Sort of. I play it to beat abrupt decay. Also sometimes it's free and gives an oops you win. It could be another rip though, but with how infrequent I feel a need for a third, leyline fills a sweet spot
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i'm looking at my box of extra cards last night and i came across ruination, is this worth running? this can be a one-sided Armageddon against decks like bug, eldrazi, cloudpost, lands, etc..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
I am trying a single main deck Geddon out. The idea came to me after I lost to my own Enchantress deck that I never get to play as it is always borrowed. I play Stax with Humility and 'geddon, but had loaned it out, and when playing Enchantress with Parfait I found myself wishing for a 'Geddon early on (I think I had a Rule of Law effect or Humility and a Leyline down, Moxen and LT on top, there seemed to be a lot of 1 drop enchantments sitting on land) and later in the night I played Nic Fit and found myself for the second time in the evening wishing for said 'Geddon as he had taxed himself all night by holding onto Abrupt Decay and dropping lands (vets had been boarded out). I like the idea of restarting mana wise with Mox D/LT down or a full hand of land, and thought it might be good against a a few decks as I run more than one Ghostly Prison. I then thought about tough matchups like Miracles, and it seemed to be calling to me. Its untutorable, but as silver bullets go it seems a fine option- in theory.
I am also going to try and take a leaf from weapon-x's book and and try to run a bit of Blood Moon action albiet with it in my sideboard, not main, with Belcher under consideration as an alternative win con from the board. I have spent most of my time these past few months working on Stax of late, and Pox before that earlier in the year (I have had lots of help with both from various people in the local Legacy group which speeds up progress, and the threads here are good too), and they are in a nice place, tested by more than one pilot in small events near and far. All my other legacy loan decks like Eldrazi, Merfolk and D n T are up to date with whatever people are running, so I can *finally* get some time to fiddle with Parfait, and to a lesser extent my two pet projects (which are much simpler really as there are far fewer options), Soldiers Stompy and Stasis.
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People with belligerent signatures are trying to compensate for something....
i would gladly drop 2 of those tops for the other 2 copies of the white tutor..
but with the 3 copies of terminus and 3 copies of entreat the angels, i guess he has a reason for the multiple copies of tops..and together with the 3 scroll racks, perhaps the pilot felt that's enough library manipulation already thus only 2 tutors..
what i found surprising is the absence of any "silence" effects..
cool interesting list, mono-white miracles?! he he he..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
Holy smokes, Miracles has had an affair with Parfait, and produced a hybrid child.
I can see why the list works, the lines of synergy. Personally I would ask why include Humility in the deck as is- yeah, its a great card, but a total nonbo with the Entreat and SFM if its drawn after. Obviously a deck like Parfait can live with nonbos because of the manipulation, but sometimes I would rather build for the Humility main with cards like Elspeth and would dump the Entreats or board them in. The basic count seems low, I guess he wanted more free shuffles...?
I like a couple of copies of UA myself, so it is good to see someone else on that train, but I am also surprised at the 2 tutor count. I would worry about running out of Tax lands, but then I sacrifice them....
I run more RIP of course, but then I have reanimation and dredge in my metas.
i'm getting and more impressed with parfait the more i play it..
beat mud, reanimator and nic fit yesterday..
against mud, a needle on his grim monolith and a blood moon in play slowed him down..later a resolved humility to nerf his creatures gave me time to resolve our rip/helm..on the second game, he needled the helm but died to a charbelcher..i feel we have really good game against this deck..though i lost to it once a few days ago when he resolved a newlamog and blew up my humility and solitary confinement..emrakul is easier, because chants can keep it from attacking for a turn but newlamog's and TKS' on-cast trigger still works under a humility..i learned that most of the time against this deck, its better to attack their mana base first via blood moon before anything else..take note that even with a blood moon in play, they can still resolve expensive threats with grim monolith, a needle or an o-ring on the monolith is good..
i'll continue to playtest the ***** outta this deck to learn its intricacies and then i'll bring it to tournaments..my other legacy deck(pox)has been getting ran over, seems like the meta is a bit hostile to it lately..i'll give it a rest for now but i'll resurrect it when the time feels right..
while pox has more lopsided matches, i feel like parfait has a better game overall, at least for now..so far, i've tested against eldrazi, nic fit, miracles, mud, grixis, junk(abzan), reanimator, DnT, pox and dredge..and none of them felt like a bad match-up..i have never encountered a match-up that felt unwinnable..
there is a storm, rug and an enchantress player in the shop that i haven't tested with yet..anyone has experience with those match-ups? i would appreciate any tips that you might have..thanks in advance..
Storm- E tutor for Solitary or Runed Halo, then RIP. In response to LED popping and Tutor, I chant them. I board in LOS. The match is good. I keep a miser's Ghostly Prison in game 2, for Goblin shenanigans.
I have never played RUG.
I have indeed played enchantress, and lost. It was my bloody enchantress deck (4 sanctum version), and I have lost twice to it. I am experimenting with ways of beating it as I own both decks its easy to get the time to try new cards. I found the issue is they run O ring/removal effects (I actually run the Quarantine field super oring at the suggestion of a local player), and other enchantment kill from the board, and the Sanctum can generate huge amounts of mana in a single turn. They can hide behind Solitary too, but can also go off and draw huge numbers of cards, doing many things a turn. I am experimenting with Blood Moon board to stop the sanctum mana, and Rule of Law effects, combined with Geddon main deck, and I want to try boarding out RIP. Weapon X is an Enchantress player- I took advice from him when putting mine together.
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People with belligerent signatures are trying to compensate for something....
i was watching it last night and i was wondering if Armageddon might be good against it..bloon moon can neuter serra sanctum but they still have those wild growth and utopia sprawl to still generate a lot of mana..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
Hmmm... What did you intend to achieve here ? To stop it from untapping? You are aware that the needle does not prevent the monolith from adding mana, right ?
yes and yes..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
i was watching it last night and i was wondering if Armageddon might be good against it..bloon moon can neuter serra sanctum but they still have those wild growth and utopia sprawl to still generate a lot of mana..
It was one of the reasons I wanted to try a main deck 'geddon- I am not running Moons main.
Rule of Law effects seem to work pretty well, Spirit of the Labyrinth might do a job too, at least on the "draw my deck" side of things....
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People with belligerent signatures are trying to compensate for something....
Enchantress is slow. Humility neuters the engine to an extent and deals with its main threats. Honestly trinisphere and just jamming the combo will get you there. Blood moon is less important as it should only affect sanctum.
RUG is interesting in that we are kind of both playing a tempo game. Resolving a trinisphere and just otherwise taxing them is all you really need to do. Blood moon is again a beating against them.
With Storm trinisphere and blood moon are houses. Needle is also great. Well timed chants just beat them if they don't make you discard them.
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what do we name against storm with needle WeaponX? Polluted Delta, i assume?
i also need to learn how to properly time my chants against it, any tips on that?
@WeaponX and drmarkb:
i trust both your intuition and decisions on card inclusions for this deck since you both are more experienced and have played the deck longer in this format than i have..so i go to you both for tips..thanks in advance..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
The simple answer is you want them to expend as many resources as you can and stop them before they cast tendrils. If in doubt stop them when it would be lethal to you.
As for the needle question, it can vary I suppose, but fetch lands are usually strong to name against them. Ideally you play a needle while they have a fetch in play and name that one if they don't crack in response.
Well casting silence is something I obviously don't do, running 4 chants only.
It is perfectly reasonable to chant them @10th storm count, but I will chant if they tutor/LED before that. Incidentally, it should be noted that I run 4 RIP, which is useful for this match (my meta makes RIP main very attractive). A restart after a LED pop is not easy for them, and stupidly hard if you have already got RIP down. All in all those Leylines from the board do a lot of work at keeping cards in hand early on. Their level of removal for Leylines is not that high, and some players go to goblin token mode automatically, hence Ghostly staying in. I forgot to mention 3 sphere as I don't run it, despite being a fan of the card in general. I have not used needle myself. Rule of law/cannonist effects work well against both enchantress and storm decks of course.
P.S.The Enchantress matches have been close, I should have added. Double sanctum in a turn was really rude (Exploration), generating that much mana with cards like Quarrantine Field...ouch. I would be more confident in your type of build than mine, those Moons may do nothing much apart from Sanctum nerfing but it was Sanctum that scared me the most from the other side of the table, that and the fact that the Enchantress deck is a bit too overloaded board wise with Krosan Grip and other Enchantment/Artifact removal itself, thanks to the popularity of Miracles and relative lack of Delvers.
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People with belligerent signatures are trying to compensate for something....
i had to read the entire 36 pages(took me about 2 hours) of this thread last night because i don't want to ask questions that have been asked before and i also don't want to waste other people's time, whom have spent a lot of effort in testing and fine tuning it, to feel like a broken record in trying to answer the same questions over and over..
its amazing how much knowledge and info about the deck is instilled in these 36 pages..
i'll try to read every page on the source too, it shorter..only about 18 pages..
Those corner case belcher plans helped shape this decision.
alright, thanks..
i checked your list in the primer in your sig and saw that it still has a plateau so i had to ask what the most current list looks like.
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
i used to run 2 copies of seal of cleansing too but i replaced one of them with an aura of silence because i think its good against enchantress, i now run a 1:1 split between the 2..there's an enchantress player in my LGS and i want to be ready for it..
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
2 infect players just up showed up at my LGS and i think they will soon become regulars, i don't have experience with this match-up with parfait..but i know we have good cards in the main to fight it..i think i would want to try to land a moon early, then ghostly prison to tax their attacks to possibly keep them from using their pump spells..i think our best cards here to help us stay alive long enough until we drop our bombs are path to exile and chant..a resolved humility should be game..though i think the match is slightly to their favor because of their speed..
daze, FoW and pierce are what i'm worried about..
anyone here who has experience with the match-up has any pointers to share?
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"I am the purifier, the light that clears all shadows."
—Seal inscription
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-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
—Seal inscription
I am also going to try and take a leaf from weapon-x's book and and try to run a bit of Blood Moon action albiet with it in my sideboard, not main, with Belcher under consideration as an alternative win con from the board. I have spent most of my time these past few months working on Stax of late, and Pox before that earlier in the year (I have had lots of help with both from various people in the local Legacy group which speeds up progress, and the threads here are good too), and they are in a nice place, tested by more than one pilot in small events near and far. All my other legacy loan decks like Eldrazi, Merfolk and D n T are up to date with whatever people are running, so I can *finally* get some time to fiddle with Parfait, and to a lesser extent my two pet projects (which are much simpler really as there are far fewer options), Soldiers Stompy and Stasis.
4 enlightened tutor
...is doing something very wrong.
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
i would gladly drop 2 of those tops for the other 2 copies of the white tutor..
but with the 3 copies of terminus and 3 copies of entreat the angels, i guess he has a reason for the multiple copies of tops..and together with the 3 scroll racks, perhaps the pilot felt that's enough library manipulation already thus only 2 tutors..
what i found surprising is the absence of any "silence" effects..
cool interesting list, mono-white miracles?! he he he..
—Seal inscription
I can see why the list works, the lines of synergy. Personally I would ask why include Humility in the deck as is- yeah, its a great card, but a total nonbo with the Entreat and SFM if its drawn after. Obviously a deck like Parfait can live with nonbos because of the manipulation, but sometimes I would rather build for the Humility main with cards like Elspeth and would dump the Entreats or board them in. The basic count seems low, I guess he wanted more free shuffles...?
I like a couple of copies of UA myself, so it is good to see someone else on that train, but I am also surprised at the 2 tutor count. I would worry about running out of Tax lands, but then I sacrifice them....
I run more RIP of course, but then I have reanimation and dredge in my metas.
beat mud, reanimator and nic fit yesterday..
against mud, a needle on his grim monolith and a blood moon in play slowed him down..later a resolved humility to nerf his creatures gave me time to resolve our rip/helm..on the second game, he needled the helm but died to a charbelcher..i feel we have really good game against this deck..though i lost to it once a few days ago when he resolved a newlamog and blew up my humility and solitary confinement..emrakul is easier, because chants can keep it from attacking for a turn but newlamog's and TKS' on-cast trigger still works under a humility..i learned that most of the time against this deck, its better to attack their mana base first via blood moon before anything else..take note that even with a blood moon in play, they can still resolve expensive threats with grim monolith, a needle or an o-ring on the monolith is good..
i'll continue to playtest the ***** outta this deck to learn its intricacies and then i'll bring it to tournaments..my other legacy deck(pox)has been getting ran over, seems like the meta is a bit hostile to it lately..i'll give it a rest for now but i'll resurrect it when the time feels right..
while pox has more lopsided matches, i feel like parfait has a better game overall, at least for now..so far, i've tested against eldrazi, nic fit, miracles, mud, grixis, junk(abzan), reanimator, DnT, pox and dredge..and none of them felt like a bad match-up..i have never encountered a match-up that felt unwinnable..
there is a storm, rug and an enchantress player in the shop that i haven't tested with yet..anyone has experience with those match-ups? i would appreciate any tips that you might have..thanks in advance..
—Seal inscription
I have never played RUG.
I have indeed played enchantress, and lost. It was my bloody enchantress deck (4 sanctum version), and I have lost twice to it. I am experimenting with ways of beating it as I own both decks its easy to get the time to try new cards. I found the issue is they run O ring/removal effects (I actually run the Quarantine field super oring at the suggestion of a local player), and other enchantment kill from the board, and the Sanctum can generate huge amounts of mana in a single turn. They can hide behind Solitary too, but can also go off and draw huge numbers of cards, doing many things a turn. I am experimenting with Blood Moon board to stop the sanctum mana, and Rule of Law effects, combined with Geddon main deck, and I want to try boarding out RIP. Weapon X is an Enchantress player- I took advice from him when putting mine together.
—Seal inscription
yes and yes..
—Seal inscription
—Seal inscription
It was one of the reasons I wanted to try a main deck 'geddon- I am not running Moons main.
Rule of Law effects seem to work pretty well, Spirit of the Labyrinth might do a job too, at least on the "draw my deck" side of things....
RUG is interesting in that we are kind of both playing a tempo game. Resolving a trinisphere and just otherwise taxing them is all you really need to do. Blood moon is again a beating against them.
With Storm trinisphere and blood moon are houses. Needle is also great. Well timed chants just beat them if they don't make you discard them.
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
what do we name against storm with needle WeaponX? Polluted Delta, i assume?
i also need to learn how to properly time my chants against it, any tips on that?
@WeaponX and drmarkb:
i trust both your intuition and decisions on card inclusions for this deck since you both are more experienced and have played the deck longer in this format than i have..so i go to you both for tips..thanks in advance..
—Seal inscription
thank you, that is very helpful..
some say to cast silence or chant on their 10th storm count? is this correct advice?
—Seal inscription
As for the needle question, it can vary I suppose, but fetch lands are usually strong to name against them. Ideally you play a needle while they have a fetch in play and name that one if they don't crack in response.
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
It is perfectly reasonable to chant them @10th storm count, but I will chant if they tutor/LED before that. Incidentally, it should be noted that I run 4 RIP, which is useful for this match (my meta makes RIP main very attractive). A restart after a LED pop is not easy for them, and stupidly hard if you have already got RIP down. All in all those Leylines from the board do a lot of work at keeping cards in hand early on. Their level of removal for Leylines is not that high, and some players go to goblin token mode automatically, hence Ghostly staying in. I forgot to mention 3 sphere as I don't run it, despite being a fan of the card in general. I have not used needle myself. Rule of law/cannonist effects work well against both enchantress and storm decks of course.
P.S.The Enchantress matches have been close, I should have added. Double sanctum in a turn was really rude (Exploration), generating that much mana with cards like Quarrantine Field...ouch. I would be more confident in your type of build than mine, those Moons may do nothing much apart from Sanctum nerfing but it was Sanctum that scared me the most from the other side of the table, that and the fact that the Enchantress deck is a bit too overloaded board wise with Krosan Grip and other Enchantment/Artifact removal itself, thanks to the popularity of Miracles and relative lack of Delvers.
its amazing how much knowledge and info about the deck is instilled in these 36 pages..
i'll try to read every page on the source too, it shorter..only about 18 pages..
—Seal inscription
are you still running plateaus or have you cut them for mountains?
—Seal inscription
-2 plateau
+1 plains
+1 mountain
Those corner case belcher plans helped shape this decision.
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
alright, thanks..
i checked your list in the primer in your sig and saw that it still has a plateau so i had to ask what the most current list looks like.
—Seal inscription
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
—Seal inscription
daze, FoW and pierce are what i'm worried about..
anyone here who has experience with the match-up has any pointers to share?
—Seal inscription