On the subject of fun ETB cards, have you ever tested Warstorm Surge?
I have it slotted in my version but have yet to draw it, but I like it alot in theory
you will find in time no matter how good the card is, another creature is just so much better. Six mana is way too much. Massacre Wurm is much more deserving of a slot.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Think of Marchesa the same way people think about Animar, Soul of Elements. You can put a bunch of good stuff in and yes it is great, but synergy is what really matters. Warstorm Surge can easily be a dead card based on board state or open you up to more removal. Focusing creatures, your board becomes much much harder to deal with, only falling to removal or tuck. This can make you opponent's removal either dead cards or wasted mana in an attempt to take board status away from you. Don't take this as "run 48+ creatures", or that anything but a creature is bad in this deck, but there is just this false idea in commander that mana is abundant. Six mana is a huge strain even without a lot of counter magic (bluffing counter magic with open mana is a huge political move in commander) and you really want something that extends you that far to give you immediate impact upon cast or etb. Look to Rune's six drops and also consider some budget options like a fore mentioned Massacre Wurm or the set of titans like Grave Titan. I PROMISE you itll be a lot better, esp since I cannot think of a hand of other six cards that'd justify keeping Warstorm Surge instead of paris'ing it away, where as in a lot of games I'm pretty stoked to see Massacre Wurm or Preyseizer Dragon.
Anyone have thoughts on this card spoiled from Fate Reforged? Personally I'm always looking to find more ways to get counters.
Shaman of the Great Hunt
3R
Creature - Orc Shaman
Haste
Whenever a creature you control deals combat damage to a player, put a +1/+1 counter on it.
Ferocious — 2(G/U)(G/U): Draw a card for each creature you control with power 4 or greater.
4/2
Anyone have thoughts on this card spoiled from Fate Reforged? Personally I'm always looking to find more ways to get counters.
Shaman of the Great Hunt
3R
Creature - Orc Shaman
Haste
Whenever a creature you control deals combat damage to a player, put a +1/+1 counter on it.
Ferocious — 2(G/U)(G/U): Draw a card for each creature you control with power 4 or greater.
4/2
You can't run it in Marchesa. It's color identity is Temur.
Also, I'm thinking that Archfiend of Depravity from the spoiler could find a home or even just be substitute for other cards in your deck.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Ah ya, still something I don't fully understand. I have seen a rule stating that extort cards can be run in mono white or mono black decks. What gives here or did i read some false stuff
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Ah ya, still something I don't fully understand. I have seen a rule stating that extort cards can be run in mono white or mono black decks. What gives here or did i read some false stuff
Basically, mana symbols in reminder text(text in parentheses) doesn't count for color identity. As the mana symbols of Shaman of the Great Hunt's Ferocious ability are not in reminder text, the color identity rule applies to him as normal.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
If the deck doesn't want to be a friend making deck, I would strongly advise Dictate of Erebos or Grave Pact. I recently removed them both from my Marchesa list because of how many people would just immediately quit as soon as one of the two stuck, and I had a 100% scoop rate if I could land it with both Marchesa and Mikaeus out.
If the deck doesn't want to be a friend making deck, I would strongly advise Dictate of Erebos or Grave Pact. I recently removed them both from my Marchesa list because of how many people would just immediately quit as soon as one of the two stuck, and I had a 100% scoop rate if I could land it with both Marchesa and Mikaeus out.
We have a ton of pact decks in my meta. Everyone I play against plays well against them, or plays them themselves. I've opted to not run them, I can usually snag whatever I need with aura thief if need be.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Actually reminder text is what made me get it. I already knew about the identity and because of extort I started to question my understanding.
Edit: Dictate of Erebos came out of my deck for the same reason, it's been a lot more fun as just a turn everything sideways deck. Also got my Sneak Attack! I didn't realize until I had it in my hands that it even makes 2-4 cmc 1 mana. I am in love with it.
Has anyone tested Anathemancer in a Marchesa build? I recently added Grenzo to my list, and replaced Warstorm Surge with the Anathemancer because the Surge has been a little too slow lately.
I figure the Anathemancer is playable albeit unexciting. If you ignore its Unearth (or treat it as an emergency button), it's a 3-mana, 2-power guy so you can get it out early (at least before Marchesa), has a ETB effect that can do some decent damage, and is a Wizard (synergy with Sage of Fables, Voidmage Prodigy, Riptide Laboratory).
I'll see how it does, but I'm wondering if anyone has already tested it and has results to save me some time.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.
Has anyone tested Anathemancer in a Marchesa build? I recently added Grenzo to my list, and replaced Warstorm Surge with the Anathemancer because the Surge has been a little too slow lately.
I figure the Anathemancer is playable albeit unexciting. If you ignore its Unearth (or treat it as an emergency button), it's a 3-mana, 2-power guy so you can get it out early (at least before Marchesa), has a ETB effect that can do some decent damage, and is a Wizard (synergy with Sage of Fables, Voidmage Prodigy, Riptide Laboratory).
I'll see how it does, but I'm wondering if anyone has already tested it and has results to save me some time.
Haven't tried it since it only targets one player and is very conditional on what they play. I have a funny hunch i'd also get murdered with about 10k+ clones of them straight to my dome with a manabase like mine
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Hope you like Grenzo and get results like I do. Now that I run Sneak Attack I'm having my circumstances where I have no use for my mana and he just dumps the bros into the board. His success ratio has been high enough where I had a game the other night people were worried to attack into me because Grenzo could potentially bring more blockers to the table. His ability also hits River Kelpie and Flayer of the Hatebound when they resolve which is just extra icing.
Haven't tried it since it only targets one player and is very conditional on what they play. I have a funny hunch i'd also get murdered with about 10k+ clones of them straight to my dome with a manabase like mine
The single-target and contingency on an expensive manabase are definitely downsides to the card, but I think there's enough nonbasics being run in my meta to warrant its inclusion. If it does 4+ damage on average each time it comes in, that adds up quickly, especially if you can copy it. I'm not sure if that's good enough, but I'll try it out and see. I think ultimately testing will prove that it's a decent card but not something that would make a final 99 of ultra-tuned Marchesa builds.
Hope you like Grenzo and get results like I do. Now that I run Sneak Attack I'm having my circumstances where I have no use for my mana and he just dumps the bros into the board. His success ratio has been high enough where I had a game the other night people were worried to attack into me because Grenzo could potentially bring more blockers to the table. His ability also hits River Kelpie and Flayer of the Hatebound when they resolve which is just extra icing.
I only have one copy of Sneak Attack and it's in my cube, so I have to do without in my build! I looked through my list and most of my creatures are either 2 or 3 power, so I think he'll hit a lot of stuff. I like that he comes in with a counter at 3 mana to give him some protection if Marchesa is out. I can see it being bad-feels if you whiff with him, but I also run Academy Ruins and Living Death which should mitigate those in the long run.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.
Yeah, hes designed well. You can get him out before marchesa if your hand didnt have a rock or a better plan, let him catch his 2nd/3rd/4th counter and you can hit anything. Recently hit Scourge of the Throne on the last end step before my turn with a pretty big board already. He's just the funnest RNG I've used and I'm a big fan of RNG, so its been wonders having something useable.
I am starting to get bored of Marchesa aggro. Do you have any experience with building or playing against Marchesa decks built around a slower strategy like some sort of reanimator-value-controlish build? There are some pretty good-value creatures higher up than this deck's curve that I would like to use again. Whose decklist that follows this kind of build performs the strongest?
I am starting to get bored of Marchesa aggro. Do you have any experience with building or playing against Marchesa decks built around a slower strategy like some sort of reanimator-value-controlish build? There are some pretty good-value creatures higher up than this deck's curve that I would like to use again. Whose decklist that follows this kind of build performs the strongest?
You could always go around straight reanimator or combo routes, she is great colors for it. I've even seen someone run her as just a straight control general with all the fixings because she is just value town. Really you can make her fit whatever play style you like.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Alrighty, now that fate reforged is completely spoiled, time to discuss!... Vaultbreaker loots and smashes for 4. Not too powerful, but seems like a decent budget list card. Dragonrage seems like a goofy but fun finisher if you have loads of little dudes. Break through the Line with all our little creatures could be something to look into. With dethrone they will take more than 2. Qarsi High Priest, cheap sac outlet that will probably nab us a free creature. Worth testing. Orc Sureshot could be strong, cloning it can make for really efficient removal for just playing creatures. Merciless Executioner is great if you need another fleshbag marauder effect. Dark Deal, if you run any wheel effects this seems like a good effect. Ghastly Conscription seems like it could be either a completely dead card or huge blowout. Not sure if it would be any good. Hero's Blade, auto equips to Marchesa and she goes to a 3 hit kill general with just 1 dethrone trigger. Seems really strong for 2 cmc. Wild Slash, it's removal and helps stop that fog deck at the deck from blanking your combat step. Arcbond, this seems like a board wipe in multiplayer games to me. I think this will find a slot. Flamewake Phoenix great aggro card. Will probably be testing this one out as well. Self recurring creatures (especially with evasion) are strong. Mardu Strike Leader probably a decent budget card for making bodies. Loves to fuel skullclamp. Monastery Siege, gives our dudes frost titan's protection. Seems worse than running a kira to me. Shaman of the Great Hunt WHY WHY WHY DO YOU COUNT AS GREEN?! Man I wish we could run this. Clone on sight. Marang River Prowler, unblockable recurring uncommon? Budget decks rejoice! Archfiend of Depravity seems pretty solid, if it doesn't immediately eat removal this can do some real damage to a board state. Palace Siege a free gravedigger trigger each upkeep is cool, but this card is quite expensive for the effect. Flamerush Rider, budget Kiki-Jiki replacement, solid for re-using etbs, or copying that Scourge of the Throne for oodles of attack steps. Very testable. Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury anthem that works well with Scourge of the Throne. I could see running it. Outpost Siege, I love that red is getting its own form of card draw, but this card is uber meh. Soulflayer, could be pretty solid, I don't think we can really abuse it though. Hooded Assassin keeps coming back with Marchesa out or can be bad removal. Budget testable? Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, strong for pretty much any every deck that wants to run it. I don't think 8 mana in an aggro deck is where I want to be.
Let me know how you guy's tests go, I will be posting my results when I get enough games in.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Phoenix is probably going to over perform in the deck I think. Sarkhan is ok i guess, even though I'd rather run one of the other 5 drop mythic dragons just because they come back off of a Living Death. I'm actually working on a Kolaghan, the Storm's FuryDragonstorm deck. I don't think she is quite right for Marchesa but as an anthem she can be decent.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
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you will find in time no matter how good the card is, another creature is just so much better. Six mana is way too much. Massacre Wurm is much more deserving of a slot.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
Flayer of the Hatebound is our warstorm surge and does a way better job at it.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Edit: Nevermind I should read the cards before I ask questions.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
Shaman of the Great Hunt
3R
Creature - Orc Shaman
Haste
Whenever a creature you control deals combat damage to a player, put a +1/+1 counter on it.
Ferocious — 2(G/U)(G/U): Draw a card for each creature you control with power 4 or greater.
4/2
You can't run it in Marchesa. It's color identity is Temur.
Also, I'm thinking that Archfiend of Depravity from the spoiler could find a home or even just be substitute for other cards in your deck.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
He would've been amazing if green wasn't in his color identity.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Basically, mana symbols in reminder text(text in parentheses) doesn't count for color identity. As the mana symbols of Shaman of the Great Hunt's Ferocious ability are not in reminder text, the color identity rule applies to him as normal.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
We have a ton of pact decks in my meta. Everyone I play against plays well against them, or plays them themselves. I've opted to not run them, I can usually snag whatever I need with aura thief if need be.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Edit: Dictate of Erebos came out of my deck for the same reason, it's been a lot more fun as just a turn everything sideways deck. Also got my Sneak Attack! I didn't realize until I had it in my hands that it even makes 2-4 cmc 1 mana. I am in love with it.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
I figure the Anathemancer is playable albeit unexciting. If you ignore its Unearth (or treat it as an emergency button), it's a 3-mana, 2-power guy so you can get it out early (at least before Marchesa), has a ETB effect that can do some decent damage, and is a Wizard (synergy with Sage of Fables, Voidmage Prodigy, Riptide Laboratory).
I'll see how it does, but I'm wondering if anyone has already tested it and has results to save me some time.
Haven't tried it since it only targets one player and is very conditional on what they play. I have a funny hunch i'd also get murdered with about 10k+ clones of them straight to my dome with a manabase like mine
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
The single-target and contingency on an expensive manabase are definitely downsides to the card, but I think there's enough nonbasics being run in my meta to warrant its inclusion. If it does 4+ damage on average each time it comes in, that adds up quickly, especially if you can copy it. I'm not sure if that's good enough, but I'll try it out and see. I think ultimately testing will prove that it's a decent card but not something that would make a final 99 of ultra-tuned Marchesa builds.
I only have one copy of Sneak Attack and it's in my cube, so I have to do without in my build! I looked through my list and most of my creatures are either 2 or 3 power, so I think he'll hit a lot of stuff. I like that he comes in with a counter at 3 mana to give him some protection if Marchesa is out. I can see it being bad-feels if you whiff with him, but I also run Academy Ruins and Living Death which should mitigate those in the long run.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
You could always go around straight reanimator or combo routes, she is great colors for it. I've even seen someone run her as just a straight control general with all the fixings because she is just value town. Really you can make her fit whatever play style you like.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Vaultbreaker loots and smashes for 4. Not too powerful, but seems like a decent budget list card.
Dragonrage seems like a goofy but fun finisher if you have loads of little dudes.
Break through the Line with all our little creatures could be something to look into. With dethrone they will take more than 2.
Qarsi High Priest, cheap sac outlet that will probably nab us a free creature. Worth testing.
Orc Sureshot could be strong, cloning it can make for really efficient removal for just playing creatures.
Merciless Executioner is great if you need another fleshbag marauder effect.
Dark Deal, if you run any wheel effects this seems like a good effect.
Ghastly Conscription seems like it could be either a completely dead card or huge blowout. Not sure if it would be any good.
Hero's Blade, auto equips to Marchesa and she goes to a 3 hit kill general with just 1 dethrone trigger. Seems really strong for 2 cmc.
Wild Slash, it's removal and helps stop that fog deck at the deck from blanking your combat step.
Arcbond, this seems like a board wipe in multiplayer games to me. I think this will find a slot.
Flamewake Phoenix great aggro card. Will probably be testing this one out as well. Self recurring creatures (especially with evasion) are strong.
Mardu Strike Leader probably a decent budget card for making bodies. Loves to fuel skullclamp.
Monastery Siege, gives our dudes frost titan's protection. Seems worse than running a kira to me.
Shaman of the Great Hunt WHY WHY WHY DO YOU COUNT AS GREEN?! Man I wish we could run this. Clone on sight.
Marang River Prowler, unblockable recurring uncommon? Budget decks rejoice!
Archfiend of Depravity seems pretty solid, if it doesn't immediately eat removal this can do some real damage to a board state.
Palace Siege a free gravedigger trigger each upkeep is cool, but this card is quite expensive for the effect.
Flamerush Rider, budget Kiki-Jiki replacement, solid for re-using etbs, or copying that Scourge of the Throne for oodles of attack steps. Very testable.
Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury anthem that works well with Scourge of the Throne. I could see running it.
Outpost Siege, I love that red is getting its own form of card draw, but this card is uber meh.
Soulflayer, could be pretty solid, I don't think we can really abuse it though.
Hooded Assassin keeps coming back with Marchesa out or can be bad removal. Budget testable?
Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, strong for pretty much any every deck that wants to run it. I don't think 8 mana in an aggro deck is where I want to be.
Let me know how you guy's tests go, I will be posting my results when I get enough games in.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
Phoenix is probably going to over perform in the deck I think. Sarkhan is ok i guess, even though I'd rather run one of the other 5 drop mythic dragons just because they come back off of a Living Death. I'm actually working on a Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury Dragonstorm deck. I don't think she is quite right for Marchesa but as an anthem she can be decent.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)