She who must say "I am the Queen", is no true Queen...
Non-Pillowfort Queen Marchesa
Ever since Queen Marchesa was spoiled I wanted to play with her. However, I like all my commander decks to play different from one another and I already had a pillowfort deck, so I wanted something different. The deck I build has a simple yet challenging game plan: staying alive as one of the last two players, then go for the kill. The main difference with a pillowfort is that with this deck, we don't make it any harder for them to attack or otherwise harm us, we just make sure we're the least attractive option to do it to. They are not attacking us because they can't, but because they don't want to! This also means we do not play cards that specifically draw attention to us like Planeswalkers or Grave Pact effects etc. In order for the deck to achieve it's goal, the cards from the deck are listed in several categories, each with their own specific use:
Gaming cards
I call these gaming after the Hunger Games: these are cards that make your opponents go after one another and allow us to influence combat. The most prominent one is Queen Marchesa herself: this deck does not intend to be Monarch, but instead have the opponent's fight over the crown. Hence the subtitle of the deck. Cards like Brutal Hordechief, Blind Fury and Fight to the Death can really screw with an opponent's combat math.Special note: Contested War Zone is meant to be taken by opponents.
Disincentivizers
These are cards that disincentivize our opponents to attack us, and go for each other instead. Most of these either kill creatures that deal damage to us (No Mercy, Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts) or make sure our opponents suffer too (Stuffy Doll, Spitemare, Boros Reckoner). Then there are a few that give us tokens when they attack us and then there's Odric, Lunarch Marshal who also fullfills this role because along Queen Marchesa he gives all our creatures deathtouch (And a stack of 1/1 tokens with deathtouch is great at preventing incoming attacks).
Finishers
These are cards that use your opponent's strength against them and these are the cards we use for the kill. Most of these are prevent and redirect damage effects in one form or another, but there is also Insurrection and Rise of the Dark Realms as ways to take the lead immediately and Shunt and Wild Ricochet to turn the result of some infinite combo against it's controller first. These are the cards that will keep opponent's on the edge at all times, because a well played finisher can often mean certain death for the opponent either directly or indirectly. Keep in mind that a Boros Charm, while listed as a punisher card (for it's indestructibility) can suddenly turn an attack lethal with it's double strike option.
Draw, Removal and Ramp
These are all pretty self explanatory. Note that the removal part also included Rebuff the Wicked and Dawn Charm, giving you some form of countering as a non-blue player. Surprise!
Utility
The tutors are there to reliably find the correct answer you need. Given the game plan, you should always try to postpone tutoring as much as possible, since you ideally want to sculpt your hand for the final opponent. A special mention needs to be given to Sunforger This card is too stupid good in this deck, since most of the finisher or non-creature punisher cards as well as the removal are instants. This is your swiss army knife and the only card you always tutor for the moment you can. The deck is not dependent on it but you lose A LOT of flexibility in your answers should this get exiled (Destroy is not a problem: put it on the bottom of your deck with Mistveil Plains and tutor it again). In case your meta has a lot of artifact exile, you might want to add Pull form Eternity to the deck. Pariah's Shield in in there because it is just too good a combo with either Stuffy Doll, Mogg Maniac, Spitemare and Boros Reckoner.
Lands Mistveil Plains is the most important card here, since it can return cards to your deck for Sunforger to find again. And again. There are also a few land that allow us to influence combat math between opponent's giving us some influence in who we end up facing as the last opponent. Especially Sunhome can be brutal, in the same way as the Boros Charm.
AS you can see, the current deck is 106 cards, but I don't know what to cut anymore! Any suggestions? The curve is quite low so maybe we can get greedy and play 36 lands but that's the minimum. That means I need to cut at least 5 nonland cards.
I actually came to the same conclusion during the C16 release here is what I have so far. Hope it helps. I will be adding the same C16 cards you've listed.
I actually came to the same conclusion during the C16 release here is what I have so far. Hope it helps. I will be adding the same C16 cards you've listed.
While the decks look similar, you run quite some cards that will draw attention to you like Kambal, Consul of Allocation and Thalia, Heretic Cathar. I specifically avoid these cards because I don't want to draw attention to myself until there's just one opponent left.
Any suggestions on which cards to cut?
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
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Good cath on eye for an eye, I believe i once had a copy somewhere in my junk boxes.... Time do dive it up.
Increasing Ambition is integral to the deck. I need the tutors to find the right answers once it's clear who i'll be left with as the last opponent.
Contested War Zone might be cut indeed, it's just that it's one of the few cards in there that actively encourage my opponents to attack each other. They way i see it, one will attack me in order to get it, and then it can be passed around the table freely by them.
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
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congregate seems like a meh card in here, seems like your doing damage to creatures enough that this may not gain you enough life to justify it. I'd drop blind fury for heat stroke since its an enchantment, and you're not blocking anyway, its a nightmare for other players since they aren't equipped to deal with it.
I like what you have here. I'd like to make a version of Marchesa in the spirit of the deck I linked you to, but one with more survivability in a familiar group. Will definitely give yours a try and report back.
I like what you have here. I'd like to make a version of Marchesa in the spirit of the deck I linked you to, but one with more survivability in a familiar group. Will definitely give yours a try and report back.
I sure did! I had a Tariel deck like the one in the link, but I updated it to Queen Marchesa because I feel she fits the overall plan better: either opponents indeed start fighting each other for the monarchy, or I draw extra cards. Both are fine
Just remember to avoid denying your opponents the choice to attack you. A lot of Marchesa builds go full pillowfort, leading to a sense of urgency in your opponents to kill you while they still can. This deck intenionally leaves the option to attack you open... it's just the least attractive option.
I have played a few games now, won about 50% of the games I played. But more importantly, the deck is a blast to play. Especially Backlash is an amazing card! I've killed an opponent through commander damage with it from his own commander (Omnath, Locus of Mana). Another game, I was left with one other opponent. We both had empty boards and he starts grinning because of his topdeck. In comes a Blightsteel ColossusThrough the Breach. As he wanted to attack me, I Backlashed the Colossus, instantly killing him through poison. Earlier that same game, another opponent got 30 token through a Tempt with Vengeance that everyone took. He decided to send them all at me, at which point I Sunforgered for Rakdos Charm instantly killing him. This deck is so much fun.
I think your creature suite merits including Blasphemous Act. Can end the game outright with any of your punishing creatures. Also plays well with Shaman En-Kor to help you maintain a decent board presence after the board wipe resolves.
Granted, this isn't entirely in the spirit of the original You'll Thank Me For This deck, but it's something to consider.
Really loving the judo theme for Marchesa v2.0! However, since you're probably gonna have your hand full of answers, it may get pretty big. Maybe include Library of Leng and/or Reliquary Tower? Library of Leng also helps against discard effects.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I really like this deck. The judo theme is fantastic. And it certainly seems like a lot more fun than your standard pillow fort. Which says a lot because my Marchesa build is pretty fort-y. I think I'll have to take some inspiration here. Well done.
Really loving the judo theme for Marchesa v2.0! However, since you're probably gonna have your hand full of answers, it may get pretty big. Maybe include Library of Leng and/or Reliquary Tower? Library of Leng also helps against discard effects.
While that might help every now and then, so far I have not suffered from this problem. I manage to keep a full hand yes, but it's not like opponents never do anything that warrants an answer.
Nevertheless, if you want some support this way you could also add Nephalia Academy. Together with the aformentioned Reliquary Tower you accomplish the same effect as a library of leng. Just mind your colors though! If discard is running rampant in your meta, don't forget to add Spiritual Focus.
I really like this deck. The judo theme is fantastic. And it certainly seems like a lot more fun than your standard pillow fort. Which says a lot because my Marchesa build is pretty fort-y. I think I'll have to take some inspiration here. Well done.
Thanks. And be sure to tell if you have any interesting additions for this deck.
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
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Thanks. And be sure to tell if you have any interesting additions for this deck.
On the contrary, I'm more likely to scavenge ideas from your iteration. I can't see anything in my build that would really translate well here unfortunately.
i love the concept of this, but i'm curious. how do you handle infinite combo vomit deck onto table shenanigans? with the amount of judo style effects it looks like the deck relies on flying under the radar like you've said, but after just one trick like that people think twice and don't bother... until they can overwhelm those effects. like, i'm not likely to throw a craterhoof at your face... unless i've got something like venser available to bounce your inevitable damage redirection. what do you do in those situations?
i love the concept of this, but i'm curious. how do you handle infinite combo vomit deck onto table shenanigans? with the amount of judo style effects it looks like the deck relies on flying under the radar like you've said, but after just one trick like that people think twice and don't bother... until they can overwhelm those effects. like, i'm not likely to throw a craterhoof at your face... unless i've got something like venser available to bounce your inevitable damage redirection. what do you do in those situations?
i really really like the concept of this deck
Not speaking for Ertai Planeswalker here, but I think one of the issues the original deck had was playing it against a regular playgroup.
I've heard some people discuss using 150 cards for that deck and rotating the 99 periodically so they don't always know what to expect. That is one option that could be used for this one, though I think it has better general survivability than the Tariel version.
Regarding your question: what if you have anything at all? What if I have anything at all? That's the nature of the game. Maybe the Marchesa player just loses.
The deck isn't meant to be super competitive. But in the specific context you brought up (you vs me, Craterhoof Behemoth, Venser, Shaper Savant), maybe I have multiple fogs in hand. Or maybe I kill you after the Craterhoof resolves by Backlashing one of your buffed creatures and using Increasing Vengeance to copy it, targeting another.
i love the concept of this, but i'm curious. how do you handle infinite combo vomit deck onto table shenanigans? with the amount of judo style effects it looks like the deck relies on flying under the radar like you've said, but after just one trick like that people think twice and don't bother... until they can overwhelm those effects. like, i'm not likely to throw a craterhoof at your face... unless i've got something like venser available to bounce your inevitable damage redirection. what do you do in those situations?
i really really like the concept of this deck
As for the flying under the radar part: I've found that even though people know this deck, they tend to leave it alone anyway because "this turn that is more important". Whatever "that" is varies from turn to turn but it's usually something an opponent has. I also tend to find that people knowing this deck actually helps you: they know they should not be attacking you because you will screw them over when they do. Sometimes it almost feels like you're playing mono blue draw go: people are afraid to mess with you if you have mana open even when you do not actually have anything to stop it.
The whole idea of this deck is to punish opponents who go over the top on something by turning that something against them. Of course, the judo style cards you need might depend a bit on your meta. Of course, if people prepare for your line of play and save a counterspell for everything it's going to become hard to resist, but that goes for every deck. I think it would require a table wide collaboration between the opponents that they leave each other alone for a few turns while they build up to collectively to smash you but in my group this never happens. If it does in your group, you could add Abeyance and/or Orim's Chant to the deck to be sure your actual finisher is not countered or prevented. If infinite combo is a thing in your meta, you could add Praetor's Grasp to remove a key combo piece (Laboratory Maniac anyone?)
i love the concept of this, but i'm curious. how do you handle infinite combo vomit deck onto table shenanigans? with the amount of judo style effects it looks like the deck relies on flying under the radar like you've said, but after just one trick like that people think twice and don't bother... until they can overwhelm those effects. like, i'm not likely to throw a craterhoof at your face... unless i've got something like venser available to bounce your inevitable damage redirection. what do you do in those situations?
i really really like the concept of this deck
As for the flying under the radar part: I've found that even though people know this deck, they tend to leave it alone anyway because "this turn that is more important". Whatever "that" is varies from turn to turn but it's usually something an opponent has. I also tend to find that people knowing this deck actually helps you: they know they should not be attacking you because you will screw them over when they do. Sometimes it almost feels like you're playing mono blue draw go: people are afraid to mess with you if you have mana open even when you do not actually have anything to stop it.
The whole idea of this deck is to punish opponents who go over the top on something by turning that something against them. Of course, the judo style cards you need might depend a bit on your meta. Of course, if people prepare for your line of play and save a counterspell for everything it's going to become hard to resist, but that goes for every deck. I think it would require a table wide collaboration between the opponents that they leave each other alone for a few turns while they build up to collectively to smash you but in my group this never happens. If it does in your group, you could add Abeyance and/or Orim's Chant to the deck to be sure your actual finisher is not countered or prevented. If infinite combo is a thing in your meta, you could add Praetor's Grasp to remove a key combo piece (Laboratory Maniac anyone?)
Yes! Thank you. This is the kind of response i was hoping for. As ive said i really like the concept of this deck design, so i was legitimately wondering how to play around those situations. Im glad you took a few moments to explain things rather than boiling it down to something like "dies to removal isnt an argument"
This is also a direction i didnt think to go in with my own build, and have been so inspired by your list that im going to be modifying my own to heavily push the ideas your posting here.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Excellented find on Simulacrum! I will definitly find a spot for that one
As for forcing opponents to attack, this deck's plan is all about maintaining the illusion that opponent's choose not to attack you. I do not want to play anything that somehow inhibits or forces my opponent to do or not do anything as long as they are not doing it to me since all it does is make your presence on the table more prominent thus increasing the chance people attack you. This does not mesh with the game plan to remain as one of the two last players. Literally every time i've seen Goblin Spymaster has hit the table, it's controller consequently got the message from the rest of the table that "we'll attack you, and only you, until you block with it so we can kill it". Cards like Goblin Spymaster and Fumiko would be excellent in a pro-active Judo (Jiu-Jitsu?) deck, but this is not such a deck.
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
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I understand what you mean. But attacking you is never a good thing with a judo deck. Forcing opponents to attack each other speeds things along - they already know not to attack you. However, I feel that some games may stall when other archetypes are present (control, stax, etc.).
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Ever since Queen Marchesa was spoiled I wanted to play with her. However, I like all my commander decks to play different from one another and I already had a pillowfort deck, so I wanted something different. The deck I build has a simple yet challenging game plan: staying alive as one of the last two players, then go for the kill. The main difference with a pillowfort is that with this deck, we don't make it any harder for them to attack or otherwise harm us, we just make sure we're the least attractive option to do it to. They are not attacking us because they can't, but because they don't want to! This also means we do not play cards that specifically draw attention to us like Planeswalkers or Grave Pact effects etc. In order for the deck to achieve it's goal, the cards from the deck are listed in several categories, each with their own specific use:
Gaming cards
I call these gaming after the Hunger Games: these are cards that make your opponents go after one another and allow us to influence combat. The most prominent one is Queen Marchesa herself: this deck does not intend to be Monarch, but instead have the opponent's fight over the crown. Hence the subtitle of the deck. Cards like Brutal Hordechief, Blind Fury and Fight to the Death can really screw with an opponent's combat math.Special note: Contested War Zone is meant to be taken by opponents.
Disincentivizers
These are cards that disincentivize our opponents to attack us, and go for each other instead. Most of these either kill creatures that deal damage to us (No Mercy, Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts) or make sure our opponents suffer too (Stuffy Doll, Spitemare, Boros Reckoner). Then there are a few that give us tokens when they attack us and then there's Odric, Lunarch Marshal who also fullfills this role because along Queen Marchesa he gives all our creatures deathtouch (And a stack of 1/1 tokens with deathtouch is great at preventing incoming attacks).
Punisher Cards
Punisher cards are the cards that punish opponents for ignoring our nudges by attacking or otherwise harming us or trying to win anyway. These include some lesser prevent and redirect damage effects as well as effects that allow us to trade favorably in combat (Safe Passage, Boros Charm) or simple but effective punishments in the form of Sunblast Angel (preferably through Winding Canyons!) or it's bigger sister Angel of the Dire Hour. There are also a few cards that punish opponents for going big in one way or another: "Blightsteel Colossus/Tainted Strike? Backlash. Laboratory Maniac combo win? Angel's Grace Infinitely big X spell? Deflecting Palm. Stroke of Genius me for 300? Shunt Swords of X and Y and Umezawa's Jitte? Armory Automaton. Infinite creature tokens? Allow me to gain some life (Congregate) then die please Rakdos Charm. Craterhoof Behemoth? Comeuppance. These are the cards that will keep our opponents from attacking us. And the beauty of it is: the better they know your deck, the more they will fear it.
Finishers
These are cards that use your opponent's strength against them and these are the cards we use for the kill. Most of these are prevent and redirect damage effects in one form or another, but there is also Insurrection and Rise of the Dark Realms as ways to take the lead immediately and Shunt and Wild Ricochet to turn the result of some infinite combo against it's controller first. These are the cards that will keep opponent's on the edge at all times, because a well played finisher can often mean certain death for the opponent either directly or indirectly. Keep in mind that a Boros Charm, while listed as a punisher card (for it's indestructibility) can suddenly turn an attack lethal with it's double strike option.
Draw, Removal and Ramp
These are all pretty self explanatory. Note that the removal part also included Rebuff the Wicked and Dawn Charm, giving you some form of countering as a non-blue player. Surprise!
Utility
The tutors are there to reliably find the correct answer you need. Given the game plan, you should always try to postpone tutoring as much as possible, since you ideally want to sculpt your hand for the final opponent. A special mention needs to be given to Sunforger This card is too stupid good in this deck, since most of the finisher or non-creature punisher cards as well as the removal are instants. This is your swiss army knife and the only card you always tutor for the moment you can. The deck is not dependent on it but you lose A LOT of flexibility in your answers should this get exiled (Destroy is not a problem: put it on the bottom of your deck with Mistveil Plains and tutor it again). In case your meta has a lot of artifact exile, you might want to add Pull form Eternity to the deck. Pariah's Shield in in there because it is just too good a combo with either Stuffy Doll, Mogg Maniac, Spitemare and Boros Reckoner.
Lands
Mistveil Plains is the most important card here, since it can return cards to your deck for Sunforger to find again. And again. There are also a few land that allow us to influence combat math between opponent's giving us some influence in who we end up facing as the last opponent. Especially Sunhome can be brutal, in the same way as the Boros Charm.
So without further ado, here's the decklist:
1 Queen Marchesa
1 Crown of Doom
1 Rite of the Raging Storm
1 Brutal Hordechief
1 Master Warcraft
1 Contested War Zone
1 Fight to the Death
1 Blind Fury
Disincentivizers (14)
1 Dread
1 Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts
1 No Mercy
1 Michiko Konda
1 Spear of Heliod
1 Karmic Justice
1 Stuffy Doll
1 Spitemare
1 Boros Reckoner
1 Mogg Maniac
1 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
1 Darien, King of Kjeldor
1 Odric, Lunarch Marshal
1 Shaman en-Kor
Punishments (14)
1 Kor Chant
1 Shining Shoal
1 Batwing Brume
1 Comeuppance
1 Divine Deflection
1 Sunblast Angel
1 Congregate
1 Angel of the Dire Hour
1 Armory Automaton
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Sudden Spoiling
1 Boros Charm
1 Safe Passsage
1 Retaliate
1 Backlash
1 Deflecting Palm
1 Incite Rebellion
1 Mirror Strike
1 Reflect Damage
1 Selfless Squire
1 Wild Ricochet
1 Shunt
1 Insurrection
1 Rise of the Dark Realms
1 Angel's Grace
Draw (2)
1 Staff of Nin
1 Phyrexian Arena
Removal (8)
1 Return to Dust
1 Rebuff the Wicked
1 Path to Exile
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Dawn Charm
1 Soul Snare
1 Anguished Unmaking
1 Utter End
Ramp (5)
1 Orzhov Signet
1 Boros Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Sol Ring
1 Coalition Relic
Utility (7)
1 Expedition Map
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Increasing Ambition
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Sunforger
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Pariah's Shield
1 Mistveil Plains
1 City of Brass
1 Sunhome, Fortress of the Legion
1 Nomad Outpost
1 Command Tower
1 Godless Shrine
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Blood Crypt
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Arid Mesa
1 Marsh Flats
1 Graven Cairns
1 Fetid Heath
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Winding Canyons
1 Hammerheim
1 Rogue's Passage
1 Shinka, the Bloadsoaked Keep
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Slayer's Stronghold
1 Tower of the Magistrate
1 Urborg
6 Swamp
5 Plains
4 Mountain
AS you can see, the current deck is 106 cards, but I don't know what to cut anymore! Any suggestions? The curve is quite low so maybe we can get greedy and play 36 lands but that's the minimum. That means I need to cut at least 5 nonland cards.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
https://deckbox.org/sets/1382517?s=c&o=a
While the decks look similar, you run quite some cards that will draw attention to you like Kambal, Consul of Allocation and Thalia, Heretic Cathar. I specifically avoid these cards because I don't want to draw attention to myself until there's just one opponent left.
Any suggestions on which cards to cut?
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
Increasing Ambition is integral to the deck. I need the tutors to find the right answers once it's clear who i'll be left with as the last opponent.
Contested War Zone might be cut indeed, it's just that it's one of the few cards in there that actively encourage my opponents to attack each other. They way i see it, one will attack me in order to get it, and then it can be passed around the table freely by them.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
I like what you have here. I'd like to make a version of Marchesa in the spirit of the deck I linked you to, but one with more survivability in a familiar group. Will definitely give yours a try and report back.
I sure did! I had a Tariel deck like the one in the link, but I updated it to Queen Marchesa because I feel she fits the overall plan better: either opponents indeed start fighting each other for the monarchy, or I draw extra cards. Both are fine
Just remember to avoid denying your opponents the choice to attack you. A lot of Marchesa builds go full pillowfort, leading to a sense of urgency in your opponents to kill you while they still can. This deck intenionally leaves the option to attack you open... it's just the least attractive option.
I have played a few games now, won about 50% of the games I played. But more importantly, the deck is a blast to play. Especially Backlash is an amazing card! I've killed an opponent through commander damage with it from his own commander (Omnath, Locus of Mana). Another game, I was left with one other opponent. We both had empty boards and he starts grinning because of his topdeck. In comes a Blightsteel Colossus Through the Breach. As he wanted to attack me, I Backlashed the Colossus, instantly killing him through poison. Earlier that same game, another opponent got 30 token through a Tempt with Vengeance that everyone took. He decided to send them all at me, at which point I Sunforgered for Rakdos Charm instantly killing him. This deck is so much fun.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
Granted, this isn't entirely in the spirit of the original You'll Thank Me For This deck, but it's something to consider.
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While that might help every now and then, so far I have not suffered from this problem. I manage to keep a full hand yes, but it's not like opponents never do anything that warrants an answer.
Nevertheless, if you want some support this way you could also add Nephalia Academy. Together with the aformentioned Reliquary Tower you accomplish the same effect as a library of leng. Just mind your colors though! If discard is running rampant in your meta, don't forget to add Spiritual Focus.
Thanks. And be sure to tell if you have any interesting additions for this deck.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
On the contrary, I'm more likely to scavenge ideas from your iteration. I can't see anything in my build that would really translate well here unfortunately.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/762998-queen-marchesa-enchantress
i really really like the concept of this deck
Not speaking for Ertai Planeswalker here, but I think one of the issues the original deck had was playing it against a regular playgroup.
I've heard some people discuss using 150 cards for that deck and rotating the 99 periodically so they don't always know what to expect. That is one option that could be used for this one, though I think it has better general survivability than the Tariel version.
Regarding your question: what if you have anything at all? What if I have anything at all? That's the nature of the game. Maybe the Marchesa player just loses.
The deck isn't meant to be super competitive. But in the specific context you brought up (you vs me, Craterhoof Behemoth, Venser, Shaper Savant), maybe I have multiple fogs in hand. Or maybe I kill you after the Craterhoof resolves by Backlashing one of your buffed creatures and using Increasing Vengeance to copy it, targeting another.
As for the flying under the radar part: I've found that even though people know this deck, they tend to leave it alone anyway because "this turn that is more important". Whatever "that" is varies from turn to turn but it's usually something an opponent has. I also tend to find that people knowing this deck actually helps you: they know they should not be attacking you because you will screw them over when they do. Sometimes it almost feels like you're playing mono blue draw go: people are afraid to mess with you if you have mana open even when you do not actually have anything to stop it.
The whole idea of this deck is to punish opponents who go over the top on something by turning that something against them. Of course, the judo style cards you need might depend a bit on your meta. Of course, if people prepare for your line of play and save a counterspell for everything it's going to become hard to resist, but that goes for every deck. I think it would require a table wide collaboration between the opponents that they leave each other alone for a few turns while they build up to collectively to smash you but in my group this never happens. If it does in your group, you could add Abeyance and/or Orim's Chant to the deck to be sure your actual finisher is not countered or prevented. If infinite combo is a thing in your meta, you could add Praetor's Grasp to remove a key combo piece (Laboratory Maniac anyone?)
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
Yes! Thank you. This is the kind of response i was hoping for. As ive said i really like the concept of this deck design, so i was legitimately wondering how to play around those situations. Im glad you took a few moments to explain things rather than boiling it down to something like "dies to removal isnt an argument"
This is also a direction i didnt think to go in with my own build, and have been so inspired by your list that im going to be modifying my own to heavily push the ideas your posting here.
How about forcing opponents to attack in order to take advantage of the judo? Fumiko the Lowblood would be pretty interesting here. Curse of the Nightly Hunt and Goblin Spymaster would do well in this regard, as well.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
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The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Excellented find on Simulacrum! I will definitly find a spot for that one
As for forcing opponents to attack, this deck's plan is all about maintaining the illusion that opponent's choose not to attack you. I do not want to play anything that somehow inhibits or forces my opponent to do or not do anything as long as they are not doing it to me since all it does is make your presence on the table more prominent thus increasing the chance people attack you. This does not mesh with the game plan to remain as one of the two last players. Literally every time i've seen Goblin Spymaster has hit the table, it's controller consequently got the message from the rest of the table that "we'll attack you, and only you, until you block with it so we can kill it". Cards like Goblin Spymaster and Fumiko would be excellent in a pro-active Judo (Jiu-Jitsu?) deck, but this is not such a deck.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
EDIT:
P.S.
I have some more sweet tech for you:
Blaze of Glory and Valor Made Real. Both tutorable with your Sunforger package. Not only great when in a pinch, but having Boros Reckoner, Stuffy Doll, or Spitemare in play is just icing on the cake. There's also Give No Ground but it's way more expensive to cast (even though you can still tutor for it with Sunforger).
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!