Did you guys see that yesterday nearly all the Death's shadows disappeared on TCG for a moment? It went up to 24 dollars, just checked now and it's back to 16ish.
I was trying to build death's shadow a week weeks before the GP. In the middle of the finals with Leyton playing against merfolk I was immediately buying death's shadow, luckily I got it for 7 a copy before it doubled.
I have the few pieces I need coming in, hoping to play it in paper next week, I tried out Abzan Company for the first time at my fnm, and played a Goryos deck and an Eldrazi Tron deck starting 0-2, I dropped (but I also sucked with this deck I wasn't familiar with playing).
Definitely will be happy to punish decks, I'm excited for Death Shadow Jund in the format.
Remember that banlist talk is not allowed in this thread. It's okay to speculate about the price of cards that might be banned or unbanned. It's even okay to talk about the risks of an unban investment. But you can't talk about unbans/bans without also including price content in your post; the primary purpose of the post must always be to discuss pricing.
If you're intending to spec you should probably pick up a few of each. They're fairly cheap to buy into right now and will definitely rise if unbanned. And you won't really lose out even if they don't.
SFM has 2 printings (WWK and GP), Preordain has 3 printings (M11, Venser vs Koth, Commander 15), so you should keep that in mind.
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
If you're looking to spec, SFM is a good one. She's fairly cheap right now,like 15ish dollars? If she were to be unbanned, she'd easily skyrocket to 40 per copy
If you're speccing on possible unbans, don't spec into cards that are so expensive.
I bought 3 foil SFM's 2 months ago, since I'd super lose out on that if I didn't, but that's because I have a lot of GBx'd foiled out and I'd shell out so, so much if she were unbanned. As the format continues to exist, she looks more realistic to see unbanned in the future.
Speccing on 2x Jace's isn't a horrible idea, if he does get an unbanning, you'll still feel pretty good on the steal you got from him, even if the other 2 will be super expensive. I also don't like the idea of spending 200 dollars on a playset when he may never see a ban, 100 feels a little better (still a lot, obviously), but you're in a less lose lose situation. I have no interest in playing blue decks unless Splinter Twin is unbanned so I am unwilling to pay any money for him. Now, if Jace were 20 dollars a copy, I'd be all in.
Picking up a playset of Preordain isn't an awful idea, every vendor is going to hold a ransom for it for the first month if it is unbanned.
What do you guys think are the best targets for speculation on the banlist? SFM, Preordain?
I would expect nothing but "no change" in the next ban announcement. Thus, no need to worry about price speculation.
Bad advice and bad prediction, Forescythe said there'd be a conversation on blue based on it's very poor performance since the Summer, thus some price speculation on blue isn't an awful idea.
What do you guys think are the best targets for speculation on the banlist? SFM, Preordain?
I would expect nothing but "no change" in the next ban announcement. Thus, no need to worry about price speculation.
Bad advice and bad prediction, Forescythe said there'd be a conversation on blue based on it's very poor performance since the Summer, thus some price speculation on blue isn't an awful idea.
I just express my expectation about the next ban announcement, which is probably no change as usual.
But there is always a price speculation near each ban announcement, just like a gambling.
My advice is not to do the gambling, because I fail many times in the past.
(I have bought 8 copies of Jace, SFM, and Preordain in the past three years...)
I have spent 600 USD on Jace, and I do not play EDH or Legacy.
If Jace is not unbanned, this expense is just a waste of money. I should better buy it after he is indeed unbanned.
What do you guys think are the best targets for speculation on the banlist? SFM, Preordain?
I would expect nothing but "no change" in the next ban announcement. Thus, no need to worry about price speculation.
Bad advice and bad prediction, Forescythe said there'd be a conversation on blue based on it's very poor performance since the Summer, thus some price speculation on blue isn't an awful idea.
Didn't Forsythe mention AV before its unbban as well? If I remember, it happened some time in January, causing the $6 -> $16 initial jump (followed by the $16 -> $50 jump after the actual unban). While his Jace tweet holds any value or not remains to be seen, it's definitely not a bad spec target. Upon further reflection, I picked up an additional new copy (1 WWK 2 FTV20 total). Worst case scenario they will live in Commander decks or sit in a binder before being traded or sold off at parity. I don't think he's ever going to go below $50.
I have spent 600 USD on Jace, and I do not play EDH or Legacy.
If Jace is not unbanned, this expense is just a waste of money. I should better buy it after he is indeed unbanned.
$600?! He's readily available in the ~$50-range for WWK, EMA, and FTV foils. Did you buy extra copies solely to spec on? That may pay off big time, but also not be the safest idea, IMO. I think spec is secondary to simply trying to avoid price spikes for a card I would want to play.
What do you guys think are the best targets for speculation on the banlist? SFM, Preordain?
I would expect nothing but "no change" in the next ban announcement. Thus, no need to worry about price speculation.
Bad advice and bad prediction, Forescythe said there'd be a conversation on blue based on it's very poor performance since the Summer, thus some price speculation on blue isn't an awful idea.
Didn't Forsythe mention AV before its unbban as well? If I remember, it happened some time in January, causing the $6 -> $16 initial jump (followed by the $16 -> $50 jump after the actual unban). While his Jace tweet holds any value or not remains to be seen, it's definitely not a bad spec target. Upon further reflection, I picked up an additional new copy (1 WWK 2 FTV20 total). Worst case scenario they will live in Commander decks or sit in a binder before being traded or sold off at parity. I don't think he's ever going to go below $50.
I have spent 600 USD on Jace, and I do not play EDH or Legacy.
If Jace is not unbanned, this expense is just a waste of money. I should better buy it after he is indeed unbanned.
$600?! He's readily available in the ~$50-range for WWK, EMA, and FTV foils. Did you buy extra copies solely to spec on? That may pay off big time, but also not be the safest idea, IMO. I think spec is secondary to simply trying to avoid price spikes for a card I would want to play.
He is $50 after the ENM release, before that he is $90-100 where I bought a playset based on that stupid price.
He is $50 after the ENM release, before that he is $90-100.
No, I get that, I'm just curious why someone would spec on Jace at such a high price if they didn't also play Legacy or Commander. The only reason to remotely justify a spec now is that he is half the price he was and AF talked about him in a tweet. I have a hard time understanding justification for purchasing at the higher level before the reprint and before any unban chatter.
Yeah for me, its not even a topic of speculation, I dont want to eat the extra $100 following a potential unban, to play the card. The copies I got would 100% be for my own use.
I have spent 600 USD on Jace, and I do not play EDH or Legacy.
If Jace is not unbanned, this expense is just a waste of money. I should better buy it after he is indeed unbanned.
Welcome to speculating? If it were 0 risk, everybody would do it.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
"Heard all the "unban Jace" chatter today. We'll talk through it at the next meeting, as always. #WOTCstaff"
This was a quote from Forsythe's twitter a couple days ago. Really doesn't sound yay or nay... but it's definitely on the radar of being looked at.
For comparison's sake, on January 15th 2016, Forsythe tweeted: "Visions will be up for discussion once we see how the post-Twin world plays out. Sword just makes Lantern more obnoxious, no?"
We could be seeing something that's not there, but it's not out of the realm of possibility to unban; hence the buying and speccing happening right now. I'm surprised we haven't seen more of an uptick in Jace's price yet. His tweet last year caused AV to triple.
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
Griselbrand: up .16
Stoic Angel: no change
Domri Rade: down .05
Seeing that these are confirmed MM17 includes, shouldn't the price be tanking?
There's essentially nowhere for the price to tank (yet).
The price would only tank if people were selling their copies in response to the announcement. No one is going to sell their $2 copy of Stoic Angel or even $6 copy of Domri Rade to prevent themselves from losing $1-3 worth of value in the future; by the time you ship the card you've already lost your profits.
The only card potentially worth selling is Griselbrand, but even that is only $12. The price will probably never go down beneath $5. So the only people really affected by this are players who aren't using their copies, who also want to make maybe $4/copy after shipping. Seems like a lot of work.
So far, the card with the most to lose is Snapcaster Mage, especially if it's reprinted at rare. But even though Snapcaster is likely on the box art, it's still not confirmed because the art is new.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
So far, the card with the most to lose is Snapcaster Mage, especially if it's reprinted at rare. But even though Snapcaster is likely on the box art, it's still not confirmed because the art is new.
Snapcaster Mage is a single Tier 1 blue deck away from going back to $60+ despite a reprint. It happened to Noble Hierarch and would absolutely happen to Snapcaster.
If he's in the set with the same art, all versions would tank at or slightly below ~$20 before settling back to the mid $30s. If he's got that new art, there will be split opinions on it (For example, I LOVE the original ISD art), and prices would reflect art changes with similar dips and returns, likely with the ISD holding more value. I think his value is much more dictated by a strong blue tier 1 presence than any reprints.
For all we know, there's more Twin staples in it. I mean we just got Deceiver Exarch in CN2...
Whatever is in this set, it was designed and finalized over a year ago. I wouldn't read too much into what is and isn't there.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
I was trying to build death's shadow a week weeks before the GP. In the middle of the finals with Leyton playing against merfolk I was immediately buying death's shadow, luckily I got it for 7 a copy before it doubled.
I have the few pieces I need coming in, hoping to play it in paper next week, I tried out Abzan Company for the first time at my fnm, and played a Goryos deck and an Eldrazi Tron deck starting 0-2, I dropped (but I also sucked with this deck I wasn't familiar with playing).
Definitely will be happy to punish decks, I'm excited for Death Shadow Jund in the format.
GGT reprint!
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
I would expect nothing but "no change" in the next ban announcement. Thus, no need to worry about price speculation.
Anything, but nothing at the moment...
Modern:
WUBRGAmulet Titan, WUBRGHuman
WUBRAd Nauseam, WBRGDeath Shadow, UBRGScapeshift, UBRGDredge
WURJeskai Nahiri, WURCheeri0s, WBGCounter Company, WRGBurn, UBRMadcap Moon, BRGJund Midrange
UBTurn,BRGriselbrand Reanimator, WGKnight Company, RGRG Tron, RGRG Ponza, XAffinity, XEldrazi Tron
SFM has 2 printings (WWK and GP), Preordain has 3 printings (M11, Venser vs Koth, Commander 15), so you should keep that in mind.
If you're speccing on possible unbans, don't spec into cards that are so expensive.
I bought 3 foil SFM's 2 months ago, since I'd super lose out on that if I didn't, but that's because I have a lot of GBx'd foiled out and I'd shell out so, so much if she were unbanned. As the format continues to exist, she looks more realistic to see unbanned in the future.
Speccing on 2x Jace's isn't a horrible idea, if he does get an unbanning, you'll still feel pretty good on the steal you got from him, even if the other 2 will be super expensive. I also don't like the idea of spending 200 dollars on a playset when he may never see a ban, 100 feels a little better (still a lot, obviously), but you're in a less lose lose situation. I have no interest in playing blue decks unless Splinter Twin is unbanned so I am unwilling to pay any money for him. Now, if Jace were 20 dollars a copy, I'd be all in.
Picking up a playset of Preordain isn't an awful idea, every vendor is going to hold a ransom for it for the first month if it is unbanned.
Bad advice and bad prediction, Forescythe said there'd be a conversation on blue based on it's very poor performance since the Summer, thus some price speculation on blue isn't an awful idea.
I just express my expectation about the next ban announcement, which is probably no change as usual.
But there is always a price speculation near each ban announcement, just like a gambling.
My advice is not to do the gambling, because I fail many times in the past.
(I have bought 8 copies of Jace, SFM, and Preordain in the past three years...)
Anything, but nothing at the moment...
Modern:
WUBRGAmulet Titan, WUBRGHuman
WUBRAd Nauseam, WBRGDeath Shadow, UBRGScapeshift, UBRGDredge
WURJeskai Nahiri, WURCheeri0s, WBGCounter Company, WRGBurn, UBRMadcap Moon, BRGJund Midrange
UBTurn,BRGriselbrand Reanimator, WGKnight Company, RGRG Tron, RGRG Ponza, XAffinity, XEldrazi Tron
Spirits
If Jace is not unbanned, this expense is just a waste of money. I should better buy it after he is indeed unbanned.
Anything, but nothing at the moment...
Modern:
WUBRGAmulet Titan, WUBRGHuman
WUBRAd Nauseam, WBRGDeath Shadow, UBRGScapeshift, UBRGDredge
WURJeskai Nahiri, WURCheeri0s, WBGCounter Company, WRGBurn, UBRMadcap Moon, BRGJund Midrange
UBTurn,BRGriselbrand Reanimator, WGKnight Company, RGRG Tron, RGRG Ponza, XAffinity, XEldrazi Tron
Didn't Forsythe mention AV before its unbban as well? If I remember, it happened some time in January, causing the $6 -> $16 initial jump (followed by the $16 -> $50 jump after the actual unban). While his Jace tweet holds any value or not remains to be seen, it's definitely not a bad spec target. Upon further reflection, I picked up an additional new copy (1 WWK 2 FTV20 total). Worst case scenario they will live in Commander decks or sit in a binder before being traded or sold off at parity. I don't think he's ever going to go below $50.
Edit:
$600?! He's readily available in the ~$50-range for WWK, EMA, and FTV foils. Did you buy extra copies solely to spec on? That may pay off big time, but also not be the safest idea, IMO. I think spec is secondary to simply trying to avoid price spikes for a card I would want to play.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
He is $50 after the ENM release, before that he is $90-100 where I bought a playset based on that stupid price.
Anything, but nothing at the moment...
Modern:
WUBRGAmulet Titan, WUBRGHuman
WUBRAd Nauseam, WBRGDeath Shadow, UBRGScapeshift, UBRGDredge
WURJeskai Nahiri, WURCheeri0s, WBGCounter Company, WRGBurn, UBRMadcap Moon, BRGJund Midrange
UBTurn,BRGriselbrand Reanimator, WGKnight Company, RGRG Tron, RGRG Ponza, XAffinity, XEldrazi Tron
WTH? Memory Jar? I bought 25 copies back when it was $7. Woohoo! There's a spec win!
No, I get that, I'm just curious why someone would spec on Jace at such a high price if they didn't also play Legacy or Commander. The only reason to remotely justify a spec now is that he is half the price he was and AF talked about him in a tweet. I have a hard time understanding justification for purchasing at the higher level before the reprint and before any unban chatter.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Spirits
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
This was a quote from Forsythe's twitter a couple days ago. Really doesn't sound yay or nay... but it's definitely on the radar of being looked at.
For comparison's sake, on January 15th 2016, Forsythe tweeted: "Visions will be up for discussion once we see how the post-Twin world plays out. Sword just makes Lantern more obnoxious, no?"
We could be seeing something that's not there, but it's not out of the realm of possibility to unban; hence the buying and speccing happening right now. I'm surprised we haven't seen more of an uptick in Jace's price yet. His tweet last year caused AV to triple.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Griselbrand: up .16
Stoic Angel: no change
Domri Rade: down .05
Seeing that these are confirmed MM17 includes, shouldn't the price be tanking?
The price would only tank if people were selling their copies in response to the announcement. No one is going to sell their $2 copy of Stoic Angel or even $6 copy of Domri Rade to prevent themselves from losing $1-3 worth of value in the future; by the time you ship the card you've already lost your profits.
The only card potentially worth selling is Griselbrand, but even that is only $12. The price will probably never go down beneath $5. So the only people really affected by this are players who aren't using their copies, who also want to make maybe $4/copy after shipping. Seems like a lot of work.
So far, the card with the most to lose is Snapcaster Mage, especially if it's reprinted at rare. But even though Snapcaster is likely on the box art, it's still not confirmed because the art is new.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
Snapcaster Mage is a single Tier 1 blue deck away from going back to $60+ despite a reprint. It happened to Noble Hierarch and would absolutely happen to Snapcaster.
If he's in the set with the same art, all versions would tank at or slightly below ~$20 before settling back to the mid $30s. If he's got that new art, there will be split opinions on it (For example, I LOVE the original ISD art), and prices would reflect art changes with similar dips and returns, likely with the ISD holding more value. I think his value is much more dictated by a strong blue tier 1 presence than any reprints.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate