This is the current version i am playing right now except for the sideboard, and i am not sure on that one. i know this might seem like a strange build but this is how i see the deck working. burn ideally should be able to win on turn 3 with an amazing hand
the perfect number would be 3 lands, 6 lightning bolt-like spells, and 1 fireblast. for 22 damage.
spark elemental to some degree could be viewed a the weakest bolt spell.
so the 1 mana bolts would be:
1) lightning bolt
2) lava spike
3) chain lightning
4) rift bolt (from time spiral)
5) spark elemental
the 2 casting cost bolts would be
1) lightning helix (amazing in mirror)
2) incinerate (could drop these in from the sideboard)
the search function fixers would be
1) fetch lands
2) magma jet
finisher is
1) fireblast
2) grim lavamancer
3) barbarian ring
4) price of progress
utility 1 drop is
1) mogg maniac
obviously the weakest link the deck are the spark elementals because they are dead draws beyond the second draw.
My take is that it less stable for using the second color splash and for the sparky (as you even note) and for the lavamancers. I do like the new rift bolt.
And the new fork like reiterate is a card that I'm toying with, maybe SB.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
3 Flamebreak - Global burn, also kills gobbos. Kills a lot though.
4 Price of progress - This can be gamebreaking. I only have 4 Nonbasics, that can be sacced anyway.
3 Fork - Double my BURNNNNNNNNN, Especially good with fireblast.
4 Ankh of mishra - It's a repeating burn source, not extremely good, but if you can drop this turn 2 when on the go, it should be pretty damn good. Needs some more testing. Makes fetchlands cry, a lot.
! ------------------------------
Okay, i saw that Ankh of mishra wasn't spoken about, it's a decent card that doesn't need mana to work. It's also nice against decks that rely on having much lands in play (MBC), Crucible decks (Stax), Or decks that want to have massive amounts of fetches.
Fork is generally very good with my free spells, and can copy a lightning bolt for extra 3 damage to the dome as well. Copying an fireblast is especially mean, because it gives 4 extra damage for 2 mana, and you dont need to sacrifice more lands for it.
For sideboard, i had this in mind.
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4 Sirocco - My anti-solidarity tech. Just because i dont like *******s that combo off in responce to a lightning bolt. That's all.
4 Sulfuring Vortex - Anti lifegain card, also nice in some matchups that tend to last long. Stellar against MBC, stopping their life drain from being an auto-win card.
4 Anarchy - Just because it is anarchy, and kills all white permanents too BTW. I heard that this is pretty nice to get rid of confinement and some spells like that.
3 Red elemental blast - I like it too, it is good against many decks, but best against solidarity
For an idea, in the decks that use 8 baubles, and most propably rift bolt too, would using a Grapeshot be of any idea? Suspending a turn 1 rift bolt, turn 2 2 baubles then this will make it deal 4 dmg for 2 mana. Might be too risky, but and idea neverthless.
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The Sage is occupied with the unspoken
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
My take is that it less stable for using the second color splash and for the sparky (as you even note) and for the lavamancers. I do like the new rift bolt.
And the new fork like reiterate is a card that I'm toying with, maybe SB.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
but i think splashing white is the perfect compliment to red. lightning helix is far better than incinerate especially in mirror matchups, and red gets access to disenchant. disenchant is the best method of removal against all of red's real threats which are of course artifacts and enchantments.
but i think splashing white is the perfect compliment to red. lightning helix is far better than incinerate especially in mirror matchups, and red gets access to disenchant. disenchant is the best method of removal against all of red's real threats which are of course artifacts and enchantments.
If you get it to work better than mono-red than use it, but I have never found overtaxing your land a solid idea. First of you need are giving a target for some cards like stifle or LD, you lose life just for doing it, you need to sac for blast, and you ar running three PoP which could hurt you as well (some games don't leave us much wiggle room to stay ahead in the life, sure you may get it back with helix, but again this is adding too much to chance), also if you are still going to try the splash route I would still replace the mancers and sparks. Also you may still have trouble with infinite combo and mutiple white threats that aren't very well addressed with your SB. Just some suggestions to mull over.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
Quoted for truth: the above probably includes a fair percentage of Tier 1 and Tier 2 Legacy Decks (Landstill, Treshold, Survival, 3-Color Zoo), and is especially fun against Loam-Control and The Land Deck. If you drop it on turn 2 on the play, you're at least going to deal 4-6 damage to your opponent with it.
Having said that, I like the simplicity of burning the opponent down, but I think that in the current metagame burn is just too unstable, as decks will either be killing faster than turn 4 (the ideal turn 3 hand won't be that common), or will have enough ressources to neutralize half your burn spells, leaving them at a comfortable life total. I myself prefer to combine burn with efficient weenies in a R/W-version (Isamaru, Grim Lavamancer, and the King of them, Jotun Grunt), enhanced by some Reckless Charges. It's not that much faster, but can at least play a decent midgame, and randomly wreck the many decks relying on the graveyard with Grunt.
Yeah, ankh is nice , but just a big target when you run no other targets.
Anyway ankh any other perms are just not any better than non-perm choices unless you run many more.
So you as Ive' been mentioning burn is not running top tier much, but i do feel it can be again. You can go the R/W weenie route (though I feel R/G is probably better), but that would be a whole different thread.
There are few cards that help put this deck in better company, see how it does if tried an piloted before feeling it can't fly. My list is largely the same, but the PoP's and forks are solid. I keep the risks to a minimum and the new cards in the SB are boosting the resolve more.
Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
Barbarian ring seems so good, that you could as well go ahead and run 4 - What would be the drawback? You lose 1 life there and there, but it can deal damage to your opponent on mid-game, and is never dead card in hand. It's bad against iggy pop though..
Oh, and im updating my list.
Ankh is good against: MBC, Stax, Train Wreck, Dirt, Landstill, Treshold, Survival, 3-Color Zoo, Loam control and the Lands deck...
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The Sage is occupied with the unspoken
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
Barbarian ring seems so good, that you could as well go ahead and run 4 - What would be the drawback? You lose 1 life there and there, but it can deal damage to your opponent on mid-game, and is never dead card in hand. It's bad against iggy pop though..
Oh, and im updating my list.
Ankh is good against: MBC, Stax, Train Wreck, Dirt, Landstill, Treshold, Survival, 3-Color Zoo, Loam control and the Lands deck...
Yeah, ring is nice but also with fireblast I feel you need to run 18 mountains and 4 ring would just mess with that.
And yes ankh is a good card, but most of the mentioned decks will be able to deal with MD and most assuredly in the SB. Permanents are just to fragile when running burn. If you want to run many permanents and still have the direct damage mono-red deck it is probably possible, but it requires a lot of changes to these burn style lists.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
Y'know, burn is like a multi-turn combo deck. You can crap out like a combo deck. You're as quick as a combo deck. And you don't pack tons of disruption like a combo deck. The only difference is that you take multiple turns instead of going off all at once.
So according to that chain of logic, extra turns = good for this deck. Would Final Fortune therefore be a good idea?
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"Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana." -Groucho Marx
"You're going to fight that?!"
"No...I'm going to kill that."
A GAME OF THRONES ON HBO!!!! AAAAAH~!!!!
Y'know, burn is like a multi-turn combo deck. You can crap out like a combo deck. You're as quick as a combo deck. And you don't pack tons of disruption like a combo deck. The only difference is that you take multiple turns instead of going off all at once.
So according to that chain of logic, extra turns = good for this deck. Would Final Fortune therefore be a good idea?
Well, I think I get the gist of your analogy, though it just not that simple.
Which leads to say that final fortune is just not solid. If the situation is that you have three land and 2 or more cards in hand than it may be beneficial, but more often than not you don't have that situation, you have one card in hand and you just threw away a potential damage card to potentially win or lose on this turn - just not a smart gamble to rely on.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
And yes, no incantatrix for you. Or anyone. That class makes puppies cry. Mostly because they are the former Big Bads who have been Baleful Polymorphed into said puppies. By you. Because you're an incantatrix.
Quote from Yukora »
This is Deraxas we're talking about.
Remember, the girl that just killed an aspect of herself before literally consuming her?
Yeah, I don't see her handling a pissing match in any way other than a duel.
Quote from RedDwarfian »
Yes mistress...
Quote from About epic-level D&D »
There are only so many epic, psuedonatural barbarian/blackguard half-dragon akutenshai vampire balor paragons they can throw at you, right?
Quote from Concerning breeding habits of humans in fantasy games »
I suppose it's true. Though the logistics implied in a human/Great Wyrm Prismatic Dragon pairing makes me shudder.
...Something tells me that even should all arcane casters in the world unite, that the Grease spell would NOT be sufficient.
Not just Solidarity - all current tier combodecks are hosed by the Pillar. It's still quite possible to win these matches even with most burn netting just 1 point of life advantage.
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Some have said embermages lack subtlety. You know what? THEY'RE ALL DEAD!! :mad1:
And actually, the key thing to remember is that if you have a Pillar down, YOU control your own life total, not your opponent. They have NO way to kill you(without commiting suicide first), so all you have to do is find out how to kill them(fireblasts, bolts, and recurring damage such as fanatic/lavamancer/scroll/whatever) most efficiently.
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I used this build (from a few pages back) in a Legacy Tourney and came 4th out of 18. I lost against affinity and tendrils (in knockout top 8). Any help? I was considering the pillars since there were like 3-4 goblin (:-/ ) decks. So umm... help please. Where were you Bullbar?
I used this build (from a few pages back) in a Legacy Tourney and came 4th out of 18. I lost against affinity and tendrils (in knockout top 8). Any help? I was considering the pillars since there were like 3-4 goblin (:-/ ) decks. So umm... help please. Where were you Bullbar?
Replace shock ! (and maybe browbeat)
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
i have had this deck for almost 5 years or so now (i think) so what do you guys think about it? this is totally a casual deck atm, but i want it to be better... all suggestions are thank... sideboard, is basically thrown together, but a little thought out.. and what are the current builds of this deck that would be closest Teir 1? 2 or 3 would be good.
I'm going to be REALLY nice. For once. Seeing as this is your very first post on this site, I'm NOT going to give you an infraction. What I will do is let you know a few things.
1. Wheel of Fortune and Strip Mine are banned in Legacy. If you had read the rules I posted, you would have found a list that included those cards. Next time, please do so before you post a decklist.
2. It would also be nice if you included a few facts about your deck, as in why you chose certain things over others. Your build is decidedly NOT the norm for most Burn decks, and I am certain that others would like the input. Besides, in this particular subforum, it's required.
3. Deck-tags are much better than card tags- it streamlines everything. I have edited your post to include them.
i have had this deck for almost 5 years or so now (i think) I'm going to be REALLY nice. For once. Seeing as this is your very first post on this site, I'm NOT going to give you an infraction. What I will do is let you know a few things.
I just wanted to mention that for deck you've had for FIVE YEARS it is not given much thought, and many cards are much newer than 5 years - like rift bolt, which means you have worked on this deck even now. So as the mod mentioned, please rethink this deck and feel free to post it once it's workable and tested.
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
I just wanted to mention that for deck you've had for FIVE YEARS it is not given much thought, and many cards are much newer than 5 years - like rift bolt, which means you have worked on this deck even now. So as the mod mentioned, please rethink this deck and feel free to post it once it's workable and tested.
thanks and enjoy
If this deck isn't quite what some were thinking, then i dunno what to say.. but yes, i have recently updated it.. but this is the best i can do with what i know of magic.. its not realy five years, but just about there maybe 3-4 can't remember, since end of Madness era i made it, then got ideas, and changed my cards accordingly. i probably should update the deck to Legacy legal, then explain why i chose the cards like mod mentioned before.
1. Wheel of Fortune and Strip Mine are banned in Legacy. If you had read the rules I posted, you would have found a list that included those cards. Next time, please do so before you post a decklist.
-----if you could please, post a url or direct me to it. i read the top post or rules thread and that was all.
2. It would also be nice if you included a few facts about your deck, as in why you chose certain things over others. Your build is decidedly NOT the norm for most Burn decks, and I am certain that others would like the input. Besides, in this particular subforum, it's required.
-----just for my knowledge, what is in a normal burn deck? this deck i have built is with the best cards that i think should be in there using T1 rules, yet made for casual play.
3. Deck-tags are much better than card tags- it streamlines everything. I have edited your post to include them
-----thanks for that tip, i was wondering how to do that, and since i knew about the cards tag, i used them instead. do i just use [*cards][*/cards] to make the cards organized? if so i will use them for now on. thanks for anything/everything. sorry for any inconvienance.
if double posting is spamming, im sorry. just an explanation of the deck i posted...
Deck
3 Grim Lavamancer - use of cards in graveyard, and just helps add in damage.
3 browbeat - drawing is rare in red, and this is the best choice, since I either want to do damage, or get more cards, so a win-win situation.
4 chain lightning - (R) for 3 damage is good.
3 fireblast - use of useless mountains in mid to late game. also game winner.
4 incinerate - best (1)(R) for 3 damage card, only because it is an instant.
4 lightning bolt - (R) for 3 damage is great.
3 magma jet - helps throw in damage, also manipulates the library.
3 rift bolt - (R) for 3 is great, plus you can use this on creatures..
4 lava spike - 3 to the head..
4 sulfuric vortex - free damage every turn is good, plus it quickens the clock for both players.
1 cursed scroll - when your hand is near empty, and you need colorless damage to get through them COP: Reds or the simularity.
3 ensnaring bridge - control creatures, since you know by turn 3, you should have like 4 or less in your hand.
1 lotus petal - just mana accel.
18 Mtn. - need these to use this deck.
2 wasteland - same as above.
Sideboard
1 Anarchy - for the (W) decks that are made against us.
1 breaking point - creature kill, or points to the head.
1 earthquake - creature kill.
1 echoing ruin - artifact hate.
1 flamebreak - creature kill.
1 granulate - artifact hate.
1 meltdown - artifact hate.
1 overmaster - make sure the spell i want gets through. also nets you a card.
2 searing rays - could win you the game.
1 wheel of fortune - best card drawer in the game for (R).
1 ensnaring bridge - creature control.
1 grafted skullcap - combos with the bridge, also drawing enhancer.
1 null rod - screws over some mana accel, and other kinds of cards.
1 pithing needle - makes sure you get the card before the card gets you basically.
Well ,i've updated it. yea, there's not much update, but i did take out the more useless cards.
-1 strip - banned
-1 scroll - don't need too many of these... the activation cost is too much for the damage.
-4 fetch - waste of space.
-1 CoW - if i don't have the fetches, don't need this.
-1 Wish - i should already have what i need in my maindeck.
+4 lava spike - makes a total of 8 (possibly 12) turn 1 (R) 3 damage spells.
+1 Wasteland - most decks use nonbasic lands. good.
+3 Mtn. - more targets for the Fb.
i don't think there is any room for PoP unless i take out the rift bolts... i think that would be a good idea, since it could get countered and then the first turn is wasted. 2-3 PoP is best IMO.
I used this build (from a few pages back) in a Legacy Tourney and came 4th out of 18. I lost against affinity and tendrils (in knockout top 8). Any help? I was considering the pillars since there were like 3-4 goblin (:-/ ) decks. So umm... help please. Where were you Bullbar?
Hiya Geek. I wasn't there as I'd had a really big party the previous nite, and already have everything that was offered as prizes anyway - much better if someone who needs them wins them IMHO.
Anyways...the deck.
Drop the Shocks, as mentioned. Just not hot enuff 4 burn. Another Flamebreak and some Price of Progress would take the cardslots in our meta.
Pyrostatic Pillars are good for burn sideboards on our meta, but not for the Gobbos matchup like you are thinking. Board them in for Salvager Game, and storm combo decks like IGGy pop.
Some other sideboard points....
Solidarity is v.v.rare in these parts, so I'd drop Sirrocco. REB and Pillar are fine for this matchup should it be encountered. I'd run at least 3 Anarchy as white enchantments are most of what stops Burn in these parts - COP:Red and Sol. Confinement etc. REB's are fine, but try to use 1/2 of them as Pyroblast, and the tech you are missing for Gobbos and the numerous other aggro deck we see so regularly could be Repercussion
3 Barb. Ring? How are U finding that?
Shattering Spree is OK, but is prime against Stax decks which have fallen from favour locally. Meltdown is heaps better vs Affinity, which is an OK matchup as it happens. The Repercussions are pretty good here too.
NEWSFLASH - a lack of non-basic land hate here means that the Rw version using Lightning Helix is pretty good. Sideboard gains some gems like Disenchant, and Honorable Passage tech for Burn mirrors and Goblin Piledriver. Check it out!
if double posting is spamming, im sorry. just an explanation of the deck i posted...
I don't advocate the burning bridge style deck, but if you want some more input on it go back to the first page of this thread and in the first couple posts there is decklist on this and link to more. Check it out and see what you think.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
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Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
yea, the reason why my deck was put together that way was becasue it was going for a little bit of multiplayer control, and casual dueling.. basically set for any deck, but now, im tired of average 6 turn wins, and get average of 3-4 turn wins... i actually thinking about using one of them threshold decks so i can have a aggro deck, and my burn deck.. but yea.. thanks for the info.
*EDIT* - what would the RW burn build look like besides adding in Lightning Helix?
Helix is the main addition, actually. Mishra's Bauble becomes more attractive as fetchlands would obvs be used, and Shahrazad could be amazing if anyone can justify the expense...
The main differece is the powerfull sideboard options you gain, white needs no introduction there.
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Some have said embermages lack subtlety. You know what? THEY'RE ALL DEAD!! :mad1:
I don't get to play often enough, so I can't even begin to ajust for a local meta. So after facing varied metas I have made a few changes to make this deck more general and still fast and efficient. I have also tuned the SB more. This list is almost like a list I've done earlier with some slight modifications (and the addition rift bolt helps); I no longer can take the gamble on using PoP. Four chasm in the SB is very helpful against many tougher matches; also add help while using pillar.
Tidbits of George Carlin : “I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.” "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." "Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
with glacial chasm in play, you basically got 4 turns until your dead.. 2+4+6+8=20 so how is putting yourself on a clock good? i can understand the rest, do you just play is when you know you can win within 3-4 turns if you life is at 20? i have though however changed my sideboard a little bit.. i love shattering spree.. i notice that most of our spells are at TCC of 3 or less os wouldn't pyrostatic pillar hurt us more, because we should be able to play our hand out that much faster.
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9 Mountain
4 Plateau
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Barbarian Ring
Creatures (10)
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Spark Elemental
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Fireblast
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Magma Jet
3 Price of Progress
4 Lightning Helix
4 Rift Bolt
3 Incinerate
3 Shattering Spree
3 Disenchant
3 Sulfuric Vortex
3 Flaring Pain
This is the current version i am playing right now except for the sideboard, and i am not sure on that one. i know this might seem like a strange build but this is how i see the deck working. burn ideally should be able to win on turn 3 with an amazing hand
the perfect number would be 3 lands, 6 lightning bolt-like spells, and 1 fireblast. for 22 damage.
spark elemental to some degree could be viewed a the weakest bolt spell.
so the 1 mana bolts would be:
1) lightning bolt
2) lava spike
3) chain lightning
4) rift bolt (from time spiral)
5) spark elemental
the 2 casting cost bolts would be
1) lightning helix (amazing in mirror)
2) incinerate (could drop these in from the sideboard)
the search function fixers would be
1) fetch lands
2) magma jet
finisher is
1) fireblast
2) grim lavamancer
3) barbarian ring
4) price of progress
utility 1 drop is
1) mogg maniac
obviously the weakest link the deck are the spark elementals because they are dead draws beyond the second draw.
what is your take on the deck?
My take is that it less stable for using the second color splash and for the sparky (as you even note) and for the lavamancers. I do like the new rift bolt.
4 chain lightning
4 fireblast
4 incinerate
4 lava spike
3 chain of plasma
4 magma jet
4 rift bolt
3 mogg fanatic
2 fork
2 price of progress
2 flamebreak
2 barbarian ring
18 mountains
4 pyrostatic pillar
3 shattering spree
1 shivan gorge
3 mogg maniac
And the new fork like reiterate is a card that I'm toying with, maybe SB.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
------------------------------
- 4 Barbarian Ring - Lands with burn aspect = Good.
- 14 Mountain
- 4 Lightning bolt - 1cc Burn, best of the bunch
- 4 Rift bolt - 1cc Burn, a bit tricky but will do the trick
- 4 Lava Spike - 1cc Burn, sorcery but still great
- 4 Chain lightning - 1cc Burn, very good
- 4 Fireblast - FREE BURNNNNNNNNN
- 4 Flame rift - 4 damage for 2 mana? Great BURN
- 2 Cave-in - Free BURN. Also kills gobbos.
- 3 Flamebreak - Global burn, also kills gobbos. Kills a lot though.
- 4 Price of progress - This can be gamebreaking. I only have 4 Nonbasics, that can be sacced anyway.
- 3 Fork - Double my BURNNNNNNNNN, Especially good with fireblast.
- 4 Ankh of mishra - It's a repeating burn source, not extremely good, but if you can drop this turn 2 when on the go, it should be pretty damn good. Needs some more testing. Makes fetchlands cry, a lot.
- 2 Browbeat - Some card advantage, OR BURNNNNNNNN!
!------------------------------
Okay, i saw that Ankh of mishra wasn't spoken about, it's a decent card that doesn't need mana to work. It's also nice against decks that rely on having much lands in play (MBC), Crucible decks (Stax), Or decks that want to have massive amounts of fetches.
Fork is generally very good with my free spells, and can copy a lightning bolt for extra 3 damage to the dome as well. Copying an fireblast is especially mean, because it gives 4 extra damage for 2 mana, and you dont need to sacrifice more lands for it.
For sideboard, i had this in mind.
-------------------------------
- 4 Sirocco - My anti-solidarity tech. Just because i dont like *******s that combo off in responce to a lightning bolt. That's all.
- 4 Sulfuring Vortex - Anti lifegain card, also nice in some matchups that tend to last long. Stellar against MBC, stopping their life drain from being an auto-win card.
- 4 Anarchy - Just because it is anarchy, and kills all white permanents too BTW. I heard that this is pretty nice to get rid of confinement and some spells like that.
- 3 Red elemental blast - I like it too, it is good against many decks, but best against solidarity
.-------------------------------
Nothing mindbreaking here.
For an idea, in the decks that use 8 baubles, and most propably rift bolt too, would using a Grapeshot be of any idea? Suspending a turn 1 rift bolt, turn 2 2 baubles then this will make it deal 4 dmg for 2 mana. Might be too risky, but and idea neverthless.
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
but i think splashing white is the perfect compliment to red. lightning helix is far better than incinerate especially in mirror matchups, and red gets access to disenchant. disenchant is the best method of removal against all of red's real threats which are of course artifacts and enchantments.
If you get it to work better than mono-red than use it, but I have never found overtaxing your land a solid idea. First of you need are giving a target for some cards like stifle or LD, you lose life just for doing it, you need to sac for blast, and you ar running three PoP which could hurt you as well (some games don't leave us much wiggle room to stay ahead in the life, sure you may get it back with helix, but again this is adding too much to chance), also if you are still going to try the splash route I would still replace the mancers and sparks. Also you may still have trouble with infinite combo and mutiple white threats that aren't very well addressed with your SB. Just some suggestions to mull over.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
Yeah, ankh is nice , but just a big target when you run no other targets.
Anyway ankh any other perms are just not any better than non-perm choices unless you run many more.
So you as Ive' been mentioning burn is not running top tier much, but i do feel it can be again. You can go the R/W weenie route (though I feel R/G is probably better), but that would be a whole different thread.
There are few cards that help put this deck in better company, see how it does if tried an piloted before feeling it can't fly. My list is largely the same, but the PoP's and forks are solid. I keep the risks to a minimum and the new cards in the SB are boosting the resolve more.
4 chain lightning
4 fireblast
4 incinerate
4 lava spike
4 magma jet
4 rift bolt
3 chain of plasma
2 mogg fanatic
2 fork
3 price of progress
2 flamebreak
2 barbarian ring
18 mountains
3 pyrostatic pillar
3 shattering spree
2 demonfire
3 tormod's crypt
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
Oh, and im updating my list.
Ankh is good against: MBC, Stax, Train Wreck, Dirt, Landstill, Treshold, Survival, 3-Color Zoo, Loam control and the Lands deck...
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
Yeah, ring is nice but also with fireblast I feel you need to run 18 mountains and 4 ring would just mess with that.
And yes ankh is a good card, but most of the mentioned decks will be able to deal with MD and most assuredly in the SB. Permanents are just to fragile when running burn. If you want to run many permanents and still have the direct damage mono-red deck it is probably possible, but it requires a lot of changes to these burn style lists.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
So according to that chain of logic, extra turns = good for this deck. Would Final Fortune therefore be a good idea?
"You're going to fight that?!"
"No...I'm going to kill that."
A GAME OF THRONES ON HBO!!!! AAAAAH~!!!!
Well, I think I get the gist of your analogy, though it just not that simple.
Which leads to say that final fortune is just not solid. If the situation is that you have three land and 2 or more cards in hand than it may be beneficial, but more often than not you don't have that situation, you have one card in hand and you just threw away a potential damage card to potentially win or lose on this turn - just not a smart gamble to rely on.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
possible mono-red creature burn deck :
4 magma jet
2 earthquake
2 flamebreak
4 reckless abandon
4 reckless charge
4 mogg fanatic
4 mogg maniac
3 spark elemental
3 cosmic larva
2 genju of the spires
1 lightning serpent
1 hunted dragon
2 barabarian ring
16 mountains
4 anarchy
4 pyrostatic pillar
4 shattering spree
3 glacial chasm
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
"I am in the arcane, and the arcane is in me."
Official Matron Mother of Clan Planar Chaos
Awesome Avatar and signature by DarkNightCavalier
Deraxas, Dark Maiden of Shimia,, still oddly obsessed with a mindmage.
17 Mountain
3 Barbarian Ring
4 Fireblast
4 Lavaspike
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Shock
4 Incinerate
4 Chain lightning
3 Chain of Plasma
2 Browbeat
3 Flamebreak
SB
3 Tormod's Crypt
4 Red Elemental Blast
3 Sirocco
2 Anarchy
3 Shattering Spree
I used this build (from a few pages back) in a Legacy Tourney and came 4th out of 18. I lost against affinity and tendrils (in knockout top 8). Any help? I was considering the pillars since there were like 3-4 goblin (:-/ ) decks. So umm... help please.
Where were you Bullbar?
Replace shock ! (and maybe browbeat)
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
3 browbeat
1 burning wish
4 chain lightning
3 fireblast
4 incinerate
4 lightning bolt
3 magma jet
3 rift bolt
1 cruicible of worlds
2 cursed scroll
3 ensnaring bridge
1 lotus petal
2 bloodstained mire
15 Mtn.
1 strip mine
1 wasteland
2 wooded foothills
1 Anarchy
1 breaking point
1 earthquake
1 echoing ruin
1 flamebreak
1 granulate
1 meltdown
1 overmaster
2 searing rays
1 wheel of fortune
1 ensnaring bridge
1 grafted skullcap
1 null rod
1 pithing needle
I'm going to be REALLY nice. For once. Seeing as this is your very first post on this site, I'm NOT going to give you an infraction. What I will do is let you know a few things.
1. Wheel of Fortune and Strip Mine are banned in Legacy. If you had read the rules I posted, you would have found a list that included those cards. Next time, please do so before you post a decklist.
2. It would also be nice if you included a few facts about your deck, as in why you chose certain things over others. Your build is decidedly NOT the norm for most Burn decks, and I am certain that others would like the input. Besides, in this particular subforum, it's required.
3. Deck-tags are much better than card tags- it streamlines everything. I have edited your post to include them.
4. Have a nice day.
I just wanted to mention that for deck you've had for FIVE YEARS it is not given much thought, and many cards are much newer than 5 years - like rift bolt, which means you have worked on this deck even now. So as the mod mentioned, please rethink this deck and feel free to post it once it's workable and tested.
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
If this deck isn't quite what some were thinking, then i dunno what to say.. but yes, i have recently updated it.. but this is the best i can do with what i know of magic.. its not realy five years, but just about there maybe 3-4 can't remember, since end of Madness era i made it, then got ideas, and changed my cards accordingly. i probably should update the deck to Legacy legal, then explain why i chose the cards like mod mentioned before.
1. Wheel of Fortune and Strip Mine are banned in Legacy. If you had read the rules I posted, you would have found a list that included those cards. Next time, please do so before you post a decklist.
-----if you could please, post a url or direct me to it. i read the top post or rules thread and that was all.
2. It would also be nice if you included a few facts about your deck, as in why you chose certain things over others. Your build is decidedly NOT the norm for most Burn decks, and I am certain that others would like the input. Besides, in this particular subforum, it's required.
-----just for my knowledge, what is in a normal burn deck? this deck i have built is with the best cards that i think should be in there using T1 rules, yet made for casual play.
3. Deck-tags are much better than card tags- it streamlines everything. I have edited your post to include them
-----thanks for that tip, i was wondering how to do that, and since i knew about the cards tag, i used them instead. do i just use [*cards][*/cards] to make the cards organized? if so i will use them for now on. thanks for anything/everything. sorry for any inconvienance.
Deck
3 Grim Lavamancer - use of cards in graveyard, and just helps add in damage.
3 browbeat - drawing is rare in red, and this is the best choice, since I either want to do damage, or get more cards, so a win-win situation.
4 chain lightning - (R) for 3 damage is good.
3 fireblast - use of useless mountains in mid to late game. also game winner.
4 incinerate - best (1)(R) for 3 damage card, only because it is an instant.
4 lightning bolt - (R) for 3 damage is great.
3 magma jet - helps throw in damage, also manipulates the library.
3 rift bolt - (R) for 3 is great, plus you can use this on creatures..
4 lava spike - 3 to the head..
4 sulfuric vortex - free damage every turn is good, plus it quickens the clock for both players.
1 cursed scroll - when your hand is near empty, and you need colorless damage to get through them COP: Reds or the simularity.
3 ensnaring bridge - control creatures, since you know by turn 3, you should have like 4 or less in your hand.
1 lotus petal - just mana accel.
18 Mtn. - need these to use this deck.
2 wasteland - same as above.
Sideboard
1 Anarchy - for the (W) decks that are made against us.
1 breaking point - creature kill, or points to the head.
1 earthquake - creature kill.
1 echoing ruin - artifact hate.
1 flamebreak - creature kill.
1 granulate - artifact hate.
1 meltdown - artifact hate.
1 overmaster - make sure the spell i want gets through. also nets you a card.
2 searing rays - could win you the game.
1 wheel of fortune - best card drawer in the game for (R).
1 ensnaring bridge - creature control.
1 grafted skullcap - combos with the bridge, also drawing enhancer.
1 null rod - screws over some mana accel, and other kinds of cards.
1 pithing needle - makes sure you get the card before the card gets you basically.
Well ,i've updated it. yea, there's not much update, but i did take out the more useless cards.
-1 strip - banned
-1 scroll - don't need too many of these... the activation cost is too much for the damage.
-4 fetch - waste of space.
-1 CoW - if i don't have the fetches, don't need this.
-1 Wish - i should already have what i need in my maindeck.
+4 lava spike - makes a total of 8 (possibly 12) turn 1 (R) 3 damage spells.
+1 Wasteland - most decks use nonbasic lands. good.
+3 Mtn. - more targets for the Fb.
i don't think there is any room for PoP unless i take out the rift bolts... i think that would be a good idea, since it could get countered and then the first turn is wasted. 2-3 PoP is best IMO.
Hiya Geek. I wasn't there as I'd had a really big party the previous nite, and already have everything that was offered as prizes anyway - much better if someone who needs them wins them IMHO.
Anyways...the deck.
Drop the Shocks, as mentioned. Just not hot enuff 4 burn. Another Flamebreak and some Price of Progress would take the cardslots in our meta.
Pyrostatic Pillars are good for burn sideboards on our meta, but not for the Gobbos matchup like you are thinking. Board them in for Salvager Game, and storm combo decks like IGGy pop.
Some other sideboard points....
Solidarity is v.v.rare in these parts, so I'd drop Sirrocco. REB and Pillar are fine for this matchup should it be encountered. I'd run at least 3 Anarchy as white enchantments are most of what stops Burn in these parts - COP:Red and Sol. Confinement etc. REB's are fine, but try to use 1/2 of them as Pyroblast, and the tech you are missing for Gobbos and the numerous other aggro deck we see so regularly could be Repercussion
3 Barb. Ring? How are U finding that?
Shattering Spree is OK, but is prime against Stax decks which have fallen from favour locally. Meltdown is heaps better vs Affinity, which is an OK matchup as it happens. The Repercussions are pretty good here too.
NEWSFLASH - a lack of non-basic land hate here means that the Rw version using Lightning Helix is pretty good. Sideboard gains some gems like Disenchant, and Honorable Passage tech for Burn mirrors and Goblin Piledriver. Check it out!
I don't advocate the burning bridge style deck, but if you want some more input on it go back to the first page of this thread and in the first couple posts there is decklist on this and link to more. Check it out and see what you think.
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”
*EDIT* - what would the RW burn build look like besides adding in Lightning Helix?
The main differece is the powerfull sideboard options you gain, white needs no introduction there.
4 chain lightning
4 fireblast
4 incinerate
4 lava spike
4 magma jet
4 rift bolt
4 chain of plasma
2 fork
2 flames of the blood hand
2 rolling earthquake
2 flamebreak
2 barbarian ring
18 mountains
3 pyrostatic pillar
4 shattering spree
4 glacial chasm
it's all good
thanks and enjoy
Tidbits of George Carlin :
“I like it when a flower or a little tuft of grass grows through a crack in the concrete. It's so f***in' heroic.”
"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist”