This is a deck I came up with trying to create a T1 win deck under $100.
The idea is pretty simple, cast Ad Nauseum as soon as possible and draw a bunch of 0 mana creatures. Play them, cast Grapeshot and win. I'm trying to keep the deck as budget as possible so Pact of Negation,Demonic Intent aren't in the deck. Tainted Pact is a surprisingly good tutor if you don't have Ad Nauseum in your hand. Dark Ritual, Culling the Weak are good mana acceleration.
I'm looking for more mana acceleration as well as anything that could make this deck better in any way. I tested Cabal Ritual but I kept losing a lot of life when I drew it using Ad Nauseum.
This is a deck I came up with trying to create a T1 win deck under $100.
The idea is pretty simple, cast Ad Nauseum as soon as possible and draw a bunch of 0 mana creatures. Play them, cast Grapeshot and win. I'm trying to keep the deck as budget as possible so Pact of Negation,Demonic Intent aren't in the deck. Tainted Pact is a surprisingly good tutor if you don't have Ad Nauseum in your hand. Dark Ritual, Culling the Weak are good mana acceleration.
I'm looking for more mana acceleration as well as anything that could make this deck better in any way. I tested Cabal Ritual but I kept losing a lot of life when I drew it using Ad Nauseum.
Not to burst your bubble, but there is a deck very similar to this called cheerios which is probably better.
I remember seeing a deck that used Angel's Grace with Ad nauseam to draw its whole deck and then fired off into sickening dreams. This way wouldn't have to run so many creatures that don't really do anything. Basically you could use cantrips, discard, or whatever.
That being said, Cheerios uses glimpse of nature to basically do the same thing AN does but for 1 mana. I remember seeing scapegoat used to reset itself if it had to.
Thanks for replying and giving advice
I looked as some cheerios lists the main problem is four copies of Glimpse of Nature is worth about as much as the entire Ad Nauseum deck which would make it hard to stay under $100
Thanks for replying and giving advice
I looked as some cheerios lists the main problem is four copies of Glimpse of Nature is worth about as much as the entire Ad Nauseum deck which would make it hard to stay under $100
Legacy is a super expensive format. when the blue duals cost 200 or so each, budget can mean alot to different people.
The most obvious way to keep the price down is to remove the cunning wish board and add more nasuem and angel's grace. If you don't own the pacts of negation, then drop those since they are 20 each. You drop ancient tombs and just put more painlands in your deck or whatever to make the mana work. Silence is another card you could up or some other type of cantrip.
Basically, you spend 5 mana for your two combo cards and then win the game instantly. The best part is if you are desperate, you fire of AN by itself and try to dig for a petal+angel's grace. The solitary foil is if they wait to try to counter sickening dreams, you can counter back--it also explains the use of your islands as part of the mana base. Islands also help you cantrip to color fix or to find your combo pieces.
With a lotus petal (for white) and a few rituals, you could combo off on turn 1, though that's pretty unlikely. Duress helps you bait countermagic and be proactive.
I can get 87 dollars for the whole list on a major online retailer. Anything you might own (lotus petals, pain lands, rituals, cantrips, etc) it becomes even more affordable.
Thanks for your help I really like the interaction with Angel's Grace
I saw another list using Phyrexian Unlife as well it looked a bit consistent on later turns
As the poster above me suggested, this is a modern deck--I was actually unaware. looked a bit at those threads. Their win condition involves Simian apirit guides and lightning storm. The guides are uncounterable mana and the first you draw can be used to help power out your combo a bit faster. The interesting difference than using Spooky's sickening dreams is lightning storm is an instant So you can win in response to your opponent tapping out or trying to resolve a disruptive element like discard or a prison effect--sorta like a quasi Solidarity deck. It also means you can spend maximize the time sculpting your hand before going for it at the last second.
The thread also had some advice that was interesting. I saw a Nic Fit deck blow someone out by flashing in Notion Thief in response to brainstorm (drew 3, opponent lost 2 cards). This would be a far from common problem but since AN puts cards in your hand rather than draws them, such a thing wouldn't work against it.
I don't think it is an optimal deck by any means, but I think you could probably storm a local tournament with it. I mean after all, a guy did really well with splinter twin in a miracle shell during eternal weekend and that's just a really vulnerable combo to being two-for oned. (Admittedly, infinite damage is nice but generally entreat or jace gets the job done). The deck takes 6 mana to work but its not without its merits. You win on the stack, grave yard hate doesn't really hurt you at all (especially if you sack the cabal rituals for simains). Playing around Thalia is easier than it is say for something like storm and trinsphere is a two mana set back instead of back breaking. There's nothing in play for them to interact with at all--every removal spell is dead against you. Even Angel's Grace is acceptable in multiples against an agro deck because it acts like a poor man's fog. The hardest thing is the mana base and we can't really afford to run basics without investing alot more money in fetches and duals (and it would mess with lightning storm too).
Patrician's Scorn is interesting tech the author suggests. It hates out Leyline of Sanctity. Maybe a sideboard card?
I thought about something like using simian or elvish guides to get Manamorphose x2 (would have to not draw the entire deck to avoid losing to the cards) for two black and a blue, then a quicken and an tendrils of agony. Maybe chain some rituals along the way to build up storm. Realistically, it is too many dead cards to ever work though.
This list clocks in at just shy of $2100 at current prices, which is juuuust a bit outside our price range, and doesn't include a sideboard that may run another $400. Let's look where we can save money.
--Dual Lands: These three cards make up $1000 of the deck's price tag on its own. Replacing them with Ravnicashocklands costs $40 and most of the time will accomplish much the same thing. If Scalding Tarn is outside your price range, consider the much cheaper and recently-reprinted Bloodstained Mire.
--Lion's Eye Diamond: The rest of the mana accelerants (Lotus Petal, Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual) are all budget friendly - LED is most decidedly NOT. Depending on your tastes, you can go with Manamorphose which effectively reads "0: draw a card", doubly so if you're flashing things back, or Rite of Flame if speed is more important over consistency. Your meta may vary, so try it both ways.
--Draw Spells: Most of the draw spells are very budget friendly, the worst offender being Gitaxian Probe at $4 apiece. Sensei's Divining Top is a bit pricy for some, you could swap it for a 3rd preordain or a 15th land. Infernal Tutor is far from the worst offender on a budget, but it also becomes a LOT less useful without LED giving you instant hellbent. For half the price you can just go with Burning Wish and stick a second tendrils in your board (as well as a fair share of sorcery-speed answers to things.)
--Discard Spells: 4 Duress is child's play to pick up. 3 Cabal Therapy is slightly less so. You'll want to get at least one, but you can probably get away with Appetite for Brains as a budget replacement, since it exiles and hits Force of Will - probably the most dangerous thing we have to play around.
--The Core: The 4-card "win finder" package (Ad Nauseam, Dark Petition, Past in Flames, Tendrils) is not something that can easily be replaced. this core will set you back $27 by today's prices, and all things considered gives you a pretty nice bang for your buck.
With that in mind, let's construct the cheap version of the deck:
This maindeck weighs in at a paltry $350, compared to the $2100 build from the top. However, with the Burning Wish package, the Sideboard needs special attention, and should at least consider the following: Tendrils of Agony: Yes, another one. Mostly because in your sideboard it's safe from any extract effects, and gives you more reach should your first tendrils come up short for some reason. Empty the Warrens: For when you can't tendrils your opponent, usually because they have hexproof. It's good to bring in game 2 or 3, but if they've got a surprise game 1 you have ways to get around it. Massacre: to tell hatebears to piss off. Will almost always be cast for free (or 1 mana if Thalia is about) and just wipes the board. Do note that Gaddock Teeg shuts this off, so if you see a lot of hatebears meta you may want something like Deathmark as well. Void Snare: Most decks use Chain of Vapor to deal with worrying permanents before going off, but it's an instant. Void Snare does exactly what we need for the same mana cost, and is fetchable with burning wish.
From there it depends a lot on what you expect to face. Most storm decks have 1 Tropical Island in the sideboard to enable Carpet of Flowers and 3-4 Abrupt Decay. We can do those same tricks with Breeding Pool if you're okay with Decay's $13 price tag - though if not, Krosan Grip may be the card for you since decay's biggest purpose is blowing up Counterbalance (yes they can counter grip if there's a 3-ball on top, but they don't get any chance to manipulate their deck once you cast it - so if you know their top card isn't a 3 then it's completely safe). Flusterstorm is also out of our price range, but Red Elemental Blast on the right card can force your spells through as well.
Hopefully this guide will help people who like ANT but are dissuaded by the pricetag get in on the game.
Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
I've been playing the list I posted with Top instead of the 3rd preordain, and I've been having really good results with it between cockatrice, xmage and pick ups with other legacy players before FNM. Yes Rite of flame/burning wish is not as good as LED/infernal tutor, and occasionally having to pay 2 life to have a shockland come in untapped will prove damning. But in most cases I've found this deck to perform quite well.
Obviously you know how to play the combo (Sac land tendrils isn't THAT different) so my advice would have to be to keep playing and get more data - are you losing to counters, wastelands, extract effects, or just bricking? What decks are you failing to get wins against? Are you bringing in the proper sideboard hate or are you stuck wishing for it?
I want to help, but basically just saying "I can't win matches" doesn't give me anything to go on.
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Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Not being able to find your win conditions seems very strange - you have the one tendrils, 4 burning wish to find your sideboard tendrils, dark petition to grab either of them, and Ad Naus to find any of those six, or past in flames to flashback all your draw spells to draw into any of the seven. It's very uncommon to not see ANY of those before you need to go off.
The best advice I can offer is that you don't have to do EVERYTHING the turn you go off. Fire off a few discard spells, filter draws, just generally play the game on the early turns when you don't have anything readily available. The idea is that by the time that you NEED to go off, your hand will have all the tools to get a kill. This isn't like Oops where you have to try to win the game on the first turn - often you want to wait until the last possible turn (usually staring down lethal) before going for the combo, so that your hand has the highest chance of finishing the job. Don't try comboing out unless you're probably going to lose before getting another turn, or you are 100% sure it'll get there.
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Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
I mean if that list works for you I can hardly complain, but I do have a few points.
Badlands is still an $80 card on the low end, which for most paper players is too high. VMA made it possible for MODO but playing physical that isn't practical.
Chrome Moxmay be comparable with the fetches price-wise, but having to exile a card to use it seems like it's rarely worth it unless you're comboing out VERY fast - and this deck shouldn't be aiming for FTKs.
Past in Flames why is this in the board? It's what gives this deck most of its reach to ensure a combo kill on the turn you go off, either by digging deeper to hit your wincon or by adding 5 or 6 spells to the storm count to ensure you get there. I've seen a few decks run an EtW maindeck, but in that case you definitely do not need 2 copies of warrens AND two copies of tendrils.
Cabal Therapy is played less than duress because its strike rate is much lower - usually it's used as a gitaxian probe just to be see if there is a counterspell. Meanwhile duress will hit something 90% of the time - that's why you play 4 copies of it and not 4 therapy.
Again, what matters is that it works for you - but those points give me some concern.
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The idea is pretty simple, cast Ad Nauseum as soon as possible and draw a bunch of 0 mana creatures. Play them, cast Grapeshot and win. I'm trying to keep the deck as budget as possible so Pact of Negation,Demonic Intent aren't in the deck. Tainted Pact is a surprisingly good tutor if you don't have Ad Nauseum in your hand.
Dark Ritual, Culling the Weak are good mana acceleration.
2x Archaeological Dig
1x Barren Moor
2x Cinder Marsh
2x Rootwater Depths
2x Snow-Covered Swamp
2x Swamp
2x Vault of Whispers
1x Waterveil Cavern
3x Jeweled Amulet
2x Lens of Clarity
4x Lotus Petal
3x Paradise Mantle
Creature (16)
2x Crimson Kobolds
3x Crookshank Kobolds
3x Kobolds of Kher Keep
2x Memnite
2x Ornithopter
2x Phyrexian Walker
2x Shield Sphere
1x Grapeshot
4x Ad Nauseam
1x Brain Freeze
4x Culling the Weak
4x Dark Ritual
4x Tainted Pact
I'm looking for more mana acceleration as well as anything that could make this deck better in any way. I tested Cabal Ritual but I kept losing a lot of life when I drew it using Ad Nauseum.
Not to burst your bubble, but there is a deck very similar to this called cheerios which is probably better.
That being said, Cheerios uses glimpse of nature to basically do the same thing AN does but for 1 mana. I remember seeing scapegoat used to reset itself if it had to.
I looked as some cheerios lists the main problem is four copies of Glimpse of Nature is worth about as much as the entire Ad Nauseum deck which would make it hard to stay under $100
Legacy is a super expensive format. when the blue duals cost 200 or so each, budget can mean alot to different people.
Here's Spooky's list from the budget thread:
3 Ad Nauseam
3 Angel's Grace
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Cunning Wish
4 Dark Ritual
4 Duress
4 Lotus Petal
2 Pact of Negation
3 Peer Through Depths
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
1 Sickening Dreams
3 Silence
2 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Brass
4 Darkslick Shores
1 Ebon Stronghold
4 Gemstone Mine
2 Seachrome Coast
Let's budget his list even further to
4 Angel's Grace
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
4 Duress
4 Lotus Petal
4 Peer Through Depths
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
1 Sickening Dreams
4 Silence
1 foil
4 Adarkar Wastes
4 Underground River
4 Caves of Koilos
2 island
The most obvious way to keep the price down is to remove the cunning wish board and add more nasuem and angel's grace. If you don't own the pacts of negation, then drop those since they are 20 each. You drop ancient tombs and just put more painlands in your deck or whatever to make the mana work. Silence is another card you could up or some other type of cantrip.
Basically, you spend 5 mana for your two combo cards and then win the game instantly. The best part is if you are desperate, you fire of AN by itself and try to dig for a petal+angel's grace. The solitary foil is if they wait to try to counter sickening dreams, you can counter back--it also explains the use of your islands as part of the mana base. Islands also help you cantrip to color fix or to find your combo pieces.
With a lotus petal (for white) and a few rituals, you could combo off on turn 1, though that's pretty unlikely. Duress helps you bait countermagic and be proactive.
I can get 87 dollars for the whole list on a major online retailer. Anything you might own (lotus petals, pain lands, rituals, cantrips, etc) it becomes even more affordable.
I saw another list using Phyrexian Unlife as well it looked a bit consistent on later turns
The thread also had some advice that was interesting. I saw a Nic Fit deck blow someone out by flashing in Notion Thief in response to brainstorm (drew 3, opponent lost 2 cards). This would be a far from common problem but since AN puts cards in your hand rather than draws them, such a thing wouldn't work against it.
I don't think it is an optimal deck by any means, but I think you could probably storm a local tournament with it. I mean after all, a guy did really well with splinter twin in a miracle shell during eternal weekend and that's just a really vulnerable combo to being two-for oned. (Admittedly, infinite damage is nice but generally entreat or jace gets the job done). The deck takes 6 mana to work but its not without its merits. You win on the stack, grave yard hate doesn't really hurt you at all (especially if you sack the cabal rituals for simains). Playing around Thalia is easier than it is say for something like storm and trinsphere is a two mana set back instead of back breaking. There's nothing in play for them to interact with at all--every removal spell is dead against you. Even Angel's Grace is acceptable in multiples against an agro deck because it acts like a poor man's fog. The hardest thing is the mana base and we can't really afford to run basics without investing alot more money in fetches and duals (and it would mess with lightning storm too).
Edit:
The non budget thread
Patrician's Scorn is interesting tech the author suggests. It hates out Leyline of Sanctity. Maybe a sideboard card?
I thought about something like using simian or elvish guides to get Manamorphose x2 (would have to not draw the entire deck to avoid losing to the cards) for two black and a blue, then a quicken and an tendrils of agony. Maybe chain some rituals along the way to build up storm. Realistically, it is too many dead cards to ever work though.
here is the "stock" Ad Naus Tendrils list, such as I've been able to divine from top finishes in recent SCG tournaments:
1 Island
2 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
Draw/Tutor (19)
1 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Brainstorm
2 Preordain
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Duress
3 Cabal Therapy
Win Conditions (4)
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Past in Flames
1 Dark Petition
1 Tendrils of Agony
This list clocks in at just shy of $2100 at current prices, which is juuuust a bit outside our price range, and doesn't include a sideboard that may run another $400. Let's look where we can save money.
--Dual Lands: These three cards make up $1000 of the deck's price tag on its own. Replacing them with Ravnica shocklands costs $40 and most of the time will accomplish much the same thing. If Scalding Tarn is outside your price range, consider the much cheaper and recently-reprinted Bloodstained Mire.
--Lion's Eye Diamond: The rest of the mana accelerants (Lotus Petal, Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual) are all budget friendly - LED is most decidedly NOT. Depending on your tastes, you can go with Manamorphose which effectively reads "0: draw a card", doubly so if you're flashing things back, or Rite of Flame if speed is more important over consistency. Your meta may vary, so try it both ways.
--Draw Spells: Most of the draw spells are very budget friendly, the worst offender being Gitaxian Probe at $4 apiece. Sensei's Divining Top is a bit pricy for some, you could swap it for a 3rd preordain or a 15th land. Infernal Tutor is far from the worst offender on a budget, but it also becomes a LOT less useful without LED giving you instant hellbent. For half the price you can just go with Burning Wish and stick a second tendrils in your board (as well as a fair share of sorcery-speed answers to things.)
--Discard Spells: 4 Duress is child's play to pick up. 3 Cabal Therapy is slightly less so. You'll want to get at least one, but you can probably get away with Appetite for Brains as a budget replacement, since it exiles and hits Force of Will - probably the most dangerous thing we have to play around.
--The Core: The 4-card "win finder" package (Ad Nauseam, Dark Petition, Past in Flames, Tendrils) is not something that can easily be replaced. this core will set you back $27 by today's prices, and all things considered gives you a pretty nice bang for your buck.
With that in mind, let's construct the cheap version of the deck:
1 Island
2 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Watery Grave
2 Steam Vents
4 Lotus Petal
4 Rite of Flame
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
Draw/Tutor (19)
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Predorain
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Burning Wish
4 Duress
1 Cabal Therapy
2 Appetite for Brains
Win Conditions (4)
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Dark Petition
1 Past in Flames
1 Tendrils of Agony
This maindeck weighs in at a paltry $350, compared to the $2100 build from the top. However, with the Burning Wish package, the Sideboard needs special attention, and should at least consider the following:
Tendrils of Agony: Yes, another one. Mostly because in your sideboard it's safe from any extract effects, and gives you more reach should your first tendrils come up short for some reason.
Empty the Warrens: For when you can't tendrils your opponent, usually because they have hexproof. It's good to bring in game 2 or 3, but if they've got a surprise game 1 you have ways to get around it.
Massacre: to tell hatebears to piss off. Will almost always be cast for free (or 1 mana if Thalia is about) and just wipes the board. Do note that Gaddock Teeg shuts this off, so if you see a lot of hatebears meta you may want something like Deathmark as well.
Void Snare: Most decks use Chain of Vapor to deal with worrying permanents before going off, but it's an instant. Void Snare does exactly what we need for the same mana cost, and is fetchable with burning wish.
From there it depends a lot on what you expect to face. Most storm decks have 1 Tropical Island in the sideboard to enable Carpet of Flowers and 3-4 Abrupt Decay. We can do those same tricks with Breeding Pool if you're okay with Decay's $13 price tag - though if not, Krosan Grip may be the card for you since decay's biggest purpose is blowing up Counterbalance (yes they can counter grip if there's a 3-ball on top, but they don't get any chance to manipulate their deck once you cast it - so if you know their top card isn't a 3 then it's completely safe).
Flusterstorm is also out of our price range, but Red Elemental Blast on the right card can force your spells through as well.
Hopefully this guide will help people who like ANT but are dissuaded by the pricetag get in on the game.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
Obviously you know how to play the combo (Sac land tendrils isn't THAT different) so my advice would have to be to keep playing and get more data - are you losing to counters, wastelands, extract effects, or just bricking? What decks are you failing to get wins against? Are you bringing in the proper sideboard hate or are you stuck wishing for it?
I want to help, but basically just saying "I can't win matches" doesn't give me anything to go on.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
The best advice I can offer is that you don't have to do EVERYTHING the turn you go off. Fire off a few discard spells, filter draws, just generally play the game on the early turns when you don't have anything readily available. The idea is that by the time that you NEED to go off, your hand will have all the tools to get a kill. This isn't like Oops where you have to try to win the game on the first turn - often you want to wait until the last possible turn (usually staring down lethal) before going for the combo, so that your hand has the highest chance of finishing the job. Don't try comboing out unless you're probably going to lose before getting another turn, or you are 100% sure it'll get there.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
Badlands is still an $80 card on the low end, which for most paper players is too high. VMA made it possible for MODO but playing physical that isn't practical.
Chrome Moxmay be comparable with the fetches price-wise, but having to exile a card to use it seems like it's rarely worth it unless you're comboing out VERY fast - and this deck shouldn't be aiming for FTKs.
Past in Flames why is this in the board? It's what gives this deck most of its reach to ensure a combo kill on the turn you go off, either by digging deeper to hit your wincon or by adding 5 or 6 spells to the storm count to ensure you get there. I've seen a few decks run an EtW maindeck, but in that case you definitely do not need 2 copies of warrens AND two copies of tendrils.
Cabal Therapy is played less than duress because its strike rate is much lower - usually it's used as a gitaxian probe just to be see if there is a counterspell. Meanwhile duress will hit something 90% of the time - that's why you play 4 copies of it and not 4 therapy.
Dread of Night over Massacre or Deathmark seems strange. Any reasoning?
Again, what matters is that it works for you - but those points give me some concern.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP