I'm still gonna try to splash blue in the future though when I get the funds xD.
Thanks
-iBboy
how do you feel about demigod of revenge? There is an interesting combo with him, but it kind of causes the deck to stray from the traditional path.
also, do you already own entomb? because if you are looking to build on a budget the 35 dollar price tag is going to be tough on the wallet, its an auto 4 of in the deck.
how do you feel about demigod of revenge? There is an interesting combo with him, but it kind of causes the deck to stray from the traditional path.
also, do you already own entomb? because if you are looking to build on a budget the 35 dollar price tag is going to be tough on the wallet, its an auto 4 of in the deck.
Unfortunately I don't have entomb :(. I only have a playset of Buried Alive =/
sadly enough, entomb is much better than buried alive (enables a turn 2 kill).
@ spooky
could it also be possible to swap around some of the lands in dredge (i.e. increase the number of tarnished citadels and decrease the number of gemstone mines)?
also what would the board of d-storm look like?
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Unfortunately I don't have entomb :(. I only have a playset of Buried Alive =/
Well I hate to say it, but you really just CANT build any version of traditional reanimator without entomb. The card is what makes reanimator good. =/
As far as the demigod version goes, that MAY still be viable. the combo is pretty simple. Play buried alive and target 3 demigod. If the 4th is in your hand you can play it, which rez's the other 3 and allows you to swing in over head with 4, 5/5 haste flyers. 20 damage right there.
I Have a lot of stuff going on today, but i will try and ind time to pose up a list for you.
sadly enough, entomb is much better than buried alive (enables a turn 2 kill).
@ spooky
could it also be possible to swap around some of the lands in dredge (i.e. increase the number of tarnished citadels and decrease the number of gemstone mines)?
also what would the board of d-storm look like?
Thinking about building dredge? well, you COULD swap some land numbers. Its just that the numbers are the way that they are for a reason. Those citadel HURT. The deck will still function the same, you will just lose the damage race more often.
the board of dragon storm eh? well, it really depends on your meta, but will probably look....something like this.
NOTE: some of the deck lists have been edited/updated and some other errors have been fixed. hopefully the whole article will be finished by the end of the weekend.
Don't forget suicide black, it could be considered as a cheap deck for legacy. That or just mono-black beats
Just saw the suicide black already there -_-
Thrun the Last Troll would be good in the Mono-Green beats
also Grow is an old Legacy deck that may be able to be budgeted fairly easily.
Don't forget suicide black, it could be considered as a cheap deck for legacy. That or just mono-black beats
Just saw the suicide black already there -_-
Thrun the Last Troll would be good in the Mono-Green beats
also Grow is an old Legacy deck that may be able to be budgeted fairly easily.
Thanks Brah. I forgot about grow. Ill see what thrun does to the price of beats as well.
EDIT: Done and DONE! The article is completely finished being revamped! Took a lot of work so I hope it helps you all. PLEASE tell me if you find any errors or have any suggestions. Check it out and enjoy!
hey man, i am planning to start playing legacy with friends, they play rather casually (no 500$ or more decks) and i am on quite a low budget myself and here is the thing: i am not sure which deck should i pick up. i am considering pox and mbc and i am wondering which one is more fun to play (i'd like a skill-intensive reactive deck as i consider myself decent player just not familiar with legacy yet) and of course more powerful in my metagame, which consist of aggro mainly (like budget g stompy, ww, mono red/rg beats also some rb deck but i am not sure) but also has 1-2 combo (dredge and belcher i believe) and 1 or 2 control (but some budget list with no fow so not really tough opponent as both black decks should just rape it with hymns and targeted discard). so, what do you think? to me mbc looks better versus these aggro decks and i believe cards are easier to get, although more expensive.
Yeah, with a meta description like that, plus my history with pox being not to good, i would go with MBC.
the great thing about the deck is that you can really shape it a number of ways. from the sounds of it you wont be facing very many non-basic lands, so you can eliminate ghost quarter all together. Also, hipnotic specter is only a dollar or 2 and can def. find a home in the deck. With all the discard and creature removal, plus 3 main board bojuka bog for that dredge player, MBC seems like the best option.
did you like the list presented or did you have some requests? I can make up a list based on what you are looking for, just gotta let me know.
1) I honestly don't like coffers that much, but if you are playing casually then it cant hurt to have 1 or 2. Sinkholes are not actually used in mono black control. They are more of an eva green type card.
2) do NOT go below 3 gatekeepers. He is an amazing card. any less than 3 would be a terrible idea, and I really like him at 4. If you want to add in some chainers edicts, which is a fine idea, take out 2 go for the throat/doomblade/smother.
3) Tombstalker is a very hard card to replace. He is simply one of the best finishers out there. abyssal persecuter is often used in his place, but he costs even more. Avatar of Discord is a maybe, but i dont really like her to be honest. phyrexian negator is an option, since he can be powered out turn 1 with dark rit. Masticore or Grinning Demon are both also an option.
Juzam Djinn would be nice, but we both know thats not gonna happen :). Also, as a side note. If you end up not running stalker then you will not need any fetchlands, as they are only in there to fuel his delve.
4) the deck has plenty of turn one plays that are strong in magic. Honestly, if you added hippy then it would mean taking out some nighthawks. Ill see what i can come up with.
5) Inquisition of Kozilek would be fine over duress. You could even run a 2/2 split if you wanted too.
Here is what I came up with. assuming your budget us less than 200. It was very difficult for me to decide of a tombstalker replacement, so feel free to use whatever you want in place of what i ended up choosing.
Might I recommend adding Spring Tide to the list? I played a budget version back before Time Spiral was unbanned, and it performed quite well (winning consistantly turns 2-4) while costing well under $100. Perhaps something like this?
Even this build can be made more budget friendly- Meditate, for example, can be replaced with cheaper alternatives. The only 'cash cards' that aren't really replacable are the 3 Cunning Wishes (this deck gets pretty terrible without its wishboard).
Sometimes it sucks not having Force of Will, but not getting two for oned isn't always a disadvantage. Only slightly more expensive than a Dragonstorm brew, this deck can put up some pretty impressive results.
Thanks Tarkus. Ill look into the deck a bit. To be honest, I really only know about Spiral tide and have just about zero experience with spring tide. I will get some proxies going. I can already tell though, that if you are missing force of will you could just play the other 3 pacts main board. Of course, I dont know what that would do to the consistency of the deck. Thanks for the suggestion though! Ill def. check it out.
Might I recommend adding Spring Tide to the list? I played a budget version back before Time Spiral was unbanned, and it performed quite (winning consistantly turns 2-4) while costing well under $100. Perhaps something like this?
Even this build can be made more budget friendly- Meditate, for example, can be replaced with cheaper alternatives. The only 'cash cards' that aren't really replacable are the 3 Cunning Wishes (this deck gets pretty terrible without its wishboard).
Sometimes it sucks not having Force of Will, but not getting two for oned isn't always a disadvantage. Only slightly more expensive than a Dragonstorm brew, this deck can put up some pretty impressive results.
What can you replace meditate with? I really like how this deck looks.
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What can you replace meditate with? I really like how this deck looks.
You have a couple of options. I've seen Compulsive Research played, usually alongside Flash of Insight to give the deck a Demonic Tutor. Impulse is a particularly solid choice, as it lets you dig just as deep as Meditate when you are in search of a particular card. Preordain is fine. Fact or Fiction isn't too shabby either.
Alternatively, you could up the number of Brain Freezes to reduce your reliance on excessive card draw. You'll only ever need a storm count of 18 to win, and drawing multiple copies of your kill condition helps. Things get a little more tricky if you need to go for the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo of Capsize looped on your Cloud of Faeries into Blue Sun's Zenith. But those occasions are rare.
Honestly, I think this is one of the better budget decks in Legacy. Without disruption it can pull off consistant turn 2 and turn 3 kills, and the wishboard gives it a lot of flexibility against some of the tougher matchups. While this certainly isn't superior to the new Spiral Tide lists, it can hold its own quite nicely.
Wow, I was really surprised to see the cost of the spiral tide list you presented, even with full sideboard, was only 110 bucks. Ill certainly goldfish a bit and work on adding this puppy in.
I do have to say however that because you are not running any fetchlands, brainstorm is not nearly as good as a preordain in this deck.
You have a couple of options. I've seen Compulsive Research played, usually alongside Flash of Insight to give the deck a Demonic Tutor. Impulse is a particularly solid choice, as it lets you dig just as deep as Meditate when you are in search of a particular card. Preordain is fine. Fact or Fiction isn't too shabby either.
Alternatively, you could up the number of Brain Freezes to reduce your reliance on excessive card draw. You'll only ever need a storm count of 18 to win, and drawing multiple copies of your kill condition helps. Things get a little more tricky if you need to go for the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo of Capsize looped on your Cloud of Faeries into Blue Sun's Zenith. But those occasions are rare.
Honestly, I think this is one of the better budget decks in Legacy. Without disruption it can pull off consistant turn 2 and turn 3 kills, and the wishboard gives it a lot of flexibility against some of the tougher matchups. While this certainly isn't superior to the new Spiral Tide lists, it can hold its own quite nicely.
I'm probably going to replace it with impulse. Thanks.
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Wow, I was really surprised to see the cost of the spiral tide list you presented, even with full sideboard, was only 110 bucks. Ill certainly goldfish a bit and work on adding this puppy in.
I do have to say however that because you are not running any fetchlands, brainstorm is not nearly as good as a preordain in this deck.
Brainstorm is still needed for a few reasons. It can be fetched with Merchant Scroll in a pinch. You still have shuffle effects (Merchant Scroll, Ponder), and depending on your build you can Impulse bad cards to the bottom as well. After casting a big draw spell (Ideas Unbound, possibly Meditate) it will get you the full 3 cards.
It also serves as valuable protection against hand disruption (specifically hiding your High Tides from a Duress or Thoughtseize). But depending on your build, you might be able to find a few slots for Preordain as well. Maximizing utility greatly increases your goldfish percentage, and having 1cc spells that can dig through your deck is not to be underrated.
I'm probably going to replace it with impulse. Thanks.
Impulse works well, and I highly doubt you'll be disappointed with it. I would recommend some instant speed draw in your sideboard, though. A high placing Spring Tide list a few months ago played a singleton Fact or Fiction which seems like an enticing option.
My friend played with this deck a while ago and its works quite well. snap and cloud of fairies work awesome together when your lands are tapping for 3 or 4. As for a replacement for meditate, my best guess would be to go for either impulse or fact or fiction, I love both of those cards and they are really powerful.
What about Frantic Search? it seems like it would go awesome with the deck in place of meditate.
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Decks I Play EDH RStarke of Rath chaosR UBGrim Grin Zombie TribalUB UWHanna Ship's NavigatorUW Legacy WMono-White Stax/ Armageddon StaxW RWRed/White Goblin Welder StaxRW XMUDX
This. I've played a casual version of the deck with 4x Frantic Search and 4x Mind's Desire, and it is very difficult to disrupt. It is conceivable that the former could be unbanned at some point in the future, but after some testing it quickly became obvious that the latter is kept out of Legacy for a reason.
You have a couple of options. I've seen Compulsive Research played, usually alongside Flash of Insight to give the deck a Demonic Tutor. Impulse is a particularly solid choice, as it lets you dig just as deep as Meditate when you are in search of a particular card. Preordain is fine. Fact or Fiction isn't too shabby either.
Alternatively, you could up the number of Brain Freezes to reduce your reliance on excessive card draw. You'll only ever need a storm count of 18 to win, and drawing multiple copies of your kill condition helps. Things get a little more tricky if you need to go for the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo of Capsize looped on your Cloud of Faeries into Blue Sun's Zenith. But those occasions are rare.
Honestly, I think this is one of the better budget decks in Legacy. Without disruption it can pull off consistant turn 2 and turn 3 kills, and the wishboard gives it a lot of flexibility against some of the tougher matchups. While this certainly isn't superior to the new Spiral Tide lists, it can hold its own quite nicely.
Hey,
Your deck seems very interesting. I still can't figure out the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo though? Care to explain T__T
Thanks,
iBboy
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how do you feel about demigod of revenge? There is an interesting combo with him, but it kind of causes the deck to stray from the traditional path.
also, do you already own entomb? because if you are looking to build on a budget the 35 dollar price tag is going to be tough on the wallet, its an auto 4 of in the deck.
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Never heard about the combo with demigo of revenge. What is it?
Unfortunately I don't have entomb :(. I only have a playset of Buried Alive =/
sadly enough, entomb is much better than buried alive (enables a turn 2 kill).
@ spooky
could it also be possible to swap around some of the lands in dredge (i.e. increase the number of tarnished citadels and decrease the number of gemstone mines)?
also what would the board of d-storm look like?
Mabbz on MTGO | Demgrinds on Twitch & Twitter | Helpdesk
Well I hate to say it, but you really just CANT build any version of traditional reanimator without entomb. The card is what makes reanimator good. =/
As far as the demigod version goes, that MAY still be viable. the combo is pretty simple. Play buried alive and target 3 demigod. If the 4th is in your hand you can play it, which rez's the other 3 and allows you to swing in over head with 4, 5/5 haste flyers. 20 damage right there.
I Have a lot of stuff going on today, but i will try and ind time to pose up a list for you.
Thinking about building dredge? well, you COULD swap some land numbers. Its just that the numbers are the way that they are for a reason. Those citadel HURT. The deck will still function the same, you will just lose the damage race more often.
the board of dragon storm eh? well, it really depends on your meta, but will probably look....something like this.
1 Empty the Warrens
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Anarchy
3 Boil
4 Red Elemental Blast
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If it doesn't work out, I could still go for Burn since I have 4 Goblin Guide already.
-iBboy
Well heres what i came up with for the demigod list. Its all from memory so sorry if it looks kinda iffy.
4 demigod of revenge
4 putrid imp
1 iona sheild of emeria
1 blazing archon
1 inkwell leviathan
4 buried alive
4 duress
4 dark ritual
4 Exhume
4 Reanimate
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Beseech the Queen
22 Swamp
The problem with this list is the fact that there are no entomb. you can proxy it out and see how it runs though.
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Haha thanks a bunch Spooky!
As I was saying if it doesn't work out, I'll make myself a Burn deck.
Thanks for your time man! Really appreciated
-iBboy
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Sure no problem. I will also try out your burn deck as well.
-iBboy
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Just saw the suicide black already there -_-
Thrun the Last Troll would be good in the Mono-Green beats
also Grow is an old Legacy deck that may be able to be budgeted fairly easily.
-Sun Tzu
Decks I Play
EDH
RStarke of Rath chaosR
UBGrim Grin Zombie TribalUB
UWHanna Ship's NavigatorUW
Legacy
WMono-White Stax/ Armageddon StaxW
RWRed/White Goblin Welder StaxRW
XMUDX
Thanks Brah. I forgot about grow. Ill see what thrun does to the price of beats as well.
EDIT: Done and DONE! The article is completely finished being revamped! Took a lot of work so I hope it helps you all. PLEASE tell me if you find any errors or have any suggestions. Check it out and enjoy!
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Appreciate it man. Means a lot to me after the work I put into it. Hopefully this is helping a lot of people. =)
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Yeah, with a meta description like that, plus my history with pox being not to good, i would go with MBC.
the great thing about the deck is that you can really shape it a number of ways. from the sounds of it you wont be facing very many non-basic lands, so you can eliminate ghost quarter all together. Also, hipnotic specter is only a dollar or 2 and can def. find a home in the deck. With all the discard and creature removal, plus 3 main board bojuka bog for that dredge player, MBC seems like the best option.
did you like the list presented or did you have some requests? I can make up a list based on what you are looking for, just gotta let me know.
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2) do NOT go below 3 gatekeepers. He is an amazing card. any less than 3 would be a terrible idea, and I really like him at 4. If you want to add in some chainers edicts, which is a fine idea, take out 2 go for the throat/doomblade/smother.
3) Tombstalker is a very hard card to replace. He is simply one of the best finishers out there. abyssal persecuter is often used in his place, but he costs even more. Avatar of Discord is a maybe, but i dont really like her to be honest. phyrexian negator is an option, since he can be powered out turn 1 with dark rit. Masticore or Grinning Demon are both also an option.
Juzam Djinn would be nice, but we both know thats not gonna happen :). Also, as a side note. If you end up not running stalker then you will not need any fetchlands, as they are only in there to fuel his delve.
4) the deck has plenty of turn one plays that are strong in magic. Honestly, if you added hippy then it would mean taking out some nighthawks. Ill see what i can come up with.
5) Inquisition of Kozilek would be fine over duress. You could even run a 2/2 split if you wanted too.
Here is what I came up with. assuming your budget us less than 200. It was very difficult for me to decide of a tombstalker replacement, so feel free to use whatever you want in place of what i ended up choosing.
3 Bojuka Bog
16 Swamp
1 Volrath's Stronghold
2 Cabal Coffers
Creatures-
3 Gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Nantuko Shade
2 Shriekmaw
2 Avatar of Discord
3 Vampire Nighthawk
3 Hypnotic Specter
2 Damnation
4 Dark Ritual
2 Duress
2 Go for the Throat
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Phyrexian Arena
2 Chainer's Edict
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Might I recommend adding Spring Tide to the list? I played a budget version back before Time Spiral was unbanned, and it performed quite well (winning consistantly turns 2-4) while costing well under $100. Perhaps something like this?
4x High Tide
4x Cloud of Faeries
3x Retraced Image
3x Snap
3x Turnabout
Draw/Search:
4x Merchant Scroll
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
4x Ideas Unbound
3x Meditate
4x Spell Pierce
3x Cunning Wish
Win:
1x Brainfreeze
Lands:
16x Island
1x Blue Sun's Zenith
1x Capsize
1x Wipe Away
1x Rebuild
1x Chain of Vapor
1x Turnabout
1x Meditate
1x Snap
1x Pact of Negation
1x Brainfreeze
2x Disrupt
3x Divert
Even this build can be made more budget friendly- Meditate, for example, can be replaced with cheaper alternatives. The only 'cash cards' that aren't really replacable are the 3 Cunning Wishes (this deck gets pretty terrible without its wishboard).
Sometimes it sucks not having Force of Will, but not getting two for oned isn't always a disadvantage. Only slightly more expensive than a Dragonstorm brew, this deck can put up some pretty impressive results.
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What can you replace meditate with? I really like how this deck looks.
Mabbz on MTGO | Demgrinds on Twitch & Twitter | Helpdesk
You have a couple of options. I've seen Compulsive Research played, usually alongside Flash of Insight to give the deck a Demonic Tutor. Impulse is a particularly solid choice, as it lets you dig just as deep as Meditate when you are in search of a particular card. Preordain is fine. Fact or Fiction isn't too shabby either.
Alternatively, you could up the number of Brain Freezes to reduce your reliance on excessive card draw. You'll only ever need a storm count of 18 to win, and drawing multiple copies of your kill condition helps. Things get a little more tricky if you need to go for the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo of Capsize looped on your Cloud of Faeries into Blue Sun's Zenith. But those occasions are rare.
Honestly, I think this is one of the better budget decks in Legacy. Without disruption it can pull off consistant turn 2 and turn 3 kills, and the wishboard gives it a lot of flexibility against some of the tougher matchups. While this certainly isn't superior to the new Spiral Tide lists, it can hold its own quite nicely.
I do have to say however that because you are not running any fetchlands, brainstorm is not nearly as good as a preordain in this deck.
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Getting Started in Legacy and Legacy Budget Primer 5!
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I'm probably going to replace it with impulse. Thanks.
Mabbz on MTGO | Demgrinds on Twitch & Twitter | Helpdesk
Brainstorm is still needed for a few reasons. It can be fetched with Merchant Scroll in a pinch. You still have shuffle effects (Merchant Scroll, Ponder), and depending on your build you can Impulse bad cards to the bottom as well. After casting a big draw spell (Ideas Unbound, possibly Meditate) it will get you the full 3 cards.
It also serves as valuable protection against hand disruption (specifically hiding your High Tides from a Duress or Thoughtseize). But depending on your build, you might be able to find a few slots for Preordain as well. Maximizing utility greatly increases your goldfish percentage, and having 1cc spells that can dig through your deck is not to be underrated.
Impulse works well, and I highly doubt you'll be disappointed with it. I would recommend some instant speed draw in your sideboard, though. A high placing Spring Tide list a few months ago played a singleton Fact or Fiction which seems like an enticing option.
What about Frantic Search? it seems like it would go awesome with the deck in place of meditate.
-Sun Tzu
Decks I Play
EDH
RStarke of Rath chaosR
UBGrim Grin Zombie TribalUB
UWHanna Ship's NavigatorUW
Legacy
WMono-White Stax/ Armageddon StaxW
RWRed/White Goblin Welder StaxRW
XMUDX
This. I've played a casual version of the deck with 4x Frantic Search and 4x Mind's Desire, and it is very difficult to disrupt. It is conceivable that the former could be unbanned at some point in the future, but after some testing it quickly became obvious that the latter is kept out of Legacy for a reason.
Hey,
Your deck seems very interesting. I still can't figure out the infinite mana/storm/card draw combo though? Care to explain T__T
Thanks,
iBboy