You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
Even though I lose one of my archetypes, I still have UWr Midrange/Control to fall back on, both of which slightly benefit from the ban of twin, whether it be through residual increases in aggro decks (UR Delver, Burn, Infect, Affinity) or the fact that Geist will resolve more often on T3 with Twin out of the format (darn you Remand!).
I do worry that Tron and Bx Eldrazi will rise in usage, both of which are a pain to play against but are hate-able (Blood Moon, land destruction, search hate, Stony Silence, etc etc etc).
Time to mainboard Bloodmoon to even play a control deck.
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On mtgsalvation people don't want to discuss ideas, so I give people something else to discuss: my controversial opinions.
Thank you Splinter Twin. You have been a valuable partner and an amazing adversary.
I wonder if ktkenshinx will quit Modern after this. I think he mentionned such a ban as his breaking point. (Please don't quit!)
He's a numbers guy. If he looks at Twin's performance over the past few years I wouldn't be surprised if it was at Pod-like levels and comes to accept the ban. Lots of people are heavily gravitated to Twin's ability to have an oops-I-win threat constantly looming over someone's head by turn 4 and keeping multiple lands tapped down constantly to stave off the combo. Unfortunately, that aspect of Twin really hurt deck diversity. There really wasn't any point in playing other control or blue-based decks that didn't have the instant-win ability that Twin had.
Also I hope this shatters any pretense that Wizards wants a healthy and balanced format. All they want is a shaken up format for the pro tour so people watch it. This ban proves it more so than any other.
Were you expecting that they wouldn't do that? Last year when they announced that there wouldn't be a modern pro tour everyone complained and complained. Wizards said they would bring it back but they would use the ban list to keep it interesting. I completely understand banning twin for that reason since we consistently see the deck show up in the top 8s, 4s, and 2s of big tournaments even though it doesn't seem to fit with any of the other reasons.
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
Not to sound arrogant or anything, but I kind of called this months ago, and got shot down by a bunch of people.
I even wrote a rationale for a Twin banning that sounded like the rationale they gave.
Hopefully everyone gets it now. Wizards bans cards to shake up the Pro Tour. That is their first priority. DRS, Pod, Twin, next year it'll be whatever the best deck is again.
Guys - we just lost THE deck in the format and the deck that MOST effected how everything else is built and what is relevant. When you remove something like that you don't just see the decks it preyed on rise to the top. EVERYTHING changes. Everything. Now decks don't have to have mainboard answers to twin, maybe the dedicate slots to things like affinity or tron, etc.
Wow, nothing unbanned? That's what's even more surprising tbh. And the way they say "we want to increase diversity"...that just means that if no other deck can come out of this that can be good against Tron and Affinity, then Tron and Affinity just become the best decks. Does this mean that Tron and Affinity will see bans at some point in the future? WoW, such a bad precedent to set. What's the point of even playing this game anymore if all they want to do is ban decks that are at the top. Someone's always going to be at the top, but that shouldn't come at the expense of banning cards from the format. If you want to increase diversity, unban the cards that everyone wants unbanned. Banning is unfun and it sucks. Not to mention you reprinted this card, and you can bet someone was buying packs of MM2 to crack a few Splinter Twins.
I don't play Twin, but wow, i'm shocked. I would have been okay with a Twin ban if they unbanned something like SFM. But nope. Legacy looks really appealing right now.
I imagine that by the next ban list update, the format will be in a very strange position. Though to be honest, I'm not entirely surprised by this. Splinter Twin falls exactly in line with the banning for Pod. Pod was a good deck, consistent, and pushed other creature-based decks out of the format. Twin does much the same for blue decks, it pushes a lot of decks out of the format because it's simply better. It has honestly been consistently one of the top decks in Modern. I could understand it getting banned, but I think blue is now extremely weak and we're going to have problems in blue for a bit.
I can't say I'm pleased to see you and must warn you I may have to do something about it.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: URDelver
Modern: UGRDelver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
So what does this do for "Control"? Many pointed to Twin, and decks like Tron, for reasons why control couldn't be a thing. Does this help control, or does it weaken the UR color pairing? While we do not know of this banning effect on the overall meta, we don't have another tier one blue deck, a few tier two, and several in tier three. Do see more play, or does blue, as a color, drop into the realms of white? As it stands right now I would say Jund is the best overall color combo, which apparently isn't a safe place to be.
This is crazy and so bad for the format.
Let's leave tron and affinity pray upon everything.
Woof. You got drilled by this news. Hope you really really like Grixis Control.
Sorry for your loss. Same for everyone who lost a lot of money in this banning.
Meh, its not like Twin players lost any money in this banning, they got 4 copies of twin plus 8 uncommons.....Not a big deal, its not like their going to be running around frantically going OMG WHERE AM I GOING TO PLAY SCALDING TARNS WHEIOHAHJHDLKAHKJHKSKLJSKLAHJHJKHSKJABJK
So is the leak true since it got removed from reddit that Twin and Bloom got hit? If so I'm shocked that they would hit twin just after reprinting twin in modern masters.
This is exactly what I was thinking. Truly, nothing is safe.
I'm not a Twin player (well, I suppose no one is now), but I do enjoy Modern. I have no idea how to proceed. Do I play Tron and wait for Urza's Tower to be banned? Or do I play Affinity and wait for Mox Opal to be banned? Do I go rogue and keep brewing random things? Oy.
I'll concede that this will be a pretty monumental shakeup for the format, most notably when it comes to sideboarding. I don't like that combo is becoming some sort of boogieman. Twin was strong, but it was definitely beatable with some thoughtful sideboarding. I guess I'll just cross my fingers and hope it will actually make the format better. *shrugs*
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Calling it now: the SOI ban announcement will be one of the Urzatron lands or Ravager.
This is so ****ed up. Twin wasn't holding back anything except Tron, and Tron was already the most abundant deck at the last two SCGs. People aren't going to flock to UW Value Control and start playing Sun Titan just because you banned Twin. The deck is still Tier 3. Instead, they're just going to play Tron or Affinity.
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These days, some wizards are finding they have a little too much deck left at the end of their $$$.
MTG finance guy- follow me on Twitter@RichArschmann or RichardArschmann on Reddit
So what does this do for "Control"? Many pointed to Twin, and decks like Tron, for reasons why control couldn't be a thing. Does this help control, or does it weaken the UR color pairing? While we do not know of this banning effect on the overall meta, we don't have another tier one blue deck, a few tier two, and several in tier three. Do see more play, or does blue, as a color, drop into the realms of white? As it stands right now I would say Jund is the best overall color combo, which apparently isn't a safe place to be.
Tron will now be the top dog, the only other decks that can maybe deal with tron consistently are affinity, but mostly infect because of the shear speed factor. I doubt control will get much of a boost from this if I'm being totally honest.
For as many players that are angry about this I'm seeing just as many if not more that are completely ecstatic. This WILL cause some people to leave the format, but maybe it brings in many more as well. There is a LOT of salt left in Twin's wake.
But thats nothing new. Jund got trashed, people said they were done and the format was dead. Pod got banned, people said they would leave and their deck was dead, and now twin. I'm sure people can move on.
So what does this do for "Control"? Many pointed to Twin, and decks like Tron, for reasons why control couldn't be a thing. Does this help control, or does it weaken the UR color pairing? While we do not know of this banning effect on the overall meta, we don't have another tier one blue deck, a few tier two, and several in tier three. Do see more play, or does blue, as a color, drop into the realms of white? As it stands right now I would say Jund is the best overall color combo, which apparently isn't a safe place to be.
Control is in a much worse position because now that twin is gone, Tron/Eldrazi/Burn/Affinity are all tier 1. Most control decks really struggle against those decks.
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So, with the interactive combo deck gone, the big mana land voltron deck and the colourless robot deck probably get smacked with the next banlist update and we're going to end up in a format of super standard where we just smash value midrange creatures into each other and the first player to draw more lands than removal or threats loses. I'm worried about what wizards' vision for the format is at this point
What is certainly true is that Magic is a game of cards that, because of the way is built And How was created, there will always be a "Best Deck". I really thought they were ok with twin being the best.
There are two paths from now on: 1) we move on past Twins ban And realise the best deck will always fall before modern Pro tour.
2) there are enough riots so they completely remove modern PT And everyone stars playing their crazy crap again like legacy. Then if you want fairness go play Standard Or chess.
Im confused as to why Twin is Nerfed at all... as a G/b/x player I thought they were fine. My buddy plays twin hes not gonna be happy. So where is the scissors now for our rock paper scissors format?
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Decks
Modern BGR Jund RGB BW Eldrazi and Taxes WB BWGAbzan CompanyGWB
Also I hope this shatters any pretense that Wizards wants a healthy and balanced format. All they want is a shaken up format for the pro tour so people watch it. This ban proves it more so than any other.
Were you expecting that they wouldn't do that? Last year when they announced that there wouldn't be a modern pro tour everyone complained and complained. Wizards said they would bring it back but they would use the ban list to keep it interesting. I completely understand banning twin for that reason since we consistently see the deck show up in the top 8s, 4s, and 2s of big tournaments even though it doesn't seem to fit with any of the other reasons.
They announced only Standard PTs in a year with consistently boring standards. They also did it before announcing the new standard rotation. Players were right to be upset with the announcement. If anything it showed Wizards that people liked moder the way it is.
For a major company, Wizards is colossally bad with PR. This is just an extension of that. Also people delude themselves into thinking wizards is trying to make modern balanced. I think this once and for all shows that its not true. Many of us have known this for a while, but its hard to still be in denial after this.
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Currently Playing:
Modern: UWUW TronUW
Legacy: WDeath N TaxesW CEldrazi C
If you couldn't tell I hate greedy blue decks.
Wow, nothing unbanned? That's what's even more surprising tbh. And the way they say "we want to increase diversity"...that just means that if no other deck can come out of this that can be good against Tron and Affinity, then Tron and Affinity just become the best decks. Does this mean that Tron and Affinity will see bans at some point in the future? WoW, such a bad precedent to set. What's the point of even playing this game anymore if all they want to do is ban decks that are at the top. Someone's always going to be at the top, but that shouldn't come at the expense of banning cards from the format. If you want to increase diversity, unban the cards that everyone wants unbanned. Banning is unfun and it sucks. Not to mention you reprinted this card, and you can bet someone was buying packs of MM2 to crack a few Splinter Twins.
I don't play Twin, but wow, i'm shocked. I would have been okay with a Twin ban if they unbanned something like SFM. But nope. Legacy looks really appealing right now.
There is no twin in legacy either fyi.
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Not hard to imagine Stirrings and Groundswell are probably on the chopping block next.
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
Time to mainboard Bloodmoon to even play a control deck.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
He's a numbers guy. If he looks at Twin's performance over the past few years I wouldn't be surprised if it was at Pod-like levels and comes to accept the ban. Lots of people are heavily gravitated to Twin's ability to have an oops-I-win threat constantly looming over someone's head by turn 4 and keeping multiple lands tapped down constantly to stave off the combo. Unfortunately, that aspect of Twin really hurt deck diversity. There really wasn't any point in playing other control or blue-based decks that didn't have the instant-win ability that Twin had.
Woof. You got drilled by this news. Hope you really really like Grixis Control.
Sorry for your loss. Same for everyone who lost a lot of money in this banning.
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
I even wrote a rationale for a Twin banning that sounded like the rationale they gave.
Hopefully everyone gets it now. Wizards bans cards to shake up the Pro Tour. That is their first priority. DRS, Pod, Twin, next year it'll be whatever the best deck is again.
I don't play Twin, but wow, i'm shocked. I would have been okay with a Twin ban if they unbanned something like SFM. But nope. Legacy looks really appealing right now.
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
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Meh, its not like Twin players lost any money in this banning, they got 4 copies of twin plus 8 uncommons.....Not a big deal, its not like their going to be running around frantically going OMG WHERE AM I GOING TO PLAY SCALDING TARNS WHEIOHAHJHDLKAHKJHKSKLJSKLAHJHJKHSKJABJK
This is exactly what I was thinking. Truly, nothing is safe.
I'm not a Twin player (well, I suppose no one is now), but I do enjoy Modern. I have no idea how to proceed. Do I play Tron and wait for Urza's Tower to be banned? Or do I play Affinity and wait for Mox Opal to be banned? Do I go rogue and keep brewing random things? Oy.
I'll concede that this will be a pretty monumental shakeup for the format, most notably when it comes to sideboarding. I don't like that combo is becoming some sort of boogieman. Twin was strong, but it was definitely beatable with some thoughtful sideboarding. I guess I'll just cross my fingers and hope it will actually make the format better. *shrugs*
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This is so ****ed up. Twin wasn't holding back anything except Tron, and Tron was already the most abundant deck at the last two SCGs. People aren't going to flock to UW Value Control and start playing Sun Titan just because you banned Twin. The deck is still Tier 3. Instead, they're just going to play Tron or Affinity.
MTG finance guy- follow me on Twitter@RichArschmann or RichardArschmann on Reddit
Tron will now be the top dog, the only other decks that can maybe deal with tron consistently are affinity, but mostly infect because of the shear speed factor. I doubt control will get much of a boost from this if I'm being totally honest.
Control is in a much worse position because now that twin is gone, Tron/Eldrazi/Burn/Affinity are all tier 1. Most control decks really struggle against those decks.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
There are two paths from now on: 1) we move on past Twins ban And realise the best deck will always fall before modern Pro tour.
2) there are enough riots so they completely remove modern PT And everyone stars playing their crazy crap again like legacy. Then if you want fairness go play Standard Or chess.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
Decks
Modern
BGR Jund RGB
BW Eldrazi and Taxes WB
BWGAbzan Company GWB
Mtgo Modern
G Company Elves G
They announced only Standard PTs in a year with consistently boring standards. They also did it before announcing the new standard rotation. Players were right to be upset with the announcement. If anything it showed Wizards that people liked moder the way it is.
For a major company, Wizards is colossally bad with PR. This is just an extension of that. Also people delude themselves into thinking wizards is trying to make modern balanced. I think this once and for all shows that its not true. Many of us have known this for a while, but its hard to still be in denial after this.
Modern:
UWUW TronUW
Legacy:
WDeath N TaxesW
CEldrazi C
If you couldn't tell I hate greedy blue decks.
Vintage
WWhite Trash