I don't know. I guess I never had much luck getting the land untappers + the charger at the same time, or really have enough mana to afford to attack again without waiting a turn. Maybe you've had more luck with it, but I never wanted to see it.
I put Carpet of Flowers back in for now. Either that or it's the hydra. Probably the carpet because blue is picking itself back up.
Oh yeah, because it was $16 where I was at, I picked up a Chandra, Torch of Defiance for the hell of it. I tried it exactly once for the hell of it, didn't expect it to get anywhere, and it didn't.
The big thing about Saskia, the Unyielding compared to Xenagos is that while your board does the same damage output to the player you choose, you would still need haste enablers and ways to get through blockers.
The toughness pump really makes your guys impossible to effectively trade for the enemy. Even if they do have something with deathtouch, they are still losing half of their life total to trample.
After playing a few more games and looking into what's been causing me to lose, I've been looking into recent options that we have.
I would actually like to test out Regal Behemoth. As Selvala as proven, giving a person a card every once in a while really isn't that bad (On the other hand wheels in decks like these aren't exactly the most ideal)... I always believe that you can ALWAYS use more mana (and more cards), and the fact that you can essentially threaten whoever took the monarch from you with a decent amount of damage makes taking the title back a little easier. The main downside is its low damage output, but we play cards that are 5 power and they work because they provide the setup for being able to take over multiple opponents in rapid bursts, as doing 120 damage is a very tall order in a short amount of time, time enough for the other decks to get advantage over you. Greenwarden of Murasa is likely the cut for this, as the current roster of 7-drops generally have too much damage output or other desirable features.
I would also like to try out Frenzied Fugue. My main issue with most threaten effects is that they are mainly only effective against voltron decks and there is no guarantee that you can get them in one hit or draw multiple copies of a threaten effect. This is better because you can get the card every turn making it like a red version of a Confiscate. Speaking of which, this card can enchant permanents and so it has additional utility. It will likely replace Strionic Resonator.
Lastly, I would like to try Conqueror's Flail, but I'm wondering if the equip cost + equip in itself makes it a little too awkward for the deck. Still, the effect is desirable enough that attaching it to utility creatures is a fine play. It simply depends upon how much time I really have and how often I'll have a spare guy up for holding the thing. I don't know what I'll cut for this card.
They will be tested, and changes to the list will be made if they survive testing.
I also got my first "bad" Selvala's Stampede, although I need to see just how often that could happen and if the hit/miss ratio is acceptable. This deck is no stranger to playing potentially clunky cards that have enormous power ceilings when used right.
EDIT: I'm also seriously considering adding in Mirri's Guile because my current observations stem a lot on how important drawing the right card at the right time can be. Half of our ramp causes a shuffle which is also good for the card.
I.... am also a bit embarrassed that I forgot the card existed.
The big thing about Saskia, the Unyielding compared to Xenagos is that while your board does the same damage output to the player you choose, you would still need haste enablers and ways to get through blockers.
The toughness pump really makes your guys impossible to effectively trade for the enemy. Even if they do have something with deathtouch, they are still losing half of their life total to trample.
How do you guys feel about Veilstone Amulet? Could this be used instead of / in addition to Dense Foilage? It forces us to pay something before combat, but it also forces the opponent who might want to react to combat to do so before combat actually starts (and so they cannot instant speed remove the creature that Xenagod buffs that turn.) and it does not protect opponent's creatures from each other
Also, I really want to add Rishkar's Expertise am considering cutting Garruk for it as it always instantly dies when you use it. Agree? Or do you think other cards should go instead?
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
Veilstone Amulet is actually interesting. It does force us to play stuff before combat, but it makes playing consecutive creatures more appealing.
I already cut Garruk for something ages ago, and so Rishkar's Expertise is amazingly good.
My current list is in flux, which is why I won't post update notes yet, but here are things to note about it:
I'm testing Nissa, Vastwood Seer. This is being done as a consistency tool to see how it goes.
I cut Giant Adephage and Selvala's Stampede. In a world where instant spot removal and counterspells are what you worry about, hexproof is so immensely important. The latter I cut because it's a six mana cheat spell. I don't have room for six mana utility anymore, especially with the new expertise taking the spot.
My thoughts on Monstrous Onslaught. It seems great as a one-sided boardwipe, but keep in mind the conditions required to use it. You need to have a big creature + 5 spare mana. That's a lot to ask for a reward that isn't better than Chandra's Ignition. At least you can still get the effect even if it dies in the process. I've realized that I need to cut down on the conditionality of some of the cards I might be running in here.
I haven't had too much time to pour into the deck, but I think I got the speed of it down very well. The sustainability of the deck however, is another issue. I'm at the point where I don't even regret jamming as much library manipulation as humanly possible because the deck flat out loses when you draw too many lands or don't hit the pieces that you need or want to hit.
It's not that the sustainability of the deck is bad. However, it is inconsistent and pretty much demands that you find certain cards each game. Also, some of the cards, while very powerful, demand that you actually meet the condition it sets forth (ie having an active big creature). This can either be very easy or very difficult depending on the amount of interaction that is gunning for your stuff alone. This is why I actually feel that the hexproof creatures have an increased value in the deck. I put Plated Crusher back in.
Also, you only really get value out of the deck from having a solidly-sized creature out. This is a huge disadvantage if you can't do so and so I decided that the number of "support" cards was actually too many. In my testing list I actually cut Strionic Resonator not because it was bad, but because it was the damage amplification card that was the least likely to "get there" by itself against a single opponent, while also costing mana to activate. I'm even to the point of readding Managorger Hydra. Yes, it's a bad topdeck. However, you can get immense value out of the damage to mana cost ratio of the card because of the internal synergies of the deck.
Emrakul may still seem questionable even to this day, but the fact of the matter is that I have found no better tool for trumping a disfavored mid-late game board state in these colors that still carry synergy with the deck. I'm always on the lookout for cards that can produce free implicit usefulness from being able to throw itself into the graveyard.
Other than that, people are still dead scared of the deck when they don't have the right protection for it and it can still do some massively powerful stuff.
If you want ultimate control of land drops, that would be Abundance, which has the upside of comboing with Sylvan Library to painlessly draw 3 cards a turn.
- Fauna Shaman (temporarily out for testing)
- Feldon of the Third Path (often felt clunky to use as it feels disadvantageous to play it early over other setup cards.
- Giant Adephage (replaced by a more needed 7-drop. Better to have that than this which can die before I get the token)
- Relic of Progenitus (fast combo is a bye for them to begin with. Other gy strategies I care less about unless they're looping something crazy.)
- Strionic Resonator (It's a solid card, but my ratio of support cards is too high and needs to be toned down a bit)
- Selvala's Stampede. Card is fun but it's a six mana cheat card, and I only have room for so many 6cmc cards in the deck.
- Farseek. It was the weakest of my ramp options and I have plenty of options.
- Forest
+ Cavern of Souls (I finally got one! Name God and make the permission players quake in having to hold spot removal or counterspellsfor every single threat.
+ Managorger Hydra (I need the extra beef. This one is cheap and threatens a metric ton of damage.)
+ Nissa, Vastwood Seer (CA is so desperately needed in this deck and most nonblue nonblack decks that I'm willing to try this.)
+ Vines of Vastwood (I'm testing this. Oftentimes my window of opportunity for going crazy simply goes down to stopping 1 piece of removal. Needing to hold up only 1 mana and also have the kicker option is relevant.
+ Plated Crusher
+ Rishkar's Expertise. I have not drawn it yet but I can only dream of insane plays. Imagine attacking with Savage Ventmaw into this and then getting an extra combat cast for free.
+ Mirri's Guile. (more library manipulation)
+ Arid Mesa
This is an excellent primer and is written very well. I am generally a control player but I've been looking for something fresh and exciting for me and this list is very enticing.
This is an excellent primer and is written very well. I am generally a control player but I've been looking for something fresh and exciting for me and this list is very enticing.
Is Rancor worthy of consideration? It offers trample to strong threats without it like Malignus and with Xenogos, it's essentially +4/0 for G.
Long story short: everything is geared toward getting Xenagod out asap, followed by a quick beater, then draw some cards to refuel. Oracle and Shaman are to slow.
I see why Rancor appears nice, but in my experience, you always need nearly all your mana for your creatures. If you don't play a creature then you have 5+ mana left and you can use Skarrg Rage Pits and/or Kessig Wolf Run. So Rancor is not in because you either can't cast it or it would be better if it was another card.
I am going to test Invigorate though. On a double striker, it;s 16 extra damage for free and could save a creature for free. Testing ought to show if it is not too much of a burden if you do not have acces to double strike
This is an excellent primer and is written very well. I am generally a control player but I've been looking for something fresh and exciting for me and this list is very enticing.
Is Rancor worthy of consideration? It offers trample to strong threats without it like Malignus and with Xenogos, it's essentially +4/0 for G.
Long story short: everything is geared toward getting Xenagod out asap, followed by a quick beater, then draw some cards to refuel. Oracle and Shaman are to slow.
I see why Rancor appears nice, but in my experience, you always need nearly all your mana for your creatures. If you don't play a creature then you have 5+ mana left and you can use Skarrg Rage Pits and/or Kessig Wolf Run. So Rancor is not in because you either can't cast it or it would be better if it was another card.
I am going to test Invigorate though. On a double striker, it;s 16 extra damage for free and could save a creature for free. Testing ought to show if it is not too much of a burden if you do not have acces to double strike
You are going for speed, however the fact of the matter is that you are generally up against 3 other players and therefore we can't make too many sacrifices in staying power to get that speed. That's why cards like Lotus Petal and Exploration need to be backed up by reliable ways of getting cards in order to mitigate any disadvantage or fuel them. Out of all of them, 1 drop mana dorks are the best option and honestly viable, however I ended up substituting Sylvan Scrying and Crop Rotation in because they can effectively double as mana ramp when you play Ancient Tomb in the list, allowing me to get more out of those slots.
Here are two new cards I'm actually quite glad to see show up for this deck.
1) Combat Celebrant. It's the cheapest viable extra combat card in the game! Now, as far as whether to classify it as a support piece or a threat, it is first and foremost a support piece. But as a secondary function it can also be a threat! As I've stated in previous pages, multi-functional cards are extremely valuable in a deck like there where you want to draw the correct ratio of certain cards.
This can be played as early as turn two and can get some decent chip damage in against players with no blockers. When you play Xenagod you can attack someone with an 8/5, and while it is possible for them to have enough stuff to kill it, oftentimes they either won't or that particular card is too valuable for them to trade off to an 8/5.
However, where it gets scary is that after Xenagod every potential big threat you play will pretty much one-shot them almost guaranteed if they don't stop it when it exerts. It's comparable to say a Blood Mist only it's mostly a one-use card but in exchange grants the damage threshold needed to take down someone from 40 health (or with a 6 power creature take them down to 4 life).
Nonetheless, it is possible you might have that and no other creatures out. Maybe the attrition game is wearing down this deck (and probably all the others too). In that case, it can still attack for a very respectable 24. While it doesn't have trample, when you have nothing else to do it's a THREE drop that can hit an open player for 24! It also makes for an excellent sac fodder for drawing cards so that you have the action to continue with more powerful threats. If you do have a Kessig Wolf Run or even a Skarrg, the Rage Pits (makes it attack for 10+20 trample!), it can kill players by itself. It's a support card that can potentially kill people. That is nuts for something that costs 3.
The only time it is actually poor is when you need an instant extra combat and you can't afford to give him the xenagod trigger to get that extra combat. Nonetheless, that's an acceptable downside when considering the upsides.
Okay, onto card #2.
2) Honored Hydra. It's a dumb fat beater with embalm. However, this deck forces people to answer you despite the fact that you play big dumb beaters! Its mana cost is highly advantageous for preventing Xenagod from being a creature for when you want to avoid it getting targeted and you literally get 2 threats for the price of one card! The embalm is also a cheap cost and can allow you to pull off same-turn draw or extra combat stunts that you otherwise would not be able to do. The only small downside is that it is a 6 power creature and not a 7 power creature, so an extra combat does not kill a person at 40 life. It plays very well with sac effects too.
As to cards to cut, probably Nissa honestly. I do like card advantage, but it is not guaranteed to get me at least 3 cards and I'd much rather play any of my other 3 drop creatures in this deck (Somberwald Sage, Tireless Tracker, Selvala, Heart of the Wilds) than play this card.
I'm probably cutting Greenwarden of Murasa as well. Even with the recursion advantage, it's kind of just too poor of a threat for it to matter that much when that's my only threat on turn 4 or 5. I have quite a bit of redundancy and I'd much rather have draw than recursion. Also, when I do want recursion it is often very much win-more.
After playing the deck a lot this past week, I don't know if I'm getting lucky, but it feels more consistent now.
I'm hitting the land drops I need at the right time, the library manipulation really helps find what I'm looking for. Also, my initial evaluation I feel where I felt like I had too many support cards and not enough threats was correct. Now I sometimes feel like I can keep pressure on my opponents even if they try to stop me. Cards like Vines of Vastwood seem to be fine, but you only need to draw one of those effects.
Usually, decks start consistently playing smoothly when an optimum balance of components is found. So you seem to be getting there, if you're not there already the new changes sound good
Just a small note. I misread a card. Combat Celebrant does not untap itself on triggering its extra combat. This means that it doesn't hit for 24 by itself.
However, it still makes the other things you play absolutely ridiculous.
I like combat celebrant, but it's more for decks going wide, I think. Isn't this deck all about going tall?
Honored hydra is a beautiful addition, however.
In my meta, greater sandwurm might be a worthwhile addition. I sometimes get chumped by utility guys and this guy makes that much more difficult, especially since I rarely attack with more than one creature at a time.
Did you ever consider Verdurous Gearhulk? I looked back a few pages and didn't see it mentioned. 8/8 Trample for 5 seems good, can also buff other beaters if the situation calls for it.
Also what about Kalonian Hydra? First attack he hits for 12, with extra combat he'd hit for 32 on the second swing. Without extra combat he'd be one shotting in 3 attacks.
Another thought is Phyrexian Dreadnought but he's prone to blowouts but can be "comboed" with Greater Good type effects at instant speed.
Personally, I'll continue testing Combat Celebrant and attempting to see if the extra 24-32 damage that his presence offers is enough. Keep in mind that as a 3 drop he still does contribute his share of chip damage and ensures that Xenagos will be doing something the turn he enters.
About Verdurous Gearhulk and Kalonian Hydra. These are workable additions to this deck, yet I like having my creatures either offer me some form of utility, advantage, or just plain be hard to kill (unless of course they are cheap to play). Additionally, these are 5 cmc creatures, meaning that it only matters if you plan on playing the threat before Xenagos for whatever reason. Otherwise, you are always playing it off curve.
How often are you hitting with more than one creature? I just played mine tonight and I had to make sure to keep my deck at one creature or I would have lost xenagos. I have to admit it was hilarious, though. 4 way game, the other players are playing w/x decks, I have a turn 3 xenagos into turn 4 siege behemoth and then a turn 5 blood mist. I wiped them out, one after another, and at the end of the game, the hands were revealed....3 stps, a PTE, and a condemn were in their hands....hexproof combat>spot removal! I loved it.
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I put Carpet of Flowers back in for now. Either that or it's the hydra. Probably the carpet because blue is picking itself back up.
Oh yeah, because it was $16 where I was at, I picked up a Chandra, Torch of Defiance for the hell of it. I tried it exactly once for the hell of it, didn't expect it to get anywhere, and it didn't.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
The big thing about Saskia, the Unyielding compared to Xenagos is that while your board does the same damage output to the player you choose, you would still need haste enablers and ways to get through blockers.
The toughness pump really makes your guys impossible to effectively trade for the enemy. Even if they do have something with deathtouch, they are still losing half of their life total to trample.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
I would actually like to test out Regal Behemoth. As Selvala as proven, giving a person a card every once in a while really isn't that bad (On the other hand wheels in decks like these aren't exactly the most ideal)... I always believe that you can ALWAYS use more mana (and more cards), and the fact that you can essentially threaten whoever took the monarch from you with a decent amount of damage makes taking the title back a little easier. The main downside is its low damage output, but we play cards that are 5 power and they work because they provide the setup for being able to take over multiple opponents in rapid bursts, as doing 120 damage is a very tall order in a short amount of time, time enough for the other decks to get advantage over you. Greenwarden of Murasa is likely the cut for this, as the current roster of 7-drops generally have too much damage output or other desirable features.
I would also like to try out Frenzied Fugue. My main issue with most threaten effects is that they are mainly only effective against voltron decks and there is no guarantee that you can get them in one hit or draw multiple copies of a threaten effect. This is better because you can get the card every turn making it like a red version of a Confiscate. Speaking of which, this card can enchant permanents and so it has additional utility. It will likely replace Strionic Resonator.
Lastly, I would like to try Conqueror's Flail, but I'm wondering if the equip cost + equip in itself makes it a little too awkward for the deck. Still, the effect is desirable enough that attaching it to utility creatures is a fine play. It simply depends upon how much time I really have and how often I'll have a spare guy up for holding the thing. I don't know what I'll cut for this card.
They will be tested, and changes to the list will be made if they survive testing.
I also got my first "bad" Selvala's Stampede, although I need to see just how often that could happen and if the hit/miss ratio is acceptable. This deck is no stranger to playing potentially clunky cards that have enormous power ceilings when used right.
EDIT: I'm also seriously considering adding in Mirri's Guile because my current observations stem a lot on how important drawing the right card at the right time can be. Half of our ramp causes a shuffle which is also good for the card.
I.... am also a bit embarrassed that I forgot the card existed.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Also, I really want to add Rishkar's Expertise am considering cutting Garruk for it as it always instantly dies when you use it. Agree? Or do you think other cards should go instead?
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
I already cut Garruk for something ages ago, and so Rishkar's Expertise is amazingly good.
My current list is in flux, which is why I won't post update notes yet, but here are things to note about it:
I'm testing Nissa, Vastwood Seer. This is being done as a consistency tool to see how it goes.
I cut Giant Adephage and Selvala's Stampede. In a world where instant spot removal and counterspells are what you worry about, hexproof is so immensely important. The latter I cut because it's a six mana cheat spell. I don't have room for six mana utility anymore, especially with the new expertise taking the spot.
I'm testing Vines of Vastwood and other cards of the sort.
And, as always, card draw is king.
I don't get to play the deck much anymore. You can only play a linear deck for so many iterations.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
GWKarametra - The MistveiledGW
GWR Marath - The Egg-laying Wool-Milk-Pig GWR
RBGrenzo - Restrained RakdosRB
UWRGBHorde of NotionsUWRGB
Retired: Karador, Ghost Chieftain | Rafiq of the Many | Animar, Soul of Elements | Maelstrom Wanderer
Why yes, yes it would
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
I haven't had too much time to pour into the deck, but I think I got the speed of it down very well. The sustainability of the deck however, is another issue. I'm at the point where I don't even regret jamming as much library manipulation as humanly possible because the deck flat out loses when you draw too many lands or don't hit the pieces that you need or want to hit.
It's not that the sustainability of the deck is bad. However, it is inconsistent and pretty much demands that you find certain cards each game. Also, some of the cards, while very powerful, demand that you actually meet the condition it sets forth (ie having an active big creature). This can either be very easy or very difficult depending on the amount of interaction that is gunning for your stuff alone. This is why I actually feel that the hexproof creatures have an increased value in the deck. I put Plated Crusher back in.
Also, you only really get value out of the deck from having a solidly-sized creature out. This is a huge disadvantage if you can't do so and so I decided that the number of "support" cards was actually too many. In my testing list I actually cut Strionic Resonator not because it was bad, but because it was the damage amplification card that was the least likely to "get there" by itself against a single opponent, while also costing mana to activate. I'm even to the point of readding Managorger Hydra. Yes, it's a bad topdeck. However, you can get immense value out of the damage to mana cost ratio of the card because of the internal synergies of the deck.
Emrakul may still seem questionable even to this day, but the fact of the matter is that I have found no better tool for trumping a disfavored mid-late game board state in these colors that still carry synergy with the deck. I'm always on the lookout for cards that can produce free implicit usefulness from being able to throw itself into the graveyard.
Other than that, people are still dead scared of the deck when they don't have the right protection for it and it can still do some massively powerful stuff.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
G Azusa, Wherever I May Roam
UG Rashmi Simic Power
WB Kambal Life Gain Kills
URG Maelstrom Wanderer Howdy
- Fauna Shaman (temporarily out for testing)
- Feldon of the Third Path (often felt clunky to use as it feels disadvantageous to play it early over other setup cards.
- Giant Adephage (replaced by a more needed 7-drop. Better to have that than this which can die before I get the token)
- Relic of Progenitus (fast combo is a bye for them to begin with. Other gy strategies I care less about unless they're looping something crazy.)
- Strionic Resonator (It's a solid card, but my ratio of support cards is too high and needs to be toned down a bit)
- Selvala's Stampede. Card is fun but it's a six mana cheat card, and I only have room for so many 6cmc cards in the deck.
- Farseek. It was the weakest of my ramp options and I have plenty of options.
- Forest
+ Cavern of Souls (I finally got one! Name God and make the permission players quake in having to hold spot removal or counterspellsfor every single threat.
+ Managorger Hydra (I need the extra beef. This one is cheap and threatens a metric ton of damage.)
+ Nissa, Vastwood Seer (CA is so desperately needed in this deck and most nonblue nonblack decks that I'm willing to try this.)
+ Vines of Vastwood (I'm testing this. Oftentimes my window of opportunity for going crazy simply goes down to stopping 1 piece of removal. Needing to hold up only 1 mana and also have the kicker option is relevant.
+ Plated Crusher
+ Rishkar's Expertise. I have not drawn it yet but I can only dream of insane plays. Imagine attacking with Savage Ventmaw into this and then getting an extra combat cast for free.
+ Mirri's Guile. (more library manipulation)
+ Arid Mesa
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
I haven't read this entire thread yet, but Why aren't you running more mana dorks (i.e Llanowar Elves, Elvish Mystic)? No Oracle of Mul Daya, Shaman of Forgotten Ways or Exploration?
Is Rancor worthy of consideration? It offers trample to strong threats without it like Malignus and with Xenogos, it's essentially +4/0 for G.
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
Long story short: everything is geared toward getting Xenagod out asap, followed by a quick beater, then draw some cards to refuel. Oracle and Shaman are to slow.
I see why Rancor appears nice, but in my experience, you always need nearly all your mana for your creatures. If you don't play a creature then you have 5+ mana left and you can use Skarrg Rage Pits and/or Kessig Wolf Run. So Rancor is not in because you either can't cast it or it would be better if it was another card.
I am going to test Invigorate though. On a double striker, it;s 16 extra damage for free and could save a creature for free. Testing ought to show if it is not too much of a burden if you do not have acces to double strike
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
If you care about speed, then I can't imagine why a green deck wouldn't run Exploration, Lotus Petal, Elvish Mystic, etc.
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
1) Combat Celebrant. It's the cheapest viable extra combat card in the game! Now, as far as whether to classify it as a support piece or a threat, it is first and foremost a support piece. But as a secondary function it can also be a threat! As I've stated in previous pages, multi-functional cards are extremely valuable in a deck like there where you want to draw the correct ratio of certain cards.
This can be played as early as turn two and can get some decent chip damage in against players with no blockers. When you play Xenagod you can attack someone with an 8/5, and while it is possible for them to have enough stuff to kill it, oftentimes they either won't or that particular card is too valuable for them to trade off to an 8/5.
However, where it gets scary is that after Xenagod every potential big threat you play will pretty much one-shot them almost guaranteed if they don't stop it when it exerts. It's comparable to say a Blood Mist only it's mostly a one-use card but in exchange grants the damage threshold needed to take down someone from 40 health (or with a 6 power creature take them down to 4 life).
Nonetheless, it is possible you might have that and no other creatures out. Maybe the attrition game is wearing down this deck (and probably all the others too). In that case, it can still attack for a very respectable 24. While it doesn't have trample, when you have nothing else to do it's a THREE drop that can hit an open player for 24! It also makes for an excellent sac fodder for drawing cards so that you have the action to continue with more powerful threats. If you do have a Kessig Wolf Run or even a Skarrg, the Rage Pits (makes it attack for 10+20 trample!), it can kill players by itself. It's a support card that can potentially kill people. That is nuts for something that costs 3.
The only time it is actually poor is when you need an instant extra combat and you can't afford to give him the xenagod trigger to get that extra combat. Nonetheless, that's an acceptable downside when considering the upsides.
Okay, onto card #2.
2) Honored Hydra. It's a dumb fat beater with embalm. However, this deck forces people to answer you despite the fact that you play big dumb beaters! Its mana cost is highly advantageous for preventing Xenagod from being a creature for when you want to avoid it getting targeted and you literally get 2 threats for the price of one card! The embalm is also a cheap cost and can allow you to pull off same-turn draw or extra combat stunts that you otherwise would not be able to do. The only small downside is that it is a 6 power creature and not a 7 power creature, so an extra combat does not kill a person at 40 life. It plays very well with sac effects too.
As to cards to cut, probably Nissa honestly. I do like card advantage, but it is not guaranteed to get me at least 3 cards and I'd much rather play any of my other 3 drop creatures in this deck (Somberwald Sage, Tireless Tracker, Selvala, Heart of the Wilds) than play this card.
I'm probably cutting Greenwarden of Murasa as well. Even with the recursion advantage, it's kind of just too poor of a threat for it to matter that much when that's my only threat on turn 4 or 5. I have quite a bit of redundancy and I'd much rather have draw than recursion. Also, when I do want recursion it is often very much win-more.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
I'm hitting the land drops I need at the right time, the library manipulation really helps find what I'm looking for. Also, my initial evaluation I feel where I felt like I had too many support cards and not enough threats was correct. Now I sometimes feel like I can keep pressure on my opponents even if they try to stop me. Cards like Vines of Vastwood seem to be fine, but you only need to draw one of those effects.
Also, these are my list's changes.
- Nissa, Vastwood Seer
- Greenwarden of Murasa
+ Combat Celebrant
+ Honored Hydra
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
However, it still makes the other things you play absolutely ridiculous.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
Honored hydra is a beautiful addition, however.
In my meta, greater sandwurm might be a worthwhile addition. I sometimes get chumped by utility guys and this guy makes that much more difficult, especially since I rarely attack with more than one creature at a time.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
Also what about Kalonian Hydra? First attack he hits for 12, with extra combat he'd hit for 32 on the second swing. Without extra combat he'd be one shotting in 3 attacks.
Another thought is Phyrexian Dreadnought but he's prone to blowouts but can be "comboed" with Greater Good type effects at instant speed.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
About Verdurous Gearhulk and Kalonian Hydra. These are workable additions to this deck, yet I like having my creatures either offer me some form of utility, advantage, or just plain be hard to kill (unless of course they are cheap to play). Additionally, these are 5 cmc creatures, meaning that it only matters if you plan on playing the threat before Xenagos for whatever reason. Otherwise, you are always playing it off curve.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!