After being completely destroyed by one in a draft, I tried running them myself in the following draft and I absolutely adore them. T2 Ravenous Rats T3 Mind Rot T4 Mind Rot was absolutely backbreaking for my opponent, I always like to run 2-3 when I play black.
Now, being a somewhat new player, I don't have the skills to really tell how good a card is or not, and I have a feeling I may be overvaluing the card. What are your thoughts?
Mind Rot is a decent sideboard card in faster decks against slower decks because they take away the slower deck's ability to preserve cards for the late game. It isn't great in the main just because it's mostly a dead card against decks that are at least as fast as yours.
I've actually tried the whole discard.dec strategy, and it's awful. There's too many cheap proactive things that wreck you, and any discard beyond what's necessary to empty your opponent's hand is dead, so you're actually making yourself "discard" as much as your opponent, most of the time.
Wit's End is the PERFECT answer to your opponent's Monomania however.
Just hold on to your Wit's End when they Monomania, so you can Wit's End them on your next turn!!!
I think this is fairly reminiscent of the "Jace Battles" we have seen in past standards.. My guess is we will soon witness the great Monomania-Wit's End battles.
I find them playable, but Black's so good in this set that often they don't make my maindeck. They're good sideboard cards against Blue because Archaeomancer will often return a spell that can't be cast on the same turn even in the late game.
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It is playable, but a problem Mind Rot has is that it's a noncreature spell that is not technically strong removal. Although it can potentially create a value advantage the same way a spot removal targeting the opponent's strongest creature does, it is not 100% reliable as it does not remove resolved threats nor does it always get rid of good cards like when the opponent discards a land and a weak card.
I've noticed that I like Mind Rot best in aggressive decks, which tend to be red. But the funny thing about red black decks is that they typically have a lot of removal. You have to be careful to not play too few creatures in your deck. Let's say you have 16 creatures and 7 removal spells with two Mind Rots in your pool. Most of the time you are better off sticking to the good creatures + removal plan rather than decreasing either of them substituting in Mind Rot. Things get even worse for Mind Rot because Sign in Blood is in general a more valuable card, so if you have any room for noncreatures and you have some Sign in Bloods and some Mind Rots (and your mana can handle BB), you are likely once again better off leaving the Mind Rots in the sideboard.
In summary, it is a playable card, and I wouldn't feel bad at all playing it, but if you draft well, you will have a hard time finding room for it. If you've got the room for it, it's perfectly playable.
After being completely destroyed by one in a draft, I tried running them myself in the following draft and I absolutely adore them. T2 Ravenous Rats T3 Mind Rot T4 Mind Rot was absolutely backbreaking for my opponent, I always like to run 2-3 when I play black.
Now, being a somewhat new player, I don't have the skills to really tell how good a card is or not, and I have a feeling I may be overvaluing the card. What are your thoughts?
This seems like a good a time as any to espouse my general theory about discard in magic. To me, the effectiveness of these spells is inversely proportional to the skill level of your opponent. If your opponent knows how to play around these things and make the most favorable discard possible, these spells lose a lot of their effectiveness.
That being said, the one thing I do truly believe (and this is a concept that I think showed very clearly when blightning was in standard) about discard is that it is actually the second one that gets you. The first discard spell usually doesn't do much - sure, there are cases where it's the stone nuts, but other times it's not really a big deal (such as when your opponent has a land heavy hand). However, the second discard spell is pretty devastating. This is why rats into mind rot is so effective.
Mind Rot is the easiest card to play around, since playing around it is free. I typically play around it when I know its there, but I don't play it often. It is pretty good early with Rav Rats though, I'll give you that.
I was playing a draft the second week up avacyn being out and i was constructing my deck when the guy across from me spilled his cherry kool-aid all over mine and his cards, he had a griselbrand and I had a cavern of souls.
So in your above example of going, Turn 2: Rats, T3: Mind Rot, Turn 4: Mind rot - if you're on the draw and your opponent goes T1: Duty Bound Dead, Turn 2: Aven Squire, Turn 3: servant of Nefarox (or some other aggro curve) then you're in pretty bad shape by durdling around with your mind rots.
To be fair, the game WAS a RB control mirror match and he wasn't doing anything to be speedy. (Which shows my deckbuilding skill, putting Mind Rots into control.)
The funny part is, he told me I'm going to run into trouble with aggro with the deck I was running, and third round I got my behind kicked, just like he (and you) predicted.
if you're on the draw and your opponent goes T1: Duty Bound Dead, Turn 2: Aven Squire, Turn 3: servant of Nefarox (or some other aggro curve) then you're in pretty bad shape by durdling around with your mind rots.
Add a T4: Duskmantle and you've just described 75% of my losses in this format. I really loathe exalted. Given the preponderance of exalted decks, I would absolutely never run Mind Rot main deck.
I just last weekend had the pleasure of destroying an opponent who did Mind Rot, Rats, Mind Rot against me. I did it with Exalted, Bejeweled Scorpions!
Mind Rot is a good sideboard card and a passable maindeck card. Also, if you cast it in game 1, you can side it out and still get the benefit of having it in your deck.
The nice thing about it is that it sometimes just wins.
And yes, it is best in aggressive decks. When you put your opponent under pressure early, he can't play around Mind Rot any more. He has to play a land every turn or he will lose.
It's a very fine card in the right deck. It's pretty brutal on T3 but it's pretty bad as a lategame topdeck. I usually play it in slower more controlly decks. It's not really something I want as my three drop over a creature when I'm playing something more aggressive.
With sufficient discard, your opponent might not be able to disrupt the "small dude + enchantment" plan. It always seems very strong when it's not disrupted.
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-A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.
IMO, Mind Rot is much better in sealed than draft. That's because most bombs cost 4 to 5 mana. If your opponent empties their hand early, usually only the bombs and premium removal is left.
I was just going to say that myself. Card is very good (granted, not as good as some people say, but very good).
I like mind rot enough. I want it if I'm running an aggressive deck that has rats, but obviously that doesn't happen that often as rats is hardly aggressive.
It'll be my 23rd card relatively often in black aggro or midrange decks, and sometimes in control decks, but more often it ends up being about 25th. It's quite a high variance card.
Now, being a somewhat new player, I don't have the skills to really tell how good a card is or not, and I have a feeling I may be overvaluing the card. What are your thoughts?
I've actually tried the whole discard.dec strategy, and it's awful. There's too many cheap proactive things that wreck you, and any discard beyond what's necessary to empty your opponent's hand is dead, so you're actually making yourself "discard" as much as your opponent, most of the time.
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
I've noticed that I like Mind Rot best in aggressive decks, which tend to be red. But the funny thing about red black decks is that they typically have a lot of removal. You have to be careful to not play too few creatures in your deck. Let's say you have 16 creatures and 7 removal spells with two Mind Rots in your pool. Most of the time you are better off sticking to the good creatures + removal plan rather than decreasing either of them substituting in Mind Rot. Things get even worse for Mind Rot because Sign in Blood is in general a more valuable card, so if you have any room for noncreatures and you have some Sign in Bloods and some Mind Rots (and your mana can handle BB), you are likely once again better off leaving the Mind Rots in the sideboard.
In summary, it is a playable card, and I wouldn't feel bad at all playing it, but if you draft well, you will have a hard time finding room for it. If you've got the room for it, it's perfectly playable.
This seems like a good a time as any to espouse my general theory about discard in magic. To me, the effectiveness of these spells is inversely proportional to the skill level of your opponent. If your opponent knows how to play around these things and make the most favorable discard possible, these spells lose a lot of their effectiveness.
That being said, the one thing I do truly believe (and this is a concept that I think showed very clearly when blightning was in standard) about discard is that it is actually the second one that gets you. The first discard spell usually doesn't do much - sure, there are cases where it's the stone nuts, but other times it's not really a big deal (such as when your opponent has a land heavy hand). However, the second discard spell is pretty devastating. This is why rats into mind rot is so effective.
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To be fair, the game WAS a RB control mirror match and he wasn't doing anything to be speedy. (Which shows my deckbuilding skill, putting Mind Rots into control.)
The funny part is, he told me I'm going to run into trouble with aggro with the deck I was running, and third round I got my behind kicked, just like he (and you) predicted.
Add a T4: Duskmantle and you've just described 75% of my losses in this format. I really loathe exalted. Given the preponderance of exalted decks, I would absolutely never run Mind Rot main deck.
I just last weekend had the pleasure of destroying an opponent who did Mind Rot, Rats, Mind Rot against me. I did it with Exalted, Bejeweled Scorpions!
~M
The nice thing about it is that it sometimes just wins.
And yes, it is best in aggressive decks. When you put your opponent under pressure early, he can't play around Mind Rot any more. He has to play a land every turn or he will lose.
Tormented Soul
Ravenous Rats
Duty-bound guard
Dark Favor
Mark of the Vampire
Mind rot
With sufficient discard, your opponent might not be able to disrupt the "small dude + enchantment" plan. It always seems very strong when it's not disrupted.
-Terror is an emotion which, when experienced, results in death.
-The pox was a disease notorious for having killed one-third, rounded up, of Europe’s population. Smallpox, on the other hand, killed only a single person.
-A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.
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I was just going to say that myself. Card is very good (granted, not as good as some people say, but very good).
I like mind rot enough. I want it if I'm running an aggressive deck that has rats, but obviously that doesn't happen that often as rats is hardly aggressive.
It'll be my 23rd card relatively often in black aggro or midrange decks, and sometimes in control decks, but more often it ends up being about 25th. It's quite a high variance card.
Draft it on Cubetutor!