Thing is only suitable in UW/x or new decktypes. He can't be played in aggressive UR shells because of how badly he interacts with Young Pyromancer and tempo in general. When you play him, you want to be sitting on a big clutch of cards to flip him with. Because of all this, he needs to be in a control deck that sits on the board and counters spells.
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These days, some wizards are finding they have a little too much deck left at the end of their $$$.
MTG finance guy- follow me on Twitter@RichArschmann or RichardArschmann on Reddit
For me it's a thing that cost at least 6 mana, gives you negative tempo in the early turn and is a terrible topdeck.
Playable, and not so much in decks abusing of token removal strategy (like hexmage).
- L
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"The problem isn't when Scissors says Rock is overpowered, it's when Paper says it is."
-Mark Rosewater
I snagged a playset preorder of Thing in the Ice on eBay for $20 shortly after announcement. Hope I don't get scammed by the rise in price since then (wouldn't be the first time).
Thing is only suitable in UW/x or new decktypes. He can't be played in aggressive UR shells because of how badly he interacts with Young Pyromancer and tempo in general. When you play him, you want to be sitting on a big clutch of cards to flip him with. Because of all this, he needs to be in a control deck that sits on the board and counters spells.
he'd be ok with low cost haste creatures though, so could couple with red there.
Isn't it a bit early to preorder? They still got to spoil the rest of the set so the prices even out, otherwise buying right now will likely have a lot of over-costed mythics and rares.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Still can't believe how high they are betting on Avacyn and the 2/2 zombie guy. I was thinking the mythic zombie would have been at 10 usd a piece.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Isn't it a bit early to preorder? They still got to spoil the rest of the set so the prices even out, otherwise buying right now will likely have a lot of over-costed mythics and rares.
Within an hour of spoiling, a playset on eBay went from $10 to $15 to $20 and now over $50. Depending on where you got in, it's either a minimal investment with good payoff or a huge risk with lots of downside. I think the card will be awesome in Modern, especially alongside cards like baby Jace. I was able to snag a set for $20, but if I end up getting scammed again due to eBay's questionable "pre order" policies, I'll wait till the dust settles before deciding to pick any of them up. I assume that if it takes off in Standard and Modern, it will easily be a $15-$20+ card. If it sucks in Standard but decent in Modern it could probably be a $5-$10 card.
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
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On mtgsalvation people don't want to discuss ideas, so I give people something else to discuss: my controversial opinions.
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
A flip angel at 5 cmc that flips and nukes the field on the following upkeep is good. Just it feels like a planeswalker and those aren't exactly known to hold strong prices unless they are proven to be insane for a format like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, Vryn's Prodigy.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
A flip angel at 5 cmc that flips and nukes the field on the following upkeep is good. Just it feels like a planeswalker and those aren't exactly known to hold strong prices unless they are proven to be insane for a format like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, Vryn's Prodigy.
I don't even care too much about the flipping and nuking. I just like the 4/4 flier with FLASH. That's really the key for me: dropping a Bolt-proof attacker at instant-speed on an endstep. Or granting indestructible in response to a kill spell. The flip stuff is just gravy; I'd test her even if she just had the 4/4 side and no transform clause.
Avacyn is pretty interesting, but I'm not sure how big of a splash it will make. White has no shortage of 5cc creatures/walkers that are good on their own.
Avacyn seems like a powerful card, but I do not see myself playing it in any of my uwx modern decks.
As cute as using it to save geist is, geist decks are not good in Modern. Moreover, a cagey opponent could pretty easily take advantage of the flip trigger to kill my geist later.
Restoration angel seems better in pretty much any established deck in the format that could run Avacyn.
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
A flip angel at 5 cmc that flips and nukes the field on the following upkeep is good. Just it feels like a planeswalker and those aren't exactly known to hold strong prices unless they are proven to be insane for a format like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, Vryn's Prodigy.
I don't even care too much about the flipping and nuking. I just like the 4/4 flier with FLASH. That's really the key for me: dropping a Bolt-proof attacker at instant-speed on an endstep. Or granting indestructible in response to a kill spell. The flip stuff is just gravy; I'd test her even if she just had the 4/4 side and no transform clause.
She already seems like an upgrade from Teferi in UWx Control strategies. Not that UWx ever played Teferi, but some blue-based control decks did, and Avacyn is way more aggressive, which may help her slot into a Jeskai shell.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Anyone have an opinion on the mythic zombie? I know avacyn feels a bit over priced for what she does and I'm always leary of mythics with launch sets.
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
A flip angel at 5 cmc that flips and nukes the field on the following upkeep is good. Just it feels like a planeswalker and those aren't exactly known to hold strong prices unless they are proven to be insane for a format like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, Vryn's Prodigy.
I don't even care too much about the flipping and nuking. I just like the 4/4 flier with FLASH. That's really the key for me: dropping a Bolt-proof attacker at instant-speed on an endstep. Or granting indestructible in response to a kill spell. The flip stuff is just gravy; I'd test her even if she just had the 4/4 side and no transform clause.
That's exactly what I like about her. I'd definitely test her myself, I'm just curious to see where she prices out in the long run.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Historically to be good such creatures allowed for cards to already be in the graveyard, see Goyf or Tasigur.
When you are forced to first draw your creature and then assemble resources to play it then you're suddenly in the Vengevine territory which is fringe playable at best.
Which is also why I think delirium mechanic will give us something good.
Historically to be good such creatures allowed for cards to already be in the graveyard, see Goyf or Tasigur.
When you are forced to first draw your creature and then assemble resources to play it then you're suddenly in the Vengevine territory which is fringe playable at best.
Which is also why I think delirium mechanic will give us something good.
graveyeard is easily hatable
how is blue just doing blue things "assembling resources"?
Historically to be good such creatures allowed for cards to already be in the graveyard, see Goyf or Tasigur.
When you are forced to first draw your creature and then assemble resources to play it then you're suddenly in the Vengevine territory which is fringe playable at best.
Which is also why I think delirium mechanic will give us something good.
An unboltable 0/4 wall that flips into a 7/8 for just playing magic is good for 2 on its own. Add in the board "wipe"/snapcaster/clique recursion and it's amazing. It's going to see play and it's going to be expensive
Turn 1 Bolt or Guide or Serum
Turn 2 Thing
Turn 3 Manamorphose, Snaps, Manamorphose, Bolt, Serum or whatever, flip.
A tempo shell a prowess shell, storm, control, combo side board, I think it's good.
Fact it gives you snaps back is hilarious.
It's good for tempo, but I think it's price will drop once release hits since it is only a rare. 15 usd seems rather expensive for something that isn't a mythic out the gate. I'd imagine it will be around 8-11 usd once launch has things settle. Now Avacyn and zombie man are a completely different matter.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
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MTG finance guy- follow me on Twitter@RichArschmann or RichardArschmann on Reddit
Playable, and not so much in decks abusing of token removal strategy (like hexmage).
- L
"The problem isn't when Scissors says Rock is overpowered, it's when Paper says it is."
-Mark Rosewater
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
Spirits
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Spirits
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
The difference between a Mythic opened up in a small core set with very little hype and a rare in a HUGELY hyped set is massive.
Within an hour of spoiling, a playset on eBay went from $10 to $15 to $20 and now over $50. Depending on where you got in, it's either a minimal investment with good payoff or a huge risk with lots of downside. I think the card will be awesome in Modern, especially alongside cards like baby Jace. I was able to snag a set for $20, but if I end up getting scammed again due to eBay's questionable "pre order" policies, I'll wait till the dust settles before deciding to pick any of them up. I assume that if it takes off in Standard and Modern, it will easily be a $15-$20+ card. If it sucks in Standard but decent in Modern it could probably be a $5-$10 card.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
As to the difference Niall, you are totally on point, but I'd rather have spent the $20, than $60.
Spirits
I feel you on that for sure.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
How does Avacyn feel overpriced for what she does. If she didn't have her flip side she would be playable in modern UW. She works super well with Geist.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
A flip angel at 5 cmc that flips and nukes the field on the following upkeep is good. Just it feels like a planeswalker and those aren't exactly known to hold strong prices unless they are proven to be insane for a format like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, Vryn's Prodigy.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I don't even care too much about the flipping and nuking. I just like the 4/4 flier with FLASH. That's really the key for me: dropping a Bolt-proof attacker at instant-speed on an endstep. Or granting indestructible in response to a kill spell. The flip stuff is just gravy; I'd test her even if she just had the 4/4 side and no transform clause.
Avacyn seems like a powerful card, but I do not see myself playing it in any of my uwx modern decks.
As cute as using it to save geist is, geist decks are not good in Modern. Moreover, a cagey opponent could pretty easily take advantage of the flip trigger to kill my geist later.
Restoration angel seems better in pretty much any established deck in the format that could run Avacyn.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
That's exactly what I like about her. I'd definitely test her myself, I'm just curious to see where she prices out in the long run.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Makes blue competitive. Returns your snapcasters and cliques, boardwipes etc
BG Rock
Modern:
RW Sun & Moon
RBG Dredge
RWG Burn
Legacy:
W Death & Taxes
Historically to be good such creatures allowed for cards to already be in the graveyard, see Goyf or Tasigur.
When you are forced to first draw your creature and then assemble resources to play it then you're suddenly in the Vengevine territory which is fringe playable at best.
Which is also why I think delirium mechanic will give us something good.
graveyeard is easily hatable
how is blue just doing blue things "assembling resources"?
URW PillowFort Stasis (costruction)
modern:
U Taking Turns combo
pauper:
UB Servitor Control
xenob8 : you know you are going to have a bad time when opponent starts with snow covered island
An unboltable 0/4 wall that flips into a 7/8 for just playing magic is good for 2 on its own. Add in the board "wipe"/snapcaster/clique recursion and it's amazing. It's going to see play and it's going to be expensive
BG Rock
Modern:
RW Sun & Moon
RBG Dredge
RWG Burn
Legacy:
W Death & Taxes
Turn 2 Thing
Turn 3 Manamorphose, Snaps, Manamorphose, Bolt, Serum or whatever, flip.
A tempo shell a prowess shell, storm, control, combo side board, I think it's good.
Fact it gives you snaps back is hilarious.
Spirits
It's good for tempo, but I think it's price will drop once release hits since it is only a rare. 15 usd seems rather expensive for something that isn't a mythic out the gate. I'd imagine it will be around 8-11 usd once launch has things settle. Now Avacyn and zombie man are a completely different matter.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!