Pod will ever come back.
Poor Kiki-Pod
Greetings,
Kathal
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What I play or have:
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
I'd rather blue have the tools for staying power and consistency rather than having to fall back on a gimmicky strategy like twin.
As a former twin player I would consider that a step backwards for the format. Better to look towards the future and all that jazz.
I would love to look towards the future too, but until blue (and especially URx) decks get tools which deal with their lack of good answers and lack of timely finishers, it's going to continue sitting in tier 3 with other rogue strategies. The irony is even with the unbanning of AV and Thopter/Sword, it's still not good. I mean, without Twin (a powerful finisher that only requires short term answers) what could we possibly give URx decks to help make up for their shortcomings without making them as broken as Eldrazi? Twin was a very elegant solution that followed every established rule as we understood for the Modern format.
Company =/= Birthing Pod. A repeatable tutor like Pod is on another power level planet.
Actually, I'd rather have Birthing Pod around instead of Collected Company. Birthing Pod is more powerful as the game goes on, but it's also much more vulnerable to sweeper effects. If you used a sweeper on a Birthing Pod deck, it would be stuck awkwardly and slowly trying to get something good into play with whatever is left still standing after the sweeper, which they can't start doing until their next turn. You do that to Collected Company and they just cast Collected Company afterwards, immediately getting creatures back before their turn without having to sacrifice any additional board presence. It lets them "reload" much more quickly and efficiently.
Granted, for people not running sweepers things might be different...
I'd rather blue have the tools for staying power and consistency rather than having to fall back on a gimmicky strategy like twin.
As a former twin player I would consider that a step backwards for the format. Better to look towards the future and all that jazz.
I would love to look towards the future too, but until blue (and especially URx) decks get tools which deal with their lack of good answers and lack of timely finishers, it's going to continue sitting in tier 3 with other rogue strategies. The irony is even with the unbanning of AV and Thopter/Sword, it's still not good. I mean, without Twin (a powerful finisher that only requires short term answers) what could we possibly give URx decks to help make up for their shortcomings without making them as broken as Eldrazi? Twin was a very elegant solution that followed every established rule as we understood for the Modern format.
Hey I can agree with the frustration. I played twin for years and thought it was safe because it seemed to be fighting on a powerful, yet very beatable axis. However the combo pieces surrounded by the best cards of various colors just gave it too much play, which in turn meant that it just hit the top tables too much. I partially attribute this to pros (ie skilled players) naturally gravitating to a flexible yet powerful deck because it meant not having to put in as much time testing or brewing, thus inflating its win percentage (winning in magic is skill + deck + luck after all). But I digress...
Unbanning twin, or even something like pod, is just a cop-out. I would rather give time to find better AV or thopter lists, and leave open the door for good reprints or unbans rather than just reverting to a situation that was pretty stifling. If you were playing URx in any capacity you were doing yourself a disservice by not playing the twin combo. AV and thopter were let out of the box because twin was banned.
I would like to give the situation more time to flesh out, and if things are still horribly wrong and URx is tier 3 (hyperbole) then maybe something like Dig Through Time or Ponder could be assessed. Who really knows, it is too early to tell; however just going back to the established feels like an admittance that the format cant evolve.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
counterspell. Just let Ux decks actually have tools of the same power level as thoughtseize, instead of depending on busted synergies to try and stay competitive.
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Yes, I am a local area mod. WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE
Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
Counterspell is still too powerful. I am however warming up to the idea of something like spell snare that counters any spell two mana or less for U1 of course. Three or less I think would be too good still, but two or less seems reasonable. IDK, what do you guys think?
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Counterspell is still too powerful. I am however warming up to the idea of something like spell snare that counters any spell two mana or less for U1 of course. Three or less I think would be too good still, but two or less seems reasonable. IDK, what do you guys think?
Prohibit has your back since invasion block. Now if they only reprint it next time kicker shows up.
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“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.” —Volrath
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Or just unban Twin.
(I'll bet no one saw that comment coming!)
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
As a former twin player I would consider that a step backwards for the format. Better to look towards the future and all that jazz.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Seriously, I've got this Legacy project right now where I'm trying to make green decks that see as many cards or draw as much as blue. It's one of those things that most people haven't really come around to yet but they eventually will. Green now is what blue used to be when it comes to deck manipulation, and you get a bunch of creatures that create on board value too, card draw, tutoring, all you lack is removal. It's just as true in Modern as it is in Legacy, maybe even more so.
True, but there is also Taking Turns at 31st, how much more Blue could you get?! Oh, and Goblins in the top 32, which outside of Guides is certainly a powerful budget build for newer players to work with.
It has always existed in some form or another, but the blue cantrip interactions are on a whole other level in legacy; not to mention providing the best forms of protection (fow, daze, etc).
The only long term problem I see for the game is that as they continue to improve creatures and print more balanced "spells" is that as time goes on that GB become the more prominant featured colors since they have a strangle on creatures + removal. It seems like every modern season that green style decks get more tools while everyone else is relying on the waning power of a bygone era.
Interested to see how it works out
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)It might still be too early to call it a bust though.
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
Yes.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
That's not even funny if you meant it as a joke, let alone if you were serious.
It's always the same thing after every tournament. If a deck shows good results the screaming for bans instantly happen. Ban this ban that! Just play the damn game and have some fun, I swear modern players are the biggest whiners I see in Magic.
Modern - Burn
EDH - Neheb the Eternal
Spirits
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
I notice you keep saying Snap-Bolt decks are what keeps Abzan Company in check. Do you have the data post-Twin ban to support this? I can't help but wonder whether it's the Snap, Bolt and counter-magic or if it was Twin itself that allowed the URx decks to be favoured over Abzan Company.
With little to no removal, Abzan Company couldn't stop Twin from going off easily. And even if Twin let Abzan Company slip their infinite life combo through their wall of removal and counter-magic, Twin could just deal infinite damage back to them.
I would love to hear that Abzan Company's bad matches are not just limited to Tron and Scapeshift because that would make the deck such a strong choice in today's meta, given it's already favoured against all forms of aggro. I have doubts it's weak to GBx too, since their very primer on this site indicates Jund and Abzan mid-range as favourable for Abzan Company.
Commander
U Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive
RG Zilortha, Strength Incarnate
WU Yorion, Sky Nomad
Abzan Company has access to the most powerful counters to the twin combo, including Abrupt Decay, Path, Spellskite, Thoughtseize, etc.
So Twin would mostly be boarded out the combo in sideboard games. However the ability to shut down the game (even through infinite life) with the 1-2 combo pieces you left in definitely was a factor.
All in all URx has a necessary control elements to stop Abzan company, but it is probably closer to a 60-40 advantage than a 70-30 (or better).
Add to this that URx has to fight super aggressive linear decks on top of big mana (or other miscellaneous over the top stuff), and you can see why URx has been in a poor position without a more settled metagame.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Poor Kiki-Pod
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
CG
I would love to look towards the future too, but until blue (and especially URx) decks get tools which deal with their lack of good answers and lack of timely finishers, it's going to continue sitting in tier 3 with other rogue strategies. The irony is even with the unbanning of AV and Thopter/Sword, it's still not good. I mean, without Twin (a powerful finisher that only requires short term answers) what could we possibly give URx decks to help make up for their shortcomings without making them as broken as Eldrazi? Twin was a very elegant solution that followed every established rule as we understood for the Modern format.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Granted, for people not running sweepers things might be different...
Hey I can agree with the frustration. I played twin for years and thought it was safe because it seemed to be fighting on a powerful, yet very beatable axis. However the combo pieces surrounded by the best cards of various colors just gave it too much play, which in turn meant that it just hit the top tables too much. I partially attribute this to pros (ie skilled players) naturally gravitating to a flexible yet powerful deck because it meant not having to put in as much time testing or brewing, thus inflating its win percentage (winning in magic is skill + deck + luck after all). But I digress...
Unbanning twin, or even something like pod, is just a cop-out. I would rather give time to find better AV or thopter lists, and leave open the door for good reprints or unbans rather than just reverting to a situation that was pretty stifling. If you were playing URx in any capacity you were doing yourself a disservice by not playing the twin combo. AV and thopter were let out of the box because twin was banned.
I would like to give the situation more time to flesh out, and if things are still horribly wrong and URx is tier 3 (hyperbole) then maybe something like Dig Through Time or Ponder could be assessed. Who really knows, it is too early to tell; however just going back to the established feels like an admittance that the format cant evolve.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Prohibit has your back since invasion block. Now if they only reprint it next time kicker shows up.
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.”
—Volrath