Causal or legacy grinder? I'll remind them of tabernacle triggers. Competitive REL, I can always call a judge if they don't agree with me.
As for top, I like it, but it's a mana sink sometimes. It does save loam and helps with dredge decisions though. Without E-tutor though, I feel you're just digging for it or waiting to dredge, and then you have to academy ruins it.
If you guys want me to test anything, let me know! I try to make my weekly $5 legacies, and I have 80-90% of the cards played in lands. You can always PM if you don't wanna let your secret out.
you have no way of consistently getting that combination of cards out at the same time (as they are usually one of's) unless your running E-Tutor. I am not sure that's really what you want to be using your mana on, of instead port, loam, etc.
I have been playing Oracle for the last two weeks and its been really good when undisruped but I am staring to think Courser might be better.
If you guys want me to test anything, let me know! I try to make my weekly $5 legacies, and I have 80-90% of the cards played in lands. You can always PM if you don't wanna let your secret out.
I'm still looking forward to hearing the results of the Extraction-effect sideboard plan.
I've got an event this Sunday for which I'm staying close to the list I've been using all month. I'll give extractions a run after that.
EDIT: And I've always wanted to test Magus of the Tabernacle for unnecessary but maximum troll value vs creature decks.
If you guys want me to test anything, let me know! I try to make my weekly $5 legacies, and I have 80-90% of the cards played in lands. You can always PM if you don't wanna let your secret out.
I'm still looking forward to hearing the results of the Extraction-effect sideboard plan.
I've got an event this Sunday for which I'm staying close to the list I've been using all month. I'll give extractions a run after that.
EDIT: And I've always wanted to test Magus of the Tabernacle for unnecessary but maximum troll value vs creature decks.
It was lackluster. THe only time it came in handy was when I extracted Wastelands + DRS from maverick and gave them no outs to Maze of Ith and such.
Today was my first official tournament with Lands and an odd debut it was.
First of all, an event that typically has 30-40 people had just 11.
Three of those were Miracles, five others were shades of blue control, one U/R Delver, and one Elves. It was a far cry from the huge variety of decks I'm used to facing at the local shop or online.
Results
Rd. 1: vs BUG Jace Control w/ heavy Manlands and Loam 1-1-1 tie
Rd. 2: vs BUG Jace Control w/ Bitterblossom, DRS, Edric, Manlands 0-2 loss
Rd. 3: vs UWr Miracles 1-1-1 tie
Rd. 4: Bye
1W 2T 1L
The key issues on my end, besides some misplays, were clock management and mindset. In rd. 1 after winning a 30-min game 1, I fell behind quickly in g2, and scooped with 15 mins on the clock in order to maybe get through a game three (I was feeling okay about the matchup). In retrospect, I should have played out g2 to the end.
The Miracles matchup was against an experienced player and game 1 came down to whether I could resolve (recurring) EE through Counter-Top lock before Jace ticked up to ultimate. He had enough Force of Will and Counterspells as backup to stall just long enough. G3 ended in extra turns with Marit Lage swinging into a lone angel token chump blocker.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"That's right!" shouted Vroomfondel, "we demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!"
The Miracles matchup was against an experienced player and game 1 came down to whether I could resolve (recurring) EE through Counter-Top lock before Jace ticked up to ultimate. He had enough Force of Will and Counterspells as backup to stall just long enough. G3 ended in extra turns with Marit Lage swinging into a lone angel token chump blocker.
I don't know if Counterbalance was the issue there, but Explosives can get around it. If you use, say, four total mana to cast Explosives but it's all in two colors, you'll end up with a spell on the stack with CMC 4 (harder to match with their trigger) and then an Explosives with 2 counters to blow up Counterbalance.
The Miracles matchup was against an experienced player and game 1 came down to whether I could resolve (recurring) EE through Counter-Top lock before Jace ticked up to ultimate. He had enough Force of Will and Counterspells as backup to stall just long enough. G3 ended in extra turns with Marit Lage swinging into a lone angel token chump blocker.
I don't know if Counterbalance was the issue there, but Explosives can get around it. If you use, say, four total mana to cast Explosives but it's all in two colors, you'll end up with a spell on the stack with CMC 4 (harder to match with their trigger) and then an Explosives with 2 counters to blow up Counterbalance.
Thanks.
That's actually exactly what I was doing. (He hadn't seen that trick before.) I did try 4 the first time and I believe he had Jace on top. I tried several different ways but he had backup for Counterbalance in the form of Force, Counterspell, Brainstorm/fetch/Top, and eventually Vendillion. Mana was somewhat tight and I was using Academy Ruins and recasting on the same turn. Perhaps I could have waited a turn to have more mana available and tried to overload with spells in one turn -- resolve a Loam for Tolaria West-->Combo piece, and just go for it?
What are the best numbers for X to push an EE through vs Counterbalance?
On a separate note, I just Tabernacle Wrathed an elf deck and not by a missed trigger. Punishing Fire (Dryad Arbor), Loam + Exploration into Waste, Waste.
What better feeling is there?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"That's right!" shouted Vroomfondel, "we demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!"
It depends on the Miracles configuration, but 4 is probably the best.
2: 3-4 Counterbalance, 1-2 Counterspell, 1-3 Snapcaster Mage. Some older lists may have Rest In Peace (ick) or Wear//Tear
3: 2-3 Vendillion Clique, 0-2 Council's Judgment, 2-3 Entreat the Angels
4: 3 JtMS, 0-1 Supreme Verdict (usually not main, depends on meta I suppose)
5: 3-4 Force of Will
6: 3-4 Terminus
It depends on the Miracles configuration, but 4 is probably the best.
2: 3-4 Counterbalance, 1-2 Counterspell, 1-3 Snapcaster Mage. Some older lists may have Rest In Peace (ick) or Wear//Tear
3: 2-3 Vendillion Clique, 0-2 Council's Judgment, 2-3 Entreat the Angels
4: 3 JtMS, 0-1 Supreme Verdict (usually not main, depends on meta I suppose)
5: 3-4 Force of Will
6: 3-4 Terminus
I usually go for 4-6 if I can. 5 Is also fairly safe as they usually have force in-hand, and not floating on top.
On a separate note, I just Tabernacle Wrathed an elf deck and not by a missed trigger. Punishing Fire (Dryad Arbor), Loam + Exploration into Waste, Waste.
What better feeling is there? :grin:
At one of the last tournies I went to, I was playing against goblins. They go T1 Lackey. I play a Forest and Pass. He swings, I think for a bit, and crop rotate into a maze. He misses his land drop and plays a second lackey. I play tabernacle and pass, and he ends up missing lands for the next 2 turns and tabernacle crushes him.
I was getting a little bored with the average list so I juggled a few things and added some spice...
Boseiju, who shelters all is interesting to me so I added it for the counterbalance match-up.
That match-up usually annoys me so I don't mind giving up a sideboard slot.
I would assume that once you start casting Life from the Loam through a counterbalance lock, your opponent would have to go "aggro".
Against any burn deck, I also figured I could Chalice of the void at "1" and "2" to shut off Price of Progress and still cast Life from the Loam.
That was a long game and I eventually "decked" him after landing an ensnaring bridge.
Sensei's Divining Top is an absolutely amazing card for us.
I'm very noobish with this card since I've never actually used it before, but the triggers to draw or dredge after seeing the top three were very good.
Riftstone portal has been mentioned before but I lived the dream of first turn exploration, Mox Diamond and pitched the portal.
I then was able to tap my The Tabernacle at pendrell vale for "green"!
However, this card underperformed for me since I actually drew it (instead of dredging it) several times.
I even contemplated wasting my own portal but I never did see a blood moon...
Helm of Obedience is a niche sideboard card (any deck packing rest in peace) but I brought it in against "12 post" hoping to get an eldrazi.
I got a Primeval Titan instead but it was a blast to see my opponent sweat while the helm was churning cards.
I noticed that if you have Academy ruins in play then true hilarity will ensue.
Smokestack was a beast when i got it into play on a neutral or stalled board. Usually, we have access to more permanents than other decks.
After a few Wasteland activations and ticking the Smokestack up to two counters was enough to kill a True-name nemesis and force a concession.
Overall, I'm very happy with the spice I've added and currently do "well" at my LGS...
Played around with jaces in the deck during my legacy weekly... was pretty funny, but wasn't too useful as most of the time I had games locked up. Also tried smokestack but didn't see it very much tonight.
finally putting the finishing touches on lands, I tried to do a slight combination of RG and RUGx, I need to play test it more though, but wanted some advice in the mean time.
Why do you think that? is it just because gamble has the chance of discarding the chosen card and it isn't an instant? it just seems very useful, but I haven't tested the deck thoroughly enough to know yet.
Why do you think that? is it just because gamble has the chance of discarding the chosen card and it isn't an instant? it just seems very useful, but I haven't tested the deck thoroughly enough to know yet.
Crop Rotation gives you the instant speed which is very important, especially when comboing out. The only upside to gamble is that you can go grab Life from the Loam and possibly Exploration/Crucible if you have enough cards in hand to risk it.
Crop Rotation also gives you game against other decks game 1 like Dredge/Oops all spells/Belcher/Past in Flames storm variants, etc.
I'm play testing Tops, a Smokestack and Worm Harvest. Kicking it somewhat back to the old days. I have a love affair with Top in the deck. Stack and Harvest are just old favorites. I'll edit a list up in a few hours when it's not 4.06 am.
So I've been testing lands with 3 crop rotation and 3 intuition.
I find that it makes far less keepable hands, intuition is hard to use for things like exploration and manabond, but works great with life from the loam of course.
Gamble allows me to keep a number of hands as long as I get one.
But crop rotation is much better and game changing when I have a decent hand.
But the problem is you only really get the first few turns to draw into them, so I'm thinking, I must be missing a certain line of play. How do you know when to dredge and when to draw?
What hands do you keep in lands? I generally go with at least one accelerant, or a gamble, or a life from the loam/manabond/exploration and gamble.
with crop rotation I go with an accelerant and hope to hell I can draw a life from the loam or intuition in time for one.
I like gamble because it lets me save my intuitions and use them strategically, but still, it has the problem of no last minute land plays.
As for top, I like it, but it's a mana sink sometimes. It does save loam and helps with dredge decisions though. Without E-tutor though, I feel you're just digging for it or waiting to dredge, and then you have to academy ruins it.
If you guys want me to test anything, let me know! I try to make my weekly $5 legacies, and I have 80-90% of the cards played in lands. You can always PM if you don't wanna let your secret out.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
I have been playing Oracle for the last two weeks and its been really good when undisruped but I am staring to think Courser might be better.
I've got an event this Sunday for which I'm staying close to the list I've been using all month. I'll give extractions a run after that.
EDIT: And I've always wanted to test Magus of the Tabernacle for unnecessary but maximum troll value vs creature decks.
My 1994 Magic Cube
Japanese cards on eBay -- Legacy, Modern, EDH, Cube.
It was lackluster. THe only time it came in handy was when I extracted Wastelands + DRS from maverick and gave them no outs to Maze of Ith and such.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
3x Dark Confidant
3x Sphere of Resistance
2x Chalice of the Void
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Abrupt Decay
2x Krosan Grip
1x Ensnaring Bridge
We'll see how it goes.
EDIT: Just realized this is the same side sockosensei proposed like half a page up. Weird.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
First of all, an event that typically has 30-40 people had just 11.
Three of those were Miracles, five others were shades of blue control, one U/R Delver, and one Elves. It was a far cry from the huge variety of decks I'm used to facing at the local shop or online.
Results
Rd. 1: vs BUG Jace Control w/ heavy Manlands and Loam 1-1-1 tie
Rd. 2: vs BUG Jace Control w/ Bitterblossom, DRS, Edric, Manlands 0-2 loss
Rd. 3: vs UWr Miracles 1-1-1 tie
Rd. 4: Bye
1W 2T 1L
The key issues on my end, besides some misplays, were clock management and mindset. In rd. 1 after winning a 30-min game 1, I fell behind quickly in g2, and scooped with 15 mins on the clock in order to maybe get through a game three (I was feeling okay about the matchup). In retrospect, I should have played out g2 to the end.
The Miracles matchup was against an experienced player and game 1 came down to whether I could resolve (recurring) EE through Counter-Top lock before Jace ticked up to ultimate. He had enough Force of Will and Counterspells as backup to stall just long enough. G3 ended in extra turns with Marit Lage swinging into a lone angel token chump blocker.
My 1994 Magic Cube
Japanese cards on eBay -- Legacy, Modern, EDH, Cube.
https://fieldmarshalshandbook.wordpress.com/
RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats
I don't know if Counterbalance was the issue there, but Explosives can get around it. If you use, say, four total mana to cast Explosives but it's all in two colors, you'll end up with a spell on the stack with CMC 4 (harder to match with their trigger) and then an Explosives with 2 counters to blow up Counterbalance.
Thanks.
That's actually exactly what I was doing. (He hadn't seen that trick before.) I did try 4 the first time and I believe he had Jace on top. I tried several different ways but he had backup for Counterbalance in the form of Force, Counterspell, Brainstorm/fetch/Top, and eventually Vendillion. Mana was somewhat tight and I was using Academy Ruins and recasting on the same turn. Perhaps I could have waited a turn to have more mana available and tried to overload with spells in one turn -- resolve a Loam for Tolaria West-->Combo piece, and just go for it?
What are the best numbers for X to push an EE through vs Counterbalance?
On a separate note, I just Tabernacle Wrathed an elf deck and not by a missed trigger. Punishing Fire (Dryad Arbor), Loam + Exploration into Waste, Waste.
What better feeling is there?
My 1994 Magic Cube
Japanese cards on eBay -- Legacy, Modern, EDH, Cube.
2: 3-4 Counterbalance, 1-2 Counterspell, 1-3 Snapcaster Mage. Some older lists may have Rest In Peace (ick) or Wear//Tear
3: 2-3 Vendillion Clique, 0-2 Council's Judgment, 2-3 Entreat the Angels
4: 3 JtMS, 0-1 Supreme Verdict (usually not main, depends on meta I suppose)
5: 3-4 Force of Will
6: 3-4 Terminus
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=339129
I usually go for 4-6 if I can. 5 Is also fairly safe as they usually have force in-hand, and not floating on top.
At one of the last tournies I went to, I was playing against goblins. They go T1 Lackey. I play a Forest and Pass. He swings, I think for a bit, and crop rotate into a maze. He misses his land drop and plays a second lackey. I play tabernacle and pass, and he ends up missing lands for the next 2 turns and tabernacle crushes him.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
Big Thanks to Xeno for sig art <3.
Boseiju, who shelters all is interesting to me so I added it for the counterbalance match-up.
That match-up usually annoys me so I don't mind giving up a sideboard slot.
I would assume that once you start casting Life from the Loam through a counterbalance lock, your opponent would have to go "aggro".
Against any burn deck, I also figured I could Chalice of the void at "1" and "2" to shut off Price of Progress and still cast Life from the Loam.
That was a long game and I eventually "decked" him after landing an ensnaring bridge.
Sensei's Divining Top is an absolutely amazing card for us.
I'm very noobish with this card since I've never actually used it before, but the triggers to draw or dredge after seeing the top three were very good.
Riftstone portal has been mentioned before but I lived the dream of first turn exploration, Mox Diamond and pitched the portal.
I then was able to tap my The Tabernacle at pendrell vale for "green"!
However, this card underperformed for me since I actually drew it (instead of dredging it) several times.
I even contemplated wasting my own portal but I never did see a blood moon...
Helm of Obedience is a niche sideboard card (any deck packing rest in peace) but I brought it in against "12 post" hoping to get an eldrazi.
I got a Primeval Titan instead but it was a blast to see my opponent sweat while the helm was churning cards.
I noticed that if you have Academy ruins in play then true hilarity will ensue.
Smokestack was a beast when i got it into play on a neutral or stalled board. Usually, we have access to more permanents than other decks.
After a few Wasteland activations and ticking the Smokestack up to two counters was enough to kill a True-name nemesis and force a concession.
Overall, I'm very happy with the spice I've added and currently do "well" at my LGS...
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=339129
CthulhuMarit Lage.WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
1 ensnaring bridge
1 crucible of worlds
4 exploration
3 intuition
2 gamble
3 crop rotation
4 life from the loam
3 punishing fire
4 mox diamond
3 grove of the burnwillows
2 thespian's stage
3 maze of ith
3 tropical island
4 rishadan port
1 misty rainforest
1 windswept heath
1 verdant catacombs
1 wooded foothills
4 wasteland
2 tolaria west
1 taiga
1 academy ruins
1 dark depths
1 glacial chasm
1 bayou
1 ghost quarter
1 the tabernacle at pendrell vale
1 forest
2 krosan grip
2 abrupt decay
1 karakas
1 bojuka bog
1 zuran orb
4 chalice of the void
As for my list, I'm currently at 0 Tranquil Thickets now. I think it's one of the weakest cards in the deck. I replaced mine with a Creeping Tar Pit.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
Crop Rotation gives you the instant speed which is very important, especially when comboing out. The only upside to gamble is that you can go grab Life from the Loam and possibly Exploration/Crucible if you have enough cards in hand to risk it.
Crop Rotation also gives you game against other decks game 1 like Dredge/Oops all spells/Belcher/Past in Flames storm variants, etc.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
Big Thanks to Xeno for sig art <3.
I find that it makes far less keepable hands, intuition is hard to use for things like exploration and manabond, but works great with life from the loam of course.
Gamble allows me to keep a number of hands as long as I get one.
But crop rotation is much better and game changing when I have a decent hand.
But the problem is you only really get the first few turns to draw into them, so I'm thinking, I must be missing a certain line of play. How do you know when to dredge and when to draw?
What hands do you keep in lands? I generally go with at least one accelerant, or a gamble, or a life from the loam/manabond/exploration and gamble.
with crop rotation I go with an accelerant and hope to hell I can draw a life from the loam or intuition in time for one.
I like gamble because it lets me save my intuitions and use them strategically, but still, it has the problem of no last minute land plays.