MTG Salvation

So far some solid reprints are out there, surprised that both chalice and blood moon showed up.

In my opinion, whether I buy into this product will almost entirely be a function of the land cycle. Fetches or old fast lands might get me, that would be about it.

Not too sure that a Tireless Tracker spike has anything to do with Humans. I don't know any lists running that card and if they did it would never be as more of a 2-of at the absolute most. It is pretty bad in a deck with 19 lands and zero fetches. Maybe in the CoCo build?

Tracker is seeing play in the various brews for RUG and Ponza online.

Quote from rogue_LOVE »

Any cards you're all waiting on to see if they're spoilered in A25?

I've been holding off on the Emrakul/Breach package in case of a reprint, ready to snap them up if they're not there. Also need to pick up a set of Vials, but I assume their not being in this set won't influence their price because of the IMA reprint.

Emrakul and Breach could be reprinted but I doubt we would see both in the set. I think we're gonna see a Breach reprint at rare honestly. Emrakul is pretty solidly 35-45 each depending if you can get a good deal.

Phew. Glad I dumped my extra Thalia play sets back in January.

Quote from BlueTronFTW »

So far some solid reprints are out there, surprised that both chalice and blood moon showed up.

In my opinion, whether I buy into this product will almost entirely be a function of the land cycle. Fetches or old fast lands might get me, that would be about it.

Assuming there's a rare land cycle, my money is on ally manlands.

Quote from darksteel88 »

Welp, that guy lost all his credibility on the first day about Chalice. But Chalice at mythic probably means the long term value won't change.

Was that me? The vendor told us sorry about getting that one wrong. He did get Imperial Recruiter right, which my friends convinced me on Friday could NOT be in the set. Lol. I personally think the other vendors were just speculating on it not being in the set. It made a lot of sense to me as well.

As for credibility, I don't mind. I made more than $5,000 on just Sword of the Meek, $500 on Ancestral Vision, $300 on Bloodbraid Elf (had fewer than I had thought or lost a *****load of them), and nearly $2,000 on Jace, the Mind Sculptor. Sure, I've lost some on other random cards, but I feel okay about it. The next card I am hoarding is Stoneforge Mystic because I already have nearly 1,000 Preordain. Probably need to get in on Green Sun's Zeniths as well...

Quote from FoodChainGoblins »

Quote from darksteel88 »

Welp, that guy lost all his credibility on the first day about Chalice. But Chalice at mythic probably means the long term value won't change.

Was that me? The vendor told us sorry about getting that one wrong. He did get Imperial Recruiter right, which my friends convinced me on Friday could NOT be in the set. Lol. I personally think the other vendors were just speculating on it not being in the set. It made a lot of sense to me as well.

As for credibility, I don't mind. I made more than $5,000 on just Sword of the Meek, $500 on Ancestral Vision, $300 on Bloodbraid Elf (had fewer than I had thought or lost a *****load of them), and nearly $2,000 on Jace, the Mind Sculptor. Sure, I've lost some on other random cards, but I feel okay about it. The next card I am hoarding is Stoneforge Mystic because I already have nearly 1,000 Preordain. Probably need to get in on Green Sun's Zeniths as well...

Ah so you are into that kind of thing. I'm more into the speculation game for the sake of getting cards at a fair market price, which is becoming harder and harder to do thanks to the greed wizards has shown. This company isn't the company I remember from my childhood, unfortunately.

I've got burned out pretty badly by Iconic Masters. Overpriced packs to get chance to open $1 worth core set rares was a nothing but a big middle finger to it. Now if they're announcing that's the future of Masters sets then I'm not wasting my time on them. A Vintage or Legacy chase rare or two won't enact any interest for those formats given how they have always been doomed due to the reserved list.

Some power common and uncommons could be interesting to see if they preserve their rarity. Remand and Lava Spike come to mind.

Quote from javert »

I've got burned out pretty badly by Iconic Masters. Overpriced packs to get chance to open $1 worth core set rares was a nothing but a big middle finger to it. Now if they're announcing that's the future of Masters sets then I'm not wasting my time on them. A Vintage or Legacy chase rare or two won't enact any interest for those formats given how they have always been doomed due to the reserved list.

Some power common and uncommons could be interesting to see if they preserve their rarity. Remand and Lava Spike come to mind.

I'm still thinking this is just iconic masters 2 and that people are setting themselves up for disappointment if they expect otherwise, but it's only the first day of spoilers and they could be holding a lot back. They designed this set at the same time as iconic masters and there is no way they could have gotten the feedback from iconic masters to really boost the second masters set in time.

How low can Blood Moon drop? Pre-Order sub $20.

I'm guessing Blood Moon will drop to at least $10-$15 or so. I am very disappointed in the reprinting of Chalice and Imperial Recruiter at Mythic. Recruiter will drop a ton in price, as it's just super low supply and not a very commonly played card. Chalice on the other hand is a very high demand card, for both Modern and Legacy, so the price will likely go up after a few months, unless they print this set into the ground.

This just shows us again that WotC puts a lot of consideration into the secondary market when printing a set. Chalice was printed as a rare in the original Modern Masters while it's price was sitting at about $8 or so. Now, many years later, it's price is 10x that and it's reprinted as a damn Mythic! Complete bull*****. Isnt the whole point of these types of sets to make very sought after cards a bit more affordable? Oh wait, I forgot, Wotc's design team thinks these sets are produced for draft only, my bad.

Chalice at Mythic is probably because of draft mostly.

Quote from Chapterhouse »

I'm guessing Blood Moon will drop to at least $10-$15 or so. I am very disappointed in the reprinting of Chalice and Imperial Recruiter at Mythic. Recruiter will drop a ton in price, as it's just super low supply and not a very commonly played card. Chalice on the other hand is a very high demand card, for both Modern and Legacy, so the price will likely go up after a few months, unless they print this set into the ground.

This just shows us again that WotC puts a lot of consideration into the secondary market when printing a set. Chalice was printed as a rare in the original Modern Masters while it's price was sitting at about $8 or so. Now, many years later, it's price is 10x that and it's reprinted as a damn Mythic! Complete bull*****. Isnt the whole point of these types of sets to make very sought after cards a bit more affordable? Oh wait, I forgot, Wotc's design team thinks these sets are produced for draft only, my bad.

No. The point of these sets is to pack them with just enough value that players want to buy a lot of them without tanking the secondary market. Part of what allows players to justify shelling out for expensive staples is the idea that those cards will hold value. Masters sets are a tightrope walk for Wizards in which card price heavily factors into rarity.

yeah there is pretty much no situation that leaves everyone satisfied. tbh i give props to wotc for even continuing this line of products for so long. sticking to the draft premise, while juggling all these other side-goals.

i was sorta low-key hoping for blue/red blast to be printed in standard.

oh more blood moons in circulation. i just cant contain my excitement. oh wait, i can, because that card is horrible.

sorta off topic, but when would be a good time to pick up the fastlands from standard?

even more off topic - has wotc said anything about continuing the alternative card back (expedition lands, masterpieces, etc) printings?

@FoodChainGoblins - holy god man. you are taking the spec game to the next level and then some.

Then Wotc should stop saying they dont make decisions based off of the secondary market, as it's clearly not true. I just want as many people as possible to have access to the Modern format, so that it can continue to grow and evolve.

Some unexpected reprints... it's up and down for me... should have waited, I bought 3 M17 moons already ... but glad that I cashed in on my 3 thalia before they got spoiled.. so that evens it out.

So far, the only thing I can / will buy from Masters 25 is Azusa - for collection purposes. Chalice would still cost a lot even if got reprinted = mythic, so hands off on that one. >__<

Quote from tronix »

@FoodChainGoblins - holy god man. you are taking the spec game to the next level and then some.

I try to make Magic a "self sustaining" hobby, as it was for me for many years. I was able to pay for tournament fees, travel, cards and supplies all with winnings. Nowadays, it's much tougher. I've been doing it since my brother and I agreed to buy and trade aggressively for dual lands, only to see them spike from $2.50 to $5 each (on average). It felt good.

Magic is such an expensive hobby that unless you are filthy rich (IMO) or only like to play 1 deck, you really have to have innovative ways to pay for it. I wish it didn't push out people without the budget for it, but it does. Pay to play.

Quote from FoodChainGoblins »

Quote from tronix »

@FoodChainGoblins - holy god man. you are taking the spec game to the next level and then some.

I try to make Magic a "self sustaining" hobby, as it was for me for many years. I was able to pay for tournament fees, travel, cards and supplies all with winnings. Nowadays, it's much tougher. I've been doing it since my brother and I agreed to buy and trade aggressively for dual lands, only to see them spike from $2.50 to $5 each (on average). It felt good.

Magic is such an expensive hobby that unless you are filthy rich (IMO) or only like to play 1 deck, you really have to have innovative ways to pay for it. I wish it didn't push out people without the budget for it, but it does. Pay to play.

The one making it hard for the game to grow and expand is the company itself. Everything else is basically a side effect of what Wizards of the Coast does as far as reprinting cards and how they print them. Masters sets need to have cards with a wide breadth of play and are legal across multiple formats. There really isn't room for dead cards like Sundering Titan.

Quote from Colt47 »

Quote from FoodChainGoblins »

Quote from tronix »

@FoodChainGoblins - holy god man. you are taking the spec game to the next level and then some.

I try to make Magic a "self sustaining" hobby, as it was for me for many years. I was able to pay for tournament fees, travel, cards and supplies all with winnings. Nowadays, it's much tougher. I've been doing it since my brother and I agreed to buy and trade aggressively for dual lands, only to see them spike from $2.50 to $5 each (on average). It felt good.

Magic is such an expensive hobby that unless you are filthy rich (IMO) or only like to play 1 deck, you really have to have innovative ways to pay for it. I wish it didn't push out people without the budget for it, but it does. Pay to play.

The one making it hard for the game to grow and expand is the company itself. Everything else is basically a side effect of what Wizards of the Coast does as far as reprinting cards and how they print them. Masters sets need to have cards with a wide breadth of play and are legal across multiple formats. There really isn't room for dead cards like Sundering Titan.

Sundering Titan is hardly "dead," it sees some play in Tron in Modern and is okay in Commander.

Quote from Lord Seth »

Quote from Colt47 »

Quote from FoodChainGoblins »

Quote from tronix »

@FoodChainGoblins - holy god man. you are taking the spec game to the next level and then some.

I try to make Magic a "self sustaining" hobby, as it was for me for many years. I was able to pay for tournament fees, travel, cards and supplies all with winnings. Nowadays, it's much tougher. I've been doing it since my brother and I agreed to buy and trade aggressively for dual lands, only to see them spike from $2.50 to $5 each (on average). It felt good.

Magic is such an expensive hobby that unless you are filthy rich (IMO) or only like to play 1 deck, you really have to have innovative ways to pay for it. I wish it didn't push out people without the budget for it, but it does. Pay to play.

The one making it hard for the game to grow and expand is the company itself. Everything else is basically a side effect of what Wizards of the Coast does as far as reprinting cards and how they print them. Masters sets need to have cards with a wide breadth of play and are legal across multiple formats. There really isn't room for dead cards like Sundering Titan.

Sundering Titan is hardly "dead," it sees some play in Tron in Modern and is okay in Commander.

Sundering Titan hasn't seen play in competitive Tron lists in a long time and it's actually banned in commander. It's only real use in the last year was in U Tron as something to tutor with Treasure Mage.

Quote from Lord Seth »

Quote from Colt47 »

Sundering Titan is hardly "dead," it sees some play in Tron in Modern and is okay in Commander.

It is more than "okay" in Commander. Which is why it is banned there. And I don't think many lists in Modern run it (I personally have not seen any). It seems about as dead as Channel in terms of being a good include for the set.

EDIT: Actually, maybe Mono-U Tron runs it? It is not a Tron variant I am familiar with and is certainly not one of the more popular ones.

You all realize this set isn't specifically designed to appease modern players? Reprint equity is a real thing and given the influx of masters sets over the past couple years they can't realistically all be loaded with staples.

You really see Sundering Titan in Legacy MUD. The decks on a bit of a downturn now, but it has been all over the place before.

FoodChain: Not going to lie, every time I see you clamour for PreOrdain to be unbanned now I'm going to be giving you the internet side-eye

With A25, I'm finding it odd. It's a set with better cards then Iconic, but I'm finding I want less of it even though I am a Legacy player. Is anyone else on the same page?

Quote from ET1 »

You all realize this set isn't specifically designed to appease modern players? Reprint equity is a real thing and given the influx of masters sets over the past couple years they can't realistically all be loaded with staples.

No doubt. This set is a reprint set that is out to claim 'nostalgia' and by that metric, its doing pretty good. There are some cards that needed another printing, and have them, and this is just the second day of spoilers.

Will there be more power? I dont know, I hope for some Modern staples to see reprint, but outside of some pretty niche cards (Chalice, Bridge) are there REALLY highly needed reprints approaching $70 outside of Snaps and Goyf?

I mean yeah, things are expensive again, but when BGx and URx rise...so do the prices of the best cards in the format.

Quote from Ratrek »

FoodChain: Not going to lie, every time I see you clamour for PreOrdain to be unbanned now I'm going to be giving you the internet side-eye

I'm going to be getting a lot of side eye then.

I truly do believe that the card is okay for Modern. I would not have purchased so many copies if I did think it wasn't okay for Modern and therefore had no chance of being unbanned.