I've thought about it, but ultimately I think doubling my opponents mana aswell (there are 1-2 other deck with black on the table) makes it by far the worst of the manan doublers. With Extraplanar Lens I can at least keep things onesided by running snow lands.
Caged Sun tends to feel a bit expensive at times. There have been games, where tapping out for a 6 drop has been problematic.
I've thought about it, but ultimately I think doubling my opponents mana aswell (there are 1-2 other deck with black on the table) makes it by far the worst of the manan doublers. With Extraplanar Lens I can at least keep things onesided by running snow lands.
Caged Sun tends to feel a bit expensive at times. There have been games, where tapping out for a 6 drop has been problematic.
Fair enough. Personally it doesn't bother me too much.
I slightly rearranged some quoted paragraphs by topic. Also, I wrote most of this several hours ago before FearDReaper went into discard option, but I'm leaving that section anyway.
I'm unsure about the stax cards tbh, they feel like they do nothing else but slow the game down. I know that's what we want to accomplish, but I just wish there was another way to do this without playing some of those cards.
Silent Arbiter could be cute tho. Might have saved me last night, when I was run over by a horde of tokens from Beacon of Creation. Turns out that card is pretty decent when you have 30 lands on the table
Basically anything that would hinder opponent actions enough to slow the game is going to be a control element, and stax can be thought of as a passive form of control (as opposed to board wipes, for example). Your assessment that they do nothing but slow the game down is pretty accurate.
Silent Arbiter could also have simply eaten removal. Green decks are pretty good at artifact/enchantment removal, and Arbiter has a reputation for annoying people more than Crawlspace/No Mercy/Propaganda-style stuff would because it affects everybody rather than just making you slightly more trouble than somebody else. A bunch of tokens (as long as they're not pumped too high yet) is also a good time for Massacre Wurm.
I like the idea of more discard a lot. Why take my opponents resources from their deck, when I can take them from their hand.
Both are good, really. Using discard to the point of making your opponent's hands useless is going to draw a lot of hate your way because you're keeping them from playing the game, so what you use and how often is going to be pretty dependent on your group's reaction. If your actions don't get you farther ahead than the rest of the table ganging up on you, you'd just be shooting yourself in the foot by becoming Arch Enemy.
On that note, what do you guys think are the removal creatures that I should run anyway? Plaguecrafter is a given ofc, but do I want more of the same? Fleshbag Marauder and Merciless Executioner would be easy additions, but I'm not sure how many times I want that kind of effect.
One or two targeted removal is pretty good for my uses, but variety can be useful (targeted vs global). Faceless Butcher is a bit of a pet card for me due to my theme choices and because I can also play politics by saving somebody else's creature, too (or killing them indirectly with their own Zegana or Phage). Chupacabra is pretty straightforward, as opposed to being dependent on having a sac outlet for turning Faceless into permanent removal.
A lot of decks run multiple Fleshbag-style creatures to make sure they either see at least one just from drawing or to cast those at the appropriate time. It's probably pretty uncommon to activate Chainer to reanimate one of those unless what's guaranteed going to die as a result is really important enough to be dead. Sometimes they can't guarantee that kind of death so targeted stuff removes the opponent's choice, but on the other hand giving the opponents a choice could be used in negotiations, though (e.g. if they sac something you want them to sac instead of provoking a board wipe). I have some questions about your group's psychology below.
No, I haven't tried Painful Quandary. At 5 mana it always felt a it expensive to me. Maybe I'm wrong on that.
Since I'm trying to add more discard to the deck anyways, what are some other pieces of discard you'd suggest?
Oppression is cheaper mana-wise, is symmetrical, and lacks the 5-life "opt-out" on the discard. Could draw less ire if it's their choice what they discard (versus cards where you choose what they discard) and you're under the same effect. But if there's a lot of graveyard removal then having to discard yourself could just mean losing those cards.
For other discard pieces, there's sac outlets in the form of Sadistic Hypnotist and Mind Slash, there's hand-wreckers like Mind Shatter and Mind Sludge, there's upkeep-based ones like Bottomless Pit and Necrogen Mists, and there's enters/dies stuff on creatures like Liliana's Specter, Entomber Exarch, and Vindictive Lich. There's quite a lot of choices out there, but I can't predict what will work best for you and in what proportion — but I can say that you'll be picking based on the scope of the effect (random vs opponent's choice vs your choice; everybody vs just opponents vs target opponent; etc.).
Attrition seems like it could be great if I do end up taking the deck in a slower direction.
The thing with the removal creatures in my meta is that I'm unsure wether I have enough time/life to actually recur a whole bunch of those and still have enough time/life left to then go on to win the game.
Maybe replacing some of my removal with instants would help me put less of a toll on my life total. The creatures do seem a lot better tho, since they're reusable.
I have my doubts that you'd need to use them that many times (and part of why I like Noxious Gearhulk because it alleviates the life cost and I can point it at my own creatures). What things are you typically pointing your removal at during games?
Also there has been quite a bit of graveyard hate recently. No Rest in Peace or anything like it, but Scavenger Grounds tends to find its way onto the board most games...
[...]
Something I've noticed is that no matter what you reanimate you draw tons of hate. Last night I reanimated a Meteor Golem a couple of times. I got rid of some stuff, but ultimately it left me low on life and vulnerable. I kinda feel like I would've done better that game if I just tried to get bigger threats and not care as much about reanimating removal.
Kindof depends on what you removed. If what you removed would have shortened the game or shortened your time in the game then it was probably a good call. Ultimately the goal of any changes you do to adapt this deck to your meta is in the interest of surviving long enough to win a fair share of the games. If any change to the list changes your threat profile with them enough that they go after you more aggressively than before, then it's not a beneficial change. Even if it increases your chances of winning by a greater margin than it increases the aggression toward you, then it's possibly just making it more of a glass cannon.
I do feel like some talking about your playgroup could take place, though. Some of your adaptations in the deck will depend on them.
Approximately what percent of games do you win, as a player? What percentage of games where you're piloting Chainer are you the victor?
Is yours the only reanimation deck and they're focusing you because they don't like that style?
Or are there other reanimation decks, but they don't steal from opponents? Are other kinds of theft that are targeted just as much as Chainer is?
Or are they instead just protective of their graveyards and don't like other people using their cards? In that case might they also be quite put off by anybody else messing with their hands?
Yeah, that would've been a nice time to Massacre Wurm, would've killed the Azusa player in fact. UNfortunatley he shuffeled my graveyard (with the Wurm in it) back into my deck with Primal Command the turn before.
I feel like I'm drawing hate anyway, so I might aswell go for the discard, which in theory should be far more disruptive.
The thing is, my meta is actually pretty light on removal overall. Sometimes it feels like people just leave game ending threats alone and it's up to me to deal with them or the game would end very quickly.
The things that need to be removed are oftentimes things mono black struggles with. For exampke last game I destroyed a loaded up Isochron Scepter, a Recycle and something else, that I don't remember right now.
In general things that have to be dealt with are all the green mana doublers from Azusa, Lost but Seeking, Azusa loaded up with a Blackblade Reforged, which tends to end a lot of games with Rogue's Passage, huge token boardstates from Azusa via Avenger of Zendikar or the likes. Recently I've been thinking of just letting him ramp and simply deal with his card advantage engines, if he runs out of cards, it shouldn't really matter how much mana he has, right? Oona, Queen of the Fae has to be removed of course, especially since I'm the guys preferred first target. I'm mono colored and don't play 50 lands after all.
There's a Teysa Karlov deck, which I don't think is all that dangerous compared to the rest, but Grave Pact and Dictate of Erebos have been problematic before. The same guy also has an Estrid, the Masked deck. I don't think that one has ever won a game though.
The Azusa player also has a Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper deck, that's basically boardwipe tribal. He doesn't like playing it much, so it rarely shows up.
Things that might be coming to the playgroup soon are a Krenko, Mob Boss deck by the Oona player and a Zur the Enchanter deck from the Azusa player which will apparently be based around Persistent Petitioners.
I actually win my fair share of games. Probably not quite 25%, but I'd say close to 20% for sure. The guy who wins most is the Azusa, Lost but Seeking player. We actually talked about that on Saturday. Our estimate was that he wins roughly a third of our games. So it's not that bad.
I play the only reanimation deck. There are other decks with graveyard synergies of course, but no real reanimation. Azusa has Crucible of Worlds and Life from the Loam of course, plus some of the typical green recursion like Eternal Witness and such. The Teysa deck doesn't really reanimate much at all. It has some graveyard synergies too though.
As far as I can tell they don't mind my strategy. The grave hate comes mostly from the Azusa player, and it's mostly in the form of recurring Scavenger Grounds and Primal Command. I think the Oona decka plays Grounds too, Teysa has a Bojuka Bog every now and again.
Theft effects are actually really uncommon in this playgroup.
They're not really protective of their graveyards tbh, they just see me reanimating something slightly bigger early and see my life drop fast, which I guess makes me a juicy target. There are also not that many useful things to get from them tbh. The Teysa deck mostly plays irrelevant little critters that I wouldn't want anyway. The Oona deck plays very few creatures, it's almost entirely combo based. Basically my only targets come from the Azusa player
Overall I think our games thend to end rather quickly, because like I said everyone is a bit light on removal and the Azusa deck will usually get to a game ending boardstate very quickly.
I guess things could be described like this if I simplify everything down to the elemental level. If the other 3 don't focus on the Azusa player and slow him down early, he wins. If we do, the next thing that will happen is that the Oona player will attempt to mill-combo us out. If we deal with that, I'm very likely to win, if we don't, he wins.
Unfortunately the Teysa/Estrid player tends to lose most of the time.
I like this thread. All this recent discussion regarding what a MBC deck looks like in 2019 has invigorated me.
Attacking the Azusa player's card advantage is absolutely the correct play. You can't control their topdecks and they're going to find a way to ramp regardless, but well timed removal in response to Rishkar's Expertise or Shamanic Revelation or whatever will slow them down, which works in your favor. Alternatively - get this - you could play Ankh of Mishra to make vomiting out lands painful and thus the player becomes more susceptible to your drains.
You should play Mind Twist. It's a hoot. There is nothing more satisfying that Twisting the blue mage for their hand after they tap out. Mindslicer is fantastic, of course, but sometimes you need surgical precision.
I like this thread. All this recent discussion regarding what a MBC deck looks like in 2019 has invigorated me.
Attacking the Azusa player's card advantage is absolutely the correct play. You can't control their topdecks and they're going to find a way to ramp regardless, but well timed removal in response to Rishkar's Expertise or Shamanic Revelation or whatever will slow them down, which works in your favor. Alternatively - get this - you could play Ankh of Mishra to make vomiting out lands painful and thus the player becomes more susceptible to your drains.
You should play Mind Twist. It's a hoot. There is nothing more satisfying that Twisting the blue mage for their hand after they tap out. Mindslicer is fantastic, of course, but sometimes you need surgical precision.
I think I will try Mind Twist. Originally I thought it would make the targeted player hate me out of the game, but he just had to discard most of his hand (if not the whole thing), so he might not even be a threat anymore.
I like this thread. All this recent discussion regarding what a MBC deck looks like in 2019 has invigorated me.
... Mindslicer is fantastic, of course, but sometimes you need surgical precision.
Yeah, it's nice to have a reboot of a classic favorite.
Mindslicer is nuts with all the sac outlets you probably already have.
If Azusa is going to keep recurring Scavenger Grounds and Primal Command then having a bit of your own graveyard removal could be handy, even if it's "target card" stuff like Withered Wretch or Crook of Condemnation — the latter also having an "all graveyards" out and not getting sacrificed to Teysa's pacts.
I play the only reanimation deck. There are other decks with graveyard synergies of course, but no real reanimation.
Cool, I was definitely most curious about other decks that could use opponents graveyards. For example, it's one thing to have a Meren deck at the table who is just fiddling with their own graveyard, but Chainer just looks at it like a buffet and can respond to her trigger.
Chainer (as well as pacts/edicts) definitely loses some advantage with creature-light decks around, so I can see why you said you might focus on using your own graveyard.
If Azusa is going to keep recurring Scavenger Grounds and Primal Command then having a bit of your own graveyard removal could be handy, even if it's "target card" stuff like Withered Wretch or Crook of Condemnation — the latter also having an "all graveyards" out and not getting sacrificed to Teysa's pacts.
I play the only reanimation deck. There are other decks with graveyard synergies of course, but no real reanimation.
Cool, I was definitely most curious about other decks that could use opponents graveyards. For example, it's one thing to have a Meren deck at the table who is just fiddling with their own graveyard, but Chainer just looks at it like a buffet and can respond to her trigger.
Chainer (as well as pacts/edicts) definitely loses some advantage with creature-light decks around, so I can see why you said you might focus on using your own graveyard.
Yeah, a little bit of grave-hate on my part might be worth a consideration. I run Bojuka Bog, but that is just a one time thing.
On another note, I'm seriously considering to re-add Razaketh, the Foulblooded to the deck. I initially cut him in an attempt to lower my curve, but I think that might have been a mistake.
I would combine him with some other pieces, where he can establish a win condition with as few resources as possible. Some sort of Gravecrawler + Phyrexian Altar loop mst likely.
I feel like this would give me a reanimation target that servesas a wincon and can assemble it's own combo. Also if I can't assembe a loop for some reason he'll still be a sac outlet and a tutor, which is what makes Dimir House Guard so great in the deck. The only difference is that Razaketh is repeatable and has a sizable body.
Razaketh, the Foulblooded is a very strong card. Though I'm probably going to cut it because I've gotten kinda bored of it being pretty much a no brainer wincon. If you can get him into play with Chainer and a bit of mana open, it's likely game unless your opponents can interact.
As for grave hate, yeah, I wouldn't really rely on Bojuka Bog to stop real graveyard shenanigans thanks to it being a one shot sorcery speed effect. Having a creature that you can abuse with Chainer is much more reliable - Agent of Erebos, Crypt Creeper, Withered Wretch etc.
Razaketh, the Foulblooded is a very strong card. Though I'm probably going to cut it because I've gotten kinda bored of it being pretty much a no brainer wincon. If you can get him into play with Chainer and a bit of mana open, it's likely game unless your opponents can interact.
As for grave hate, yeah, I wouldn't really rely on Bojuka Bog to stop real graveyard shenanigans thanks to it being a one shot sorcery speed effect. Having a creature that you can abuse with Chainer is much more reliable - Agent of Erebos, Crypt Creeper, Withered Wretch etc.
You're not wrong there, but I feel like it would give me an opportunity to sneak in some fast wins without having to survive 2 other players attempt to win first.
If it turns out to be too powerful I can always still use him to value tutor or something.
I'll definitly consider adding another piece of grave hate. The ones you suggested seem nice. I also think I own a Withered Wretch, so it'll be easy to try.
I want a Chainer Reprint!!! I wonder what the chances of seeing it in Modern Horizons are
At least he's not all that expensive right now. I picked up my copy in nm for a bit under 2€.
Btw guys, on the note of Razaketh, the Foulblooded, which Rituals aside from the obvious Dark Ritual do you think will yield the most mana on average?
Cabal Ritual is always a bit worse than the OG one. However getting to Threshold should be pretty easy in this deck.
Culling the Weak seems pretty good, but it does take up a creature that could aswell be sacreficed to Raza. Assuming a Gravecrawler loop, this is almost as good as a Dark Ritual, giving BBBB but taking away B to bring the Gravecrawler back again.
Songs of the Damned has a super high ceiling, but it could also be terrible if the graveyard is not all that filled up. Has anone here played with this before? How much mana did it give on average?
Rain of Filth This one seems crazy powerful aswell. However, this is likely dead until the turn you actually try to win. It will also criple us if the combo we're going for is disrupted.
Lake of the Dead is also an option I guess. It has the advantage of being usefull at other stages of the game aswell. However it kinda seems like this is significantly worse than a basic Swamp if we're not planning to go off relatively soon, as it does put us a land behind.
Lion's Eye Diamond should be mentioned too I guess, Would be pretty sweet here, but I don't think I can afford one of these
Btw guys, on the note of Razaketh, the Foulblooded, which Rituals aside from the obvious Dark Ritual do you think will yield the most mana on average?
Cabal Ritual is always a bit worse than the OG one. However getting to Threshold should be pretty easy in this deck.
Culling the Weak seems pretty good, but it does take up a creature that could aswell be sacreficed to Raza. Assuming a Gravecrawler loop, this is almost as good as a Dark Ritual, giving BBBB but taking away B to bring the Gravecrawler back again.
Songs of the Damned has a super high ceiling, but it could also be terrible if the graveyard is not all that filled up. Has anone here played with this before? How much mana did it give on average?
Rain of Filth This one seems crazy powerful aswell. However, this is likely dead until the turn you actually try to win. It will also criple us if the combo we're going for is disrupted.
Lake of the Dead is also an option I guess. It has the advantage of being usefull at other stages of the game aswell. However it kinda seems like this is significantly worse than a basic Swamp if we're not planning to go off relatively soon, as it does put us a land behind.
Lion's Eye Diamond should be mentioned too I guess, Would be pretty sweet here, but I don't think I can afford one of these
Culling the Weak + Gravecrawler + a zombie to enable GC is 3 objects to do Dark Ritual. And you can only sacrifice once anyway (see Oracle text of Culling).
Lake of the Dead is "cute", but I don't think it works for a longer game where you're trying to impose attrition on your opponents.
You already could figure out how much to expect from Songs of the Damned by how big your graveyard is allowed to get before somebody exiles it. If you can get Threshold without drawing graveyard hate, would you be able to get 2-4 B from Songs?
Bog Witch would be okay if she lives. There's also Soldevi Adnate but it also has to live to tap plus have a subject with a decent CMC (or haste). Sacrifice is the one-shot Instant version Soldevi Adnate (Burnt Offering unfortunately can't be used if you go by the Oracle text because of the R in the text).
Tokens + Phyrexian Altar/Ashnod's Altar/sac+Pitiless Plunderer are good — I use two of these with Pawn of Ulamog and Sifter of Skulls in mine. Sacrificing creatures to Phyrexian Altar and then using some of the mana to Living Death and repeat that if possible can make a lot of mana (especially with XHD bringing back LD, though there are other ways). As you can see (especially if you've seen my list), I favor a more combo-engine approach.
Btw guys, on the note of Razaketh, the Foulblooded, which Rituals aside from the obvious Dark Ritual do you think will yield the most mana on average?
Cabal Ritual is always a bit worse than the OG one. However getting to Threshold should be pretty easy in this deck.
Culling the Weak seems pretty good, but it does take up a creature that could aswell be sacreficed to Raza. Assuming a Gravecrawler loop, this is almost as good as a Dark Ritual, giving BBBB but taking away B to bring the Gravecrawler back again.
Songs of the Damned has a super high ceiling, but it could also be terrible if the graveyard is not all that filled up. Has anone here played with this before? How much mana did it give on average?
Rain of Filth This one seems crazy powerful aswell. However, this is likely dead until the turn you actually try to win. It will also criple us if the combo we're going for is disrupted.
Lake of the Dead is also an option I guess. It has the advantage of being usefull at other stages of the game aswell. However it kinda seems like this is significantly worse than a basic Swamp if we're not planning to go off relatively soon, as it does put us a land behind.
Lion's Eye Diamond should be mentioned too I guess, Would be pretty sweet here, but I don't think I can afford one of these
Culling the Weak + Gravecrawler + a zombie to enable GC is 3 objects to do Dark Ritual. And you can only sacrifice once anyway (see Oracle text of Culling).
Lake of the Dead is "cute", but I don't think it works for a longer game where you're trying to impose attrition on your opponents.
You already could figure out how much to expect from Songs of the Damned by how big your graveyard is allowed to get before somebody exiles it. If you can get Threshold without drawing graveyard hate, would you be able to get 2-4 B from Songs?
Bog Witch would be okay if she lives. There's also Soldevi Adnate but it also has to live to tap plus have a subject with a decent CMC (or haste). Sacrifice is the one-shot Instant version Soldevi Adnate (Burnt Offering unfortunately can't be used if you go by the Oracle text because of the R in the text).
Tokens + Phyrexian Altar/Ashnod's Altar/sac+Pitiless Plunderer are good — I use two of these with Pawn of Ulamog and Sifter of Skulls in mine. Sacrificing creatures to Phyrexian Altar and then using some of the mana to Living Death and repeat that if possible can make a lot of mana (especially with XHD bringing back LD, though there are other ways). As you can see (especially if you've seen my list), I favor a more combo-engine approach.
The more combo centirc approach might actually be the way to go. If we do the math, we get 13 reanimations with Chainer from 40 life, which would leave us at 1. Ofc that's not a realistic scenario, since we'll cast a Night's Whisper or a Necropotence here and there, which will reduce the ammount.
It's also almost certain that we'll take at least some ammount of cmobat damage. Not even taking into account out more life taxing cards like Reanimate, I think it's safe to say we won't get more than 6-7 reanimations (assuming no life-gain shenannigans) at best per game. That might not be enough to just win through general value alone.
I think the next iteration of my deck will try to change up the wincons to be a bit more combo centric and try to fit some cards that slow everything down, like Oppression and perhaps Silent Arbiter.
Alright, here's the updated list. I did a little bit of online testing and it turns out that re-adding Razaketh, the Foulblooded gave the deck a much needed way to close out a game quickly (usually with a Gravecrawler loop).
I cut Cabal Stronghold. It felt like I never activated ti, even if I had a few Swamps out, mostly, because once you have a mana doubler for your Swamps this becomes a lot worse.
Carrion Feeder replaces Viscera Seer. This is a zombie, which is the only reason why I made this change. I don't think both of their abilities are all that relevant, but a sac outlet on a creature is nice.
Oppression & Painful Quandary have been decent so far, not 100% sold on them yet (small sample size), but I think I like them.
Final Parting replaces Corpse Connoisseur. While this is a spell and replaces a zombie, I think it's super powerful for this deck. The ability to get any big creature we happen to need into the grave AND tutor up Reanimate is crazy good.
Stronghold has a low opportunity cost. Are there times it mattered that it wasn't a Swamp? I don't often activate it myself until the late game but since there's such a small risk associated with running it that I think it's fine.
Cutting Seer for Feeder is a mistake, in my opinion. Scry 1 is a much, much better ability than a measly +1/+1 counter. Being able to dig for answers or a win condition is great, especially with Overlord.
Stronghold has a low opportunity cost. Are there times it mattered that it wasn't a Swamp? I don't often activate it myself until the late game but since there's such a small risk associated with running it that I think it's fine.
Cutting Seer for Feeder is a mistake, in my opinion. Scry 1 is a much, much better ability than a measly +1/+1 counter. Being able to dig for answers or a win condition is great, especially with Overlord.
There were tons of times where it mattered that it didn't double up with one of the mana doublers.
I agree that Carrion Feeder is worse, but he's a 1 mana Zombie, I need a few of those if I want to win super easily with Razaketh, the Foulblooded and Gravecrawler. I don't actually need to dig for a wincon if i get to reanimate Raza and have a body to tutor up Gravecrawler, which tutors up a 1 mana zombie. Then I get to replay the Crawler and can tutor for any combo I want. I just need mana to do it. Or not even that if I were to add things like Lake of the Dead and some more Rituals.
God-Eternal Bontu might have a use as a sac outlet and card draw. It can be dumped and revived by Chainer. Then if exiled by Chainer's effect, it will just go back to the top of your deck. This can work as an emergency with Chainer in response to some kinds of removal to sac whatever you're going to lose and draw off of them.
Since it can sac any other permanent excess lands or permanents you no longer need can be draw fodder later on.
God-Eternal Bontu might have a use as a sac outlet and card draw. It can be dumped and revived by Chainer. Then if exiled by Chainer's effect, it will just go back to the top of your deck. This can work as an emergency with Chainer in response to some kinds of removal to sac whatever you're going to lose and draw off of them.
Since it can sac any other permanent excess lands or permanents you no longer need can be draw fodder later on.
I like the idea, but I'm afraid it wouldn't work out well in practice.
Let's compare it to another card that sacrifices and draws cards Disciple of Bolas. Disciple only needs to sac 1 creature, will ususally draw a lot more cards and tends to be life cost neutral at least.
God-Eternal Bontu on the other hand needs more than 1 sacrifice to be good enough. This also means it's less loopable, since it'll take up so many more resources than Disciple. It has a higher cmc and it's body is not good enough to justify the drop-off in draw power. Additionally, I don't think there is such a thing as excess lands in this deck. I've never played a more mana hungy deck ever before.
So the only thing that's really good about it is it's way to avoid exile. That would be really awesome, but I'm afraid the card just isn't good powerful enough for this to tip the scales in its favor.
On the note of this deck being extra mana hungry, I'm currently on the lookout for fitting ramp pieces. I guess the important number we'd want to hit is 8, since that allows us to cast Chainer, Dementia Master and reanimate something the same turn.
If anyone has some suggestions, I'd love to hear about them!
Other stuff: Sculpting Steel can copy a rock. Some decks also run Burnished Hart. Jet Medallion is usually used in storm decks that are casting a lot, which isn't usually Chainer's way.
Other stuff: Sculpting Steel can copy a rock. Some decks also run Burnished Hart. Jet Medallion is usually used in storm decks that are casting a lot, which isn't usually Chainer's way.
Most of these I've already considered. I like Fellwar Stone a ton in general, but I'm not sure if mana rocks that add 1 manan are enough for this deck, they feel like a little raindroplet on the hot stone that is Chainer's thrist for BBB.
Coalition Relic is cool too, I ran that before I added Extraplanar Lens to the deck. In particular I like how you can use it to get to Chianer with only 3 lands in play. However, I've since learned that casting Chainer without mana up to reanimate the same turn cycle is usually a bad idea.
The tapped rocks have always felt weird to me. I never tried them, so I might be wrong on this, but they do seem kinda bad. Also again, just 1 mana might not be enough.
Thran Dynamo and Worn Powerstone I think produce way too much colorless mana. The deck is so B hungry, I sometimes find it diffucult to use even my Sol Ring mana effectively.
I like the flexibility on Everflowing Chalice, but again I woory that it might not help much since it only produces colorless mana.
EDIT: Also I used to like Burnished Hart, until people started to kill that thing way to often before I could crack it. It's actually terrible to play a 3 mana 2/2 that does nothing
Most of these I've already considered. I like Fellwar Stone a ton in general, but I'm not sure if mana rocks that add 1 manan are enough for this deck, they feel like a little raindroplet on the hot stone that is Chainer's thrist for BBB.
...
The tapped rocks have always felt weird to me. I never tried them, so I might be wrong on this, but they do seem kinda bad. Also again, just 1 mana might not be enough.
They add up, and it's stable-enough ramp (assuming mass artifact destruction isn't frequent) that they're good to throw down early or whenever you have an extra 2. Also, having a bit of colorless mana sources and small B rocks can take pressure off of your swamps so you can save those for activating Chainer (especially when you have any swamp boosters in play) and have that extra mana available from the rocks for casting an answer or a ritual.
EDIT: Also I used to like Burnished Hart, until people started to kill that thing way to often before I could crack it. It's actually terrible to play a 3 mana 2/2 that does nothing
Yeah, that one can be power-level/meta dependent. Works okay in my meta since it's not cutthroat speed and it's rarely, rarely been killed before I could activate it.
Alright, so last night's games were pretty frustrating...
The Oona player upgraded his deck and combo'd out with infinite manan 4/6 games. I managed to stop him in one with Phyrexian Revoker and ended up winning that one. I might need some more anti combo techs....
On the other hand, Painful Quandary did pretty well everytime I drew it. Oppression on the other hand likes to hide at the bottom of my deck, so I can't talk about that one yet. I only drew t once and it got Windfalled away.
Caged Sun tends to feel a bit expensive at times. There have been games, where tapping out for a 6 drop has been problematic.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Basically anything that would hinder opponent actions enough to slow the game is going to be a control element, and stax can be thought of as a passive form of control (as opposed to board wipes, for example). Your assessment that they do nothing but slow the game down is pretty accurate.
Silent Arbiter could also have simply eaten removal. Green decks are pretty good at artifact/enchantment removal, and Arbiter has a reputation for annoying people more than Crawlspace/No Mercy/Propaganda-style stuff would because it affects everybody rather than just making you slightly more trouble than somebody else. A bunch of tokens (as long as they're not pumped too high yet) is also a good time for Massacre Wurm.
Both are good, really. Using discard to the point of making your opponent's hands useless is going to draw a lot of hate your way because you're keeping them from playing the game, so what you use and how often is going to be pretty dependent on your group's reaction. If your actions don't get you farther ahead than the rest of the table ganging up on you, you'd just be shooting yourself in the foot by becoming Arch Enemy.
One or two targeted removal is pretty good for my uses, but variety can be useful (targeted vs global). Faceless Butcher is a bit of a pet card for me due to my theme choices and because I can also play politics by saving somebody else's creature, too (or killing them indirectly with their own Zegana or Phage). Chupacabra is pretty straightforward, as opposed to being dependent on having a sac outlet for turning Faceless into permanent removal.
A lot of decks run multiple Fleshbag-style creatures to make sure they either see at least one just from drawing or to cast those at the appropriate time. It's probably pretty uncommon to activate Chainer to reanimate one of those unless what's guaranteed going to die as a result is really important enough to be dead. Sometimes they can't guarantee that kind of death so targeted stuff removes the opponent's choice, but on the other hand giving the opponents a choice could be used in negotiations, though (e.g. if they sac something you want them to sac instead of provoking a board wipe). I have some questions about your group's psychology below.
Oppression is cheaper mana-wise, is symmetrical, and lacks the 5-life "opt-out" on the discard. Could draw less ire if it's their choice what they discard (versus cards where you choose what they discard) and you're under the same effect. But if there's a lot of graveyard removal then having to discard yourself could just mean losing those cards.
For other discard pieces, there's sac outlets in the form of Sadistic Hypnotist and Mind Slash, there's hand-wreckers like Mind Shatter and Mind Sludge, there's upkeep-based ones like Bottomless Pit and Necrogen Mists, and there's enters/dies stuff on creatures like Liliana's Specter, Entomber Exarch, and Vindictive Lich. There's quite a lot of choices out there, but I can't predict what will work best for you and in what proportion — but I can say that you'll be picking based on the scope of the effect (random vs opponent's choice vs your choice; everybody vs just opponents vs target opponent; etc.).
I have my doubts that you'd need to use them that many times (and part of why I like Noxious Gearhulk because it alleviates the life cost and I can point it at my own creatures). What things are you typically pointing your removal at during games?
Kindof depends on what you removed. If what you removed would have shortened the game or shortened your time in the game then it was probably a good call. Ultimately the goal of any changes you do to adapt this deck to your meta is in the interest of surviving long enough to win a fair share of the games. If any change to the list changes your threat profile with them enough that they go after you more aggressively than before, then it's not a beneficial change. Even if it increases your chances of winning by a greater margin than it increases the aggression toward you, then it's possibly just making it more of a glass cannon.
I do feel like some talking about your playgroup could take place, though. Some of your adaptations in the deck will depend on them.
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R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
I feel like I'm drawing hate anyway, so I might aswell go for the discard, which in theory should be far more disruptive.
The thing is, my meta is actually pretty light on removal overall. Sometimes it feels like people just leave game ending threats alone and it's up to me to deal with them or the game would end very quickly.
The things that need to be removed are oftentimes things mono black struggles with. For exampke last game I destroyed a loaded up Isochron Scepter, a Recycle and something else, that I don't remember right now.
In general things that have to be dealt with are all the green mana doublers from Azusa, Lost but Seeking, Azusa loaded up with a Blackblade Reforged, which tends to end a lot of games with Rogue's Passage, huge token boardstates from Azusa via Avenger of Zendikar or the likes. Recently I've been thinking of just letting him ramp and simply deal with his card advantage engines, if he runs out of cards, it shouldn't really matter how much mana he has, right?
Oona, Queen of the Fae has to be removed of course, especially since I'm the guys preferred first target. I'm mono colored and don't play 50 lands after all.
There's a Teysa Karlov deck, which I don't think is all that dangerous compared to the rest, but Grave Pact and Dictate of Erebos have been problematic before. The same guy also has an Estrid, the Masked deck. I don't think that one has ever won a game though.
The Azusa player also has a Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper deck, that's basically boardwipe tribal. He doesn't like playing it much, so it rarely shows up.
Things that might be coming to the playgroup soon are a Krenko, Mob Boss deck by the Oona player and a Zur the Enchanter deck from the Azusa player which will apparently be based around Persistent Petitioners.
I actually win my fair share of games. Probably not quite 25%, but I'd say close to 20% for sure. The guy who wins most is the Azusa, Lost but Seeking player. We actually talked about that on Saturday. Our estimate was that he wins roughly a third of our games. So it's not that bad.
I play the only reanimation deck. There are other decks with graveyard synergies of course, but no real reanimation. Azusa has Crucible of Worlds and Life from the Loam of course, plus some of the typical green recursion like Eternal Witness and such. The Teysa deck doesn't really reanimate much at all. It has some graveyard synergies too though.
As far as I can tell they don't mind my strategy. The grave hate comes mostly from the Azusa player, and it's mostly in the form of recurring Scavenger Grounds and Primal Command. I think the Oona decka plays Grounds too, Teysa has a Bojuka Bog every now and again.
Theft effects are actually really uncommon in this playgroup.
They're not really protective of their graveyards tbh, they just see me reanimating something slightly bigger early and see my life drop fast, which I guess makes me a juicy target. There are also not that many useful things to get from them tbh. The Teysa deck mostly plays irrelevant little critters that I wouldn't want anyway. The Oona deck plays very few creatures, it's almost entirely combo based. Basically my only targets come from the Azusa player
Overall I think our games thend to end rather quickly, because like I said everyone is a bit light on removal and the Azusa deck will usually get to a game ending boardstate very quickly.
I guess things could be described like this if I simplify everything down to the elemental level. If the other 3 don't focus on the Azusa player and slow him down early, he wins. If we do, the next thing that will happen is that the Oona player will attempt to mill-combo us out. If we deal with that, I'm very likely to win, if we don't, he wins.
Unfortunately the Teysa/Estrid player tends to lose most of the time.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
Attacking the Azusa player's card advantage is absolutely the correct play. You can't control their topdecks and they're going to find a way to ramp regardless, but well timed removal in response to Rishkar's Expertise or Shamanic Revelation or whatever will slow them down, which works in your favor. Alternatively - get this - you could play Ankh of Mishra to make vomiting out lands painful and thus the player becomes more susceptible to your drains.
You should play Mind Twist. It's a hoot. There is nothing more satisfying that Twisting the blue mage for their hand after they tap out. Mindslicer is fantastic, of course, but sometimes you need surgical precision.
[Primer] Erebos, God of the Dead
HONK HONK
I think I will try Mind Twist. Originally I thought it would make the targeted player hate me out of the game, but he just had to discard most of his hand (if not the whole thing), so he might not even be a threat anymore.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
Yeah, it's nice to have a reboot of a classic favorite.
Mindslicer is nuts with all the sac outlets you probably already have.
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
If Azusa is going to keep recurring Scavenger Grounds and Primal Command then having a bit of your own graveyard removal could be handy, even if it's "target card" stuff like Withered Wretch or Crook of Condemnation — the latter also having an "all graveyards" out and not getting sacrificed to Teysa's pacts.
Cool, I was definitely most curious about other decks that could use opponents graveyards. For example, it's one thing to have a Meren deck at the table who is just fiddling with their own graveyard, but Chainer just looks at it like a buffet and can respond to her trigger.
Chainer (as well as pacts/edicts) definitely loses some advantage with creature-light decks around, so I can see why you said you might focus on using your own graveyard.
old thread
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R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
Yeah, a little bit of grave-hate on my part might be worth a consideration. I run Bojuka Bog, but that is just a one time thing.
On another note, I'm seriously considering to re-add Razaketh, the Foulblooded to the deck. I initially cut him in an attempt to lower my curve, but I think that might have been a mistake.
I would combine him with some other pieces, where he can establish a win condition with as few resources as possible. Some sort of Gravecrawler + Phyrexian Altar loop mst likely.
I feel like this would give me a reanimation target that servesas a wincon and can assemble it's own combo. Also if I can't assembe a loop for some reason he'll still be a sac outlet and a tutor, which is what makes Dimir House Guard so great in the deck. The only difference is that Razaketh is repeatable and has a sizable body.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
As for grave hate, yeah, I wouldn't really rely on Bojuka Bog to stop real graveyard shenanigans thanks to it being a one shot sorcery speed effect. Having a creature that you can abuse with Chainer is much more reliable - Agent of Erebos, Crypt Creeper, Withered Wretch etc.
You're not wrong there, but I feel like it would give me an opportunity to sneak in some fast wins without having to survive 2 other players attempt to win first.
If it turns out to be too powerful I can always still use him to value tutor or something.
I'll definitly consider adding another piece of grave hate. The ones you suggested seem nice. I also think I own a Withered Wretch, so it'll be easy to try.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
At least he's not all that expensive right now. I picked up my copy in nm for a bit under 2€.
Btw guys, on the note of Razaketh, the Foulblooded, which Rituals aside from the obvious Dark Ritual do you think will yield the most mana on average?
Cabal Ritual is always a bit worse than the OG one. However getting to Threshold should be pretty easy in this deck.
Culling the Weak seems pretty good, but it does take up a creature that could aswell be sacreficed to Raza. Assuming a Gravecrawler loop, this is almost as good as a Dark Ritual, giving BBBB but taking away B to bring the Gravecrawler back again.
Songs of the Damned has a super high ceiling, but it could also be terrible if the graveyard is not all that filled up. Has anone here played with this before? How much mana did it give on average?
Rain of Filth This one seems crazy powerful aswell. However, this is likely dead until the turn you actually try to win. It will also criple us if the combo we're going for is disrupted.
Lake of the Dead is also an option I guess. It has the advantage of being usefull at other stages of the game aswell. However it kinda seems like this is significantly worse than a basic Swamp if we're not planning to go off relatively soon, as it does put us a land behind.
Lion's Eye Diamond should be mentioned too I guess, Would be pretty sweet here, but I don't think I can afford one of these
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
Tokens + Phyrexian Altar/Ashnod's Altar/sac+Pitiless Plunderer are good — I use two of these with Pawn of Ulamog and Sifter of Skulls in mine. Sacrificing creatures to Phyrexian Altar and then using some of the mana to Living Death and repeat that if possible can make a lot of mana (especially with XHD bringing back LD, though there are other ways). As you can see (especially if you've seen my list), I favor a more combo-engine approach.
old thread
old thread
old thread
R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
The more combo centirc approach might actually be the way to go. If we do the math, we get 13 reanimations with Chainer from 40 life, which would leave us at 1. Ofc that's not a realistic scenario, since we'll cast a Night's Whisper or a Necropotence here and there, which will reduce the ammount.
It's also almost certain that we'll take at least some ammount of cmobat damage. Not even taking into account out more life taxing cards like Reanimate, I think it's safe to say we won't get more than 6-7 reanimations (assuming no life-gain shenannigans) at best per game. That might not be enough to just win through general value alone.
I think the next iteration of my deck will try to change up the wincons to be a bit more combo centric and try to fit some cards that slow everything down, like Oppression and perhaps Silent Arbiter.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
1x Chainer, Dementia Master
Card Draw (7):
1x Skullclamp
1x Night's Whisper
1x Sign in Blood
1x Read the Bones
1x Phyrexian Arena
1x Necropotence
1x Disciple of Bolas
Tutors (6):
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Beseech the Queen
1x Dimir House Guard
1x Sidisi, Undead Vizier
1x Final Parting
1x Razaketh, the Foulblooded
Ramp (12):
1x Sol Ring
1x Expedition Map
1x Wayfarer's Bauble
1x Dark Ritual
1x Soldevi Adnate
1x Extraplanar Lens
1x Bog Witch
1x Solemn Simulacrum
1x Crypt Ghast
1x Gilded Lotus
1x Caged Sun
1x Nirkana Revenant
1x Carrion Feeder
1x Spawning Pit
1x Altar of Dementia
1x Phyrexian Altar
1x Ashnod's Altar
Alternate Recursion (4):
1x Reanimate
1x Myr Retriever
1x Junk Diver
1x Yawgmoth's Will
Lifegain/Lifedrain (6):
1x Blood Artist
1x Zulaport Cutthroat
1x Exsanguinate
1x Sangromancer
1x Gray Merchant of Asphodel
1x Kokusho, the Evening Star
Grave Fuel (3):
1x Entomb
1x Stitcher's Supplier
1x Buried Alive
Removal and Permission (9):
1x Withering Boon
1x Phyrexian Revoker
1x Plaguecrafter
1x Oppression
1x Sudden Spoiling
1x Ravenous Chupacabra
1x Mindslicer
1x Painful Quandary
1x Meteor Golem
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Nevinyrral's Disk
1x Living Death
1x Massacre Wurm
Utility/Other (6)
1x Gravecrawler
1x Torment of Hailfire
1x Rings of Brighthearth
1x Pitiless Plunderer
1x Wurmcoil Engine
1x Abhorrent Overlord
Lands (37):
1x Cabal Coffers
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Thespian's Stage
1x Deserted Temple
1x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1x Phyrexian Tower
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Geier Reach Sanitarium
1x Buried Ruin
27x Snow-Covered Swamp
I cut Cabal Stronghold. It felt like I never activated ti, even if I had a few Swamps out, mostly, because once you have a mana doubler for your Swamps this becomes a lot worse.
Stitcher's Supplier is a cheap zombie for Gravecrawler and fills our graveyard. Should be a good fit.
Carrion Feeder replaces Viscera Seer. This is a zombie, which is the only reason why I made this change. I don't think both of their abilities are all that relevant, but a sac outlet on a creature is nice.
Oppression & Painful Quandary have been decent so far, not 100% sold on them yet (small sample size), but I think I like them.
Final Parting replaces Corpse Connoisseur. While this is a spell and replaces a zombie, I think it's super powerful for this deck. The ability to get any big creature we happen to need into the grave AND tutor up Reanimate is crazy good.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
Cutting Seer for Feeder is a mistake, in my opinion. Scry 1 is a much, much better ability than a measly +1/+1 counter. Being able to dig for answers or a win condition is great, especially with Overlord.
[Primer] Erebos, God of the Dead
HONK HONK
There were tons of times where it mattered that it didn't double up with one of the mana doublers.
I agree that Carrion Feeder is worse, but he's a 1 mana Zombie, I need a few of those if I want to win super easily with Razaketh, the Foulblooded and Gravecrawler. I don't actually need to dig for a wincon if i get to reanimate Raza and have a body to tutor up Gravecrawler, which tutors up a 1 mana zombie. Then I get to replay the Crawler and can tutor for any combo I want. I just need mana to do it. Or not even that if I were to add things like Lake of the Dead and some more Rituals.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
Since it can sac any other permanent excess lands or permanents you no longer need can be draw fodder later on.
I like the idea, but I'm afraid it wouldn't work out well in practice.
Let's compare it to another card that sacrifices and draws cards Disciple of Bolas. Disciple only needs to sac 1 creature, will ususally draw a lot more cards and tends to be life cost neutral at least.
God-Eternal Bontu on the other hand needs more than 1 sacrifice to be good enough. This also means it's less loopable, since it'll take up so many more resources than Disciple. It has a higher cmc and it's body is not good enough to justify the drop-off in draw power. Additionally, I don't think there is such a thing as excess lands in this deck. I've never played a more mana hungy deck ever before.
So the only thing that's really good about it is it's way to avoid exile. That would be really awesome, but I'm afraid the card just isn't good powerful enough for this to tip the scales in its favor.
On the note of this deck being extra mana hungry, I'm currently on the lookout for fitting ramp pieces. I guess the important number we'd want to hit is 8, since that allows us to cast Chainer, Dementia Master and reanimate something the same turn.
If anyone has some suggestions, I'd love to hear about them!
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
old thread
old thread
old thread
R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
Most of these I've already considered. I like Fellwar Stone a ton in general, but I'm not sure if mana rocks that add 1 manan are enough for this deck, they feel like a little raindroplet on the hot stone that is Chainer's thrist for BBB.
Coalition Relic is cool too, I ran that before I added Extraplanar Lens to the deck. In particular I like how you can use it to get to Chianer with only 3 lands in play. However, I've since learned that casting Chainer without mana up to reanimate the same turn cycle is usually a bad idea.
The tapped rocks have always felt weird to me. I never tried them, so I might be wrong on this, but they do seem kinda bad. Also again, just 1 mana might not be enough.
Thran Dynamo and Worn Powerstone I think produce way too much colorless mana. The deck is so B hungry, I sometimes find it diffucult to use even my Sol Ring mana effectively.
Thought Vessel and Mind Stone are not impactful enough imo. Also I never see myself cashing in a Mind Stone in this deck ever.
I like the flexibility on Everflowing Chalice, but again I woory that it might not help much since it only produces colorless mana.
EDIT: Also I used to like Burnished Hart, until people started to kill that thing way to often before I could crack it. It's actually terrible to play a 3 mana 2/2 that does nothing
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim
My ramp is:
Edit: Idk why it isn't but Darksteel Ingot should be in my list too. I put it and Commander's Sphere in all my decks. Good against removal.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Yeah, that one can be power-level/meta dependent. Works okay in my meta since it's not cutthroat speed and it's rarely, rarely been killed before I could activate it.
old thread
old thread
old thread
R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
The Oona player upgraded his deck and combo'd out with infinite manan 4/6 games. I managed to stop him in one with Phyrexian Revoker and ended up winning that one. I might need some more anti combo techs....
On the other hand, Painful Quandary did pretty well everytime I drew it. Oppression on the other hand likes to hide at the bottom of my deck, so I can't talk about that one yet. I only drew t once and it got Windfalled away.
BWB/W Tokens
Pauper:
RUGAffinity
EDH:
BWAyli, Eternal Pilgrim