I think I'm the only person that thinks this but I feel Reality Smasher is the real problem here. 5/5, haste, must discard to target the card is just unfair in my opinion. If this was say 5/5 (3 and 2 red) like thundermaw hellkite but with haste, trample and the discard clause, I think people would argue its too good.
The problem is that there really isn't anything that can trade 1 for 1 with Reality Smasher (WurmCoil is a bit too slow and people don;t play enough counter spells). I think reality smasher was the real mistake. If it was say 5/4 and could trade with Tasigur or Siege Rhino or Tarmgoyf (usually its 4/5) or batterskull, then I think this card might be a bit more reasonable.
It is only a problem because of what comes before it. The mimic into thought-knot into smasher is back breaking. If they played like an abzan deck it would be birds into wall of roots into smasher. That hardly seems broken to me at least by modern standards.
I think if we can take away Reality Smasher, its a little bit more reasonable for the other side of the table to come up with a plan. Reality Smasher without the Anicent Temple or Ugin's workshop is just insane even in "Zoo" decks if it was as i described it above.
But what I'm still a little bit angry about is that given we're in a set with Eldrazi and colorless threats, Wizards didn't print anything in the threat that could deal with the eldrazi. Maybe a say (W) -> exile target colorless permanent?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm actively maintaining a comprehensive article to help explain to new cube players how some complex vintage level cards work in a cube environment. Vintage Cube Cards Explained
People. Instead of whining about the eldrazi. We should be like Jace, njssa, Gideon and chandra and we find a solution and we fight!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm actively maintaining a comprehensive article to help explain to new cube players how some complex vintage level cards work in a cube environment. Vintage Cube Cards Explained
I think if we can take away Reality Smasher, its a little bit more reasonable for the other side of the table to come up with a plan. Reality Smasher without the Anicent Temple or Ugin's workshop is just insane even in "Zoo" decks if it was as i described it above.
But what I'm still a little bit angry about is that given we're in a set with Eldrazi and colorless threats, Wizards didn't print anything in the threat that could deal with the eldrazi. Maybe a say (W) -> exile target colorless permanent?
Reality smasher isn't an issue. There are some creative ways a deck could deal with it or even take advantage of it, like removal and loxodon smiter, both of which are ok includes across the meta for a deck running those colors. If any creature is truly the issue here it is either Mimic for making the deck too aggressive, or Thought-Knot Seer for being able to handle so many of the answers.
If abzan really wants to fight eldrazi, a turn one mana dork followed by a turn 2 glissa the traitor, with some executioners capsules in the deck, is virtually impossible for some of the builds to deal with, which may be why we saw so many U/W variants of eldrazi today, so they could maximize removal options and run Hurkyls for affinity. Living end and Restore balance as I have mentioned a few times have very favorable match ups against most eldrazi decks, it is unfortunate that people are reluctant to pilot them in any real number, I am guessing because of the price point and learning curve the decks have. Affinity obviously still has game against them and the field, and Merfolk even made top 8 which is pretty impressive considering how so many people declared blue a dead color outside of snapcaster.
The only card that eldrazi has that honestly deals with all these cards efficiently is thought-knot seer, just because of the proactive protection. So many games went by in the coverage where if you really watch them, the big aggro creatures could have basically been anything because the TKS took the answers away. I would go ahead and say TKS really was the all star of the day, not temple and not eye because TKS often came down on turn 4 and 5 on schedule and was just as good if not better. If you banned him then the deck basically just becomes an all in aggro deck with a strange hole in its CMC between 3 and 5. It would be much easier to deal with overall because it would not have as much recovery or protection as it does now and spamming early of eye would open you up to 2 for 1's.
The problem with the Eldrazi menace is that it has too many ways to cheat cards into play and the cards it cheats in are too cost-effective, in terms of power and the 2-for-1's they create.
The Eye of Ugin and Eldrazi Temple are 2 mana lands on turn 1. There are no other 2 mana lands in the meta on turn 1. The effect by turn 3 can be ridiculous, with an Eye in play.
The creature that gets deployed on turn 1 is innocuous enough, a 2/1, which is something that is available in many other forms in the meta. However it is also a 3/2 or 4/4 often on turn 2 and only Wild Nacatl is as good as the former and nothing is as good as the latter in terms of attack power turn 2.
The creatures that land after the 2/1 are either cheated into play earlier than they should be or create a 2-for-1 when they land or leave the battlefield or both and then there's the hasty 5/5 that lands turn 3.
The synergy between the mana base and the creatures and between the creatures themselves borders on the absurd.
The choices that the opponent is forced to make are often unreasonable in the extreme, as in when a Thought-Knot Seer lands turn 2 and the opponent has to spend 4 life to remove it with a Dismember, while it's trigger is on the stack. The removal happens and the opponent draws a card and then the TKS player gets to also take the best card left in the opponent's hand counting the draw from TKS removal.
Matter Reshaper is pure card advantage and it matches up very well against the early aggro creatures in other archetypes as well as letting Eldrazi Mimic swing in for 3 on turn 2.
Reality Smasher costs an extra card to target and cannot be killed by a hellbent topdeck for that reason. This alongside the fact that it is a 5/5 Haste, Trample that can realistically land turn 3 and 4.
It's just an absurd amount of synergy and fast damage and disruption in a tight set of cards. Even without the very fast mana the synergy might be too much for the meta to handle without collapsing into just a few highly tuned opposing lists. Modern isn't supposed to be about finding the best list and forcing the meta to adapt to it. At least not in my understanding of the format.
Everything you just said can be applied to affinity.
Land that provides more than 1 mana? Darksteel Citadel when combined with affinity. Plus there is a mox.
2 for 1s? Pure Card advantage? Thoughtcast.
Scary early threats? basically anything in the deck that isn't making mana.
Creatures That are really big for low cost? Master of Etherium.
Synergy? yep.
The only thing eldrazi really does that affinity does not do is thought knot. Affinity has a spiritual version of pretty much everything eldrazi does except have big disruption on a stick. This is why I think if any card is a problem that is the one (though I still say wait.)
I'm joining protoaddict's side of the fence. Eldrazi is perfectly fine, is not warping the format and should not have any bans whatsoever. Every different painland added with its enabled variety of SB answers represents a completely different deck.
(My rolling of store credit has been slower than expected thanks to splitting of packs at the top with other drazi players. I need more time before I can recoup the cost of the deck! also, if we get past April without a ban, the eye prices will spike again and I can really make a PILE.)
In conclusion, everything is fine, let's just keep playing in this incredibly diverse meta with half the people piloting UW eldrazi, RG eldrazi, Colorless eldrazi, Temur eldrazi and UR eldrazi! (font scaled to level of importance and required visibility to understand the pro-eldrazi stance)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
I'm joining protoaddict's side of the fence. Eldrazi is perfectly fine, is not warping the format and should not have any bans whatsoever. Every different painland added with its enabled variety of SB answers represents a completely different deck.
(My rolling of store credit has been slower than expected thanks to splitting of packs at the top with other drazi players. I need more time before I can recoup the cost of the deck! also, if we get past April without a ban, the eye prices will spike again and I can really make a PILE.)
In conclusion, everything is fine, let's just keep playing in this incredibly diverse meta with half the people piloting UW eldrazi, RG eldrazi, Colorless eldrazi, Temur eldrazi and UR eldrazi! (font scaled to level of importance and required visibility to understand the pro-eldrazi stance)
While I think your trying to besmirch me as someone who has financial stake in all this instead of speaking to the points I make is adorable, I play Living End in modern and I sold my eldrazi stuff almost two weeks ago. If I have any financial concern in magic right now it's that vintage masters won't be good and my power 9 won't go up in value, not the few bucks on the 3 eyes I used to have and the 1 I kept for commander.
The only financial part of my thought process regarding these cards is that I don't want WOTC making any more bans to the format because I believe a ban like this where many people will lose money is more damaging to the format than waiting to see if the next set brings answers or not, or giving the format more time to sort itself. WOTC just destroyed two archetypes, one of which was I think provided a real balance to the format, and to come out on the next cycle and do it yet again destroys confidence in players and the format.
I honestly feel like if twin was still around the format would be fair and more balanced in the minds of most people. More people would not have jumped to a new eldrazi deck because the one they played was steamrolled, and an almost entirely linear, non-reactive deck like eldrazi would never appear like it does right now because twin would just eat it for lunch.
I'm joining protoaddict's side of the fence. Eldrazi is perfectly fine, is not warping the format and should not have any bans whatsoever. Every different painland added with its enabled variety of SB answers represents a completely different deck.
(My rolling of store credit has been slower than expected thanks to splitting of packs at the top with other drazi players. I need more time before I can recoup the cost of the deck! also, if we get past April without a ban, the eye prices will spike again and I can really make a PILE.)
In conclusion, everything is fine, let's just keep playing in this incredibly diverse meta with half the people piloting UW eldrazi, RG eldrazi, Colorless eldrazi, Temur eldrazi and UR eldrazi! (font scaled to level of importance and required visibility to understand the pro-eldrazi stance)
While I think your trying to besmirch me as someone who has financial stake in all this instead of speaking to the points I make is adorable, I play Living End in modern and I sold my eldrazi stuff almost two weeks ago. If I have any financial concern in magic right now it's that vintage masters won't be good and my power 9 won't go up in value, not the few bucks on the 3 eyes I used to have and the 1 I kept for commander.
The only financial part of my thought process regarding these cards is that I don't want WOTC making any more bans to the format because I believe a ban like this where many people will lose money is more damaging to the format than waiting to see if the next set brings answers or not, or giving the format more time to sort itself. WOTC just destroyed two archetypes, one of which was I think provided a real balance to the format, and to come out on the next cycle and do it yet again destroys confidence in players and the format.
I honestly feel like if twin was still around the format would be fair and more balanced in the minds of most people. More people would not have jumped to a new eldrazi deck because the one they played was steamrolled, and an almost entirely linear, non-reactive deck like eldrazi would never appear like it does right now because twin would just eat it for lunch.
I am honestly not trying to besmirch you!
I am actually on your side of the fence moving forward, everything in the spoiler is a fact as far as I am concerned. I'm just being transparent on my motivations, which is useful for anyone who might try to engage me.
Wow, we are actually in agreement on the twin issue. Well, twin got banned so if eye gets banned as well that will be 2 of my decks rendered crippled within the space of 4 months. In the meantime, I am going to roll as much credit as I can before april.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Which I must emphasize hardly ever happens. This has been proven by the thread's mathematician. We hardly ever go Eye - mimic - mimic, that's just people using anecdotal evidence to wrongly advocate the banning of a perfectly fair, non-format-warping deck, that simply needs more time for people to get used to losing to adapt to.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
- 31 out of 65 decks in day two were Eldrazi builds (almost half), but there were 20 Eldrazi decks in the top 32 (almost two thirds).
- Affinity did even better, all five day two Affinity players made it into top 32, two in top 8.
- Almost half of the non-Eldrazi decks in the top 32 were Affinity (5/12).
- 26 out of 65 decks in day two were non-Affinity, non-Eldrazi. Only 7 of those decks made it into the top 32, that`s about a quarter of them into the top half.
At this point I'm certain they will ban both lands. Just like with ruse cruise and DTT, they will not want to risk doing half work
Yeah, I think this is the most obvious ban in years, an even bigger no-brainer than Cruise and Bloom. If I had an Eldrazi deck, I would sell it today, though I`d have some pretty stiff competition on my local buy/sell group on FB, people are unloading Eldrazi staples and complete decks like crazy.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Hey if Griselshoal pulls a Faithless Looting, Grislebrand, and Goryo's Vengeance out of those 10-11 cards they draw in two turns and you don't have a disruption spell... I'm just saying a dream draw can happen with many decks, but how likely? 1 Eye of Ugin should keep the deck in check. I just don't want players afraid of their investments being banned. I have a friend who built Twin and two weeks later it was gone with Summer Bloom.
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Hey if Griselshoal pulls a Faithless Looting, Grislebrand, and Goryo's Vengeance out of those 10-11 cards they draw in two turns and you don't have a disruption spell... I'm just saying a dream draw can happen with many decks, but how likely? 1 Eye of Ugin should keep the deck in check. I just don't want players afraid of their investments being banned. I have a friend who built Twin and two weeks later it was gone with Summer Bloom.
I am going to be blunt. If you are not a card shop you should have zero investment, in the money sense for magic the gathering.
I am going to be blunt. If you are not a card shop you should have zero investment, in the money sense for magic the gathering.
Be as blunt as you want, but it`s kind of hard to play competitive Modern and not be monetarily invested right now, since most competitive decks are in the $1000 range, and even the cheap ones are several hundred dollars. I wish it wasn`t like that, but your point is moot.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Hey if Griselshoal pulls a Faithless Looting, Grislebrand, and Goryo's Vengeance out of those 10-11 cards they draw in two turns and you don't have a disruption spell... I'm just saying a dream draw can happen with many decks, but how likely? 1 Eye of Ugin should keep the deck in check. I just don't want players afraid of their investments being banned. I have a friend who built Twin and two weeks later it was gone with Summer Bloom.
I am going to be blunt. If you are not a card shop you should have zero investment, in the money sense for magic the gathering.
I was using "investment" loosely as a figure of speech. The cool kid on the street wanting an eldrazi deck to break into competitive magic has to throw down nearly $200 dollars for a play set of Eye of Ugin's.
certainly if we can provide enough quantifiable data to prove that something is unfair, then that will justify demands for a ban.
Just leave out the data showing Eldrazi did not win the latest tournament.
I mean, why work to find a way to compete when we can just put all of that energy into forcing someone else not to play?
certainly if we can provide enough quantifiable data to prove that something is unfair, then that will justify demands for a ban.
Just leave out the data showing Eldrazi did not win the latest tournament.
I mean, why work to find a way to compete when we can just put all of that energy into forcing someone else not to play?
I`m not sure I follow you through your multiple layers of sarcasm, but if you`re using first place as an anti-ban argument, completely ignoring that the whole tournament was Eldrazi dominated and that first place was stolen by virtually the only Eldrazi-less deck that thrives in an Eldrazi overrun meta, I`m not sure you should be accusing others of hand-picking focal points (if that`s what you`re even doing).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
At this point I'm certain they will ban both lands. Just like with ruse cruise and DTT, they will not want to risk doing half work
Yeah, I think this is the most obvious ban in years, an even bigger no-brainer than Cruise and Bloom. If I had an Eldrazi deck, I would sell it today, though I`d have some pretty stiff competition on my local buy/sell group on FB, people are unloading Eldrazi staples and complete decks like crazy.
There's literally no point in even trying. When your LGS is only willing to buy them for 1/3 of the cost already that is pretty damning. Not to mention I've been watching ebay auctions and it's the most abysmal looking event ever seeing people try to sell eye of ugin and temple. I'd just keep them for legacy and write it all off as a loss. The eldrazi cards can still find homes elsewhere, especially Thought-knot seer.
Also, I've got a feeling they will probably just try an Eye banning first and if that fails, hit SSG and Temple. There's no point rushing to kill the deck completely when it could live like affinity. But as it stands right now, it is just way too consistent. It can win even if the player has to mulligan like a boss because they only need one eye of ugin to break the game wide open. SSG and Temple are a lot less of a problem in regards to mulligans. One basically is a one shot pony and the other only gives 2 mana flat rate.
I mean, they might be able to do some crazy Dark Ritual move on turn 1 with both in hand, but they are burning 3 cards out of 7 to do so and given the speed of modern, a 3 cost drop should not break the game coming out on turn 1 or 2 by itself. There's just way too many answers to a singleton eldrazi.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
They should create a Restricted List for Modern and add Eye of Ugin. It'll make the deck less consistent and slow things down without completely killing the deck. Plus, losing Eye completely hurts Tron.
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Hey if Griselshoal pulls a Faithless Looting, Grislebrand, and Goryo's Vengeance out of those 10-11 cards they draw in two turns and you don't have a disruption spell... I'm just saying a dream draw can happen with many decks, but how likely? 1 Eye of Ugin should keep the deck in check. I just don't want players afraid of their investments being banned. I have a friend who built Twin and two weeks later it was gone with Summer Bloom.
I am going to be blunt. If you are not a card shop you should have zero investment, in the money sense for magic the gathering.
I was using "investment" loosely as a figure of speech. The cool kid on the street wanting an eldrazi deck to break into competitive magic has to throw down nearly $200 dollars for a play set of Eye of Ugin's.
You are not realistically playing magic the gathering for the money unless you are top pro that is a great writer. Only top players get more money out this game than they get in.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I think if we can take away Reality Smasher, its a little bit more reasonable for the other side of the table to come up with a plan. Reality Smasher without the Anicent Temple or Ugin's workshop is just insane even in "Zoo" decks if it was as i described it above.
But what I'm still a little bit angry about is that given we're in a set with Eldrazi and colorless threats, Wizards didn't print anything in the threat that could deal with the eldrazi. Maybe a say (W) -> exile target colorless permanent?
Vintage Cube Cards Explained
Here are some other articles I've written about fine tuning your cube:
1. Minimum Archetype Support
2. Improving Green Archetypes
3. Improving White Archetypes
4. Matchup Analysis
5. Cube Combos (Work in Progress)
Draft my Cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/d8i
Freaking unfair deck
C Long Live Eldrazi C
Vintage Cube Cards Explained
Here are some other articles I've written about fine tuning your cube:
1. Minimum Archetype Support
2. Improving Green Archetypes
3. Improving White Archetypes
4. Matchup Analysis
5. Cube Combos (Work in Progress)
Draft my Cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/d8i
Reality smasher isn't an issue. There are some creative ways a deck could deal with it or even take advantage of it, like removal and loxodon smiter, both of which are ok includes across the meta for a deck running those colors. If any creature is truly the issue here it is either Mimic for making the deck too aggressive, or Thought-Knot Seer for being able to handle so many of the answers.
If abzan really wants to fight eldrazi, a turn one mana dork followed by a turn 2 glissa the traitor, with some executioners capsules in the deck, is virtually impossible for some of the builds to deal with, which may be why we saw so many U/W variants of eldrazi today, so they could maximize removal options and run Hurkyls for affinity. Living end and Restore balance as I have mentioned a few times have very favorable match ups against most eldrazi decks, it is unfortunate that people are reluctant to pilot them in any real number, I am guessing because of the price point and learning curve the decks have. Affinity obviously still has game against them and the field, and Merfolk even made top 8 which is pretty impressive considering how so many people declared blue a dead color outside of snapcaster.
The only card that eldrazi has that honestly deals with all these cards efficiently is thought-knot seer, just because of the proactive protection. So many games went by in the coverage where if you really watch them, the big aggro creatures could have basically been anything because the TKS took the answers away. I would go ahead and say TKS really was the all star of the day, not temple and not eye because TKS often came down on turn 4 and 5 on schedule and was just as good if not better. If you banned him then the deck basically just becomes an all in aggro deck with a strange hole in its CMC between 3 and 5. It would be much easier to deal with overall because it would not have as much recovery or protection as it does now and spamming early of eye would open you up to 2 for 1's.
Http://www.fantasticneighborhood.com/
Comedy gaming podcast. Listening to it makes you cool.
The Eye of Ugin and Eldrazi Temple are 2 mana lands on turn 1. There are no other 2 mana lands in the meta on turn 1. The effect by turn 3 can be ridiculous, with an Eye in play.
The creature that gets deployed on turn 1 is innocuous enough, a 2/1, which is something that is available in many other forms in the meta. However it is also a 3/2 or 4/4 often on turn 2 and only Wild Nacatl is as good as the former and nothing is as good as the latter in terms of attack power turn 2.
The creatures that land after the 2/1 are either cheated into play earlier than they should be or create a 2-for-1 when they land or leave the battlefield or both and then there's the hasty 5/5 that lands turn 3.
The synergy between the mana base and the creatures and between the creatures themselves borders on the absurd.
The choices that the opponent is forced to make are often unreasonable in the extreme, as in when a Thought-Knot Seer lands turn 2 and the opponent has to spend 4 life to remove it with a Dismember, while it's trigger is on the stack. The removal happens and the opponent draws a card and then the TKS player gets to also take the best card left in the opponent's hand counting the draw from TKS removal.
Matter Reshaper is pure card advantage and it matches up very well against the early aggro creatures in other archetypes as well as letting Eldrazi Mimic swing in for 3 on turn 2.
Reality Smasher costs an extra card to target and cannot be killed by a hellbent topdeck for that reason. This alongside the fact that it is a 5/5 Haste, Trample that can realistically land turn 3 and 4.
It's just an absurd amount of synergy and fast damage and disruption in a tight set of cards. Even without the very fast mana the synergy might be too much for the meta to handle without collapsing into just a few highly tuned opposing lists. Modern isn't supposed to be about finding the best list and forcing the meta to adapt to it. At least not in my understanding of the format.
Land that provides more than 1 mana? Darksteel Citadel when combined with affinity. Plus there is a mox.
2 for 1s? Pure Card advantage? Thoughtcast.
Scary early threats? basically anything in the deck that isn't making mana.
Creatures That are really big for low cost? Master of Etherium.
Synergy? yep.
The only thing eldrazi really does that affinity does not do is thought knot. Affinity has a spiritual version of pretty much everything eldrazi does except have big disruption on a stick. This is why I think if any card is a problem that is the one (though I still say wait.)
Http://www.fantasticneighborhood.com/
Comedy gaming podcast. Listening to it makes you cool.
In conclusion, everything is fine, let's just keep playing in this incredibly diverse meta with half the people piloting UW eldrazi, RG eldrazi, Colorless eldrazi, Temur eldrazi and UR eldrazi! (font scaled to level of importance and required visibility to understand the pro-eldrazi stance)
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
While I think your trying to besmirch me as someone who has financial stake in all this instead of speaking to the points I make is adorable, I play Living End in modern and I sold my eldrazi stuff almost two weeks ago. If I have any financial concern in magic right now it's that vintage masters won't be good and my power 9 won't go up in value, not the few bucks on the 3 eyes I used to have and the 1 I kept for commander.
The only financial part of my thought process regarding these cards is that I don't want WOTC making any more bans to the format because I believe a ban like this where many people will lose money is more damaging to the format than waiting to see if the next set brings answers or not, or giving the format more time to sort itself. WOTC just destroyed two archetypes, one of which was I think provided a real balance to the format, and to come out on the next cycle and do it yet again destroys confidence in players and the format.
I honestly feel like if twin was still around the format would be fair and more balanced in the minds of most people. More people would not have jumped to a new eldrazi deck because the one they played was steamrolled, and an almost entirely linear, non-reactive deck like eldrazi would never appear like it does right now because twin would just eat it for lunch.
Http://www.fantasticneighborhood.com/
Comedy gaming podcast. Listening to it makes you cool.
And that's exactly why it was banned. To push eldrazi and boost sales.
Landcronomicon
I am honestly not trying to besmirch you!
I am actually on your side of the fence moving forward, everything in the spoiler is a fact as far as I am concerned. I'm just being transparent on my motivations, which is useful for anyone who might try to engage me.
Wow, we are actually in agreement on the twin issue. Well, twin got banned so if eye gets banned as well that will be 2 of my decks rendered crippled within the space of 4 months. In the meantime, I am going to roll as much credit as I can before april.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
The problem is a restricted list doesn't stop anything from being broken, it just makes it less likely to happen. They can still get the dream draws.
Which I must emphasize hardly ever happens. This has been proven by the thread's mathematician. We hardly ever go Eye - mimic - mimic, that's just people using anecdotal evidence to wrongly advocate the banning of a perfectly fair, non-format-warping deck, that simply needs more time for people to
get used to losing toadapt to.BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
- 31 out of 65 decks in day two were Eldrazi builds (almost half), but there were 20 Eldrazi decks in the top 32 (almost two thirds).
- Affinity did even better, all five day two Affinity players made it into top 32, two in top 8.
- Almost half of the non-Eldrazi decks in the top 32 were Affinity (5/12).
- 26 out of 65 decks in day two were non-Affinity, non-Eldrazi. Only 7 of those decks made it into the top 32, that`s about a quarter of them into the top half.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Hey if Griselshoal pulls a Faithless Looting, Grislebrand, and Goryo's Vengeance out of those 10-11 cards they draw in two turns and you don't have a disruption spell... I'm just saying a dream draw can happen with many decks, but how likely? 1 Eye of Ugin should keep the deck in check. I just don't want players afraid of their investments being banned. I have a friend who built Twin and two weeks later it was gone with Summer Bloom.
I am going to be blunt. If you are not a card shop you should have zero investment, in the money sense for magic the gathering.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Just leave out the data showing Eldrazi did not win the latest tournament.
I mean, why work to find a way to compete when we can just put all of that energy into forcing someone else not to play?
C Long Live Eldrazi C
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
RBGLiving EndRBG
EDH
UFblthpU
BRXantchaRB
BGVarolzGB
URWZedruuWRU
There's literally no point in even trying. When your LGS is only willing to buy them for 1/3 of the cost already that is pretty damning. Not to mention I've been watching ebay auctions and it's the most abysmal looking event ever seeing people try to sell eye of ugin and temple. I'd just keep them for legacy and write it all off as a loss. The eldrazi cards can still find homes elsewhere, especially Thought-knot seer.
Also, I've got a feeling they will probably just try an Eye banning first and if that fails, hit SSG and Temple. There's no point rushing to kill the deck completely when it could live like affinity. But as it stands right now, it is just way too consistent. It can win even if the player has to mulligan like a boss because they only need one eye of ugin to break the game wide open. SSG and Temple are a lot less of a problem in regards to mulligans. One basically is a one shot pony and the other only gives 2 mana flat rate.
I mean, they might be able to do some crazy Dark Ritual move on turn 1 with both in hand, but they are burning 3 cards out of 7 to do so and given the speed of modern, a 3 cost drop should not break the game coming out on turn 1 or 2 by itself. There's just way too many answers to a singleton eldrazi.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
You are not realistically playing magic the gathering for the money unless you are top pro that is a great writer. Only top players get more money out this game than they get in.