Philosophy behind this...
There are quite a few different threads from which all are decent- but most if not all of them only talked about pauper commander while the only peasant rules I have found have been largely for 60 card formats with only house rules adopted for commander. Since this is a format full of common and uncommon cards, the power level for 90% or more of all the cards out there are weaker than what is in regular commander. In other words, boardwipes, tutor cards, hoser cards and combo cards are generally weaker all-around and level the playing field. The majority of the cards that cause problems within regular commander simply do not exist and do not cause the same amount or even type of problems. For example, Channel could be used, but the amount of cards that work well with it are cut in half due to rarity alone. So when combined with either the "no uncommons allowed" in pauper and "no more than 15 uncommons in your deck total" should keep cards like that from ever being a problem in the first place. Lastly the amount of "playroom" or "shenanigans" that are at the common and uncommon level are extremely low and usually have extreme requirements to use them.
I've decided to go ahead and to try and put down everything that I believe should make up the rules and what all should be included within them. These are my suggestions as to what the rules for pauper and peasant edh should be as there are none that are set in stone. I hope this will change it. Without further ado, I present to you the rules that I believe should be followed when playing pauper or peasant commander/ edh.
Pauper EDH Comprehensive Rules List: 1. Commander / General must be either an Uncommon or Common. It does not need to be a legendary creature. 2. All other cards must have been printed as a common somewhere at least once before. 3. Players begin the game with 30 life. 4. If a player has been dealt 18 points of combat damage by a particular Commander during the game, that player loses a game.
Peasant EDH Comprehensive Rules List: 1. Commander / General must be either an Uncommon or Common. It does not need to be a legendary creature. 2. Up to 15 uncommon cards are allowed to be within the deck- including the general but all other cards must have been printed as a common somewhere at least once before. 3. Players begin the game with 40 life. 4. If a player has been dealt 18 points of combat damage by a particular Commander during the game, that player loses a game.
Rules that apply to both pauper and peasant commander: 1. Abilities may be used from the Commander Zone, but are subject to cumulative commander costs (+2 per each previous use) 2. Commanders who are not Legendary are not subject to the Legend rule and all copies that are made of that creature are not considered Legendary.
All other rules that are not stated here follow the rules that here here
Banlist
The following is the official banned list for commander games. These cards should not be played without prior agreement from the other players in the game, and may steer your playgroup to avoid other, similar cards.
1. Sensei's Divining Top
Discussion of banlist:
However, I personally disagree with much that has been said about the banned list for any peasant related commander games. However, for pauper, these cards are very strong.
sensei's divining top. This card is the perfect example of a powerful card that leads to adds too much and is virtually impossible to remove in pauper and only a little less difficult in peasant. krosan grip is about the only card to be able to remove it within that commander variation.
Cards to watch out for: Sword of the Meek is great, but is fairly strong in that it does more than 3 things- It is a combo piece, it is abused easily and lastly, it can fit into every deck. The last one isn't so much relevant, but it can be format warping if everyone plays that card along with Thopter foundry. However the reason why it's not currently banned is that it combos off best with only one card that only fits into esper decks.
Generals to watch out for:
Psychatog
Bloodbraid Elf
Invisible Stalker
Mistmeadow Witch
Azorious Guildmage
Izzet Guildmage
Lorescale Coatl
Jace's Phantasm
Shriekmaw
Briarhorn
Glareweilder
Meadowboon
Nevermaker
Offalsnout
Spitebellows
Walker of the Grove
Found here is a good reason for why cards like these are not banned. I'm quoting ISBPathfinder on this
My own feelings for each that you highlited:
Jace's Phantasm - run graveyard hate and lockdown enchantments. There are like 20+ variants of Pacifism available and its all that it takes to stop this bugger. Beyond that there are tons of things like Master Decoy that can just tap him down as well.
Bloodbraid Elf - cascade isn't even good in EDH because the target that you get is so unpredictable. Even if you build around that in mind he is still little better than a draw effect on a creature with haste. You need to kill and recast him a lot to really benefit from the cascade much. I am not convinced in the least with this pick. This creature is far better in a 1v1, 20 life setting. There are too many things that delute it for multiplayer 30 or 40 life formats whatever you want to play it as.
Psychatog wait.... what???? this format lacks huge draw engines, he has no evasion, and there is no mass bounce to hand effects. He was only good because Upheaval was so crazy in 60 card magic. He lacks evasion and the card draw in this format is lacking. The only way I could even see this taking off is in some sort of self mill deck where nobody hates on their graveyard and lacks the ability to block / spot remove it.
Mistmeadow Witch solid by all means but I dont have any reason in particular that I think it is banworthy other than being a good value engine. Keep in mind that if you are playing with ETB creatures they cant really defend themselves with it's blink. Rush them first and dont let them establish a manabase.
Invisible Stalker very slow in general. If the deck runs a ton of ramp effects to power him up then target the artifacts / enchantments with your removal and just 3v1 them. This isnt a commander that can fight off 3 opponents and in general if you play the whole you can touch me game then opponents will curb stomp you for being lame. There are a ton of commanders that can race this guy for faster damage in general. Sure it is lame that it is so un-interactive but it also isnt that solid.
Azorius Guildmage - really nice solid control but I dont get how you get banworthy from this. Keep in mind that it takes tons of mana to keep abilities up and even then, if you are playing multiplayer you really cant control everything. Shroud / hexproof blow this guy up and you always have the option of just using spot removal before it flips to your turn and rolling through them.
Izzet Guildmage - possibly.... I have had a blast playing him and if considering banning him it would be for his ability to go infinite. Even then remember that you can push on him early and the heavy mana requirement abilities he has are hard to use.
Overall though I would like to hear reasoning for anything going on this list. Just having a strong board presence and a good set of abilities alone doesn't make any sense to ban them for that. The point of this format is to be able to use cool commanders that you couldn't otherwise play and if you take that away then you are just playing bad uncommons. If you can give me a reason as to why they should be banned perhaps I would listen.
Other cards to watch out for:
rhystic study- one of the best sources to draw cards in pauper and peasant games.
Skullclamp- same as above
Sol Ring- would consider banning it, but it's been in every single commander product, so it should be fine in most every single deck. It's only banned in Dual Commander rules as it's considered to be "fast mana".
Other Links that I have used in trying to create official rules for both pauper and peasant commander. Link 1 Link 2 Link 3
I would very much like feedback on this on how to improve this.
Philosophy behind this... Pauper EDH Comprehensive Rules List: 1. Commander / General must be either an Uncommon or Common. It does not need to be a legendary creature. 2. All other cards must have been printed as a common somewhere at least once before. 3. Players begin the game with 30 life. 4. If a player has been dealt 18 points of combat damage by a particular Commander during the game, that player loses a game.
I like that summary for Pauper. I had never tried toying with commander damage numbers but I do actually like the idea of a reduced number. Its been years since I touched the format so I dont know if thats some new norm or something you came up with yourself.
Does anyone actually play Peasant commander? I am aware that it is a thing in 60 card magic but I have not really seen anyone mentioning much on it before.
If I were you I would actually not have general discussion that crosses into both as its a little confusing. Focus on one format at a time and find a better way to divide what you are talking about. You mention several uncommons as cards to look out for but like in between mentioning and discussing uncommons you went back to Pauper commander watchlist. Its confusing I guess so I would consider finding a better way to organize or just try to turn it into two different threads.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Love your reply and most of this is not mine but numbers and rules that others believe works best. Personally, I believe that the life total doesn't need to change, but due to the lack of power within the format; unlike regular commander, the game will take longer to finish up. As for as anyone playing peasant/ pauper commander, not that I know of- with exception of two others who did for one game. Of the 4 of us, someone else didn't have a peasant/ pauper deck and only wanted to use his regular edh deck. Wasn't too bad of a game and we managed to do fairly well for the most part.
You're right, I should clean it up and make both separate, however, there has yet to be a common creature that I've seen that should be banned as a general. In general, cards like rhystic study are powerful because they are A. common, and B. powerful in what they do.
I find it a bit weird that all the Evoke creatures are on the watch list. I don't find anything particularly oppressive about Offalsnout... I understand that Evoke is a dangerous mechanic with the Command Zone, but I don't think it should be a "blanket" add to a watchlist necessarily. I also just noticed that Mulldrifter is not there. Seems like it would be one of the best ones.
The only Pauper card I feel deserves a watch is Capsize. I've seen this thing completely take over games by itself and have read many people complaining about it.
Not saying it's a bad number by any means, but why 18 Commander damage? I always figured it would be half the starting life total +1, like in regular Commander. Is there any justification to it, other than the good feeling?
There are quite a few different threads from which all are decent- but most if not all of them only talked about pauper commander while the only peasant rules I have found have been largely for 60 card formats with only house rules adopted for commander. Since this is a format full of common and uncommon cards, the power level for 90% or more of all the cards out there are weaker than what is in regular commander. In other words, boardwipes, tutor cards, hoser cards and combo cards are generally weaker all-around and level the playing field. The majority of the cards that cause problems within regular commander simply do not exist and do not cause the same amount or even type of problems. For example, Channel could be used, but the amount of cards that work well with it are cut in half due to rarity alone. So when combined with either the "no uncommons allowed" in pauper and "no more than 15 uncommons in your deck total" should keep cards like that from ever being a problem in the first place. Lastly the amount of "playroom" or "shenanigans" that are at the common and uncommon level are extremely low and usually have extreme requirements to use them.
I've decided to go ahead and to try and put down everything that I believe should make up the rules and what all should be included within them. These are my suggestions as to what the rules for pauper and peasant edh should be as there are none that are set in stone. I hope this will change it. Without further ado, I present to you the rules that I believe should be followed when playing pauper or peasant commander/ edh.
Pauper EDH Comprehensive Rules List:
1. Commander / General must be either an Uncommon or Common. It does not need to be a legendary creature.
2. All other cards must have been printed as a common somewhere at least once before.
3. Players begin the game with 30 life.
4. If a player has been dealt 18 points of combat damage by a particular Commander during the game, that player loses a game.
Peasant EDH Comprehensive Rules List:
1. Commander / General must be either an Uncommon or Common. It does not need to be a legendary creature.
2. Up to 15 uncommon cards are allowed to be within the deck- including the general but all other cards must have been printed as a common somewhere at least once before.
3. Players begin the game with 40 life.
4. If a player has been dealt 18 points of combat damage by a particular Commander during the game, that player loses a game.
Rules that apply to both pauper and peasant commander:
1. Abilities may be used from the Commander Zone, but are subject to cumulative commander costs (+2 per each previous use)
2. Commanders who are not Legendary are not subject to the Legend rule and all copies that are made of that creature are not considered Legendary.
All other rules that are not stated here follow the rules that here here
Banlist
The following is the official banned list for commander games. These cards should not be played without prior agreement from the other players in the game, and may steer your playgroup to avoid other, similar cards.
1. Sensei's Divining Top
Discussion of banlist:
However, I personally disagree with much that has been said about the banned list for any peasant related commander games. However, for pauper, these cards are very strong.
sensei's divining top. This card is the perfect example of a powerful card that leads to adds too much and is virtually impossible to remove in pauper and only a little less difficult in peasant. krosan grip is about the only card to be able to remove it within that commander variation.
Cards to watch out for:
Sword of the Meek is great, but is fairly strong in that it does more than 3 things- It is a combo piece, it is abused easily and lastly, it can fit into every deck. The last one isn't so much relevant, but it can be format warping if everyone plays that card along with Thopter foundry. However the reason why it's not currently banned is that it combos off best with only one card that only fits into esper decks.
Generals to watch out for:
Psychatog
Bloodbraid Elf
Invisible Stalker
Mistmeadow Witch
Azorious Guildmage
Izzet Guildmage
Lorescale Coatl
Jace's Phantasm
Shriekmaw
Briarhorn
Glareweilder
Meadowboon
Nevermaker
Offalsnout
Spitebellows
Walker of the Grove
Found here is a good reason for why cards like these are not banned. I'm quoting ISBPathfinder on this
Other cards to watch out for:
rhystic study- one of the best sources to draw cards in pauper and peasant games.
Skullclamp- same as above
Sol Ring- would consider banning it, but it's been in every single commander product, so it should be fine in most every single deck. It's only banned in Dual Commander rules as it's considered to be "fast mana".
Other Links that I have used in trying to create official rules for both pauper and peasant commander.
Link 1
Link 2
Link 3
I would very much like feedback on this on how to improve this.
If I were you I would actually not have general discussion that crosses into both as its a little confusing. Focus on one format at a time and find a better way to divide what you are talking about. You mention several uncommons as cards to look out for but like in between mentioning and discussing uncommons you went back to Pauper commander watchlist. Its confusing I guess so I would consider finding a better way to organize or just try to turn it into two different threads.
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[Modern] Allies
You're right, I should clean it up and make both separate, however, there has yet to be a common creature that I've seen that should be banned as a general. In general, cards like rhystic study are powerful because they are A. common, and B. powerful in what they do.
What do you think of this? Pauper Commander Primer Video
I find it a bit weird that all the Evoke creatures are on the watch list. I don't find anything particularly oppressive about Offalsnout... I understand that Evoke is a dangerous mechanic with the Command Zone, but I don't think it should be a "blanket" add to a watchlist necessarily. I also just noticed that Mulldrifter is not there. Seems like it would be one of the best ones.
Crypt Rats and Peregrine Drake as Commanders are also cards I think need to be looked out for.
The only Pauper card I feel deserves a watch is Capsize. I've seen this thing completely take over games by itself and have read many people complaining about it.
Not saying it's a bad number by any means, but why 18 Commander damage? I always figured it would be half the starting life total +1, like in regular Commander. Is there any justification to it, other than the good feeling?
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio