I would like to thank Channel fireball for what they did to chalice.
I did a lot of mirrodin drafting the last weeks and got myself 4 chalice (2 which were even passed to me lmao). Last week they were worth 28tix, just sold them off for 88. Bought time I came out ahead on a PT spike.
well congratulations for blindly reading the metagame ahead of time; fortunately, only modern as a format had to be sacrificed in the process.
Buy your Painter Servants and laugh. Postpone and pay more.
I think I'll pass on a world where main deck Painter's Servants make the format playable. I don't mean to tinfoil, but I think wizards probably wishes they hadn't made such an attractive alternative to Standard, well it's not looking so attractive now is it?
See it as a replacement for Spellskite in an Eldrazi infested meta. Painter's Servant will be what graveyard hate is against dredge. If you are unwilling to adapt to a changing meta with hate cards, then don't call for bans. Magic is a game where you either adapt or die.
In my opinion the "solution" for this format is an easy one. The format do not have the "answers", but it have the BIG threats. Without the right answers, which should be the pillars of the format, there is no other solution other than the ban list us.
Don't know how WoTC could easy add the following cards to the format, but Modern needs them badly:
- Counterspell - add something to the nonexisting control decks;
- Wasteland - yes, the format need this card or we need more and more banings;
- Swords to Plowshares - Path to Exile come with an heavy drawback; this is the more fine solution to creature since Alpha and Beta;
Those card are just a defensive tools and will help greatly for a shorter banlist and most important- for a few situation like this one, with the Eldrazi decks.
I don't think those card are so oppressive. In reality they will just help the format to be more healthy.
I really don't see how any of those cards other than wasteland would be that great. wasteland wouldn't even be that great imo since like every other card you listed they would simply be assimilated into the Eldrazi shell. Most of the Eldrazi decks were running blue anyways and it wouldn't be to much to slip any color into the Mono-C version. the problem is the fast mana, TKS on t4 is tuff but on t2 its simply better than anything else any other deck is doing.
The real mistake WotC made is in printing a swarm of =/< 4cc over powered Eldrazi creatures. if they would have kept the Eldrazi at 5+cc it would have been fine since all the creatures would be competing for the same space and would give the opponent at least 3 turns to do something productive. as it stands now no other deck is capable of so easily doing so much so fast with a opponent having little to do against it other than play the same strategy. its a deck that can come out the gate as fast as affinity and 1-2 turns later be dropping Tron level big creatures. At least they had the good sense not to slap the "when cast" trigger on the small ones.
I am glade that this decks existence will likely devalue a bunch of other cards while its legal; baby jace is a laughable play when your opponent is dropping a TKS or a Reality Smasher as their follow up.
[quote from="Honoric »" url="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/668488-pro-tour-oath-of-the-gatewatch-modern-discussion?comment=887"]
I am glade that this decks existence will likely devalue a bunch of other cards while its legal; baby jace is a laughable play when your opponent is dropping a TKS or a Reality Smasher as their follow up.
I don't want to bust your bubble but Shadows over Innistrad has Madness cards. Baby Jace will increase further.
I believe the response is ramping up really hard with SSG and friends for a Stone Rain or similar 3cc LD spells on Eye of Ugin. Maybe it's doable on an artifact based shell with opals and springleaf drums. CMON PEOPLE!
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
[quote from="Honoric »" url="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/668488-pro-tour-oath-of-the-gatewatch-modern-discussion?comment=887"]
I am glade that this decks existence will likely devalue a bunch of other cards while its legal; baby jace is a laughable play when your opponent is dropping a TKS or a Reality Smasher as their follow up.
I don't want to bust your bubble but Shadows over Innistrad has Madness cards. Baby Jace will increase further.
</blockquote>
not while Eldrazi is everywhere. I had already pulled mine out of my Grixis Midrange deck because of how bad they are against the processors version. he's even worst against the ones playing 2-4cc Eldrazi. sorry but a 0/2 who literally does nothing when he hits the board is laughable when they drop TKS Reality Smasher etc.. what am I going to do flash back a IoK lol.
[quote from="Honoric »" url="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/668488-pro-tour-oath-of-the-gatewatch-modern-discussion?comment=887"]
I am glade that this decks existence will likely devalue a bunch of other cards while its legal; baby jace is a laughable play when your opponent is dropping a TKS or a Reality Smasher as their follow up.
I don't want to bust your bubble but Shadows over Innistrad has Madness cards. Baby Jace will increase further.
</blockquote>
not while Eldrazi is everywhere. I had already pulled mine out of my Grixis Midrange deck because of how bad they are against the processors version. he's even worst against the ones playing 2-4cc Eldrazi. sorry but a 0/2 who literally does nothing when he hits the board is laughable when they drop TKS Reality Smasher etc.. what am I going to do flash back a IoK lol.
</blockquote>
For modern, Painter's Servant is the way to go. Floating Path to Exile against TKS works as well. Eldrazi is strong but not unbeatable.
It's funny, when treasure cruise completely busted the format in half, people all played the wait and see, and lots even played the "OMG NO WAY" (incidentally, to the surprise of no pro players) when it was finally banned a few months later, everyone was like just play main deck chalice it's totally fine.
Phyrexian Obliterator looks awful sexy right about now!
all you have to do is play mono black and live till you hit 4 B mana and then what hope they don't have a dismember or any other number of easy to slide in removal options. all Phyrexian Obliterator would do is make main deck dismember or go for the throat slide into the deck.
I would like to thank Channel fireball for what they did to chalice.
I did a lot of mirrodin drafting the last weeks and got myself 4 chalice (2 which were even passed to me lmao). Last week they were worth 28tix, just sold them off for 88. Bought time I came out ahead on a PT spike.
well congratulations for blindly reading the metagame ahead of time; fortunately, only modern as a format had to be sacrificed in the process.
Well it's the only silver lining for me in an utterly depressing weekend... and if it makes you feel better I was a twin player so I lost far more than that with the bans
Ya, but it's not like you're only going to be playing Phyrexian Obliterator. Mono black actually seems really strong against the eldrazi. Smallpox, Rain of tears, Ghost quarter, lots of discard. Almost 8 rack style.
It is does completely shut off Eye of Ugin but only makes Eldrazi Temple slightly worse. It is also vulnerable to Dismember and comes down on turn 2, where often a lot of tempo has already been gained from sol lands. Doesn't sound like it does nearly enough.
Floating Path to Exile against TKS works as well.
Ramping a deck that can very well make use of the land seems awful.
Pathing a Reality Smasher is 3-for-1 card disadvantage. Seems like a losing strategy.
Well it's the only silver lining for me in an utterly depressing weekend... and if it makes you feel better I was a twin player so I lost far more than that with the bans
I'm just bustin your chops, I love it when things like that happen, I incidentally made a few on the spellskite spike that just happened.
I believe the response is ramping up really hard with SSG and friends for a Stone Rain or similar 3cc LD spells on Eye of Ugin. Maybe it's doable on an artifact based shell with opals and springleaf drums. CMON PEOPLE!
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
I believe it's rather obvious that the first Eye hurts other decks the most. Joking aside, I believe that the only response to these kinds of Eldrazi decks is ramping to land denial. Fulminator Mage , Ghost Quarter, Crack the Earth, Boom // Bust can fit into existing shells.
really so every deck needs to run a playset of Painter's Servant just in hopes that it doesn't die instantly to any of the numerous 1-1 removal spells that the deck could easily slide into the deck. add lighting bolt and they just SSG+bolt it while tapped out on your turn. or wait to untap and then cast it.
Does that mean we mull hard for servant because its our only out and if i don't get it down by turn 2 i likely never will.
these decks have been all over MTGO and i haven't found a reasonable way to put them off of their game.
I get it that people bought into the deck and are not going to be happy, but fast mana is what is busted about this deck. how bad would it feel to have a t2 TKS rip your painter out of your hand. given they play a full 4 of the creature that sounds just as likely as you dropping Painters Servant and them responding with a removal spell.
its much easier for the busted fast mana deck to adapt to a very narrow and easy to deal with problem card.
I believe the response is ramping up really hard with SSG and friends for a Stone Rain or similar 3cc LD spells on Eye of Ugin. Maybe it's doable on an artifact based shell with opals and springleaf drums. CMON PEOPLE!
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
I believe it's rather obvious that the first Eye hurts other decks the most. Joking aside, I believe that the only response to these kinds of Eldrazi decks is ramping to land denial. Fulminator Mage , Ghost Quarter, Crack the Earth, Boom // Bust can fit into existing shells.
I believe the response is ramping up really hard with SSG and friends for a Stone Rain or similar 3cc LD spells on Eye of Ugin. Maybe it's doable on an artifact based shell with opals and springleaf drums. CMON PEOPLE!
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
I believe it's rather obvious that the first Eye hurts other decks the most. Joking aside, I believe that the only response to these kinds of Eldrazi decks is ramping to land denial. Fulminator Mage , Ghost Quarter, Crack the Earth, Boom // Bust can fit into existing shells.
really so every deck needs to run a playset of Painter's Servant just in hopes that it doesn't die instantly to any of the numerous 1-1 removal spells that the deck could easily slide into the deck. add lighting bolt and they just SSG+bolt it while tapped out on your turn. or wait to untap and then cast it.
Does that mean we mull hard for servant because its our only out and if i don't get it down by turn 2 i likely never will.
these decks have been all over MTGO and i haven't found a reasonable way to put them off of their game.
I get it that people bought into the deck and are not going to be happy, but fast mana is what is busted about this deck. how bad would it feel to have a t2 TKS rip your painter out of your hand. given they play a full 4 of the creature that sounds just as likely as you dropping Painters Servant and them responding with a removal spell.
its much easier for the busted fast mana deck to adapt to a very narrow and easy to deal with problem card.
T2 TKS disrupting your hand happens. I don't see why broken cards are a problem. 4 Path to Exile + 4 Painter's Servant I guarantee you will have game. That's 4 sideboard slots dedicated.
Also, Eldrazi autoscoops both pre and post board to Ensnaring Bridge, except that one build that has a one off sideboard World Breaker. Lantern Control is probably favored against Eldrazi.
I believe the response is ramping up really hard with SSG and friends for a Stone Rain or similar 3cc LD spells on Eye of Ugin. Maybe it's doable on an artifact based shell with opals and springleaf drums. CMON PEOPLE!
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
I believe it's rather obvious that the first Eye hurts other decks the most. Joking aside, I believe that the only response to these kinds of Eldrazi decks is ramping to land denial. Fulminator Mage , Ghost Quarter, Crack the Earth, Boom // Bust can fit into existing shells.
guys... story circle...colorless (clear sarcasm)
we may have a problem here. There is a huge time period for people to try and figure out how to beat these different eldrazi strategies, but it really does feel like a crapshoot. Until the articles from intelligent players swim in about how abysmal it felt to play and watch eldrazi on the pro tour because everything else seemed weak...wizards doesn't care. They made their money and the pro tour is going off without a hitch. The company is set in their banlist schedule and unless an emergency reset and analysis of the modern format is imminent (not likely) maybe find a different hobby to occupy your time. I honestly got bored watching the event myself and I switched over to the StarCityGames Regionals streams. I dont think the sky is falling yet, but now we are starting to see the kind of company we are dealing with.
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Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
Umm ok..Personally I don't care about price fluctuations, so I can't consider this as a valid argument. Nevertheless, there are other land hate cards that can be considered.
Look a penny saved is a penny earned, everyone who plays the wait and see and hangs onto their cards are literally spending hundreds of dollars to do so (this mainly applies to MTGO where the metagame is instantly interpreted into market value).
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See it as a replacement for Spellskite in an Eldrazi infested meta. Painter's Servant will be what graveyard hate is against dredge. If you are unwilling to adapt to a changing meta with hate cards, then don't call for bans. Magic is a game where you either adapt or die.
You sir, have moxy, I'll give you that.
But in all seriousness, spellskite is basically good against everything, painter's is literally dead vs everything but eldrazi.
The real mistake WotC made is in printing a swarm of =/< 4cc over powered Eldrazi creatures. if they would have kept the Eldrazi at 5+cc it would have been fine since all the creatures would be competing for the same space and would give the opponent at least 3 turns to do something productive. as it stands now no other deck is capable of so easily doing so much so fast with a opponent having little to do against it other than play the same strategy. its a deck that can come out the gate as fast as affinity and 1-2 turns later be dropping Tron level big creatures. At least they had the good sense not to slap the "when cast" trigger on the small ones.
I am glade that this decks existence will likely devalue a bunch of other cards while its legal; baby jace is a laughable play when your opponent is dropping a TKS or a Reality Smasher as their follow up.
I don't want to bust your bubble but Shadows over Innistrad has Madness cards. Baby Jace will increase further.
that sounds like a terrible deck; i need to hope to have 5 cards in hand (1 land;spring leaf drum, SSG,a creature that cost 0-1, and a stone rain) just to deal with 1 of 8 lands they run.
not while Eldrazi is everywhere. I had already pulled mine out of my Grixis Midrange deck because of how bad they are against the processors version. he's even worst against the ones playing 2-4cc Eldrazi. sorry but a 0/2 who literally does nothing when he hits the board is laughable when they drop TKS Reality Smasher etc.. what am I going to do flash back a IoK lol.
For modern, Painter's Servant is the way to go. Floating Path to Exile against TKS works as well. Eldrazi is strong but not unbeatable.
Well it's the only silver lining for me in an utterly depressing weekend... and if it makes you feel better I was a twin player so I lost far more than that with the bans
It is does completely shut off Eye of Ugin but only makes Eldrazi Temple slightly worse. It is also vulnerable to Dismember and comes down on turn 2, where often a lot of tempo has already been gained from sol lands. Doesn't sound like it does nearly enough.
Ramping a deck that can very well make use of the land seems awful.
Pathing a Reality Smasher is 3-for-1 card disadvantage. Seems like a losing strategy.
WURUWr Stoneblade
Modern
WRGNaya Zoo Company
I'm just bustin your chops, I love it when things like that happen, I incidentally made a few on the spellskite spike that just happened.
I believe it's rather obvious that the first Eye hurts other decks the most. Joking aside, I believe that the only response to these kinds of Eldrazi decks is ramping to land denial. Fulminator Mage , Ghost Quarter, Crack the Earth, Boom // Bust can fit into existing shells.
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
Does that mean we mull hard for servant because its our only out and if i don't get it down by turn 2 i likely never will.
these decks have been all over MTGO and i haven't found a reasonable way to put them off of their game.
I get it that people bought into the deck and are not going to be happy, but fast mana is what is busted about this deck. how bad would it feel to have a t2 TKS rip your painter out of your hand. given they play a full 4 of the creature that sounds just as likely as you dropping Painters Servant and them responding with a removal spell.
its much easier for the busted fast mana deck to adapt to a very narrow and easy to deal with problem card.
I beleive MTGO has correctly interpreted that fulminator is a terrible answer to eldrazi: http://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Modern+Masters+2015/Fulminator+Mage#online
...and this chart shows??
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
T2 TKS disrupting your hand happens. I don't see why broken cards are a problem. 4 Path to Exile + 4 Painter's Servant I guarantee you will have game. That's 4 sideboard slots dedicated.
Also, Eldrazi autoscoops both pre and post board to Ensnaring Bridge, except that one build that has a one off sideboard World Breaker. Lantern Control is probably favored against Eldrazi.
...a massive sell off of the supposed answer to the deck which just took over modern.
we may have a problem here. There is a huge time period for people to try and figure out how to beat these different eldrazi strategies, but it really does feel like a crapshoot. Until the articles from intelligent players swim in about how abysmal it felt to play and watch eldrazi on the pro tour because everything else seemed weak...wizards doesn't care. They made their money and the pro tour is going off without a hitch. The company is set in their banlist schedule and unless an emergency reset and analysis of the modern format is imminent (not likely) maybe find a different hobby to occupy your time. I honestly got bored watching the event myself and I switched over to the StarCityGames Regionals streams. I dont think the sky is falling yet, but now we are starting to see the kind of company we are dealing with.
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)