So far I'd say that Displacer is quite strong in this deck and I'm not looking to cut it anytime soon. Outside of just winning on the spot with a combo, the incremental value can really matter especially in those grindy games after an armageddon and/or under a uba mask.
I think having Deathmantle and Displacer as cards that can instantly win the game with Ironworks/Clock/etc is enough combo. Just grinding the game down and then using a well-placed tutor should be okay. And we're running a LOT of the better tutors for these A + B combos anyway. Adding another A + B combo where at least one of the pieces (Salvagers) doesn't really interact well with your other combo cards... seems kinda iffy. LED is a sweet EDH card as we all know, but I think you can safely pass for now. If you find slots for them and the testing works out well, I'd love to hear about it of course.
If anything I'd like to push Battlesphere again as it has great synergy with alot of other cards in the deck, and combos hard with Clock or Ironworks, and goes infinite with Ironworks + Deathmantle. Seems redundant because those two cards are already a win with Breya but it's good to know. Also as I believe someone else mentioned earlier in this thread: Myr Battlesphere + Master Transmuter + Clock of Omens + Gilded Lotus = infinite colored mana and tokens.
I did some testing against my own decks with LED and Salvagers and I don't think I'll be adding them after all.
While they're powerful together it's fairly fragile when you have to discard your hand and someone can just kill the salvagers.
There is a ton of removal in my group (Not to mention 3 other Breya decks) so I don't think it would work as well. I'll keep it on the test list but not adding it for now.
I'm not really wanting to add battlesphere because if I'm cheating out big artifacts it's often either Mindslaver or Blightsteel (Who I may cut anyway)
He's fine with the combos but both of those just do the same and better with Breya so I don't quite see the appeal of him.
Plus seven mana is a ton.
Right now I do want to find something to replace Agent of Bolas and Voltaic key
I'm thinking Devastation/Cataclsym and Arcum Daggson/Lightning greaves.
I could also cut Blightsteel and throw in 3 of them anyway. We'll see soon
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Hmmmmm I still thinking that reliance on 1 win con is pretty bad, although mindslaving people to death is pretty fun but unless you can win right away then its fine.
Nice suggestion of Arcum Dagsson could replace Kuldotha Forgemaster as a faster and cheaper althou it can't find creatures which is meh since most of our win cons aren't creatures anyway.
I am thinking of replacing Voltaic Key with Chain of Vapor since either it bounces something that your opponent has or save your Nim Deathmantle from being exiled, this bring us to another weak point of the deck, we need another win con badly since we are not afraid of destruction effects but if deathmantle gets exiled, we are cutted off from our primary win con, without it its hard to win.
I am currently looking for alternate win cons such as Isochron Scepter + Dramatic Reversal + Mana rocks for Infinite to sac and recast Breya for infinite to machine gun down the whole board or the old Sharuum the Hegemon + Sculpting Steel + Bitter Ordeal to exile everyone's library. Both combo's has their strength and weakness.
I am looking at this combo line that makes the Isochron Scepter combo line pretty good, basically Isochron Scepter + any 1/2 cmc spell or Dramatic Reversal + Paradox Engine = Infinite Mana, recast breya and machine down the board.
The good line of this combo is that, none of the cards are useless outside the combo and either which will enable infinite mana.
Eg: Sceptor imprinting Demonic Tutor with engine in play, tap 4 land, float 2, cast tutor from scepter, untap all lands/stuff, float 4 (2 from previous), cast tutor again, repeat till infinite.
Eg: without engine in play, imprint tutor, with 7 sources of mana including 1 U, tutor for Dramatic Reversal,cast dramatic reversal, cast tutor from sceptor searching for engine, cast engine then cast tutor, untap all, go infinite.
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Standard : What is Stand-tart
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
Without Deathmantle we can still infinite with Displacer/Ironworks.
I don't like Specter that much since if it's destroyed we are often two for one'd and reversal doesn't really do much by itself.
It can be good but I think adding something like Mystical Teachings as a 2nd notion thief target plus answers/snapcaster would be better.
I also would like to try Wild Research in the future as well.
Of course I'm saying all this as my own meta choices since things like Salavgers and Spector would often be killed same turn. Not saying you shouldn't test them but I don't think they would work in my own group
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
That list looks so fun with Zur and Destructive force. Love the use of enchantments here.
Tainted pact without Lab man seems odd
I love World Queller but don't think he's quite good enough here.
I think you could make a lot of use of Wild Research in here
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
I did some testing against my own decks with LED and Salvagers and I don't think I'll be adding them after all.
While they're powerful together it's fairly fragile when you have to discard your hand and someone can just kill the salvagers.
There is a ton of removal in my group (Not to mention 3 other Breya decks) so I don't think it would work as well. I'll keep it on the test list but not adding it for now.
I'm not really wanting to add battlesphere because if I'm cheating out big artifacts it's often either Mindslaver or Blightsteel (Who I may cut anyway)
He's fine with the combos but both of those just do the same and better with Breya so I don't quite see the appeal of him.
Plus seven mana is a ton.
Right now I do want to find something to replace Agent of Bolas and Voltaic key
I'm thinking Devastation/Cataclsym and Arcum Daggson/Lightning greaves.
I could also cut Blightsteel and throw in 3 of them anyway. We'll see soon
Thanks for the reply Dies_to_Doom_Blade.
I understand that you may be cutting Blightsteel soon anyway, but his huge casting cast among other reasons is why I advocated cutting him for Battlesphere in a vacuum. While 7 mana may be a "ton" there are plenty of ways to ramp into him or cheat him into play, and in grindy games having all those chump blockers/Breya fodder/Clock or Ironworks food make him such a flexible card. I can understand being hesitant, and time may prove that it's not an optimal slot, but I'd still recommend giving the Battleball a shot. Basically it interacts well with so many other key cards and occasionally helps you hard combo.
Meanwhile Blightsteel has only two legitimate ways to cheat himself onto the battlefield: Master Transmuter and Kuldotha Forgemaster, two four-or-greater cmc creatures that require a tap. One could add Greaves but that just seems so clunky to me even though it does make Transmuter and Forgemaster better. As with many ideas concerning edh, I am biased towards my experiences with my playgroup, and I've never really liked Blightsteel in multiplayer. Sure sometimes you take out the main threat at the table and leave yourself with the players with the weaker board states, but so many times I've alpha striked one opponent only to see another combo off in my face. The games in which I manage to lock the opponents out of the game and then finish them off one-by-one with Blightsteel... those feel like games I'm going to win anyway. I know you're not fighting hard for Blightsteel's inclusion these days so I won't harp on it too much more, but as a closing thought I really hate how we can't do ANY graveyard tricks with the big fella, which makes Welder and friends very sad.
I can understand cutting Voltaic Key but for the time being I'm keeping it in as another low cmc artifact to put onto the table especially before wheels come online. I also cut Agent of Bolas and added Grim Monolith. The deck is obviously very colored mana hungry but I wanted to add more value to Key as well as get another three mana rock for Clock of Omens. There are still a few uses for extra colorless mana in this deck including Breya's ability and recasting her from the zone. Also Ironworks isn't the only way to go infinite with Displacer and Breya; having Vault/Monolith plus Clock does the trick as well.
Which brings me to a point I'd again like to make about win conditions and adding more to this shell. Your play experience with your group obviously affects this, but I just don't see the need to add more standalone win conditions, especially if they are a) clunky or b) don't synergize with your other combo/engine pieces. Not counting Forgemaster, my list (and yours, if memory serves me) has nine tutors that can search up a game-winning combo piece like Nim Deathmantle. Mystical Tutor also finds Demonic etc to stitch together the win. In a typical game after grinding the opponents down and gaining board presence and card advantage, the win seems to "fall into my lap" if that makes sense. I'll have one combo piece like an Ironworks which is already good by itself, and I'll untap one turn, draw a wheel or draw some cards off clamp, and boom, there's the Fabricate or DT. Good game.
If Deathmantle or Displacer gets exiled, I'm not really worried, because Mindslaver is one of the best ways to make one or more players scoop, especially if you get recursion going. I also got a scoop one game (deathmantle was exiled) having Smokestack on two, Uba Mask, and Daretti I.I.. And the number one reason I don't think we need to worry about adding more A + B instawin combos, is the commander herself. Breya is meant to go the distance, a 4/4 general body is not insignificant, sure it takes a few turns to get there on combat, but we're grinding and staxing, aren't we? I mean I guess if they exile our Deathmantle, Displacer, Welder, all our walkers, Mindslaver etc etc, then you can say "you got me."
And lastly before this becomes seriously TLDR, how are you liking Scrap Mastery Dies_to_Doom_Blade? I can see its "bomby" appeal but in my limited time with this deck it's been just an imprint for Chrome Mox, a total win more in another game, and in another I didn't even want to cast it because it would have restored my opponents' boards (I had been Smokestack'ing/Daretti'ing them all game.) I'm thinking of cutting it soon but I'd like to hear more discussion/lines of play with the card.
I'll post my list when I have more time later. It's obviously based off your deck with a few changes to my liking and meta (also I don't have a Ravages of War ), the deck is very interesting to play and takes alot of good decision making while in the heat of battle. As a lover of Value-Town Sharuum decks, I'm enjoying the transition to this Breya cult so far. My friends sure aren't enjoying it as much for obvious reasons
I understand that you may be cutting Blightsteel soon anyway, but his huge casting cast among other reasons is why I advocated cutting him for Battlesphere in a vacuum. While 7 mana may be a "ton" there are plenty of ways to ramp into him or cheat him into play, and in grindy games having all those chump blockers/Breya fodder/Clock or Ironworks food make him such a flexible card. I can understand being hesitant, and time may prove that it's not an optimal slot, but I'd still recommend giving the Battleball a shot. Basically it interacts well with so many other key cards and occasionally helps you hard combo.
Meanwhile Blightsteel has only two legitimate ways to cheat himself onto the battlefield: Master Transmuter and Kuldotha Forgemaster, two four-or-greater cmc creatures that require a tap. One could add Greaves but that just seems so clunky to me even though it does make Transmuter and Forgemaster better. As with many ideas concerning edh, I am biased towards my experiences with my playgroup, and I've never really liked Blightsteel in multiplayer. Sure sometimes you take out the main threat at the table and leave yourself with the players with the weaker board states, but so many times I've alpha striked one opponent only to see another combo off in my face. The games in which I manage to lock the opponents out of the game and then finish them off one-by-one with Blightsteel... those feel like games I'm going to win anyway. I know you're not fighting hard for Blightsteel's inclusion these days so I won't harp on it too much more, but as a closing thought I really hate how we can't do ANY graveyard tricks with the big fella, which makes Welder and friends very sad.
I can understand cutting Voltaic Key but for the time being I'm keeping it in as another low cmc artifact to put onto the table especially before wheels come online. I also cut Agent of Bolas and added Grim Monolith. The deck is obviously very colored mana hungry but I wanted to add more value to Key as well as get another three mana rock for Clock of Omens. There are still a few uses for extra colorless mana in this deck including Breya's ability and recasting her from the zone. Also Ironworks isn't the only way to go infinite with Displacer and Breya; having Vault/Monolith plus Clock does the trick as well.
Which brings me to a point I'd again like to make about win conditions and adding more to this shell. Your play experience with your group obviously affects this, but I just don't see the need to add more standalone win conditions, especially if they are a) clunky or b) don't synergize with your other combo/engine pieces. Not counting Forgemaster, my list (and yours, if memory serves me) has nine tutors that can search up a game-winning combo piece like Nim Deathmantle. Mystical Tutor also finds Demonic etc to stitch together the win. In a typical game after grinding the opponents down and gaining board presence and card advantage, the win seems to "fall into my lap" if that makes sense. I'll have one combo piece like an Ironworks which is already good by itself, and I'll untap one turn, draw a wheel or draw some cards off clamp, and boom, there's the Fabricate or DT. Good game.
If Deathmantle or Displacer gets exiled, I'm not really worried, because Mindslaver is one of the best ways to make one or more players scoop, especially if you get recursion going. I also got a scoop one game (deathmantle was exiled) having Smokestack on two, Uba Mask, and Daretti I.I.. And the number one reason I don't think we need to worry about adding more A + B instawin combos, is the commander herself. Breya is meant to go the distance, a 4/4 general body is not insignificant, sure it takes a few turns to get there on combat, but we're grinding and staxing, aren't we? I mean I guess if they exile our Deathmantle, Displacer, Welder, all our walkers, Mindslaver etc etc, then you can say "you got me."
And lastly before this becomes seriously TLDR, how are you liking Scrap Mastery Dies_to_Doom_Blade? I can see its "bomby" appeal but in my limited time with this deck it's been just an imprint for Chrome Mox, a total win more in another game, and in another I didn't even want to cast it because it would have restored my opponents' boards (I had been Smokestack'ing/Daretti'ing them all game.) I'm thinking of cutting it soon but I'd like to hear more discussion/lines of play with the card.
I'll post my list when I have more time later. It's obviously based off your deck with a few changes to my liking and meta (also I don't have a Ravages of War ), the deck is very interesting to play and takes alot of good decision making while in the heat of battle. As a lover of Value-Town Sharuum decks, I'm enjoying the transition to this Breya cult so far. My friends sure aren't enjoying it as much for obvious reasons
I think cutting Blightsteel for Battlesphere would make sense since Blightsteel really just kills one person and then does nothing else. Battlesphere has more room for abuse and combos with us but I'm not certain it would be in the final 99. I think I'll give it a test in Blightsteel's slot and see but I'm not so sure about it's longevity.
I do like how you brought up Grim Monolith, although I'm uncertain how you generate infinite mana with it. I was thinking of adding something like Scrap trawler and having a huge mana gain by saccing an artifact, get grim, tap, sac it and get mana vault, sac it, get crypt and so on. Throw in a Junk Diver or Myr Retriever and I believe you can generate infinite mana with this.
That brings me to Scrap Mastery, I often use it after a massive board wipe like vandalblast or whatever but I have used it plenty after killing creatures and bolting players with Breya by saccing all my artifacts to get them in the yard and then get them back. This has happened less and less as I continued with the deck so I can see cutting it in the future but for now I need to think more about that.
As I mentioned before that I want to try out Scrap Trawler and he may be a better option than Scrap Mastery
Edit:
This is what I'm thinking for the next test
Cut
Blightsteel
Scrap Mastery
Tezz, Agent of bolas
Voltaic key
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
You know those times when you find an "infinite" and later someone makes you realize the line doesn't actually work?
It's true, the above scenario with Clock of Omens, Displacer/Breya, and a 3 rock is NOT an infinite, at least not an infinite that ends the game on the spot. It produces infinite tapped thopters. Clearly not as good as just plain winning, but can still be an option to look out for to give your victims-er I mean friends one turn to find the answer. Despite this shortcoming in the combo, it doesn't really change my earlier stance on win conditions or Grim. Time will tell if the monolith isn't really worth it.
I your Scrap Trawler idea. It really gets the combo addict in me going, but I have to keep reminding myself "keep this a control deck, keep this a control deck." I can see cutting Scrap Mastery for it, and adding Myr Retriever may be worth it but I'm not sure I could find room for it currently. I heavily doubt I could cut enough cards for both Retriever and Junk Diver.
I'm actually thinking of adding Arcum myself, but I think I want to cut Forgemaster for its slot. Forgemaster has a powerful effect to be certain, but it has a clunky cmc and the activation has a high resource cost even if our commander does bring two friends. Outside of fetching a fatty or maybe Scrap Trawler in combo lines, Arcum gets all the important stuff just as well.
Thanks for the explanation on Scrap Mastery. Also LOL that you would cut Scrap Mastery for Scrap Trawler. I didn't know you were all about flavor. I had a game where I sacked all of my artifacts to Ironworks and then cast Mastery, but it was a little unnecessary, and I also reanimated one of my friends' Torpor Orb and had to find a Wear/Tear that same turn. Living Death for artifacts is fun but I think I'll order a Trawler and explore that angle.
Let me know how Devastation works out for you. I only have one Geddon right now and would definitely play a Ravages, but not sure I would want a 7 cmc sorcery. Yes it does sweep all the creatures but we have some pretty useful dudes ourselves.
I'll work on posting my list here in a sec. I have a tappedout of it but I know people hate links
-I know it can be a crutch for some players, but I'm too greedy to not run Trinket Mage here. Usually at worst it's a Worn Powerstone, and having a deck that abuses Skullclamp makes Trinket all the more powerful.
-There are no absolutes in "competitive" edh (and mtg strategy in general), but I'm of the opinion that Swords to Plowshares is a staple, plain and simple. I don't have a ton of white decks currently, but if my general has a in its casting cost I'm slamming Plow into the 99.
-Currently on the chopping block: Kuldotha Forgemaster, Scrap Mastery, possibly a land (although the land would probably be replaced by a Fellwar Stone or a similar rock, don't want to skimp too hard on the mana
edit: decided to pull the trigger on cutting Forgemaster for Arcum. It just sounded like too good an idea not to test for my next battle!
Deck looks solid, I also want to add swords but currently don't know what to remove for it. I'm doing the changes I mention for the next commander night and hopefully it works out well.
Trinket mage should also be in the deck but again I'm not sure what to cut for it.
Anyway, I do like the changes I'm making and think it will work, just need to test it out
Edit
Also Yawgmoth's will is likely way better than Scrap Mastery
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Oh my... How did I not think of Will earlier? That's a great idea!
Sure like most mtg players my head is spinning in Magical Christmasland and only actual play will show what's what, but Yawgmoth's Will seems like an amazing value addition to the deck.
Forget just for a second the busted combo turn that ends the game. I'm thinking that in several midgame situations we could cast a Will, get another land drop, rebuy some mana rocks and utility creatures, rebuy tutors to find more relevant threats/answers/combo pieces, and rebuy cheap removal like plow or wear/tear to put ourselves even further ahead on the value curve. The list kinda goes on and on.
And of course if we have even a half decent amount of mana rocks either on the battlefield or in the yard and at least one tutor, then having Ironworks + Will is just game I'd imagine.
Thanks for the suggestion, I think I'm going to have to test that slot for sure!
So far I'm not loving Nim Deathmantle.
Ironworks is amazing even without combo and deathmantle sucks outside of combo.
Displacer works well without combo and Ironworks so I'm keeping them.
I'm thinking I add Sun titan to make sure I have displacer just in case it dies and plus he gets Dack, Daretti, and plenty of goods.
I've been testing with Battlesphere and actually like it so far. It actually gave me another combo.
So end of turn with Forgemaster plus 6 artifacts, which is easy with Breya.
Sac 3 and get clock, sac 3 and get battlesphere, untap and sac 3 to get sculpting steel and repeat for metamorph.
By now you have 3 battlesphere's and 5 tokens. Sac 3 to get transmuter and 2 plus a sphere to get gilded lotus.
Now during your turn you can bounce battlesphere and get tokens and untap transmuter and gilded lotus for infinite mana and bounce. Now you can attack with an infinite sized battlesphere and kill someone right away with damage.
Or play Breya and nuke everyone.
That combo has killed a few times now I don't think I need deathmantle.
Also, so far I'm fairly meh on Scrap Trawler, it's been ok but not quite fantasic. I'm thinking I replace with Myr Retriever (Combo helper and overall solid) or Yawgmoth's will, which I shouldn't have to explain why it's good.
Edit:
Went ahead and cut Deathmantle for Sun titan for testing
Also cut Izzet signet for Fellwar stone. Izzet signet wasn't bad it's just stone is better.
It can come back one day maybe
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
I see what you're saying when it comes to Deathmantle. It was decent for me in one situation outside the infinite, but I also had a ton of mana and probably would have won that game anyway. I may very well remove it soon, but I kinda like that ANY of the tutors in the deck can fetch it for the win, while only a handful of tutors nab Displacer. Displacer is clearly the better card though.
I'm glad you're liking Battlesphere, and even though I recently cut Forgemaster for Arcum, I really like that line you found. The fact that you just need Forgemaster plus any six artifacts is rather nice. Most of the time I think Arcum is just strictly better but maybe I should just play both. Perhaps I'll just cut Deathmantle for it.
And oh btw, Yawgmoth's Win definitely deserves a slot in this list. The other day I used it mid-game, rebuying: some rocks, an overloaded Vandalblast, Winter Orb, and Daretti II. I went on to win that game surprisingly. I had another game with Ironworks and a Demonic Tutor in the yard, and top-decked Will late and won that same turn. Card is completely bonkers in a deck like this, and you're only really sad to see this early in the game.
I am still running death mantle, 2 win cons better than 1.
On Devastation, I think it's wiser to run Decree of Annihilation if you just wanna deal with lands since cycling can't be "countered" unless it's stifled or the likes which makes it stronger plus the cycling fee is the same cmc as Devastation.
On Day's Undoing, not a rich man so its the budget replacement for Timetwister. It has its good points, same effect as TT but it ends the turn and exiles itself, but i still make do with it whenever i draw it so. =P
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Standard : What is Stand-tart
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
On Devastation, I think it's wiser to run Decree of Annihilation if you just wanna deal with lands since cycling can't be "countered" unless it's stifled or the likes which makes it stronger plus the cycling fee is the same cmc as Devastation.
I like devastation since its a creature and land wipe that doesnt touch artifacts
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
It does in cast.
The point in devastation was having a spell that kills all creatures and lands but nothing else.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Man, this is like my deck just less absurd. Maybe it's an avenue to consider. I'm playing a Doomsday/bomberman/Ad nauseum/Dragon deck atm.
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My modern Decks: GBRJundGBR URWJeskai NahiriURW My Legacy Deck: URBGrixis DelverURB My EDH Decks: GJarad, Golgari Lich LordB GRhys, The RedeemedW RWArchangel AvacynRW UWDragonlord OjutaiUW
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
We have a running banlist where something is added every week. Started out with most fast mana being axed, and has started to move more towards the repeat offender pieces of combo. That's what I love about Breya: ban one piece, there's plenty of options to take it's place, or just add something in that reinforces one of the other combos in the deck. Fun times.
@ Kylar:I'd consider Voltaic Key, Metalworker and Grim Monolith. Your list suggests that you don't have much of a budget. I don't play Breya but over the years I can attest to the power of Voltaic Key in such builds. Since you have Sol Ring, Mana Vault, Mana Crypt, and Gilded Lotus already I think you'd benefit from my suggestions.
I watched a video* yesterday, and it's ideas have brought me to a very intriguing question; one that I haven't been able to stop thinking about.
What is Breya's competitive advantage as a stax commander? What is it that she does better than any other Stax commander?
Then those questions lead me to another question; is her niche relevant enough to warrant playing her over other stax commanders?
The best way I can think of to illustrate my points is to compare her to the only other stax commander I have meaningful information on; Brago**.
Brago also runs a huge artifact contingent. While it's true he doesn't have access to BR, he more than makes up for it by enabling his deck to operate in a far more hostile board state WITHOUT having to worry about manipulating his symmetrically oppressive stax pieces.
Breya on the hand offers access to BR, her infinite combo wins straight out (as opposed to Brago + Strionic Resonator, which only gives infinite mana), and she can manipulate the board state with her own abilities. Black adds consistency and speed with stuff like Vampiric Tutor, Demonic Tutor, and Dark Confident. Red's major asset (funnily enough, this ISN'T something black is providing) is graveyard manipulation, by providing several ways to dump our expensive artifacts through filter effects, and then cheat them onto the battlefield by sacking disposable things.
I'm not sure just how relevant the infinite combo being a direct wincon is, so I'll move onto Breya herself. She is a toolbox that allows us to make fodder, snipe creatures, reach our opponents life, and give a buffer to our own life. However, in games I've played, I have never really had enough disposable fodder to use Breya's effects consistently for control. They usually just provide a way to protect my key artifacts from exile effects, or add value to my artifacts being destroyed by using them as fodder.
After thinking about it, the thing stands out the most to me is the explosiveness that Breya provides as wincon, thanks to the aforementioned consistency and card-cheating-in her colors provide.
I'd like to see the perspective on this that more experienced players can provide.
Sorry if the post is messy or rambly, I wanted to get my thoughts out ASAP, and I've got things I need to get back to doing.
The forum just ate the post about my perspective about the subject I want to ask everyone in this thread about. Instead of taking another hour to rewrite that, I'm just gonna throw out my question. https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/brewer-s-minute-competitive-advantage-in-deck-building
What is the competive advantage Breya has over other stax commanders, and is that advantage significant enough to edge out competitors (the main one catching my attention is Brago)? If the advantage you've thought of is good enough to edge out competitors, then how do we go about further go about further cultivating that advantage? If the answer you have isn't good enough, that does not mean we should abandon Breya as a competive stax commander. It means we need to look at her from a different angle and see if there is another way we can push her. http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/689658-competitive-stax-combo-brago-stax-eternal
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I think having Deathmantle and Displacer as cards that can instantly win the game with Ironworks/Clock/etc is enough combo. Just grinding the game down and then using a well-placed tutor should be okay. And we're running a LOT of the better tutors for these A + B combos anyway. Adding another A + B combo where at least one of the pieces (Salvagers) doesn't really interact well with your other combo cards... seems kinda iffy. LED is a sweet EDH card as we all know, but I think you can safely pass for now. If you find slots for them and the testing works out well, I'd love to hear about it of course.
If anything I'd like to push Battlesphere again as it has great synergy with alot of other cards in the deck, and combos hard with Clock or Ironworks, and goes infinite with Ironworks + Deathmantle. Seems redundant because those two cards are already a win with Breya but it's good to know. Also as I believe someone else mentioned earlier in this thread: Myr Battlesphere + Master Transmuter + Clock of Omens + Gilded Lotus = infinite colored mana and tokens.
While they're powerful together it's fairly fragile when you have to discard your hand and someone can just kill the salvagers.
There is a ton of removal in my group (Not to mention 3 other Breya decks) so I don't think it would work as well. I'll keep it on the test list but not adding it for now.
I'm not really wanting to add battlesphere because if I'm cheating out big artifacts it's often either Mindslaver or Blightsteel (Who I may cut anyway)
He's fine with the combos but both of those just do the same and better with Breya so I don't quite see the appeal of him.
Plus seven mana is a ton.
Right now I do want to find something to replace Agent of Bolas and Voltaic key
I'm thinking Devastation/Cataclsym and Arcum Daggson/Lightning greaves.
I could also cut Blightsteel and throw in 3 of them anyway. We'll see soon
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Nice suggestion of Arcum Dagsson could replace Kuldotha Forgemaster as a faster and cheaper althou it can't find creatures which is meh since most of our win cons aren't creatures anyway.
I am thinking of replacing Voltaic Key with Chain of Vapor since either it bounces something that your opponent has or save your Nim Deathmantle from being exiled, this bring us to another weak point of the deck, we need another win con badly since we are not afraid of destruction effects but if deathmantle gets exiled, we are cutted off from our primary win con, without it its hard to win.
I am currently looking for alternate win cons such as Isochron Scepter + Dramatic Reversal + Mana rocks for Infinite to sac and recast Breya for infinite to machine gun down the whole board or the old Sharuum the Hegemon + Sculpting Steel + Bitter Ordeal to exile everyone's library. Both combo's has their strength and weakness.
I am looking at this combo line that makes the Isochron Scepter combo line pretty good, basically Isochron Scepter + any 1/2 cmc spell or Dramatic Reversal + Paradox Engine = Infinite Mana, recast breya and machine down the board.
The good line of this combo is that, none of the cards are useless outside the combo and either which will enable infinite mana.
Eg: Sceptor imprinting Demonic Tutor with engine in play, tap 4 land, float 2, cast tutor from scepter, untap all lands/stuff, float 4 (2 from previous), cast tutor again, repeat till infinite.
Eg: without engine in play, imprint tutor, with 7 sources of mana including 1 U, tutor for Dramatic Reversal,cast dramatic reversal, cast tutor from sceptor searching for engine, cast engine then cast tutor, untap all, go infinite.
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
I don't like Specter that much since if it's destroyed we are often two for one'd and reversal doesn't really do much by itself.
It can be good but I think adding something like Mystical Teachings as a 2nd notion thief target plus answers/snapcaster would be better.
I also would like to try Wild Research in the future as well.
Of course I'm saying all this as my own meta choices since things like Salavgers and Spector would often be killed same turn. Not saying you shouldn't test them but I don't think they would work in my own group
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Tainted pact without Lab man seems odd
I love World Queller but don't think he's quite good enough here.
I think you could make a lot of use of Wild Research in here
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Thanks for the reply Dies_to_Doom_Blade.
I understand that you may be cutting Blightsteel soon anyway, but his huge casting cast among other reasons is why I advocated cutting him for Battlesphere in a vacuum. While 7 mana may be a "ton" there are plenty of ways to ramp into him or cheat him into play, and in grindy games having all those chump blockers/Breya fodder/Clock or Ironworks food make him such a flexible card. I can understand being hesitant, and time may prove that it's not an optimal slot, but I'd still recommend giving the Battleball a shot. Basically it interacts well with so many other key cards and occasionally helps you hard combo.
Meanwhile Blightsteel has only two legitimate ways to cheat himself onto the battlefield: Master Transmuter and Kuldotha Forgemaster, two four-or-greater cmc creatures that require a tap. One could add Greaves but that just seems so clunky to me even though it does make Transmuter and Forgemaster better. As with many ideas concerning edh, I am biased towards my experiences with my playgroup, and I've never really liked Blightsteel in multiplayer. Sure sometimes you take out the main threat at the table and leave yourself with the players with the weaker board states, but so many times I've alpha striked one opponent only to see another combo off in my face. The games in which I manage to lock the opponents out of the game and then finish them off one-by-one with Blightsteel... those feel like games I'm going to win anyway. I know you're not fighting hard for Blightsteel's inclusion these days so I won't harp on it too much more, but as a closing thought I really hate how we can't do ANY graveyard tricks with the big fella, which makes Welder and friends very sad.
I can understand cutting Voltaic Key but for the time being I'm keeping it in as another low cmc artifact to put onto the table especially before wheels come online. I also cut Agent of Bolas and added Grim Monolith. The deck is obviously very colored mana hungry but I wanted to add more value to Key as well as get another three mana rock for Clock of Omens. There are still a few uses for extra colorless mana in this deck including Breya's ability and recasting her from the zone. Also Ironworks isn't the only way to go infinite with Displacer and Breya; having Vault/Monolith plus Clock does the trick as well.
Which brings me to a point I'd again like to make about win conditions and adding more to this shell. Your play experience with your group obviously affects this, but I just don't see the need to add more standalone win conditions, especially if they are a) clunky or b) don't synergize with your other combo/engine pieces. Not counting Forgemaster, my list (and yours, if memory serves me) has nine tutors that can search up a game-winning combo piece like Nim Deathmantle. Mystical Tutor also finds Demonic etc to stitch together the win. In a typical game after grinding the opponents down and gaining board presence and card advantage, the win seems to "fall into my lap" if that makes sense. I'll have one combo piece like an Ironworks which is already good by itself, and I'll untap one turn, draw a wheel or draw some cards off clamp, and boom, there's the Fabricate or DT. Good game.
If Deathmantle or Displacer gets exiled, I'm not really worried, because Mindslaver is one of the best ways to make one or more players scoop, especially if you get recursion going. I also got a scoop one game (deathmantle was exiled) having Smokestack on two, Uba Mask, and Daretti I.I.. And the number one reason I don't think we need to worry about adding more A + B instawin combos, is the commander herself. Breya is meant to go the distance, a 4/4 general body is not insignificant, sure it takes a few turns to get there on combat, but we're grinding and staxing, aren't we? I mean I guess if they exile our Deathmantle, Displacer, Welder, all our walkers, Mindslaver etc etc, then you can say "you got me."
And lastly before this becomes seriously TLDR, how are you liking Scrap Mastery Dies_to_Doom_Blade? I can see its "bomby" appeal but in my limited time with this deck it's been just an imprint for Chrome Mox, a total win more in another game, and in another I didn't even want to cast it because it would have restored my opponents' boards (I had been Smokestack'ing/Daretti'ing them all game.) I'm thinking of cutting it soon but I'd like to hear more discussion/lines of play with the card.
I'll post my list when I have more time later. It's obviously based off your deck with a few changes to my liking and meta (also I don't have a Ravages of War ), the deck is very interesting to play and takes alot of good decision making while in the heat of battle. As a lover of Value-Town Sharuum decks, I'm enjoying the transition to this Breya cult so far. My friends sure aren't enjoying it as much for obvious reasons
I think cutting Blightsteel for Battlesphere would make sense since Blightsteel really just kills one person and then does nothing else. Battlesphere has more room for abuse and combos with us but I'm not certain it would be in the final 99. I think I'll give it a test in Blightsteel's slot and see but I'm not so sure about it's longevity.
I do like how you brought up Grim Monolith, although I'm uncertain how you generate infinite mana with it. I was thinking of adding something like Scrap trawler and having a huge mana gain by saccing an artifact, get grim, tap, sac it and get mana vault, sac it, get crypt and so on. Throw in a Junk Diver or Myr Retriever and I believe you can generate infinite mana with this.
That brings me to Scrap Mastery, I often use it after a massive board wipe like vandalblast or whatever but I have used it plenty after killing creatures and bolting players with Breya by saccing all my artifacts to get them in the yard and then get them back. This has happened less and less as I continued with the deck so I can see cutting it in the future but for now I need to think more about that.
As I mentioned before that I want to try out Scrap Trawler and he may be a better option than Scrap Mastery
Edit:
This is what I'm thinking for the next test
Cut
Blightsteel
Scrap Mastery
Tezz, Agent of bolas
Voltaic key
Add
Scrap Trawler
Devastation
Myr Battlesphere
Arcum Daggson.
Thoughts?
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
You know those times when you find an "infinite" and later someone makes you realize the line doesn't actually work?
It's true, the above scenario with Clock of Omens, Displacer/Breya, and a 3 rock is NOT an infinite, at least not an infinite that ends the game on the spot. It produces infinite tapped thopters. Clearly not as good as just plain winning, but can still be an option to look out for to give your victims-er I mean friends one turn to find the answer. Despite this shortcoming in the combo, it doesn't really change my earlier stance on win conditions or Grim. Time will tell if the monolith isn't really worth it.
I your Scrap Trawler idea. It really gets the combo addict in me going, but I have to keep reminding myself "keep this a control deck, keep this a control deck." I can see cutting Scrap Mastery for it, and adding Myr Retriever may be worth it but I'm not sure I could find room for it currently. I heavily doubt I could cut enough cards for both Retriever and Junk Diver.
I'm actually thinking of adding Arcum myself, but I think I want to cut Forgemaster for its slot. Forgemaster has a powerful effect to be certain, but it has a clunky cmc and the activation has a high resource cost even if our commander does bring two friends. Outside of fetching a fatty or maybe Scrap Trawler in combo lines, Arcum gets all the important stuff just as well.
Thanks for the explanation on Scrap Mastery. Also LOL that you would cut Scrap Mastery for Scrap Trawler. I didn't know you were all about flavor. I had a game where I sacked all of my artifacts to Ironworks and then cast Mastery, but it was a little unnecessary, and I also reanimated one of my friends' Torpor Orb and had to find a Wear/Tear that same turn. Living Death for artifacts is fun but I think I'll order a Trawler and explore that angle.
Let me know how Devastation works out for you. I only have one Geddon right now and would definitely play a Ravages, but not sure I would want a 7 cmc sorcery. Yes it does sweep all the creatures but we have some pretty useful dudes ourselves.
I'll work on posting my list here in a sec. I have a tappedout of it but I know people hate links
1 Academy Ruins
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Arid Mesa
1 Badlands
1 Blood Crypt
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 City of Brass
1 Command Tower
1 Exotic Orchard
1 Flooded Strand
1 Godless Shrine
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Inventor's Fair
1 Mana Confluence
1 Marsh Flats
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Plateau
1 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Scrubland
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Snow-Covered Island
1 Spire of Industry
1 Steam Vents
1 Tarnished Citadel
1 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Volcanic Island
1 Watery Grave
Creature (11)
1 Goblin Welder
2 Dark Confidant
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Spellskite
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Trinket Mage
4 Arcum Dagsson
4 Master Transmuter
4 Notion Thief
4 Phyrexian Metamorph
7 Myr Battlesphere
3 Dack fayden
3 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
4 Daretti, Scrap Savant
5 Tezzeret the Seeker
Artifact (25)
0 Chrome Mox
0 Mana Crypt
0 Mox Diamond
0 Mox Opal
1 Mana Vault
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Voltaic Key
2 Grim Monolith
2 Izzet Signet
2 Nim Deathmantle
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Talisman of Progress
2 Winter Orb
3 Coalition Relic
3 Crucible of Worlds
3 Sculpting Steel
3 Static Orb
4 Clock of Omens
4 Krark-Clan Ironworks
4 Smokestack
4 Uba Mask
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Mindslaver
Enchantment (2)
3 Ghirapur Aether Grid
3 Rhystic Study
Sorcery (13)
1 Gamble
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
1 Vandalblast
2 Demonic Tutor
2 Transmute Artifact
3 Fabricate
3 Timetwister
3 Toxic Deluge
3 Wheel of Fortune
3 Windfall
4 Armageddon
5 Scrap Mastery
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Swan Song
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Vampiric Tutor
2 Arcane Denial
2 Cyclonic Rift
2 Mana Drain
3 Anguished Unmaking
3 Thirst for Knowledge
3 Wear // Tear
3 Whir of Invention
5 Force of Will
8 Dig Through Time
Couple things:
-I know it can be a crutch for some players, but I'm too greedy to not run Trinket Mage here. Usually at worst it's a Worn Powerstone, and having a deck that abuses Skullclamp makes Trinket all the more powerful.
-There are no absolutes in "competitive" edh (and mtg strategy in general), but I'm of the opinion that Swords to Plowshares is a staple, plain and simple. I don't have a ton of white decks currently, but if my general has a in its casting cost I'm slamming Plow into the 99.
-Currently on the chopping block: Kuldotha Forgemaster, Scrap Mastery, possibly a land (although the land would probably be replaced by a Fellwar Stone or a similar rock, don't want to skimp too hard on the mana
edit: decided to pull the trigger on cutting Forgemaster for Arcum. It just sounded like too good an idea not to test for my next battle!
Trinket mage should also be in the deck but again I'm not sure what to cut for it.
Anyway, I do like the changes I'm making and think it will work, just need to test it out
Edit
Also Yawgmoth's will is likely way better than Scrap Mastery
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Oh my... How did I not think of Will earlier? That's a great idea!
Sure like most mtg players my head is spinning in Magical Christmasland and only actual play will show what's what, but Yawgmoth's Will seems like an amazing value addition to the deck.
Forget just for a second the busted combo turn that ends the game. I'm thinking that in several midgame situations we could cast a Will, get another land drop, rebuy some mana rocks and utility creatures, rebuy tutors to find more relevant threats/answers/combo pieces, and rebuy cheap removal like plow or wear/tear to put ourselves even further ahead on the value curve. The list kinda goes on and on.
And of course if we have even a half decent amount of mana rocks either on the battlefield or in the yard and at least one tutor, then having Ironworks + Will is just game I'd imagine.
Thanks for the suggestion, I think I'm going to have to test that slot for sure!
Ironworks is amazing even without combo and deathmantle sucks outside of combo.
Displacer works well without combo and Ironworks so I'm keeping them.
I'm thinking I add Sun titan to make sure I have displacer just in case it dies and plus he gets Dack, Daretti, and plenty of goods.
I've been testing with Battlesphere and actually like it so far. It actually gave me another combo.
So end of turn with Forgemaster plus 6 artifacts, which is easy with Breya.
Sac 3 and get clock, sac 3 and get battlesphere, untap and sac 3 to get sculpting steel and repeat for metamorph.
By now you have 3 battlesphere's and 5 tokens. Sac 3 to get transmuter and 2 plus a sphere to get gilded lotus.
Now during your turn you can bounce battlesphere and get tokens and untap transmuter and gilded lotus for infinite mana and bounce. Now you can attack with an infinite sized battlesphere and kill someone right away with damage.
Or play Breya and nuke everyone.
That combo has killed a few times now I don't think I need deathmantle.
Also, so far I'm fairly meh on Scrap Trawler, it's been ok but not quite fantasic. I'm thinking I replace with Myr Retriever (Combo helper and overall solid) or Yawgmoth's will, which I shouldn't have to explain why it's good.
Edit:
Went ahead and cut Deathmantle for Sun titan for testing
Also cut Izzet signet for Fellwar stone. Izzet signet wasn't bad it's just stone is better.
It can come back one day maybe
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
I'm glad you're liking Battlesphere, and even though I recently cut Forgemaster for Arcum, I really like that line you found. The fact that you just need Forgemaster plus any six artifacts is rather nice. Most of the time I think Arcum is just strictly better but maybe I should just play both. Perhaps I'll just cut Deathmantle for it.
And oh btw, Yawgmoth's Win definitely deserves a slot in this list. The other day I used it mid-game, rebuying: some rocks, an overloaded Vandalblast, Winter Orb, and Daretti II. I went on to win that game surprisingly. I had another game with Ironworks and a Demonic Tutor in the yard, and top-decked Will late and won that same turn. Card is completely bonkers in a deck like this, and you're only really sad to see this early in the game.
I have also been testing Will and Battlesphere, here is my list.
1x Anguished Unmaking
1x Arcane Denial
1x Brainstorm
1x Counterspell
1x Cyclonic Rift
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Force of Will
1x Lim-Dul's Vault
1x Mystical Tutor
1x Swan Song
1x Swords to Plowshares
1x Thirst for Knowledge
1x Vampiric Tutor
1x Wear / Tear
1x Whir of Invention
Sorcery (14)
1x Armageddon
1x Day's Undoing
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Fabricate
1x Gamble
1x Ponder
1x Preordain
1x Ravages of War
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Transmute Artifact
1x Vandalblast
1x Wheel of Fortune
1x Windfall
1x Yawgmoth's Will
Enchantment (2)
1x Ghirapur AEther Grid
1x Rhystic Study
Artifact (23)
1x Chromatic Lantern
1x Chrome Mox
1x Clock of Omens
1x Coalition Relic
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Fellwar Stone
1x Gilded Lotus
1x Krark-Clan Ironworks
1x Mana Crypt
1x Mana Vault
1x Mindslaver
1x Mox Diamond
1x Mox Opal
1x Nim Deathmantle
1x Sculpting Steel
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Skullclamp
1x Sol Ring
1x Static Orb
1x Talisman of Dominance
1x Talisman of Progress
1x Uba Mask
1x Winter Orb
1x Dack Fayden
1x Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1x Daretti, Scrap Savant
1x Tezzeret the Seeker
Creature (11)
1x Arcum Dagsson
1x Dark Confidant
1x Eldrazi Displacer
1x Goblin Welder
1x Kuldotha Forgemaster
1x Master Transmuter
1x Myr Battlesphere
1x Notion Thief
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
1x Snapcaster Mage
1x Spellskite
Land (30)
1x Academy Ruins
1x Ancient Tomb
1x Badlands SL
1x Blood Crypt
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Command Tower
1x Exotic Orchard
1x Flooded Strand
1x Godless Shrine
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Inventors' Fair
2x Island
1x Mana Confluence
1x Marsh Flats
1x Plateau
1x Polluted Delta
1x Reflecting Pool
1x Scalding Tarn
1x Scrubland
1x Seat of the Synod
1x Spire of Industry
1x Steam Vents
1x Strip Mine
1x Tundra
1x Underground Sea SL
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Volcanic Island MP
1x Wasteland
1x Watery Grave
I am still running death mantle, 2 win cons better than 1.
On Devastation, I think it's wiser to run Decree of Annihilation if you just wanna deal with lands since cycling can't be "countered" unless it's stifled or the likes which makes it stronger plus the cycling fee is the same cmc as Devastation.
On Day's Undoing, not a rich man so its the budget replacement for Timetwister. It has its good points, same effect as TT but it ends the turn and exiles itself, but i still make do with it whenever i draw it so. =P
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
Don't really care for it. With all the five color lands, fetches, duals, and shocks I dont see room for it
I like devastation since its a creature and land wipe that doesnt touch artifacts
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
It does in cast.
The point in devastation was having a spell that kills all creatures and lands but nothing else.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
GBRJundGBR
URWJeskai NahiriURW
My Legacy Deck:
URBGrixis DelverURB
My EDH Decks:
GJarad, Golgari Lich LordB
GRhys, The RedeemedW
RWArchangel AvacynRW
UWDragonlord OjutaiUW
I would love some advice, preferably using the list of cards I currently have.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/608790#paper
Just needs testing.
I don't like lodestone in here because of how often it makes our own spells cost more.
I think you also need a bit more counters
Zur seems odd with only 5 targets. I like him a lot but don't think he's worth a slot here. And if you want to keep him add Necro
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
We have a running banlist where something is added every week. Started out with most fast mana being axed, and has started to move more towards the repeat offender pieces of combo. That's what I love about Breya: ban one piece, there's plenty of options to take it's place, or just add something in that reinforces one of the other combos in the deck. Fun times.
What is Breya's competitive advantage as a stax commander? What is it that she does better than any other Stax commander?
Then those questions lead me to another question; is her niche relevant enough to warrant playing her over other stax commanders?
The best way I can think of to illustrate my points is to compare her to the only other stax commander I have meaningful information on; Brago**.
Brago also runs a huge artifact contingent. While it's true he doesn't have access to BR, he more than makes up for it by enabling his deck to operate in a far more hostile board state WITHOUT having to worry about manipulating his symmetrically oppressive stax pieces.
Breya on the hand offers access to BR, her infinite combo wins straight out (as opposed to Brago + Strionic Resonator, which only gives infinite mana), and she can manipulate the board state with her own abilities. Black adds consistency and speed with stuff like Vampiric Tutor, Demonic Tutor, and Dark Confident. Red's major asset (funnily enough, this ISN'T something black is providing) is graveyard manipulation, by providing several ways to dump our expensive artifacts through filter effects, and then cheat them onto the battlefield by sacking disposable things.
I'm not sure just how relevant the infinite combo being a direct wincon is, so I'll move onto Breya herself. She is a toolbox that allows us to make fodder, snipe creatures, reach our opponents life, and give a buffer to our own life. However, in games I've played, I have never really had enough disposable fodder to use Breya's effects consistently for control. They usually just provide a way to protect my key artifacts from exile effects, or add value to my artifacts being destroyed by using them as fodder.
After thinking about it, the thing stands out the most to me is the explosiveness that Breya provides as wincon, thanks to the aforementioned consistency and card-cheating-in her colors provide.
I'd like to see the perspective on this that more experienced players can provide.
Sorry if the post is messy or rambly, I wanted to get my thoughts out ASAP, and I've got things I need to get back to doing.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/brewer-s-minute-competitive-advantage-in-deck-building
What is the competive advantage Breya has over other stax commanders, and is that advantage significant enough to edge out competitors (the main one catching my attention is Brago)? If the advantage you've thought of is good enough to edge out competitors, then how do we go about further go about further cultivating that advantage? If the answer you have isn't good enough, that does not mean we should abandon Breya as a competive stax commander. It means we need to look at her from a different angle and see if there is another way we can push her.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/689658-competitive-stax-combo-brago-stax-eternal