Cabal_chan: Ad Nauseam Tendrils (ANT) is a :symu::symb: combo deck that gets its namesake from Ad Nauseam and Tendrils of Agony. The deck runs cantrips for consistency, rituals and artifacts for mana, discard for proactive protection, and tutors for Ad Nauseam, Ill-Gotten Gains, and Tendrils of Agony. Your goal? Build up a high enough storm count for a lethal Tendrils and win the game.
Having played TES somewhat, I can answer some questions pertaining to ANT.
The idea of the deck is to play a lethal Tendrils of Agony. Just cast X spells on the same turn before casting Tendrils, and you won. X is equal to half the life total of the opponent minus 1. So if the opponent is at 18, you’ll need to cast 8 spells and then Tendrils to kill him/her. The turn where you throw all those spells is called the combo turn; before (and/or during) your combo turn you'll use the cantrips package (Brainstorm, Ponder and Preordain) to sculpt your hand in order to ensure the win. Please note that all spells that your opponent casts on the combo turn will count towards the storm sum; use that in your advantage. Ways to play a lethal tendrils:
-> Ad Nauseam: Cast it, and draw a lot of cards. Then proceed to slaughter you oponent by casting the spells in your hand, which now should be huge. Be careful not to kill yourself with Ad Nauseam nor leave yourself in Brun range (for instance, ending Ad Nauseam at life against 4 is a bad idea in case they have Fireblast and 2 mountains in play). The idea is that once you have enough spells in hand to kill the opponent, stop revealing with Ad nauseam. Also remember that it’s an instant, so if you’re low on life you can cast it on your opponent’s end of turn and combo on your turn. To reliably win with this card you should be at 13+ life and have :suymub: floating (preferabily B) AND/OR with land drop available for the turn.
-> Ill-Gotten Gains: Whenever you cast this, you'll have a new hand of 3 cards. This lets you win on 1 life, provided you have the appropriate cards to make the loop. The loop: - Cast a bunch of fast mana (X spells) - Cast Ill-Gotten Gains (X+1 spells) - Cast the 3 cards you took back with IGG (X+4 spells)
So you see that you’ll usually need to cast 4-5 spells before IGG to win the game, not taking into account any Infernal Tutors. To make it more clear, I’ll make a loop example with Infernal Tutor: - Cast Dark Ritual (1 spell, BBB in pool) - Cast thresholded Cabal Ritual (2 spells, BBBBBB in pool) - Cast Lion’s eye Diamond (3 spells, BBBBBB in pool) - Cast Infernal Tutor, crack LED in response for black mana, search for a IGG (4 spells, BBBBBBB in pool) - Cast IGG, getting back Dark Ritual, LED and Infernal Tutor (5 spells, BBB in pool) - Cast Dark Ritual and LED (7 spells, BBBBB in pool) - Cast Infernal Tutor, crack LED in response for black mana, search for Infernal Tutor (8 spells, BBBBBB in pool) - Cast Infernal Tutor for Tendrils of Agony (9 spells, BBBB in pool) - Cast Tendrils of Agony (10 spells).
-> Infernal Tutor Chain: If you have a lot of mana, the opponent is low on life and you have an Infernal in hand, you may win easily. The idea is to generate a lot of mana, play a hellbent Infernal, search for another infernal, cast it searching for another infernal...and so on until you search for Tendrils of Agony and finish the opponent. The idea is that for each 1B spare when you're hellbent, you can get +1 storm.
When to use each route?
It depends This is a difficult deck to learn, and more difficult to master. Only practice will tell you which route is better against each matchup and state of the game. As a rule of thumb:
- The Ad Nauseam kill is the less reliable, though the easiest one as you get to see more cards. Sometimes you'll cast it on 8 life and win; sometimes you'll cast it on 20 life and kill yourself miserabily. To get the picture, AdN is VERY powerful but can sometimes backfire on you. it also needs a healty life total, so you're less likely to be able to use it against agressive decks.
- The IGG kill is the much more reliable, and if you make your counts right you're sure to kill the opponent. Note that you have to be careful with the loop as the opponent will be getting 3 cards as well. This makes you a bit soft to counterspells; however, you can still win through 1 counterspell if you have duress/thoughtseize in your hand/graveyard (you’ll only need more starting mana). The problems with IGG loops is that they’re vulnerable to graveyard hate. Keep in mind that. IGG is the best way to finish a non-blue aggro opponent.
- Infernal Chain kill is the most reliable way of killing the opp, because if you don't misscount and the opp doesn't have counters, she/he is dead. However, you'll need loads of mana, a full grip, and your opponent should have already lost some amount of life. When using this tactic you can bait counterspells from the opponent to boost your storm count.
To make matters more complicated, in some games you'll be using two or more of those routes on the same turn (or in different turns if something goes wrong). For example: If I Ad nauseam and find Infernal tutor + IGG but I don't have another way to empty my hand, I can use IGG to empty my hand and then take back the Infernal from the graveyard. Or if i have enough mana, I can end the IGG loop with an infernal tutor chain.
This may seem a bit complicated at first, and it is, but that's the real incentive to play the deck. Never throw up the towel. I have won plenty of games at 1 life.
Lands
Most builds play around 15-17 lands. It's important to play a lot of fetchlands (around 10) to maximize your cantrips and to make threshold for Cabal Ritual. Fetchlands should be blue based, because on the early game (turn 1 and 2) you want to be playing cantrips. As for the rest of the lands, some use Crystal Vein/City of Traitors (max 2 of them) to make the deck faster. I haven't tried that, as in my experience is better not having wastelandable lands, or at least keeping them to a minium. I play 2 underground sea and the rest are basics. One good thing this deck has over TES variants is a rock-solid manabase, not to loose random games to a well placed Wasteland or two. i usually only fetch a dual the combo turn OR if I know for sure my opponent isn't playing LD.
Cantrips
Brainstorm: The King of cantrips, especially when you play as much fetchlands as we do. Play them correctly and they’ll give you wins. Play 4.
Ponder + Preordain: They complement the cantrips package. They’ll filter your draws until you have the kill in your hand. Also, they help you to reach Threshold for the Cabal Rituals.
Having 12 cantrips on the deck is very important, as they give you incredible consistency. As general rule, use your Ponders and Preordains first, and save your Brainstorms for later. Note that there are synergies between the cantrips, use them well.
Defense
Duress and Thoughtseize: The deck’s main enemy are counterspells and anti-storm critters. Duress deals with the former and Thoughtseize is a catch-all, but at the cost of your oh-so-precious life (the main route to victory is Ad Nauseam, so each point of life counts). 4 Duress is a must, 2-4 Thoughtseize (usually with the rest on the side) is recommended. As note, if there are not a lot of Force of Wills on your meta, you could use Inquisition of Kozilek as a Thoughtseize replacement.
As a general rule, I usually play cantrips before discard. However, playing discard first is cool when you don't have a clue about what your opponent is playing, or when you know positively that your opponent plays a lot of counterspells.
Bombs
Tendrils of Agony: The kill card. Just cast X spells on the same turn before casting this, and you won. X is equal to half the life total of the opponent minus 1. So if the opponent is at 18, you’ll need to cast 8 spells and then Tendrils to kill him/her. Given its high cost and the abundance of tutors on the deck, you’ll only want 1 (2 max)
Infernal Tutor: Well, not exactly a bomb but searches for our bombs. You’ll need 4 no questions asked. The synergy with Lion’s Eye Diamond is the base of the deck, as it enables you to legally play with 4 Black Lotus and 4 Demonic Tutor. Extra Infernal tutors can be used to find extra disruption or fast mana.
Ad Nauseam: The easier way to win, but can be risky sometimes. Simply keep on revealing until you have the kill on hand. I play with 2 of them, some people use only 1. Note that if you play with 2 AdN, when you resolve one there’s only 1 card with cost 5 in the deck and 2 with cost 4.
Ill-Gotten Gains: Given its high cost and the abundance of tutors on the deck, you’ll only want 1.
Fast Mana
We use the best cards that give us an unfair boost in our mana for the combo turn. Those are:
Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual: They give a lot of black mana, that we need in the combo turn. The threshold requirement on Cabal Ritual is usually not a problem, as we play a lot of fetchlands and cantrips before the combo turn. Note that a thresholded Cabal Ritual gives us the same net mana as a LED. It is important to note that both cards are instants. You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked.
Lotus Petal: +1 storm +1 mana of any color for 0. It’s a good deal! This card is very important, especially after a blind Ad Nauseam (when you cast it without having mana floating). You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked.
Lion’s Eye Diamond: +1 storm +3 mana of any color for 0. You’ll always use its ability in response to spell being cast (usually Infernal Tutor). Note that emptying our hand is good as it makes Infernal tutor = Demonic Tutor. You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked; WITHOUT THIS CARD YOU CAN’T PLAY THIS DECK.
Chrome Mox: The ugly duck. Some lists play them, some don’t. In any case, you’ll play 2 of those at max. The only thing OK about this card, in my eyes, is that is an additional starting mana source after a blind Ad Nauseam. In extremely corner cases, though, it can also help you to get Hellbent by imprinting something on it.
Mox Diamond: Much reviled by the community in general, it's not a good idea to pack a lot of those. I use 1 in my build, as I HATE HATE Chrome Mox (and therefore I run 1 Diamond and 1 Chrome). Having a Diamond in my deck has saved me from pesky Ad Nauseams sometimes.
General concepts
This deck gives up a bit of raw power in order to stay very consistent and diminish the weaknesses of other storm decks. Those weakneses are:
- very fragile manabase: When playing other storm decks, a pair (or even a single) Wasteland can ruin your day. With this deck is highly unlikely, as you'll only run 1-3 nonbasic lands.
- less color requirements: This deck is UB. You need the U for the cantrips (1st to 3rd turn) and B on the combo turn and for the discard. The fact that you only need B to combo can be huge sometimes, other times may be negligible...thus, this deck is more reliable. And more importantly, it can combo through Contamination.
Let's discuss the splashes to see what we're missing:
R splash
Red gives access to:
-Burning Wish (plus the sideboard sorcery toolbox): BW is a powerful tool, as it is basically Infernal Tutor v.2. Additionally, it saves you from random Sadistic Sacrament effects; However, it doesn't help much in the IGG loop (as it exiles itself). I think that after testing, I prefer having 4 more cantrips (Preordain) and keep my stable manabase than having access to BW.
-Rite of Flame: We run Cabal Ritual in place of this. If you make the math, Rite is equal to an unthresholded Cabal, but you need 3 Rite to equal a thresholded Cabal. Given that Cabal makes black mana and both are susceptible to graveyard hate....I'll take Cabal. Oh, and it's an instant, so you can cast it in response to some taxing counterspell.
-Empty the Warrens: There is a card that can be very good or very bad depending on your meta. In creature metas, EtW isn't a good card; in blue metas is a good card. However, is a kill condition all around less reliable than Tendrils of Agony, so this one gets the nod.
-Red Elemental Blast/Pyroblast: To use those you need reliable access to red mana on the combo turn. Sounds bad, right? Yeah, I'd rather play discard effects, as I don't necessarily have to play them on the combo turn and I get to Peek at the opponent's hand.
W splash
White gives access to:
- Silence/Orim's chant: those are good cards, as they negate counterspells and spell based graveyard hate on the combo turn. They also can buy you a turn or two against creature/discard decks. However, I'd rather play discard for protection, because I get to see their hand and I don't necessarily have to play it on the combo turn. Also, splashing a color just for those cards is not worth it.
I have tried having a tendrils and igg main but because of the added consistency of the ad nauseum, I think its OK to just have them board. Some might disagree with my 2 pacts and only 1 chant main, and if you disagree, feel free to try the build with changing the pacts to chants.
The wish adds a lot to the deck, the most of which is that you can wish for a meltdown and kill chalices or what-have-you.
Also, I have tried and tried to see Angel's Grace "do its thing" and it just leaves me wanting more. With the build I listed above aggro shoudlnt get you low enough before you go off, and if its control-aggro (merfolk or something maybe) then you are probably more worried about the FOW and Daze and stifle than you are the low life. Not to mention that with the build I listed above, if you resolve an Ad Nauseum with 1 left in your deck there is only 1 card in the entire library which has a CC of more than 2.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Jeff
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
A lack of Tendrils and IGG main deck seems like a questionable decision. Meddling Mage naming Burning Wish would be rough.
The Ad Nauseam list I've been running resembles DD Fetchland Tendrils. The difference is that I have the Doomsday engine in the sideboard currently and Infernal Tutor in the main (essentially, the opposite of what emidln has set up). Here's the current list:
Ad Nauseam is used more opportunistically. If I see an immediate opening thanks to Duress/Chant, I can go for Ad Nauseam and not have to worry about resolving a Chant (to use IGG).
Spell Snare is a questionable choice (I may have to find room for a 4th copy too) but I'm experimenting with a 3 color mana base rather than 4-5, to support Pyroblast. Basically, I'm pre-boarding vs. blue based control.
I also may have to go up to 4 Infernal Tutors. My academic schedule (stupid physical chem..) has been eating up my time that could be used for more testing.
There is always bounce for a Meddling Mage. You would be siding in the bounce anyway if you thought they had mage. I tried the build both ways, when I used IGG and Tendrils main I cut a Chrome Mox and a Ponder, and I tried cutting two Ponders, and the build just wasn't as consistent as with them on your wishboard. Before I ran wishes I ran the standard BUW build and it wasn't as consistent either.
I haven't tried doomsday, though.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Jeff
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
I would just rather not have to deal with permanent-based hate if I don’t have to.
After many attempts to fuse Doomsday and Ad Nauseam together, I came to the conclusion that it works best in the traditional FT shell. Thus, I think it all works much more smoothly with 11-12 cantrips. If you’re not willing to go that route, you should probably just focus on IGG + AN.
As far as these more traditional ‘ANT’ builds go, I found the most success when running 4 Brainstorm, 4 Ponder, and 2 Ad Nauseam, often with a third in the sideboard. As for protection, I liked having 4 Duress + 4 Pyroblast in order to combat Counter-top. Pact of Negation gave me mixed results; I don’t think it should be run without numerous answers to Counterbalance (at least 4 Duress).
In those builds I tended to design them to push for the resolution of Ad Nauseam as quickly as possible. I tried to avoid too many 2cc spells (Spell Snare) and Stifle targets in addition to having multiple answers to FoW and Counterbalance. My goal was to nullify as much potential disruption as possible in the first few turns and resolve an Ad Nauseam. This is because the probability of the Dreadstill/Thresh beating you increases, progressively, as the game moves on (they have more cantrips and/or draw power, excluding ad nauseam). Brainstorm + Ponder helped considerably since you need ways of recovering from Stifle/Wasteland -- preventing Daze from becoming a hard counter, and to hit answers for Counterbalance.
I'll note that Orim's Chant does solve a lot of problems, allowing for an IGG loop vs. countermagic and the ability to ignore Spell Snare/Stifle. However, its inability to handle Counterbalance, and slight difficulty to resolve through FoW + Daze + manabase disruption, is what drove me to running Pyroblasts instead. I also tried 4-5 colors but then I found myself just running TES instead. Then again, I then returned to the list I provided above since I didn't care for the other issues not having Chant brought up.
I've been testing out a build with Ad Nauseam, Ill-Gotten Gains, and Doomsday, and it's been working out fine for me. A turn slower, but the added engine really makes up for it.
I've been testing out a build with Ad Nauseam, Ill-Gotten Gains, and Doomsday, and it's been working out fine for me. A turn slower, but the added engine really makes up for it.
Same here, all of them 3 are maindecked. Since no one posted a hybrid yet, I'm just going to do it:
This list has been rocking the ass off the combo mirror and is still able to do whatever combo likes to do with the rest of the format that doesn't run Counterbalance. First, I was skeptic about running lands in the sideboard, but since I had some free slots and the control match asked for extra lands, I just did it and it was fine enough.
I just wanna state a few things about this deck:
- Never play less than 8 protection (Duress/Pyroblast/Chant). This deck isn't as explosive as TES (which already runs 6), so it can't afford too few disruption. It doesn't slow the goldfish unless you are filling your ass with acceleration. Not counting bounce here, which should be carried as 1 or 2 -of maindeck.
- Doomsday is totally worth it. Gives you the versatility you need in the mid/late game, also because of the inclusion of Top. Playing this deck only for the early game is the worst mistake ever.
- As partially stated in the last point, Top > Ponder. Ponder is better until you get to turn 3. Once again, a well used Top almost won't slow the goldfish compared to Pondering.
- Angel's Grace is soooooooooo unecessary. I can see it being useful only against Pyrostatic Pillar.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I am a spammer, for I am a replier.
Storm Boards - We don't like to use the attack step.
- Doomsday is totally worth it. Gives you the versatility you need in the mid/late game, also because of the inclusion of Top. Playing this deck only for the early game is the worst mistake ever.
- As partially stated in the last point, Top > Ponder. Ponder is better until you get to turn 3. Once again, a well used Top almost won't slow the goldfish compared to Pondering.
- Angel's Grace is soooooooooo unecessary. I can see it being useful only against Pyrostatic Pillar.
I'm going to disagree with these three points. First, I played Doomsday in a dedicated deck way back when, and I can't see how its inclusion here would be of any great enough benefit to run it. I'll wait for it to show up in top4s before I test it out.
Ponder is fantastic. Not because of the looking at the top 3 cards part, but because of the shuffle effect and the fact that it's a spell to add to your storm count. Plus, it gives you quality of the top 3 just like the top, but can do something when the top 3 are lands.
Angel's Grace is good. It allows for more devastating Ad Nausea, does it through a Pyrostatic or what have you, and is great in the combo mirror, as when they try to storm off you can simply ruin their day with this, and win at your leisure.
Angel's Grace lets you do more devastating things? Like Ad Nauseum for more? Does it ever really fizzle? There has only been a few times I can remember out of the hundreds of games I've played with my TES/ANT deck you fizzle after resolving Ad Naus.
I only reason I would play it would be if there were a lot of pillars in the meta.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Jeff
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
My half finished primer is over here: http://www.teambzk.org/public/pld-primer.html It includes a section (actually two, one written in white background, the other in pink because I haven't determined which format I like better) that explains Doomsday piles. (For anyone interested, it is easier for me to edit things on my private webserver than it is using this forum software. I plan on reuploading it here one of these days, assuming I ever finish it.)
Doomsday generally requires about 5-6 mana, Doomsday, and a Draw Spell (the cost of which is included int he 5-6 mana) to win the game. It's actually a very similar requirement compared with Ad Nauseam when you realize that SDT counts as a draw spell (although it is technically 2 cards compared to 1, the DDay never fails and works at 2 life). The primer goes over at least 20 piles that can win with varying hands and circumstances. The most important (and most common) piles are at the top.
This would be the pile we'd be using, and I give full credit to emidln for his primer, I just thought I'd post it here for ease:
SDT/Brainstorm
LED
LED
IGG
Tendrils
I'm going to disagree with these three points. First, I played Doomsday in a dedicated deck way back when, and I can't see how its inclusion here would be of any great enough benefit to run it. I'll wait for it to show up in top4s before I test it out.
Ponder is fantastic. Not because of the looking at the top 3 cards part, but because of the shuffle effect and the fact that it's a spell to add to your storm count. Plus, it gives you quality of the top 3 just like the top, but can do something when the top 3 are lands.
Ponder is fantastic. Top is fantastic-er. In a Doomsdayless build, I'd play Ponder, but only because I would be aiming for a faster game, while sacrificing match value against (aggro-)control for sure.
Angel's Grace is good. It allows for more devastating Ad Nausea, does it through a Pyrostatic or what have you, and is great in the combo mirror, as when they try to storm off you can simply ruin their day with this, and win at your leisure.
Angel's Grace does nothing in the combo mirror, unless your opponent is killing you with Grapeshot or Goblins tokens. Read Tendrils and then Angel's Grace.
This would be the pile we'd be using, and I give full credit to emidln for his primer, I just thought I'd post it here for ease:
SDT/Brainstorm
LED
LED
IGG
Tendrils
Bam. 9 Storm then Tendrils FTW.
This is the 2nd most common pile. The one we use 80% of the time is this:
Angel's Grace does nothing in the combo mirror, unless your opponent is killing you with Grapeshot or Goblins tokens. Read Tendrils and then Angel's Grace.
Oh, eew. I guess my playtest group thought it was better than it was also. all of us thought that it was "if your life total would become less than 1, it becomes 1 instead". Whelp, that opens up some slots!
Works off Top (LED or Ritual both will do) or any other cantrip (Rituals only).
Except that only does half the job (storm 4+ tendrils), which could work but you kind of have no library. So unless doomsday was spell number five, you screwed yourself.
Except that only does half the job (storm 4+ tendrils), which could work but you kind of have no library. So unless doomsday was spell number five, you screwed yourself.
With top that pile provides 5 storm + Tendrils of Agony (hint, you recast SDT to draw into Tendrils). With Brainstorm it provides 5 Storm + Tendrils of Agony. With Ponder it provides 5 Storm + Tendrils of Agony. If you add in the Doomsday you've already played this turn, you'll notice that you already have 6 storm + tendrils. That means you're dealing 14 damage. Now, let's just go ahead and assume that you're not hardcasting Doomsday off only lands. Perhaps you've played a ritual effect, an artifact mana source, or maybe even a protection spell to get to your 2UBBB needed to pull this off with Top. Welcome to your lethal storm!
If you're assuming that you play Doomsday, go, perhaps you should reread my primer's section on piles one more time. The reason we go for the Meditate pile is that it ignores graveyard hate and doesn't require any extra cards in hand. It's also handy to know that if you can do better than 2U after your draw spell, (specifically 2 better), you can swap out a Lotus Petal for a 2nd SDT and ramp to extra storm for each extra mana you can come up with. This lets you, especially in a hybrid build with access to Cabal Rits and LEDs, ramp to obscene storm counts while at a low life total and without making yourself vulnerable to yard hate.
I think some versions run bounce also its more Chalice at 0 that would give us the biggest problems. (pact of negotiation nice too particularly if you are running angels grace)
Challice @ 1 is a nuisance, but most versions run bounce main as a way to dodge these kind of scenario's, if the Bounce is not in hand or on the top (SDT) you can play mystical in response and bounce the damn thing when you have the cards to combo off with, but try to Duress the buggers when you can
Also, if is is Staxx you are playing againsy, you can Chant them in their upkeep, since they dont play many instants(relevant ones) so it's basicly a timewalk
@ Emidln
Could you Post your current list?, i'm very interested in your version
This is my current list, i haven't taken the deck to a tournament yet, because i still think my skills are to rusty.
I know some choices seem odd, like the 1 off Chrome Mox, and Perish in my board.
The Mox acts like a extra Petal for comboing off and the Perish is to win time against the likes of Elfball and all the random Aggro that pops up, it's better than most bounce then + it kills Teeg and it's a must counter for Tresh because it kills Mongeese.
Edit: Emidln get out my Stronghold!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thanks to SpiderBoy4 @ High-Light Studio's for the awesome banner
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.” —Volrath
Chalice @ 1 is pretty bad game 1 if you are on the draw. It's really bad news, but you can always try to work your way around it, if it's not followed by a fast enough clock: Cabal Ritual, LED, Petal and Mox as acceleration, Infernal Tutor as your only tutor and whichever engine you wish. A singleton bounce won't do much, so your sideboard must be equipped to deal with both Chalice and Trinishpere: Serenity, Rushing River, Rebuild, Hurkyl's Recall (not recommended over Rebuild), Echoing Truth, Ancient Grudge (if R and G), Shattering Spree (if at least RR is reliable), whatevers.
Thresh's Mongoose is too slow to be something you have to worry about. Also, killing creatures is way off your game plan -- it won't help you win the game. For Gaddock, even Terror/Ghastly Demise/whatever is better than Perish, since it's always solo.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I am a spammer, for I am a replier.
Storm Boards - We don't like to use the attack step.
I'd rather have Helm/Grapeshot in there than Perish/Hurkyl's Recall.
Perish doesn't help against Meddling Mage, Runed Halo, and to a lesser extent, Ethersworn Canonist. This is where the alternate win via Grapeshot comes in handy. Jaiminho already sort-of covered the rest of the reasoning behind why Perish is bad.
and with so few lands, four colors is hard to manage- one thing you may notice immediately is the inclusion of Red Elemental Blast in the sideboard despite no lands which produce red. The solution? Lotus Petal and Chrome Mox. Chrome Mox pitching another REB, or Lotus Petal, which produces any color of mana.
I just thought I point out this fault in your primer, this is actually a completely inaccurate statement. James does not run REB at all. At this tournament James was late and didn't have time to properly build his sideboard, his older lists included Volcanic Island and Badlands in his mana base and REB in the side, so when he was regging his deck he still had his older sideboard despite his maindeck not containing red mana source outside of Petal and Mox. He neversided them in once because it is a waste of the usually vital petals and mox's.
A more accurate sideboard is as follows:
Yeah perish doesn't help win you the game and a runed halo against ANT should fail because the turn you go off and of course them naming tendrils on the halo you just tutor for echoing truth or chain of vapor or something runed halo should not hurt you much as well as true believe or cards that give shroud to themselves because of the bounciness in the deck.
I honestly think you should run 3 if not 4 chrome mox maindeck as it is a vital accelerator and does not die like petals do.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Yeah perish doesn't help win you the game and a runed halo against ANT should fail because the turn you go off and of course them naming tendrils on the halo you just tutor for echoing truth or chain of vapor or something runed halo should not hurt you much as well as true believe or cards that give shroud to themselves because of the bounciness in the deck.
I honestly think you should run 3 if not 4 chrome mox maindeck as it is a vital accelerator and does not die like petals do.
Assuming, of course, that you have sufficient life to risk casting Ad Nauseam, was able to draw enough (or the correct) cards to win and bounce the Halo, and there isn't a Meddling Mage chanting it.
Chrome Mox is pretty awful any time other than post-AN, and he runs 2 additional storm engines. While I'm not sure about 1 Chrome Mox in that specific list, I don't think he should be running any more than 2.
Edit: I should elaborate on the Runed Halo/Meddling Mage situation (I sort of misread the post --I'm dumb). Why spend more time and resources tutoring up answers to permanents when you can just win (Doomsday into Grapeshot kill)?
Assuming, of course, that you have sufficient life to risk casting Ad Nauseam, was able to draw enough (or the correct) cards to win and bounce the Halo, and there isn't a Meddling Mage chanting it.
Chrome Mox is pretty awful any time other than post-AN, and he runs 2 additional storm engines. While I'm not sure about 1 Chrome Mox in that specific list, I don't think he should be running any more than 2.
Lots of top 8 lists have run even 5 moxen total and you're saying that you shouldn't run more than 2 just makes no sense. Check deckcheck.net for ANT lists and you'll see plenty of moxen in the deck whereas no one has tried to use divining top while divining top seems good with mystical tutor it has little other uses in the deck other than filtering out land before you draw a card and drawing the card you tutored for.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Yeah, i agree with most thing people say around here, but i like Perish as an answer to Tresh, i still play UGR Tresh, and place top 8 in every tournament i enter with, and with ANT i always find myself midgame against them, there Perish really shines, because a bounce doesnt hurt them, but Perish is a must counter, it is basicly better than rushing river in this matchup(keep in mind that in Holland people don't play CounterBalance that often, since it is boring to play with or against).
If you play 4 chrome moxen, and the other accel, you are flooded to much of the time, i play 1 as a 5th petal after an AN, but even as that i think of cutting it and the third infernal tutor and a Top for 3 ponders, but im not sure on this though.
Also whe said anything about Halo being a Prob?, the damn thing is bouce able and helm + Grapeshot also kicks it in the Nutz.
Having played TES somewhat, I can answer some questions pertaining to ANT.
2 Ad Nauseam
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
Sorceries [22]
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Tendrils of Agony
4 Duress
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
4 Thoughtseize
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
Lands [16]
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Swamp
2 Crystal Vein
2 Flooded Strand
2 Island
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
4 Polluted Delta
1 Tropical Island
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
2 Echoing Truth
2 Hurkyl's Recall
3 Krosan Grip
1 Extirpate
4 Dark Confidant
1 Chain of Vapor
2 Ad Nauseam
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
Sorceries [20]
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Tendrils of Agony
2 Duress
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
4 Thoughtseize
2 Chrome Mox
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
Lands [15]
1 Swamp
2 Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Verdant Catacombs
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
3 Chain of Vapor
4 Doomsday
1 Dream's Grip
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Shelldock Isle
1 Tropical Island
4 Xantid Swarm
Primer by Lorgalis.
-> Ad Nauseam: Cast it, and draw a lot of cards. Then proceed to slaughter you oponent by casting the spells in your hand, which now should be huge. Be careful not to kill yourself with Ad Nauseam nor leave yourself in Brun range (for instance, ending Ad Nauseam at life against 4 is a bad idea in case they have Fireblast and 2 mountains in play). The idea is that once you have enough spells in hand to kill the opponent, stop revealing with Ad nauseam. Also remember that it’s an instant, so if you’re low on life you can cast it on your opponent’s end of turn and combo on your turn. To reliably win with this card you should be at 13+ life and have :suymub: floating (preferabily B) AND/OR with land drop available for the turn.
-> Ill-Gotten Gains: Whenever you cast this, you'll have a new hand of 3 cards. This lets you win on 1 life, provided you have the appropriate cards to make the loop. The loop:
- Cast a bunch of fast mana (X spells)
- Cast Ill-Gotten Gains (X+1 spells)
- Cast the 3 cards you took back with IGG (X+4 spells)
So you see that you’ll usually need to cast 4-5 spells before IGG to win the game, not taking into account any Infernal Tutors. To make it more clear, I’ll make a loop example with Infernal Tutor:
- Cast Dark Ritual (1 spell, BBB in pool)
- Cast thresholded Cabal Ritual (2 spells, BBBBBB in pool)
- Cast Lion’s eye Diamond (3 spells, BBBBBB in pool)
- Cast Infernal Tutor, crack LED in response for black mana, search for a IGG (4 spells, BBBBBBB in pool)
- Cast IGG, getting back Dark Ritual, LED and Infernal Tutor (5 spells, BBB in pool)
- Cast Dark Ritual and LED (7 spells, BBBBB in pool)
- Cast Infernal Tutor, crack LED in response for black mana, search for Infernal Tutor (8 spells, BBBBBB in pool)
- Cast Infernal Tutor for Tendrils of Agony (9 spells, BBBB in pool)
- Cast Tendrils of Agony (10 spells).
-> Infernal Tutor Chain: If you have a lot of mana, the opponent is low on life and you have an Infernal in hand, you may win easily. The idea is to generate a lot of mana, play a hellbent Infernal, search for another infernal, cast it searching for another infernal...and so on until you search for Tendrils of Agony and finish the opponent. The idea is that for each 1B spare when you're hellbent, you can get +1 storm.
When to use each route?
It depends This is a difficult deck to learn, and more difficult to master. Only practice will tell you which route is better against each matchup and state of the game. As a rule of thumb:
- The Ad Nauseam kill is the less reliable, though the easiest one as you get to see more cards. Sometimes you'll cast it on 8 life and win; sometimes you'll cast it on 20 life and kill yourself miserabily. To get the picture, AdN is VERY powerful but can sometimes backfire on you. it also needs a healty life total, so you're less likely to be able to use it against agressive decks.
- The IGG kill is the much more reliable, and if you make your counts right you're sure to kill the opponent. Note that you have to be careful with the loop as the opponent will be getting 3 cards as well. This makes you a bit soft to counterspells; however, you can still win through 1 counterspell if you have duress/thoughtseize in your hand/graveyard (you’ll only need more starting mana). The problems with IGG loops is that they’re vulnerable to graveyard hate. Keep in mind that. IGG is the best way to finish a non-blue aggro opponent.
- Infernal Chain kill is the most reliable way of killing the opp, because if you don't misscount and the opp doesn't have counters, she/he is dead. However, you'll need loads of mana, a full grip, and your opponent should have already lost some amount of life. When using this tactic you can bait counterspells from the opponent to boost your storm count.
To make matters more complicated, in some games you'll be using two or more of those routes on the same turn (or in different turns if something goes wrong). For example: If I Ad nauseam and find Infernal tutor + IGG but I don't have another way to empty my hand, I can use IGG to empty my hand and then take back the Infernal from the graveyard. Or if i have enough mana, I can end the IGG loop with an infernal tutor chain.
This may seem a bit complicated at first, and it is, but that's the real incentive to play the deck. Never throw up the towel. I have won plenty of games at 1 life.
Most builds play around 15-17 lands. It's important to play a lot of fetchlands (around 10) to maximize your cantrips and to make threshold for Cabal Ritual. Fetchlands should be blue based, because on the early game (turn 1 and 2) you want to be playing cantrips. As for the rest of the lands, some use Crystal Vein/City of Traitors (max 2 of them) to make the deck faster. I haven't tried that, as in my experience is better not having wastelandable lands, or at least keeping them to a minium. I play 2 underground sea and the rest are basics. One good thing this deck has over TES variants is a rock-solid manabase, not to loose random games to a well placed Wasteland or two. i usually only fetch a dual the combo turn OR if I know for sure my opponent isn't playing LD.
Cantrips
Brainstorm: The King of cantrips, especially when you play as much fetchlands as we do. Play them correctly and they’ll give you wins. Play 4.
Ponder + Preordain: They complement the cantrips package. They’ll filter your draws until you have the kill in your hand. Also, they help you to reach Threshold for the Cabal Rituals.
Having 12 cantrips on the deck is very important, as they give you incredible consistency. As general rule, use your Ponders and Preordains first, and save your Brainstorms for later. Note that there are synergies between the cantrips, use them well.
Defense
Duress and Thoughtseize: The deck’s main enemy are counterspells and anti-storm critters. Duress deals with the former and Thoughtseize is a catch-all, but at the cost of your oh-so-precious life (the main route to victory is Ad Nauseam, so each point of life counts). 4 Duress is a must, 2-4 Thoughtseize (usually with the rest on the side) is recommended. As note, if there are not a lot of Force of Wills on your meta, you could use Inquisition of Kozilek as a Thoughtseize replacement.
As a general rule, I usually play cantrips before discard. However, playing discard first is cool when you don't have a clue about what your opponent is playing, or when you know positively that your opponent plays a lot of counterspells.
Bombs
Tendrils of Agony: The kill card. Just cast X spells on the same turn before casting this, and you won. X is equal to half the life total of the opponent minus 1. So if the opponent is at 18, you’ll need to cast 8 spells and then Tendrils to kill him/her. Given its high cost and the abundance of tutors on the deck, you’ll only want 1 (2 max)
Infernal Tutor: Well, not exactly a bomb but searches for our bombs. You’ll need 4 no questions asked. The synergy with Lion’s Eye Diamond is the base of the deck, as it enables you to legally play with 4 Black Lotus and 4 Demonic Tutor. Extra Infernal tutors can be used to find extra disruption or fast mana.
Ad Nauseam: The easier way to win, but can be risky sometimes. Simply keep on revealing until you have the kill on hand. I play with 2 of them, some people use only 1. Note that if you play with 2 AdN, when you resolve one there’s only 1 card with cost 5 in the deck and 2 with cost 4.
Ill-Gotten Gains: Given its high cost and the abundance of tutors on the deck, you’ll only want 1.
Fast Mana
We use the best cards that give us an unfair boost in our mana for the combo turn. Those are:
Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual: They give a lot of black mana, that we need in the combo turn. The threshold requirement on Cabal Ritual is usually not a problem, as we play a lot of fetchlands and cantrips before the combo turn. Note that a thresholded Cabal Ritual gives us the same net mana as a LED. It is important to note that both cards are instants. You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked.
Lotus Petal: +1 storm +1 mana of any color for 0. It’s a good deal! This card is very important, especially after a blind Ad Nauseam (when you cast it without having mana floating). You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked.
Lion’s Eye Diamond: +1 storm +3 mana of any color for 0. You’ll always use its ability in response to spell being cast (usually Infernal Tutor). Note that emptying our hand is good as it makes Infernal tutor = Demonic Tutor. You’ll want 4 of each no questions asked; WITHOUT THIS CARD YOU CAN’T PLAY THIS DECK.
Chrome Mox: The ugly duck. Some lists play them, some don’t. In any case, you’ll play 2 of those at max. The only thing OK about this card, in my eyes, is that is an additional starting mana source after a blind Ad Nauseam. In extremely corner cases, though, it can also help you to get Hellbent by imprinting something on it.
Mox Diamond: Much reviled by the community in general, it's not a good idea to pack a lot of those. I use 1 in my build, as I HATE HATE Chrome Mox (and therefore I run 1 Diamond and 1 Chrome). Having a Diamond in my deck has saved me from pesky Ad Nauseams sometimes.
This deck gives up a bit of raw power in order to stay very consistent and diminish the weaknesses of other storm decks. Those weakneses are:
- very fragile manabase: When playing other storm decks, a pair (or even a single) Wasteland can ruin your day. With this deck is highly unlikely, as you'll only run 1-3 nonbasic lands.
- less color requirements: This deck is UB. You need the U for the cantrips (1st to 3rd turn) and B on the combo turn and for the discard. The fact that you only need B to combo can be huge sometimes, other times may be negligible...thus, this deck is more reliable. And more importantly, it can combo through Contamination.
Let's discuss the splashes to see what we're missing:
R splash
Red gives access to:
-Burning Wish (plus the sideboard sorcery toolbox): BW is a powerful tool, as it is basically Infernal Tutor v.2. Additionally, it saves you from random Sadistic Sacrament effects; However, it doesn't help much in the IGG loop (as it exiles itself). I think that after testing, I prefer having 4 more cantrips (Preordain) and keep my stable manabase than having access to BW.
-Rite of Flame: We run Cabal Ritual in place of this. If you make the math, Rite is equal to an unthresholded Cabal, but you need 3 Rite to equal a thresholded Cabal. Given that Cabal makes black mana and both are susceptible to graveyard hate....I'll take Cabal. Oh, and it's an instant, so you can cast it in response to some taxing counterspell.
-Empty the Warrens: There is a card that can be very good or very bad depending on your meta. In creature metas, EtW isn't a good card; in blue metas is a good card. However, is a kill condition all around less reliable than Tendrils of Agony, so this one gets the nod.
-Red Elemental Blast/Pyroblast: To use those you need reliable access to red mana on the combo turn. Sounds bad, right? Yeah, I'd rather play discard effects, as I don't necessarily have to play them on the combo turn and I get to Peek at the opponent's hand.
W splash
White gives access to:
- Silence/Orim's chant: those are good cards, as they negate counterspells and spell based graveyard hate on the combo turn. They also can buy you a turn or two against creature/discard decks. However, I'd rather play discard for protection, because I get to see their hand and I don't necessarily have to play it on the combo turn. Also, splashing a color just for those cards is not worth it.
Here is my build as of last Saturday:
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Underground Sea
2 City of Brass
4 Forbidden Orchard
4 Gemstone Mine
1 Swamp
mana:
2 Cabal Ritual
2 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Rite of Flame
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Mystical Tutor
business:
3 Burning Wish
2 Ad Nauseum
2 Infernal Tutor
protection:
4 Duress
1 Chain of Vapor
2 Orim's Chant
2 Pact of Negation
1 Infernal Tutor
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Grapeshot
2 Meltdown
1 Pyroclasm
2 Orim's Chant
1 Pact of Negation
1 Serenity
1 Rushing River
1 Echoing Truth
1 Wipe Away
I have tried having a tendrils and igg main but because of the added consistency of the ad nauseum, I think its OK to just have them board. Some might disagree with my 2 pacts and only 1 chant main, and if you disagree, feel free to try the build with changing the pacts to chants.
The wish adds a lot to the deck, the most of which is that you can wish for a meltdown and kill chalices or what-have-you.
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
The Ad Nauseam list I've been running resembles DD Fetchland Tendrils. The difference is that I have the Doomsday engine in the sideboard currently and Infernal Tutor in the main (essentially, the opposite of what emidln has set up). Here's the current list:
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
2 Underground Sea
1 Tundra
1 Scrubland
2 Island
1 Swamp
4 Duress
3 Orim’s Chant
3 Spell Snare
1 Wipe Away
Cantrips:
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Sensei’s Divining Top
4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Ritual
4 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
Buisness:
4 Mystical Tutor
3 Infernal Tutor
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Tendrils of Agony
Ad Nauseam is used more opportunistically. If I see an immediate opening thanks to Duress/Chant, I can go for Ad Nauseam and not have to worry about resolving a Chant (to use IGG).
Spell Snare is a questionable choice (I may have to find room for a 4th copy too) but I'm experimenting with a 3 color mana base rather than 4-5, to support Pyroblast. Basically, I'm pre-boarding vs. blue based control.
I also may have to go up to 4 Infernal Tutors. My academic schedule (stupid physical chem..) has been eating up my time that could be used for more testing.
I haven't tried doomsday, though.
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
After many attempts to fuse Doomsday and Ad Nauseam together, I came to the conclusion that it works best in the traditional FT shell. Thus, I think it all works much more smoothly with 11-12 cantrips. If you’re not willing to go that route, you should probably just focus on IGG + AN.
As far as these more traditional ‘ANT’ builds go, I found the most success when running 4 Brainstorm, 4 Ponder, and 2 Ad Nauseam, often with a third in the sideboard. As for protection, I liked having 4 Duress + 4 Pyroblast in order to combat Counter-top. Pact of Negation gave me mixed results; I don’t think it should be run without numerous answers to Counterbalance (at least 4 Duress).
In those builds I tended to design them to push for the resolution of Ad Nauseam as quickly as possible. I tried to avoid too many 2cc spells (Spell Snare) and Stifle targets in addition to having multiple answers to FoW and Counterbalance. My goal was to nullify as much potential disruption as possible in the first few turns and resolve an Ad Nauseam. This is because the probability of the Dreadstill/Thresh beating you increases, progressively, as the game moves on (they have more cantrips and/or draw power, excluding ad nauseam). Brainstorm + Ponder helped considerably since you need ways of recovering from Stifle/Wasteland -- preventing Daze from becoming a hard counter, and to hit answers for Counterbalance.
I'll note that Orim's Chant does solve a lot of problems, allowing for an IGG loop vs. countermagic and the ability to ignore Spell Snare/Stifle. However, its inability to handle Counterbalance, and slight difficulty to resolve through FoW + Daze + manabase disruption, is what drove me to running Pyroblasts instead. I also tried 4-5 colors but then I found myself just running TES instead. Then again, I then returned to the list I provided above since I didn't care for the other issues not having Chant brought up.
Same here, all of them 3 are maindecked. Since no one posted a hybrid yet, I'm just going to do it:
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
2 Underground Sea
1 Tundra
1 Scrubland
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Plains
Acceleration
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Ritual
1 Chrome Mox
4 Mystical Tutor
2 Infernal Tutor
Dig
4 Brainstorm
4 Sensei's Divining Top
Protection
4 Orim's Chant
4 Duress
1 Wipe Away
Win
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Doomsday
1 Meditate
2 Ad Nauseam
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Doomsday
1 Helm of Awakening
1 Grapeshot
1 Wipe Away
1 Echoing Truth
1 Rushing River
3 Serenity
1 Slaughter Pact
2 Pyroblast
1 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
This list has been rocking the ass off the combo mirror and is still able to do whatever combo likes to do with the rest of the format that doesn't run Counterbalance. First, I was skeptic about running lands in the sideboard, but since I had some free slots and the control match asked for extra lands, I just did it and it was fine enough.
I just wanna state a few things about this deck:
- Never play less than 8 protection (Duress/Pyroblast/Chant). This deck isn't as explosive as TES (which already runs 6), so it can't afford too few disruption. It doesn't slow the goldfish unless you are filling your ass with acceleration. Not counting bounce here, which should be carried as 1 or 2 -of maindeck.
- Doomsday is totally worth it. Gives you the versatility you need in the mid/late game, also because of the inclusion of Top. Playing this deck only for the early game is the worst mistake ever.
- As partially stated in the last point, Top > Ponder. Ponder is better until you get to turn 3. Once again, a well used Top almost won't slow the goldfish compared to Pondering.
- Angel's Grace is soooooooooo unecessary. I can see it being useful only against Pyrostatic Pillar.
Storm Boards - We don't like to use the attack step.
I'm going to disagree with these three points. First, I played Doomsday in a dedicated deck way back when, and I can't see how its inclusion here would be of any great enough benefit to run it. I'll wait for it to show up in top4s before I test it out.
Ponder is fantastic. Not because of the looking at the top 3 cards part, but because of the shuffle effect and the fact that it's a spell to add to your storm count. Plus, it gives you quality of the top 3 just like the top, but can do something when the top 3 are lands.
Angel's Grace is good. It allows for more devastating Ad Nausea, does it through a Pyrostatic or what have you, and is great in the combo mirror, as when they try to storm off you can simply ruin their day with this, and win at your leisure.
I only reason I would play it would be if there were a lot of pillars in the meta.
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
Currently playing
Legacy: Dredge, TES, SI variants
Doomsday generally requires about 5-6 mana, Doomsday, and a Draw Spell (the cost of which is included int he 5-6 mana) to win the game. It's actually a very similar requirement compared with Ad Nauseam when you realize that SDT counts as a draw spell (although it is technically 2 cards compared to 1, the DDay never fails and works at 2 life). The primer goes over at least 20 piles that can win with varying hands and circumstances. The most important (and most common) piles are at the top.
SDT/Brainstorm
LED
LED
IGG
Tendrils
Bam. 9 Storm then Tendrils FTW.
Here, a top 4.
Ponder is fantastic. Top is fantastic-er. In a Doomsdayless build, I'd play Ponder, but only because I would be aiming for a faster game, while sacrificing match value against (aggro-)control for sure.
Angel's Grace does nothing in the combo mirror, unless your opponent is killing you with Grapeshot or Goblins tokens. Read Tendrils and then Angel's Grace.
This is the 2nd most common pile. The one we use 80% of the time is this:
Meditate
LED/Dark Ritual
LED/Dark Ritual
Petal
Tendrils
Works off Top (LED or Ritual both will do) or any other cantrip (Rituals only).
Storm Boards - We don't like to use the attack step.
Huh, not bad... field of over 30. Time to begin testing.
Oh, eew. I guess my playtest group thought it was better than it was also. all of us thought that it was "if your life total would become less than 1, it becomes 1 instead". Whelp, that opens up some slots!
Except that only does half the job (storm 4+ tendrils), which could work but you kind of have no library. So unless doomsday was spell number five, you screwed yourself.
With top that pile provides 5 storm + Tendrils of Agony (hint, you recast SDT to draw into Tendrils). With Brainstorm it provides 5 Storm + Tendrils of Agony. With Ponder it provides 5 Storm + Tendrils of Agony. If you add in the Doomsday you've already played this turn, you'll notice that you already have 6 storm + tendrils. That means you're dealing 14 damage. Now, let's just go ahead and assume that you're not hardcasting Doomsday off only lands. Perhaps you've played a ritual effect, an artifact mana source, or maybe even a protection spell to get to your 2UBBB needed to pull this off with Top. Welcome to your lethal storm!
If you're assuming that you play Doomsday, go, perhaps you should reread my primer's section on piles one more time. The reason we go for the Meditate pile is that it ignores graveyard hate and doesn't require any extra cards in hand. It's also handy to know that if you can do better than 2U after your draw spell, (specifically 2 better), you can swap out a Lotus Petal for a 2nd SDT and ramp to extra storm for each extra mana you can come up with. This lets you, especially in a hybrid build with access to Cabal Rits and LEDs, ramp to obscene storm counts while at a low life total and without making yourself vulnerable to yard hate.
Also, if is is Staxx you are playing againsy, you can Chant them in their upkeep, since they dont play many instants(relevant ones) so it's basicly a timewalk
@ Emidln
Could you Post your current list?, i'm very interested in your version
This is my list ATM
1 [R] Scrubland
1 [R] Tundra
2 [US] Island
2 [R] Underground Sea
1 [US] Swamp
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
2 [TO] Cabal Ritual
4 [PS] Orim's Chant
2 [ALA] Ad Nauseam
4 [MM] Brainstorm
3 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
4 [MI] Mystical Tutor
1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
4 [TE] Dark Ritual
1 [MR] Chrome Mox
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
4 [ARE] Duress
1 [TSP] Wipe Away
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
1 [WL] Doomsday
1 [TE] Meditate
1 [US] Plains
1 [UL] Rebuild
1 [10E] Hurkyl's Recall
1 [FUT] Slaughter Pact
1 [DS] Echoing Truth
4 [WL] Serenity
1 [TE] Perish
1 [PS] Rushing River
4 [RAV] Dark Confidant
This is my current list, i haven't taken the deck to a tournament yet, because i still think my skills are to rusty.
I know some choices seem odd, like the 1 off Chrome Mox, and Perish in my board.
The Mox acts like a extra Petal for comboing off and the Perish is to win time against the likes of Elfball and all the random Aggro that pops up, it's better than most bounce then + it kills Teeg and it's a must counter for Tresh because it kills Mongeese.
Edit: Emidln get out my Stronghold!
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.”
—Volrath
@Volrath: Perish? Why's that?
EDIT: Nevermind, I just learned how to read.
Seems pretty unnecessary, though. Chant > Elf Ball.
Thresh's Mongoose is too slow to be something you have to worry about. Also, killing creatures is way off your game plan -- it won't help you win the game. For Gaddock, even Terror/Ghastly Demise/whatever is better than Perish, since it's always solo.
Storm Boards - We don't like to use the attack step.
I'd rather have Helm/Grapeshot in there than Perish/Hurkyl's Recall.
Perish doesn't help against Meddling Mage, Runed Halo, and to a lesser extent, Ethersworn Canonist. This is where the alternate win via Grapeshot comes in handy. Jaiminho already sort-of covered the rest of the reasoning behind why Perish is bad.
I just thought I point out this fault in your primer, this is actually a completely inaccurate statement. James does not run REB at all. At this tournament James was late and didn't have time to properly build his sideboard, his older lists included Volcanic Island and Badlands in his mana base and REB in the side, so when he was regging his deck he still had his older sideboard despite his maindeck not containing red mana source outside of Petal and Mox. He neversided them in once because it is a waste of the usually vital petals and mox's.
A more accurate sideboard is as follows:
C.I.#:5
I honestly think you should run 3 if not 4 chrome mox maindeck as it is a vital accelerator and does not die like petals do.
Currently Playing:
Retired
Assuming, of course, that you have sufficient life to risk casting Ad Nauseam, was able to draw enough (or the correct) cards to win and bounce the Halo, and there isn't a Meddling Mage chanting it.
Chrome Mox is pretty awful any time other than post-AN, and he runs 2 additional storm engines. While I'm not sure about 1 Chrome Mox in that specific list, I don't think he should be running any more than 2.
Edit: I should elaborate on the Runed Halo/Meddling Mage situation (I sort of misread the post --I'm dumb). Why spend more time and resources tutoring up answers to permanents when you can just win (Doomsday into Grapeshot kill)?
Lots of top 8 lists have run even 5 moxen total and you're saying that you shouldn't run more than 2 just makes no sense. Check deckcheck.net for ANT lists and you'll see plenty of moxen in the deck whereas no one has tried to use divining top while divining top seems good with mystical tutor it has little other uses in the deck other than filtering out land before you draw a card and drawing the card you tutored for.
Currently Playing:
Retired
If you play 4 chrome moxen, and the other accel, you are flooded to much of the time, i play 1 as a 5th petal after an AN, but even as that i think of cutting it and the third infernal tutor and a Top for 3 ponders, but im not sure on this though.
Also whe said anything about Halo being a Prob?, the damn thing is bouce able and helm + Grapeshot also kicks it in the Nutz.
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.”
—Volrath