I was surprised there was very little in-depth discussion on Noyan Dar as I have been playing him since release to great success. I put together a little write up, inspired by the primer format, on my opinions on the commander and share my deck, hopefully provoking some discussion around him and the cards in this kind of deck.
Noyan Dar as I see it is very much a deck that appeases both Timmy and Mel personality types, which also bringing a level of competitiveness that spikes can respect. It plays like a draw go control deck, however frequently has the largest creature on the board, and is very hard to attack profitably even when the creature land(s) are tapped from an attack previously.
Addressing Concerns about losing lands
Most peoples biggest concern when seeing Noyan Dar's Ability is putting their lands on the line, ripe for removal, however these lands are surprisingly resilient. Between dodging things like Terastodon and Cyclonic Rifts, land creature can be an impressively resistant card type combination, many premier removal in the format is aimed at nonland permanents because of the versatility that line of text provides, cards like Oblivion Ring, Abrupt Decay, Utter End, Council's Judgement, and Maelstrom Pulse are all examples, and that is before we talk about noncreature removal. Even then, if people are packing Wasteland, or other land destruction effects, more often than not it has a small little clause for only hitting nonbasics. This leaves only creature removal, which people are more often going to point at creatures that are not vanilla X/X's but also cards like Acidic Slime, Strip Mine and Ghost Quarter.
This leaves traditional boardwipes. This in itself is dealt with in three ways. The first of which is via control magic, having a counterspell available to protect your lands. However, secondly and more frequently, you are the one casting the boardwipe to clear the board to remove blockers and swing for large amounts of damage. Lastly there are a few cards that allow you to protect you lands from destruction, which will be covered later.
The deck frequently plays a Draw Go style game, the first few turns are used to can various setup spells for the rest of the game, using cantrips to find an initial set of answers to the board, like targeted removal and a counter spell, as well as ensure the deck hits all it's land drops, which is the decks most valuable resource. After that you play a soft control style game where you try and build up around 20 power in your lands or 7 spells.
When animating lands, often I wont look to animate a single land above a 12/12, where it can come out on top of most of the field, however eldrazi or other creatures may push this number higher. I will also invest more heavily into a single land, if my mana base has not developed as much as I had hoped. It is also worth considering animating lands until they are 15/15, as then they dodge common spells, like Tragic Slip and Blasphemous Act.
When choosing a land to animate, the first choice is usually Darksteel Citidel followed by any basic land. Very rarely do I find myself needing to animate my manlands unless it is an Inkmoth Nexus to remove a problematic player from the game, or I need an evasive threat to deal with a planeswalker.
Notable Exceptions
Sol Ring: This is a just personal opinion, that it should be banned, and I follow through with this in my deck lists. If you want to, run it in the list.
Land Tax: This was an interesting cut, but most of the time the deck had little issue making land drop's and maintaining card advantage, so the card was cut as it didn't add anything, except be a bad draw late in the game.
Sun Titan: The card was too mana incentive for a sorcery speed play in the deck, and recurring land while useful, was unreliable and not the testament to the power of the card.
Core Cards
These are the cards that I feel should be the basis of any Noyan Dar deck. These are the over performers of my deck, and usually very happy to see. I will avoid the cards that are traditionally strong cards in control, and more on the cards that are unique to this kind of deck.
Tragic Arrogance : Any Noyan Dar deck list is incomplete without this card. The nonland clause means that your land creatures are untouched but also due to the permanent light approach of the deck means that it frequently only has one creature (Noyan Dar) and one enchantment that can be sacrificed making it a very efficient one sided board-wipe. If I am tutoring for a boardwipe, this is my first port of call.
Notable interactions with this is that you can choose the same permanent multiple times, Artifact creatures are often subject to this.
Muddle the Mixture: This spell is versatile in its ability to get almost any card in the deck. It can get protection for your lands like Sacred Ground and Trade Routes, but also can be used to find a CMC 2 answer, or be used to chain Merchant Scroll into either Mystical Tutor or a blue instant to solve a problem. It's strength is in it's ability to do anything the deck needs it to, which also being a counterspell.
Quicken and Scout's Warning: These seems like a strange choice, when you consider the card's that they pair with make a measly 17 cards in the list, however both the ability to cast Noyan Dar during end step and untap with him, along with instant speed boardwipes are powerful effects. Also at worse they draw a card, which is not a bad thing.
Vanish Into Memory: This card is a 4 mana draw 6 at instant speed 90% of the time, as the land will have no toughness when it returns to the battlefield. But is also flexible in it's ability to protect you from a massive threat, or a land from removal.
View from Above: This is an interesting inclusion for me, originally I was not sold on the card, however a friend gave me a copy and told me to run it. Sold. It's a repeatable source of evasion and pump, the downside of requiring a white permanent to return to hand, is fine as most of the time this is cast, Noyan Dar will be on the field to enable it.
Inkmoth Nexus: This is a necessary evil of the deck, I don't enjoy using it to win games, but frequently it is necessary to make it quick. An important thing of note, is that Noyan Dars animated lands have haste, so frequently this will kill a player the turn it comes down, when combined with three spells to make a "combo" style kill. Also never making the mistake of animating it before swinging as it will lose haste, but also don't pump it after animation, as it will lose infect and flying.
These are the various ways unique to the deck to protect it's lands, outside of traditional counterspells.
Sacred Ground: Often my go to removal, especially against both eldrazi and mind control style decks. I have managed to get eldrazi players to attack me, just so I can cast larger Sphinx's Revelation as the land returns untapped.
Terra Eternal: Unlike Sacred Ground, this is a double edge sword. Protecting you opponent's problematic lands from removal is often something that can come back to bite you if you are not careful. However it also protects you in a better fashion that Sacred Ground against board-wipes.
Teferi's Response: This card is playable for the first line of text alone. The next two just make the card absurd in the context of the deck.
Trade Routes: Bouncing lands is not the most preferable way to protect them, as land drops are scare. However being able to abuse ETB effects from Zendikar Spell lands, and also turn land heavy hand's into action is a big benefit to the deck. Also if you have a Crucible of Worlds it turns into a power value engine.
Future Additions
The following are cards that could or should be in the deck list, however I do not have access to them due to availability or price.
Celestial Colonnade: I'm not sure if the deck wants this card, as between the board-wipes and other souces of evasion, I don't think it is worth risking investing triggers on a nonbasic land that doesn't protect itself.
Crucible of Worlds: I'm not sure if the deck wants this card, as it already hits it's land drops reliably. It would however allow the deck to run less lands, especially if paired with more fetch lands.
Force of Will: The deck is reasonable mana constrained, due to having to invest it mana sources as threats, so a free counterspell, that can also allow you to protect you command the turn he comes down would be a huge boon to the deck.
Snap: A "free" counterspell, that can also be used to untap your creatures if someone attacks you.
TODO: Weak cards in the list and what I am looking at cutting.
22/05/16
Cuts:
1x Dissipate
1x Exclude
1x Clockspinning
1x Hinder
1x Into the Roil
1x Scatter to the Winds
1x Time Stop
1x To Arms!
1x Tranquil Cove
1x Plains
1x Leyline of Anticipation
1x Archaeomancer
1x Disciple of the Ring
1x Heliod, God of the Sun
1x Crush of Tentacles
1x Planar Outburst
1x Pull from the Deep
1x Spelltwine
What do you feel about Narset Transcendent and extra turn effects? I use Narset for mine because of double-cast effect she grants (and draws), and extra turn effect let you create creature while giving them at least one chance to attack.
The deck plays like a draw go control deck with a lot of the deck operating at instant speed, so spending 4 mana and then following up with a spells that will be 2 or more mana on your turn feels like a bad idea, and it doesn't generate enough advantage most of the time to justify it. This is the very reason the deck doesn't play Sun Titan, as it requires the deck to tap out on it's turn, as it would much rather use excess mana on the end step of the previous player.
If we add extra turn effects to the mix, we are adding spells that cost 5 or more mana, which puts us at the top of our curve, and often wont be much more than an explore for the deck. If we want to attack with our lands, a boardwipe or VfO will allow me to swing in for damage and if we want to keep them for blocking, the threat of a frantic search or other similar untap effect can act as a rattlesnake deterrent and also vigilance effects are better value for mana, as well as tutorable off muddle the mixture.
Arcane Melee and Jace's Sanctum imho should be auto include, as You can lower spell costs with ease. Just like Sapphire Medallion.
The problem with VfO is that blue archetype makes Your land creature lose fly ability (and this archetype is a staple in my play group), so what do You think about Slip Through Space, Distortion Strike and Taigam's Strike? Two of them got rebound, so it's a free cast and all of them gives unblockable, which is amazing.
Also Azorious Guildmage is important in every UWx shell, as You can counter activated abilities. I try to keep my creature count as low as possible (only three with Noyan, Tarland and Guildmage), but another creature I would add is Mother of Runes for the repeatable protection. My friend suggested me Deadeye Navigator with Archeomancer, but I would much rather add Eldrazi Displacer (if I would pay on higher creature count).
Have You ever encountered sacrificing attacking creature? This is why I play both Tarland and Rise from the Tides, as it allows me to attack with more than one creature without endangering another land.
To Your protection theme I would add Darksteel Mutation. Some of my spells got proliferate and I still have to get my copy of Tolaria West for more fetching power. Sure it will become only insect, without land type, but once You get him like 20/20 and have handful of counters, You can battle anything. To face the loss of spell empowering, add Inexorable Tide.
Sol Ring should be banned much harder than Prophet of Kruphix imho, but the rest of mana rocks are good options. I tend to have slower starts, but I never cast Noyan without at least one counter spell to protect him
Arcane Melee and Jace's Sanctum I feel are a tad too mana incentive for the deck, the curve for the deck ends at ~4 mana, with only Planar Cleansing, Tragic Arrogance and Mystic Confluence filling out what is left (Delve cards don't count). Sapphire Medallion however is actually a solid consideration and I may pick one up to test with.
I have not encountered the Blue Archetype myself, so I don't have this issue. If I want to play with those style of cards, I would look at Shadow Rift, Artful Dodge and Slip Through Space. Anything that replaces itself, and the second cast is on call rather than on the second turn.
Azorious Guildmage is interesting, but I currently have both Squelch and Stifle in the list to deal with activated abilities. Mother of Runes is an interesting suggestion, I actually really like the idea, will need to grab a copy to test with.
Deadeye + Archeomancer is more mana than I would like, and Deadeye is a dead card without the Archeomancer. I dont think either are worth running, when I could run card draw instead.
Darksteel Mutation is interesting, but ultimately I don't think it is worth is on a land for the indestructible. Inexarable Tide I have played with, and most of the time it was a dead card in hand as I wanted to be doing something else, like hold up mana for counter-spells.
The deck plays like Draw Go control, and most of the time it can't afford to tap out and play an enchantment at 4 or 5 mana just to make its' spells cheaper, when the enchantment itself is more expensive than the spells that it is discounting. Its not something that can really come down until the deck has a minimum of 7 mana, where it can cast it an another spell or two, in which case it can play 2-3 spells a turn anyway and the discount doesn't do much I feel. I also don't want to help my opponents do things that their deck wants to do, I would rather run cards like Hushwing Gryff that interfer with my opponents plays.
Flying and Draw a card is not as good as unblockable or shadow, and draw a card like I list above. Most of the time either VfO or a boardwipe does more than enough to ensure my lands can connect anyway.
Usually attack mode for me is when they don't have fliers and can't race me, or after an asymmetrical boardwipe.
And how is Runechanter's Pike working for You? Was thinking about adding it to my deck. But I wonder if it would be much of a power up
It hard to say, for the most part I have never been too unhappy to draw it, outside of the first few turns.
I have a hard time recommending the card, as often it is not relevant due to Noyan Dar being able to stick to the board. However I feel as well that if I remove it I will miss having access to it as a win condition if I can't land another payoff card like Talrand to the field. So far it has only been a card that has cut down a clock significantly, for a reasonable amount of mana for the deck. Suiting up Inkmoth for lethal amounts. Another thing is that it makes Commander Damage a legitimate threat.
I ran that for a while, the problem is that you need to jump through hoops to enable it. Very often it was a dead card in hand due to the deck only having 15 basics and when it did work, the payoff was not worth the effort.
People make the argument of restoring destroyed lands, and I do priorities animating basics, however the lands that do get animated are often hard to kill, and even then rarely make it to the graveyard.
Cyclonic Rift also says "opponents control"... O-Stone and Perilous Vault say nonland
I am aware, its just very popular on the other side of the table and does nothing to save one from a lethal land. It was more a play on how much some people like to complain about the card.
Yeah, that is very much slower than my current build.
I also picked up a copy of Mother of Runes and Sapphire Medallion to test with, however have not got to play with them yet. The have replaced Brave the Sands and Quiet Contemplation for testing.
I am thinking about building this guy, I might try Humility.
..
I do like the idea, it can close out a game with a few counters on a land. Similarly Godhead of Awe is worth considering for that plan, however doesn't hit abilities and is more prone to removal as a creature.
Its a creature that grants evasion, which is nice. However there are 0 regrow targets in the deck and we can get better evasion or clear away blockers through the decks spells.
On the Aven there are two other big issues with it is that it does nothing the turn it comes down and it is a sorcery speed play. Another thing it typically you will have one land animated, maybe two the later the game goes. But the Aven does not have any real payoff after the first trigger.
Chancery was never worth the temp loss for the functional card it provided as a Karoo, while Maze of Ith hopefully adds some defensive utility to the deck.
Quicken was also often a deck card as the deck does not run much interaction at sorcery speed, and hence just can-tripped. I replaced it with Peer Through Depths to help dig for the cards we need instead.
EDIT: One concern at the moment is the number of colourless sources the deck currently runs, I may look at replacing some of the colourless nonbasics with basics in the near future.
EDIT2: And tapped lands.
What do you think of Talent of the Telepath? It's potentially a three-spells-for-one that triggers Noyan multiple times.
Too unreliable, by itself it does nothing. If I was looking to abuse opponents graveyards with cards like reanimate or similar. But the potential additional cast triggers are not worth it as I have never had an issue with growing my lands.
It's a sorcery, and expensive. It is also reliant on there being spells in both mine and another players graveyard, but that is less of an issue. The cards in the deck that cost more than 4 mana are the commander, board wipes, or delve. And since I last updated the list, I have cut Talrad. Which cuts the most expensive sorcery speed cards in the deck down two three mana, outside of the exceptions outlined earlier. Also as I said above, the triple trigger is not too relevant, as I have never had issues growing my lands.
Just wanted to say this has quickly become my favorite deck since I saw your topic. Some changes I made are adding the 2 Gearhulks. They may seem top heavy but I've been adjusting from your list and being able to enlightened tutor for them is key. They're very high impact. The fact that they work wonders with Academy Ruins is icing. The only creatures I'm running now are Hushwing and those two a as my list has become really reactive over time. I kept the mass board wipes like Planar Outburst and Cleansing mainly due to my meta. I also replaced Stifle with Trickbind to neuter combos. Just my 2 cents, all in all the deck is just great regardless of your direction.
I also have the two gearhulks in my current build. I have also been meaning to pick up a copy of enlightened and academy ruins with their addition but have not found one for trade yet :(. That said, I will have to experiment with ruins in regards to the number of colourless lands that I include in the deck. I have not been able to really play Noyan Dar recently, due to fiddling around with other decks (Mainly Kambal), and most recently Breya.
The list in the main post is actually quite out of date, and I tend to keep the TappedOut copy (here) more up to date.
Thoughts on All Is Dust? With most of our creatures being colorless land creatures, it will frequently function as a Plague Wind that gets around indestructible.
7 mana I think is getting a tad bit too much. It would work a lot better in a deck that abuses artifact mana like Sol Ring, however I explicitly don't. Finding a board wipe that is one sided is not hard for the deck. I have access to Cataclysmic Gearhulk, Tragic Arrogance, Planar Cleansing and Cyclonic Rift for asymmetry. If I was looking to replace one of my cards it would be planar cleansing, which is to trade the triple white cost for an additional mana.
One thing I will say is that I am not a fan of All is Dust not hitting mana rocks, as compared to other decks at the table, I do not field as many so not hitting them to create a pseudo mana parity is also a downside compared to cards like planar cleansing that does hit their rocks.
On the lightning greaves side of things. It does not protect him from board wipes, and often held up mana does a very good job of protecting him. Most of the time I would much rather the greaves be a counterspell, as that has more utility. Giving haste also has very little relevance.
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—Noyan Dar, Tazeem lullmage
Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper
I was surprised there was very little in-depth discussion on Noyan Dar as I have been playing him since release to great success. I put together a little write up, inspired by the primer format, on my opinions on the commander and share my deck, hopefully provoking some discussion around him and the cards in this kind of deck.
Noyan Dar as I see it is very much a deck that appeases both Timmy and Mel personality types, which also bringing a level of competitiveness that spikes can respect. It plays like a draw go control deck, however frequently has the largest creature on the board, and is very hard to attack profitably even when the creature land(s) are tapped from an attack previously.
Addressing Concerns about losing lands
Most peoples biggest concern when seeing Noyan Dar's Ability is putting their lands on the line, ripe for removal, however these lands are surprisingly resilient. Between dodging things like Terastodon and Cyclonic Rifts, land creature can be an impressively resistant card type combination, many premier removal in the format is aimed at nonland permanents because of the versatility that line of text provides, cards like Oblivion Ring, Abrupt Decay, Utter End, Council's Judgement, and Maelstrom Pulse are all examples, and that is before we talk about noncreature removal. Even then, if people are packing Wasteland, or other land destruction effects, more often than not it has a small little clause for only hitting nonbasics. This leaves only creature removal, which people are more often going to point at creatures that are not vanilla X/X's but also cards like Acidic Slime, Strip Mine and Ghost Quarter.
This leaves traditional boardwipes. This in itself is dealt with in three ways. The first of which is via control magic, having a counterspell available to protect your lands. However, secondly and more frequently, you are the one casting the boardwipe to clear the board to remove blockers and swing for large amounts of damage. Lastly there are a few cards that allow you to protect you lands from destruction, which will be covered later.
Play this deck if:
Don't Play this deck if:
1x Anticipate
1x Blue Sun's Zenith
1x Brainstorm
1x Dig Through Time
1x Fact or Fiction
1x Frantic Search
1x Hallowed Moonlight
1x Impulse
1x Misdirection
1x Muddle the Mixture
1x Mystic Confluence
1x Mystical Tutor
1x Path to Exile
1x Peer Through Depths
1x Rapid Hybridization
1x Repulse
1x Return to Dust
1x Rewind
1x Scout's Warning
1x Sphinx's Revelation
1x Squelch
1x Stubborn Denial
1x Swords to Plowshares
1x Teferi's Response
1x Telling Time
1x Tithe
1x Vanish into Memory
1x View from Above
1x Disdainful Stroke
1x Submerge
1x Memory Lapse
1x Cyclonic Rift
1x Swan Song
1x Render Silent
1x Stifle
1x Deprive
1x Dismantling Blow
1x Mental Misstep
1x Counterspell
1x Aetherize
1x Azorius Chancery
1x Blighted Cataract
1x Darksteel Citadel
1x Evolving Wilds
1x Faerie Conclave
1x Flagstones of Trokair
1x Flood Plain
1x Flooded Strand
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Glacial Fortress
1x Halimar Depths
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Inkmoth Nexus
9x Island
1x Myriad Landscape
1x Nimbus Maze
6x Plains
1x Prairie Stream
1x Reliquary Tower
1x Rogue's Passage
1x Seachrome Coast
1x Skyline Cascade
1x Temple of Enlightenment
1x Terrain Generator
1x Terramorphic Expanse
1x Tolaria West
1x Maze of Ith
Enchantments
1x Sacred Ground
1x Terra Eternal
1x Trade Routes
1x Monastery Mentor
1x Hushwing Gryff
1x Talrand, Sky Summoner
1x Weathered Wayfarer
1x Mother of Runes
Sorcery
1x Compulsive Research
1x Merchant Scroll
1x Planar Cleansing
1x Ponder
1x Preordain
1x Revoke Existence
1x Tragic Arrogance
1x Treasure Cruise
Artifact
1x Runechanter's Pike
1x Pristine Talisman
1x Azorious Signet
1x Sapphire Medallion
Play Style
The deck frequently plays a Draw Go style game, the first few turns are used to can various setup spells for the rest of the game, using cantrips to find an initial set of answers to the board, like targeted removal and a counter spell, as well as ensure the deck hits all it's land drops, which is the decks most valuable resource. After that you play a soft control style game where you try and build up around 20 power in your lands or 7 spells.
When animating lands, often I wont look to animate a single land above a 12/12, where it can come out on top of most of the field, however eldrazi or other creatures may push this number higher. I will also invest more heavily into a single land, if my mana base has not developed as much as I had hoped. It is also worth considering animating lands until they are 15/15, as then they dodge common spells, like Tragic Slip and Blasphemous Act.
When choosing a land to animate, the first choice is usually Darksteel Citidel followed by any basic land. Very rarely do I find myself needing to animate my manlands unless it is an Inkmoth Nexus to remove a problematic player from the game, or I need an evasive threat to deal with a planeswalker.
Notable Exceptions
Core Cards
These are the cards that I feel should be the basis of any Noyan Dar deck. These are the over performers of my deck, and usually very happy to see. I will avoid the cards that are traditionally strong cards in control, and more on the cards that are unique to this kind of deck.
These are the various ways unique to the deck to protect it's lands, outside of traditional counterspells.
- Sacred Ground: Often my go to removal, especially against both eldrazi and mind control style decks. I have managed to get eldrazi players to attack me, just so I can cast larger Sphinx's Revelation as the land returns untapped.
- Terra Eternal: Unlike Sacred Ground, this is a double edge sword. Protecting you opponent's problematic lands from removal is often something that can come back to bite you if you are not careful. However it also protects you in a better fashion that Sacred Ground against board-wipes.
- Teferi's Response: This card is playable for the first line of text alone. The next two just make the card absurd in the context of the deck.
- Trade Routes: Bouncing lands is not the most preferable way to protect them, as land drops are scare. However being able to abuse ETB effects from Zendikar Spell lands, and also turn land heavy hand's into action is a big benefit to the deck. Also if you have a Crucible of Worlds it turns into a power value engine.
The following are cards that could or should be in the deck list, however I do not have access to them due to availability or price.
TODO: Weak cards in the list and what I am looking at cutting.
22/05/16
Cuts:
1x Dissipate
1x Exclude
1x Clockspinning
1x Hinder
1x Into the Roil
1x Scatter to the Winds
1x Time Stop
1x To Arms!
1x Tranquil Cove
1x Plains
1x Leyline of Anticipation
1x Archaeomancer
1x Disciple of the Ring
1x Heliod, God of the Sun
1x Crush of Tentacles
1x Planar Outburst
1x Pull from the Deep
1x Spelltwine
Additions:
1x Disdainful Stroke
1x Submerge
1x Memory Lapse
1x Cyclonic Rift
1x Swan Song
1x Render Silent
1x Stifle
1x Deprive
1x Dismantling Blow
1x Mental Misstep
1x Counterspell
1x Aetherize
2x Island
1x Brave the Sands
1x Monastery Mentor
1x Hushwing Gryff
1x Pristine Talisman
1x Azorious Signet
20/06/2016
Additions:
1x Mother of Runes
1x Sapphire Medallion
1x Maze of Ith
1x Peer Through Depths
Cuts:
1x Azorius Chancery
1x Brave the Sands
1x Quiet Contemplation
1x Quicken
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
If we add extra turn effects to the mix, we are adding spells that cost 5 or more mana, which puts us at the top of our curve, and often wont be much more than an explore for the deck. If we want to attack with our lands, a boardwipe or VfO will allow me to swing in for damage and if we want to keep them for blocking, the threat of a frantic search or other similar untap effect can act as a rattlesnake deterrent and also vigilance effects are better value for mana, as well as tutorable off muddle the mixture.
Arcane Melee and Jace's Sanctum I feel are a tad too mana incentive for the deck, the curve for the deck ends at ~4 mana, with only Planar Cleansing, Tragic Arrogance and Mystic Confluence filling out what is left (Delve cards don't count). Sapphire Medallion however is actually a solid consideration and I may pick one up to test with.
I have not encountered the Blue Archetype myself, so I don't have this issue. If I want to play with those style of cards, I would look at Shadow Rift, Artful Dodge and Slip Through Space. Anything that replaces itself, and the second cast is on call rather than on the second turn.
Azorious Guildmage is interesting, but I currently have both Squelch and Stifle in the list to deal with activated abilities. Mother of Runes is an interesting suggestion, I actually really like the idea, will need to grab a copy to test with.
Deadeye + Archeomancer is more mana than I would like, and Deadeye is a dead card without the Archeomancer. I dont think either are worth running, when I could run card draw instead.
Darksteel Mutation is interesting, but ultimately I don't think it is worth is on a land for the indestructible. Inexarable Tide I have played with, and most of the time it was a dead card in hand as I wanted to be doing something else, like hold up mana for counter-spells.
Flying and Draw a card is not as good as unblockable or shadow, and draw a card like I list above. Most of the time either VfO or a boardwipe does more than enough to ensure my lands can connect anyway.
Usually attack mode for me is when they don't have fliers and can't race me, or after an asymmetrical boardwipe.
It hard to say, for the most part I have never been too unhappy to draw it, outside of the first few turns.
I have a hard time recommending the card, as often it is not relevant due to Noyan Dar being able to stick to the board. However I feel as well that if I remove it I will miss having access to it as a win condition if I can't land another payoff card like Talrand to the field. So far it has only been a card that has cut down a clock significantly, for a reasonable amount of mana for the deck. Suiting up Inkmoth for lethal amounts. Another thing is that it makes Commander Damage a legitimate threat.
Also it is a Muddle the mixture target.
GGG [Primer] Omnath, Big Green Beatstick Machine GGG
I ran that for a while, the problem is that you need to jump through hoops to enable it. Very often it was a dead card in hand due to the deck only having 15 basics and when it did work, the payoff was not worth the effort.
People make the argument of restoring destroyed lands, and I do priorities animating basics, however the lands that do get animated are often hard to kill, and even then rarely make it to the graveyard.
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I am aware, its just very popular on the other side of the table and does nothing to save one from a lethal land. It was more a play on how much some people like to complain about the card.
Yeah, that is very much slower than my current build.
I also picked up a copy of Mother of Runes and Sapphire Medallion to test with, however have not got to play with them yet. The have replaced Brave the Sands and Quiet Contemplation for testing.
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Azusa - Derevi - Glissa - Mizzix - Sharuum - Wanderer - Wort
I do like the idea, it can close out a game with a few counters on a land. Similarly Godhead of Awe is worth considering for that plan, however doesn't hit abilities and is more prone to removal as a creature.
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Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsIts a creature that grants evasion, which is nice. However there are 0 regrow targets in the deck and we can get better evasion or clear away blockers through the decks spells.
On the Aven there are two other big issues with it is that it does nothing the turn it comes down and it is a sorcery speed play. Another thing it typically you will have one land animated, maybe two the later the game goes. But the Aven does not have any real payoff after the first trigger.
Chancery was never worth the temp loss for the functional card it provided as a Karoo, while Maze of Ith hopefully adds some defensive utility to the deck.
Quicken was also often a deck card as the deck does not run much interaction at sorcery speed, and hence just can-tripped. I replaced it with Peer Through Depths to help dig for the cards we need instead.
EDIT: One concern at the moment is the number of colourless sources the deck currently runs, I may look at replacing some of the colourless nonbasics with basics in the near future.
EDIT2: And tapped lands.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Too unreliable, by itself it does nothing. If I was looking to abuse opponents graveyards with cards like reanimate or similar. But the potential additional cast triggers are not worth it as I have never had an issue with growing my lands.
It's a sorcery, and expensive. It is also reliant on there being spells in both mine and another players graveyard, but that is less of an issue. The cards in the deck that cost more than 4 mana are the commander, board wipes, or delve. And since I last updated the list, I have cut Talrad. Which cuts the most expensive sorcery speed cards in the deck down two three mana, outside of the exceptions outlined earlier. Also as I said above, the triple trigger is not too relevant, as I have never had issues growing my lands.
Combo-Free Kiki-Jiki
The list in the main post is actually quite out of date, and I tend to keep the TappedOut copy (here) more up to date.
Also no Lightning Greaves to protect Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper?
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
One thing I will say is that I am not a fan of All is Dust not hitting mana rocks, as compared to other decks at the table, I do not field as many so not hitting them to create a pseudo mana parity is also a downside compared to cards like planar cleansing that does hit their rocks.
On the lightning greaves side of things. It does not protect him from board wipes, and often held up mana does a very good job of protecting him. Most of the time I would much rather the greaves be a counterspell, as that has more utility. Giving haste also has very little relevance.