When you put it like that i guess i see it. They play their elf, take 2 damage and get an elf. I play my bolt, take 2 damage and do 3 damage to them. Same idea with the vortex, were both taking the same damage from these cards, but my spells are also damaging them.
Doing that much damage to myself always makes me nervous, but thanks for the advice, ill look into it.
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My decks. Feel free to make suggestions. The Precious B___U___G___R___W
More like, their deck requires playing 5-6 Elves/Spells to win. You don't even have to cast a spell until they are within range of just straight up losing to that Bolt. There is also situations you can setup against any deck that involves forcing them to deal with your early aggression which that puts them into Bolt range. There are also locks where they can't play a spell without dying to the trigger. Our deck is faster generally, so the effect isn't actually symmetrical in game play when we have more life as a resource.
It's a team constructed event, so I think he's only playing basics so that his team can play fetches. Perhaps not, though, because he has no maindeck grim or blaze but that could also be a consequence of not having fetches.
It's a team constructed event, so I think he's only playing basics so that his team can play fetches. Perhaps not, though, because he has no maindeck grim or blaze but that could also be a consequence of not having fetches.
There are no unified construction rules, so it shouldn't be a problem. But it honestly might just be that he hasn't played legacy in a while
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"What's your plan?" Gideon asked.
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
It's a team constructed event, so I think he's only playing basics so that his team can play fetches. Perhaps not, though, because he has no maindeck grim or blaze but that could also be a consequence of not having fetches.
There are no unified construction rules, so it shouldn't be a problem. But it honestly might just be that he hasn't played legacy in a while
My bad, I thought there were restrictions. I'm inclined to agree that he might be out of the loop a bit.
I suspect he is playing without fetches because he's playing Flame Rift and trying to mitigate the self inflicted damage. Between Eidolon and Flame Rift, that's a lot of damage and there's a lot of heavy hitters in the field right now and trying to match that with four damage spells.
No Grim Lavamancer or Sulfuric Vortex? Interesting. It's probably because Flame Rift rips you pretty hard already, and you don't want to pile on more sources of self-damage on top of that. But is it really better? I defer to him given that he's more experienced, but I can't help but wonder.
I'm assuming the logic is to have as many turn 3/4 kill as possible; Lavamancer & Vortex are slower but gives more reach (although he does have the Vortex in the sideboard)
So far the team is 8-2, but that doesn't really tell us anything since it's possible his teammates are just winning
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"What's your plan?" Gideon asked.
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
Im back for one more round of advice before I sleeve 'em up and try it out for a while.
Since no one's life is on the line, Im going to defy convention and brew around a little. That being said, there are still a few things id like to hear opinions about.
Eidolon of the Great Revel. I dont have any and Im not going to run out and get any this week. Im going to do the best i can without him, at least for now. It might be a mistake, but hes just out for now.
Browbeat. Yeah, yeah I know, I cant help it. Maybe its from all my years playing control, but I LOVE drawing extra cards. I also love doing 5 damage with 1 card. Like I said in an earlier post, right now im willing to sacrifice some speed for some staying power. By the time I cast this, Im usually down to 1 or 2 cards in my hand and my opponent is usually way down in life. Ive yet to be really disappointed in either outcome. Its just in for now.
Mountain. Im going to go with 21 for now. During the game Id always rather have 1 too many lands then 1 too few. If I wind up getting flooded a lot, Ill go down to 20, but with 4 Fireblast and Searing Blaze, the extra Mountain hasn't been a problem yet.
Other thoughts ive had on these 9 slots:
-is 4 flex cards too many? ive considered going down to 3, but i kind of feel that if im tailoring the deck or sideboarding in cards to deal with a certain threat, i should have 4 of them.
-Vexing Devil. I haven't actually played any games with this card yet. They're on the way and im looking forward to it. It seems like a great card, should i play 4 of them? which of these 9 cards should i take out to fit in the 4th devil?
-Grim Lavamancer. I love using cards from my graveyard and, lets be serious, even without fetchlands it's really, really rare that there arent 4 cards in my graveyard. Im never expecting to get the chance to use him more then twice before he gets removed somehow. However....it is the slowest card in the deck currently. It's the only card in the deck that has no way to deal damage the turn it is cast. and i kind of try to stay away from only having 2 copies of any card in a deck without tutors. Every 30 cards i see i get to see 1 of them? it could be half a dozen games before i even pull one. do i leave them? do i take them out for a 4th copy of vexing devil and price of progress? do i take them out for 2 sulfuric vortex? that still leaves me with a 2 of...do i replace them with 2 Monastery Swiftspear that kind of gives me 6 Goblin Guide....do i replace them with 2 Flame Rift, which is sort of like 2 more Fireblast?
anyway, thanks for your thoughts.
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My decks. Feel free to make suggestions. The Precious B___U___G___R___W
Vexing Devil: I hope you didn't waste money buying a playset of these when you could have bought a playset of Eidolons for less. The punisher mechanic is not good, so these and the browbeats don't belong.
Smash to Smithereens: this is a sideboard card, so I'm not sure what you mean about "seeing what's going on around you" and playing them main accordingly.
You should have a few Sulfuric Vortex, 4 PoPs, and probably a few Exquisite Firecraft. 21 lands is 1 or 2 too many.
You should play Monastery Swiftspear, the 4th Price, and maybe a couple of Searing Blood as additions to the core list you posted. Flame Rift would be a decent card to add if you don't have the Eidolons.
And really, Browbeat needs cut. You don't have to take our word for it. Try to find a successful (e.g. Top8) burn list at a competitive event that plays it. You will have a difficult time.
Im just going to have to make my own mistakes with the devil and browbeat. If they wind up being terrible ill take them out eventually.
4 damage for R seems great to me....so does a 4/3 creature for R....
im not making this deck in a vacuum or for one particular event. its just a deck to have to play with. often im playing against someone ive played against before. if i know they use a lot of artifacts, ill put in smash to smithereens. or if im at the card shop with my kids playing a few games against strangers and i find im having trouble with lifegain that day.... ill put in the skullcracks and see how that works out for an hour or 2.
if i try to look at your answer only with regards to those last 9 card slots, would you say that your advice would be to loose the 2 grim lavamancers in favor of 2 sulfuric vortex? or should i go with 3 vortexes and drop down to 3 searing blaze? or just keep the lavamancers?
thank you for your time. ill try some different things and get back to you in a few weeks....
Any tips against infect? I was assuming it would be more or less like modern where it's an easy matchup, but I seem to be having a lot of trouble with it
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"What's your plan?" Gideon asked.
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
Any tips against infect? I was assuming it would be more or less like modern where it's an easy matchup, but I seem to be having a lot of trouble with it
I don't have too much experience against it but I feel like it's somewhat similar to modern, except faster and they have access to trample so just blocking isn't good enough. I think it's at least correct to approach it the same way as you do in modern and play control.
no ensnaring bridge or gy hate in P. Sullivan sb. you think his plan to deal with reanimator and all the other decks that cheat big creatures into play was just burn and burn fast?
i have all these cards... i can try it out a few ways.
Do you not have access to any red fetches? If not, I suggest switching over to Searing Blood and in both cases, you don't need it to be a four in the deck. You also need more creatures. To be honest, if you just play with the deck with your version and then out version and you play it against people who are experienced in the format you'll see what we are talking about and how you play with the deck.
Doing that much damage to myself always makes me nervous, but thanks for the advice, ill look into it.
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
It's a team constructed event, so I think he's only playing basics so that his team can play fetches. Perhaps not, though, because he has no maindeck grim or blaze but that could also be a consequence of not having fetches.
There are no unified construction rules, so it shouldn't be a problem. But it honestly might just be that he hasn't played legacy in a while
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
My bad, I thought there were restrictions. I'm inclined to agree that he might be out of the loop a bit.
I suspect he is playing without fetches because he's playing Flame Rift and trying to mitigate the self inflicted damage. Between Eidolon and Flame Rift, that's a lot of damage and there's a lot of heavy hitters in the field right now and trying to match that with four damage spells.
Legacy: Merfolk U; Shadow UB; Eldrazi Stompy C
Pauper: Delver U
Vintage: Merfolk U
Primers:
So far the team is 8-2, but that doesn't really tell us anything since it's possible his teammates are just winning
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
probably more a case of having a final game with the old cards rather than analysing burn theory
Since no one's life is on the line, Im going to defy convention and brew around a little. That being said, there are still a few things id like to hear opinions about.
Eidolon of the Great Revel. I dont have any and Im not going to run out and get any this week. Im going to do the best i can without him, at least for now. It might be a mistake, but hes just out for now.
Browbeat. Yeah, yeah I know, I cant help it. Maybe its from all my years playing control, but I LOVE drawing extra cards. I also love doing 5 damage with 1 card. Like I said in an earlier post, right now im willing to sacrifice some speed for some staying power. By the time I cast this, Im usually down to 1 or 2 cards in my hand and my opponent is usually way down in life. Ive yet to be really disappointed in either outcome. Its just in for now.
Mountain. Im going to go with 21 for now. During the game Id always rather have 1 too many lands then 1 too few. If I wind up getting flooded a lot, Ill go down to 20, but with 4 Fireblast and Searing Blaze, the extra Mountain hasn't been a problem yet.
Other then those 3 things, Im looking at a pretty standard build:
These cards are most certainly in:
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Fireblast
4 Goblin Guide
3 Price of Progress
3 Browbeat
21 Mountain
that leaves me 9 slots. Its these 9 slots id like advice on. My first thoughts are:
4 "flex" cards. usually Searing Blaze but sometimes Skullcrack or Smash to Smithereens depending on whats going on around me on a given day.
3 Vexing Devil
2 Grim Lavamancer
Other thoughts ive had on these 9 slots:
-is 4 flex cards too many? ive considered going down to 3, but i kind of feel that if im tailoring the deck or sideboarding in cards to deal with a certain threat, i should have 4 of them.
-Vexing Devil. I haven't actually played any games with this card yet. They're on the way and im looking forward to it. It seems like a great card, should i play 4 of them? which of these 9 cards should i take out to fit in the 4th devil?
-Grim Lavamancer. I love using cards from my graveyard and, lets be serious, even without fetchlands it's really, really rare that there arent 4 cards in my graveyard. Im never expecting to get the chance to use him more then twice before he gets removed somehow. However....it is the slowest card in the deck currently. It's the only card in the deck that has no way to deal damage the turn it is cast. and i kind of try to stay away from only having 2 copies of any card in a deck without tutors. Every 30 cards i see i get to see 1 of them? it could be half a dozen games before i even pull one. do i leave them? do i take them out for a 4th copy of vexing devil and price of progress? do i take them out for 2 sulfuric vortex? that still leaves me with a 2 of...do i replace them with 2 Monastery Swiftspear that kind of gives me 6 Goblin Guide....do i replace them with 2 Flame Rift, which is sort of like 2 more Fireblast?
anyway, thanks for your thoughts.
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W
Smash to Smithereens: this is a sideboard card, so I'm not sure what you mean about "seeing what's going on around you" and playing them main accordingly.
You should have a few Sulfuric Vortex, 4 PoPs, and probably a few Exquisite Firecraft. 21 lands is 1 or 2 too many.
And really, Browbeat needs cut. You don't have to take our word for it. Try to find a successful (e.g. Top8) burn list at a competitive event that plays it. You will have a difficult time.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Im just going to have to make my own mistakes with the devil and browbeat. If they wind up being terrible ill take them out eventually.
4 damage for R seems great to me....so does a 4/3 creature for R....
im not making this deck in a vacuum or for one particular event. its just a deck to have to play with. often im playing against someone ive played against before. if i know they use a lot of artifacts, ill put in smash to smithereens. or if im at the card shop with my kids playing a few games against strangers and i find im having trouble with lifegain that day.... ill put in the skullcracks and see how that works out for an hour or 2.
if i try to look at your answer only with regards to those last 9 card slots, would you say that your advice would be to loose the 2 grim lavamancers in favor of 2 sulfuric vortex? or should i go with 3 vortexes and drop down to 3 searing blaze? or just keep the lavamancers?
thank you for your time. ill try some different things and get back to you in a few weeks....
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W
lets say i were to take your exact advice (with the exception of Eidolon)
the deck would look like this?
that leaves 8 slots. a mix of sulfuric vortex, Flame Rift, and Monastery Swiftspear ?
maybe 3 vortex, 3 flame rift, and 2 swiftspear?
i have all these cards... i can try it out a few ways.
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W
"Are you serious?" Chandra replied.
Patrick Sullivan was in the top 8 of the Team Open with this Burn list. Interesting to see it with no fetches and Flame Rifts again
Original link: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=111741
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
20 Mountain
4 Fireblast
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Price of Progress
4 Chain Lightning
4 Flame Rift
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Searing Blaze
4 Searing Blood
2 Smash to Smithereens
1 Sudden Shock
4 Exquisite Firecraft
I don't have too much experience against it but I feel like it's somewhat similar to modern, except faster and they have access to trample so just blocking isn't good enough. I think it's at least correct to approach it the same way as you do in modern and play control.
Do you not have access to any red fetches? If not, I suggest switching over to Searing Blood and in both cases, you don't need it to be a four in the deck. You also need more creatures. To be honest, if you just play with the deck with your version and then out version and you play it against people who are experienced in the format you'll see what we are talking about and how you play with the deck.
Searing Blaze should be Searing Blood in a deck without fetches. Swiftspear is worth the full set in a deck without Eidolon.
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swifspear
Spells (32)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Fireblast
4 Price of Progress
4 Searing Blood
4 Flame Rift
20 Mountain
4 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Pyrostatic Pillar
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Smash to Smithereens
2 Sulfuric Vortex
I've added a sideboard that give you some tools against common decks which Burn has trouble with.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
ill try out a bunch of these ideas in the coming weeks.
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W
"...I'm coming out blasting like Yosemite Sam..."
The Precious
B___U___G___R___W