Is it a glass cannon? Yes! But it's the damn finest glass cannon you'll ever see! I know the mana seems very tight, and it is - be warned, this is a deck that may need to mulligan hard & often. Thank God for the Vancouver mull! The premise is simple - so long as you have a mana, a glimpse, & at least 4 0 -drops, you should win 95% of the time if goldfishing. IRL, against a wide variety of Legacy decks, the match-ups are pretty much like you'd imagine: nigh 100% vs. certain decks (like Elves), significantly worse match-ups vs. fair decks with interaction. It's important to remember that even though they have tons of counterspells, you can still catch them by surprise. Naturally, Force of Will is as tough on this deck as it is on belcher; I have toyed with the idea of including my own playset in the side).
All that being said, it is an incredibly fun deck to play, especially as a comic relief in the sometimes too serious Legacy metagame.
Thanks,
Feedback and suggestions are welcome!
ATTACHMENTS
interesting man kobolds
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LegacyHelm LegacyBelcher LegacyCheeri 0 s LegacyManaless Dredge CubeDragons
why brain freeze over grapeshot? Assuming turn 1, you'll need 17 spells before it to go off with the brain freeze in a color of mana you're not already running while grapeshot will at least put you in mana you already have.
Old school cheerios usually likes to run culling the weak. If you stick to red/green, any thought given to infernal plunge? The mana boost could be useful.
- I prefer brain freeze over grapeshot because by the time you go off with the final spell they are both equally easy to play and have plenty storm count. I just like having a non-damage alternative to attacking with bushwhacker as an alternative wincon.
- I have never really noticed a need for extra mana to make this combo go off - such as can be generated by culling the weak and infernal plunge. The wincons both cost only 2 and you usually have access to 3 or 4 mana by the time you go for the kill.
- Chalice of the Void is indeed a powerful card and a serious threat to this deck. I bring in Mortal Combat as an alternative wincon in those matchups because it does not matter if the creatures are dead. I just let them be countered. It's out of abrupt decay range too. Multani's presence is excellent, and I gave it a lot of consideration. However, I have noticed that the mechanism of this combo is quite specific and there is absolutely no room for non-essential cards. Could be workable from the side though..
I realize that on paper it looks like I would never have enough mana, but I usually find it.
The meta I test against contains:
Storm, Colorless Eldrazi, Lands, D&T, Elves, Miracles, Grixis Delver, MUD, High Tide, Dredge, Leylines, & Infect so I have tried it out against a lot of stuff.
I appreciate your reminding me of some classic Cheeri0s cards, but I am particularly interested to see if anyone knows of some new additions which might benefit this zany old archetype.
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LegacyHelm LegacyBelcher LegacyCheeri 0 s LegacyManaless Dredge CubeDragons
There's a (necro) thread about this deck in the development section. The name of this deck is Cheeri0s. Reckless Bushwhacker is great tech Endless One seems meh.
Replace Dryad Arbor with Savannah and put a set of Scapegoat into the deck.
Summoner's Pact is very interesting.. hadn't considered that, thanks for the suggestion!
I know it's hard to fathom from just looking at the decklist, but getting U is really no problem at all. Once you are going off you will find the lotus petals, guaranteed. The tricky part is finding the right build which has good T1 or T2 hands to go off with. If you have too high a desnity of cheery 0 s, you may end up with a lot of hands composed entirely of them. My latest rendition has only reckless bushwhacker for the win with grapeshot and brain freeze in the side. 4 multani's presence also SB in case my opponent wants to put chalice of the void on 0 , as was suggested above.
I play 1 dryad arbor because it fixes land grant when you are going off from a brick into a creature when you need it to keep glimpse rollin', or it can cast you glimpse on T2. Sounds thin, but I have found it to be a good variance-reducer.
Scapegoat is very interesting because when it resolves it ensures your combo will succeed. But in my playtesting with it I found that scapegoat + white mana was too much to ask for when I am combo-ing off.
Endless One > Phyrexian Marauder or Shifting Wall . I am always tinkering with the right balance of 0 -drops, spells, & lands, so I threw him in there just because I was wanting a bit more creatures. Gamble is in there because it's the best 1 CMC tutor when it works, & because - hey - this whole damn deck is a gamble, why not let it ride? It's great fun playing an honest gamble. And then when you have 20 cards in hand it becomes a dishonest gamble for your wincon.
Thanks all for the feedback!
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LegacyHelm LegacyBelcher LegacyCheeri 0 s LegacyManaless Dredge CubeDragons
I have a Kobold Deck togetyer thqt goes an entirely different route.
The deck consists of the kobolds, foundry street denizen, goblin bushwacker, simian spirit guide and a suite of burn spells in the likes of reckless abandon, bolts, mob justice and lotus petals with 16 mountains. Deck is a ton of fun to play.
I have a Kobold Deck togetyer thqt goes an entirely different route.
The deck consists of the kobolds, foundry street denizen, goblin bushwacker, simian spirit guide and a suite of burn spells in the likes of reckless abandon, bolts, mob justice and lotus petals with 16 mountains. Deck is a ton of fun to play.
Sounds like you're saying you just play a burn deck... With Kobolds. Although the title didn't imply it, we were really focused on Kobold Storm decks. (OP probably just said budget Kobold, because to my knowledge there aren't any other established Kobold style decks that aren't storm based, or at at least storm derived (Like laboratory maniac win). You can corner the "Kobold Burn" market, if you want to.
@knifemind: My bad, I am running a cheerios variant of my own using an entire suite of 0 drop artifact creatures and retracts to kill my opponent with assault formation.
@knifemind: My bad, I am running a cheerios variant of my own using an entire suite of 0 drop artifact creatures and retracts to kill my opponent with assault formation.
No worries, I wasn't trying to be negative about it.
Side note: I do like the idea of Assault Formation as another win condition. I may try running one. Seems like it could add some stability.
I play 1 dryad arbor because it fixes land grant when you are going off from a brick into a creature when you need it to keep glimpse rollin', or it can cast you glimpse on T2. Sounds thin, but I have found it to be a good variance-reducer.
dryad arbor is not a spell, that doesnt work. Glimpse only triggers on casting creature spells.
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4 Crimson Kobolds
4 Crookshank Kobolds
4 Kobolds of Kher Keep
4 Ornithopter
4 Memnite
4 Phyrexian Walker
4 Shield Sphere
4 Street Wraith
1 Endless One
1 Signal Pest
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
Spells 14
4 Glimpse of Nature
4 Gamble
4 Gitaxian Probe
1 Brain Freeze
1 Noxious Revival
Mana 11
4 Lotus Petal
3 Elvish Spirit Guide
2 Land Grant
1 Taiga
1 Dryad Arbor
~-~-~-~-~
Sideboard (Work in progress)
4 Pact of Negation
Flusterstorm
Ingot Chewer
Xantid Swarm
Mortal Combat
Is it a glass cannon? Yes! But it's the damn finest glass cannon you'll ever see! I know the mana seems very tight, and it is - be warned, this is a deck that may need to mulligan hard & often. Thank God for the Vancouver mull! The premise is simple - so long as you have a mana, a glimpse, & at least 4 0 -drops, you should win 95% of the time if goldfishing. IRL, against a wide variety of Legacy decks, the match-ups are pretty much like you'd imagine: nigh 100% vs. certain decks (like Elves), significantly worse match-ups vs. fair decks with interaction. It's important to remember that even though they have tons of counterspells, you can still catch them by surprise. Naturally, Force of Will is as tough on this deck as it is on belcher; I have toyed with the idea of including my own playset in the side).
All that being said, it is an incredibly fun deck to play, especially as a comic relief in the sometimes too serious Legacy metagame.
Thanks,
Feedback and suggestions are welcome!
Legacy Helm
Legacy Belcher
Legacy Cheeri 0 s
Legacy Manaless Dredge
Cube Dragons
~
Old school cheerios usually likes to run culling the weak. If you stick to red/green, any thought given to infernal plunge? The mana boost could be useful.
I would expect to see a great deal of chalice of the void brought in to counter you. Might as well make it do work for you with multani's presence.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
- I prefer brain freeze over grapeshot because by the time you go off with the final spell they are both equally easy to play and have plenty storm count. I just like having a non-damage alternative to attacking with bushwhacker as an alternative wincon.
- I have never really noticed a need for extra mana to make this combo go off - such as can be generated by culling the weak and infernal plunge. The wincons both cost only 2 and you usually have access to 3 or 4 mana by the time you go for the kill.
- Chalice of the Void is indeed a powerful card and a serious threat to this deck. I bring in Mortal Combat as an alternative wincon in those matchups because it does not matter if the creatures are dead. I just let them be countered. It's out of abrupt decay range too. Multani's presence is excellent, and I gave it a lot of consideration. However, I have noticed that the mechanism of this combo is quite specific and there is absolutely no room for non-essential cards. Could be workable from the side though..
I realize that on paper it looks like I would never have enough mana, but I usually find it.
The meta I test against contains:
Storm, Colorless Eldrazi, Lands, D&T, Elves, Miracles, Grixis Delver, MUD, High Tide, Dredge, Leylines, & Infect so I have tried it out against a lot of stuff.
I appreciate your reminding me of some classic Cheeri0s cards, but I am particularly interested to see if anyone knows of some new additions which might benefit this zany old archetype.
Legacy Helm
Legacy Belcher
Legacy Cheeri 0 s
Legacy Manaless Dredge
Cube Dragons
~
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
Reckless Bushwhacker is great tech Endless One seems meh.
Replace Dryad Arbor with Savannah and put a set of Scapegoat into the deck.
Commander: Child of Alara BURGW, Adeliz, the Cinder Wind UR
Tiny Leaders: Gwafa, Hazid Profiteer UW
Regular Pauper: Stompy G, Mono-G Tron G, Infect G
Here's the version I run...still tweaking a card here & there, and constantly adjusting the sideboard.
4 Ornithopter 4 Memnite
4 Shield Sphere 4 Phyrexian Walker
4 Crimson Kobolds 4 Crookshank Kobolds
4 Kobolds of Kher Keep 4 Lotus Petal
2 Mox Opal 2 Wild Cantor
2 Street Wraith 2 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Gitaxian Probe 4 Glimpse of Nature
2 Personal Tutor 1 Land Grant
1 Grapeshot 2 Scapegoat
1 Retract 1 Pact of Negation
1 Noxious Revival 1 Force of Will
1 Breeding Pool 1 Taiga
Sideboard
2 Altar of the Brood
2 Tinder Wall
2 Elvish Spirit Guide
2 Street Wraith
2 Nature's Claim
1 Noxious Revival
1 Force of Will
1 Retract
1 Pact of Negation
1 Laboratory Maniac
I do not have any Multani's Presence, but it would be a good addition.
Summoner's Pact is very interesting.. hadn't considered that, thanks for the suggestion!
I know it's hard to fathom from just looking at the decklist, but getting U is really no problem at all. Once you are going off you will find the lotus petals, guaranteed. The tricky part is finding the right build which has good T1 or T2 hands to go off with. If you have too high a desnity of cheery 0 s, you may end up with a lot of hands composed entirely of them. My latest rendition has only reckless bushwhacker for the win with grapeshot and brain freeze in the side. 4 multani's presence also SB in case my opponent wants to put chalice of the void on 0 , as was suggested above.
I play 1 dryad arbor because it fixes land grant when you are going off from a brick into a creature when you need it to keep glimpse rollin', or it can cast you glimpse on T2. Sounds thin, but I have found it to be a good variance-reducer.
Scapegoat is very interesting because when it resolves it ensures your combo will succeed. But in my playtesting with it I found that scapegoat + white mana was too much to ask for when I am combo-ing off.
Endless One > Phyrexian Marauder or Shifting Wall . I am always tinkering with the right balance of 0 -drops, spells, & lands, so I threw him in there just because I was wanting a bit more creatures. Gamble is in there because it's the best 1 CMC tutor when it works, & because - hey - this whole damn deck is a gamble, why not let it ride? It's great fun playing an honest gamble. And then when you have 20 cards in hand it becomes a dishonest gamble for your wincon.
Thanks all for the feedback!
Legacy Helm
Legacy Belcher
Legacy Cheeri 0 s
Legacy Manaless Dredge
Cube Dragons
~
I have a Kobold Deck togetyer thqt goes an entirely different route.
The deck consists of the kobolds, foundry street denizen, goblin bushwacker, simian spirit guide and a suite of burn spells in the likes of reckless abandon, bolts, mob justice and lotus petals with 16 mountains. Deck is a ton of fun to play.
Sounds like you're saying you just play a burn deck... With Kobolds. Although the title didn't imply it, we were really focused on Kobold Storm decks. (OP probably just said budget Kobold, because to my knowledge there aren't any other established Kobold style decks that aren't storm based, or at at least storm derived (Like laboratory maniac win). You can corner the "Kobold Burn" market, if you want to.
No worries, I wasn't trying to be negative about it.
Side note: I do like the idea of Assault Formation as another win condition. I may try running one. Seems like it could add some stability.
dryad arbor is not a spell, that doesnt work. Glimpse only triggers on casting creature spells.