LittlestMorte suggested that card too; I guess I forgot to address it! It's a fine inclusion and could quite possibly be worth more than a generic 2-for-1. It all depends on if we can find room.
As such, here are the cards currently being considered for inclusion: Arcane Denial Maul Splicer Mind Extraction Remember the Fallen
I've ruled out Primal Growth because we honestly have enough ramp/fixing to get the job done. In fact, Far Wanderings is often a tutor target because it ramps us to our stage four (yes, stage FOUR) trumps. Mycosynth Wellspring is probably not going to make it either because it's a lousy topdeck and isn't as abusable as Sylvan Ranger (which also didn't make it). The others seem useful at the very least, so I'll be testing them in place of some other cards.
And here are the cards in the current list that are under the most scrutiny: Opaline Bracers Prophetic Prism Soul Manipulation? Tilling Treefolk? Voidmage Apprentice
Bracers is an easy cut, and since Mind Extraction is priority number one, I'll make that swap now. Tilling Treefolk might be a little too niche, but I want to give it some more time before making a decision. Voidmage Apprentice is expensive and did nothing except scare people when I played it the other day, but it's like Treefolk in that it has potential. I can see comparable power levels between the other cards and the possible includes, but would the new cards actually be better? I don't know.
At this point, I have no more information and I'd just be rambling, so I would greatly appreciate hearing some opinions on this.
Don't want to derail the thread or anything, but I was intrigued by the idea of pauper EDH and made a deck last night. Is there a place in the forums to post it?
Whereas it seems like your deck was intended to play against regular EDH decks, I made mine envisioning Pauper EDH as its own format.
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I had completely forgotten Rolling Thunder was a common. I think I'm going to give both it and Fireball a slot for now. I don't think 2 X-spells are too many as I usually use my tutors for other targets.
If you're running Tilling Treefolk, give the panoramas a shot. They're pretty decent mana fixing, and getting extra value out of your cards is always a plus.
I'm pretty sure Rancor doesn't do nearly enough, but it does speed the general kill up by a turn. I doubt that that's worth a slot, but I thought I'd mention it as an alternative to the Bracers.
Excluding Rhystic Study is more of a political thing. I've replaced it with Syphon Mind and I've been pretty pleased with the results.
I'm still running Sylvan Ranger. I find it preferable to the Prophetic Prism. I very rarely used the Prism as mana fixing and it dies to Child anyway, so mostly it was a blank card that cycled. At least the Ranger provides a body.
I know what you mean about Far Wanderings. If I see it early, I do my best to hit threshold ASAP just so I can get +3 lands, and it's a great transmute target. I'm still amazed at how strong this card is every time I play it.
The more I think about it, the less I like Remember the Fallen. I just don't play enough artifacts in my deck for it to be worthwhile. I guess if you still run the Bracers it's a decent way to get them back. I don't think I'll add it to my deck though.
I'm becoming less and less a fan of Trinket Mage as time goes on. The only card I ever want to tutor for is Nihil Spellbomb. The rest of the cards either have redundancies or just aren't worth spending 2U to find. Also, I've found that artifact lands are not worth the trouble in my paper meta because there are just so many artifact sweepers running around. I'd prefer to just have regular old reliable basics. (On an amusing note, I think this is the first 5C deck I've ever played that's almost entirely immune to Blood Moon.)
I cut Voidmage Apprentice a long time ago because it was just never worth holding 2UU open and it's only a surprise the first time you play the card.
I've been really liking Reprisal as another removal spell. It's practically a 1W Terminate in EDH. It definitely passes the test to be in the deck (instant, kills Child).
I have to give you major props for this deck d0su. This is a thing of beauty. I'm definitely making my playgroup fear the all-common deck, even if they do ***** about the mythic general heading the team. (Seriously, who wants a vanilla general? I can't imagine how that would be interesting at all.)
It's not a large difference and I think it comes down to play style. I just love drawing lands and my main goal is to drop a land every turn of the game.
Last weekend was the SCG Open: Charlotte, and I had a blast playing tons of EDH two days in a row. I guess I played 10 games total and went either 6-3-1 or 5-3-2, depending on who you ask. Child of Alara got played the most and had a 50% win/loss ratio -- not bad for multiplayer!
I also only played in one official side event, instead opting to participate in random pick-up casual games. This worked out extremely well, and I'd recommend it to anyone else going to one of these events.
What worked: Capsize, Child of Alara recursion, Opaline Bracers (was in my IRL list at the time), MIND EXTRACTION. In the one side event I played, I was apparently the only guy doing anything to stop the other Child player from going infinite. He has Summoning Station and Blasting Station in his graveyard, and a Dross Scorpion and Doubling Cube in play -- Scorpion alone is a huge red flag. He casts Time Sieve and I Mystical Teachings for Faerie Trickery to exile it. Then he casts Conflux and gets All Suns' Dawn, Open the Vaults, and more game-winning bombs. I recur Drift of Phantasms and transmute it for Mind Extraction (sacrificing Child) to nuke his board and strip his hand, while he still tries to convince people that he isn't the threat.
Lo and behold, he rips a Demonic Tutor off the top for Roar of Reclamation (I was trying to exile his graveyard... arg). He doesn't see his own infinite combo on the board, and by the time he does, I have Dispeller's Capsule and Capsize to interrupt it. With things finally under control, the Teysa player mills me a ton with a double-striker + Sword of Body and Mind (I was running out of gas and got greedy, to be honest) and I deck within 5 or 6 turns despite all the Rolling Thunder recursion I can muster. With me out of the game, the other Child player combos out within a few turns.
In retrospect, it's a little frustrating, but we were all having fun I think. Skithirix and Teysa didn't seem to do a whole lot, but maybe I just can't remember. I did get a lot of compliments on the pauper deck, though. Several people took notice of my "Beta" manabase, and I was like, "Yeeaaahh.... Beta...."
What didn't work:Tilling Treefolk, Voidmage Apprentice. Treefolk might get better if I can squeeze in Strip Mine (pauper Crucible lock! lol) or some Panoramas, but while I like the late-game lockdown Apprentice provides, it's freaking expensive and Mind Extraction gives us a huge nut punch in its place. In any case, Arcane Denial is looking more and more appealing!
Looking toward the future: I'm pretty excited about the potential of Pauper EDH. I threw together a pauper Momir Vig, Simic Visionary deck on Cockatrice that's pretty sweet on the beatdown and can also combo out somewhat consistently with the Lifespark Spellbomb + Freed from the Real combo thanks to Trinket Mage and Drift of Phantasms. The Invokers (especially Dawnglare Invoker) seem to be hidden gems for this format. Because it's largely unexplored, would anyone be interested in some kind of league or deckbuilding challenge?
I would definitely be interested in a pauper EDH deckbuilding challenge. I have been wanting to mess around with Pauper but I am daunted by the idea of a bringing a pauper deck to a non-pauper table.
What generals other than Child do you think would have a chance at a non-pauper table?
I would definitely be interested in a pauper EDH deckbuilding challenge. I have been wanting to mess around with Pauper but I am daunted by the idea of a bringing a pauper deck to a non-pauper table.
What generals other than Child do you think would have a chance at a non-pauper table?
In multiplayer, I think generals with lots of late-game power are the most viable. Child is fine because sweepers are almost always relevant and useful. Other mass removal effects, like Kagemaro, First to Suffer or Jaya Ballard, Task Mage, could be good for similar reasons. On the other hand, you could play a general with a bomb-tastic effect to give you lots of reach: Maga, Traitor to Mortals, Verdeloth the Ancient, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Wort the Raidmother, or even Latulla, Keldon Overseer could probably do just fine. Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite has the potential to lock up games, though I have no idea what a mono-white pauper EDH deck would look like. Any of the Eldrazi would be especially nasty if there were enough common, non-color-specific nonbasics to make them work. Aggro might be even be possible with something like Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer or Thrun, the Last Troll, but it would be fairly difficult against multiple opponents. Basically, because commons typically lack the power plays available at other rarities, you make up for it with synergy/politics/card advantage and a swingy general.
In 1v1, anything is fair game I think. Voltron generals like Uril, the Miststalker or Skithirix, the Blight Dragon would still be pretty scary. Aggro-control in the form of Sygg, River Cutthroat or Vendilion Clique are still strong as far as I can tell. Niv-Mizzet still gets Ophidian Eye (lol!), is in good colors, and has powerful effects on the game, so he's a good choice -- matter of fact, he's probably good in multiplayer. Unless you have a sweeper general, I'd be hesitant to get in slugfests with full-powered EDH decks, so try to circumvent it by going on the beatdown or doing something unfair.
I'm not trying to misrepresent things: if a pauper deck goes head-to-head against a deck that does the same thing but with better cards, the pauper deck will lose 90% of the time, so you have to destabilize the game to have a chance. That's why stuff like the Sicilian Defense works in chess (if you mirror White, you're just a turn behind), and that's why pauper EDH decks need to make some gambits and attack at some weird angles to "get there" against their non-pauper cousins. Does that answer your question?
Have you tried out Shred Memory or Brainspoil? The transmute cards seem to be the most important cards in the deck, and Brainspoil is the only 5cc transmuter we can run. It conveniently gets Mnemonic Wall or Izzet Chronarch which allows the recursion engine to be tutorable through Mystical Teachings.
Also, I tossed together a pauper Thraximundar deck. It looks pretty promising so far. Thrax is such a huge beast as far as finishing the game goes.
I played in a $5 EDH tournament at the prerelease with the Child of Alara deck. It ended up being 10 people, so we split into two 5-man pods with the last 2 standing from each to advance to a final 4-way table. I ended up sweeping the first pod with 3 player kills and an assist (I Capsized one guy's blocker so that another guy could swing through for lethal general damage). Some highlights include casting Cultivate 3 times in the first 5 turns of the game, using someone else's Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth to make my Crypt Rats + Disturbed Burial combo insanely lethal, and randomly Rolling Thundering out one guy while also killing a Magus of the Coffers.
In the second pod, I start off with some serious gas but I have one guy pounding on me so I have to expend some resources defending myself early. I eventually stabilize, but I keep drawing land after land so I don't have much (Child was already in my graveyard). I kill one player with Ulamog's Crusher, but the other two are so far ahead of me I'm just praying that they don't decide to kill me just because they can. I make the mistake of using Faerie Trickery to counter a Bitter Ordeal copy aimed at me (I was worried about losing Capsize) and that gave the Sedris player an opportunity to Time Stretch himself and then go off with Future Sight + Top + Helm of Awakening into a Tendrils kill. (I had Mind Extracted him earlier in the game, but no one put pressure on him so he was able to rebuild. I'd never seen the deck before so I didn't know he was planning to combo kill.)
All in all, it was a great tournament. I ended up in 2nd place, winning $15 store credit. I got a lot of compliments on the deck, and people were amazed that I was able to hang with the big guns while playing pauper. The final table had a pretty good crowd watching us play, and some spectators were even placing early bets on me sweeping that table too.
I got a chance to play with Mycosynth Wellspring. I'm fairly unimpressed with it, but that might be because I drew it when I was already mana-flooded. It's already out of the deck in favor of Brainspoil. Maul Splicer was in the deck but didn't make an appearance so I can't judge as to his usefulness.
One of the guys in my playgroup recently bought a set of Unhinged and we were talking about how some of the cards would work in EDH. There is one card in the set that is absolutely perfect for the deck, but it's a rare. I think it's worth breaking pauper for it in this one specific instance, because the card fits so well with the deck that it just has to go in.
Beautiful. Just beautiful... I think I have the perfect place for this. My generals are packed in those hard plastic toploaders and are sleeved with another card facing the opposite direction, simply for amusement purposes. My playgroup has picked up on this:
Anyway, congrats on the 2nd place finish! I'm toying with the idea of Brainspoil as a means to tutor up Child of Alara should he meet a Hinder or Hallowed Burial in a dark alley. It hasn't happened yet because I play around those cards like my life depends on it, but Brainspoil is a possible include.
Shred Memory is really good, but I've been doing more than ok as far as graveyard hate is concerned. Maybe Dimir Infiltrator so we can Gravedigger it for profit? Or heck, transmute for Disturbed Burial for a reusable tutor chain? Sounds fun.
Voidmage Apprentice is going to get the axe for sure, probably in favor of Arcane Denial. We seem to be the ones policing the table and keeping everything in check, so more flexible (read: CASTABLE) answers are in order. Now I have an excuse to play another one of my favorite cards! I need to custom art that bad boy something fierce.
I'm going to pass on Maul Splicer. The more I play this deck, the more it seems dedicated wincons clog up my hand and just get discarded when I overflow with Rhystic Study or whatever.
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I will be posting pics of my deck at some point; I haven't forgotten. I'm getting some cards altered and I'm in the process of custom foiling my manabase, but once that is complete, I'll have scans up fo sho! Also, I'm making a pauper version of Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker, so I'll let you know how that turns out.
I'm toying with the idea of Brainspoil as a means to tutor up Child of Alara should he meet a Hinder or Hallowed Burial in a dark alley. It hasn't happened yet because I play around those cards like my life depends on it, but Brainspoil is a possible include.
Shred Memory is really good, but I've been doing more than ok as far as graveyard hate is concerned. Maybe Dimir Infiltrator so we can Gravedigger it for profit? Or heck, transmute for Disturbed Burial for a reusable tutor chain? Sounds fun.
I've actually included every common transmuter in the deck except for Dizzy Spell. Dimir Infiltrator is indeed really good, because I usually grab Grim Harvest, and that lets me set up a tutor chain for whatever I need.
The reason I included Shred Memory (beyond the transmute factor) is that I cut the Trinket Mage package and I wanted another graveyard hate spell. I only ever wanted to tutor for Nihil Spellbomb with Trinket Mage because the rest of the cards were either redundant to other effects (Wayfarer's Bauble, artifact lands, Dispeller's Capsule) or not worth tutoring out (Aether Spellbomb, Dispeller's Capsule). So I cut all the cute TMage targets for actual spells and replaced the mage itself with Shred Memory, which is a graveyard hate spell that doubles as a tutor. In addition, by tripling up on 2cc transmute spells, it allows me to use Muddle the Mixture as an actual counterspell and not feel bad about wasting my only transmute card.
I included Brainspoil mainly because it tutors for Mnemonic Wall and Izzet Chronarch so I can set up a recursion engine much easier. Brainspoil actually makes me want to reinclude Merchant Scroll so that I can use my 2cc transmuters to set up the loop as well. (Transmute -> Scroll -> Teachings -> Brainspoil -> Wall). The fact that it can also recover a tucked Child is mostly bonus, but it is a very good one at that.
Voidmage Apprentice is going to get the axe for sure, probably in favor of Arcane Denial. We seem to be the ones policing the table and keeping everything in check, so more flexible (read: CASTABLE) answers are in order. Now I have an excuse to play another one of my favorite cards! I need to custom art that bad boy something fierce.
I think you hit the nail on the head with the policeman comment. I feel like this deck's goal is to make everyone else play fair and then politic its way into a 1v1 match, where it can dominate with buyback spells and recursion. I absolutely love every counterspell in the deck right now (I cut the Apprentice, included Denial). In fact, I'm thinking about packing Mana Leak, Negate, or Cancel to supplement the suite. I really wish Forbid and Dismiss were commons.
I'm going to pass on Maul Splicer. The more I play this deck, the more it seems dedicated wincons clog up my hand and just get discarded when I overflow with Rhystic Study or whatever.
I've gotten some play time in with Maul Splicer in a 1v1 setting, and it's really subpar. I actually prefer Krosan Tusker to it on the battlefield, because a 6/5 can actually rumble with most generals, whereas a couple of 3/3s can't attack through hardly anything in EDH.
I feel like the deck is evolving into a modern version of Weissman's The Deck.
One thing I really wish the deck had access to is efficient lifegain. There have been many times where I get down to 10 or less life and there's just nothing I can do to keep people from forcing through the last few points of damage. Also, there have been games where Crypt Rats has been practically unuseable because I'm at such low life compared to everyone else. I would love for Pelakka Wurm to be a common, but sadly it's out of reach. The only other lifegain creature I can think of is Aven Riftwatcher, but I'm not sure if that's good enough.
I'd love to see scans of your deck. I'm in the process of foiling the deck out as well. After I get the newest batch of cards from SCG, I'll be up to 74/100 foil and an additional 7 that can't be foiled and that I need to alter. I was kind of thinking about painting Carrot Top's hair on Child and altering it to say "StepChild of Alara" since we abuse the poor kid so much.
I've been agonizing over what to cut for Dimir Infiltrator, and while I really like the card, I'm just not convinced I really need it in here. Tilling Treefolk was on the chopping block, but it was a total beast in the last game I played -- Treefolk recursion netted me my two missing colors, put me on top of the game after someone played Obliterate, and was effectively a 7-for-1 or something ridiculous. It's a shame the art is so ugly, so to make up for it, I'm going to add Strip Mine in place of a Forest for some extra cuteness utility. I can't wait to lock someone out of the game with Tilling Treefolk, but as soon as I get color screwed because of Strip Mine, it's back out again in favor of a Forest.
Similarly, Trinket Mage has always been good to me, fixing my mana, exiling graveyards, and (yes) disenchanting stuff. I can't see it ever leaving, though the toolbox will undoubtedly change over time.
Out of all of these, I like the two counterspells and the two Bounties the best. Sun's Bounty seems like it could be strong, considering we already have a recover engine, but all it does is gain life. The others at least have other uses with lifegain tacked on as a bonus.
What ultimately led to me cutting Trinket Mage is that I was forced to remove the artifact lands from my mana base. There are just too many cards like Pernicious Deed, Fracturing Gust, and even Creeping Corrosion in my paper group for me to depend on artifact lands. There's one guy in my group who goes out of his way to blow up as many of my lands as possible, and the last thing I need to do is let his artifact hate double as Stone Rain. With those gone, Trinket Mage lost a lot of its flexibility and I took him out in favor of transmute cards. I've found I don't miss the Mage at all. If I had to choose at any point in a game between having a Trinket Mage or Dimir Infiltrator, I'd almost always choose the Infiltrator because it does so much more for the deck. It primarily finds Disturbed Burial or Grim Harvest, but it can also grab counterspells and Rolling Thunder. I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here. If you're getting good mileage out of the mage, by all means, run it. I'm just saying that it underperformed for me and by taking it and its associated trinkets out, I freed up a lot of room for more powerful spells.
So far I've been loving Tilling Treefolk. It patches up a huge hole in the deck (land destruction) and at worse, it picks up a couple cycling lands or panoramas. I've always gotten good value out of it.
Sounds reasonable. I can still see Infiltrator and/or some lifegain coming in at some point, just not now; things are humming smoothly in my local meta. Now my attention turns toward the manabase, and testing out the panoramas you suggested.
I'm also working on custom foiling the manabase. The attached image should give you an idea of what I have in mind.
Also, I want to get Child of Alara altered to look like Electrode about to self destruct. That would be awesome.
EDIT: I think I've finished the basic land proxies. They're not quite 300 dpi (closer to 240ish), but because the image isn't that detailed I think it will be okay. There is also a tad of granulation left over from the scanner, but it looks great when viewed actual size! I'd say it was a success for my first real proxy attempt.
It's been a few weeks since anyone posted in this thread. I hope the deck didn't die, it's too much fun to let it fade away. I don't have any major changes to the deck to report, but I do have some play time with a couple that were brought up earlier.
I think I've managed to make my playgroup fear commons. I've heard on numerous occasions that Child is unbeatable after the game turns into a heads up, and people are going out of their way to try to take me out early. The funny thing is, the deck can usually handle it (no one is running heavy counterspells so my recursion doesn't get stopped).
Rare-B-Gone has been such an insanely powerful spell. It honestly feels like a 4 mana Obliterate that only affects opponents. My playgroup is mostly ok with me playing it, too, since it's very conditional and flavorful.
Sun's Bounty has been a great life-gain spell, since we already run a recover engine. It gets a little mana-intensive if I have both it and Grim Harvest going at the same time, but so far it's been worth it. Having access to it allows me to mostly ignore non-general damage entirely. It's definitely plugged a hole in the deck. I haven't tested out any of the others because Sun's Bounty is all I really need.
I love this deck, definitely was lots of fun to play with today. I won a 4 player game today. Child of Alara (me), Jhoira of the Ghitu, Crosis, the Purger and Rith, the Awakener. After surviving a obliterate, I was able to take control with the Child, wiping the board at least 6 times.
I found Fling to be my gem during this game. Nothing like sac'ing Child and hitting someone on the dome for 6.
This list looks interesting, and I'm going to build some variation of it for chuckles. Though I was looking it over, and Strip Mine isn't actually a common, figured I'd mention it.
Strip Mine had four versions in Antiquities, one of which was printed on the common sheet. Magiccards.info doesn't list it that way, but it was technically common.
Nope, this deck didn't die! I was just waiting to post until I finished the custom manabase and got my altered cards back. I'm still not done with it, but soon! Soon!
My playgroup is starting to hate Child of Alara as well. Most people around here play battlefield-based threats and interactions, so Child of Alara just throws a giant middle finger their way. No one plays enough graveyard hate, either; maybe a Tormod's Crypt comes down every few games, which I just destroy before it gets too problematic. This deck is superbly positioned right now in my meta.
After one long game where I barely won at 1 life, I decided to hop on board with the lifegain. I'm going to ditch Journey to Nowhere for Overrule -- Journey has poor synergy with Child and doesn't have the versatility of Oblivion Ring to make up for it. Journey is also expensive to get in foil.
LittlestMorte is right about Strip Mine. I have no idea why only one of the four arts was common, but hey, I'll roll with it!
Fling looks cool, Evermore. Why Fling and not Rite of Consumption, which also gains you life? Or are you running both?
@Nideovinja -- Sweet, let us know how it turns out! This has actually become my favorite deck, and I hope you enjoy it as well.
@LittlestMorte -- Thanks a ton for all your input on this deck. Your suggestions have made it, like, ten times better than it would be otherwise!
I thought you guys might like to know: There is a 1v1 tournament coming up in July around here, so I'm going to sleeve up a pauper deck and see if I can roll the competition. You can check out my intended list here. I know it's gag-inducing, but I going WIN lol
You're welcome d0su. All credit goes to you for coming up with the idea though, I'm just helping to polish it.
People don't hate the deck, they just acknowledge that they can't let me survive into a heads up match, because I'll crush them like a bug. So it's more like the deck has gotten a reputation.
The problem with Rite of Consumption is that it's a sorcery. I absolutely hate having sorcery speed ways to kill Child, because it forces my hand. I prefer to show an instant speed way to kill Child and dare people to mess with me. The only reason I keep Mind Extraction around is because it's a huge kick to the junk of the person you target.
If you're looking for life gain, try out Sun's Bounty. It's a really great engine card if you need lifegain.
I actually didn't think about rite of consumption, will have to put that in the deck too. Since fling is instant you can sac child anything, which is huge for my playgroup. Definitely will put in rite, since life gain is also important.
I've only gotten to play a handful of games with the deck so far, and surprisingly it's won them all. All the strange interactions in the deck definitely keep the game fresh, and even a bit play skill intensive (which always makes a game better).
A few suggestions, or at least stuff I'm trying for those interested...
1. Rush of Knowledge, this wonderful card always draws at least 3 cards, though often draws 5 (nobody likes to kill Child in response), (sometimes 8 if Crusher is running around). And makes my opponent shed tears with Izzet Chronarch or Mnemonic Wall around.
2. Red Elmental Blast, instant speed removal for Child and as a bonus it counters the only important spells in EDH :p, and says Vindicate for almost all the good generals. So far I've loved it, I might even stuff Pyroblast in there somewhere if it keeps serving me so well.
3. Cavern Harpy, the newest recursion engine. Makes recurring "enters the battlefield" effects so much cheaper than the other options. Admittedly it doesn't work for green creatures, but that's a fair trade to recur Izzet Chornarch, Menmonic Wall, Grave Digger, Sea Gate Oracle, Mull Drifter and Cadaver Imp. Oh and as an added bonus it also saves Crypt Rats (even if I do find the Rats nearly useless).
And while it's so far been unnecessary (since so few people seem to run graveyard anything) I've switched to running Faerie Macabre as tutorable instant speed, uncounterable, recurable graveyard hate. This is mostly because I tossed out the Trinket package (as much as I do love Trinket, I wanted more Transmute stuff), and wanted a tutorable means of graveyard hate.
Also on the life gain issue, I'm currently messing with Renewed Faith since it cycles (and even gains life) when it's not terriblely useful. Though Narrow Escape might be better since I get an extra enters the battlefield effect off it.
*shrugs* Anyway, I'll keep people posted as I play it more. Thanks for making the deck d0su! It is indeed entertaining.
This notion has popped up several times now in this thread. It seems that everyone's meta is completely different from mine. Basically every deck I play with or against has some amount of both graveyard abuse and graveyard hate.
That's one reason (there are others) this deck would not stand a chance where I play.
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While I'll admit it's not top tier or anything, you'd be amazed how many decks fold to repeatable board wipe. Not to mention both d0su's and my version have recurring graveyard hate, so anything relying on that is basically dead. Though obviously super fast combo is a real problem, probably why I've been sneaking more counters into it. Still the beauty of this deck is it can easily be tailored to a specific meta, it is after all a control deck.
I'd say give it a shot, it's not like the deck is expensive to build, you probably won't steam roll anybody. But this deck will put up a surprisingly good fight if your opponent(s) need nonlands to win, and they don't combo you out in the first 4 turns. Even then you have a handful of counters, so it's not all lost.
A few suggestions, or at least stuff I'm trying for those interested...
1. Rush of Knowledge, this wonderful card always draws at least 3 cards, though often draws 5 (nobody likes to kill Child in response), (sometimes 8 if Crusher is running around). And makes my opponent shed tears with Izzet Chronarch or Mnemonic Wall around.
2. Red Elmental Blast, instant speed removal for Child and as a bonus it counters the only important spells in EDH :p, and says Vindicate for almost all the good generals. So far I've loved it, I might even stuff Pyroblast in there somewhere if it keeps serving me so well.
3. Cavern Harpy, the newest recursion engine. Makes recurring "enters the battlefield" effects so much cheaper than the other options. Admittedly it doesn't work for green creatures, but that's a fair trade to recur Izzet Chornarch, Menmonic Wall, Grave Digger, Sea Gate Oracle, Mull Drifter and Cadaver Imp. Oh and as an added bonus it also saves Crypt Rats (even if I do find the Rats nearly useless).
Sweet, glad to hear it's working out for you! These suggestions are really good, too -- all three of them are quite useful. Now I have to figure out which ones to squeeze into my build.
I can rule out Red Elemental Blast for the time being because, while it at least kills Child, there isn't enough serious blue in my meta (yeah, my local scene is a little warped) for it to be worthwhile. I've got an extra copy, though, so I'll carry it around for when I go to an EDH event or whatever.
Cavern Harpy is groovy as well. Why didn't I think of that?
Here are what I consider to be the "loosest" slots in the deck: Twisted Abomination -- I think I've only actually cast him twice, preferring his cycling ability and its subsequent shuffle the majority of the time. However, he has helped close out a few games, and the Timeshifted version looks freaking sweet in foil (but that shouldn't be a deciding factor). Aether Spellbomb -- The least-used Trinket Mage target. It, too, has come in handy every once in a while, like just leaving it on the board to deter the voltron player for ages and bouncing Dross Scorpion mid-combo. I tend to forget I can use it on my own guys, so I'll pay more attention to that in the future.
That's it; I've been more or less satisfied with everything else in the deck.
Quote from metalevolence »
This notion has popped up several times now in this thread. It seems that everyone's meta is completely different from mine. Basically every deck I play with or against has some amount of both graveyard abuse and graveyard hate.
That's one reason (there are others) this deck would not stand a chance where I play.
Enemy graveyard abuse is not a problem; like Nideovinja said, we can exile graveyards all day long. I play Bojuka Bog, Nihil Spellbomb, and a ton of ways to tutor for Spellbomb. I also play a lot of ways to use them multiple times, such as Capsize, Sanctum Gargoyle, and even the terrible "blow-up-your-own-Bojuka-Bog-into-Tilling-Treefolk" line of play.
Graveyard hate can be problematic, though. An opening-hand Leyline of the Void just grinds things to a halt and is one of the primary reasons I play Dispeller's Capsule. Planar Void isn't quite as bad because we can kill it with Child, but it's still a pain in the butt. A one-shot graveyard hoser like Tormod's Crypt can do surprisingly little with tight play, but the second one is often a slap in the face -- thankfully, that doesn't happen often, but there is still Capsize to pull you out of that hole.
If your meta is brimming with graveyard hate, then this might not be a good deck choice. However, if it's just the obligatory Relic of Progenitus + maybe Bojuka Bog setup, you're good to go.
In other news:
I've got a small shipment of foils on the way. Pics are happening when they arrive. I'm excited, because when I get those, my deck will be >90% pimped. 83 foils, 5 altered art cards, and a few foreign/unfoilable cards to round it out. I've never owned a nice-looking deck in my life (lol), so I'm pretty stoked.
Would Remember the Fallen make the cut?
I had no idea that card existed. Man, Mind Extraction is a kick in the nuts! I'll find room for that bad boy ASAP.
LittlestMorte suggested that card too; I guess I forgot to address it! It's a fine inclusion and could quite possibly be worth more than a generic 2-for-1. It all depends on if we can find room.
As such, here are the cards currently being considered for inclusion:
Arcane Denial
Maul Splicer
Mind Extraction
Remember the Fallen
I've ruled out Primal Growth because we honestly have enough ramp/fixing to get the job done. In fact, Far Wanderings is often a tutor target because it ramps us to our stage four (yes, stage FOUR) trumps. Mycosynth Wellspring is probably not going to make it either because it's a lousy topdeck and isn't as abusable as Sylvan Ranger (which also didn't make it). The others seem useful at the very least, so I'll be testing them in place of some other cards.
And here are the cards in the current list that are under the most scrutiny:
Opaline Bracers
Prophetic Prism
Soul Manipulation?
Tilling Treefolk?
Voidmage Apprentice
Bracers is an easy cut, and since Mind Extraction is priority number one, I'll make that swap now. Tilling Treefolk might be a little too niche, but I want to give it some more time before making a decision. Voidmage Apprentice is expensive and did nothing except scare people when I played it the other day, but it's like Treefolk in that it has potential. I can see comparable power levels between the other cards and the possible includes, but would the new cards actually be better? I don't know.
At this point, I have no more information and I'd just be rambling, so I would greatly appreciate hearing some opinions on this.
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Don't want to derail the thread or anything, but I was intrigued by the idea of pauper EDH and made a deck last night. Is there a place in the forums to post it?
Whereas it seems like your deck was intended to play against regular EDH decks, I made mine envisioning Pauper EDH as its own format.
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If you're running Tilling Treefolk, give the panoramas a shot. They're pretty decent mana fixing, and getting extra value out of your cards is always a plus.
I'm pretty sure Rancor doesn't do nearly enough, but it does speed the general kill up by a turn. I doubt that that's worth a slot, but I thought I'd mention it as an alternative to the Bracers.
Excluding Rhystic Study is more of a political thing. I've replaced it with Syphon Mind and I've been pretty pleased with the results.
I'm still running Sylvan Ranger. I find it preferable to the Prophetic Prism. I very rarely used the Prism as mana fixing and it dies to Child anyway, so mostly it was a blank card that cycled. At least the Ranger provides a body.
I know what you mean about Far Wanderings. If I see it early, I do my best to hit threshold ASAP just so I can get +3 lands, and it's a great transmute target. I'm still amazed at how strong this card is every time I play it.
I had no idea Mind Extraction existed. Planar Cleansing + Mind Twist seems pretty reasonable. I'm definitely going to have to scour common boxes to find a copy.
The more I think about it, the less I like Remember the Fallen. I just don't play enough artifacts in my deck for it to be worthwhile. I guess if you still run the Bracers it's a decent way to get them back. I don't think I'll add it to my deck though.
I'm becoming less and less a fan of Trinket Mage as time goes on. The only card I ever want to tutor for is Nihil Spellbomb. The rest of the cards either have redundancies or just aren't worth spending 2U to find. Also, I've found that artifact lands are not worth the trouble in my paper meta because there are just so many artifact sweepers running around. I'd prefer to just have regular old reliable basics. (On an amusing note, I think this is the first 5C deck I've ever played that's almost entirely immune to Blood Moon.)
I cut Voidmage Apprentice a long time ago because it was just never worth holding 2UU open and it's only a surprise the first time you play the card.
I've been really liking Reprisal as another removal spell. It's practically a 1W Terminate in EDH. It definitely passes the test to be in the deck (instant, kills Child).
I have to give you major props for this deck d0su. This is a thing of beauty. I'm definitely making my playgroup fear the all-common deck, even if they do ***** about the mythic general heading the team. (Seriously, who wants a vanilla general? I can't imagine how that would be interesting at all.)
These are the differences between our two decks:
You run
I run:
It's not a large difference and I think it comes down to play style. I just love drawing lands and my main goal is to drop a land every turn of the game.
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Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
I also only played in one official side event, instead opting to participate in random pick-up casual games. This worked out extremely well, and I'd recommend it to anyone else going to one of these events.
Concerning this deck, the 3 games I won were decided by Child of Alara + Opaline Bracers, Capsize, and Child recursion/resource advantage (meaning I didn't get to Rolling Thunder people out of the game this weekend. :(). The games I didn't win were to my Rasputin Dreamweaver combo deck, decking via Sword of Body and Mind + Font of Mythos, and the T.O. making us move so they could start a draft.
What worked: Capsize, Child of Alara recursion, Opaline Bracers (was in my IRL list at the time), MIND EXTRACTION. In the one side event I played, I was apparently the only guy doing anything to stop the other Child player from going infinite. He has Summoning Station and Blasting Station in his graveyard, and a Dross Scorpion and Doubling Cube in play -- Scorpion alone is a huge red flag. He casts Time Sieve and I Mystical Teachings for Faerie Trickery to exile it. Then he casts Conflux and gets All Suns' Dawn, Open the Vaults, and more game-winning bombs. I recur Drift of Phantasms and transmute it for Mind Extraction (sacrificing Child) to nuke his board and strip his hand, while he still tries to convince people that he isn't the threat.
Lo and behold, he rips a Demonic Tutor off the top for Roar of Reclamation (I was trying to exile his graveyard... arg). He doesn't see his own infinite combo on the board, and by the time he does, I have Dispeller's Capsule and Capsize to interrupt it. With things finally under control, the Teysa player mills me a ton with a double-striker + Sword of Body and Mind (I was running out of gas and got greedy, to be honest) and I deck within 5 or 6 turns despite all the Rolling Thunder recursion I can muster. With me out of the game, the other Child player combos out within a few turns.
In retrospect, it's a little frustrating, but we were all having fun I think. Skithirix and Teysa didn't seem to do a whole lot, but maybe I just can't remember. I did get a lot of compliments on the pauper deck, though. Several people took notice of my "Beta" manabase, and I was like, "Yeeaaahh.... Beta...."
What didn't work: Tilling Treefolk, Voidmage Apprentice. Treefolk might get better if I can squeeze in Strip Mine (pauper Crucible lock! lol) or some Panoramas, but while I like the late-game lockdown Apprentice provides, it's freaking expensive and Mind Extraction gives us a huge nut punch in its place. In any case, Arcane Denial is looking more and more appealing!
Looking toward the future: I'm pretty excited about the potential of Pauper EDH. I threw together a pauper Momir Vig, Simic Visionary deck on Cockatrice that's pretty sweet on the beatdown and can also combo out somewhat consistently with the Lifespark Spellbomb + Freed from the Real combo thanks to Trinket Mage and Drift of Phantasms. The Invokers (especially Dawnglare Invoker) seem to be hidden gems for this format. Because it's largely unexplored, would anyone be interested in some kind of league or deckbuilding challenge?
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What generals other than Child do you think would have a chance at a non-pauper table?
Like smashing face? Like not worrying about pitiful tokens or life gain? Check out Stonebrow, Krosan Hero for all your face smashing needs
In multiplayer, I think generals with lots of late-game power are the most viable. Child is fine because sweepers are almost always relevant and useful. Other mass removal effects, like Kagemaro, First to Suffer or Jaya Ballard, Task Mage, could be good for similar reasons. On the other hand, you could play a general with a bomb-tastic effect to give you lots of reach: Maga, Traitor to Mortals, Verdeloth the Ancient, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Wort the Raidmother, or even Latulla, Keldon Overseer could probably do just fine. Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite has the potential to lock up games, though I have no idea what a mono-white pauper EDH deck would look like. Any of the Eldrazi would be especially nasty if there were enough common, non-color-specific nonbasics to make them work. Aggro might be even be possible with something like Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer or Thrun, the Last Troll, but it would be fairly difficult against multiple opponents. Basically, because commons typically lack the power plays available at other rarities, you make up for it with synergy/politics/card advantage and a swingy general.
In 1v1, anything is fair game I think. Voltron generals like Uril, the Miststalker or Skithirix, the Blight Dragon would still be pretty scary. Aggro-control in the form of Sygg, River Cutthroat or Vendilion Clique are still strong as far as I can tell. Niv-Mizzet still gets Ophidian Eye (lol!), is in good colors, and has powerful effects on the game, so he's a good choice -- matter of fact, he's probably good in multiplayer. Unless you have a sweeper general, I'd be hesitant to get in slugfests with full-powered EDH decks, so try to circumvent it by going on the beatdown or doing something unfair.
I guess some card-specific generals like Captain Sisay and Scion of the Ur-Dragon get the hose, though.
I'm not trying to misrepresent things: if a pauper deck goes head-to-head against a deck that does the same thing but with better cards, the pauper deck will lose 90% of the time, so you have to destabilize the game to have a chance. That's why stuff like the Sicilian Defense works in chess (if you mirror White, you're just a turn behind), and that's why pauper EDH decks need to make some gambits and attack at some weird angles to "get there" against their non-pauper cousins. Does that answer your question?
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Also, I tossed together a pauper Thraximundar deck. It looks pretty promising so far. Thrax is such a huge beast as far as finishing the game goes.
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Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
In the second pod, I start off with some serious gas but I have one guy pounding on me so I have to expend some resources defending myself early. I eventually stabilize, but I keep drawing land after land so I don't have much (Child was already in my graveyard). I kill one player with Ulamog's Crusher, but the other two are so far ahead of me I'm just praying that they don't decide to kill me just because they can. I make the mistake of using Faerie Trickery to counter a Bitter Ordeal copy aimed at me (I was worried about losing Capsize) and that gave the Sedris player an opportunity to Time Stretch himself and then go off with Future Sight + Top + Helm of Awakening into a Tendrils kill. (I had Mind Extracted him earlier in the game, but no one put pressure on him so he was able to rebuild. I'd never seen the deck before so I didn't know he was planning to combo kill.)
All in all, it was a great tournament. I ended up in 2nd place, winning $15 store credit. I got a lot of compliments on the deck, and people were amazed that I was able to hang with the big guns while playing pauper. The final table had a pretty good crowd watching us play, and some spectators were even placing early bets on me sweeping that table too.
I got a chance to play with Mycosynth Wellspring. I'm fairly unimpressed with it, but that might be because I drew it when I was already mana-flooded. It's already out of the deck in favor of Brainspoil. Maul Splicer was in the deck but didn't make an appearance so I can't judge as to his usefulness.
One of the guys in my playgroup recently bought a set of Unhinged and we were talking about how some of the cards would work in EDH. There is one card in the set that is absolutely perfect for the deck, but it's a rare. I think it's worth breaking pauper for it in this one specific instance, because the card fits so well with the deck that it just has to go in.
The card?
Rare-B-Gone.
Teneb, the Harvester: Let there be life!
Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
Beautiful. Just beautiful... I think I have the perfect place for this. My generals are packed in those hard plastic toploaders and are sleeved with another card facing the opposite direction, simply for amusement purposes. My playgroup has picked up on this:
Gaddock Teeg has a foily James from Team Rocket (he protects the world from devastation);
Rasputin Dreamweaver is packing Gleemax;
Nicol Bolas is packing Charmander (Charmander is evolving... oh FFFUUUUU!!!);
...and now Child of Alara will be packing Rare-B-Gone! Sweet.
Anyway, congrats on the 2nd place finish! I'm toying with the idea of Brainspoil as a means to tutor up Child of Alara should he meet a Hinder or Hallowed Burial in a dark alley. It hasn't happened yet because I play around those cards like my life depends on it, but Brainspoil is a possible include.
Shred Memory is really good, but I've been doing more than ok as far as graveyard hate is concerned. Maybe Dimir Infiltrator so we can Gravedigger it for profit? Or heck, transmute for Disturbed Burial for a reusable tutor chain? Sounds fun.
Voidmage Apprentice is going to get the axe for sure, probably in favor of Arcane Denial. We seem to be the ones policing the table and keeping everything in check, so more flexible (read: CASTABLE) answers are in order. Now I have an excuse to play another one of my favorite cards! I need to custom art that bad boy something fierce.
I'm going to pass on Maul Splicer. The more I play this deck, the more it seems dedicated wincons clog up my hand and just get discarded when I overflow with Rhystic Study or whatever.
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I will be posting pics of my deck at some point; I haven't forgotten. I'm getting some cards altered and I'm in the process of custom foiling my manabase, but once that is complete, I'll have scans up fo sho! Also, I'm making a pauper version of Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker, so I'll let you know how that turns out.
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I've actually included every common transmuter in the deck except for Dizzy Spell. Dimir Infiltrator is indeed really good, because I usually grab Grim Harvest, and that lets me set up a tutor chain for whatever I need.
The reason I included Shred Memory (beyond the transmute factor) is that I cut the Trinket Mage package and I wanted another graveyard hate spell. I only ever wanted to tutor for Nihil Spellbomb with Trinket Mage because the rest of the cards were either redundant to other effects (Wayfarer's Bauble, artifact lands, Dispeller's Capsule) or not worth tutoring out (Aether Spellbomb, Dispeller's Capsule). So I cut all the cute TMage targets for actual spells and replaced the mage itself with Shred Memory, which is a graveyard hate spell that doubles as a tutor. In addition, by tripling up on 2cc transmute spells, it allows me to use Muddle the Mixture as an actual counterspell and not feel bad about wasting my only transmute card.
I included Brainspoil mainly because it tutors for Mnemonic Wall and Izzet Chronarch so I can set up a recursion engine much easier. Brainspoil actually makes me want to reinclude Merchant Scroll so that I can use my 2cc transmuters to set up the loop as well. (Transmute -> Scroll -> Teachings -> Brainspoil -> Wall). The fact that it can also recover a tucked Child is mostly bonus, but it is a very good one at that.
I think you hit the nail on the head with the policeman comment. I feel like this deck's goal is to make everyone else play fair and then politic its way into a 1v1 match, where it can dominate with buyback spells and recursion. I absolutely love every counterspell in the deck right now (I cut the Apprentice, included Denial). In fact, I'm thinking about packing Mana Leak, Negate, or Cancel to supplement the suite. I really wish Forbid and Dismiss were commons.
I've gotten some play time in with Maul Splicer in a 1v1 setting, and it's really subpar. I actually prefer Krosan Tusker to it on the battlefield, because a 6/5 can actually rumble with most generals, whereas a couple of 3/3s can't attack through hardly anything in EDH.
I feel like the deck is evolving into a modern version of Weissman's The Deck.
One thing I really wish the deck had access to is efficient lifegain. There have been many times where I get down to 10 or less life and there's just nothing I can do to keep people from forcing through the last few points of damage. Also, there have been games where Crypt Rats has been practically unuseable because I'm at such low life compared to everyone else. I would love for Pelakka Wurm to be a common, but sadly it's out of reach. The only other lifegain creature I can think of is Aven Riftwatcher, but I'm not sure if that's good enough.
I'd love to see scans of your deck. I'm in the process of foiling the deck out as well. After I get the newest batch of cards from SCG, I'll be up to 74/100 foil and an additional 7 that can't be foiled and that I need to alter. I was kind of thinking about painting Carrot Top's hair on Child and altering it to say "StepChild of Alara" since we abuse the poor kid so much.
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Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
cutenessutility. I can't wait to lock someone out of the game with Tilling Treefolk, but as soon as I get color screwed because of Strip Mine, it's back out again in favor of a Forest.Similarly, Trinket Mage has always been good to me, fixing my mana, exiling graveyards, and (yes) disenchanting stuff. I can't see it ever leaving, though the toolbox will undoubtedly change over time.
I agree that some lifegain could be useful. How about Congregate? That stupidly scalable thing from Urza's Saga has been showing up at multiplayer tables for the last decade. Here are some other ideas that came up after a brief search:
Bloodrite Invoker
Fangren Marauder (IDK)
Grazing Gladehart
Urborg Syphon-Mage (draws more hate than Rhystic Study)
Overrule
Renewed Faith
Sun's Bounty
Overrule actually looks quite attractive. I might have to consider it, as well.
Weissman would be proud of our red-headed stepchild and the creature-based card advantage it accrues!
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- Brindle Boar
- Captured Sunlight
- Exile
(Common in Master's Edition, but this feels like cheating)Out of all of these, I like the two counterspells and the two Bounties the best. Sun's Bounty seems like it could be strong, considering we already have a recover engine, but all it does is gain life. The others at least have other uses with lifegain tacked on as a bonus.
What ultimately led to me cutting Trinket Mage is that I was forced to remove the artifact lands from my mana base. There are just too many cards like Pernicious Deed, Fracturing Gust, and even Creeping Corrosion in my paper group for me to depend on artifact lands. There's one guy in my group who goes out of his way to blow up as many of my lands as possible, and the last thing I need to do is let his artifact hate double as Stone Rain. With those gone, Trinket Mage lost a lot of its flexibility and I took him out in favor of transmute cards. I've found I don't miss the Mage at all. If I had to choose at any point in a game between having a Trinket Mage or Dimir Infiltrator, I'd almost always choose the Infiltrator because it does so much more for the deck. It primarily finds Disturbed Burial or Grim Harvest, but it can also grab counterspells and Rolling Thunder. I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here. If you're getting good mileage out of the mage, by all means, run it. I'm just saying that it underperformed for me and by taking it and its associated trinkets out, I freed up a lot of room for more powerful spells.
So far I've been loving Tilling Treefolk. It patches up a huge hole in the deck (land destruction) and at worse, it picks up a couple cycling lands or panoramas. I've always gotten good value out of it.
Teneb, the Harvester: Let there be life!
Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
I'm also working on custom foiling the manabase. The attached image should give you an idea of what I have in mind.
Also, I want to get Child of Alara altered to look like Electrode about to self destruct. That would be awesome.
EDIT: I think I've finished the basic land proxies. They're not quite 300 dpi (closer to 240ish), but because the image isn't that detailed I think it will be okay. There is also a tad of granulation left over from the scanner, but it looks great when viewed actual size! I'd say it was a success for my first real proxy attempt.
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I think I've managed to make my playgroup fear commons. I've heard on numerous occasions that Child is unbeatable after the game turns into a heads up, and people are going out of their way to try to take me out early. The funny thing is, the deck can usually handle it (no one is running heavy counterspells so my recursion doesn't get stopped).
Rare-B-Gone has been such an insanely powerful spell. It honestly feels like a 4 mana Obliterate that only affects opponents. My playgroup is mostly ok with me playing it, too, since it's very conditional and flavorful.
Sun's Bounty has been a great life-gain spell, since we already run a recover engine. It gets a little mana-intensive if I have both it and Grim Harvest going at the same time, but so far it's been worth it. Having access to it allows me to mostly ignore non-general damage entirely. It's definitely plugged a hole in the deck. I haven't tested out any of the others because Sun's Bounty is all I really need.
Teneb, the Harvester: Let there be life!
Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
I found Fling to be my gem during this game. Nothing like sac'ing Child and hitting someone on the dome for 6.
Thanks for the deck concept.
Teneb, the Harvester: Let there be life!
Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
My playgroup is starting to hate Child of Alara as well. Most people around here play battlefield-based threats and interactions, so Child of Alara just throws a giant middle finger their way. No one plays enough graveyard hate, either; maybe a Tormod's Crypt comes down every few games, which I just destroy before it gets too problematic. This deck is superbly positioned right now in my meta.
After one long game where I barely won at 1 life, I decided to hop on board with the lifegain. I'm going to ditch Journey to Nowhere for Overrule -- Journey has poor synergy with Child and doesn't have the versatility of Oblivion Ring to make up for it. Journey is also expensive to get in foil.
LittlestMorte is right about Strip Mine. I have no idea why only one of the four arts was common, but hey, I'll roll with it!
Fling looks cool, Evermore. Why Fling and not Rite of Consumption, which also gains you life? Or are you running both?
@Nideovinja -- Sweet, let us know how it turns out! This has actually become my favorite deck, and I hope you enjoy it as well.
@LittlestMorte -- Thanks a ton for all your input on this deck. Your suggestions have made it, like, ten times better than it would be otherwise!
I thought you guys might like to know: There is a 1v1 tournament coming up in July around here, so I'm going to sleeve up a pauper deck and see if I can roll the competition. You can check out my intended list here. I know it's gag-inducing, but I going WIN lol
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People don't hate the deck, they just acknowledge that they can't let me survive into a heads up match, because I'll crush them like a bug. So it's more like the deck has gotten a reputation.
The problem with Rite of Consumption is that it's a sorcery. I absolutely hate having sorcery speed ways to kill Child, because it forces my hand. I prefer to show an instant speed way to kill Child and dare people to mess with me. The only reason I keep Mind Extraction around is because it's a huge kick to the junk of the person you target.
If you're looking for life gain, try out Sun's Bounty. It's a really great engine card if you need lifegain.
Teneb, the Harvester: Let there be life!
Drafting Aggro in the Cube: A Primer for Beginners
A few suggestions, or at least stuff I'm trying for those interested...
1. Rush of Knowledge, this wonderful card always draws at least 3 cards, though often draws 5 (nobody likes to kill Child in response), (sometimes 8 if Crusher is running around). And makes my opponent shed tears with Izzet Chronarch or Mnemonic Wall around.
2. Red Elmental Blast, instant speed removal for Child and as a bonus it counters the only important spells in EDH :p, and says Vindicate for almost all the good generals. So far I've loved it, I might even stuff Pyroblast in there somewhere if it keeps serving me so well.
3. Cavern Harpy, the newest recursion engine. Makes recurring "enters the battlefield" effects so much cheaper than the other options. Admittedly it doesn't work for green creatures, but that's a fair trade to recur Izzet Chornarch, Menmonic Wall, Grave Digger, Sea Gate Oracle, Mull Drifter and Cadaver Imp. Oh and as an added bonus it also saves Crypt Rats (even if I do find the Rats nearly useless).
And while it's so far been unnecessary (since so few people seem to run graveyard anything) I've switched to running Faerie Macabre as tutorable instant speed, uncounterable, recurable graveyard hate. This is mostly because I tossed out the Trinket package (as much as I do love Trinket, I wanted more Transmute stuff), and wanted a tutorable means of graveyard hate.
Also on the life gain issue, I'm currently messing with Renewed Faith since it cycles (and even gains life) when it's not terriblely useful. Though Narrow Escape might be better since I get an extra enters the battlefield effect off it.
*shrugs* Anyway, I'll keep people posted as I play it more. Thanks for making the deck d0su! It is indeed entertaining.
This notion has popped up several times now in this thread. It seems that everyone's meta is completely different from mine. Basically every deck I play with or against has some amount of both graveyard abuse and graveyard hate.
That's one reason (there are others) this deck would not stand a chance where I play.
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I'd say give it a shot, it's not like the deck is expensive to build, you probably won't steam roll anybody. But this deck will put up a surprisingly good fight if your opponent(s) need nonlands to win, and they don't combo you out in the first 4 turns. Even then you have a handful of counters, so it's not all lost.
Sweet, glad to hear it's working out for you! These suggestions are really good, too -- all three of them are quite useful. Now I have to figure out which ones to squeeze into my build.
I can rule out Red Elemental Blast for the time being because, while it at least kills Child, there isn't enough serious blue in my meta (yeah, my local scene is a little warped) for it to be worthwhile. I've got an extra copy, though, so I'll carry it around for when I go to an EDH event or whatever.
Rush of Knowledge is great card draw. I'll have to test it versus Mystic Remora, Brainstorm, and Compulsive Research (even though not in the list *yet*) and find the optimal mix.
Cavern Harpy is groovy as well. Why didn't I think of that?
Here are what I consider to be the "loosest" slots in the deck:
Twisted Abomination -- I think I've only actually cast him twice, preferring his cycling ability and its subsequent shuffle the majority of the time. However, he has helped close out a few games, and the Timeshifted version looks freaking sweet in foil (but that shouldn't be a deciding factor).
Aether Spellbomb -- The least-used Trinket Mage target. It, too, has come in handy every once in a while, like just leaving it on the board to deter the voltron player for ages and bouncing Dross Scorpion mid-combo. I tend to forget I can use it on my own guys, so I'll pay more attention to that in the future.
That's it; I've been more or less satisfied with everything else in the deck.
Enemy graveyard abuse is not a problem; like Nideovinja said, we can exile graveyards all day long. I play Bojuka Bog, Nihil Spellbomb, and a ton of ways to tutor for Spellbomb. I also play a lot of ways to use them multiple times, such as Capsize, Sanctum Gargoyle, and even the terrible "blow-up-your-own-Bojuka-Bog-into-Tilling-Treefolk" line of play.
Graveyard hate can be problematic, though. An opening-hand Leyline of the Void just grinds things to a halt and is one of the primary reasons I play Dispeller's Capsule. Planar Void isn't quite as bad because we can kill it with Child, but it's still a pain in the butt. A one-shot graveyard hoser like Tormod's Crypt can do surprisingly little with tight play, but the second one is often a slap in the face -- thankfully, that doesn't happen often, but there is still Capsize to pull you out of that hole.
Late game Timetwisters and Time Spirals suck the most because they tuck Child of Alara. Those bad boys are usually must-counters.
If your meta is brimming with graveyard hate, then this might not be a good deck choice. However, if it's just the obligatory Relic of Progenitus + maybe Bojuka Bog setup, you're good to go.
In other news:
I've got a small shipment of foils on the way. Pics are happening when they arrive. I'm excited, because when I get those, my deck will be >90% pimped. 83 foils, 5 altered art cards, and a few foreign/unfoilable cards to round it out. I've never owned a nice-looking deck in my life (lol), so I'm pretty stoked.
Draft my Mono-Blue Cube!
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