Clone effects never worked off show and tell. You have to announce what to clone before any of the cards hit the battlefield. This change makes the card worse because you can now die to an opposing fatty.
OMG at least someone knew.
I was going to start bashing my head against the wall reading this drivel.
SnT got worse, because you can now lose to your opponents big fat creature, where as before, you couldn't.
The real change I'm interested in the SB one. being able to start a deck at 75/0 loaded with silver bullets for, well, whatever and then SB out chaffe for whoever you're playing against. Seems like it could be reasonable.
This could change deck construction completely. Expect to see a lot more decks with tutors.
I was going to start bashing my head against the wall reading this drivel.
.
Dude it irratates me because fauna shaman into metamorph in maverick no longer works against show and tell. The deck has enough trouble with that matchup already.
People know what they are talking about, don't be an ass.
I have a question. I'm playing Omni Tell. I Show and Tell Omniscience onto the field. I then drop Emrakul, getting an extra turn. If I then drop another Emrakul, killing my first one, do I then get a second extra turn, thus giving me 2 extra turns? If so, then that's essentially an auto win.
Dude it irratates me because fauna shaman into metamorph in maverick no longer works against show and tell. The deck has enough trouble with that matchup already.
People know what they are talking about, don't be an ass.
I believe he was talking about putting in a clone off show and tell. Not everybody knows that you can't copy what the SnT player puts in if you put a clone in.
I have a question. I'm playing Omni Tell. I Show and Tell Omniscience onto the field. I then drop Emrakul, getting an extra turn. If I then drop another Emrakul, killing my first one, do I then get a second extra turn, thus giving me 2 extra turns? If so, then that's essentially an auto win.
Yea, but to be fair you weren't going to lose if you had double Emrakul and Omniscience in play anyway/
This change is going to change nothing. It just some small tweeks. Calm down.
This change rewards having 4 Liliana of the Veil in the decks that play it. It allows Gaea's Cradle chains. People have pointed out many other interactions. Decks are going to change to take advantage of these interactions.
Well...now my dead mox opals will be usefull but once they drop a jitte my deck will die no matter what (yes i play affinity) time to play some artifact hate mainboard :(.
Also I fear Legacy will become more of the Jace TMS race than anything else.
Quite the opposite I think. It used to the a "Race to the Jace", look at Jace Beleren, used for nothing but racing. Now without the exploding Legend rule, you won't be that much behind if you played Jace 1 or 2 turns late. Eventually Jace will draw so many cards, 1 or 2 extra on either side doesn't matter.
Guys, SnT mirrors were ALREADY lost by the first Show and Tell. It was a bad idea as it is to cast a Show, unless you had Sneak Attack and multiple fatties or Omniscience and a combo card. The matrix hasn't changed:
You show Emrakul, they show Emrakul, old rules you lose because you lost a Show and a fatty plus any Petals, new rules you lose cause they get the first attack.
You show Emrakul, they show Griselbrand, old rules you lose because they draw 14 and kill you, new rules unchanged.
You show Griselbrand, they show Emrakul, old rules you lose because thy get the first attack step and you're not likely to have mana to do anything with the 14 you draw on your turn, new rules unchanged.
You show Griselbrand, they show Griselbrand, old rules you lose because you wasted a Show and a fatty, new rules you lose because they get the first attack.
As always, if either player shows a Sneak or Omni instead the values change. But don't pretend that the legend rule was the deciding factor.
Oh, I thought he was talking about playing a spell that is countering a spell with counters on it as it comes into play, but I see you guys were just discussing whether he was flashing a creature with flash in order to flash a flashback or just flashing a creature with flash but not needing flash in order to flashback a spell without flash.
I don't know about you guys but at my 5 local store in legacy, 2/3 of people are playing Jace, the mind sculptor, with this new rules it's going to be ridiculous.
It's time to get Jace ban for the health of legacy.
I can understand the Planeswalker rule - sort of. Think about it, if they keep printing different iterations of the same names, and there are 10 different Jaces and 10 different Lilianas, I can see the complications of the planeswalker/legend rule always killing them. My gut tells me identical planeswalkers on each side (JTMS VS JTMS) should not be allowed.
Not sure why they changed the legend rule. It seemed fine. Probably foreshadowing for something theyre going to print.
It's time to get Jace ban for the health of legacy.
Or people could play Vindicate. Or Dreadbore. Or Pithing Needle. Or Termogoyf/Battrrskull/Knight of the Reliquary/any number of other fatties and just swing in.
As much as I hate the idea of the jace race, I don't think it's goimg to wreck the format at all.
I think at the next tourney I go to, I'm going to find space for that, perhaps in the sideboard. I can't wait to see my opponents face when I "EOT, Intuition, Loam/Depths/Stage"
I think at the next tourney I go to, I'm going to find space for that, perhaps in the sideboard. I can't wait to see my opponents face when I "EOT, Intuition, Loam/Depths/Stage"
Problem is, it's not really necessary. I play Lands as well, and we can usually find a lock or an answer if we have an intuition and our grave isn't bring threatened. It does win quicker if time is an issue for you in tournaments. But realistically, we could run singleton Stronghold, Depths, and Hexmage already and get the combo, but nobody does. This just makes it slightly more resilient and Thespian's Stage isn't a 100% dead card in our deck.
Oh, I thought he was talking about playing a spell that is countering a spell with counters on it as it comes into play, but I see you guys were just discussing whether he was flashing a creature with flash in order to flash a flashback or just flashing a creature with flash but not needing flash in order to flashback a spell without flash.
Dude it irratates me because fauna shaman into metamorph in maverick no longer works against show and tell. The deck has enough trouble with that matchup already.
People know what they are talking about, don't be an ass.
It never worked, unless you were planning to hardcast or Vial or something.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Due to real-life obligations, I am taking a long break from Magic which may include missing the local Legacy GP. Apologies for not being able to keep my threads updated.
I dont like the idea of playing a planeswalker into the same one that you or your opponent has out, killing theirs and then using an ability. That seems like such a tempo advantage and a big game swing. Especially in the idea of jace or liliana.
I dont like the idea of playing a planeswalker into the same one that you or your opponent has out, killing theirs and then using an ability. That seems like such a tempo advantage and a big game swing. Especially in the idea of jace or liliana.
Then it's a good thing the new uniqueness rule doesn't actually work the way you described, right?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"[Screw] you and the green you ramped in on." - My EDH battle cry. If I had one. Which I don't.
I dont like the idea of playing a planeswalker into the same one that you or your opponent has out, killing theirs and then using an ability. That seems like such a tempo advantage and a big game swing. Especially in the idea of jace or liliana.
You don't get to kill theirs (by any new state-based effects).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Due to real-life obligations, I am taking a long break from Magic which may include missing the local Legacy GP. Apologies for not being able to keep my threads updated.
I do love Knight of the Reliquary not only being a good toolbox dude, but also a way to search up my 20/20...
I'll still use my girl to wasteland someone into oblivion and give me cradle. Just sayin'
ANYWHO....upon further review this is the worst rules change I have seen in a long while. I can't wait for people to double liliana against me.
/sarcasm
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
That which nourishes me, destroys me
10th at SCG: Syracuse (2014), GP:NJ Last-Chance Grinder Winner (2014):: Former Legacy Mod
I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
OMG at least someone knew.
I was going to start bashing my head against the wall reading this drivel.
SnT got worse, because you can now lose to your opponents big fat creature, where as before, you couldn't.
The real change I'm interested in the SB one. being able to start a deck at 75/0 loaded with silver bullets for, well, whatever and then SB out chaffe for whoever you're playing against. Seems like it could be reasonable.
This could change deck construction completely. Expect to see a lot more decks with tutors.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the amazing sig.
NO RUG: Primer
Tempo Thresh: Primer
Dude it irratates me because fauna shaman into metamorph in maverick no longer works against show and tell. The deck has enough trouble with that matchup already.
People know what they are talking about, don't be an ass.
Run it with Explorations, Life from the Loams and Intuitions?
Isn't that a deck already?
Thanks for spiderboy4 of High~Light_Studios for the kick ass avatar.
Thanks for DarkNightCavalier of HotPS for the exceptional signature.
I believe he was talking about putting in a clone off show and tell. Not everybody knows that you can't copy what the SnT player puts in if you put a clone in.
Have any questions or concerns? Come take a dip in my pool.
Yea, but to be fair you weren't going to lose if you had double Emrakul and Omniscience in play anyway/
BGStandard Green AggroGB
UWRGModern Saheeli CobraGRWU
UBRGLegacy StormGRBU
Wizards Certified Rules Advisor
This change rewards having 4 Liliana of the Veil in the decks that play it. It allows Gaea's Cradle chains. People have pointed out many other interactions. Decks are going to change to take advantage of these interactions.
Yes..... Relevent.... now go! Bring that to a tournament and win!
Quite the opposite I think. It used to the a "Race to the Jace", look at Jace Beleren, used for nothing but racing. Now without the exploding Legend rule, you won't be that much behind if you played Jace 1 or 2 turns late. Eventually Jace will draw so many cards, 1 or 2 extra on either side doesn't matter.
You show Emrakul, they show Emrakul, old rules you lose because you lost a Show and a fatty plus any Petals, new rules you lose cause they get the first attack.
You show Emrakul, they show Griselbrand, old rules you lose because they draw 14 and kill you, new rules unchanged.
You show Griselbrand, they show Emrakul, old rules you lose because thy get the first attack step and you're not likely to have mana to do anything with the 14 you draw on your turn, new rules unchanged.
You show Griselbrand, they show Griselbrand, old rules you lose because you wasted a Show and a fatty, new rules you lose because they get the first attack.
As always, if either player shows a Sneak or Omni instead the values change. But don't pretend that the legend rule was the deciding factor.
-regarding Snapcaster Mage.
It's time to get Jace ban for the health of legacy.
Not sure why they changed the legend rule. It seemed fine. Probably foreshadowing for something theyre going to print.
Pretty sure Jund is still a deck. Though it eats walkers with ease.
Or people could play Vindicate. Or Dreadbore. Or Pithing Needle. Or Termogoyf/Battrrskull/Knight of the Reliquary/any number of other fatties and just swing in.
As much as I hate the idea of the jace race, I don't think it's goimg to wreck the format at all.
Have any questions or concerns? Come take a dip in my pool.
I think at the next tourney I go to, I'm going to find space for that, perhaps in the sideboard. I can't wait to see my opponents face when I "EOT, Intuition, Loam/Depths/Stage"
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
Problem is, it's not really necessary. I play Lands as well, and we can usually find a lock or an answer if we have an intuition and our grave isn't bring threatened. It does win quicker if time is an issue for you in tournaments. But realistically, we could run singleton Stronghold, Depths, and Hexmage already and get the combo, but nobody does. This just makes it slightly more resilient and Thespian's Stage isn't a 100% dead card in our deck.
-regarding Snapcaster Mage.
It never worked, unless you were planning to hardcast or Vial or something.
Legacy
UWR Miracles UWR
GWB Maverick GWB
GB Elves GB
UBR ANT UBR
RG Combo Lands RG
Vintage
BUG BUG Fish BUG
Modern
GBW
Junk PodMagic: the BuylistingThen it's a good thing the new uniqueness rule doesn't actually work the way you described, right?
Pristaxcontrombmodruu!
You don't get to kill theirs (by any new state-based effects).
Legacy
UWR Miracles UWR
GWB Maverick GWB
GB Elves GB
UBR ANT UBR
RG Combo Lands RG
Vintage
BUG BUG Fish BUG
Modern
GBW
Junk PodMagic: the BuylistingYou are correct. Thank you.
I thought this was a very relevant line of thought.
I recall drafts several weeks ago when I'd display Thespian Stage as a "nifty score with potential to increase in value," only to be chuckled at.
Perhaps my interlocutors did not recollect the days when Dark Depths had junk rare status.
Overall record: 139-98-15
Total number of matches: 252
Win percentage ignoring draws: 58.649789
Win percentage including draws: 55.158730
I'll still use my girl to wasteland someone into oblivion and give me cradle. Just sayin'
ANYWHO....upon further review this is the worst rules change I have seen in a long while. I can't wait for people to double liliana against me.
/sarcasm
10th at SCG: Syracuse (2014), GP:NJ Last-Chance Grinder Winner (2014):: Former Legacy Mod