This is why I've been very behind people repping one kind of deck, and grabbing the stables of them as they get printed. I've been doing naya aggro for years, and have all the stables, but I hate the idea of people jumping from one deck to another making all these crazy spikes. I have it easy, I grab it as it comes, and I watch as tarmo... goes up! Because people are going into zoo, even though jund guys would tell you the whole deck is dead.
Its just nutzo. I think people should figure out what their playstyle is and stick with it. In the long run it makes the market more stable.
Tron will get worse. Mono-U Tron is weak to aggro and RG Tron can't use Pyroclasm against Zoo.
False. RG Tron can use Pyroclasm. True, some creatures are immune, such as Wild Nacatl (though if on the play, Tron can kill a Wild Nacatl on turn 2 with Pyroclasm), but not all are. For example, Goblin Guide, mana dorks, Burning-Tree Emissary, and Steppe Lynx are cards Zoo is likely to play some copies of, and Pyroclasm kills them all. And of course Oblivion Stone nicely sweeps the entire board regardless of toughness. It's true that Pyroclasm is not a kill-all spell against Zoo, but to say it can't use Pyroclasm is false.
And if it really does become an issue, Firespout does exist last time I checked.
So I was looking to pick up some foils for my black deck and I noticed that there isn't a single foil disfigure on the market currently. What the heck? I understood the prospecting for the ban list but a foil common that sees net to no play in any format?
Anyone know what is going on?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy:B The Gate // B Pox Modern:RGB Dredge // RBG Goblins // B The Gate // UBR Tezz AoB Control // RBG Prison Pox EDH:RBU Thraximundar // R Norin the Wary // RWB Kaalia of the Vast // BUR Grixis Combos // BU Gisa and Geralf Tribal Tiny Leaders:BUW Sydri, Galvanic Genius // R Feldon of the Third Path
Tron will get worse. Mono-U Tron is weak to aggro and RG Tron can't use Pyroclasm against Zoo.
False. RG Tron can use Pyroclasm. True, some creatures are immune, such as Wild Nacatl (though if on the play, Tron can kill a Wild Nacatl on turn 2 with Pyroclasm), but not all are. For example, Goblin Guide, mana dorks, Burning-Tree Emissary, and Steppe Lynx are cards Zoo is likely to play some copies of, and Pyroclasm kills them all. And of course Oblivion Stone nicely sweeps the entire board regardless of toughness. It's true that Pyroclasm is not a kill-all spell against Zoo, but to say it can't use Pyroclasm is false.
And if it really does become an issue, Firespout does exist last time I checked.
Look at the Zoo threads. They are cutting Goblin Guide and Burning-Tree Emissary and aren't running Steppe Lynx. And the problem with Firespout is that it costs 3 mana.
i have 3 foil disfigures which i bought ages ago in anticipation of playing them in UB fae. I also have a playset of foil peppersmoke, smother, and FNM go fors.. missing dismembers though.
but yeah, i don't even know how much mistbind foils are. i'm relatively upset i traded my mistbinds for like 4 bucks a year ago..
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I speak in sarcasm because calling people ******* ******** is not allowed.
Look at the Zoo threads. They are cutting Goblin Guide and Burning-Tree Emissary and aren't running Steppe Lynx. And the problem with Firespout is that it costs 3 mana.
I'm going to just end this here because this is rather off topic and, most importantly, completely tangential to my main point, which was that even if Urzatron does lose power, I don't see it as dropping Wurmcoil Engine's price, just keeping it stable rather than increasing as it has been.
We're nearing Modern PTQ season and post B&R announcement Modern is the epitome of an unsolved format. Things effected by the B&R announcement (all Zoo, Fae and more broadly GY based pieces) are going to rise/remain inflated until more sense is made of the format. I mean, speculators are already trying to "next level" the market by grabbing cards based on the assumption that the format goes down a specific path. If you wake up and see that "x" card has doubled overnight, you really shouldn't even remotely be surprised. Now, whether or not this kind of rampant speculation and subsequent inflation is sustainable is whole other story.
I think the cards that are most likely to drop in price in modern from that currently ridiculously high price points are Karn and Liliana, but Karn especially. While lili still sees play in legacy, Karn does not and GR Tron is going to take a hit with these unbans and bans as their best matchup was JUND. Lili definitely got weaker in modern as well, so I expect her to tick down, or at least stabilize.
I predict Lili is back down to 40 in a few months, and Karn at 20...
wishful thinking that liliana and karn will drop in price. planeswalker from a small third set. NPH is loaded with value and only increasing. Then you have the second best planeswalker printed.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I speak in sarcasm because calling people ******* ******** is not allowed.
So what is exactly the right move for Modern? Too many prices have gone haywire and it seems reprints are not coming fast enough. Inflated Modern prices just don't seem to drop, so what do we think will be done? I really want to like this format, but at the rate it's going Legacy would just be a better investment. Bitterblossom, Noble Hierarchic, and now even BoB? When is WotC going to control these spastic spikes? I know they don't care about the second format, but if they want Modern to be accessible then something has to be done to lower the barrier of entry.
Its honestly just how modern is and its unfortunate because so many people in my area just dont have the money to cash in. That being said I'd say if you dont have many any of the cards for this format in the deck you would want to play, wait. The format will settle people will figure out whats good/bad and prices may (hopefully) drop
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently Playing:
Modern: RUGScapeshift[RUG...Occasionally with goyfs RUGTarmotwinRUG(RIP)
Legacy: UWxuwr miracles and stonebladeUWx
Commander: UWRShu Yun/Ruhan SmashUWR
Its honestly just how modern is and its unfortunate because so many people in my area just dont have the money to cash in. That being said I'd say if you dont have many any of the cards for this format in the deck you would want to play, wait. The format will settle people will figure out whats good/bad and prices may (hopefully) drop
In my area many have cashed in to the format, now there are several who have put ridiculous amounts of time and effort into putting jund together who don't consider it a deck they want to play post ban. Now they're sitting on a pile of fetches that they can't use with their goyfs and a $500 dollar set of Goyfs that they need to get new fetches among other cards so they can use them. I'm not one of these people but I completely understand where they're coming from . Even a lot of the people with the money to cash in to this format are becoming very weary of doing so now. Hopefully eventually the format will settle and shifts in the meta don't have to be from bans/unbans, but it's been 2 years already, makes me wonder how long it will take.
Its honestly just how modern is and its unfortunate because so many people in my area just dont have the money to cash in. That being said I'd say if you dont have many any of the cards for this format in the deck you would want to play, wait. The format will settle people will figure out whats good/bad and prices may (hopefully) drop
In my area many have cashed in to the format, now there are several who have put ridiculous amounts of time and effort into putting jund together who don't consider it a deck they want to play post ban. Now they're sitting on a pile of fetches that they can't use with their goyfs and a $500 dollar set of Goyfs that they need to get new fetches among other cards so they can use them. I'm not one of these people but I completely understand where they're coming from . Even a lot of the people with the money to cash in to this format are becoming very weary of doing so now. Hopefully eventually the format will settle and shifts in the meta don't have to be from bans/unbans, but it's been 2 years already, makes me wonder how long it will take.
No ofense, but those people are idiots. If you have the goyfs and fetches for jund, you are literally less than $100 from a competitive version of Zoo or Junk. Trading Bobs and Lilianas for Arid Mesas, Linvala, and cheap-as-dirt kird apes, PtEs, Smiters, rampagers, and pridemages is pretty simple. Dont like that style of deck? Keep the bobs and lilianas, get some lingering souls and temple gardens, and BAM you have Junk.
Its honestly just how modern is and its unfortunate because so many people in my area just dont have the money to cash in. That being said I'd say if you dont have many any of the cards for this format in the deck you would want to play, wait. The format will settle people will figure out whats good/bad and prices may (hopefully) drop
In my area many have cashed in to the format, now there are several who have put ridiculous amounts of time and effort into putting jund together who don't consider it a deck they want to play post ban. Now they're sitting on a pile of fetches that they can't use with their goyfs and a $500 dollar set of Goyfs that they need to get new fetches among other cards so they can use them. I'm not one of these people but I completely understand where they're coming from . Even a lot of the people with the money to cash in to this format are becoming very weary of doing so now. Hopefully eventually the format will settle and shifts in the meta don't have to be from bans/unbans, but it's been 2 years already, makes me wonder how long it will take.
No ofense, but those people are idiots. If you have the goyfs and fetches for jund, you are literally less than $100 from a competitive version of Zoo or Junk. Trading Bobs and Lilianas for Arid Mesas, Linvala, and cheap-as-dirt kird apes, PtEs, Smiters, rampagers, and pridemages is pretty simple. Dont like that style of deck? Keep the bobs and lilianas, get some lingering souls and temple gardens, and BAM you have Junk.
Yea, if you have Goyf and fetches you will always have a good deck to play in modern no matter what is banned or unbanned. I have fetches but no goyf, and that makes for a slightly bigger challenge to build a competitive deck, but I still have a lot of options.
Yeah I know Goyf will always be a key piece to a competitive deck but just imagine going through the amount of trading to put Jund together then having a key card banned and your only options are to go through more trading to play a deck that you don't really like that much, or completely trade into something else. Personally I'd just stick with Jund and go a faster route if I were in their shoes. I think I saw a few decks like that before Deathrite was printed, but most people who played jund don't seem to be interested, the biggest appeal for many of the players was DRS and BBE initially.
It's not really that they can't play, it's the fact that they put that much effort into getting all those cards, now they probably have to either trade for 4 Arid Mesa to play them in zoo or 4 Noble Hierarch to play them in junk which also ran DRS. That's not only a lot of money worth of staples after buying/trading into what was the most expensive deck in the format, but also very hard to find staples in some places, especially with so many more people looking for them. I mean personally I wouldn't really care that much because I change decks a lot anyway, but I understand where people are coming from especially when some pretty much traded their whole collection away to play that one deck.
As someone still struggling to buy into the format fully, with fetches being the biggest issue, I find this attitude a little hard to stomach. Its very hard to be involved in the format and have fetches that can't be used as said above.
Fetches will always have a use in Modern, but if you are a one-deck person (which I have a hard time understanding) then it may be possible that the fetches you bought or traded for are no longer of use in the next deck you want to play after one deck's effectiveness is diminished a bit by a ban. Though, with only the 5 enemy fetches available (and thus having imperfect fetch bases common) there will many times be some kind of overlap.
The GBx shell still has Goyf, Decay, Confidant, Pulse, Inquisition, Thoughtseize, Village. If that's not a shell for a viable deck, I don't know what is.
You're right, of course, but there are a lot of people that equate the deck becoming less effective with it becoming unplayable, which is probably nonsense- though we won't know for sure until the meta stabilizes and has some time after the ban goes into effect (not yet in effect on MTGO).
Apologies if I'm coming across as an ass, the idea of people with Goyfs and Fetches giving out they can't play them was a little hard to read, when there's many people out there struggling to get to such a stage.
It's not really that they can't play, it's the fact that they put that much effort into getting all those cards, now they probably have to either trade for 4 Arid Mesa to play them in zoo or 4 Noble Hierarch to play them in junk which also ran DRS. That's not only a lot of money worth of staples after buying/trading into what was the most expensive deck in the format, but also very hard to find staples in some places, especially with so many more people looking for them. I mean personally I wouldn't really care that much because I change decks a lot anyway, but I understand where people are coming from especially when some pretty much traded their whole collection away to play that one deck.
Hierarch seems bad in Junk, as it doesn't really enable t2 lil that well. Hell it doesn't even enable t2 seize into bob that well either
Is Liliana going to see play in faeries? Got them for complex dredge but decided against picking up black fetches, was waiting for the season high to trade them but I'm impatient and want to finish pod and some legacy decks. Wondering if it will go up any more?
Is Liliana going to see play in faeries? Got them for complex dredge but decided against picking up black fetches, was waiting for the season high to trade them but I'm impatient and want to finish pod and some legacy decks. Wondering if it will go up any more?
I don't think anyone knows what will be seen in faeries right now...
I think Liliana could fit quite well into the right faeries shell. For example, I play UWR midrange and have been testing against faeries. In games where I am on the play and faeries plays a turn 2 bitterblossom (in the rare chance I don't have mana leak or remand), but I play a turn three Geist, faeries loses around 80% of the time. I get to swing on turn 4, and the only way they can try to prevent the 6 damage profitably is by flashing in a spellstutter and double blocking, but at that point I can let it resolve then remove the token or spellstutter.
Lets say they played around removal and perhaps played a scion and didn't block. I still remove the scion on my turn 4 with counter mana or removal mana up. The next turn I'm looking at 2 tokens as I most likely countered whatever else they attempted to play. If I have one more removal spell and they double block here, their board is wiped at they have, at most, 8 life remaining and the game is over right there...
Now, if instead of scion or spellstutter or even V-Clique they had played Liliana on turn 3 and minus 2'd her, I'm essentially down for the count with no way out of it...
Liliana is a 3 mana walker that can lock down a game...something that is right in faeries wheelhouse. I think it is very possible they could play her, but we'll have to see how the deck unfolds. I know I gave a very specific situation, but since UWR won the last grand prix and only got stronger with the DRS ban, I think this is something to consider...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Its just nutzo. I think people should figure out what their playstyle is and stick with it. In the long run it makes the market more stable.
False. RG Tron can use Pyroclasm. True, some creatures are immune, such as Wild Nacatl (though if on the play, Tron can kill a Wild Nacatl on turn 2 with Pyroclasm), but not all are. For example, Goblin Guide, mana dorks, Burning-Tree Emissary, and Steppe Lynx are cards Zoo is likely to play some copies of, and Pyroclasm kills them all. And of course Oblivion Stone nicely sweeps the entire board regardless of toughness. It's true that Pyroclasm is not a kill-all spell against Zoo, but to say it can't use Pyroclasm is false.
And if it really does become an issue, Firespout does exist last time I checked.
Anyone know what is going on?
Modern: RGB Dredge // RBG Goblins // B The Gate // UBR Tezz AoB Control // RBG Prison Pox
EDH: RBU Thraximundar // R Norin the Wary // RWB Kaalia of the Vast // BUR Grixis Combos // BU Gisa and Geralf Tribal
Tiny Leaders: BUW Sydri, Galvanic Genius // R Feldon of the Third Path
Projects:
Gisa and Geralf Extreme-Tribal EDH
Esper Eldrazi Processor Control
Brewing with Kuldotha Forgemaster
Primer: "The Gate" - Mono Black in Modern
Modern Prison Pox - building a better plague
Look at the Zoo threads. They are cutting Goblin Guide and Burning-Tree Emissary and aren't running Steppe Lynx. And the problem with Firespout is that it costs 3 mana.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
but yeah, i don't even know how much mistbind foils are. i'm relatively upset i traded my mistbinds for like 4 bucks a year ago..
I'm going to just end this here because this is rather off topic and, most importantly, completely tangential to my main point, which was that even if Urzatron does lose power, I don't see it as dropping Wurmcoil Engine's price, just keeping it stable rather than increasing as it has been.
I predict Lili is back down to 40 in a few months, and Karn at 20...
Sig by SGT_Chubbz. Thanks for the signature.
GYisan Toolbox Combo/ControlG
Modern:
RUGScapeshift[RUG...Occasionally with goyfs
RUGTarmotwinRUG(RIP)
Legacy:
UWxuwr miracles and stonebladeUWx
Commander:
UWRShu Yun/Ruhan SmashUWR
In my area many have cashed in to the format, now there are several who have put ridiculous amounts of time and effort into putting jund together who don't consider it a deck they want to play post ban. Now they're sitting on a pile of fetches that they can't use with their goyfs and a $500 dollar set of Goyfs that they need to get new fetches among other cards so they can use them. I'm not one of these people but I completely understand where they're coming from . Even a lot of the people with the money to cash in to this format are becoming very weary of doing so now. Hopefully eventually the format will settle and shifts in the meta don't have to be from bans/unbans, but it's been 2 years already, makes me wonder how long it will take.
No ofense, but those people are idiots. If you have the goyfs and fetches for jund, you are literally less than $100 from a competitive version of Zoo or Junk. Trading Bobs and Lilianas for Arid Mesas, Linvala, and cheap-as-dirt kird apes, PtEs, Smiters, rampagers, and pridemages is pretty simple. Dont like that style of deck? Keep the bobs and lilianas, get some lingering souls and temple gardens, and BAM you have Junk.
Yea, if you have Goyf and fetches you will always have a good deck to play in modern no matter what is banned or unbanned. I have fetches but no goyf, and that makes for a slightly bigger challenge to build a competitive deck, but I still have a lot of options.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
An uncomfortable $30-ish per, but if you don't mind parting with some black staples...
You're right, of course, but there are a lot of people that equate the deck becoming less effective with it becoming unplayable, which is probably nonsense- though we won't know for sure until the meta stabilizes and has some time after the ban goes into effect (not yet in effect on MTGO).
Apologies if I'm coming across as an ass, the idea of people with Goyfs and Fetches giving out they can't play them was a little hard to read, when there's many people out there struggling to get to such a stage.
[/quote]
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Hierarch seems bad in Junk, as it doesn't really enable t2 lil that well. Hell it doesn't even enable t2 seize into bob that well either
Liliana won't see play in Faeries.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
I think Liliana could fit quite well into the right faeries shell. For example, I play UWR midrange and have been testing against faeries. In games where I am on the play and faeries plays a turn 2 bitterblossom (in the rare chance I don't have mana leak or remand), but I play a turn three Geist, faeries loses around 80% of the time. I get to swing on turn 4, and the only way they can try to prevent the 6 damage profitably is by flashing in a spellstutter and double blocking, but at that point I can let it resolve then remove the token or spellstutter.
Lets say they played around removal and perhaps played a scion and didn't block. I still remove the scion on my turn 4 with counter mana or removal mana up. The next turn I'm looking at 2 tokens as I most likely countered whatever else they attempted to play. If I have one more removal spell and they double block here, their board is wiped at they have, at most, 8 life remaining and the game is over right there...
Now, if instead of scion or spellstutter or even V-Clique they had played Liliana on turn 3 and minus 2'd her, I'm essentially down for the count with no way out of it...
Liliana is a 3 mana walker that can lock down a game...something that is right in faeries wheelhouse. I think it is very possible they could play her, but we'll have to see how the deck unfolds. I know I gave a very specific situation, but since UWR won the last grand prix and only got stronger with the DRS ban, I think this is something to consider...