My first thought is that there are 17 2 drops in your deck. I know that they do much different things and the Dark Rituals can help a bit with it, but that is still a lot.
Instead of Icequake in the SB, I would suggest Choking Sands same casting cost, works in the same matchups but the extra damage is more likely to be relevant.
Of these options, I like Carrion Beetles for its repeated effect and large swath to hit but I am worried that it might be too costly (mana-wise). The Bonegnawer is free to activate and a repeated effect but more limited in its hits. We don't have a ton of 1 drops in this deck so either of these could be a reasonable SB cards. However, they are only 1/1s so they are extrmely vulnerable to stuff like Firebolt, Perilious Myr etc. Bog is more of a mid-to-late game play and almost impossible to stop but it is a one time effect so it can be more overcome by card advantage over time.
On the fast effects side, Ebony Charm is the most flexible of the 3, Shred Memory can go fetch any of your 2 drops in the late game and removes the most cards of the group. Crypt Incursion gains you some life in the process but I worry it might be too expensive.
Another approach to really hurt Tron and to a lesser extent, Affinity would be Disciple of the Vault. They are always sacrificing artifacts to filter their mana, search cards etc. It was good enough to get banned in some formats, so it might make sense. It also makes Atog a VERY painful creature.
I think you hit it with Disciple of the Vault in the SB, maybe a 2/2 split MB/SB. Gonna test that for sure. I also like the idea of a pair of Bogs in the SB. Thanks for chiming in! Appreciate the insight!
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Okay so this UW control deck with life gaining got me good. I'm not fast enough to beat it down aggressively and when the game gets too long endsup running me over. I'm thinking of getting some land control in and see what happens, because I don't really know what else to do.
Also, I'm thinking Crypt Incursion instead of Nihil Spellbomb vs Tortured Existence decks. Some people run them vs Burn too. What do you do against Tortured Existence?
The U/W lifegain deck is tough, I think I have seen it once in my playtesting. I ended up splitting 1-1 before timing out. IIRC, the first game, I just ended up having too many threats for him to handle. The second game, he gained a ton of life and finally beat me down with some flyers. If I were going to see more of them, I would think about another way to beat the player: poison. Something like Plague Stinger or Toxic Nim don't care if the opponent gains 1 million life. As I said before, I don't see this as a huge part of the meta, so I wouldn't devote SB slots to it.
I run sideboard bogs against tortured existence and try to duress them. It is a tough matchup because they don't really care about your creature kill. In my testing, Oubliette seems to mess with them the most because it puts their creatures beyond reach. I haven't really found a good way to beat Existence with any regularity though. They can recover from your discard, and your kill clock is very slow. Nonbasic hate doesn't do a ton against them either. Maybe just a lot of graveyard hate? I would be interested in other opinions on this.
I'd like to tune my list for the new meta we seem to be faced with. There's either too many threats too fast, or powerful threats with some sort of evasion or counterspell protection. This is the list I've been using for almost a year if not longer, from the days of izzet post and its ilk.
Often times I'm in top deck mode hoping for a kill spell but knowing in my mind I somehow need to turn that kill spell into two. I'm spending the rest of the night brainstorming ideas and if anyone has any please post her and/or send me a message.
Seems like an interesting addition to this deck. The singleton island doesn't hurt Tendrils or Corrupt that much, IMO, and the taplands aren't as bad as they sound.
Sign in Blood is WAY better than Treasure Cruise. Even if I were playing UB Control, I'd rather play Mulldrifter and Sign in Blood before Treasure Cruise. That card fits better Delver variants and some sort of combo.
Hey everyone super excited to see this thread still relatively active! I've just recently gotten into MTGO after not having played MTG for about 10 years, back when I was a kid. Anyway after messing around a bit, as well as wasting some money I stumbled onto the pauper format. I ended up deciding to play Mono Black and lo and behold here I am. I've already read through most of this primer, as well as a few other articles and have set myself up a fairly decent deck that has been working out thus far. A few matchups have been difficult, most notably a UB Mill deck that I really just couldn't interact with. Figured I would post my list here before I enter my first daily this weekend and look for any advice/suggestions.
Update: I've removed the 2x Evincar's Justice and the 2x Consume Spirit and replaced them with 4x Choking Sands at least for the time being. I didn't find myself ever siding in either of the initial 2 and have seen a few matchups where they LD may be useful. Time will tell!
The thing is, I don't know if I want to spend 10 tickets on Cuombajj Witches right now. I just want to get started for like 10 total tickets, so I was thinking of replacing the BB slot with one of the following:
I was leaning towards Dauthi Slayer, but was curious for some suggestions. If I enjoy the deck and want to upgrade it, I'll get the Witches in the future, but just for starting out, I probably don't want to spend those extra 10 tix until I know I'm happy with the basics of the deck and the format.
Don't waste slots on evasive threats. With Gray Merchant of Asphodel now in the meta, MBC has zero interest in playing dudes that do nothing but bypass blockers.
Instead, take advantage of the cards that Cuombajj Witches pushed out of the deck: either Relentless Rats for the same spot in your curve, or Liliana's Specter for the much stronger card with a slightly worse cost. (Both of these are 2-for-1 discard spells, but they also both die to the Witches, meaning you couldn't keep them active if you needed your Witches to kill something.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
You mean Ravenous Rats, right? Most decks seem to go in the Specter direction.
Ha! That's what I get for not proofreading my card links for once. Yes, I mean Ravenous Rats.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
Yeah, it's totally feasible without the Witches. If you start running in to Delver a lot you may wish you had them, but the game plan remains the same regardless.
Hi, all! I have a question about non-competitive MBC decks. What can I use to substitute the following cards?
1. Chittering Rats
2. Cuombajj Witches
3. Unearth (I know it won't be the same, but Grim Harvest maybe?)
With Regard toParalyze it is less than ideal for this deck for the following reasons:
1. That the paralyzed creature remains in play effectively turns off our various edict effects Cruel Edict and Geth's Verdict as our opponent can now just sacrifice the paralyzed creature when we cast them.
2. Games against Mono Black can go long, making the work around of paying 4 mana to untap the creature and use it for either attacks or blocking, for a turn or every turn a very real possibility.
3. Many other decks run cards that would otherwise allow our opponents to make use of the paralyzed creature and gain value in some fashion. Such as Kor Skyfisher or Perilous Research
At the end of the day, mono black probably has access to the best removal suite of any color. However leaving the creature in any condition other than exiled or in the graveyard is not good value.
Regarding Card Substitutions: I'm guessing your considerations here are cost. Without knowing what other cards you are running I would suggest some number of:
In addition, there are a lot of potential synergies, up to and including sweep effects, repeatable damage and graveyard recursion available if you go a more Zombie Tribal route. A gatherer search for "Zombie" at common will give you plenty of options to chose from, and most of the cards are inexpensive. Good Luck.
Unearth has Exhume to keep it company at common, but I wouldn't play this card in MBC. Some decks play Death Denied, which I think is a great card to use as a 1 or 2-of. The instant speed makes it very appealing.
I have a question that has been perplexing me. I notice that nearly every MBC list runs Oubliette. Why not Murder? What am I missing?
With decks running Oubliette, that opens up opposing decks to destroy the enchantment with removal. Murder is instant speed, costs the same, and the creature can't be brought back with enchantment removal. I have to be missing something obvious here.
Cloud of Faeries being banned probably improves the Delver matchup a bit, but that's true of most decks. Anything more detailed than that, we'll have to wait and see.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
I am assuming that Delver was one of MBC's less positive matchups. The only problem with them replacing Cloud is that they might put in Faerie Miscreant, which draws a card with multiples. It does seem that though this deck has lots of card advantage, it does struggle when other decks can out value it since it is somewhat slow.
Would anyone please help me to figure out whether the devotion is the only reason to play Oubliette over other removal and which number of Oubliette cards is optimal? I'm starting pauper and buying into all cards from scratch. Oubliette is rather expensive and hard to find
MBC runs Oubliette because it gives you BB devotion.
Agreed. @Olga, Oubliette is not necessary for the deck, but its more of a "why not" card. It gets rid of a creature by exiling so undying or persist dont trigger, and gaining 2 more life and dealing 2 more damage off of gray merchant seems good
Agreed. @Olga, Oubliette is not necessary for the deck, but its more of a "why not" card. It gets rid of a creature by exiling so undying or persist dont trigger, and gaining 2 more life and dealing 2 more damage off of gray merchant seems good
Yeah, you can run any other kind of removal. The thing about it is that things like Murder (same cmc) go to the graveyard which helps to feed Delve for Angler. Also, the cycle lands are AWESOME for Delve too because you can basically spend the mana to cycle the card but it still counts as a mana to cast a Delve creature because you can Delve the cycle land away. Such a cool interaction.
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I think you hit it with Disciple of the Vault in the SB, maybe a 2/2 split MB/SB. Gonna test that for sure. I also like the idea of a pair of Bogs in the SB. Thanks for chiming in! Appreciate the insight!
The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realize it doesn't say anything it's too late to stop reading it....
The U/W lifegain deck is tough, I think I have seen it once in my playtesting. I ended up splitting 1-1 before timing out. IIRC, the first game, I just ended up having too many threats for him to handle. The second game, he gained a ton of life and finally beat me down with some flyers. If I were going to see more of them, I would think about another way to beat the player: poison. Something like Plague Stinger or Toxic Nim don't care if the opponent gains 1 million life. As I said before, I don't see this as a huge part of the meta, so I wouldn't devote SB slots to it.
I run sideboard bogs against tortured existence and try to duress them. It is a tough matchup because they don't really care about your creature kill. In my testing, Oubliette seems to mess with them the most because it puts their creatures beyond reach. I haven't really found a good way to beat Existence with any regularity though. They can recover from your discard, and your kill clock is very slow. Nonbasic hate doesn't do a ton against them either. Maybe just a lot of graveyard hate? I would be interested in other opinions on this.
4 Cuombajj Witches
4 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
4 Phyrexian Rager
4 Unearth
3 Geth's Verdict
3 Sign in Blood
2 Oubliette
2 Victim of Night
3 Liliana's Specter
2 Okiba-Gang Shinobi
1 Corrupt
1 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Barren Moor
1 Bojuka Bog
3 Shrivel
3 Duress
2 Wrench Mind
2 Victim of Night
1 Geth's Verdict
2 Disfigure
1 Corrupt
1 Tendrils of Corruption
Often times I'm in top deck mode hoping for a kill spell but knowing in my mind I somehow need to turn that kill spell into two. I'm spending the rest of the night brainstorming ideas and if anyone has any please post her and/or send me a message.
This one went 3-1 on a private event (Pauper Classic Tuesdays) with 3 copies of TC instead of Sign In Blood:
4 Chittering Rats
4 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
3 Cuombajj Witches
3 Phyrexian Rager
1 Crypt Rats
1 Liliana's Specter
21 Spells
4 Chainer's Edict
3 Disfigure
3 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Treasure Cruise
2 Corrupt
2 Oubliette
2 Wrench Mind
1 Ghastly Demise
1 Pestilence
14 Swamp
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Island
2 Geth's Verdict
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Font of Return
2 Duress
2 Choking Sands
1 Shrivel
1 Stinkweed Imp
1 Cuombajj Witches
1 Disfigure
1 Child of Night
Seems like an interesting addition to this deck. The singleton island doesn't hurt Tendrils or Corrupt that much, IMO, and the taplands aren't as bad as they sound.
20x Swamp
2x Barren Moor
Creatures
4x Chittering Rats
4x Liliana's Specter
4x Gray Merchant of Asphodel
2x Phyrexian Rager
Enchantments
4x Oubliette
2x Dead Weight
4x Distress
4x Sign in Blood
2x Chainer's Edict
2x Corrupt
Instans
4x Echoing Decay
2x Death Denied
4x Duress
3x Shrivel
2x Wrench Mind
2x Evincar's Justice
2x Consume Spirit
2x Bojuka Bog
Thanks for your time, and good luck out there!
I like this list and was thinking of pulling the trigger:
4 Chittering Rats
4 Cuombajj Witches
4 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
4 Phyrexian Rager
1 Crypt Rats
1 Gurmag Angler
1 Okiba-Gang Shinobi
Spells (22)
4 Chainer's Edict
4 Duress
4 Sign in Blood
3 Disfigure
2 Unearth
2 Dead Weight
2 Oubliette
1 Tendrils of Corruption
19 Swamp
4 Choking Sands
3 Okiba-Gang Shinobi
2 Tendrils of Corruption
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Shrivel
1 Crypt Rats
1 Doom Blade
The thing is, I don't know if I want to spend 10 tickets on Cuombajj Witches right now. I just want to get started for like 10 total tickets, so I was thinking of replacing the BB slot with one of the following:
I was leaning towards Dauthi Slayer, but was curious for some suggestions. If I enjoy the deck and want to upgrade it, I'll get the Witches in the future, but just for starting out, I probably don't want to spend those extra 10 tix until I know I'm happy with the basics of the deck and the format.
Thanks!
Instead, take advantage of the cards that Cuombajj Witches pushed out of the deck: either Relentless Rats for the same spot in your curve, or Liliana's Specter for the much stronger card with a slightly worse cost. (Both of these are 2-for-1 discard spells, but they also both die to the Witches, meaning you couldn't keep them active if you needed your Witches to kill something.
Ha! That's what I get for not proofreading my card links for once. Yes, I mean Ravenous Rats.
sorry if the question seems a bit noob..
—Seal inscription
—Seal inscription
With Regard toParalyze it is less than ideal for this deck for the following reasons:
1. That the paralyzed creature remains in play effectively turns off our various edict effects Cruel Edict and Geth's Verdict as our opponent can now just sacrifice the paralyzed creature when we cast them.
2. Games against Mono Black can go long, making the work around of paying 4 mana to untap the creature and use it for either attacks or blocking, for a turn or every turn a very real possibility.
3. Many other decks run cards that would otherwise allow our opponents to make use of the paralyzed creature and gain value in some fashion. Such as Kor Skyfisher or Perilous Research
At the end of the day, mono black probably has access to the best removal suite of any color. However leaving the creature in any condition other than exiled or in the graveyard is not good value.
Regarding Card Substitutions: I'm guessing your considerations here are cost. Without knowing what other cards you are running I would suggest some number of:
1.Liliana's Specter or Ravenous Rats
2.Fume Spitter or Festering Goblin
3.Undying Evil To allow you to recur the threats for cheap, and abuse ETB effects. Grim Harvest or perhaps Font of Return would also work alongside them.
In addition, there are a lot of potential synergies, up to and including sweep effects, repeatable damage and graveyard recursion available if you go a more Zombie Tribal route. A gatherer search for "Zombie" at common will give you plenty of options to chose from, and most of the cards are inexpensive. Good Luck.
Chittering Rats can be replaced with ravenous Rats or Liliana's Specter, though the chittering rats are generally much better.
There is no substitute for Cuombajj Witches. Find another two drop, or maybe play maindeck Crypt Rats.
Unearth has Exhume to keep it company at common, but I wouldn't play this card in MBC. Some decks play Death Denied, which I think is a great card to use as a 1 or 2-of. The instant speed makes it very appealing.
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GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
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With decks running Oubliette, that opens up opposing decks to destroy the enchantment with removal. Murder is instant speed, costs the same, and the creature can't be brought back with enchantment removal. I have to be missing something obvious here.
Agreed. @Olga, Oubliette is not necessary for the deck, but its more of a "why not" card. It gets rid of a creature by exiling so undying or persist dont trigger, and gaining 2 more life and dealing 2 more damage off of gray merchant seems good
Got it, thanks!
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