This deck just won an SCG Legacy Open and is not getting that much love. I think we need a new thread with a primer. This is deck is UR Delver not U/r/(x) Snapcaster.
This deck just won an SCG Legacy Open and is not getting that much love. I think we need a new thread with a primer. This is deck is UR Delver not U/r/(x) Snapcaster.
the reason for the deck name and lack of a primer is this is what the community has been asking for. the deck name was NOT chosen by me (I had originally named the deck UR control burn). as for a primer update, I can write a primer for the deck but every time I update the primer, people complain about what has been added/excluded. if you would be willing to help in the construction of a new primer I would love to get it updated. the problem is that everyone who offers to help with the primer either has 0 clue as to how to play the deck or ends up not helping.
I was wondering how U/R Delver compares to Canadian Threshold overall? I'm having a good time with Delver in modern/standard and am currently trying to build a legacy with that type of tempo style of play
Mongoose is really a HUGE problem I think. You can't get rid of that little beast.
Is there ANYTHING we can do against it? Except racing it, of course. I would really appreciate some sideboard suggestions please.
Try Hibernation? It's the only card i can think of that can bounce nimble mongoose and tarmogoyf when you are going for lethal next turn, the 3cc is heavy for us though.
At my last three tournaments, I went second, first and third today. Really like the performance of this deck.
I was playing twice against Tempo Tresh today, won 2-1 and lost 1-2 (he was at 2 life at the third match, so it was really close). I think this match-up is slightly against us, because Nimble Mongoose is really a HUGE problem I think. You can't get rid of that little beast.
Is there ANYTHING we can do against it? Except racing it, of course. I would really appreciate some sideboard suggestions please.
firespout
i know it sounds horrible for us (and thats cause it really hurts....) but the thing is we can just kill them with burn or reestablish
firespout kills 3/4ths of their creatures (assuming creature heavy builds)
they really have a hard time coming back from a resolved one
@achamian: presuming we are talking about mass wipe across all boards in dealing with RUG thresh then slagstorm can hit their nimble mongoose and flip delver all at once.
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Mono color Rules!
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
@Achamian: if there is a majority of RUG player on your meta then Blood moon is good SB, it shuts off their mana source totally provided it got in. I recommended hibernation in my previous post because I have Maverick, Enchantress, RUG, and Show&Tell/Progenitus back in my mind because thats my meta here.
I'm running 4 Surgical Extractions and I don't really see why they'd be any better than Tormod's Crypt in this deck. Is there some matchup I'm missing?
I'm running 4 Surgical Extractions and I don't really see why they'd be any better than Tormod's Crypt in this deck. Is there some matchup I'm missing?
I believed you covered the majority of the match ups. A balanced list!
Running almost the same list as yours except -1 island, -1 misty rainforest, -1 snapcaster Mage, +1 force of will, +2 spell pierce and my sb list is this
I piloted this deck for the first time this weekend (at the gp) and u have to say I was impressed. I went 6-2-1 and barely missed day 2 (went to time on my last round. I had him dead on extra turn six...so close)
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Current Decks
Standard BEtched Champion/InfectB WSoilders/knightsW WUVenser SplicerWU RRDWR GFeed the Pack comboG WUPool of ExhaustionWU
EDH GEzuri, Elf OverrunG BGeth, GraverobberB UThada Adel, ThiefU RUrabrask, Big RedR WElesh Norn, CrusadeW WUGAngus Makenzie, Bant ControlWUG
I played a small tournament this past weekend. I don't remember a lot of the details but here is a brief tournament report:
Burn - Figure of Destiny messed me up. The deck is just too fast and consistent to handle.
match 0-2
record 0-1
MUD - Beat his face and countered his threats or burned metalworker.
match 2-0
record 1-1
Death and Taxes - Outraced him game 1. Rishadan Port and Aether Vial killed me game 2. Force of Will on his Vial shut him out of game 3.
match 2-1
record 2-1
ANT - He went off turn 2 and killed me game 1. Once I knew what he was playing I mulliganed appropriately, countered a few key cards and didn't even play Pyrostatic Pillar but won anyways. Ad Nauseam can be a tough situation for them when burn is involved.
match 2-1
record 4-1
Top 8:
Maverick - Very tight games. Only a savior Spell Snare on Jitte (he got greedy instead of waiting to vial it in with Mystic) and a Price when he attacked with his Knight saved me, barely.
match 2-1
record 5-1 - going to top 4!
High Tide - I had never played against this deck before. I sided out my soft counters (that he could always pay for) hoping to just counter a key spell later after he had exhausted some resources but probably should have left them all in and focused on countering the initial High Tide. Flusterstorm just blew me out both games. This deck sucks to play against. It kills you as a combo deck but doesn't have the courtesy to do it quickly. Seeing 3 Candelabra's down on the other side of the table after 3 high tides have been played is depressing. I might have been able to win if I knew how to sideboard but it was my first time playing UR Tempo in a tournament and my first time playing against high tide. I also was unaware that High Tide doubles or triples MY islands too. He crushed Enchantress in the finals.
match 0-2
record 5-2
Overall I was happy but felt like I was wanting to draw more burn to finish my opponent off more quickly in the matches I lost. Other than the Aether Vial I think Force was underwhelming. Spell Pierce was the star counter. I hardly played Snapcaster and he was never a majorly helpful play. I have been testing my new deck without Force and Snapcaster and with more burn and so far I am quite happy. I can still usually slow down fast combo (Storm, Reanimator) enough to finish them and my aggro and slower/counter-heavy combo decks (such as High Tide and sometimes Hive Mind) match-ups should improve as my increased speed has a better chance to kill them before they go off. I haven't played any dredge decks yet.
I'm cosidering dropping 3 grim because he underperforms most of the time. and put unstable mutation instead for more aggro pressure. What do you think?
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Mono Black Control
I know that everyone hates this question, but is Force of Will 100% necessary for this deck? I've noticed that a couple lists posted in this thread have 0 main deck, so I'm wondering if this is practical or budgetary. I'm trying a build with 4 Daze, 3 Spell Snare, and 2 Spell Pierce, as well as the usual burn and creature suites.
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MTGO: Stillenacht288
Modern:
Footsteps Hulk
Ascendency Combo
Restore Balance
Ad Nauseam
EDH:
Ghave Lands
Narset Combo
I'm cosidering dropping 3 grim because he underperforms most of the time. and put unstable mutation instead for more aggro pressure. What do you think?
I've considered it, but I haven't found a suitable replacement. I pulled one for Serendib effreet. It's nice to be able to block opposing delvers or attack into them. But the 3cc I eventually dropped it.
I dropped force of will from my build. I side them out in almost all match ups. I've replaced them with seering blaze. My logic is that I am in a creature heavy meta and rather 2 for 1ing myself, I rather 2 for one them and get advantage taking out blockers and doing 3 to the face.
It also gives another reason to hold lands in your hand after the first 3 land drops. Which increases your bluff ability.
I think that Snapcaster is not for a UR deck, unless you focus more on control. Other way will happen that you will lose for not have a burn spell in hand.
TRAMD's current list is really the closest list from what I imagine to play in UR for Legacy.
I think that Snapcaster is not for a UR deck, unless you focus more on control. Other way will happen that you will lose for not have a burn spell in hand.
TRAMD's current list is really the closest list from what I imagine to play in UR for Legacy.
And I really think that FoW is not necessary, cause the UR version have to focus on kill fast as monoR with some answers the monoR dont have, just this.
Plus FoW makes the deck more accessible to players who don't want to drop the $$$ on it. It's always nice to see a competitive deck that isn't an oppressive cost. The Volcanics are a bit rough, but I guess one could get away with Steam Vents if they had to. Hopefully the game will be over before the loss of live becomes an issue.
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| U Merfolk | UR Delver Burn| B Reanimator| B Landless Dredge |
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Sword of feast and famine FAIL responses
"How can we make a future if we don't try our hardest?"
-Monkey D. Luffy
Playing:
Modern:
BGR JUND RGB
Legacy:
URU/R Delver RU
the reason for the deck name and lack of a primer is this is what the community has been asking for. the deck name was NOT chosen by me (I had originally named the deck UR control burn). as for a primer update, I can write a primer for the deck but every time I update the primer, people complain about what has been added/excluded. if you would be willing to help in the construction of a new primer I would love to get it updated. the problem is that everyone who offers to help with the primer either has 0 clue as to how to play the deck or ends up not helping.
Try Hibernation? It's the only card i can think of that can bounce nimble mongoose and tarmogoyf when you are going for lethal next turn, the 3cc is heavy for us though.
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
firespout
i know it sounds horrible for us (and thats cause it really hurts....) but the thing is we can just kill them with burn or reestablish
firespout kills 3/4ths of their creatures (assuming creature heavy builds)
they really have a hard time coming back from a resolved one
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
Here's my current list
4x Misty Rainforest
3x Arid Mesa
2x Mountain
3x Island
4x Volcanic Island
4x Scalding Tarn
Spells
4x Brainstorm
4x Chain Lightning
2x Daze
3x Force of Will
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Ponder
2x Price of Progress
1x Spell Pierce
2x Spell Snare
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Goblin Guide
4x Snapcaster Mage
3x Grim Lavamancer
2x Blue Elemental Blast
1x Force of Will
2x Price of Progress
2x Red Elemental Blast
2x Smash to Smithereens
2x Submerge
4x Surgical Extraction
I believed you covered the majority of the match ups. A balanced list!
Running almost the same list as yours except -1 island, -1 misty rainforest, -1 snapcaster Mage, +1 force of will, +2 spell pierce and my sb list is this
3 pyrostatic pillar
1 price of progress
2 hibernation
2 red elemental blast
4 surgical extraction
3 smash to smithereens
I'm testing hibernation for the time being because of the enchantress match up and for maverick match up.
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
BEtched Champion/InfectB
WSoilders/knightsW
WUVenser SplicerWU
RRDWR
GFeed the Pack comboG
WUPool of ExhaustionWU
EDH
GEzuri, Elf OverrunG
BGeth, GraverobberB
UThada Adel, ThiefU
RUrabrask, Big RedR
WElesh Norn, CrusadeW
WUGAngus Makenzie, Bant ControlWUG
Extended
WGElvesWG
Legacy
RGoblinsR
UBGFariesUBG
UBGRaffinityUBG
Burn - Figure of Destiny messed me up. The deck is just too fast and consistent to handle.
match 0-2
record 0-1
MUD - Beat his face and countered his threats or burned metalworker.
match 2-0
record 1-1
Death and Taxes - Outraced him game 1. Rishadan Port and Aether Vial killed me game 2. Force of Will on his Vial shut him out of game 3.
match 2-1
record 2-1
Affinity - Tight games. I probably only won because I won the roll game 1. Burn Vault Skirge and ride Price of Progress and Shattering Spree to the win.
match 2-1
record 3-1
ANT - He went off turn 2 and killed me game 1. Once I knew what he was playing I mulliganed appropriately, countered a few key cards and didn't even play Pyrostatic Pillar but won anyways. Ad Nauseam can be a tough situation for them when burn is involved.
match 2-1
record 4-1
Top 8:
Maverick - Very tight games. Only a savior Spell Snare on Jitte (he got greedy instead of waiting to vial it in with Mystic) and a Price when he attacked with his Knight saved me, barely.
match 2-1
record 5-1 - going to top 4!
High Tide - I had never played against this deck before. I sided out my soft counters (that he could always pay for) hoping to just counter a key spell later after he had exhausted some resources but probably should have left them all in and focused on countering the initial High Tide. Flusterstorm just blew me out both games. This deck sucks to play against. It kills you as a combo deck but doesn't have the courtesy to do it quickly. Seeing 3 Candelabra's down on the other side of the table after 3 high tides have been played is depressing. I might have been able to win if I knew how to sideboard but it was my first time playing UR Tempo in a tournament and my first time playing against high tide. I also was unaware that High Tide doubles or triples MY islands too. He crushed Enchantress in the finals.
match 0-2
record 5-2
Overall I was happy but felt like I was wanting to draw more burn to finish my opponent off more quickly in the matches I lost. Other than the Aether Vial I think Force was underwhelming. Spell Pierce was the star counter. I hardly played Snapcaster and he was never a majorly helpful play. I have been testing my new deck without Force and Snapcaster and with more burn and so far I am quite happy. I can still usually slow down fast combo (Storm, Reanimator) enough to finish them and my aggro and slower/counter-heavy combo decks (such as High Tide and sometimes Hive Mind) match-ups should improve as my increased speed has a better chance to kill them before they go off. I haven't played any dredge decks yet.
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
-Aggro: UWR/RUB/WUB/RUG/UR Delver; Affinity; Burn
-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
I run it now. It has been mostly used to stop Wasteland or to stifle a fetch. Both awesome. There are very few match-ups where it is dead.
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
-Aggro: UWR/RUB/WUB/RUG/UR Delver; Affinity; Burn
-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
Cool, I'm considerring dropping goblin guide and throwing in wastelands and stifles. Thinking it will end up being really good.
:symw:Death and Taxes:symw:
:symr:Burn:symr:
Mono Black Control
Footsteps Hulk
Ascendency Combo
Restore Balance
Ad Nauseam
EDH:
Ghave Lands
Narset Combo
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
-Aggro: UWR/RUB/WUB/RUG/UR Delver; Affinity; Burn
-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
I've considered it, but I haven't found a suitable replacement. I pulled one for Serendib effreet. It's nice to be able to block opposing delvers or attack into them. But the 3cc I eventually dropped it.
I dropped force of will from my build. I side them out in almost all match ups. I've replaced them with seering blaze. My logic is that I am in a creature heavy meta and rather 2 for 1ing myself, I rather 2 for one them and get advantage taking out blockers and doing 3 to the face.
It also gives another reason to hold lands in your hand after the first 3 land drops. Which increases your bluff ability.
Interested in seeing the list, I don't wanna buy FoW to play the deck on Modo.
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
-Aggro: UWR/RUB/WUB/RUG/UR Delver; Affinity; Burn
-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
TRAMD's current list is really the closest list from what I imagine to play in UR for Legacy.
I would just fit at least 2 Grim Lavamancer and maybe Hellspark Elemental in a more creature light meta.
Creatures (8)
4 Goblin Guide
4 Delver of Secrets
Blue Spells (14)
4 Brainstorm
4 Spell Pierce
3 Daze
3 Stifle
Red Spells (20)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
3 Rift Bolt
3 Lava Spike
3 Price of Progress
3 Fireblast
2 Mountain
1 Island
3 Volcanic Island
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire
3 Arid Mesa
4 Surgical Extraction
3 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Pyroblast
2 Shattering Spree
1 Smash to Smithereens
Moderm - Mono blue Tron and Eldrazi variants
Legacy - Building Eldrazi Stompy
My team for ever ever:
Sport Club Internacional
www.internacional.com.br
Wow, thanks! I am very excited about the way it has been performing for me.
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
-Aggro: UWR/RUB/WUB/RUG/UR Delver; Affinity; Burn
-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
Moderm - Mono blue Tron and Eldrazi variants
Legacy - Building Eldrazi Stompy
My team for ever ever:
Sport Club Internacional
www.internacional.com.br
| U Merfolk | UR Delver Burn| B Reanimator| B Landless Dredge |