One thing I have learned about watching pro tour coverage over the past couple of years is that some pros like to force certain deck types in their drafts or at least have a strong bias, so I guess it is not surprising to see such a wide variety of opinions about card values. I don't understand the biases much of the time, such as the pro tour this past weekend in which one very successful player said that he forces white in every OGW draft, but it is interesting and means we really need to view lists in that context, and it can be most helpful for those who agree with those deck types.
I definitely would put Baloth Pup and Lead by Example much further down and move the Pathwarden and Spider up. Even in a support deck, the pup just trades unless you can get 2 counters on it. Embodiment has definitely fallen below where I thought it was, sometimes it attacks for 7 but a lot of time the extra land can't profitably attack or you don't have more lands to trigger it with. I'd almost always rather have Pathwarden (which can also cohort quite well), and losing to a common in the 5-drop slot means you really don't need to prioritize Embodiment of Insight.
Overall I think green is way underdrafted compared to ally decks or colorless shenanigans, and it's also less risky in that most of the green cards can slide well into any green deck. Lagac is best with a low curve but fits anywhere, and the Seed Guardian, Pathwarden, Summoner, and Spider can go in any deck and fill their role. Compare to white, blue, or black, where if you draft white allies and no other color is open in allies you end up kind of screwed. Green is more adaptable and more generically strong.
I definitely would put Baloth Pup and Lead by Example much further down and move the Pathwarden and Spider up. Even in a support deck, the pup just trades unless you can get 2 counters on it. Embodiment has definitely fallen below where I thought it was, sometimes it attacks for 7 but a lot of time the extra land can't profitably attack or you don't have more lands to trigger it with. I'd almost always rather have Pathwarden (which can also cohort quite well), and losing to a common in the 5-drop slot means you really don't need to prioritize Embodiment of Insight.
Overall I think green is way underdrafted compared to ally decks or colorless shenanigans, and it's also less risky in that most of the green cards can slide well into any green deck. Lagac is best with a low curve but fits anywhere, and the Seed Guardian, Pathwarden, Summoner, and Spider can go in any deck and fill their role. Compare to white, blue, or black, where if you draft white allies and no other color is open in allies you end up kind of screwed. Green is more adaptable and more generically strong.
I agree with all of this, three of my four best decks to date have been more midrange/controlling green decks where it is just looking to ramp/block/kill for the first few turns then throw down a string of haymakers once it hits 4+ mana. Spiders, Envoys and Crawlers are the top priority, as the 4+ cmc fat is pretty abundant. All of them have actually been 2 colors plus a splash, sometimes including colorless too. The mana fixing is great for small splashes in this set thanks to all of the common lands that provide any color.
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Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
I've had success with G/U/C ramp, sometimes splashing black for Baloth Null or Mindmelter or something. I haven't gotten to draft G.W, the're never open together. Green is definitely playable and even good in this set, which is a nice change of pace from BFZ.
I've had success with G/U/C ramp, sometimes splashing black for Baloth Null or Mindmelter or something. I haven't gotten to draft G.W, the're never open together. Green is definitely playable and even good in this set, which is a nice change of pace from BFZ.
Yeah, maybe it is just MTGO, but the GW aggro deck seems overdrafted at this point. I've been in it just once, very early on.
I have had a couple of nice GRx midrangy fat decks though, where you just overwhelm the opponent with sheer creature size/quality thanks to all of the beefy 2-5 drops. Being able to swing for 4 seems especially important.
I feel that when playing green, what I'm looking at for creatures in this format is a power of at least 2 and a toughness of 3 or more. There are a few exceptions like the aforementioned Saddleback Lagac which can push two other creatures into 3/4 range. Scion Summoner is also really good despite having a two toughness since it gives me a 3/3 creature split into two bodies and can help ramp into playing a 5-drop on turn 4.
Overall I think with OGW, OGW, BFZ draft green has moved up to being the color I'm most interested in being in rather than the least, as I always seem to do really well when playing Green/Colorless/x, X usually being is the color that had the most removal I was able to draft.
I've played a lot of limited the last few weeks and green is now one of my favorite colors. It's just solid all-around. Good creatures, good combat tricks, and the best uncommon in the set not close: Nissa's Judgment.
I drafted UG midrange/control last night and can say with certainty that I regret the green, even with 2 scion summoner and a birthing hulk. I ended up going 1-2 and had mana color issues (in both directions) 2 of 3 rounds.
Overall I think green is way underdrafted compared to ally decks or colorless shenanigans, and it's also less risky in that most of the green cards can slide well into any green deck. Lagac is best with a low curve but fits anywhere, and the Seed Guardian, Pathwarden, Summoner, and Spider can go in any deck and fill their role. Compare to white, blue, or black, where if you draft white allies and no other color is open in allies you end up kind of screwed. Green is more adaptable and more generically strong.
I agree with all of this, three of my four best decks to date have been more midrange/controlling green decks where it is just looking to ramp/block/kill for the first few turns then throw down a string of haymakers once it hits 4+ mana. Spiders, Envoys and Crawlers are the top priority, as the 4+ cmc fat is pretty abundant. All of them have actually been 2 colors plus a splash, sometimes including colorless too. The mana fixing is great for small splashes in this set thanks to all of the common lands that provide any color.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Yeah, maybe it is just MTGO, but the GW aggro deck seems overdrafted at this point. I've been in it just once, very early on.
I have had a couple of nice GRx midrangy fat decks though, where you just overwhelm the opponent with sheer creature size/quality thanks to all of the beefy 2-5 drops. Being able to swing for 4 seems especially important.
Overall I think with OGW, OGW, BFZ draft green has moved up to being the color I'm most interested in being in rather than the least, as I always seem to do really well when playing Green/Colorless/x, X usually being is the color that had the most removal I was able to draft.
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-Decks-
Commander:
GWR Rith, the Awakener RWG
U Kami of the Crescent Moon U (Flagship Deck)
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion WB
Under Construction:
UBR Crosis, the Purger RBU
Cube:
WUBRGX Pauper XGRBUW
Decklist:
3 Blinding Drone
1 Eldrazi Skyspawner
2 Benthic Infiltrator
2 Gravity Negator
1 Sphinx of the Final Word
1 Jaddi Offshoot
1 Snapping Gnarlid
2 Scion Summoner
1 Birthing Hulk
4 Sweep Away
1 Clutch of Currents
1 Containment Membrane
1 Seer's Lantern
1 Swell of Growth
Lands (18)
8 Island
6 Forest
1 Holdout Settlement
1 Unknown Shores
1 Blighted Woodland
1 Wastes