With Seething Song's banning, my idea of having a backup Modern deck to go with Restore Balance was kinda shot down. I always liked Storm decks, and played Mind's Desire pretty much exclusively back when it was Extended-legal.
So since Modern isn't an option, I've decided to build it in Legacy. I don't plan on taking this to the competitive level (I'd need LEDs at the very least to even contemplate that), so it really doesn't matter how fine-tuned the deck is overall, just that it can pull off a Dragonstorm combo reliably (turn 4 65% of the time is good enough for me).
Of course you'll want to max out on some number of Seething Song, Desperate Ritual, and Rite of Flame. Past in Flames can help you crap out a ton of mana. Black for Dark Ritual and the biggest boosst Cabal Ritual helps as well.
Lotus Bloom would be your best bet for a replacement LED. That's closer to what a modern version would be, I suppose. Ancient Tomb and/or City of Traitors speed things up. I'm not sure which Mox, Chrome or Diamond, you might want to play as well.
You might want some Overmaster, and just go for the combo kill with x4 Hellkite/Kushoku.
You could also go UR like the old extended decks, but I know little about them.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Decks:
Legacy: RWBG Goblins RRR Burn WBU Affinity UBR Sac-Land Tendrils! BBBPox
Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
There probably will come a point where you realize Empty the Warrens is much more effective, both with deck space requirements and early game efficiency.
Of course you'll want to max out on some number of Seething Song, Desperate Ritual, and Rite of Flame. Past in Flames can help you crap out a ton of mana. Black for Dark Ritual and the biggest boosst Cabal Ritual helps as well.
Lotus Bloom would be your best bet for a replacement LED. That's closer to what a modern version would be, I suppose. Ancient Tomb and/or City of Traitors speed things up. I'm not sure which Mox, Chrome or Diamond, you might want to play as well.
My playgroup allows proxies as long as the player using them owns at least 1 copy of the real card, and I happen to have an FtV Mox Diamond, a promo Chrome Mox, and a Mox Opal. I even have 2 Ancient Tombs, so those could work nicely. The Rituals aren't going to be a problem, but the Lotus Boom might (it depends on if I can get one off of a friend, and he may be using it).
You might want some Overmaster, and just go for the combo kill with x4 Hellkite/Kushoku.
I hadn't thought about using Kokusho. I may consider it, although I do want to avoid being crippled by Extirpate effects (hence why I listed the 2-of dragons in the OP).
There probably will come a point where you realize Empty the Warrens is much more effective, both with deck space requirements and early game efficiency.
That much is planned on. The sideboard will be designed to mix up the decklist to be faster, that way I can just tweak the actual list and play it psuedo-competitively (there aren't any real Legacy players where I live though).
You definitely need blue for digging for dragonstorm. Running black for Infernal Tutor + LED is not budget friendly :/.
Also i dont think that you can support 3 colors with a budget mana base.
I actually have a set of RTR/GTC Shocks and the Fetches available to me, so I can pull off a slightly less budget Grixis mana base. I'd be lacking the Duals, but I could make do with a "Suicide" list.
The Moxes are a given (I'm so glad I got one for my Toshiro EDH deck), but since I have Ancient Tombs I'm not sure about Crystal Vein. I'd have to find my real copy.
Seeing as I can access Moxen, would it be better if I used those instead of Lotus Petals (which I don't actually have, and would need to trade for before I could proxy them)?
i think one of the problems with Dragonstorm in legacy is that there is a lot of fasters decks in this format. So i think that you should focus on rituals and mox(or lotus ) artifacts for mana ramp maybe adding some Lion's Eye Diamond for a final ramp. you could add black for Dark ritual and Cabal Ritual that with past in flames would add a ton of Black mana. But, yeah , i wouldn't discount Dragonstorm from modern yet. I think that Dragonstorm has a chance in a BR built
LED would not go in dragonstorm regardless. The only way you would be able to use it would be in response to a burning wish or other tutor that is fetching the dragonstorm, which means you would need to be able to produce 11 mana in one turn. Legacy storm decks have a hard enough time producing 5-7 mana in one turn as it is, so 11 is very unrealistic. Heck, reaching the 9 for the dragonstorm is tough. I think your best bet is a u/r or u/r/b version of the deck. 3 colors is possible if you run City of Brass, Gemstone Mine and some of the scarz dual lands. Ponder and preordain would be a must, with peer through depths following close behind to search for your win card. Dark ritual, seething song, rite of flame and cabal ritual are your rituals of choice. Lotus petal is your mana rock.
Spooky, that list is a good start. However, I wouldn't run rorix bladewing. Karrthus, tyrant of jund is much stronger as two bogardan hellkites and him is 27 damage (10 etb and 17 attack). Lotus petal also seems sort of weak. I think that would be better as disruption, as you +1 mana isn't really worth it when you're trying to generate 9 in something like 3 cards. Also, even though you're not running fetches, brainstorm is a no brainer in here for the ability to put back drawn dragons.
Karrthus, tyrant of jund is not in my list becuase it is pretty much impossible to hard cast him. Lethal damage is lethal damage regardless, and the option to hard cast one of your dragons in a pickle is definitely something I would want to have. At least this way he is not completely dead in your hand, like karrthus is.
I don't run brainstorm because without fetches the card is actually pretty bad. If you cast it and see nothing (which happens quite often) you cant shuffle away the dead cards, leaving you with 3 turns of dead draws. This equates to you losing. If you could shuffle away the dragons it owuld make much more sense, but you cant. Ponder and preordain are much better choices when you dont have fetchlands to shuffle your deck.
Because of the high casting cost of dragonstorm (9) compared to a more typical storm win condition card (5 for ad nauseum, 4 for empty the warrens, 6 for burning wish+empty the warrens) you can't really afford to include disruption in the list in my opinion. You need all the mana you can get, as early as you can get it. You are not producing 9 mana with 3 cards, you are producing it with 5+. Beyond this, the deck is 3 colors, which means a mana rock that can produce any color is invaluable.
Of course, this is all my opinion, but I think I back it up with pretty solid points. The Karrthus thing may be a moot point, but I think it makes sense that being able to hard cast him if you want is pretty nice. maybe run 1 karrthas, 2 hellkite and 2 rorix?
Oh, I understood where you were coming from. However, if you don't have threshold, then cabal ritual may as well be desperate ritual as they are pretty well the same at that point.
I don't disagree that brainstorm can be pretty bad without fetches. On the other hand, I would also make the point that it is also disruption protection, in a way. And the ability to put dragons back is the reason I would run it, not necessarily to shuffle them away.
To be honest, the black card I would run in this deck is in fact, infernal tutor. The ability to doubles on your big rituals is actually pretty important, and if you've already emptied your hand, then you can go fetch the win condition. I used to use infernal tutor to get extra copies of rite of flame and seething song.
Karrthus may or may not be a moot point. I still feel it's better than rorix. Opinions only, of course.
I have a dragonstorm list I had put together that ran Dragonlord Dramoka, Dragonlord Kolaghan, Atarka World Render combo of dragons by using mizzix mastery a red loot spells with rituals to get it done.
Sadly, I have not been able to get ahold of the dragonstorms and the mizzix mastery
Two nights ago I played the deck and this was the 2nd week of playing the deck I have discovered that every time I had gotten one of the three dragons in my openimg hands or simply drawing one of them while trying to go for it has caused me to lose the game. I had given the deck a shot and have failed miserably I am scrapping the deck.
The Dragons I used when I tried this deck recently in Modern were 1 each of:
Thundermaw Hellkite
Stormbreath Dragon
Dragonlord Kolaghan
Atarka, World Render
Scourge of Valkas
Bogardan Hellkite
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
So since Modern isn't an option, I've decided to build it in Legacy. I don't plan on taking this to the competitive level (I'd need LEDs at the very least to even contemplate that), so it really doesn't matter how fine-tuned the deck is overall, just that it can pull off a Dragonstorm combo reliably (turn 4 65% of the time is good enough for me).
I figure the basics would be this:
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Lotus Petal
4 Dragonstorm
2 Bogardan Hellkite
2 Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund
3 Hunted Dragon
What else does the deck need?
Driving Stick with Isochron Scepter.
Trinkets and Treasure: An Artificer's Toolbox.
Proc Drops: Playing with One Drops.
Deck Primer: Toshiro Umezawa
Lotus Bloom would be your best bet for a replacement LED. That's closer to what a modern version would be, I suppose. Ancient Tomb and/or City of Traitors speed things up. I'm not sure which Mox, Chrome or Diamond, you might want to play as well.
You might want some Overmaster, and just go for the combo kill with x4 Hellkite/Kushoku.
You could also go UR like the old extended decks, but I know little about them.
Legacy:
RWBG Goblins
RRR Burn
WBU Affinity
UBR Sac-Land Tendrils!
BBBPox
Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
Pauper:
RGoblins
URCloudpost
other decks
Goblins.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=496372
My playgroup allows proxies as long as the player using them owns at least 1 copy of the real card, and I happen to have an FtV Mox Diamond, a promo Chrome Mox, and a Mox Opal. I even have 2 Ancient Tombs, so those could work nicely. The Rituals aren't going to be a problem, but the Lotus Boom might (it depends on if I can get one off of a friend, and he may be using it).
I hadn't thought about using Kokusho. I may consider it, although I do want to avoid being crippled by Extirpate effects (hence why I listed the 2-of dragons in the OP).
That much is planned on. The sideboard will be designed to mix up the decklist to be faster, that way I can just tweak the actual list and play it psuedo-competitively (there aren't any real Legacy players where I live though).
I actually have a set of RTR/GTC Shocks and the Fetches available to me, so I can pull off a slightly less budget Grixis mana base. I'd be lacking the Duals, but I could make do with a "Suicide" list.
Thanks for the link. I'll be sure to scour it.
The Moxes are a given (I'm so glad I got one for my Toshiro EDH deck), but since I have Ancient Tombs I'm not sure about Crystal Vein. I'd have to find my real copy.
Seeing as I can access Moxen, would it be better if I used those instead of Lotus Petals (which I don't actually have, and would need to trade for before I could proxy them)?
Driving Stick with Isochron Scepter.
Trinkets and Treasure: An Artificer's Toolbox.
Proc Drops: Playing with One Drops.
Deck Primer: Toshiro Umezawa
3 Overmaster
4 Preordain
2 Ponder
4 Lotus Bloom
4 Rite of Flame
3 Seething Song
1 past in flames
1 Dragonstorm
3 Lotus Petal
2 Manamorphose
3 force of will
i think one of the problems with Dragonstorm in legacy is that there is a lot of fasters decks in this format. So i think that you should focus on rituals and mox(or lotus ) artifacts for mana ramp maybe adding some Lion's Eye Diamond for a final ramp. you could add black for Dark ritual and Cabal Ritual that with past in flames would add a ton of Black mana. But, yeah , i wouldn't discount Dragonstorm from modern yet. I think that Dragonstorm has a chance in a BR built
EDIT: maybe you can add Lotus Vale like a one sided Seething Song or Dark ritual effect
you could open a:
2 lands
1 Lotus Vale
2 Seething Song
1 Dragonstorm
and win on Turn2 with 4 Bogardan Hellkite ...
Maybe add Gemstone Caverns for a 1 st turn win
I'm thinking maybe a list like this...
3 Bogardan Hellkite
2 Rorix Bladewing
Spells [39]
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
4 Dragonstorm
4 Manamorphose
4 Lotus Petal
3 Peer Through Depths
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
4 Rite of Flame
4 Seething Song
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 City of Brass
4 Gemstone Mine
2 Sandstone Needle
2 Saprazzan Skerry
this list comes to $130 and in goldfishing it just a few times I have had a turn 2, turn 3 and turn 5 win, which is pretty decent.
Like Squandered Resources on Facebook for updates on article releases, deck lists, and more!
Getting Started in Legacy and Legacy Budget Primer 5!
Special thanks to Bornnover for the banner used in those articles.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
I don't run brainstorm because without fetches the card is actually pretty bad. If you cast it and see nothing (which happens quite often) you cant shuffle away the dead cards, leaving you with 3 turns of dead draws. This equates to you losing. If you could shuffle away the dragons it owuld make much more sense, but you cant. Ponder and preordain are much better choices when you dont have fetchlands to shuffle your deck.
Because of the high casting cost of dragonstorm (9) compared to a more typical storm win condition card (5 for ad nauseum, 4 for empty the warrens, 6 for burning wish+empty the warrens) you can't really afford to include disruption in the list in my opinion. You need all the mana you can get, as early as you can get it. You are not producing 9 mana with 3 cards, you are producing it with 5+. Beyond this, the deck is 3 colors, which means a mana rock that can produce any color is invaluable.
Of course, this is all my opinion, but I think I back it up with pretty solid points. The Karrthus thing may be a moot point, but I think it makes sense that being able to hard cast him if you want is pretty nice. maybe run 1 karrthas, 2 hellkite and 2 rorix?
Like Squandered Resources on Facebook for updates on article releases, deck lists, and more!
Getting Started in Legacy and Legacy Budget Primer 5!
Special thanks to Bornnover for the banner used in those articles.
I don't disagree that brainstorm can be pretty bad without fetches. On the other hand, I would also make the point that it is also disruption protection, in a way. And the ability to put dragons back is the reason I would run it, not necessarily to shuffle them away.
To be honest, the black card I would run in this deck is in fact, infernal tutor. The ability to doubles on your big rituals is actually pretty important, and if you've already emptied your hand, then you can go fetch the win condition. I used to use infernal tutor to get extra copies of rite of flame and seething song.
Karrthus may or may not be a moot point. I still feel it's better than rorix. Opinions only, of course.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
Sadly, I have not been able to get ahold of the dragonstorms and the mizzix mastery
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
Thundermaw Hellkite
Stormbreath Dragon
Dragonlord Kolaghan
Atarka, World Render
Scourge of Valkas
Bogardan Hellkite