4 pages of decks. Don't know why the deck pane on the right is different from the coverage archive. The mothership is the official website for magic, your ignorance is totally pardoned.
The Kurt Spiess list in my opinion lets you be more one-dimensional and more efficient. The Intuitions and like are fine and good, but cutting blue can definitely be worth it in a number of matchups. I play a list very similar to the Spiess Combo list and find that I have to realistically only resolve Punishing Fire if I need to, nearly every other counterspell my opponent draws is dead, as long as I'm patient enough to wait for shields to go down to resolve my Crop Rotation and beat their brains out. Sure, cards like Swords to Plowshares exist that beat Marit Lage, but that's why I play Chalice of the Void in the SB, and they'll usually be so cut off of mana that Plowing my Lage only buys them one turn.
Been out of the Legacy scene for a while due to lack of interest in my local meta, but our store's been bought out by a larger store and there's a push for Legacy events so I'm making another push at finishing my Lands deck! Thought I'd check in to see what you guys have been changing up with the deck post Khans if anything.
I have to think Treasure Cruise has become a possibility with how large our graveyards get quickly. Possibly Dig Through Time is a better option for our deck though as we tend to need specific answers in matchups.
Why would you put in TC when Loam already lets you draw 3 cards a turn?
I used this same argument with a friend last week when he told me, quite adamantly, that Treasure Cruise should be in my Lands deck.
The only things I would be okay with exiling to Cruise are things I couldn't normally get back with Loam or Academy Ruins. Which in the average build is what, 16 cards?
I finished building the deck a couple weeks ago (the build in Sparki's sig) and finally got to take it for a spin yesterday. I ended up going 3-1 at our local event playing 12 post twice (1-1) and UR delver. It was a lot of fun, and I saw a bunch of obvious misplays that I made through the evening. I did encounter a play that I wasn't sure if it was correct or not and was hoping for more input. The end result didn't matter as I won the game anyway, but here we go:
Game 3 vs delver I had two chalices in my opener but no loam. I ended up playing both on 1 and eventually drawing into the loam and loaming into the combo, but I had to play pretty conservative holding back wastes to save myself if he were to try and double price me. Was the better play to put a chalice on two and force me to naturally draw into the combo?
People suggest Treasure Cruise because they don't know better. These same people make assumptions or theroycraft about what is good or bad based of there limited knowledge base on this deck. The reality is most people who play legacy causally will never have the interest or the opportunity to play this deck. They don't know how fragile it can be, how complicated it is, or how all the pieces interact.
There is a large list of better cards then treasure cruse in this deck, Intuition, Gamble, hell even fact or fiction, Mulch (old school) are better then T Cruise.
People suggest Treasure Cruise because they don't know better. These same people make assumptions or theroycraft about what is good or bad based of there limited knowledge base on this deck. The reality is most people who play legacy causally will never have the interest or the opportunity to play this deck. They don't know how fragile it can be, how complicated it is, or how all the pieces interact.
There is a large list of better cards then treasure cruse in this deck, Intuition, Gamble, hell even fact or fiction, Mulch (old school) are better then T Cruise.
You don't want to go super oldschool and play Mulch?
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
People suggest Treasure Cruise because they don't know better. These same people make assumptions or theroycraft about what is good or bad based of there limited knowledge base on this deck. The reality is most people who play legacy causally will never have the interest or the opportunity to play this deck. They don't know how fragile it can be, how complicated it is, or how all the pieces interact.
There is a large list of better cards then treasure cruse in this deck, Intuition, Gamble, hell even fact or fiction, Mulch (old school) are better then T Cruise.
You don't want to go super oldschool and play Mulch?
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
People suggest Treasure Cruise because they don't know better. These same people make assumptions or theroycraft about what is good or bad based of there limited knowledge base on this deck. The reality is most people who play legacy causally will never have the interest or the opportunity to play this deck. They don't know how fragile it can be, how complicated it is, or how all the pieces interact.
There is a large list of better cards then treasure cruse in this deck, Intuition, Gamble, hell even fact or fiction, Mulch (old school) are better then T Cruise.
You don't want to go super oldschool and play Mulch?
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
I mentioned mulch LOL - Love that card
While I do feel that the community is growing, its small and will always be small. There is also a lot of people that have put this deck down. The price barrier does keep people from playing it, there are other factors like how repetitive it is, its soft combo matchup, the lure of Brainstorm, etc. Its a specialists deck, much like storm.
I finished building the deck a couple weeks ago (the build in Sparki's sig) and finally got to take it for a spin yesterday. I ended up going 3-1 at our local event playing 12 post twice (1-1) and UR delver. It was a lot of fun, and I saw a bunch of obvious misplays that I made through the evening. I did encounter a play that I wasn't sure if it was correct or not and was hoping for more input. The end result didn't matter as I won the game anyway, but here we go:
Game 3 vs delver I had two chalices in my opener but no loam. I ended up playing both on 1 and eventually drawing into the loam and loaming into the combo, but I had to play pretty conservative holding back wastes to save myself if he were to try and double price me. Was the better play to put a chalice on two and force me to naturally draw into the combo?
I am going to assume its UR delver your talking about because of Price, but the generic answer is that it depends:
Against UR or RUG delver I would drop the COTV on 2 knowing full well that I can easily combo them out as they can now locked out of the game. I also bring in K-Grip or Abrupt Decay in this matchup for things like Blood Moon or Sulfuric Vortex
Against UWR or BUG I would drop another COTV on 1. UWR has True-name at the three casting cost slot which doesn't make a COTV on 2 very good as it locks you out of the game more then them. BUG can just Decay your COTV so if you have a COTV on 2 they just destroy the COTV on 1 basically locking you out of the game with your own COTV on 2. It better to be redundant in these matchups
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
I've been on the verge of building the deck for a few months now. I've got one Tabernacle, three Ports, and everything else I need. I've been reading up on lists and how to play the deck and whatnot. I just haven't got around to playing it for reals yet, largely because I can't make up my mind which version to put together. Also because I don't get to play Legacy often and it's kind of my third-string deck.
Game 3 vs delver I had two chalices in my opener but no loam. I ended up playing both on 1 and eventually drawing into the loam and loaming into the combo, but I had to play pretty conservative holding back wastes to save myself if he were to try and double price me. Was the better play to put a chalice on two and force me to naturally draw into the combo?
Having played a different Chalice deck, I would personally put one on two counters. Delver-style decks fully expect a Chalice on one after board, so their answers will almost always be two-cost artifact destruction like Smash to Smithereens or Ancient Grudge. By having a Chalice on both one and two counters, you lock them out of all answers unless they're running the much-less-common Shattering Spree or Ingot Chewer.
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
I can honestly say that it's the price of Tabernacle that caused me not to get this deck together sooner. Luckily I wanted to play the deck at GPNJ so I traded a bunch of cards to get one on Friday. Although that meant I didn't really have too much time to play the deck and the gauntlet my friend and I had set up was not what I faced at all.
Match 1 I played burn and won handily due to Zuran Orb and the same thing happened game 2, both without a mulligan. Although not knowing what I was playing against game 1 I almost shipped the zuran orb hand back except it had exploration, mox diamond, life from the loam, and a 3 lands (1 a Thespian's Stage).
Match 2 I played MUD, in fact it was the MUD player who took 7th. I basically wasteland locked him both games, very early on. Game one due to Crucible of Worlds and game 2 due to Life from the loam.
Match 3 I played BUG Food chain and lost to him going off game 1 and the 2nd game he extracted my loams and Punishing Fire.
Match 4 I played against a Jund list with main deck Deathrite Shaman and more importantly main deck Scavenging Ooze. Which is basically how I lost both of those games.
Match 5 I played against a BUG list that also had Deathrite but I was able to wasteland lock him and get a The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale and he conceded. The second game I had the turn 4 Marit Lage for the win.
Match 6 I played against UWR Stoneblade, and had 3 games of back and forth and eventually came to a point where I had to gamble for an engineered explosives to land on zero in order to be able to hit with the marit lage and win. Zero would have wiped his flipped Delver of Secrets and his Germ token on the Batterskull. Unfortunately the gamble pitched the card I needed and I lost. Although out of all the loses, that was the most fun as my opponent was having a good time and wasn't all serious like my other opponents I lost to.
Match 7 I played a friend of mine who was on D&T and I lost the first game, the only game, because I wanted to have a safe path to create my token and swing in but I couldn't find the right moment and I waited too long. This showed me just how inexperienced I am with the deck and should have just made him have an answer at instant speed.
Match 8 I played a Dredge player who I drew an early Bojuka Bog Zuran Orb and Crucible of Worlds for game 1 and game 2 he managed to beat me down with his Ichorid and Nether Shadow. Game 3 I got an early Marit Lage and that's all she wrote.
Match 9 I played another MUD deck and wasteland locked this player out also.
So all in all, considering it's my first event with the deck I think I did fairly well at 5-4.
Congrats on the finish! So I have been interested in the Crucible idea for awhile now, how did it work for you? Did you draw it? Dig for it? Did you MD Academy Ruins?
Congrats on the finish! So I have been interested in the Crucible idea for awhile now, how did it work for you? Did you draw it? Dig for it? Did you MD Academy Ruins?
I ended up drawing into it more often than not but having the academy backup was always a nice feeling, in addition to the Explosives being reusable also.
crucible was amazing as a 5th life from the loam and it allowed me to just draw cards for a few turns while still recurring wastelands. This was especially useful when I needed an exploration to get even further ahead.
While I agree lands is pretty expensive, the deck is only around $2300 (R/G anyway), and for anyone rushing to play U/R delver they need $1000 just for the 4 Volcanic Islands...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
So two Opalescence and a Humility walk into a bar, I forget the rest of the joke but your sanctioned judge is a scrub.
While I agree lands is pretty expensive, the deck is only around $2300 (R/G anyway), and for anyone rushing to play U/R delver they need $1000 just for the 4 Volcanic Islands...
With Tabernacle it's not just the price tag.
Tabernacle has to be paid for all at once. Other cheaper staples can be acquired one at a time.
The card goes in very few decks. Unless somebody is seriously devoted to Lands, they want to spend money on cards which can go into other decks (besides Pox and Stax).
Tabernacles are scarce compared to revised duals, Goyfs, FoWs, etc. There was roughly as many Tabernacles printed as there where Unlmited Black Lotuses! If you want a Tabernacle, you have to shell out and probably order on line. Revised duals can be more easilly traded for and/or subsidised with store credit won at weekly events.
If you buy a Taberrnacle and change your mind, it's hard to find somebody who wants one who has $700+ of traders which you actually want. Harder still to find a cash buyer.
Lots of players already have other staples from Modern or EDH, or other Legacy decks. Old school Legacy players bought duals, wastelands, Fows, etc for $15-$30. Most of them didn't bother shelling out $100+ for obscure Legends rares.
Basically, tracking down a Tabernacle is difficult and committal compared to building other decks.
Basically, tracking down a Tabernacle is difficult and committal compared to building other decks.
I can see this wonderful mental image where a bunch of Lands players like us are gathered around a campfire swapping stories about our quests to find our Tabernacles.
Speaking of which, I'm starting to get tired of explaining to people what my Italian one does. Maybe it's time to put it on eBay and upgrade to a nice English one. >_>
I got mine (some play) for about $195.00 two summers ago. Just in time I guess.
It's funny, by the next winter U.Seas had gone up to about $180, while Tabernacle has stagnated. I was still a long way from finishing the deck, and I had been wondering if I should have bought a couple duals instead. No regrets now!
I can see this wonderful mental image where a bunch of Lands players like us are gathered around a campfire swapping stories about our quests to find our Tabernacles.
Speaking of which, I'm starting to get tired of explaining to people what my Italian one does. Maybe it's time to put it on eBay and upgrade to a nice English one. >_>
To be fair though, you have to explain what the English one does also. I'm afraid my story lacks any difficulty really, I just picked mine up from an SCG event after trading in a bunch of cards for credit.
I was told recently I don't have to remind opponents about the upkeep trigger on their creatures and it feel a bit shady not reminding them of the cost.
I got my Pizza Tabernacle for about 220 in early 2013. A fine price now, but I remember there being an English Tabernacle sold 3 days before for 10 dollars more
I remember not wanting to shell out $60.00 for a Unlimited Tundra/Underground Sea. It makes me wonder if duals are actually gaining value or adjusting for inflation like everything else.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
So two Opalescence and a Humility walk into a bar, I forget the rest of the joke but your sanctioned judge is a scrub.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
4 pages of decks. Don't know why the deck pane on the right is different from the coverage archive. The mothership is the official website for magic, your ignorance is totally pardoned.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
I have to think Treasure Cruise has become a possibility with how large our graveyards get quickly. Possibly Dig Through Time is a better option for our deck though as we tend to need specific answers in matchups.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive-modern/598381-kiki-chord-kiki-company
Bring to Niv
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/814060-bring-to-niv-the-golden-deck
Legacy - Lands
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/legacy-type-1-5/established-legacy/control/535484-primer-lands
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
I used this same argument with a friend last week when he told me, quite adamantly, that Treasure Cruise should be in my Lands deck.
The only things I would be okay with exiling to Cruise are things I couldn't normally get back with Loam or Academy Ruins. Which in the average build is what, 16 cards?
Game 3 vs delver I had two chalices in my opener but no loam. I ended up playing both on 1 and eventually drawing into the loam and loaming into the combo, but I had to play pretty conservative holding back wastes to save myself if he were to try and double price me. Was the better play to put a chalice on two and force me to naturally draw into the combo?
There is a large list of better cards then treasure cruse in this deck, Intuition, Gamble, hell even fact or fiction, Mulch (old school) are better then T Cruise.
You don't want to go super oldschool and play Mulch?
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
You don't want to go super oldschool and play Mulch?
I think there's a slow, growing interest in this deck, but as usual, the price barrier keeps people away from trying to get into playing it. There's only so many tabernacles to go around.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
I mentioned mulch LOL - Love that card
While I do feel that the community is growing, its small and will always be small. There is also a lot of people that have put this deck down. The price barrier does keep people from playing it, there are other factors like how repetitive it is, its soft combo matchup, the lure of Brainstorm, etc. Its a specialists deck, much like storm.
I am going to assume its UR delver your talking about because of Price, but the generic answer is that it depends:
Against UR or RUG delver I would drop the COTV on 2 knowing full well that I can easily combo them out as they can now locked out of the game. I also bring in K-Grip or Abrupt Decay in this matchup for things like Blood Moon or Sulfuric Vortex
Against UWR or BUG I would drop another COTV on 1. UWR has True-name at the three casting cost slot which doesn't make a COTV on 2 very good as it locks you out of the game more then them. BUG can just Decay your COTV so if you have a COTV on 2 they just destroy the COTV on 1 basically locking you out of the game with your own COTV on 2. It better to be redundant in these matchups
I've been on the verge of building the deck for a few months now. I've got one Tabernacle, three Ports, and everything else I need. I've been reading up on lists and how to play the deck and whatnot. I just haven't got around to playing it for reals yet, largely because I can't make up my mind which version to put together. Also because I don't get to play Legacy often and it's kind of my third-string deck.
Having played a different Chalice deck, I would personally put one on two counters. Delver-style decks fully expect a Chalice on one after board, so their answers will almost always be two-cost artifact destruction like Smash to Smithereens or Ancient Grudge. By having a Chalice on both one and two counters, you lock them out of all answers unless they're running the much-less-common Shattering Spree or Ingot Chewer.
I can honestly say that it's the price of Tabernacle that caused me not to get this deck together sooner. Luckily I wanted to play the deck at GPNJ so I traded a bunch of cards to get one on Friday. Although that meant I didn't really have too much time to play the deck and the gauntlet my friend and I had set up was not what I faced at all.
For those interested, I mashed the RUG and RG lists together, opting for no intuitions but wanting Academy Ruins, Zuran Orb and 2 Engineered explosives in the main along with a Nephalia Drownyard in the side.
Match 1 I played burn and won handily due to Zuran Orb and the same thing happened game 2, both without a mulligan. Although not knowing what I was playing against game 1 I almost shipped the zuran orb hand back except it had exploration, mox diamond, life from the loam, and a 3 lands (1 a Thespian's Stage).
Match 2 I played MUD, in fact it was the MUD player who took 7th. I basically wasteland locked him both games, very early on. Game one due to Crucible of Worlds and game 2 due to Life from the loam.
Match 3 I played BUG Food chain and lost to him going off game 1 and the 2nd game he extracted my loams and Punishing Fire.
Match 4 I played against a Jund list with main deck Deathrite Shaman and more importantly main deck Scavenging Ooze. Which is basically how I lost both of those games.
Match 5 I played against a BUG list that also had Deathrite but I was able to wasteland lock him and get a The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale and he conceded. The second game I had the turn 4 Marit Lage for the win.
Match 6 I played against UWR Stoneblade, and had 3 games of back and forth and eventually came to a point where I had to gamble for an engineered explosives to land on zero in order to be able to hit with the marit lage and win. Zero would have wiped his flipped Delver of Secrets and his Germ token on the Batterskull. Unfortunately the gamble pitched the card I needed and I lost. Although out of all the loses, that was the most fun as my opponent was having a good time and wasn't all serious like my other opponents I lost to.
Match 7 I played a friend of mine who was on D&T and I lost the first game, the only game, because I wanted to have a safe path to create my token and swing in but I couldn't find the right moment and I waited too long. This showed me just how inexperienced I am with the deck and should have just made him have an answer at instant speed.
Match 8 I played a Dredge player who I drew an early Bojuka Bog Zuran Orb and Crucible of Worlds for game 1 and game 2 he managed to beat me down with his Ichorid and Nether Shadow. Game 3 I got an early Marit Lage and that's all she wrote.
Match 9 I played another MUD deck and wasteland locked this player out also.
So all in all, considering it's my first event with the deck I think I did fairly well at 5-4.
UWR MiraclesUWR
Veteran WalkerBUG
Lands RUG
Karn
I ended up drawing into it more often than not but having the academy backup was always a nice feeling, in addition to the Explosives being reusable also.
crucible was amazing as a 5th life from the loam and it allowed me to just draw cards for a few turns while still recurring wastelands. This was especially useful when I needed an exploration to get even further ahead.
My Decklist
1 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Glacial Chasm
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Maze of Ith
3 Rishadan Port
2 Taiga
3 Thespian's Stage
3 Tranquil Thicket
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Misty Rainforest
4 Wasteland
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
2 Dark Depths
1 Tropical Island
1 Academy Ruins
1 Karakas
1 Bayou
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Barbarian Ring
4 Mox Diamond
4 Exploration
3 Crop Rotation
3 Punishing Fire
3 Gamble
4 Life from the Loam
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Zuran Orb
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Sphere of Resistance
2 Krosan Grip
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Slaughter Games
1 Notion Thief
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Ray of Revelation
UWR MiraclesUWR
Veteran WalkerBUG
Lands RUG
Karn
With Tabernacle it's not just the price tag.
Basically, tracking down a Tabernacle is difficult and committal compared to building other decks.
https://fieldmarshalshandbook.wordpress.com/
RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats
I can see this wonderful mental image where a bunch of Lands players like us are gathered around a campfire swapping stories about our quests to find our Tabernacles.
Speaking of which, I'm starting to get tired of explaining to people what my Italian one does. Maybe it's time to put it on eBay and upgrade to a nice English one. >_>
It's funny, by the next winter U.Seas had gone up to about $180, while Tabernacle has stagnated. I was still a long way from finishing the deck, and I had been wondering if I should have bought a couple duals instead. No regrets now!
https://fieldmarshalshandbook.wordpress.com/
RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats
To be fair though, you have to explain what the English one does also. I'm afraid my story lacks any difficulty really, I just picked mine up from an SCG event after trading in a bunch of cards for credit.
I was told recently I don't have to remind opponents about the upkeep trigger on their creatures and it feel a bit shady not reminding them of the cost.
UWR MiraclesUWR
Veteran WalkerBUG
Lands RUG
Karn
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=339129
UWR MiraclesUWR
Veteran WalkerBUG
Lands RUG
Karn