No value 0-2-1... in my only MM draft... I got caught between WB Spirits and UW affinity so I drafted UB medicore stuff. I go stuck on my first pick of shadowmage influtrator only to have the person that was passing to me build the exact deck I was trying to make. He had flyiers and went on to win the pod.UB is so directionless buy shadowmage is good in draft, I picked up a crainal plating fairly late first pack then opend lodestone golem but just couldn't get enough good artifacts.. and had three thieves of hope.. blergh.
I will draft one more time. on tuesday but I am just not going out of my way to draft it.. $50 each draft D:.
I've never considered picking a gold card first to be a good play (at least for me). I have made exceptions, but for a Shadowmage Infiltrator? Was there nothing else in the pack?
Unfortunately I can't remember, it was my first MM draft, so it isn't the most obvious what to pick, it is really hard to know what to do in your first draft in a format so complex. Hmm I think there was nothing else in the pack, I remember looking at it and just not finding anything better, at least not obviously powerful. You just can't know the powerful synergy cards the first draft on release week.
I remember my second pick was dimir guildmage (little did I know that the person to the left had taken profane command and slid into UB D:) and I took every nameless inversion I could find I just had no bombs at all.
In my 4th draft I finally had reasonably value cards and actually won some matches, with 5 colour rares (I had 7), losing to mana screw in the finals.
I don't mind losing when I'm outplayed, and I don't even really mind losing that much when I'm out-lucked, but I really hate not getting to play the game at all. Drafted a fun-looking Abzan deck with two Duneblasts and a Dromoka and feel like I read the table pretty well.
Round 1 had to mulligan repeatedly, never saw Duneblast or Dromoka after trying my hardest to hang on for the long game. Round 2 I got the bye after someone dropped. Round 3 I had to mulligan to 6 in game 1, mulligan to 5 in game two, and after keeping a 4-land, 5-card hand proceeded to draw three lands in a row. I'm sitting on 8 land just waiting for a business spell and lose to a guy running Taigam's Scheming and Sultai Runemark in the main. In a "3" round tournament I literally had one game where I had any chance at winning.
Had a pretty solid BG deck which totally owned my first two opponents. It had a good curve, decent removal and seemed to have good synergy. Last round I play against URG jank. The deck was pretty terrible and I trounced all over it in game one. Game two he gets a good draw, but I stabilize at 3 and get him down to 3. He drops Ugin, plus 1s and I loose. Not happy, but it could have been any number of burn spells and I would have lost, so not that big of a deal. Game 3 is going well, with my opponent at 3 and myself at 18. I pass the turn back and he plays Ugin, wipes the board and then I proceed to draw 1 creature which is countered over the next 4 turns. This is the 2nd match I have lost to this same player in 2 months because of Ugin.
I am so sick and tired of loosing because someone got lucky and pulled a broken rare for limited. WotC needs to quit printing this crap and/or put the tools in the game to remove it. It is very frustrating when you both out draft and out play your opponent only to loose to a $33 mythic that your opponent was lucky enough to open. Ugin in particular is offensive because he wraths and then can kill the opponent. Karn, his most compared to card, is no where near as bad for limited as he can only remove one thing at a time.
I am so sick and tired of loosing because someone got lucky and pulled a broken rare for limited.
Did you consider that maybe the reason Game 1 looked "janky" and you trounced him is because he drew Ugin without the mana to cast it and effectively mulliganed himself? Sure Ugin wins plenty of games when it hits the table but it also loses plenty of games languishing in someone's hand because it costs 8.
Maybe his deck was less jank and more had a bad Game 1 against you and you got overconfident. Just trying to be fair about this. I always worry when I beat another 2-0 deck easily in Game 1 because it means he has something really good, I just haven't seen it yet.
Also struggling to see how you "outplayed" him. Seems like he was just playing with a plan -- survive long enough to play an 8 drop. He also got you to 3 life in Game 2 so I doubt his deck was "pretty terrible."
Does anyone ever come to this thread to see if someone has vented about a game they played against you?
In a match a week ago one opponent made a few comments about how lucky I was to win game 1 and then in game 2 after I misplayed a turn I top-decked like a champ to win it, and he predictably chirped at me. I thought about posting on here a vent about the awful opponent who played poorly and then was rewarded with a miraculous win, to then point out that I was the lucky one, but I figured I should just stow it (which I should probably have done now anyway).
Had a pretty solid BG deck which totally owned my first two opponents. It had a good curve, decent removal and seemed to have good synergy. Last round I play against URG jank. The deck was pretty terrible and I trounced all over it in game one. Game two he gets a good draw, but I stabilize at 3 and get him down to 3. He drops Ugin, plus 1s and I loose. Not happy, but it could have been any number of burn spells and I would have lost, so not that big of a deal. Game 3 is going well, with my opponent at 3 and myself at 18. I pass the turn back and he plays Ugin, wipes the board and then I proceed to draw 1 creature which is countered over the next 4 turns. This is the 2nd match I have lost to this same player in 2 months because of Ugin.
I am so sick and tired of loosing because someone got lucky and pulled a broken rare for limited. WotC needs to quit printing this crap and/or put the tools in the game to remove it. It is very frustrating when you both out draft and out play your opponent only to loose to a $33 mythic that your opponent was lucky enough to open. Ugin in particular is offensive because he wraths and then can kill the opponent. Karn, his most compared to card, is no where near as bad for limited as he can only remove one thing at a time.
I'm not going to say Ugin is "easy" to deal with, but as far as ridiculous bombs go, it's not THAT bad. It's not like a Citadel Siege where if you don't have a sideboard enchantment removal (either because of the colors you are in or they just aren't available) turn 4 onwards is an uphill battle because all the opponent needs are any creatures to make it good. As compared to something that your opponent needs to hit 8 mana for.
In Game 2 he conceded to me on Turn 4 after casting Rakshasa's Disdain for X=0.
I feel like if the purpose of variance in the game is to trick bad players into thinking they're mediocre so they keep playing, I should get some sort of merit badge for every match like this where I convinced my opponent he wasn't the helpless noob he really is.
That is a pretty important function of variance. Hopefully the new mulligan rule removes the land-screw part of variance that is more obvious and less effective at generating illusory competence (fortunately for your opponent, color screw is a smidge less obvious). Once WotC is comfortable with that decrease in variance, they will be sure to replace the variance that was lost by printing swingier rares that are better for illusory competence, because only smart kids pick token generating planeswalkers. However! Since WotC surely monitors this thread very closely, I am confident these new planeswalkers will produce an "ante emblem" when they ult that will go into the opponent's collection. This code (xG@&^7) will let you see the hidden flavor text on the emblem: "This badge of merit rewards your patience in helping us convince <player-name> that he is not the helpless noob he really is".
I think Wizards did a terrible job designing the archetypes in MM2. I've seen rookie cube designers with more competence at making archetypes deep. Like, Nest Invader, Scion of the Wild, Kozilek's Predator, and Scatter the Seeds all are at common, while Elementals has like, two good commons? They made all the green cards good in all the green decks, but all the white and blue cards are scattered and have next to no versatility between the archetypes. Like, how do you justify that as a paid designer of Wizards? Tokens are so overpowered and deep that you can have 3 or 4 players drafting it and all of them will have good enough decks to get in the winners bracket, but you can't have two Spirit decks or Elemental decks at the same table?
Same with 5c, there's a bajillion fixers, a bajillion cards that are only good if you have 5 colors, but you also get to play any card that is objectively good, leaving room for many people at the table to draft it. Try to draft a good artifacts deck, suddenly you're filling the last 6 spots of your deck with Frogmites and Runed Servitors because some guy 4 spots to your left opened an Argent Sphinx.
Double strike has to be the saddest archetype I've ever seen. I stay away from it like the plague because every color pairing has insane removal options. And I mean every. Leaving you to play a very unsatisfying game of "does he have it" literally every turn. Not to mention the inherent problem of designing an archetype that divides your deck into two factions that you have to draw an equal amount of. And of course, I've yet to see Viashino Slaughtermaster's ability activated a single time, but in Alara block you wouldn't even play it if you didn't have the colors for it.
And then there's the bloodthirst nonsense. I could have come up with a better archetype throwing darts at a wall of modern cards. The only practical synergy is with proliferate, the rest of the time, the cards just say "bloodthirst" for the sake of saying "bloodthirst". That's some grade-school-level design.
Hey, speaking of proliferate, I hope they were really aiming to make U/B an unplayable combination, because they did a great job. I've played over 100 matches of this poorly-designed format, and I've seen a U/B deck twice -- once was when I drafted it and went 1-2, the other time I smashed a guy playing it because all his removal was so damned inefficient.
They should have worked way harder to include cards that you can play across archetypes and actually encourage drafting skills and deckbuilding skills, as opposed to making everything extremely linear. There are so many Elementals and Spirits to choose from, but they manage to make the Spirits curve completely clogged in the 3cmc (twooptions as the only common spirit creatures for 2cmc or less), meanwhile Elementals isn't even a real deck unless you get the gooduncommonsandrares, lord forbid you don't come across multiple Smokebraiders. There are hardly any Spirits cards that are good in other decks -- Rusalka goes into B/G sacrifice, and Nameless Inversion goes anywhere -- that's literally it. Hell, Swans of Bryn Argoll isn't even good in the spirits deck.
Mystic Snake is such a stupid card to put in the rare slot. It's the definition of "unflexible". It's only good in the U/G graft deck because it's a built in 2 for 1, otherwise it doesn't even fit the scheme. It isn't a coveted card in Modern at all, so putting it at rare furthers the mystery. Nobilis of War suffers the same fate. Can only play it in one deck. Midnight Banshee...also a pretty big "wtf are you doing".
I think Wizards did a terrible job designing the archetypes in MM2. I've seen rookie cube designers with more competence at making archetypes deep. Like, Nest Invader, Scion of the Wild, Kozilek's Predator, and Scatter the Seeds all are at common, while Elementals has like, two good commons? They made all the green cards good in all the green decks, but all the white and blue cards are scattered and have next to no versatility between the archetypes. Like, how do you justify that as a paid designer of Wizards? Tokens are so overpowered and deep that you can have 3 or 4 players drafting it and all of them will have good enough decks to get in the winners bracket, but you can't have two Spirit decks or Elemental decks at the same table?
Same with 5c, there's a bajillion fixers, a bajillion cards that are only good if you have 5 colors, but you also get to play any card that is objectively good, leaving room for many people at the table to draft it. Try to draft a good artifacts deck, suddenly you're filling the last 6 spots of your deck with Frogmites and Runed Servitors because some guy 4 spots to your left opened an Argent Sphinx.
Double strike has to be the saddest archetype I've ever seen. I stay away from it like the plague because every color pairing has insane removal options. And I mean every. Leaving you to play a very unsatisfying game of "does he have it" literally every turn. Not to mention the inherent problem of designing an archetype that divides your deck into two factions that you have to draw an equal amount of. And of course, I've yet to see Viashino Slaughtermaster's ability activated a single time, but in Alara block you wouldn't even play it if you didn't have the colors for it.
And then there's the bloodthirst nonsense. I could have come up with a better archetype throwing darts at a wall of modern cards. The only practical synergy is with proliferate, the rest of the time, the cards just say "bloodthirst" for the sake of saying "bloodthirst". That's some grade-school-level design.
Hey, speaking of proliferate, I hope they were really aiming to make U/B an unplayable combination, because they did a great job. I've played over 100 matches of this poorly-designed format, and I've seen a U/B deck twice -- once was when I drafted it and went 1-2, the other time I smashed a guy playing it because all his removal was so damned inefficient.
They should have worked way harder to include cards that you can play across archetypes and actually encourage drafting skills and deckbuilding skills, as opposed to making everything extremely linear. There are so many Elementals and Spirits to choose from, but they manage to make the Spirits curve completely clogged in the 3cmc (twooptions as the only common spirit creatures for 2cmc or less), meanwhile Elementals isn't even a real deck unless you get the gooduncommonsandrares, lord forbid you don't come across multiple Smokebraiders. There are hardly any Spirits cards that are good in other decks -- Rusalka goes into B/G sacrifice, and Nameless Inversion goes anywhere -- that's literally it. Hell, Swans of Bryn Argoll isn't even good in the spirits deck.
Mystic Snake is such a stupid card to put in the rare slot. It's the definition of "unflexible". It's only good in the U/G graft deck because it's a built in 2 for 1, otherwise it doesn't even fit the scheme. It isn't a coveted card in Modern at all, so putting it at rare furthers the mystery. Nobilis of War suffers the same fate. Can only play it in one deck. Midnight Banshee...also a pretty big "wtf are you doing".
I could go on. So many blanks, so much potential, so many flawed designs. I'm done with this format.
I agree there are problems with the design of the set. I agree that spirits is a fragile, linear deck to draft, and it's often either awesome or terrible. I do think that the lack of two-drops was intentional though. For one thing, there aren't a ton of 2-drop spirits that would be useful to the deck and can be printed at common. For another, I think the idea is that you're supposed to count Nameless Inversion as a two-drop to stall the faster decks and recur it as you trade off your Thief of Hopes and such. The problem is there's almost no deck in the format that can't use Nameless Inversion, especially with all the colorless fixing around, so you're lucky to see more than 1 if you're the spirit deck.
Someone told me that losing to me made them realize they should quit MTGO. =/
Sorry, I was having a bad day.
No, just kidding, it wasn't me. I actually find it really funny when people say stuff like that to me. Or when they say things that I can only assume are foreign curse words.
Went on a tear and was really close to a Khans set redemption, so I started jamming drafts and it became all about the grind.
I just bought the last couple cards I needed from bots to redeem the set and scratch that itch, but I'm uninstalling MTGO for a while, at least until Origins is out. I need to remember why I play this game.
Drafted all day (12 hours) and kept running into Sentinel of the Eternal Watch and Vigilance Spider
Who the hell thought a slightly underpowered Citadel Siege, giving it a 4/6 body with vigilance was a good idea? Vigilance Spider? Are you playing white or black? No? Have fun removing it without losing half your board!
I mean seriously, I must have played those two creatures in about half my matches
Drafted all day (12 hours) and kept running into Sentinel of the Eternal Watch and Vigilance Spider
Who the hell thought a slightly underpowered Citadel Siege, giving it a 4/6 body with vigilance was a good idea? Vigilance Spider? Are you playing white or black? No? Have fun removing it without losing half your board!
I mean seriously, I must have played those two creatures in about half my matches
I'm doing pretty bad in BFZ drafts so far too. Two 1-2's in swiss so far. Last night I drafted a pretty sweet UW control/awaken deck, but double punted away my first game by not countering a turn three Retreat to Valakut, then making an overly aggressive attack that left me dead to a topdecked land (apparently I forgot how to math). Match 2 I timed out the turn before I could swing in for lethal. I'm not sure if it's more reassuring to know that these were mistakes I can identify and fix, or frustrating to know that I've been playing long enough that I shouldn't be making these noob mistakes.
Three sealed events so far. 1-3, 2-2, 2-2 (including a bye). No mythic cards have been seen by me yet. 2 of the dual lands as the only opened value in total. This is becoming sadly par for the course, at least online, when a new set comes out. I apparently need a while to figure out how to play.
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Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I played 4 sealeds and 4 drafts and won ONE MATCH because my opponent didn't show up.
I feel your pain. I've spent the past few days practicing my deck building and playing against myself, getting looks at different board states, etc. I'm going to do another draft tomorrow.
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I've never considered picking a gold card first to be a good play (at least for me). I have made exceptions, but for a Shadowmage Infiltrator? Was there nothing else in the pack?
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I remember my second pick was dimir guildmage (little did I know that the person to the left had taken profane command and slid into UB D:) and I took every nameless inversion I could find I just had no bombs at all.
In my 4th draft I finally had reasonably value cards and actually won some matches, with 5 colour rares (I had 7), losing to mana screw in the finals.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
I don't mind losing when I'm outplayed, and I don't even really mind losing that much when I'm out-lucked, but I really hate not getting to play the game at all. Drafted a fun-looking Abzan deck with two Duneblasts and a Dromoka and feel like I read the table pretty well.
Round 1 had to mulligan repeatedly, never saw Duneblast or Dromoka after trying my hardest to hang on for the long game. Round 2 I got the bye after someone dropped. Round 3 I had to mulligan to 6 in game 1, mulligan to 5 in game two, and after keeping a 4-land, 5-card hand proceeded to draw three lands in a row. I'm sitting on 8 land just waiting for a business spell and lose to a guy running Taigam's Scheming and Sultai Runemark in the main. In a "3" round tournament I literally had one game where I had any chance at winning.
Yep. Every time I play horribly but rip runner-runner-runner-runner-runner, which is more often than I'd like to admit. Hasn't happened yet though.
Had a pretty solid BG deck which totally owned my first two opponents. It had a good curve, decent removal and seemed to have good synergy. Last round I play against URG jank. The deck was pretty terrible and I trounced all over it in game one. Game two he gets a good draw, but I stabilize at 3 and get him down to 3. He drops Ugin, plus 1s and I loose. Not happy, but it could have been any number of burn spells and I would have lost, so not that big of a deal. Game 3 is going well, with my opponent at 3 and myself at 18. I pass the turn back and he plays Ugin, wipes the board and then I proceed to draw 1 creature which is countered over the next 4 turns. This is the 2nd match I have lost to this same player in 2 months because of Ugin.
I am so sick and tired of loosing because someone got lucky and pulled a broken rare for limited. WotC needs to quit printing this crap and/or put the tools in the game to remove it. It is very frustrating when you both out draft and out play your opponent only to loose to a $33 mythic that your opponent was lucky enough to open. Ugin in particular is offensive because he wraths and then can kill the opponent. Karn, his most compared to card, is no where near as bad for limited as he can only remove one thing at a time.
Did you consider that maybe the reason Game 1 looked "janky" and you trounced him is because he drew Ugin without the mana to cast it and effectively mulliganed himself? Sure Ugin wins plenty of games when it hits the table but it also loses plenty of games languishing in someone's hand because it costs 8.
Maybe his deck was less jank and more had a bad Game 1 against you and you got overconfident. Just trying to be fair about this. I always worry when I beat another 2-0 deck easily in Game 1 because it means he has something really good, I just haven't seen it yet.
Also struggling to see how you "outplayed" him. Seems like he was just playing with a plan -- survive long enough to play an 8 drop. He also got you to 3 life in Game 2 so I doubt his deck was "pretty terrible."
In a match a week ago one opponent made a few comments about how lucky I was to win game 1 and then in game 2 after I misplayed a turn I top-decked like a champ to win it, and he predictably chirped at me. I thought about posting on here a vent about the awful opponent who played poorly and then was rewarded with a miraculous win, to then point out that I was the lucky one, but I figured I should just stow it (which I should probably have done now anyway).
I'm not going to say Ugin is "easy" to deal with, but as far as ridiculous bombs go, it's not THAT bad. It's not like a Citadel Siege where if you don't have a sideboard enchantment removal (either because of the colors you are in or they just aren't available) turn 4 onwards is an uphill battle because all the opponent needs are any creatures to make it good. As compared to something that your opponent needs to hit 8 mana for.
Ghastly Conscription and Dragon Tempest in the same pool?
I know rares aren't the end-all be-all to a pool, but they can bring up the mediocre commons/uncommons.
In Game 2 he conceded to me on Turn 4 after casting Rakshasa's Disdain for X=0.
I feel like if the purpose of variance in the game is to trick bad players into thinking they're mediocre so they keep playing, I should get some sort of merit badge for every match like this where I convinced my opponent he wasn't the helpless noob he really is.
Same with 5c, there's a bajillion fixers, a bajillion cards that are only good if you have 5 colors, but you also get to play any card that is objectively good, leaving room for many people at the table to draft it. Try to draft a good artifacts deck, suddenly you're filling the last 6 spots of your deck with Frogmites and Runed Servitors because some guy 4 spots to your left opened an Argent Sphinx.
Double strike has to be the saddest archetype I've ever seen. I stay away from it like the plague because every color pairing has insane removal options. And I mean every. Leaving you to play a very unsatisfying game of "does he have it" literally every turn. Not to mention the inherent problem of designing an archetype that divides your deck into two factions that you have to draw an equal amount of. And of course, I've yet to see Viashino Slaughtermaster's ability activated a single time, but in Alara block you wouldn't even play it if you didn't have the colors for it.
And then there's the bloodthirst nonsense. I could have come up with a better archetype throwing darts at a wall of modern cards. The only practical synergy is with proliferate, the rest of the time, the cards just say "bloodthirst" for the sake of saying "bloodthirst". That's some grade-school-level design.
Hey, speaking of proliferate, I hope they were really aiming to make U/B an unplayable combination, because they did a great job. I've played over 100 matches of this poorly-designed format, and I've seen a U/B deck twice -- once was when I drafted it and went 1-2, the other time I smashed a guy playing it because all his removal was so damned inefficient.
They should have worked way harder to include cards that you can play across archetypes and actually encourage drafting skills and deckbuilding skills, as opposed to making everything extremely linear. There are so many Elementals and Spirits to choose from, but they manage to make the Spirits curve completely clogged in the 3cmc (two options as the only common spirit creatures for 2cmc or less), meanwhile Elementals isn't even a real deck unless you get the good uncommons and rares, lord forbid you don't come across multiple Smokebraiders. There are hardly any Spirits cards that are good in other decks -- Rusalka goes into B/G sacrifice, and Nameless Inversion goes anywhere -- that's literally it. Hell, Swans of Bryn Argoll isn't even good in the spirits deck.
Mystic Snake is such a stupid card to put in the rare slot. It's the definition of "unflexible". It's only good in the U/G graft deck because it's a built in 2 for 1, otherwise it doesn't even fit the scheme. It isn't a coveted card in Modern at all, so putting it at rare furthers the mystery. Nobilis of War suffers the same fate. Can only play it in one deck. Midnight Banshee...also a pretty big "wtf are you doing".
Here's a quick list of cards that could have gone in multiple decks and actually made the drafting process deep:
Sulfur Elemental
Bloodghast
Courier's Capsule
Sigil of Distinction
Nether Traitor
Fireshrieker
Banshee's Blade
Festercreep
Vault Skirge
Fertilid
Spore Burst
Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
I could go on. So many blanks, so much potential, so many flawed designs. I'm done with this format.
I agree there are problems with the design of the set. I agree that spirits is a fragile, linear deck to draft, and it's often either awesome or terrible. I do think that the lack of two-drops was intentional though. For one thing, there aren't a ton of 2-drop spirits that would be useful to the deck and can be printed at common. For another, I think the idea is that you're supposed to count Nameless Inversion as a two-drop to stall the faster decks and recur it as you trade off your Thief of Hopes and such. The problem is there's almost no deck in the format that can't use Nameless Inversion, especially with all the colorless fixing around, so you're lucky to see more than 1 if you're the spirit deck.
Sorry, I was having a bad day.
No, just kidding, it wasn't me. I actually find it really funny when people say stuff like that to me. Or when they say things that I can only assume are foreign curse words.
Keep it up boys....someday!
I just bought the last couple cards I needed from bots to redeem the set and scratch that itch, but I'm uninstalling MTGO for a while, at least until Origins is out. I need to remember why I play this game.
Drafted all day (12 hours) and kept running into Sentinel of the Eternal Watch and Vigilance Spider
Who the hell thought a slightly underpowered Citadel Siege, giving it a 4/6 body with vigilance was a good idea? Vigilance Spider? Are you playing white or black? No? Have fun removing it without losing half your board!
I mean seriously, I must have played those two creatures in about half my matches
I think you were using Citadel Siege wrong...
I'm 0-9 in 3 swiss drafts. Swiss. Yup.
Ooof. It'll turn around.
I feel your pain. I've spent the past few days practicing my deck building and playing against myself, getting looks at different board states, etc. I'm going to do another draft tomorrow.