I think crew is just a worse sower, but ravager on the other hand, is super spicy. that thing can chunk folks super hard, and on a big turn can really put folks within kill range for swings.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Just imagine a Dire Fleet Ravager hitting the board next to Gray Merchant of Asphodel off of Living Death. It's like an Oprah give away... "You lose life... You lose life... YOU lose life... EVERYBODY LOSES LIFE!!!"
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
I just saw Tempest Caller as well, it does seem like a very interesting card. The Wizard subtype does work quite nicely with Metallic Mimic/Sage of Fables to recur the Caller and repeatedly use its ability.
Been playing Tempest Caller and not enjoying it. In my experience, it only allows for a swing in once and then sits there. If you can loop it, your opponents will just untap on their turn anyway. Herald of Secret Streams looks like a similar effect, just always on when I need it.
Combat Celebrant has either felt win more or completely useless the few times I've drawn it. I've gotten to exert it all of once and it got me some value, but not enough to warrant an inclusion.
I understand your disappointment with the Tempest Caller. It's a card with good effect, but the core mechanics Dethrone in our deck always dictate who we will be attacking most of the time.
Regarding most of the non evasive, non ETB effect creatures, unless they get evasion via herald, most will be blocked. I don have much success with Combat Celebrant or Cephalid Constable yet.
I see you ran looter il kor, my kind of creature. can I recommend you to try
Thrummingbird : have evasion pumps the team after battle.
Riftwing cloudskate : extra bounce that compliment your Venser, always suspend
Windfall : I don own wheel of fortune, but I think the deck needs a burst of card drawing and disruption. If u can run both, it's better than rhystic Study IMHO
Cephalid Constable is mostly in my list for its ability to lock someone out of the game. If its in my opening hand, I'm likely to hit whoever is on the throne for 2 turn 4 and bounce their 2 best permanents (usually their lands). They're effectively dead at this point due to how far behind they are, and its unlikely they'll find a blocker by next turn if they didn't already have one, so its another 2 lands gone (or the new throne loses 3 lands, but this second scenario rarely happens for me). Midgame, I'm able to get Cephalid Constable out and hit someone pretty uncommonly, but it still comes up. If I don't draw it in my first 2 or 3 turns, its almost always the weakest card in my hand. This may be reason enough to get rid of it, but I'm still reluctant just based on how many games I've won. I guess: when its good, its phenomenal, when its bad, its really weak.
I want to test out Thrummingbird and Riftwing, though I'm not quite sure what I'd cut. I just ended up cutting Hanweir Garrison, but that ended up being a huge mistake, so I'm going to need a find a spot already to put it back in. Maybe cut Solemn? If I've gotten to 4 mana at all, I can cast the majority of my deck and don't need any more lands, and looping him (or really anything else) is only meh. I feel like Treasonous Ogre is really good, but I never want to cast it, and I can never do a ton with 4-5 extra mana either. I don't really need a life outlet either; if anything I want to find more ways to get life back. I think my most recent additions of Ankh of Mishra, Spellshock, and Zo-Zu, the Punisher are going to exacerbate this problem as well.
Thrummingbird looks like a "clincher" card, where it will help me get just enough power to knock someone out so I can snowball the rest of the way and kill the table. I thought Riftwing looked a little meh at first, but then I realized it came down with haste and flying on turn 5, when I'm usually making my first huge "block some of this or you're dead" swing. Looping it is also just nuts. Even just hardcasting it if I'm desperate is not out of the question.
I've hated Rhystic Study in my list for a while, but its allowed me to come back from the brink. I'll probably do some testing with Windfall, since I agree that we want bursts of card draw and disruption. Maybe cutting Grim Haruspex for Windfall is better, since I find Grim just eats a removal spell immediately unless Marchesa is already on the table (in which case she eats it instead).
yeah, Cephalid Constable is a High ceiling card. High ground - Card always perform High ceiling - Card performs differently at different situation. eg early turns
Venser is High ground where as Cephalid Constable is High ceiling.
I think if you include 8 -10 high ceiling cards that is before Marchesa, it's possible to draw one and make a strong board pressence.
There is a high chance you will cut Treasonous Ogre, because when you start to group yr cards by functionality, the odd ones usually gets cut.
There are 2 school of thought in this forum Solrune and Tev.
Solrune - clunk of 4 cc cards with toolbox aided by tutors and game ending spell
Tev - Lean creatures, trying to do 120 before dying.
Eg Treasonous Ogre fits nicely in Solrune listing where in Tev , it's a odd card that don't contribute to winning. As your listing is closer to Tev, you are probably looking out for 8 x punisher cards, 8 x high impact/ high ceiling cards.
The unfortunate thing is that Marchesa's reputation has always been a troublesome commander and people are bound to archenemy you, especially as we go more punisher. If only we have vigilance creatures, then we might not need that much lifegain.. I searched and found Angel's Trumpet.
I doubt it's good, but who knows... someone might find love for Angel's Trumpet ?
I carry a third line of thought, and that is to make Marchesa a resilient slow combo deck.
I believe that this would be suitable in places where full commitment to aggression is simply not feasible due to the tools people can access that protect them from aggression.
Yesterday I was an inch away from winning with Time Sieve twice while I was drawing the disruptive attention of two grindy midrange decks at once for pretty much the whole game. If I was on the aggro plan I don't think I would have survived even that long. Maybe I also would have avoided drawing that much attention, but I'm used to it by now.
I carry a third line of thought, and that is to make Marchesa a resilient slow combo deck.
I believe that this would be suitable in places where full commitment to aggression is simply not feasible due to the tools people can access that protect them from aggression.
Yesterday I was an inch away from winning with Time Sieve twice while I was drawing the disruptive attention of two grindy midrange decks at once for pretty much the whole game. If I was on the aggro plan I don't think I would have survived even that long. Maybe I also would have avoided drawing that much attention, but I'm used to it by now.
I use grave pact and dictate for control. I added in vindictive lich and have been having few problems with aggro, midrange, control matchups. My meta is roughly between 70 to 80 percent meta.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard: No Time
Modern: Jund Midrange BRG
Legacy: Shardless Bug BUG
With Timestream Navigator, Marchesa now has access to a hilarious 6 card infinite turns combo.
[1] Have Marchesa, a free sac outlet, a haste enabler, and Metallic Mimic on board, naming Human.
[2] Cast Imperial Recruiter and fetch Timestream Navigator.
[3] Cast Timestream Navigator and use its ability.
[4] On your second main phase, sacrifice Imperial Recruiter.
[5] When Imperial Recruiter returns, fetch Timestream Navigator again.
[6] Repeat steps 2-5 until you win.
I was wrong. At least in regard to Xiahou Dun. He's ridiculous. Was able to top-deck and resolve Rune-Scarred Demon, which grabbed Living Death. Someone else resolved a board wipe. Living Death followed, with me having the most beneficial ETB effects stacked in my graveyard.
Grabbed Xiahou Dun. Chained Living Deaths. Closed the game out soon after.
Going to be looking on eBay for a copy of Xiahou Dun now...
Xiahou Dun is bonkers. The first time I got to play with him, I had an Unspeakable Symbol in play and was casting Demonic Tutor every turn for the low, low price of "Buyback: pay 3 life".
Thada player had taken everyone's mana rocks. Maelstrom Wanderer missed most of its ramp and had endured some targeted land destruction. Ramos player likewise generally a non-issue because of over-theming with legendary cards.
Thada resolved Hive Mind, then Windfall with a Swarm Intelligence already in play, in the attempt to speed this already long game to a conclusion. With all the copies, he drew himself and the Maelstrom Wanderer player to death.
The rest of us survived with small libraries and huge graveyards. So, naturally, I spent some large amount of time going through each.
Snagged the Scarab God player's Havengul Lich and sacrificed it to Carrion Feeder to prevent any later shenanigans, then passed. Probably should have kept it up but wasn't thinking entirely straight by that point in the evening.
Beckett played some creatures. Scarab God player resolved his commander but only had enough mana up for one activation. Ramos player tried to pull all his trash back with Primevals' Glorious Rebirth, but the Scarab God player exiled my Venser, Shaper Savant to keep him in line for a turn. Salty, he passed the turn to me.
I played Bojuka Bog, targeting Scarab God's yard. With my remaining lands (I think I had exactly enough), I activated Feldon's ability again, made a copy of Sidisi, Undead Vizier, searched for Living Death and resolved it not really considering how everyone's ETB triggers would affect things.
My Gray Merchant of Asphodel entered, and every creature I controlled that could copy it did copy it. I stopped counting at 100, and everyone scooped.
Biggest takeaway is how ridiculously long a turn can be when you have to account for 200+ cards spread out across 4 graveyards. But it was a classic EDH finish.
Yeah, I goofed. Copy creatures have a specific point in Gatherer rulings that the creature they copy as a replacement effect has to already be in play.
Oh well, lesson learned. I think I would have still taken it with all the hasty creatures.
I personally run no Sac Outlets that require mana as I'm so low to the ground. But I can easily see a Midrange build get a lot of value out of this; including bumping someone's life total up so that they're no tied with you for Dethrone. That has been an issue every now and then.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
I did this today with natural draws on turn 4 in one game for the win. Really enjoyed the interaction.
Modern: Jund Midrange BRG
Legacy: Shardless Bug BUG
Been playing Tempest Caller and not enjoying it. In my experience, it only allows for a swing in once and then sits there. If you can loop it, your opponents will just untap on their turn anyway. Herald of Secret Streams looks like a similar effect, just always on when I need it.
Combat Celebrant has either felt win more or completely useless the few times I've drawn it. I've gotten to exert it all of once and it got me some value, but not enough to warrant an inclusion.
I understand your disappointment with the Tempest Caller. It's a card with good effect, but the core mechanics Dethrone in our deck always dictate who we will be attacking most of the time.
Regarding most of the non evasive, non ETB effect creatures, unless they get evasion via herald, most will be blocked. I don have much success with Combat Celebrant or Cephalid Constable yet.
I see you ran looter il kor, my kind of creature. can I recommend you to try
Thrummingbird : have evasion pumps the team after battle.
Riftwing cloudskate : extra bounce that compliment your Venser, always suspend
Windfall : I don own wheel of fortune, but I think the deck needs a burst of card drawing and disruption. If u can run both, it's better than rhystic Study IMHO
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
I want to test out Thrummingbird and Riftwing, though I'm not quite sure what I'd cut. I just ended up cutting Hanweir Garrison, but that ended up being a huge mistake, so I'm going to need a find a spot already to put it back in. Maybe cut Solemn? If I've gotten to 4 mana at all, I can cast the majority of my deck and don't need any more lands, and looping him (or really anything else) is only meh. I feel like Treasonous Ogre is really good, but I never want to cast it, and I can never do a ton with 4-5 extra mana either. I don't really need a life outlet either; if anything I want to find more ways to get life back. I think my most recent additions of Ankh of Mishra, Spellshock, and Zo-Zu, the Punisher are going to exacerbate this problem as well.
Thrummingbird looks like a "clincher" card, where it will help me get just enough power to knock someone out so I can snowball the rest of the way and kill the table. I thought Riftwing looked a little meh at first, but then I realized it came down with haste and flying on turn 5, when I'm usually making my first huge "block some of this or you're dead" swing. Looping it is also just nuts. Even just hardcasting it if I'm desperate is not out of the question.
I've hated Rhystic Study in my list for a while, but its allowed me to come back from the brink. I'll probably do some testing with Windfall, since I agree that we want bursts of card draw and disruption. Maybe cutting Grim Haruspex for Windfall is better, since I find Grim just eats a removal spell immediately unless Marchesa is already on the table (in which case she eats it instead).
yeah, Cephalid Constable is a High ceiling card.
High ground - Card always perform
High ceiling - Card performs differently at different situation. eg early turns
Venser is High ground where as Cephalid Constable is High ceiling.
I think if you include 8 -10 high ceiling cards that is before Marchesa, it's possible to draw one and make a strong board pressence.
There is a high chance you will cut Treasonous Ogre, because when you start to group yr cards by functionality, the odd ones usually gets cut.
There are 2 school of thought in this forum Solrune and Tev.
Solrune - clunk of 4 cc cards with toolbox aided by tutors and game ending spell
Tev - Lean creatures, trying to do 120 before dying.
Eg Treasonous Ogre fits nicely in Solrune listing where in Tev , it's a odd card that don't contribute to winning. As your listing is closer to Tev, you are probably looking out for 8 x punisher cards, 8 x high impact/ high ceiling cards.
The unfortunate thing is that Marchesa's reputation has always been a troublesome commander and people are bound to archenemy you, especially as we go more punisher. If only we have vigilance creatures, then we might not need that much lifegain.. I searched and found Angel's Trumpet.
I doubt it's good, but who knows... someone might find love for Angel's Trumpet ?
I believe that this would be suitable in places where full commitment to aggression is simply not feasible due to the tools people can access that protect them from aggression.
Yesterday I was an inch away from winning with Time Sieve twice while I was drawing the disruptive attention of two grindy midrange decks at once for pretty much the whole game. If I was on the aggro plan I don't think I would have survived even that long. Maybe I also would have avoided drawing that much attention, but I'm used to it by now.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
I use grave pact and dictate for control. I added in vindictive lich and have been having few problems with aggro, midrange, control matchups. My meta is roughly between 70 to 80 percent meta.
Modern: Jund Midrange BRG
Legacy: Shardless Bug BUG
[1] Have Marchesa, a free sac outlet, a haste enabler, and Metallic Mimic on board, naming Human.
[2] Cast Imperial Recruiter and fetch Timestream Navigator.
[3] Cast Timestream Navigator and use its ability.
[4] On your second main phase, sacrifice Imperial Recruiter.
[5] When Imperial Recruiter returns, fetch Timestream Navigator again.
[6] Repeat steps 2-5 until you win.
Or you could just combo with Kiki-Jiki.
I was wrong. At least in regard to Xiahou Dun. He's ridiculous. Was able to top-deck and resolve Rune-Scarred Demon, which grabbed Living Death. Someone else resolved a board wipe. Living Death followed, with me having the most beneficial ETB effects stacked in my graveyard.
Grabbed Xiahou Dun. Chained Living Deaths. Closed the game out soon after.
Going to be looking on eBay for a copy of Xiahou Dun now...
Thada player had taken everyone's mana rocks. Maelstrom Wanderer missed most of its ramp and had endured some targeted land destruction. Ramos player likewise generally a non-issue because of over-theming with legendary cards.
Thada resolved Hive Mind, then Windfall with a Swarm Intelligence already in play, in the attempt to speed this already long game to a conclusion. With all the copies, he drew himself and the Maelstrom Wanderer player to death.
The rest of us survived with small libraries and huge graveyards. So, naturally, I spent some large amount of time going through each.
I resolved Necrotic Ooze and, because Anger in the yard gave it haste, activated it using Feldon of the Third Path to bring in a copy of Sower of Temptation.
Snagged the Scarab God player's Havengul Lich and sacrificed it to Carrion Feeder to prevent any later shenanigans, then passed. Probably should have kept it up but wasn't thinking entirely straight by that point in the evening.
Beckett played some creatures. Scarab God player resolved his commander but only had enough mana up for one activation. Ramos player tried to pull all his trash back with Primevals' Glorious Rebirth, but the Scarab God player exiled my Venser, Shaper Savant to keep him in line for a turn. Salty, he passed the turn to me.
I played Bojuka Bog, targeting Scarab God's yard. With my remaining lands (I think I had exactly enough), I activated Feldon's ability again, made a copy of Sidisi, Undead Vizier, searched for Living Death and resolved it not really considering how everyone's ETB triggers would affect things.
My Gray Merchant of Asphodel entered, and every creature I controlled that could copy it did copy it. I stopped counting at 100, and everyone scooped.
Biggest takeaway is how ridiculously long a turn can be when you have to account for 200+ cards spread out across 4 graveyards. But it was a classic EDH finish.
It's unclear from your description if you mean these clone effects came in off the Living Death, but if so, then those creatures couldn't copy Gary.
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
Oh well, lesson learned. I think I would have still taken it with all the hasty creatures.
RGWMayael the AnimaRGW
UBRMarchesa, the Black RoseUBR
Modern Decks
RGWNaya BurnRGW
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs