Please don't be afraid to be condescending if you have to, I know I'm not the greatest deck builder. At a first glance, I'm sure most will see that this deck may be trying to do too many things at once. "Is it a control deck? Discard deck? Or Psychatog deck?" The thing is I like having options =D. Also, this IS in the Budget section, so no Underground Seas, Force of Wills or Planeswalkers over $20. Thank you in advance.
I would stay away from a full 4 Creeping tarpit, that seems like a bit much. I would also suggest exactly what you said you knew we would. You need to make your deck more streamlined.
Maybe play the Thoughtseizes that you have, and possibly the tops and counterbalances, a 1-of Engineered Explosives and 1-of shackles. include your watery graves. That leaves us with something like this.
CounterTop is really inconsistent to just splash. To make it run smoothly, you want at minimum:
4 Brainstorm
3 Sensei's Divining Top
2-3 Counterbalance (if only 2 then you want some Ponders too to dig into it)
The problem is that in a budget deck cards like Brainstorm and Top lose a lot of value because you do not have fetchlands to get free shuffle effects. Without the free shuffles easily available, Brainstorm is worse than Ponder or Preordain and sustaining the CounterTop lock can be awkward when you get stuck unable to reset your top 3. So I would avoid trying to play budget CounterTop unless you can get more shuffle effects. Evolving Wilds is kind of bad but at least it shuffles for you, so maybe worth keeping if you insist on trying CounterTop.
In terms of UB budget manabase, this is Legacy and the first few turns matter a lot so:
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Watery Grave
(to maximize untapped duals on turn 1 so you can turn 1 Thoughtseize or cantrip)
2 Creeping Tar Pit
(more becomes awkward with the comes into play tapped and the activation cost, but having a couple is useful)
Underground River is a bit awkward for a control deck. I wouldn't play painlands in control. If you run enough basics and the 4 Watery Grave, then it might be worth playing the m13 dual that enters untapped if you control an Island or Swamp. I forget what it's called. River of Tears is not terrible if most of your costs are blue. It's actually very clever design, giving you black (or blue) mana on your turn to cast sorcery speed discard and blue mana on opponent's turn to counter spells. There might also be room for 2 Sunken Ruins if you end up playing cards with heavy double mana commitments (e.g. Hymns and Counterspells).
Once you decide on a more solid manabase, then you'll realize you can support Counterspell. This is a huge improvement over Mana Leak, especially when put on Isochron Scepter. Between Scepter lock and CounterTop and Academy Ruins recursion, your deck is obviously playing for the slow long game. In a long game, Mana Leak loses value while Counterspell always hits its target. Counterspell's only drawback is the UU cost, and the solution is just to have a better manabase (or to put it on Isochron). I would then back them up with a couple Spell Pierce main. This gives you a turn 1 counterspell and a functional Mana Leak most of the time.
I would never run more than 2 Vedalken Shackles in any deck (soaks up mana... if you want to see them more often just run more cantrips and library manipulation). And you may want to rethink Shackles altogether depending on what lands you end up playing. If you have enough Islands though then it is awesome.
I wouldn't play Psychatog or Thirst for Knowledge. You don't really have enough gas to combo Psychatog and he's just a vanilla fatty even if you do get to pump him up a lot. I think you're better off relying on winning with creatures with evasion or some useful ability. e.g. Delver of Secrets, Tombstalker, Shadowmage Infiltrator, Desecration Demon, Thopter+Sword combo, etc.
Engineered Explosives, while amazing, is a bit awkward in your deck. You can only ever set it to X=0,1 or 2. X=2 happens to blow up your own Isochron Scepter or Counterbalance. X=1 doesn't kill that many dangerous things that your spells can't already handle. EE really shines in a control deck that a) splashes a 3rd color and b) runs mostly spells and doesn't rely on keeping artifact/enchantment lock pieces on the board. Just a little anti-synergy there.
You'll probably get massive value out of Planeswalkers if you can afford to run any.
I would stick with just efficiency on a budget. Split duress/thoughtseize because of the life loss but both should hit something in any given match. Hymn to Tourach seems pretty sweet of course, but the problem is without immediate pressure the opponent just recovers, so maybe no on hymn. Vedalken Shackles is a good card but with abrupt decay pretty much everywhere and a low Island count, it seems lackluster. Vedalken Shackles shines in monoblue decks that can at least support it well or decks with blue duals. Besides you have access to black, which has some of the best removal in the game. Even budget you have things like smother, edict effects, some mass removal, for library manipulation there is Impulse/Ponder/Preordain and if you want cards in hand Fact or Fiction is pretty good for budget. Problem is how to win in this style deck. If you have it, I would use Batterskull as it seems just about the best thing available.
For some reason, I really don't wanna get rid of the discard theme. Also, Isochron Scepter, Vedalken Shackles, and CounterTop are just too hard to let go of. If Batterskull and the Tezzeret planeswalker were a little cheaper, I would be more than willing to just do a complete 180. Now, is there anything else I can do to fine tune the deck, or am I a lost cause? =S
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Creatures(6):
Sphinx of Jwar Isle x2 (Win Condition)
Nezumi Shortfang x2
Psychatog x2
Artifacts(9):
Vedalken Shackles x3
Sensei's Divining Top x2 (w/ Counterbalance)
Engineered Explosives x2
Isochron Scepter x2
Spells(21):
Mana Leak x4
Thoughtseize x3
Hymn to Tourach x3
Brainstorm x3
Thirst for Knowledge x3 (w/ Psychatog)
Smother x3
Counterbalance x2
Lands(24):
Watery Grave x4
Temple of Deceit x4
Evolving Wilds x4
Island x7
Swamp x4
Academy Ruins x1
Side Board:
Ratchet Bomb x2
Ultimate Price x3
Doom Blade x3
Hero's Downfall x2
Swamp x1
Spell Snare x2
Echoing Truth x2
Please don't be afraid to be condescending if you have to, I know I'm not the greatest deck builder. At a first glance, I'm sure most will see that this deck may be trying to do too many things at once. "Is it a control deck? Discard deck? Or Psychatog deck?" The thing is I like having options =D. Also, this IS in the Budget section, so no Underground Seas, Force of Wills or Planeswalkers over $20. Thank you in advance.
- 4 Deceits
+ 4 Creeping Tarpit
One problem in Legacy (and all formats to a degree) is have a deck with different themes weakens a deck, regardless of what it has.
Temple of Deceit and Evolving Wilds are a no go. Use Darkslick Shores and Underground River instead.
Dimir Signet could be really helpful for you. Really, You may want to try and just combine your list with something like this.
2 Tezzeret the Seeker
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Spells [34]
4 Dimir Signet
4 Duress
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Muddle the Mixture
4 Ponder
4 Smother
4 Spell Pierce
4 Sword of the Meek
1 Talisman of Dominance
4 Thopter Foundry
1 Academy Ruins
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Island
4 Seat of the Synod
1 Swamp
4 Underground River
4 Vault of Whispers
Maybe play the Thoughtseizes that you have, and possibly the tops and counterbalances, a 1-of Engineered Explosives and 1-of shackles. include your watery graves. That leaves us with something like this.
2 Tezzeret the Seeker
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Spells [34]
4 Dimir Signet
4 Thoughtseize
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Muddle the Mixture
4 Ponder
4 Smother
4 Spell Pierce
4 Sword of the Meek
1 Vedalkin Shackles
4 Thopter Foundry
1 Academy Ruins
2 Darkslick Shores
3 Watery Grave
4 Island
4 Seat of the Synod
1 Swamp
3 Underground River
4 Vault of Whispers
I would much rather you played something akin to this, with tezzeret and thopter sword combo as your win conditions, than what you have listed above.
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4 Brainstorm
3 Sensei's Divining Top
2-3 Counterbalance (if only 2 then you want some Ponders too to dig into it)
The problem is that in a budget deck cards like Brainstorm and Top lose a lot of value because you do not have fetchlands to get free shuffle effects. Without the free shuffles easily available, Brainstorm is worse than Ponder or Preordain and sustaining the CounterTop lock can be awkward when you get stuck unable to reset your top 3. So I would avoid trying to play budget CounterTop unless you can get more shuffle effects. Evolving Wilds is kind of bad but at least it shuffles for you, so maybe worth keeping if you insist on trying CounterTop.
In terms of UB budget manabase, this is Legacy and the first few turns matter a lot so:
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Watery Grave
(to maximize untapped duals on turn 1 so you can turn 1 Thoughtseize or cantrip)
2 Creeping Tar Pit
(more becomes awkward with the comes into play tapped and the activation cost, but having a couple is useful)
Underground River is a bit awkward for a control deck. I wouldn't play painlands in control. If you run enough basics and the 4 Watery Grave, then it might be worth playing the m13 dual that enters untapped if you control an Island or Swamp. I forget what it's called. River of Tears is not terrible if most of your costs are blue. It's actually very clever design, giving you black (or blue) mana on your turn to cast sorcery speed discard and blue mana on opponent's turn to counter spells. There might also be room for 2 Sunken Ruins if you end up playing cards with heavy double mana commitments (e.g. Hymns and Counterspells).
Once you decide on a more solid manabase, then you'll realize you can support Counterspell. This is a huge improvement over Mana Leak, especially when put on Isochron Scepter. Between Scepter lock and CounterTop and Academy Ruins recursion, your deck is obviously playing for the slow long game. In a long game, Mana Leak loses value while Counterspell always hits its target. Counterspell's only drawback is the UU cost, and the solution is just to have a better manabase (or to put it on Isochron). I would then back them up with a couple Spell Pierce main. This gives you a turn 1 counterspell and a functional Mana Leak most of the time.
I would never run more than 2 Vedalken Shackles in any deck (soaks up mana... if you want to see them more often just run more cantrips and library manipulation). And you may want to rethink Shackles altogether depending on what lands you end up playing. If you have enough Islands though then it is awesome.
I wouldn't play Psychatog or Thirst for Knowledge. You don't really have enough gas to combo Psychatog and he's just a vanilla fatty even if you do get to pump him up a lot. I think you're better off relying on winning with creatures with evasion or some useful ability. e.g. Delver of Secrets, Tombstalker, Shadowmage Infiltrator, Desecration Demon, Thopter+Sword combo, etc.
Engineered Explosives, while amazing, is a bit awkward in your deck. You can only ever set it to X=0,1 or 2. X=2 happens to blow up your own Isochron Scepter or Counterbalance. X=1 doesn't kill that many dangerous things that your spells can't already handle. EE really shines in a control deck that a) splashes a 3rd color and b) runs mostly spells and doesn't rely on keeping artifact/enchantment lock pieces on the board. Just a little anti-synergy there.
You'll probably get massive value out of Planeswalkers if you can afford to run any.
This is what I came up with:
Creatures(4):
Delver of Secrets x2
Nezumi Shortfang x2
Artifacts(13):
Vedalken Shackles x2
Sensei's Divining Top x2
Engineered Explosives x1
Isochron Scepter x2
Thopter Foundry x3
Sword of the Meek x3
Spells(21):
Counterspell x4
Thoughtseize x3
Hymn to Tourach x3
Brainstorm x3
Ponder x3
Smother x3
Counterbalance x2
Lands(22):
Watery Grave x4
Darkslick Shores x4
Evolving Wilds x4
Sunken Ruins x2
Island x5
Swamp x2
Academy Ruins x1
For some reason, I really don't wanna get rid of the discard theme. Also, Isochron Scepter, Vedalken Shackles, and CounterTop are just too hard to let go of. If Batterskull and the Tezzeret planeswalker were a little cheaper, I would be more than willing to just do a complete 180. Now, is there anything else I can do to fine tune the deck, or am I a lost cause? =S