Hey guys as the title says what do you feel the top ten (non fetch/duel) cards are in the format? Off the top of my head (Not in order).
Brainstorm
Delver of secrets
Deathrite
Jace, the mind sculptor
Hymn To Discard cards
LED
Force
Wasteland
Goyf
Swords to plowshares
Keep it friendly guys this is obviously a contentious topic! Have fun with it
I don't see many decks continuing to run JtMS. Control decks were the only things playing him and using him as a finisher, and in most control decks, Monastery Mentor kills faster and is a little harder to interact with.
This may change if the Cruise banhammer results in less maindeck Pyroblast and Lightning Bolt, however.
My picks (and I know I'm missing something obvious):
1 - Brainstorm
2 - FoW
3 - Wasteland (despite being out of favor during Cruise's reign of terror)
4 - Show and Tell
5 - Fetchlands (making this one category)
6 - Dig Through Time (bad Cruise is still sick)
7 - Pyroblast
8 - Monastery Mentor (not yet proven; if I overrate this, Young Pyromancer will replace it)
9 - Liliana of the Veil
10 - Revised duals
Goyf, JtMS and DRS are excellent cards that don't really have decks at the moment. You can still play them and they will still be good. I feel terrible not putting Thoughtseize on the list, but I felt the lands that define the format (fetches) and their lesser cousins that synergize so well with them (duals) need to be on.
This question is super easy, and uses data This makeup may change slightly with the banning of Treasure Cruise, but considering Delver decks were super popular before TC, I suspect they will remain so after as well.
Without looking at actual charts, not counting duels and fetches.
1) Brainstorm
2) Force Of Will
3) Delver Of Secrets
4) Stoneforge Mystic
5) Wasteland
6) Sensei's Divining Top
7) Show And Tell
8) Thoughtseize
9) Lightning Bolt
10) Swords To Plowshares
1) Brainstorm
2) Delver of Secrets
3) Wasteland
4) Show and Tell
5) Sensei's Divining Top
6) Force of Will
7) Tendrils of Agony
8) Dread Return
9) Liliana of the Veil
10) Abrupt Decay
Lili as stronger than Jace? Interesting take on the meta I approve! Thanks for the replies everyone! And I know you can look at legacy meta game datasets but I don't care about those, I care about what players feel the strongest cards are.
Lili as stronger than Jace? Interesting take on the meta I approve! Thanks for the replies everyone! And I know you can look at legacy meta game datasets but I don't care about those, I care about what players feel the strongest cards are.
Lili is weaker in a vacuum, but I do not expect Jace to have a home going forward. I just feel he's badly positioned against the better decks in the format.
The card is *busted*, but isn't really the best card at any role, and is so thoroughly trumped by two widely-played cards (Pyroblast, Lightning Bolt) and has never been at its best in a format where deploying multiple creatures is a thing (and Young Pyromancer and the more explosive FRF version do exactly that).
Control just performs better in the present environment if it aims to kill with Stoneforge/Batterskull, or Monastery Mentor, or Entreat the Angels. If Pyroblast falls out of favor, JtMS may improve back to top ten status.
Lili, OTOH, goes into totally different decks - decks that are just fine with playing an ultra-disruptive PW and that can protect her if needed. She too is soft to Pyromancer and Mentor but not as soft as Jace is.
Pretty solid reasoning! With cruise being banned I do not expect red blasts to be played in the main outside of a one of in miracles (pre khans style). Regardless thanks for your take on it!
Well I'll go with generic good cards in no particular order
1)brainstorm
2)wasteland
3)stifle
4)abrupt decay
5)pernicious deed
6)orim's chant
7)pyroblast/REB
8)force of will
9)chalice of the void/trinisphere
10)liliana/jace/elspeth
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------------------- Keep Abiding or Get Mangled ------------------
Very diverse list I like it! Didn't see your earlier replies sorry I did not respond! The 10 cards you feel are the best in legacy (although Im pretty sure you already did that writing it here might help anyone else wondering about a more specific criteria).
I wouldn't call orim's chant underplayed. It is terrible in storm and the only other place for it is in mighty quinn/imprint on scepter/that's just cold to so many things namely abrupt decay. I haven't sleeved up chant in forever. It has no real place in legacy.
My top 10
Brainstorm
Force of Will
Lion's Eye Diamond
Show and tell
Griselbrand
Wasteland
Stoneforge mystic
Dig Through Time
Deathrite Shaman
Lightning Bolt
No real order to them but it's hard to go wrong with any of the above 10 cards in legacy.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Brainstorm
Force of Will
Wasteland
Delver of Secrets
Stoneforge Mystic
Deathrite Shaman
Swords to Plowshares
Lion's Eye Diamond
Griselbrand
Sensei's Divining Top
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Thanks to Gabgabdevo for the awesome sig image!
I'm always looking for foil Madcap Skills and Ghitu Fire-Eater, [trade thread link forthcoming]
Pretty sure it should be like:
1: island
2: Scalding tarn
3: brainstorm
4: force of will
5: ponder
6: daze
7: gitaxian probe
8: delver of secrets
9: misty rain forest
10: volcanic island
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So two Opalescence and a Humility walk into a bar, I forget the rest of the joke but your sanctioned judge is a scrub.
I wouldn't call orim's chant underplayed. It is terrible in storm and the only other place for it is in mighty quinn/imprint on scepter/that's just cold to so many things namely abrupt decay. I haven't sleeved up chant in forever. It has no real place in legacy.
My top 10
Brainstorm
Force of Will
Lion's Eye Diamond
Show and tell
Griselbrand
Wasteland
Stoneforge mystic
Dig Through Time
Deathrite Shaman
Lightning Bolt
No real order to them but it's hard to go wrong with any of the above 10 cards in legacy.
I think including both SnT and Griselbrand is a mistake, as their power is joined. Especially since you then include Mystic, an enabler.
Is DTT that powerful currently?
STATISTICS.
All of these "Let's eliminate bad cards" crusades are simply ignorant. And when they start to devolve into "WotC is conspiring to give us crappy cards," they just become embarrassing. MATH is conspiring to give you crappy cards.
BS
FoW
LED
SDT
Another Acronym
Delver
Stoneforge Mystic
SnT
Ponder
Daze
Bolt
I base this primarily on format regulators, FoW and Daze, and cards which spawned powerful decks. Delver's impact on Delver, SnT, SDT on Miracles/Countertop, Mystic on Blade decks, and LED on any number of combo decks.
STATISTICS.
All of these "Let's eliminate bad cards" crusades are simply ignorant. And when they start to devolve into "WotC is conspiring to give us crappy cards," they just become embarrassing. MATH is conspiring to give you crappy cards.
Here are the little self-imposed guidelines I'm working with for the multiplayer decks I've been building:
• Must be cheap. Total price tag < $100, preferably < $50. Ideally ~$30. No one card greater than about ~$6
• Format: Modern (makes getting the cards somewhat easier for the play group, and almost all my cards are Modern-legal)
• Must be relatively interesting in 1:1 games. I don't need to win against Splinter Twin, but I should be able to play duels now and then
• Avoid instant-win combos; they only serve to make me target #1, and then the deck is worse than useless because I get killed first, every time
• Must have a funny name!
1. Brainstorm
2. Force of Will
3. Ponder
4. Daze
5. Delver of Secrets
6. Wasteland
7. Swords to Plowshare
8. Sensei's Divining Top
9. Dig Through Time
10. Jace, the Mindsculptor
Delver doesn't belong on these lists, as the power behind those decks is whichever one they run of Young Pyromancer and/or Monastery Mentor.
The deck is only named Delver because in older (pre-Pyromancer's printing) versions of the deck that ran some combination of Goyf, Delver, Mongoose, Geist and Edric as combat creatures, Delver was then the best of them. It wasn't a particularly great deck then. Pyromancer's printing took the deck from tier 2 to tier 1.
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Brainstorm
Delver of secrets
Deathrite
Jace, the mind sculptor
Hymn To Discard cards
LED
Force
Wasteland
Goyf
Swords to plowshares
Keep it friendly guys this is obviously a contentious topic! Have fun with it
This may change if the Cruise banhammer results in less maindeck Pyroblast and Lightning Bolt, however.
My picks (and I know I'm missing something obvious):
1 - Brainstorm
2 - FoW
3 - Wasteland (despite being out of favor during Cruise's reign of terror)
4 - Show and Tell
5 - Fetchlands (making this one category)
6 - Dig Through Time (bad Cruise is still sick)
7 - Pyroblast
8 - Monastery Mentor (not yet proven; if I overrate this, Young Pyromancer will replace it)
9 - Liliana of the Veil
10 - Revised duals
Goyf, JtMS and DRS are excellent cards that don't really have decks at the moment. You can still play them and they will still be good. I feel terrible not putting Thoughtseize on the list, but I felt the lands that define the format (fetches) and their lesser cousins that synergize so well with them (duals) need to be on.
http://www.mtgdecks.net/formats/view/Legacy
or
http://www.mtggoldfish.com/format-staples/legacy
Modern: WUBValue Titan UMerfolk WGDeath and Taxes
1) Brainstorm
2) Force Of Will
3) Delver Of Secrets
4) Stoneforge Mystic
5) Wasteland
6) Sensei's Divining Top
7) Show And Tell
8) Thoughtseize
9) Lightning Bolt
10) Swords To Plowshares
Top 10
Treasure CruiseTop 11-20
21+
I buy HP and Damaged cards!
Only EDH:
Sigarda, Host of Herons: Enchantress' Enchantments
Jenara, Asura of War: ETB Value Town
Purphoros, God of the Forge: Global Punishment
Xenagos, God of Revels: Ramp, Sneak, & Heavy Hitters
Ghave, Guru of Spores: Dies_to_Doom_Blade's stax list
Edric, Spymaster of Trest: Donald's list
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
2) Delver of Secrets
3) Wasteland
4) Show and Tell
5) Sensei's Divining Top
6) Force of Will
7) Tendrils of Agony
8) Dread Return
9) Liliana of the Veil
10) Abrupt Decay
Lili is weaker in a vacuum, but I do not expect Jace to have a home going forward. I just feel he's badly positioned against the better decks in the format.
The card is *busted*, but isn't really the best card at any role, and is so thoroughly trumped by two widely-played cards (Pyroblast, Lightning Bolt) and has never been at its best in a format where deploying multiple creatures is a thing (and Young Pyromancer and the more explosive FRF version do exactly that).
Control just performs better in the present environment if it aims to kill with Stoneforge/Batterskull, or Monastery Mentor, or Entreat the Angels. If Pyroblast falls out of favor, JtMS may improve back to top ten status.
Lili, OTOH, goes into totally different decks - decks that are just fine with playing an ultra-disruptive PW and that can protect her if needed. She too is soft to Pyromancer and Mentor but not as soft as Jace is.
1)brainstorm
2)wasteland
3)stifle
4)abrupt decay
5)pernicious deed
6)orim's chant
7)pyroblast/REB
8)force of will
9)chalice of the void/trinisphere
10)liliana/jace/elspeth
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
-----The Legacy Flowchart-----
Tiny Leaders Overlord
ponder
gitaxian probe
force of will
wasteland
abrupt decay
lion's eye diamond
lightning bolt
daze
stoneforge mystic
My top 10
Brainstorm
Force of Will
Lion's Eye Diamond
Show and tell
Griselbrand
Wasteland
Stoneforge mystic
Dig Through Time
Deathrite Shaman
Lightning Bolt
No real order to them but it's hard to go wrong with any of the above 10 cards in legacy.
Currently Playing:
Retired
Force of Will
Brainstorm
Stoneforge Mystic
Wasteland
Lion's Eye Diamond
Delver of Secrets
Tarmogoyf
Show and Tell
Jace
Liliana
Force of Will
Wasteland
Delver of Secrets
Stoneforge Mystic
Deathrite Shaman
Swords to Plowshares
Lion's Eye Diamond
Griselbrand
Sensei's Divining Top
Thanks to Gabgabdevo for the awesome sig image!
I'm always looking for foil Madcap Skills and Ghitu Fire-Eater, [trade thread link forthcoming]
1: island
2: Scalding tarn
3: brainstorm
4: force of will
5: ponder
6: daze
7: gitaxian probe
8: delver of secrets
9: misty rain forest
10: volcanic island
I think including both SnT and Griselbrand is a mistake, as their power is joined. Especially since you then include Mystic, an enabler.
Is DTT that powerful currently?
FoW
LED
SDT
Another Acronym
Delver
Stoneforge Mystic
SnT
Ponder
Daze
Bolt
I base this primarily on format regulators, FoW and Daze, and cards which spawned powerful decks. Delver's impact on Delver, SnT, SDT on Miracles/Countertop, Mystic on Blade decks, and LED on any number of combo decks.
• Must be cheap. Total price tag < $100, preferably < $50. Ideally ~$30. No one card greater than about ~$6
• Format: Modern (makes getting the cards somewhat easier for the play group, and almost all my cards are Modern-legal)
• Must be relatively interesting in 1:1 games. I don't need to win against Splinter Twin, but I should be able to play duels now and then
• Avoid instant-win combos; they only serve to make me target #1, and then the deck is worse than useless because I get killed first, every time
• Must have a funny name!
2. Force of Will
3. Ponder
4. Daze
5. Delver of Secrets
6. Wasteland
7. Swords to Plowshare
8. Sensei's Divining Top
9. Dig Through Time
10. Jace, the Mindsculptor
EDH: Xenagos, God of Revels.
my take (i'm very sure i'll leave something very important out):
Brainstorm
Force of Will
Lion's Eye Diamond
Sensei's Divining Top
Wasteland
Lightning Bolt
Stoneforge Mystic
Jace, The Mind Sculptor
Tarmogoyf
Stifle
The deck is only named Delver because in older (pre-Pyromancer's printing) versions of the deck that ran some combination of Goyf, Delver, Mongoose, Geist and Edric as combat creatures, Delver was then the best of them. It wasn't a particularly great deck then. Pyromancer's printing took the deck from tier 2 to tier 1.