Hi everyone, wishing everyone a very nice day ahead. Thank you for reading this post.
I recently opened a sealed deck pool (5 Dragons of Tarkir and 1 Fate Reforged boosters). Was playing at the prerelease of Dragons of Tarkir but my local game store ran out of prerelease packs and instead offered me those boosters to build my sealed pool. Anyway these are the cards I opened and would love to hear from you guys on what is the optimum build.
The black in this pool looks strong but I have questions on the following:
1. How would you build differently (if any) based on the pool above?
2. What other color should I pair black with? I chose white because it has lots of strong removal (although Pacifism is a bit weak in this set, it is still decent removal) but the white creatures are quite subpar other than the fliers. Green looks okay but not enough playables, Blue seems decent as well and has more synergy with the exploit theme in the Palace Familiar and Jeskai Sage.
3. Is Echoes of the Kin Tree worth maindecking? It performed well in one of my matches where it went to lategame but other than that I feel I could have substituted it with other cards. I brought in Mind Rot and Shambling Goblin from the sideboard as well in some of my matches replacing it. I have included Echoes because I thought my deck would be slow and controlling, needed some late game reach.
4. Is Butcher's Glee or Coat with Venom good in this deck? Since it often gets a slow start I feel that either one of these should replace the Echoes? I think I overlooked the Glee here, it seems good but maybe a bit slow. Venom might be better due to my high toughness creatures.
5. Hewed Stone Retainers looks strong as well, is it playable in maindeck?
Thank you for your opinions guys. Really appreciate your time to read and help me out. Thanks again!
Hi everyone, wishing everyone a very nice day ahead. Thank you for reading this post.
The black in this pool looks strong but I have questions on the following:
1. How would you build differently (if any) based on the pool above? I'll address this below
2. What other color should I pair black with? I chose white because it has lots of strong removal (although Pacifism is a bit weak in this set, it is still decent removal) but the white creatures are quite subpar other than the fliers. Green looks okay but not enough playables, Blue seems decent as well and has more synergy with the exploit theme in the Palace Familiar and Jeskai Sage. Yeah, your black is a slam dunk, and merely needs some removal and early creatures. White is the perfect complement.
3. Is Echoes of the Kin Tree worth maindecking? It performed well in one of my matches where it went to lategame but other than that I feel I could have substituted it with other cards. I brought in Mind Rot and Shambling Goblin from the sideboard as well in some of my matches replacing it. I have included Echoes because I thought my deck would be slow and controlling, needed some late game reach. I think you had amazing late game already that you will be better off with another creature instead
4. Is Butcher's Glee or Coat with Venom good in this deck? Since it often gets a slow start I feel that either one of these should replace the Echoes? I think I overlooked the Glee here, it seems good but maybe a bit slow. Venom might be better due to my high toughness creatures. I like them both
5. Hewed Stone Retainers looks strong as well, is it playable in maindeck? no. you have a powerful deck so you want cards that will increase your consistency
Thank you for your opinions guys. Really appreciate your time to read and help me out. Thanks again!
All in all, pretty minor. The only thing is I would really want the 18th land over the scion to better facilitate megamorph, but Enduring Victory is quite arguable over coat with venom.
Thanks a lot magicmerl for the feedback. I see your point in adding the additional land for megamorph. The deck needs to hit seven mana on time and the extra land helps.
If I were to build again I would try to find room for the extra land. Just I am not sure if removing the Scion of Ugin actually helps. Since the evasion is useful and his 6 cmc does not interfere with the 7 mana cost of Marsh Hulk and Deathbringer Regent.
Seems like the deck you built is actually 41 cards instead of 40. There was also Shambling Goblin in the additional card list.
Having said that I would probably cut a Butcher's Glee from the 41 card list. Don't get me wrong, the card is powerful, but leaving 3 mana up and having to play during the opponent's combat phase (most of the time) increases the risk of 2-for-1 as the opponent also has open mana for tricks of their own. The same could be said for Coat with Venom but at least it is cheaper. Which card would you rather take out?
Any additional comments are most welcome.
Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong or if you have a different opinion.
Thanks again.
Thanks a lot magicmerl for the feedback. I see your point in adding the additional land for megamorph. The deck needs to hit seven mana on time and the extra land helps.
If I were to build again I would try to find room for the extra land. Just I am not sure if removing the Scion of Ugin actually helps. Since the evasion is useful and his 6 cmc does not interfere with the 7 mana cost of Marsh Hulk and Deathbringer Regent.
Well, if you stall on mana you're unlikely to hit 6 mana as well. You're still not likely to hit that before turn 7-8. (And 7 mana on turns 8-10).
Seems like the deck you built is actually 41 cards instead of 40. There was also Shambling Goblin in the additional card list.
Having said that I would probably cut a Butcher's Glee from the 41 card list. Don't get me wrong, the card is powerful, but leaving 3 mana up and having to play during the opponent's combat phase (most of the time) increases the risk of 2-for-1 as the opponent also has open mana for tricks of their own. The same could be said for Coat with Venom but at least it is cheaper. Which card would you rather take out?
Whoops. I would take out Coat of Venom from my decklist above.
Butcher's Glee is pretty solid, but you're right that it is a poor defensive trick. That's not it's purpose. It's designed to kill their blocker and leave your attacker still in play. You want defensive tricks to either be cheaper or hard removal for their creatures, not pump spells for your own (where you are extremely vulnerable to being block out by THEIR combat trick/removal spell on their own turn).
What was the fixing land from the Fate booster? Although you probably aren't splashing, in a normal DDDDFF sealed pool, you will want to keep track of the mana fixing at your disposal. But even here, something like a Tranquil Cove or Dismal Backwater might cause me to consider splashing for the Pristine Skywise, particularly since this deck is looking defensive. Something like a Thornwood Falls on the other hand would lead me to consider a much spicier brew, particularly since this is supposed to be akin to a prerelease. Any gainland that provides black mana would have me considering a splash of Flatten + Death Wind into a different deck entirely.
As for the list, I would not be happy playing several of these creatures and, as a result, I'd be looking to play Enduring Victory in the main deck. While it requires the target to attack or block, it kills it regardless of how big it is and gets you a bonus to another creature, which may let you win in combat as well. It's too powerful in sealed not to play here.
Seems like the deck you built is actually 41 cards instead of 40. There was also Shambling Goblin in the additional card list.
Having said that I would probably cut a Butcher's Glee from the 41 card list. Don't get me wrong, the card is powerful, but leaving 3 mana up and having to play during the opponent's combat phase (most of the time) increases the risk of 2-for-1 as the opponent also has open mana for tricks of their own. The same could be said for Coat with Venom but at least it is cheaper. Which card would you rather take out?
Whoops. I would take out Coat of Venom from my decklist above.
Butcher's Glee is pretty solid, but you're right that it is a poor defensive trick. That's not it's purpose. It's designed to kill their blocker and leave your attacker still in play. You want defensive tricks to either be cheaper or hard removal for their creatures, not pump spells for your own (where you are extremely vulnerable to being block out by THEIR combat trick/removal spell on their own turn).
So to interject here, the issue I see is that the list is already trending towards defensive. If the goal is to survive until the late game, then (barring playing both) Coat of Venom should be the choice over Butcher's Glee. The two tricks do mostly the same thing in this deck, but the lower cost on the Coat means you can play a two-drop and hold this up on turn 3 to stymie a trick-supported attack. Barring first-strike or similar shenanigans, Coat will always allow you to trade, at a minimum. You really aren't beating down with 2x Territorial Roc and 1x Arashin Cleric, and should not be concerned about the extra 3 damage on an attack if the plan is to keep the shields up.
I also noticed a lack of consideration for Center Soul. It may not seem like much, but against those removal-heavy decks, this card does a lot of work by preventing the removal and then facilitating an attack/removing a Pacifism on your next turn. Maybe not the right fit for this particular deck in the main, but still worth considering in certain builds or vs. certain opponents out of the sideboard.
Overall, I'd probably be looking at a 14-8 split between creatures and spells. 18 lands is a must if your plan revolves around high-cost cards. And at that point, you really should be running Echoes of the Kin Tree. If you successfully get the board stalemated, this card lets you break it wide open. It looks slow and clunky, but it definitely does a good amount of work in sealed, as well as the occasional draft deck.
Thanks for pointing it out warplord. Sorry I forgot to include the fixing land. It was actually a Swiftwater Cliffs. (already edited my initial list to include it) Since the packs were 5DTK and 1FRF I only got one fixing land.
If I were to consider playing Pristine Skywise, could I have splashed for other cards like Silumgar Spell-Eater and Reduce in Stature as well? But I would rather play Scion of Ugin in a more consistent 2-color deck if I need a 6-drop. And as magicmerl pointed out, the high casting cost can be an issue if I am not careful.
I see your point on Arashin Cleric and Territorial Roc being poor attackers and such Coat is preferred over Glee due to its casting cost. Center Soul is a great card as well, it can be played maindeck or sideboard but I would prefer to start it in the sideboard and board it in accordingly since I have other good cards to fill up the spell slots. And Enduring Victory is indeed powerful, I would love to find a slot for it if at all possible.
Speaking of spicier brews, for a moment I did consider playing GU splashing R for Sarkhan Unbroken but decided against it as the green and blue commons were not very powerful on their own.
How would you build the deck then or what changes would you have made in regard to either my or magicmerl's build?
If I were to consider playing Pristine Skywise, could I have splashed for other cards like Silumgar Spell-Eater and Reduce in Stature as well? But I would rather play Scion of Ugin in a more consistent 2-color deck if I need a 6-drop. And as magicmerl pointed out, the high casting cost can be an issue if I am not careful.
Well the Skywise is rather nice if you have anything to back it up. But without decent fixing, I would probably take my chances on a 2-color build since the power level with and without it in this instance doesn't seem like enough to warrant the inconsistency. But if you could splash blue here, the other main card I'd consider is Mistfire Adept. Reduce in Stature is not a card that I'm ever happy to play, and I'm happy that I've not had to put it in a deck yet. At one of the prerelease events that I attended, I had an opponent cast Reduce in Stature on each of my first three creatures. Unfortunately for my opponent, they were all megamorphs, so I could still flip them up and have them be 1/3 (0/2 with a +1/+1 counter). So when he dropped Sarkhan, I was able to remove his dragon and attack Sarkhan down to nothing.
How would you build the deck then or what changes would you have made in regard to either my or magicmerl's build?
This is certainly an easier exercise when the cards are there in front of you. When I made my initial reply, I didn't even notice you had more than one Coat with Venom. I'd probably shave off one of the 1/3's or possibly the Shambling Goblin and get down to 14 creatures. If I'm ideally going T1 Plains, T2 Plains for Anafenza, then that reduces the number of times where I want to go T1 Swamp. Sure, the goblin makes great fodder for your Gravecallers, but so would an Arashin Cleric.
For your spells, I would prioritize removal like Flatten, Death Wind, Sandblast, Enduring Victory, and Pacifism, and round it out with some number of Coat with Venom. I would be trying to fit Echoes of the Kin Tree in as a powerful hedge against mana flood. With Echoes, when you've manipulated your board in a way where you have multiple possible destinations for a single Bolster activation, your opponent will find combat difficult.
If you wanted to try a Temur build, you have Shaman of Forgotten Ways to help power out your creatures, and your green fight cards serve as decent removal options. However, beyond Atarka Efreet, Sprinting Warbrute, there's not much in red that seems worthwhile as just a splash. You could probably go UGr, though, if your goal is just to have fun, durdle around, and get Sarkhan into play. If the players at your store are super competitive, though, I'd probably just stick with W/B. Without a seeded prerelease booster, it seems fortunate even to have a decent 2-color deck available.
Seems like my original build except maybe -1 Territorial Roc for +1 Swamp. While opinions may differ, I think the consensus is that 18 lands is a must for this deck. I guess there is a lot to consider during sideboarding as well, fortunately this pool has a flexible sideboard. Thanks a lot warplord and magicmerl for your input
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I recently opened a sealed deck pool (5 Dragons of Tarkir and 1 Fate Reforged boosters). Was playing at the prerelease of Dragons of Tarkir but my local game store ran out of prerelease packs and instead offered me those boosters to build my sealed pool. Anyway these are the cards I opened and would love to hear from you guys on what is the optimum build.
White
Blue
Black
Red
Green
Gold and Multicolor and Colorless
Artifacts
This is the deck I built:
2 Territorial Roc
1 Arashin Cleric
1 Lightwalker
2 Marang River Skeleton
1 Misthoof Kirin
1 Student of Ojutai
1 Sandstorm Charger
1 Marsh Hulk
2 Rakshasha Gravecaller
1 Acid-Spewer Dragon
1 Scion of Ugin
1 Deathbringer Regent
1 Echoes of the Kin Tree
2 Pacifism
1 Sandblast
1 Flatten
1 Death Wind
1 Enduring Victory
8 Swamp
9 Plains
The black in this pool looks strong but I have questions on the following:
1. How would you build differently (if any) based on the pool above?
2. What other color should I pair black with? I chose white because it has lots of strong removal (although Pacifism is a bit weak in this set, it is still decent removal) but the white creatures are quite subpar other than the fliers. Green looks okay but not enough playables, Blue seems decent as well and has more synergy with the exploit theme in the Palace Familiar and Jeskai Sage.
3. Is Echoes of the Kin Tree worth maindecking? It performed well in one of my matches where it went to lategame but other than that I feel I could have substituted it with other cards. I brought in Mind Rot and Shambling Goblin from the sideboard as well in some of my matches replacing it. I have included Echoes because I thought my deck would be slow and controlling, needed some late game reach.
4. Is Butcher's Glee or Coat with Venom good in this deck? Since it often gets a slow start I feel that either one of these should replace the Echoes? I think I overlooked the Glee here, it seems good but maybe a bit slow. Venom might be better due to my high toughness creatures.
5. Hewed Stone Retainers looks strong as well, is it playable in maindeck?
Thank you for your opinions guys. Really appreciate your time to read and help me out. Thanks again!
So I would have built:
1 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
2 Territorial Roc
1 Arashin Cleric
1 Lightwalker
1 Misthoof Kirin
1 Sandstorm Charger
2 Marang River Skeleton
1 Marsh Hulk
1 Acid-Spewer Dragon
1 Student of Ojutai
2 Rakshasha Gravecaller
1 Deathbringer Regent
2 Pacifism
1 Sandblast
1 Butcher's Glee
1 Flatten
1 Death Wind
9 Swamp
9 Plains
1 Coat with Venom
1 Enduring Victory
1 Ambuscade Shaman
Curve
1 c
2 cccccsss
3 ccccccss
4 css
5 cc
6+c
Differences from you:
1 Swamp
1 Coat with Venom
1 Butcher's Glee
1 Scion of Ugin
1 Echoes of the Kin Tree
1 Enduring Victory
All in all, pretty minor. The only thing is I would really want the 18th land over the scion to better facilitate megamorph, but Enduring Victory is quite arguable over coat with venom.
If I were to build again I would try to find room for the extra land. Just I am not sure if removing the Scion of Ugin actually helps. Since the evasion is useful and his 6 cmc does not interfere with the 7 mana cost of Marsh Hulk and Deathbringer Regent.
Seems like the deck you built is actually 41 cards instead of 40. There was also Shambling Goblin in the additional card list.
Having said that I would probably cut a Butcher's Glee from the 41 card list. Don't get me wrong, the card is powerful, but leaving 3 mana up and having to play during the opponent's combat phase (most of the time) increases the risk of 2-for-1 as the opponent also has open mana for tricks of their own. The same could be said for Coat with Venom but at least it is cheaper. Which card would you rather take out?
Any additional comments are most welcome.
Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong or if you have a different opinion.
Thanks again.
Well, if you stall on mana you're unlikely to hit 6 mana as well. You're still not likely to hit that before turn 7-8. (And 7 mana on turns 8-10).
Whoops. I would take out Coat of Venom from my decklist above.
Butcher's Glee is pretty solid, but you're right that it is a poor defensive trick. That's not it's purpose. It's designed to kill their blocker and leave your attacker still in play. You want defensive tricks to either be cheaper or hard removal for their creatures, not pump spells for your own (where you are extremely vulnerable to being block out by THEIR combat trick/removal spell on their own turn).
As for the list, I would not be happy playing several of these creatures and, as a result, I'd be looking to play Enduring Victory in the main deck. While it requires the target to attack or block, it kills it regardless of how big it is and gets you a bonus to another creature, which may let you win in combat as well. It's too powerful in sealed not to play here.
So to interject here, the issue I see is that the list is already trending towards defensive. If the goal is to survive until the late game, then (barring playing both) Coat of Venom should be the choice over Butcher's Glee. The two tricks do mostly the same thing in this deck, but the lower cost on the Coat means you can play a two-drop and hold this up on turn 3 to stymie a trick-supported attack. Barring first-strike or similar shenanigans, Coat will always allow you to trade, at a minimum. You really aren't beating down with 2x Territorial Roc and 1x Arashin Cleric, and should not be concerned about the extra 3 damage on an attack if the plan is to keep the shields up.
I also noticed a lack of consideration for Center Soul. It may not seem like much, but against those removal-heavy decks, this card does a lot of work by preventing the removal and then facilitating an attack/removing a Pacifism on your next turn. Maybe not the right fit for this particular deck in the main, but still worth considering in certain builds or vs. certain opponents out of the sideboard.
Overall, I'd probably be looking at a 14-8 split between creatures and spells. 18 lands is a must if your plan revolves around high-cost cards. And at that point, you really should be running Echoes of the Kin Tree. If you successfully get the board stalemated, this card lets you break it wide open. It looks slow and clunky, but it definitely does a good amount of work in sealed, as well as the occasional draft deck.
If I were to consider playing Pristine Skywise, could I have splashed for other cards like Silumgar Spell-Eater and Reduce in Stature as well? But I would rather play Scion of Ugin in a more consistent 2-color deck if I need a 6-drop. And as magicmerl pointed out, the high casting cost can be an issue if I am not careful.
I see your point on Arashin Cleric and Territorial Roc being poor attackers and such Coat is preferred over Glee due to its casting cost. Center Soul is a great card as well, it can be played maindeck or sideboard but I would prefer to start it in the sideboard and board it in accordingly since I have other good cards to fill up the spell slots. And Enduring Victory is indeed powerful, I would love to find a slot for it if at all possible.
Speaking of spicier brews, for a moment I did consider playing GU splashing R for Sarkhan Unbroken but decided against it as the green and blue commons were not very powerful on their own.
How would you build the deck then or what changes would you have made in regard to either my or magicmerl's build?
Well the Skywise is rather nice if you have anything to back it up. But without decent fixing, I would probably take my chances on a 2-color build since the power level with and without it in this instance doesn't seem like enough to warrant the inconsistency. But if you could splash blue here, the other main card I'd consider is Mistfire Adept. Reduce in Stature is not a card that I'm ever happy to play, and I'm happy that I've not had to put it in a deck yet. At one of the prerelease events that I attended, I had an opponent cast Reduce in Stature on each of my first three creatures. Unfortunately for my opponent, they were all megamorphs, so I could still flip them up and have them be 1/3 (0/2 with a +1/+1 counter). So when he dropped Sarkhan, I was able to remove his dragon and attack Sarkhan down to nothing.
This is certainly an easier exercise when the cards are there in front of you. When I made my initial reply, I didn't even notice you had more than one Coat with Venom. I'd probably shave off one of the 1/3's or possibly the Shambling Goblin and get down to 14 creatures. If I'm ideally going T1 Plains, T2 Plains for Anafenza, then that reduces the number of times where I want to go T1 Swamp. Sure, the goblin makes great fodder for your Gravecallers, but so would an Arashin Cleric.
For your spells, I would prioritize removal like Flatten, Death Wind, Sandblast, Enduring Victory, and Pacifism, and round it out with some number of Coat with Venom. I would be trying to fit Echoes of the Kin Tree in as a powerful hedge against mana flood. With Echoes, when you've manipulated your board in a way where you have multiple possible destinations for a single Bolster activation, your opponent will find combat difficult.
If you wanted to try a Temur build, you have Shaman of Forgotten Ways to help power out your creatures, and your green fight cards serve as decent removal options. However, beyond Atarka Efreet, Sprinting Warbrute, there's not much in red that seems worthwhile as just a splash. You could probably go UGr, though, if your goal is just to have fun, durdle around, and get Sarkhan into play. If the players at your store are super competitive, though, I'd probably just stick with W/B. Without a seeded prerelease booster, it seems fortunate even to have a decent 2-color deck available.