As always: whow. Thanks Xen! Well reasoned, and an extra thought for flavour on top
I think Mangara of Corondor is still in your 99? I found that, in this deck, creatures need to have the possibility of instant value (by EtB or dying). So, as much as I love Mangara (and The Tree of Pain as well) - unfortunately, I had to cut those. They attract StP and PtE.
I don't know about Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter. Every time he has been in play, he was vastly underwhelming. Maybe I just havent found a very good situation where he shines. (or maybe I am playing him wrong :p)
I changed Beacon of Unrest for Reanimate. Beacon is nice and all as it can be reused later in the game, however an early game reanimate (even if its for say, a Solemn Simulacrum) has proven extremely useful. The life loss isn't an issue with this deck, and I have never gotten back an artifact with it yet, as I don't tend to play my sac outlets until I am about to do something silly.
Path to Exile seems like a better fit that Angel of Serenity. I understand the whole Oblivion Ring trick you can do with it, however I have never truly needed it more than say, an Archon of Justice or a Swords to Plowshares. I have usually found that people in my meta either play a one or a couple of creatures a turn, or like 10 of them in a turn, which I feel Angel of Serenity doesn't help over other cards. The graveyard hate part of it I can see being pretty good, but my meta is very light on graveyard shenanigans. (aside from myself)
I took out Exsanguinate for Debt to the Deathless for two reason. One, it's just amazing as flavor to this deck. Two, putting anything more than 2 into its X cost makes it 100% better than Exsanguinate in every way. So unless your Exsanguinate's are typically with an X of 2 or 3, then I feel like Debt to the Deathless would be a better choice.
Also, I kind of want to have less infinite's in here, and more consistent tempo. I have been thinking about taking out Blasting Station, as I only really ever cast it if I am about to do either a Reveillark/Karmic Guide infinite or a Sun Titan/Angelic Renewal infinite. Infinite combos which kill the table immediately are heavily frowned upon where I play, but infinite combos where you don't win immediately (gaining infinite life, having an infinite amount of some tokens, e.t.c) are still not liked, but tolerated. Any suggestions for something like that?
I don't know about Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter. Every time he has been in play, he was vastly underwhelming. Maybe I just havent found a very good situation where he shines. (or maybe I am playing him wrong :p)
I changed Beacon of Unrest for Reanimate. Beacon is nice and all as it can be reused later in the game, however an early game reanimate (even if its for say, a Solemn Simulacrum) has proven extremely useful. The life loss isn't an issue with this deck, and I have never gotten back an artifact with it yet, as I don't tend to play my sac outlets until I am about to do something silly.
Path to Exile seems like a better fit that Angel of Serenity. I understand the whole Oblivion Ring trick you can do with it, however I have never truly needed it more than say, an Archon of Justice or a Swords to Plowshares. I have usually found that people in my meta either play a one or a couple of creatures a turn, or like 10 of them in a turn, which I feel Angel of Serenity doesn't help over other cards. The graveyard hate part of it I can see being pretty good, but my meta is very light on graveyard shenanigans. (aside from myself)
I took out Exsanguinate for Debt to the Deathless for two reason. One, it's just amazing as flavor to this deck. Two, putting anything more than 2 into its X cost makes it 100% better than Exsanguinate in every way. So unless your Exsanguinate's are typically with an X of 2 or 3, then I feel like Debt to the Deathless would be a better choice.
Also, I kind of want to have less infinite's in here, and more consistent tempo. I have been thinking about taking out Blasting Station, as I only really ever cast it if I am about to do either a Reveillark/Karmic Guide infinite or a Sun Titan/Angelic Renewal infinite. Infinite combos which kill the table immediately are heavily frowned upon where I play, but infinite combos where you don't win immediately (gaining infinite life, having an infinite amount of some tokens, e.t.c) are still not liked, but tolerated. Any suggestions for something like that?
Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter is a combo piece. Without including him in a combo, he's a beefy flier that can hit very hard, but I more or less exclusively use him as a combo piece. He's a potential finisher with the Reveillark + Karmic Guide combo by swinging in with an infinitely large creature. He can also clear the board with his second ability with the same combo. This combo works with Sun Titan + Angelic Renewal, as well. In general he's a really good sac outlet with multiple ways to utilize what you get from sacrificing to him. Sac outlets are pretty important!
Beacon of Unrest is one of the very few ways to get Artifacts back into play from our graveyard, which is important given that sac outlets are killed pretty quickly in EDH. That it comes back later is a bonus, but the utility of hitting an Artifact in our graveyard or an opponent's as well as our own for our own combo pieces is a must have. It seems you have a very different idea of what you want to do with the deck than what I post here about and what this thread is for Reanimate into large creatures early in the game typically sees them removed and tends to be political suicide by making yourself a target from the start. For the purposes of the deck here and the thread, that's the opposite of what we want to do.
Path to Exile is something I never play in EDH because I don't like helping opponents ramp into spells, especially in the early game. It's not really something I see played often, truly, and since I run both Utter End and Anguished Unmaking plus several board wipes and other spells, it's pretty unnecessary. Angel of Serenity being able to exile three creatures from the battlefield or graveyard makes it one of the most powerful removal spells in the deck. It's great to reanimate out in response to someone trying to combo out of their graveyard and exiling their combo pieces while still being a beater and being able to use it later on again.
Debt to the Deathless costs two colored mana more than Exsanguinate and seems more like a "win more" card. Since cards like Corpse Dance and other combos require colored mana to keep pumping into them to make them go far, having to pay two extra colored mana isn't always the best situation to be in. Exsanguinate is a combo finisher for the deck and can require other colored mana to help set up. While the flavor aspect is there, it's only ever cast when winning the game or in a very desperate situation where it's only being cast outside of a combo finisher to gain another turn to try to find a way to win. When comboing with Exsanguinate it's with infinite mana which makes the point of the life gain being moot.
As for running less infinite combos, I have a section about it in the Addendum section. I'll quote it here:
Bring It Down A Notch
Sometimes a player's metagame is made up of very casual players and a lot of newer Magic players who are just cobbling together their first attempt at a deck from scratch, or even just modifying a preconstructed deck. For those types of situations the intense combos in the deck can be hard to follow and unfun, and you may wish to tone the amount of combos down. While some new and very casual players may be impressed by such complicated stack mechanics, some can become frustrated and overwhelmed. First, I would suggest removing cards like Sorin Markov, Yosei, the Morning Star, Corpse Dance, Blasting Station, Sensei's Divining Top and perhaps even Nim Deathmantle. My philosophy is about everyone having an experience during the game which is why I removed Mimic Vat due to how tempting it is to put False Prophet or others Imprinted on it. For those cases where everyone benefits most by cutting down the intensity, here's some fun and "interesting" suggestions.
Abyssal Persecutor: It's a creature that can be hit by removal, but provides an interesting and fun effect that can spark some odd politics.
Necrotic Plague: At the time this came out, I was fighting The Lich King in World of Warcraft and one of his abilities shared this name and effect, so I thought it was pretty awesome. It's a hilarious effect for opponents to have to deal with.
Imp's Mischief: This is a card I've played before that has been entirely situational, oftentimes too much so. But, it's also quite a surprise when you misdirect a spell elsewhere being that you're in Orzhov colors.
Pain's Reward: Forcing players to bid life for card advantage always leads to interesting scenarios. Who is really desperate for those four cards?
Withering Boon: No one expects you to be able to counter spells in Black!
Curse of the Cabal: Who is most scared of having half of their permanents sacrificed? Players can work to avoid this and delay the inevitable. Despite the powerful effect, the Suspend mechanic involved creates interesting gameplay.
Do or Die: It's no board wipe, but watching another player make tough choices is always fun for everyone else.
Twilight's Call: Sometimes it's risky to give everyone their toys back, but with some targeted graveyard hate such as Withered Wretch and using Nezumi Graverobber you can make sure everyone has some fun while not hurting yourself too terribly.
Morality Shift: When your game has gone far too long and half or more of your deck is in your graveyard and you're running out of options... and suddenly you switch your graveyard with your library and all your answers and tutors are back to draw, again. The look on your opponent's faces is priceless.
Endless Whispers: Great for when you want to introduce chaos into your build! As long as you reanimate your creatures that die before the end of your turn, you'll never give your opponents your own creatures.
As always: whow. Thanks Xen! Well reasoned, and an extra thought for flavour on top
I think Mangara of Corondor is still in your 99? I found that, in this deck, creatures need to have the possibility of instant value (by EtB or dying). So, as much as I love Mangara (and The Tree of Pain as well) - unfortunately, I had to cut those. They attract StP and PtE.
I try to not use Tree or Mangara unless I've put them into play with Haste via Corpse Dance Leaving them on the battlefield for any amount of time does tend to end up with them being removed before you can use them. I think they're much more effective with Mimic Vat in the deck, which I'm currently reconsidering adding now that my playgroup has shifted quite a bit
I don't know about Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter. Every time he has been in play, he was vastly underwhelming. Maybe I just havent found a very good situation where he shines. (or maybe I am playing him wrong :p)
I changed Beacon of Unrest for Reanimate. Beacon is nice and all as it can be reused later in the game, however an early game reanimate (even if its for say, a Solemn Simulacrum) has proven extremely useful. The life loss isn't an issue with this deck, and I have never gotten back an artifact with it yet, as I don't tend to play my sac outlets until I am about to do something silly.
Path to Exile seems like a better fit that Angel of Serenity. I understand the whole Oblivion Ring trick you can do with it, however I have never truly needed it more than say, an Archon of Justice or a Swords to Plowshares. I have usually found that people in my meta either play a one or a couple of creatures a turn, or like 10 of them in a turn, which I feel Angel of Serenity doesn't help over other cards. The graveyard hate part of it I can see being pretty good, but my meta is very light on graveyard shenanigans. (aside from myself)
I took out Exsanguinate for Debt to the Deathless for two reason. One, it's just amazing as flavor to this deck. Two, putting anything more than 2 into its X cost makes it 100% better than Exsanguinate in every way. So unless your Exsanguinate's are typically with an X of 2 or 3, then I feel like Debt to the Deathless would be a better choice.
Also, I kind of want to have less infinite's in here, and more consistent tempo. I have been thinking about taking out Blasting Station, as I only really ever cast it if I am about to do either a Reveillark/Karmic Guide infinite or a Sun Titan/Angelic Renewal infinite. Infinite combos which kill the table immediately are heavily frowned upon where I play, but infinite combos where you don't win immediately (gaining infinite life, having an infinite amount of some tokens, e.t.c) are still not liked, but tolerated. Any suggestions for something like that?
Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter is a combo piece. Without including him in a combo, he's a beefy flier that can hit very hard, but I more or less exclusively use him as a combo piece. He's a potential finisher with the Reveillark + Karmic Guide combo by swinging in with an infinitely large creature. He can also clear the board with his second ability with the same combo. This combo works with Sun Titan + Angelic Renewal, as well. In general he's a really good sac outlet with multiple ways to utilize what you get from sacrificing to him. Sac outlets are pretty important!
Beacon of Unrest is one of the very few ways to get Artifacts back into play from our graveyard, which is important given that sac outlets are killed pretty quickly in EDH. That it comes back later is a bonus, but the utility of hitting an Artifact in our graveyard or an opponent's as well as our own for our own combo pieces is a must have. It seems you have a very different idea of what you want to do with the deck than what I post here about and what this thread is for Reanimate into large creatures early in the game typically sees them removed and tends to be political suicide by making yourself a target from the start. For the purposes of the deck here and the thread, that's the opposite of what we want to do.
Path to Exile is something I never play in EDH because I don't like helping opponents ramp into spells, especially in the early game. It's not really something I see played often, truly, and since I run both Utter End and Anguished Unmaking plus several board wipes and other spells, it's pretty unnecessary. Angel of Serenity being able to exile three creatures from the battlefield or graveyard makes it one of the most powerful removal spells in the deck. It's great to reanimate out in response to someone trying to combo out of their graveyard and exiling their combo pieces while still being a beater and being able to use it later on again.
Debt to the Deathless costs two colored mana more than Exsanguinate and seems more like a "win more" card. Since cards like Corpse Dance and other combos require colored mana to keep pumping into them to make them go far, having to pay two extra colored mana isn't always the best situation to be in. Exsanguinate is a combo finisher for the deck and can require other colored mana to help set up. While the flavor aspect is there, it's only ever cast when winning the game or in a very desperate situation where it's only being cast outside of a combo finisher to gain another turn to try to find a way to win. When comboing with Exsanguinate it's with infinite mana which makes the point of the life gain being moot.
As for running less infinite combos, I have a section about it in the Addendum section. I'll quote it here:
Bring It Down A Notch
Sometimes a player's metagame is made up of very casual players and a lot of newer Magic players who are just cobbling together their first attempt at a deck from scratch, or even just modifying a preconstructed deck. For those types of situations the intense combos in the deck can be hard to follow and unfun, and you may wish to tone the amount of combos down. While some new and very casual players may be impressed by such complicated stack mechanics, some can become frustrated and overwhelmed. First, I would suggest removing cards like Sorin Markov, Yosei, the Morning Star, Corpse Dance, Blasting Station, Sensei's Divining Top and perhaps even Nim Deathmantle. My philosophy is about everyone having an experience during the game which is why I removed Mimic Vat due to how tempting it is to put False Prophet or others Imprinted on it. For those cases where everyone benefits most by cutting down the intensity, here's some fun and "interesting" suggestions.
Abyssal Persecutor: It's a creature that can be hit by removal, but provides an interesting and fun effect that can spark some odd politics.
Necrotic Plague: At the time this came out, I was fighting The Lich King in World of Warcraft and one of his abilities shared this name and effect, so I thought it was pretty awesome. It's a hilarious effect for opponents to have to deal with.
Imp's Mischief: This is a card I've played before that has been entirely situational, oftentimes too much so. But, it's also quite a surprise when you misdirect a spell elsewhere being that you're in Orzhov colors.
Pain's Reward: Forcing players to bid life for card advantage always leads to interesting scenarios. Who is really desperate for those four cards?
Withering Boon: No one expects you to be able to counter spells in Black!
Curse of the Cabal: Who is most scared of having half of their permanents sacrificed? Players can work to avoid this and delay the inevitable. Despite the powerful effect, the Suspend mechanic involved creates interesting gameplay.
Do or Die: It's no board wipe, but watching another player make tough choices is always fun for everyone else.
Twilight's Call: Sometimes it's risky to give everyone their toys back, but with some targeted graveyard hate such as Withered Wretch and using Nezumi Graverobber you can make sure everyone has some fun while not hurting yourself too terribly.
Morality Shift: When your game has gone far too long and half or more of your deck is in your graveyard and you're running out of options... and suddenly you switch your graveyard with your library and all your answers and tutors are back to draw, again. The look on your opponent's faces is priceless.
Endless Whispers: Great for when you want to introduce chaos into your build! As long as you reanimate your creatures that die before the end of your turn, you'll never give your opponents your own creatures.
I guess my question to you is, is it important to get your sac outlets out early on? I generally hold off on them until I can do a big play and/or win the game, which is why I felt Beacon of Unrest was just a more expensive Reanimate. However you did make a point about it working with opponent's graveyard, which I always seem to forget it can grab other peoples' things
I guess my question to you is, is it important to get your sac outlets out early on? I generally hold off on them until I can do a big play and/or win the game, which is why I felt Beacon of Unrest was just a more expensive Reanimate. However you did make a point about it working with opponent's graveyard, which I always seem to forget it can grab other peoples' things
It's entirely situational, which is a non-answer, I know. In some games I find I want one out really early, but in others I spend most of the game quietly building up combo pieces to set up a win out of nowhere. Some early game examples would be like wanting an Archon of Justice to trigger if someone tries to bully you; or False Prophet; or the Oblivion Stone trick with Fiend Hunter. It's always good to have one available though so you can play combo pieces like Karmic Guide without someone exiling them, so you can sacrifice them in response. That's the entire reason for stuff like High Market and why I changed the General from Ghost Council of Orzhova to Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim. Sometimes you want to play with cards important to the late game, but don't want them exiled in the early game.
Generally I try to wait to dump all my combo pieces in at once as opposed to spreading them out, and having a way to keep going or get pieces back if they try to remove one. The good thing about Vish Kal is that with Necromancy or Corpse Dance or a number of other cards, they think they got rid of your sac outlet to stop you from comboing but suddenly he's on the battlefield because he was in the graveyard waiting to be re-animated. Same thing with Beacon of Unrest. It's very uncommon to be able to reanimate Artifacts, so when you reanimate Ashnod's Altar it usually catches everyone off guard because that's mostly a thing that Red does. One of my favorite things to target in my meta is Avenger of Zendikar With Weathered Wayfarer on the board I can pump up a ton of tokens from the thing twice or so and either kill people with all those tokens or sacrifice them to something I control to great effect.
The thing about the deck, at least my list, is that it's entirely responsive until the late game. Because there are so many ways to get spells and creatures back and come back from a board wipe or having a combo disrupted, I pretty much ride the wave. That's honestly what the deck is meant to do, though: keep coming back. Players who know the deck usually disrupt my combo, which leads to me rebounding and trying to combo again, then disrupting another one. I don't rush and I tend to play long grindy games because Ayli can weather anything and it's more Combo than Reanimator.
I wanted to ask what your thoughts were on Sheoldred. I understand that she is a very powerful card, but at times do you find that she may be a little too slow? Likewise, if you have a tutor in hand and a reanimation spell, how often are you going for Sheoldred in the early game? Basically my concern is that she may be a little too narrow or slow, and hard casting her for 7 mana is never something you want to be doing.
I wanted to ask what your thoughts were on Sheoldred. I understand that she is a very powerful card, but at times do you find that she may be a little too slow? Likewise, if you have a tutor in hand and a reanimation spell, how often are you going for Sheoldred in the early game? Basically my concern is that she may be a little too narrow or slow, and hard casting her for 7 mana is never something you want to be doing.
Sheoldred, Whispering One is actually one of my favorite cards in the deck! Most creatures that cost her mana cost or more I play in the deck don't come out in the early game unless they do something like Angel of Serenity that act as removal. She's great at helping seal the mid to late game, especially getting her on the battlefield after a board wipe so that it's really hard for opponent to keep creatures out. Putting her out on a board full of creatures isn't the greatest - she's definitely a Creature that requires a setup. In this deck that's pretty easy to do, though. Early game I'm reanimating Merciless Executioner to get around Hexproof and Shroud on 1-2 creature boards to slow the pace down and there's not much to speak of in my graveyard to bring back with Sheoldred, anyway. Late game she can be helping setup combos, though, while keeping opponents in a stranglehold.
Sheoldred, Whispering One is actually one of my favorite cards in the deck! Most creatures that cost her mana cost or more I play in the deck don't come out in the early game unless they do something like Angel of Serenity that act as removal. She's great at helping seal the mid to late game, especially getting her on the battlefield after a board wipe so that it's really hard for opponent to keep creatures out. Putting her out on a board full of creatures isn't the greatest - she's definitely a Creature that requires a setup. In this deck that's pretty easy to do, though. Early game I'm reanimating Merciless Executioner to get around Hexproof and Shroud on 1-2 creature boards to slow the pace down and there's not much to speak of in my graveyard to bring back with Sheoldred, anyway. Late game she can be helping setup combos, though, while keeping opponents in a stranglehold.
So I can agree that she's definitely a value generating creature. Would you really classify her as removal though? She keeps a board cleared post-wipe, but as people build up, they will always sacrifice the least valuable creature - the lowest common denominator. If anything, I would think she is more of a board slowdown/lock than some sort of removal.
Sheoldred, Whispering One is actually one of my favorite cards in the deck! Most creatures that cost her mana cost or more I play in the deck don't come out in the early game unless they do something like Angel of Serenity that act as removal. She's great at helping seal the mid to late game, especially getting her on the battlefield after a board wipe so that it's really hard for opponent to keep creatures out. Putting her out on a board full of creatures isn't the greatest - she's definitely a Creature that requires a setup. In this deck that's pretty easy to do, though. Early game I'm reanimating Merciless Executioner to get around Hexproof and Shroud on 1-2 creature boards to slow the pace down and there's not much to speak of in my graveyard to bring back with Sheoldred, anyway. Late game she can be helping setup combos, though, while keeping opponents in a stranglehold.
So I can agree that she's definitely a value generating creature. Would you really classify her as removal though? She keeps a board cleared post-wipe, but as people build up, they will always sacrifice the least valuable creature - the lowest common denominator. If anything, I would think she is more of a board slowdown/lock than some sort of removal.
Another way to look at it is people treat Diabolic Edict effects like Innocent Blood and Barter in Blood as removal spells, so why not Sheoldred? She's both reanimation and removal. Even with a board wipe aside, I've found cases where a creature has Hexproof or Indestructible so I just use spot removal on one or two other creatures at the end of turn prior to the owner's turn with the troublesome creature so they're forced to sacrifice the one I want them to sacrifice. Regardless of what she's killing, she's effectively killing 3 creatures per round of turns if there's any on the board. Sheoldred is utility but she does one thing better than any other thing she does. With Urborg out she can swing in for some damage unimpeded against anyone; she can put a choke hold on opponents and make it very hard for them to set back up on the board; and she can reanimate other creatures to help keep the board under control or finish the game. Reanimating Ashen Rider with her every turn by targeting it then sacrificing it to something is even more backbreaking. She's very heavy removal and enables the use of other creatures with removal effects pinned to them. Personally I don't see any reason to split hairs over it. I play her most of all for her ability to get rid of creatures, so as far as I'm concerned she's a form of removal.
Ah, yes. I requested a name change for consistency with my online presence as a gamer on social media and in video games and other gaming communities. I haven't used the username Xenphire in over 11 years. When I talk to people in Facebook Magic groups or on Twitter, etc. I want them to be able to find me easy when I mention work like this primer
Just checking back to ask how the deck is doing, or seeing if you have made any changes/considerations.
Quick question for you though. I know this deck probably isn't tailored to a 1v1 styled game, but have you managed to play this deck out in a few 1v1's? I play with just 1 friend alot of the time and he is using a Maelstrom Wanderer deck with ramp/extra turns/land destruction. I win sometimes, but usually if he casts the wanderer, it's usually followed by a crap ton of extra turns. Probably a stupid question but thought I'd ask anyways!
Just checking back to ask how the deck is doing, or seeing if you have made any changes/considerations.
Quick question for you though. I know this deck probably isn't tailored to a 1v1 styled game, but have you managed to play this deck out in a few 1v1's? I play with just 1 friend alot of the time and he is using a Maelstrom Wanderer deck with ramp/extra turns/land destruction. I win sometimes, but usually if he casts the wanderer, it's usually followed by a crap ton of extra turns. Probably a stupid question but thought I'd ask anyways!
Thanks!
Hey thanks for stopping by!
I've been busy with a lot of stuff the last while, so I haven't updated much here. Since Amonkhet came out I've fallen in love with Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons and been player her a lot. Ayli feels like it's in a really good place at the moment, but I haven't abandoned her! I actually just finally picked up a Masterpiece Sol Ring for her, earlier today!
As for 1v1, it really depends! Against other decks not specifically built for 1v1 I find that I win a lot, because I run so much removal. Last week I was actually playing against Rafiq the Many and both games I got Maze of Ith out and pretty much shut him down both games off of that alone. Otherwise the constant removal left him really behind both games. I've played a lot of other Commanders over the years 1v1 when I don't have anyone else around. My partner will test with me sometimes but because I tend to build all of our decks it's an unfair advantage as I know them all and what to expect and most of the lines of play there.
It's fairly easy, though, I find. If you play 1v1 a lot I'd make some substitutions of some cards that are a lot less effective outside of multiplayer. Sorin, Grim Nemesis immediately comes to mind because only hitting one player with his +1 makes him less dangerous. Tree of Perdition becomes worse because it loses the ability to go unnoticed while players in multiplayer are juggling all the threats on the board. At the same time, Yosei, the Morning Star combos get even better because you only have to lock one player out of the game instead of three. Depending on how mean/competitive your 1v1 opponent is, I'd probably just substitute Sorin, Grim Nemesis for Sorin Markov, and maybe Tree of Perdition with Mana Vault or some more ramp to match pace. Decks that ramp out really fast are fair in multiplayer because there's three players to keep the player's board state in check, while in 1v1 it's only you and if you don't have an answer in hand at the wrong time, you could be facing lethal Commander damage or infinite turns like your friend playing Maelstrom Wanderer
Kelzam, I'd be very interested to see your Hapatra list (only because your Ayli list made me fall in love with EDH all over again). I built her too, and am falling in love with the deck. It's just so synergistic.
Play report:
Yesterday, facing a gazillion 5/3 Elemental tokens (from Titania, Protector of Argoth) and Breya, Etherium Shaper gone wild with thopter tokens and dealing pain with Purphoros, God of the Forge. Won with a tutor > Yosei, locking both opponents out of the game (Corpse Dance / Buyback. The deck has a bit of a reputation of a infini-combo or unfun lock-out plan, which I think, is not entirely untrue. It does work alot better when no-one is playing U, stopping combos or countering crucial spells (Corpse Dance)
Ayli is an Answers deck more than anything else, at least in my opinion. It's really funny because the deck can be so resilient and answer so many types of archetypes that people call it unfun or a lock-out deck, but Ayli is entirely responsive. Lockouts like Yosei combos happen because they're being degenerate, and the Ayli will more often than not have an answer. The deck falls under the Reanimator umbrella because that's how most of the deck's biggest answers and win conditions function, but it's a hard to pin down a definition. Many of the win conditions are combos, but it can win without combos. It plays an attrition game very well and lockdown opponents if it needs to, but it's not control. The flexibility is what I love about this deck
Fast land ramp decks have started to become common in my meta lately, so I've ended up responding in kind. I've currently taken Tree of Perdition out and one other card that I forget at the moment and put in Desolation Angel and Cataclysm. Once GW land ramp gets online, it can be really hard to stop even for Ayli. I'm taking the approach of dealing with the root of the problem, which is too much mana being generated so that it becomes impossible to keep them down. Never been a fan of mass land destruction in EDH, but we'll see where this goes. Ayli handles being the archenemy easily enough.
As much as I love the art from Desolation Angel, it doesn't seem right. I mean its terrible to reanimate, so it's pros of being a creature are not much.. If ramp is getting you, what about other options like classic Armageddon or Global Ruin ect ect ? I mean you can win by locking people out of the game...its pretty much over the 'friendly' line there so why sell yourself short? No untap or no lands is pretty much the same result, but some decks can deal with 0 lands.
Fast land ramp decks have started to become common in my meta lately, so I've ended up responding in kind. I've currently taken Tree of Perdition out and one other card that I forget at the moment and put in Desolation Angel and Cataclysm. Once GW land ramp gets online, it can be really hard to stop even for Ayli. I'm taking the approach of dealing with the root of the problem, which is too much mana being generated so that it becomes impossible to keep them down. Never been a fan of mass land destruction in EDH, but we'll see where this goes. Ayli handles being the archenemy easily enough.
It’s true, Desolation Angel has amazing flavor and art (in both versions), but perhaps Balancing Act would be something to consider?
It levels the playing field, and, if it forces us to discard or sacifice, that’s often a positive thing, given all our recursion.
To clarify, I'm not at all suggesting you guys run it, by any means. Desolation Angel is a pet card and is one of my favorites in the entire game, and it's effect with Kicker achieves what I need for it to achieve, so I'm trying to squeeze it in to see how it plays out. I can sacrifice it to other effects afterwards if I need to, which is a bonus, but ultimately I'm trying it out more for nostalgia reasons to see if it can fit without being too much of a hindrance (I won't be updating the main post for it or Cataclysm, because these are meta/personal choices). I'm not necessarily looking to reanimate it, though if an opponent tries to steal it from my graveyard I'd love to see the look on their faces when they realize they can't pay the Kicker cost There are definitely better options out there! If anyone here needs to run LD in their meta, there are plenty of great options! This is me tickling my Vorthos/Melvin psychographic, haha.
Oh boy! Hour of Devastation has some spicy new cards that have some serious potential I wanted to take the time to post my thoughts on some of the cards we've seen so far, so here we go!
Desert's Hold may well replace Faith's Fetters. The 4 life gain from Faith's Fetters has never been the goal of playing the card, so not gaining life from Desert's Hold is not a big deal. Getting the effect of the Aura for one mana less makes it practically strictly better for the reasons we're playing Faith's Fetters!
Solemnity has caused some buyouts to happen. This is definitely a meta call, and isn't necessarily an auto-include. It's a hate card against a meta full of Atraxas, Hapatras, Scorpion Gods and any other deck depending on counters. Otherwise, it forces us to stop running Black Sun's Zenith or draw a dead card if we drop BSZ when Solemnity is already out. To really make use of it as anything but a hate card requires putting a lot of cards in the deck. Currently I don't run Glacial Chasm because Ayli packs so much removal that it's never seemed necessary. I'm sure some of you will want to play around with it and I don't blame you! I'll be holding off though, personally
Bontu's Last Reckoning. In other formats, exhausting your lands for your next turn is a steep price to pay. Depending on if you run a lot of mana rocks in the early game, it might not actually be that bad of a card for us. In EDH it could be the answer to very early game aggression from more competitive decks. If someone cheated all their creatures into play on turns 1-3 and we played this, it would be a massive setback and not having lands to tap on our next turn may be a low price to pay, especially since after such a blow it would take anyone a few turns to catch back up again.
Razaketh, the Fouldblooded is insanity. He's an auto-include in almost any deck running Black. I'm not typically a BAN! sensationalist, but my excitement about him is tempered by a feeling that he could see a ban pretty fast. For Black, life is just another resource and very seldom a concern, and it is not at all hard to make tokens or recur creatures to chain off many demonic tutors to finish a game. On the other hand, they unbanned Protean Hulk which is known for ending games if players choose to play it that way, and Tooth and Nail is still legal and very often is the last spell cast in a game. Razaketh is easily reanimated or cheated into play for cheap in Black, though. But he still does have that requirement of fodder. He'll be finding his way into Ayli in some way, but I can't help but have that feeling that he might not be around long.
Torment of Hailfire is a very interesting finisher and potential board wipe. If follow up Ugin, the Spirit Dragon or another board wipe with this and pump a decent amount of mana into it, it'll either do a lot of damage to our opponents or make them sacrifice a lot of permanents. I'm on the fence about if this card has a place in Ayli, because it can cause a lot of damage, but is it better than what Ayli already has?
Grind // Dust would be a fun companion card to Black Sun's Zenith, if Grind // Dust were already in your graveyard. If someone chose to run Contagion Engine for some reason, it would also be nice following that, as well. By itself, it's 4WB just to exile two creatures, which is pretty awful, and the front end isn't something we really care about. I only mention it as it's deceptive, really. It looks more powerful than it is
As usual it's getting tougher and tougher to make cuts and switches in the main build
I think Rune-scarred Demon has to stay simply because redundancy is great with tutors and he does it entering the battlefield and is a good reanimation target.
The two I'm looking at are Kaya, Ghost Assassin and Sorin, Grim Nemesis. I'm leaning towards Kaya, because while she hasn't been awful, over time I haven't been as impressed with her as I had hoped. I'm finding that I would rather being doing a lot of other things at any given time, or would have rather drawn something else. The only reason I was considering Sorin was because of his high mana cost. I do like his +1 ability, but for the sake of efficiency and considering what each of them do, Razaketh wins out in that regard.
I suppose it's worth mentioning that I've been considering Approach of the Second Sun, as well! Since the addition of Scroll Rack it's been rather easy to manipulate the top of the library in concert with Sensei's Divining Top, not to mention the amount of tutors the main build runs
Hello! Really liking this guide and I've been using it for inspiration ever since I decided I wanted to start building an Ayli deck (main theme: drain/bleed lifegain wincons, with a token subtheme for use as ammo for Ashnod's Altar or Ayli's second ability, for throwing out spot removal/disruption).
I haven't totally finished my deck yet, but I had a question. Since I'm focusing on lifegain/draining for this deck, one of the cards I planned for my 99 was Serra Avatar. It seems like it has good potential, but I want to be sure before I try it: Say I have 100 life and I sacrifice the Avatar to Ayli's first skill. Would I gain 100 life from that as it's toughness would be 100, tied to my life total, or would it be zero as it's a * amount? Because if it works like I hope it does, it'd have a Beacon of Immortality effect that pairs beautifully with Sanguine Bond or Vizkopa Guildmage. A shame you can't really do any recursion shenanigans with it, though.
I think Mangara of Corondor is still in your 99? I found that, in this deck, creatures need to have the possibility of instant value (by EtB or dying). So, as much as I love Mangara (and The Tree of Pain as well) - unfortunately, I had to cut those. They attract StP and PtE.
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
- Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter
- Beacon of Unrest
- Angel of Serenity
- Exsanguinate
+ Path to Exile
+ Animate Dead
+ Reanimate
+ Debt to the Deathless
I don't know about Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter. Every time he has been in play, he was vastly underwhelming. Maybe I just havent found a very good situation where he shines. (or maybe I am playing him wrong :p)
I changed Beacon of Unrest for Reanimate. Beacon is nice and all as it can be reused later in the game, however an early game reanimate (even if its for say, a Solemn Simulacrum) has proven extremely useful. The life loss isn't an issue with this deck, and I have never gotten back an artifact with it yet, as I don't tend to play my sac outlets until I am about to do something silly.
Path to Exile seems like a better fit that Angel of Serenity. I understand the whole Oblivion Ring trick you can do with it, however I have never truly needed it more than say, an Archon of Justice or a Swords to Plowshares. I have usually found that people in my meta either play a one or a couple of creatures a turn, or like 10 of them in a turn, which I feel Angel of Serenity doesn't help over other cards. The graveyard hate part of it I can see being pretty good, but my meta is very light on graveyard shenanigans. (aside from myself)
I took out Exsanguinate for Debt to the Deathless for two reason. One, it's just amazing as flavor to this deck. Two, putting anything more than 2 into its X cost makes it 100% better than Exsanguinate in every way. So unless your Exsanguinate's are typically with an X of 2 or 3, then I feel like Debt to the Deathless would be a better choice.
Also, I kind of want to have less infinite's in here, and more consistent tempo. I have been thinking about taking out Blasting Station, as I only really ever cast it if I am about to do either a Reveillark/Karmic Guide infinite or a Sun Titan/Angelic Renewal infinite. Infinite combos which kill the table immediately are heavily frowned upon where I play, but infinite combos where you don't win immediately (gaining infinite life, having an infinite amount of some tokens, e.t.c) are still not liked, but tolerated. Any suggestions for something like that?
Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter is a combo piece. Without including him in a combo, he's a beefy flier that can hit very hard, but I more or less exclusively use him as a combo piece. He's a potential finisher with the Reveillark + Karmic Guide combo by swinging in with an infinitely large creature. He can also clear the board with his second ability with the same combo. This combo works with Sun Titan + Angelic Renewal, as well. In general he's a really good sac outlet with multiple ways to utilize what you get from sacrificing to him. Sac outlets are pretty important!
Beacon of Unrest is one of the very few ways to get Artifacts back into play from our graveyard, which is important given that sac outlets are killed pretty quickly in EDH. That it comes back later is a bonus, but the utility of hitting an Artifact in our graveyard or an opponent's as well as our own for our own combo pieces is a must have. It seems you have a very different idea of what you want to do with the deck than what I post here about and what this thread is for Reanimate into large creatures early in the game typically sees them removed and tends to be political suicide by making yourself a target from the start. For the purposes of the deck here and the thread, that's the opposite of what we want to do.
Path to Exile is something I never play in EDH because I don't like helping opponents ramp into spells, especially in the early game. It's not really something I see played often, truly, and since I run both Utter End and Anguished Unmaking plus several board wipes and other spells, it's pretty unnecessary. Angel of Serenity being able to exile three creatures from the battlefield or graveyard makes it one of the most powerful removal spells in the deck. It's great to reanimate out in response to someone trying to combo out of their graveyard and exiling their combo pieces while still being a beater and being able to use it later on again.
Debt to the Deathless costs two colored mana more than Exsanguinate and seems more like a "win more" card. Since cards like Corpse Dance and other combos require colored mana to keep pumping into them to make them go far, having to pay two extra colored mana isn't always the best situation to be in. Exsanguinate is a combo finisher for the deck and can require other colored mana to help set up. While the flavor aspect is there, it's only ever cast when winning the game or in a very desperate situation where it's only being cast outside of a combo finisher to gain another turn to try to find a way to win. When comboing with Exsanguinate it's with infinite mana which makes the point of the life gain being moot.
As for running less infinite combos, I have a section about it in the Addendum section. I'll quote it here:
(Also known as Xenphire)
I try to not use Tree or Mangara unless I've put them into play with Haste via Corpse Dance Leaving them on the battlefield for any amount of time does tend to end up with them being removed before you can use them. I think they're much more effective with Mimic Vat in the deck, which I'm currently reconsidering adding now that my playgroup has shifted quite a bit
(Also known as Xenphire)
Hmmm....you make some good points. Ill give Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter and Angel of Serenity another shot.
I guess my question to you is, is it important to get your sac outlets out early on? I generally hold off on them until I can do a big play and/or win the game, which is why I felt Beacon of Unrest was just a more expensive Reanimate. However you did make a point about it working with opponent's graveyard, which I always seem to forget it can grab other peoples' things
It's entirely situational, which is a non-answer, I know. In some games I find I want one out really early, but in others I spend most of the game quietly building up combo pieces to set up a win out of nowhere. Some early game examples would be like wanting an Archon of Justice to trigger if someone tries to bully you; or False Prophet; or the Oblivion Stone trick with Fiend Hunter. It's always good to have one available though so you can play combo pieces like Karmic Guide without someone exiling them, so you can sacrifice them in response. That's the entire reason for stuff like High Market and why I changed the General from Ghost Council of Orzhova to Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim. Sometimes you want to play with cards important to the late game, but don't want them exiled in the early game.
Generally I try to wait to dump all my combo pieces in at once as opposed to spreading them out, and having a way to keep going or get pieces back if they try to remove one. The good thing about Vish Kal is that with Necromancy or Corpse Dance or a number of other cards, they think they got rid of your sac outlet to stop you from comboing but suddenly he's on the battlefield because he was in the graveyard waiting to be re-animated. Same thing with Beacon of Unrest. It's very uncommon to be able to reanimate Artifacts, so when you reanimate Ashnod's Altar it usually catches everyone off guard because that's mostly a thing that Red does. One of my favorite things to target in my meta is Avenger of Zendikar With Weathered Wayfarer on the board I can pump up a ton of tokens from the thing twice or so and either kill people with all those tokens or sacrifice them to something I control to great effect.
The thing about the deck, at least my list, is that it's entirely responsive until the late game. Because there are so many ways to get spells and creatures back and come back from a board wipe or having a combo disrupted, I pretty much ride the wave. That's honestly what the deck is meant to do, though: keep coming back. Players who know the deck usually disrupt my combo, which leads to me rebounding and trying to combo again, then disrupting another one. I don't rush and I tend to play long grindy games because Ayli can weather anything and it's more Combo than Reanimator.
(Also known as Xenphire)
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary Primer UG
Sheoldred, Whispering One is actually one of my favorite cards in the deck! Most creatures that cost her mana cost or more I play in the deck don't come out in the early game unless they do something like Angel of Serenity that act as removal. She's great at helping seal the mid to late game, especially getting her on the battlefield after a board wipe so that it's really hard for opponent to keep creatures out. Putting her out on a board full of creatures isn't the greatest - she's definitely a Creature that requires a setup. In this deck that's pretty easy to do, though. Early game I'm reanimating Merciless Executioner to get around Hexproof and Shroud on 1-2 creature boards to slow the pace down and there's not much to speak of in my graveyard to bring back with Sheoldred, anyway. Late game she can be helping setup combos, though, while keeping opponents in a stranglehold.
(Also known as Xenphire)
So I can agree that she's definitely a value generating creature. Would you really classify her as removal though? She keeps a board cleared post-wipe, but as people build up, they will always sacrifice the least valuable creature - the lowest common denominator. If anything, I would think she is more of a board slowdown/lock than some sort of removal.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary Primer UG
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
Another way to look at it is people treat Diabolic Edict effects like Innocent Blood and Barter in Blood as removal spells, so why not Sheoldred? She's both reanimation and removal. Even with a board wipe aside, I've found cases where a creature has Hexproof or Indestructible so I just use spot removal on one or two other creatures at the end of turn prior to the owner's turn with the troublesome creature so they're forced to sacrifice the one I want them to sacrifice. Regardless of what she's killing, she's effectively killing 3 creatures per round of turns if there's any on the board. Sheoldred is utility but she does one thing better than any other thing she does. With Urborg out she can swing in for some damage unimpeded against anyone; she can put a choke hold on opponents and make it very hard for them to set back up on the board; and she can reanimate other creatures to help keep the board under control or finish the game. Reanimating Ashen Rider with her every turn by targeting it then sacrificing it to something is even more backbreaking. She's very heavy removal and enables the use of other creatures with removal effects pinned to them. Personally I don't see any reason to split hairs over it. I play her most of all for her ability to get rid of creatures, so as far as I'm concerned she's a form of removal.
Ah, yes. I requested a name change for consistency with my online presence as a gamer on social media and in video games and other gaming communities. I haven't used the username Xenphire in over 11 years. When I talk to people in Facebook Magic groups or on Twitter, etc. I want them to be able to find me easy when I mention work like this primer
(Also known as Xenphire)
Just checking back to ask how the deck is doing, or seeing if you have made any changes/considerations.
Quick question for you though. I know this deck probably isn't tailored to a 1v1 styled game, but have you managed to play this deck out in a few 1v1's? I play with just 1 friend alot of the time and he is using a Maelstrom Wanderer deck with ramp/extra turns/land destruction. I win sometimes, but usually if he casts the wanderer, it's usually followed by a crap ton of extra turns. Probably a stupid question but thought I'd ask anyways!
Thanks!
Hey thanks for stopping by!
I've been busy with a lot of stuff the last while, so I haven't updated much here. Since Amonkhet came out I've fallen in love with Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons and been player her a lot. Ayli feels like it's in a really good place at the moment, but I haven't abandoned her! I actually just finally picked up a Masterpiece Sol Ring for her, earlier today!
As for 1v1, it really depends! Against other decks not specifically built for 1v1 I find that I win a lot, because I run so much removal. Last week I was actually playing against Rafiq the Many and both games I got Maze of Ith out and pretty much shut him down both games off of that alone. Otherwise the constant removal left him really behind both games. I've played a lot of other Commanders over the years 1v1 when I don't have anyone else around. My partner will test with me sometimes but because I tend to build all of our decks it's an unfair advantage as I know them all and what to expect and most of the lines of play there.
It's fairly easy, though, I find. If you play 1v1 a lot I'd make some substitutions of some cards that are a lot less effective outside of multiplayer. Sorin, Grim Nemesis immediately comes to mind because only hitting one player with his +1 makes him less dangerous. Tree of Perdition becomes worse because it loses the ability to go unnoticed while players in multiplayer are juggling all the threats on the board. At the same time, Yosei, the Morning Star combos get even better because you only have to lock one player out of the game instead of three. Depending on how mean/competitive your 1v1 opponent is, I'd probably just substitute Sorin, Grim Nemesis for Sorin Markov, and maybe Tree of Perdition with Mana Vault or some more ramp to match pace. Decks that ramp out really fast are fair in multiplayer because there's three players to keep the player's board state in check, while in 1v1 it's only you and if you don't have an answer in hand at the wrong time, you could be facing lethal Commander damage or infinite turns like your friend playing Maelstrom Wanderer
(Also known as Xenphire)
Here is my list:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/14-05-17-IIP-hapatra/
Yesterday, facing a gazillion 5/3 Elemental tokens (from Titania, Protector of Argoth) and Breya, Etherium Shaper gone wild with thopter tokens and dealing pain with Purphoros, God of the Forge. Won with a tutor > Yosei, locking both opponents out of the game (Corpse Dance / Buyback. The deck has a bit of a reputation of a infini-combo or unfun lock-out plan, which I think, is not entirely untrue. It does work alot better when no-one is playing U, stopping combos or countering crucial spells (Corpse Dance)
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
Fast land ramp decks have started to become common in my meta lately, so I've ended up responding in kind. I've currently taken Tree of Perdition out and one other card that I forget at the moment and put in Desolation Angel and Cataclysm. Once GW land ramp gets online, it can be really hard to stop even for Ayli. I'm taking the approach of dealing with the root of the problem, which is too much mana being generated so that it becomes impossible to keep them down. Never been a fan of mass land destruction in EDH, but we'll see where this goes. Ayli handles being the archenemy easily enough.
(Also known as Xenphire)
It’s true, Desolation Angel has amazing flavor and art (in both versions), but perhaps Balancing Act would be something to consider?
It levels the playing field, and, if it forces us to discard or sacifice, that’s often a positive thing, given all our recursion.
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
(Also known as Xenphire)
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
Hour of Revelation is potenially a Planar Cleansing for WWW. In EDH it's pretty easy to find 10+ nonland permanents on the board.
Desert's Hold may well replace Faith's Fetters. The 4 life gain from Faith's Fetters has never been the goal of playing the card, so not gaining life from Desert's Hold is not a big deal. Getting the effect of the Aura for one mana less makes it practically strictly better for the reasons we're playing Faith's Fetters!
Solemnity has caused some buyouts to happen. This is definitely a meta call, and isn't necessarily an auto-include. It's a hate card against a meta full of Atraxas, Hapatras, Scorpion Gods and any other deck depending on counters. Otherwise, it forces us to stop running Black Sun's Zenith or draw a dead card if we drop BSZ when Solemnity is already out. To really make use of it as anything but a hate card requires putting a lot of cards in the deck. Currently I don't run Glacial Chasm because Ayli packs so much removal that it's never seemed necessary. I'm sure some of you will want to play around with it and I don't blame you! I'll be holding off though, personally
Bontu's Last Reckoning. In other formats, exhausting your lands for your next turn is a steep price to pay. Depending on if you run a lot of mana rocks in the early game, it might not actually be that bad of a card for us. In EDH it could be the answer to very early game aggression from more competitive decks. If someone cheated all their creatures into play on turns 1-3 and we played this, it would be a massive setback and not having lands to tap on our next turn may be a low price to pay, especially since after such a blow it would take anyone a few turns to catch back up again.
Razaketh, the Fouldblooded is insanity. He's an auto-include in almost any deck running Black. I'm not typically a BAN! sensationalist, but my excitement about him is tempered by a feeling that he could see a ban pretty fast. For Black, life is just another resource and very seldom a concern, and it is not at all hard to make tokens or recur creatures to chain off many demonic tutors to finish a game. On the other hand, they unbanned Protean Hulk which is known for ending games if players choose to play it that way, and Tooth and Nail is still legal and very often is the last spell cast in a game. Razaketh is easily reanimated or cheated into play for cheap in Black, though. But he still does have that requirement of fodder. He'll be finding his way into Ayli in some way, but I can't help but have that feeling that he might not be around long.
Torment of Hailfire is a very interesting finisher and potential board wipe. If follow up Ugin, the Spirit Dragon or another board wipe with this and pump a decent amount of mana into it, it'll either do a lot of damage to our opponents or make them sacrifice a lot of permanents. I'm on the fence about if this card has a place in Ayli, because it can cause a lot of damage, but is it better than what Ayli already has?
Grind // Dust would be a fun companion card to Black Sun's Zenith, if Grind // Dust were already in your graveyard. If someone chose to run Contagion Engine for some reason, it would also be nice following that, as well. By itself, it's 4WB just to exile two creatures, which is pretty awful, and the front end isn't something we really care about. I only mention it as it's deceptive, really. It looks more powerful than it is
(Also known as Xenphire)
WB Ayli, Eternal Recursion WB - GUPir and Toothy GU - WBR Mathas, Fiend SeekerWBR
As usual it's getting tougher and tougher to make cuts and switches in the main build
I think Rune-scarred Demon has to stay simply because redundancy is great with tutors and he does it entering the battlefield and is a good reanimation target.
The two I'm looking at are Kaya, Ghost Assassin and Sorin, Grim Nemesis. I'm leaning towards Kaya, because while she hasn't been awful, over time I haven't been as impressed with her as I had hoped. I'm finding that I would rather being doing a lot of other things at any given time, or would have rather drawn something else. The only reason I was considering Sorin was because of his high mana cost. I do like his +1 ability, but for the sake of efficiency and considering what each of them do, Razaketh wins out in that regard.
I suppose it's worth mentioning that I've been considering Approach of the Second Sun, as well! Since the addition of Scroll Rack it's been rather easy to manipulate the top of the library in concert with Sensei's Divining Top, not to mention the amount of tutors the main build runs
(Also known as Xenphire)
I haven't totally finished my deck yet, but I had a question. Since I'm focusing on lifegain/draining for this deck, one of the cards I planned for my 99 was Serra Avatar. It seems like it has good potential, but I want to be sure before I try it: Say I have 100 life and I sacrifice the Avatar to Ayli's first skill. Would I gain 100 life from that as it's toughness would be 100, tied to my life total, or would it be zero as it's a * amount? Because if it works like I hope it does, it'd have a Beacon of Immortality effect that pairs beautifully with Sanguine Bond or Vizkopa Guildmage. A shame you can't really do any recursion shenanigans with it, though.
Is that how it works, or am I just crazy?
WB Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim | WBR Queen Marchesa | WUBR Breya, Etherium Shaper
Modern:
/ Death and Taxes | W/ Soul Sisters | Spirits | U Faeries | Tempered Steel Affinity