I agree with abrupt decay. Sometimes you lose coz you can't find the 2nd mana source to cast it. Which is why I still have claims and chains in my sideboard.
A single Surgical Extraction can do enough to beat you in the early game, but I agree, we fear other cards a lot more.
I also agree on Abrupt Decay. For me, it's not worth the risk of being unable to pay the mana for it because I don't sideboard any lands or Petals currently.
I agree. If they know what they're doing, a single Surgical Extraction is a massive blow and, with a decent pressure in play, is enough to get them the win. Surgical > Snap > Surgical is even more brutal. But that's a big "if" in my experience. It still depends on what cards they target.
I also agree on Abrupt Decay. For me, it's not worth the risk of being unable to pay the mana for it because I don't sideboard any lands or Petals currently.
Yeah I run Petals too.
I used to run a Dakmor Salvage (side) when I first started using AD. Simply, cos taxers like D&T are everywhere around me.
It's not ideal at all, I won't tell you guys it is, but I would consider popping 1 into my side should I run AD again.
A little off topic but I sure hope everyone here already has a playset of LED. The Eternal Masters announcement just triggered a buyout of legacy staples that are on the reserved list and LED is currently out of stock with around 50usd price spike according to TCG. I also hope they reprint dredge staple cards like Ichorid and Cabal Therapy in the set so that more people can build and try out Dredge decks.
I personally like the Abrupt Decay plan, when I ran nature's claims I found they often got forced, spell pierced or dazed. When running Abrupt Decay, at least if they aren't able to put a fast clock on me I can attempt to draw/cantrip to an answer. I suppose in a less blue saturated meta where your opponents have more wastelands than counterspells it'd be more reasonable to play a one mana answer. Though I must say my favorite way of fighting the hate is Cabal Therapy. Becoming acquainted with what hate is typically run by each archetype will help in giving you a slight edge in game 2.
Hey guys, been toying with Dredge for a while now, and the EMA announcement pushed me to buy a set of LEDs, so I guess I'll be playing Dredge for a while.
I have a question, what do you bring Faerie Macabre in against?
I personally prefer Ingot Chewer and Wispmare against counterspells and mana taxing. One really nice thing about AD though is that it can kill Containment Priest and friends!
Would you bring Macabre in against the mirror? How do we handle other dredge decks any ways? Is it just a race?
Personally, No. I would just bring in Elesh Norn and race in mirror matches. First one to go off wins so if I can't go off then I use Therapy (usually on Breakthrough) to stop them from going off.
RE: Abrupt Decay
In a meta where Leyline of the Void does not exist, Abrupt Decay is pretty much a catch all for all Dredge hate. Which makes the sideboard plan a lot easier. But if you're paranoid like me, ensuring you have answers to all forms of hate is the way to go. Especially when you are going into an unknown meta like a large tournamant.
So now that we've seen the list for Blessed Vs Cursed I'll be keeping a close eye on the new cards with Madness and Delirium. Who knows, we might get something fun printed for us instead of yet more graveyard hate.
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Against the mirror I bring in my favorite sideboard card of all time, Memory's Journey. I am a huge fan of this one because it works both to protect your own graveyard from removal (especially targeted removal like Surgical Extraction), and acts as targeted graveyard removal against your opponent. I know that I am a big fan of this card and others are not, but I have had many positive results with it. It defends you when you want it to, and it hates on your opponent's graveyard when you need it to.
@gibbousm, I wouldn't count on it Wouldn't that be nice, though?
Do you mean "like gurmag" as in all creatures with Delve? Either way, chances are that we cannot really use these creatures because they do not contribute much of anything to deck synergy. You want creatures that come back from the graveyard, like Ichorid, and contribute to the deck synergy, like Putrid Imp.
Ideally, this deck relies on its opening hand and, as much as possible, never draws from the library throughout the game. Delve creatures like Angler need to be in your opening hand if you want it to have an impact in a game if you're using it in a Dredge deck. Like Eretoryi said, reccuring creatures are the way to go. Or cards that do things in your graveyard.
I see a lot of lists running City of Brass over Mana Confluence. I'd like to assume this is just because of the cards the player has, but is there some other interaction I'm missing between paying life and taking damage?
The City of Brass damage comes from its triggered ability. This is relevant when you and your opponent are down to 1 life and can win with something like a firestorm for 1 by using City of Brass and have the City of Brass trigger on the stack when Firestorm resolves and you win the game. Most of the time, Mana Confluence is used over City of Brass because of Rishadan Port.
I've been thinking about getting into legacy and as I did some more research, dredge looks pretty fun I like that it's a synergistic deck. I've read through most of the primer, and watched some videos on how it's played. It seems like the primer is a little out of date? Is there a sort of "stock list" that I could look at building into? Personally, I'd rather not get LEDs...
Unfortunately the primer is significantly out of date and we have not been able to get control of the thread to post our new one yet.
There are some flexible slots in the maindeck, but it is generally agreed upon that LED Dredge is currently the most competitive form of the deck. If you would like to play something that doesn't require them you could always try Manaless Dredge, but I would say that standard Dredge is probably the stronger deck even without the LEDs. Here are some cards I would say never start playing Dredge without:
Of course, the LEDs would help immensely, I just can't justify that purchase right now (I know it won't be getting any better either lol)
I notice that the list you suggested doesn't have a flame-kin zealot or dragonlord, is that style going for the "one-shot" kill, whereas this list is more consistent/able to go longer? Also, as a poster previous to me was asking about city of brass vs mana confluence - any reason for one over the other?
Thanks for the help, I may lurk around here some more and hopefully you're able to get control of the primer to update it!
Eretoryi's list is only 56 cards and is the basic necessities for playing Dredge, granted you could pitch a card or two when tweaking your list. I've put my list below if it helps you any; it's the list that I currently run, with the sideboard tweaked for (hopefully) overall coverage of the metagame.
Roughly speaking, my list runs about $250 including sideboard. I've been told Mana Confluence and City of Brass are pretty much interchangeable, unless you run more copies of Firestorm in the sideboard than I do. In that case you'll want City over Confluence. Hope this helps.
City of Brass and Mana Confluence are interchangable but if you have a lot of Rishadan Ports in your meta, Mana Confluence would be better than City of Brass. The list that Eretoryi provided (just add a playset of Putrid Imps) is good for practice so that you won't rely on the one shot kill via FKZ/DK/Flayer too much. Experienced Dredge pilots can win without the dedicated DR targets. They are simply familiar with the various interactions with the deck and uses it to their advantage. LEDless lists aren't optimal but, at the very least, can still win games in the hands of an experienced pilot.
I use (faerie Macabre)it against reanimator/tin fins. A well timed activation can get you the match.
This. I also like it against the Mirror, bearing in mind I'm usually only using it to stop their first dredge and icky food thereafter.
I'd rather play LotV if I knew I was going to play the mirror, but that very rarely happens.
I prefer Faerie if it matters.
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I also agree on Abrupt Decay. For me, it's not worth the risk of being unable to pay the mana for it because I don't sideboard any lands or Petals currently.
Yeah I run Petals too.
I used to run a Dakmor Salvage (side) when I first started using AD. Simply, cos taxers like D&T are everywhere around me.
It's not ideal at all, I won't tell you guys it is, but I would consider popping 1 into my side should I run AD again.
I have a question, what do you bring Faerie Macabre in against?
RIP Karn EDH
RIP Karn EDH
RE: Abrupt Decay
In a meta where Leyline of the Void does not exist, Abrupt Decay is pretty much a catch all for all Dredge hate. Which makes the sideboard plan a lot easier. But if you're paranoid like me, ensuring you have answers to all forms of hate is the way to go. Especially when you are going into an unknown meta like a large tournamant.
-Anonymous
@gibbousm, I wouldn't count on it Wouldn't that be nice, though?
I've been thinking about getting into legacy and as I did some more research, dredge looks pretty fun I like that it's a synergistic deck. I've read through most of the primer, and watched some videos on how it's played. It seems like the primer is a little out of date? Is there a sort of "stock list" that I could look at building into? Personally, I'd rather not get LEDs...
There are some flexible slots in the maindeck, but it is generally agreed upon that LED Dredge is currently the most competitive form of the deck. If you would like to play something that doesn't require them you could always try Manaless Dredge, but I would say that standard Dredge is probably the stronger deck even without the LEDs. Here are some cards I would say never start playing Dredge without:
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Golgari Thug
4 Narcomoeba
4 Ichorid
2 Dread Return
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Faithless Looting
4 Breakthrough
4 Careful Study
2 City of Brass
4 Cephalid Coliseum
4 Gemstone Mine
Once you have a little experience then you are free to change up as much as you want, of course.
Of course, the LEDs would help immensely, I just can't justify that purchase right now (I know it won't be getting any better either lol)
I notice that the list you suggested doesn't have a flame-kin zealot or dragonlord, is that style going for the "one-shot" kill, whereas this list is more consistent/able to go longer? Also, as a poster previous to me was asking about city of brass vs mana confluence - any reason for one over the other?
Thanks for the help, I may lurk around here some more and hopefully you're able to get control of the primer to update it!
4 Cephalid Coliseum
4 Gemstone Mine
4 Mana Confluence
Creatures
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Ichorid
4 Narcomoeba
4 Putrid Imp
4 Stinkweed Imp
3 Golgari Thug
3 Tireless Tribe
1 Flame-Kin Zealot
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
4 Bridge from Below
Spells
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Careful Study
3 Breakthrough
3 Faithless Looting
2 Dread Return
3 Chain of Vapor
3 Nature's Claim
2 Echoing Truth
2 Pithing Needle
1 Ancestor's Chosen
1 Ashen Rider
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Firestorm
1 Terastodon
Roughly speaking, my list runs about $250 including sideboard. I've been told Mana Confluence and City of Brass are pretty much interchangeable, unless you run more copies of Firestorm in the sideboard than I do. In that case you'll want City over Confluence. Hope this helps.
This. I also like it against the Mirror, bearing in mind I'm usually only using it to stop their first dredge and icky food thereafter.
I'd rather play LotV if I knew I was going to play the mirror, but that very rarely happens.
I prefer Faerie if it matters.