To help you out a bit with what to cut for The Immortal Sun, I'd cut Liliana's Mastery. The Immortal Sun only costs 1 more mana, it's easier to cast because it's all generic mana, and has more boons. It pumps all your creatures regardless if they're zombies or not, it reduces the costs of all your spells by 1, you get to draw an additional card, and has the bonus of hosing planeswalkers. By contrast Liliana's Mastery gives you two 2/2 black zombie creature tokens when it enters the battlefield (technically they're gonna be 3/3) and that's basically it. If you're already running Liliana's Mastery, what's 1 more in order to have the same boon and then some?
As for what to silver-bordered cards to include that stay on theme, you can add the following:
Over My Dead Bodies works for this deck because if you're sacrificing creatures, they're gonna be in the graveyard. However, with them in the graveyard, this enchantment still lets you attack them. Any creatures that deal combat damage to each other will be exiled, which is a bonus against other reanimator decks.
Time Out is another good removal spell because it puts the nonland permanent into the deck anywhere between the 2nd and 7th place.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
To help you out a bit with what to cut for The Immortal Sun, I'd cut Liliana's Mastery. The Immortal Sun only costs 1 more mana, it's easier to cast because it's all generic mana, and has more boons. It pumps all your creatures regardless if they're zombies or not, it reduces the costs of all your spells by 1, you get to draw an additional card, and has the bonus of hosing planeswalkers. By contrast Liliana's Mastery gives you two 2/2 black zombie creature tokens when it enters the battlefield (technically they're gonna be 3/3) and that's basically it. If you're already running Liliana's Mastery, what's 1 more in order to have the same boon and then some?
As for what to silver-bordered cards to include that stay on theme, you can add the following:
Over My Dead Bodies works for this deck because if you're sacrificing creatures, they're gonna be in the graveyard. However, with them in the graveyard, this enchantment still lets you attack them. Any creatures that deal combat damage to each other will be exiled, which is a bonus against other reanimator decks.
Time Out is another good removal spell because it puts the nonland permanent into the deck anywhere between the 2nd and 7th place.
I disagree with Immortal Sun over Liliana's Mastery. Liliana's Mastery creating two zombie tokens is huge in Lord of Tresserhorn. The two tokens can have multiple synergies with many other very relevant zombie matters cards like multiplying them with Endless Ranks of the Dead for starters, and by creating two zombie tokens Liliana's Mastery acts as an enabler to sacrifice two creatures AND it puts Lord of Tressehorn in a two hit kill range. Immortal Sun does not enable you to cast Lord of Tresserhorn and is really goodstuff filler that does not fully synergize with the rest of the deck.
As far as silver bordered cards, the best ones are probably the ones you mentioned. No uncard sticks out to me as being worthy of being in your deck.
Also I would like to point out how many ETB triggers you have, and with Torpor Orb that is an ultimate nombo. May I suggest a fully dedicated anti ETB deck with death triggers or leaves the battlefield triggers instead? Think creatures like Nevermaker (brutal if copied and sacrificed). Running Stifle, Trickbind etc. makes your deck way more able to interact with your Commander and being able to stop more non-interactive strategies such as Kiki-Jiki infinites etc. Having Torpor Orb with your own ETB creatures is just feel bads.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"People are the worst. The worst thing about music is that people play it." - Mike Patton
If I wanted more removal, I agree that Fowl Play is great. Time Out is good, but at 5cmc I'd expect more from my single-target removal.
I thought quite a bit about Over My Dead Bodies, and still haven't made a decision. I think it could be really powerful, but I'm curious if my group would be grumpy because it warps the game so much? I'll have to talk to them first.
// 11 Instant
1 Stifle
1 Trickbind
1 Hatred
1 Time Stop
1 Tainted Strike
1 Final Fortune
1 Reins of Power
1 Soul's Fire
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Glorious End
1 Disallow
// 36 Land
3 Island
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Island
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Steam Vents
1 Rogue's Passage
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Smoldering Marsh
1 Homeward Path
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Volcanic Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Graven Cairns
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Cathedral of War
1 Canyon Slough
1 Fetid Pools
// 1 Planeswalker
1 Dack Fayden
// 6 Sorcery
1 Living Death
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Faithless Looting
1 Mystic Retrieval
1 Scrap Mastery
1 Ever After
// 2 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Lord of Tresserhorn
// 1 Land
SB: 1 Lost Vale
// 1 Tokens
// 1 Emblem
1 Dack Fayden (emblem)
Here is my list in case you would like some ideas. It is focused on winning out of nowhere, from a sudden infinite combo, Phage win, or a one shot Lord of Tresserhorn. Every card works with each other so no tutors are necessary. I have every possible way in the game to counter a triggered ability, except for Voidslime and Humility since those are outside of Grixis colors. I think taking out your ETB triggers will help you the most.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"People are the worst. The worst thing about music is that people play it." - Mike Patton
Hi crumbcrispcoating, sorry for the delayed response. You have a neat list, though I'd encourage you to use this site's formatting for ease of viewing. If you need help with formatting lists or cards, I have a helpful link in my signature.
Rivals of Ixalan full spoiler is up! Below is a list of cards I think at least merit discussion. Let me know what you think or if you think I missed anything.
Vona's Hunger: Edict effects are a favored type of removal in this list; however, this is a spot removal spell, and as such I will generally never get the target I want. Even at 3cmc, we have access to better, more dependable removal.
Hello Outcryqq,
I have been trying some variations of your list (differ by about 10 cards) and would like propose/discuss some cards. In particular I feel that all the lords lead to to much 3 drops, so I like to swap in cheaper zombies.
Phyrexian Altar: Together with gravecrawler it to can combo with almost any tax effect. So I prefer it over Ashnods Altar, which only advantage seems to be ramp into fatties.
Tymaret, the Murder King: Great toolbox as it provides an expensive sac outlet (even when in graveyard) and can reccur itself. Shots down small creatures and planeswalker.
Gisa and Geralf: It is not in your list, do you play them? Never had them out for long to really test them.
Graveborn Muse: Isnt this card a more costly Phyrexian Altar that is also a zombie? The 3 slot is quite full - i would play a lord on t3 rather than arena, if i have the choice.
Plague Belcher: I like him over blood artist, although it is a 3 drop. It can kill our own creatures, if we have no sac outlet and is fat zombie.
Unfortunately my list hasn’t been updated properly. You have some great suggestions in here, and a few of them have made it into my permanent list, which I’ll update shortly: Cryptbreaker, Relentless Dead, and Gisa and Geralf. They’re all great and deserve their spots.
Phyrexian Altar is great and worth an add, but my list has a high CMC and I’ve found that Ashnod’s Altar helps me power out the higher portions of my deck earlier. I would agree with anyone who ran Phyrexian Altar instead of Ashnod’s, or in addition to it.
Tymaret, the Murder King: this is a decent card, but for me I think it’s a bit too mana-intensive for what you get. Have you ran it a lot, and have you found that you use his activated abilities regularly?
Graveborn Muse: Great card, but when I tried it early on in this deck, it killed me almost as often as it saved me. Great card, but I wish it had a “may” ability. As it reads, it is dangerous to play in the mid-late game, which is when I’d ideally be playing this guy.
Plague Belcher: It’s a decent effect, but the life gain from Blood Artist is why I’d choose it over the belcher. Good card, and I used to run more bleeder effects, and if I did this guy would be an auto include.
Lord of the Accursed: Yeah, this is a good card. I wouldn’t choose it over Cemetery Reaper, which provides for graveyard hate in addition the lord. But the team menace is great and I need to test it.
Withered Wretch: Of course this is an amazing card. Like you noted, it’s probably meta dependent, and I haven’t found myself needing it yet, but it’s definitely on my radar.
Hi all, the full Dominaria list has been spoiled. I think the set looks like a lot of fun, and has a lot of potentially powerful cards across many formats. Here is a list of cards I think at least warrant a discussion in this deck. As always, please feel free to discuss these cards, or let me know if I missed any! For reference, our historic card count for the current list is approximately 20, so I am choosing to not include historic-matters cards. For lists with a higher historic permanent count, this could change what cards you might include from Dominaria.
Karn, Scion of Urza: One of the big hype cards of the set. Planeswalkers haven't fared well in this deck, unless their abilities are directly on theme with the deck (Venser, the Sojourner), but they are always fun to look at. This guy is a really good card, and will be a solid draw engine for a lot of decks. However, in this deck, we have better card draw, especially since Karn will need to survive for you to get some serious gas out of him. Fun card, but will not earn a spot in this deck.
Dark Bargain: Interesting card, and lets us selectively fill the yard. However, I think we have access to better card draw, so I will pass on this one.
The Eldest Reborn: This should be inherent massive card advantage, and I might test it. It doesn't fit our theme exceptionally well, but I could see this doing some good work as a fancy removal spell.
Josu Vess, Lich Knight: Absolutely going into this deck. Early game you can cast him for early attack/block/sacrifice, and late game you can cast him to close out a game. Very great card for this deck!
Torgaar, Famine Incarnate: Shame this guy isn't a zombie. This would be a neat addition, but I don't think it will do enough in EDH to deserve a slot in this deck.
Whisper, Blood Liturgist: Very powerful effect. I wish she was a zombie. I don't think I'll be testing her.
Yawgmoth's Vile Offering: Neat spell, and on theme with the deck. I dislike adding non-zombie cards to the deck in general, but this one might be worth testing.
Garna, the Bloodflame: This is a very powerful effect, considering all of our sacrifice outlets and board wipes. It's a shame he's not a zombie. This might be worth testing.
Cabal Stronghold: This is not worth adding to this list, but if I used a different mana base, I might consider it.
Battlebond review is below. I am only going to discuss new cards, not reprints, though I'm pretty pumped about the value in the set. I'll discuss possible additions to the deck. Let me know if I missed any or what you're excited to try!
The new lands: Luxury Suite and Morphic Pool seem really good, even if they lack the basic land subtype.
Khorvath's Fury: Wheel effects are powerful in this deck, and this is a solid one. I don't think it's worth it in this deck, but I wouldn't fault someone for trying it.
Virtus's Maneuver: Solid piece of removal and recursion for the price. I think it's worth considering for a removal spell.
Thrilling Encore: I'll have to think about it more, but any kind of mass recursion spell warrants consideration in this deck. Seems very powerful, and can be used defensively after someone wipes the board, or offensively to sacrifice and recur my whole team.
Below are a list of cards I think warrant a discussion for inclusion in this deck. If you think I missed anything, or just want to talk about these cards, please don't be scared to comment!
Sift: Draw 3 discard 3 is powerful for this deck, as it lets us dig deep and fill up our yard. However, this deck has very limited spots for card draw, and when I compare Sift to something like Frantic Search, it's hard to justify Sift.
Graveyard Marshal: Competitive stats for the cost, with a decent ability. However, this forces us to exile creatures from our own yard, and typically we want to be storing creatures there to reanimate later, so this is not very powerful, especially since we have something like Cemetery Reaper which lets us hit opposing graveyards for a similar cost, and is a lord to boot.
Isareth the Awakener: It's a darn shame she isn't a zombie, because that ability is amazing for the deck. That being said, I'll probably pass.
Open the Graves: This is a pretty good zombie token maker. We have enough creatures and recursion to keep a good supply of zombie tokens. This might be tested.
Stitcher's Supplier: Probably not effective enough in EDH, but this ability is strong and will help fill our graveyard.
Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: Does not fit thematically, but like many Bolas cards/walkers, this is an incredibly powerful, fun card, and I might try to fit it in for fun (unless I just build another deck using him as a commander).
Have you considered Lightning Reaver? It's a Zombie, it's evasive, and it ends the game impressively fast for a 5 CMC creature.
Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen this creature before. It seems like it could be really powerful, though it is competing for a spot with the likes of Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Havengul Lich, and Grimgrin, Corpse-Born, all of which can end the game quickly as well. What would you cut for it?
Ravnica Allegiance set review! Below is a list of cards I think deserve discussion about adding to this list. I will not address reprints. Let me know your thoughts!
Awaken the Erstwhile[/c]: I think this card is too risky in the deck, unless we had a great boardstate before casting it. And in that case, this would be a "win more" type card.
Priest of Forgotten Gods: Interesting card, but I think it's too creature intensive for this deck.
Bedvil: Premium removal with no restrictions, this has a chance of getting tested, but I don't think it will make the final list.
Judith, the Scourge Diva: Decent anthem effect, and the ability is OK, it's really a shame she doesn't have a zombie creature type.
Theater of Horrors: Interesting design. I don't think we want card advantage that is dependent on other conditions being met, though.
War of the Spark set review! Below is a list of cards I think deserve discussion about adding to this list. I will not address reprints.
Amass (as a mechanic): I think this is worthwhile, as they still count as zombie tokens. Depending on the card, I think going keeper into Amass is a solid idea.
God-Eternal Kefnet: Cool card, but unfortunately we don't run many instants or soceries, so this won't be going in.
Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion: The RR in the casting cost is very restrictive, but the trigger on damage is a great way to fill the graveyard and draw new gas. However, the fact that it adds red mana to the pool is also a problem.
Bolas's Citadel: Neat card. Probably too expensive for this deck, but it's a consideration in any deck that is heavy in black.
Dreadhorde Invasion: One of the better cards for this deck in the set. A slightly worse Bitterblossom, but it makes zombie token(s) each turn is a very strong play on turn 2. The extra text might sometimes be relevant in this deck, but unlikely.
God-Eternal Bontu: Also a solid candidate for testing, this guy is thankfully a zombie. Together with a deck that already makes a fair amount of tokens, this could be a decent draw engine that I can recur if necessary.
Liliana, Dreadhorde General: This walker has it all - card draw, removal, and zombie token generation. Strange she doesn't create an army token, but that's fine with me. I think she is definitely deserving of a slot, and will probably go in to replace Liliana's Mastery.
Liliana's Triumph: Not as good in EDH as it will be in other formats, this is still a solid piece of removal. I don't think it will win a slot in my list, but if I had more Liliana cards in the deck, this card might be more deserving of a slot.
Spark Reaper: This card is pretty good, though I think the activated ability is a bit too pricey to actually play. The ability is very powerful in the deck though, and I wouldn't fault someone for running it.
Vizier of the Scorpion: This gives you two bodies on turn 3, which is relevant when you want to cast Lord of Tresserhorn on turn 4 and have two dudes to sacrifice. However, the extra text of giving your zombie tokens (not just zombie ARMY tokens!) is very important and I will test this card.
Eternal Skylord: Much like the Vizier, above, this guy is great in that he comes with two bodies and is a zombie himself. And like Vizier, this guy grants all zombie tokens a very powerful ability - flying. The 5cmc is very expensive, but the payoff might be worth it. I will test this guy.
Angrath's Rampage: Neat removal spell. Unfortunately, it is sorcery speed and it gives the opponent the choice of creature/walker removal, so I'll generally choose Dreadbore over this.
Dreadhorde Butcher: I think this is too little impact for EDH play, though he's aggressively-costed and would play better in some tempo version of this deck, if it exists.
Enter the God-Eternals: Creature removal, life gain, fill your yard, and token generation in one spell is good. Even with all those boxes checked, I still am not convinced this is worth a lot at 5cmc with a restrictive mana requirement.
Gleaming Overseer: This fella is aggressively costed for the body, and like Vizier of the Scorpion, gives you two bodies on turn 3. I still think Vizier wins out, but this would be a solid addition.
Soul Diviner: This card was better in limited than I expected; however, unless I'm going heavily into amass (still undecided!), this will whiff pretty often in my deck. Otherwise this would be a nice source of card advantage stapled to an aggressively-costed body.
What do you think? Are there any other cards that you're excited to try in your Tresserhorn (or other zombie) build, or do you have a different opinion on some cards? Feel free to share your thoughts!
5/19/19:
+Liliana, Dreadhorde General, Gleaming Overseer
-Bloodchief Ascension, Karn Liberated
Why: Through testing, my list has morphed into one that doesn't look quite like my original thread. These two have been taken out for testing, and I haven't missed them. Bloodchief Ascension does nothing until it has 3 counters, and once it does, it makes you Archenemy. Karn Liberated is great removal for probably permanent types (enchantments and artifacts) but lately I haven't been facing down ones that this deck cannot simply fight through. On the other hand, Liliana, Dreadhorde General is AMAZING for the deck: the static ability should fill our hand, the plus makes fodder, the minus is amazing removal, and the ultimate should end the game. Gleaming Overseer provides evasion to all my tokens and gives me two bodies on turn 3, which can help with casting Lord of Tresserhorn early.
I also considered Eternal Taskmaster, Vizier of the Scorpion, Dreadhorde Invasion, and Eternal Skylord. After speaking to my playgroup, all people who know this deck and have played against it dozens of times, I think Gleaming Overseer provides the best perk to my tokens (menace) on an aggressively-costed body and obviously Liliana, Dreadhorde General is just an awesome card for the deck. I held off on the Vizier, Invasion, and Skylord because, as my opponents pointed out, this deck is not all about making tokens. While I often have tokens available, they aren't the focus of this deck, and therefore the token buff is almost an afterthought for me. If I want to change up the build a bit to be more focused on tokens, I'd immediately add those three cards. Eternal Taskmaster is just very mana intensive, and I already have some great recursion at a better rate.
I really like Ikoria, but the set doesn't have much for this deck. The only card worth a look is Footfall Crater. Haste and trample are both big for Tresserhorn, and the cycling is good if I'm in a game where it's a dead card.
I think the Commander 2020 decks are great. Below is a list of cards I think deserve some thought about being added to the deck. Let me know what you think of these cards or if you think I missed any!
Deadly Rollick: like the other free with commander cards, this is a good card. In this deck I prefer my removal to be creature based when possible, but the exile is very attractive.
Netherborn Altar: really neat design. Unfortunately I don't cast Tressorhorn more than 1-2 times a game, so this probably won't earn a spot in my list.
Species Survivalist: amazing card in just about any tribal deck. I really like it too because you can drop him even after you've developed a board presence. I will test him.
Molten Echoes: neat tribal card. Probably works best with tribes that rely heavily on ETB triggers, which zombies do not.
Sorry that I've been missing in action for a while, I had a baby and then COVID hit and I haven't kept up with updating my decks because I wasn't playing any games. However, I've kept up with acquisitions of cards, and I finally sat down and updated my list!
Notes: I updated the mana base (temples, Lavaclaw Reaches). I had to move my one copy of Cabal Coffers to a deck where it fits better (The Gitrog Monster); when I acquire another copy (probably when it gets printed next), I'll add it back in. Since it's out for now, I took out a few other cards that focused on Coffers/Urborg: Expedition Map, Frantic Search, and Thespian's Stage. I upgraded my creature removal suite to be even more flexible (Oblivion Stone, Terminate). I added in a bunch of versatile card draw, so I removed some of the less efficient options (Skullclamp, Necromancer's Stockpile). I added in more flexible recursion options, so removed some less flexible options (Reanimate, Liliana, Death's Majesty), Removed some less steller cards in favor of some flexible cards (Lich Lord of Unx, Prized Amalgam). Finally, Blood Artist is great, but some of my additions really want the zombie creature type, so I took out any non-zombies that I thought I might be able to afford to lose.
As for what to silver-bordered cards to include that stay on theme, you can add the following:
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I disagree with Immortal Sun over Liliana's Mastery. Liliana's Mastery creating two zombie tokens is huge in Lord of Tresserhorn. The two tokens can have multiple synergies with many other very relevant zombie matters cards like multiplying them with Endless Ranks of the Dead for starters, and by creating two zombie tokens Liliana's Mastery acts as an enabler to sacrifice two creatures AND it puts Lord of Tressehorn in a two hit kill range. Immortal Sun does not enable you to cast Lord of Tresserhorn and is really goodstuff filler that does not fully synergize with the rest of the deck.
As far as silver bordered cards, the best ones are probably the ones you mentioned. No uncard sticks out to me as being worthy of being in your deck.
Also I would like to point out how many ETB triggers you have, and with Torpor Orb that is an ultimate nombo. May I suggest a fully dedicated anti ETB deck with death triggers or leaves the battlefield triggers instead? Think creatures like Nevermaker (brutal if copied and sacrificed). Running Stifle, Trickbind etc. makes your deck way more able to interact with your Commander and being able to stop more non-interactive strategies such as Kiki-Jiki infinites etc. Having Torpor Orb with your own ETB creatures is just feel bads.
If I wanted more removal, I agree that Fowl Play is great. Time Out is good, but at 5cmc I'd expect more from my single-target removal.
I thought quite a bit about Over My Dead Bodies, and still haven't made a decision. I think it could be really powerful, but I'm curious if my group would be grumpy because it warps the game so much? I'll have to talk to them first.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears// 10 Artifact
1 Torpor Orb
1 Anvil of Bogardan
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Vedalken Orrery
1 Mindlock Orb
1 Sundial of the Infinite
1 Altar of Dementia
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Dowsing Dagger
1 Skullclamp
// 30 Creature
1 Volrath's Shapeshifter
1 Mikaeus, the Unhallowed
1 Phage the Untouchable
1 Filth
1 Havengul Lich
1 Necrotic Ooze
1 Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
1 Deathbringer Thoctar
1 Wonder
1 Thraximundar
1 Gravecrawler
1 Notion Thief
1 Undead Alchemist
1 Dralnu, Lich Lord
1 Death Baron
1 Fatestitcher
1 Nekusar, the Mindrazer
1 Ghoulcaller Gisa
1 Corpse Augur
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Diregraf Colossus
1 Magus of the Wheel
1 Haunted Dead
1 Nevermaker
1 Anger
1 Feldon of the Third Path
1 Nimble Obstructionist
1 Vindictive Lich
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 The Locust God
// 5 Enchantment
1 Elemental Mastery
1 Endless Whispers
1 Rooftop Storm
1 Goblin Bombardment
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
// 11 Instant
1 Stifle
1 Trickbind
1 Hatred
1 Time Stop
1 Tainted Strike
1 Final Fortune
1 Reins of Power
1 Soul's Fire
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Glorious End
1 Disallow
// 36 Land
3 Island
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Island
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Steam Vents
1 Rogue's Passage
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Smoldering Marsh
1 Homeward Path
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Volcanic Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Graven Cairns
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Cathedral of War
1 Canyon Slough
1 Fetid Pools
// 1 Planeswalker
1 Dack Fayden
// 6 Sorcery
1 Living Death
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Faithless Looting
1 Mystic Retrieval
1 Scrap Mastery
1 Ever After
// 2 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Lord of Tresserhorn
// 1 Land
SB: 1 Lost Vale
// 1 Tokens
// 1 Emblem
1 Dack Fayden (emblem)
Here is my list in case you would like some ideas. It is focused on winning out of nowhere, from a sudden infinite combo, Phage win, or a one shot Lord of Tresserhorn. Every card works with each other so no tutors are necessary. I have every possible way in the game to counter a triggered ability, except for Voidslime and Humility since those are outside of Grixis colors. I think taking out your ETB triggers will help you the most.
Rivals of Ixalan full spoiler is up! Below is a list of cards I think at least merit discussion. Let me know what you think or if you think I missed anything.
- Vona's Hunger: Edict effects are a favored type of removal in this list; however, this is a spot removal spell, and as such I will generally never get the target I want. Even at 3cmc, we have access to better, more dependable removal.
- Twilight Prophet: Shame it's not a zombie.
- The Immortal Sun: This seems like it would be great in this list.
So, unfortunately there's not a whole lot for this list from Rivals. The Immortal Sun will likely earn a spot, but that's about it.Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsI have been trying some variations of your list (differ by about 10 cards) and would like propose/discuss some cards. In particular I feel that all the lords lead to to much 3 drops, so I like to swap in cheaper zombies.
Phyrexian Altar: Together with gravecrawler it to can combo with almost any tax effect. So I prefer it over Ashnods Altar, which only advantage seems to be ramp into fatties.
Tymaret, the Murder King: Great toolbox as it provides an expensive sac outlet (even when in graveyard) and can reccur itself. Shots down small creatures and planeswalker.
Relentless Dead: Can recur itself. Combos with rooftop storm and phyrexian altar.
Gisa and Geralf: It is not in your list, do you play them? Never had them out for long to really test them.
Graveborn Muse: Isnt this card a more costly Phyrexian Altar that is also a zombie? The 3 slot is quite full - i would play a lord on t3 rather than arena, if i have the choice.
Plague Belcher: I like him over blood artist, although it is a 3 drop. It can kill our own creatures, if we have no sac outlet and is fat zombie.
Lord of the accursed Another lord with pseudo evasion and only one B in the casting cost. Prefer him over Cemetery Reaper for example.
Cryptbreaker: Great one drop.
Withered Wretch: Graveyard hate is very relevant in my meta.
Cheers,
yell
Unfortunately my list hasn’t been updated properly. You have some great suggestions in here, and a few of them have made it into my permanent list, which I’ll update shortly: Cryptbreaker, Relentless Dead, and Gisa and Geralf. They’re all great and deserve their spots.
Phyrexian Altar is great and worth an add, but my list has a high CMC and I’ve found that Ashnod’s Altar helps me power out the higher portions of my deck earlier. I would agree with anyone who ran Phyrexian Altar instead of Ashnod’s, or in addition to it.
Tymaret, the Murder King: this is a decent card, but for me I think it’s a bit too mana-intensive for what you get. Have you ran it a lot, and have you found that you use his activated abilities regularly?
Graveborn Muse: Great card, but when I tried it early on in this deck, it killed me almost as often as it saved me. Great card, but I wish it had a “may” ability. As it reads, it is dangerous to play in the mid-late game, which is when I’d ideally be playing this guy.
Plague Belcher: It’s a decent effect, but the life gain from Blood Artist is why I’d choose it over the belcher. Good card, and I used to run more bleeder effects, and if I did this guy would be an auto include.
Lord of the Accursed: Yeah, this is a good card. I wouldn’t choose it over Cemetery Reaper, which provides for graveyard hate in addition the lord. But the team menace is great and I need to test it.
Withered Wretch: Of course this is an amazing card. Like you noted, it’s probably meta dependent, and I haven’t found myself needing it yet, but it’s definitely on my radar.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsFor reference, our historic card count for the current list is approximately 20, so I am choosing to not include historic-matters cards. For lists with a higher historic permanent count, this could change what cards you might include from Dominaria.
Karn, Scion of Urza: One of the big hype cards of the set. Planeswalkers haven't fared well in this deck, unless their abilities are directly on theme with the deck (Venser, the Sojourner), but they are always fun to look at. This guy is a really good card, and will be a solid draw engine for a lot of decks. However, in this deck, we have better card draw, especially since Karn will need to survive for you to get some serious gas out of him. Fun card, but will not earn a spot in this deck.
- Dark Bargain: Interesting card, and lets us selectively fill the yard. However, I think we have access to better card draw, so I will pass on this one.
- The Eldest Reborn: This should be inherent massive card advantage, and I might test it. It doesn't fit our theme exceptionally well, but I could see this doing some good work as a fancy removal spell.
- Josu Vess, Lich Knight: Absolutely going into this deck. Early game you can cast him for early attack/block/sacrifice, and late game you can cast him to close out a game. Very great card for this deck!
- Final Parting: Interesting tutor, as you get a Diabolical Tutor and an Entomb out of one card. This probably won't make it, but I'll consider testing it, as you can always fill your yard with whatever creature you currently need (Gravecrawler, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, etc).
- Torgaar, Famine Incarnate: Shame this guy isn't a zombie. This would be a neat addition, but I don't think it will do enough in EDH to deserve a slot in this deck.
- Whisper, Blood Liturgist: Very powerful effect. I wish she was a zombie. I don't think I'll be testing her.
- Yawgmoth's Vile Offering: Neat spell, and on theme with the deck. I dislike adding non-zombie cards to the deck in general, but this one might be worth testing.
- Garna, the Bloodflame: This is a very powerful effect, considering all of our sacrifice outlets and board wipes. It's a shame he's not a zombie. This might be worth testing.
- Cabal Stronghold: This is not worth adding to this list, but if I used a different mana base, I might consider it.
- The memorial lands, Memorial to Folly, Memorial to Genius, and Memorial to War are all interesting and worth testing, though I think only the black one has much promise for this deck.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsCurrently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsBelow are a list of cards I think warrant a discussion for inclusion in this deck. If you think I missed anything, or just want to talk about these cards, please don't be scared to comment!
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears- Rabid Wombat
Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen this creature before. It seems like it could be really powerful, though it is competing for a spot with the likes of Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Havengul Lich, and Grimgrin, Corpse-Born, all of which can end the game quickly as well. What would you cut for it?
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears- Rabid Wombat
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears- Amass (as a mechanic): I think this is worthwhile, as they still count as zombie tokens. Depending on the card, I think going keeper into Amass is a solid idea.
- God-Eternal Kefnet: Cool card, but unfortunately we don't run many instants or soceries, so this won't be going in.
- Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion: The RR in the casting cost is very restrictive, but the trigger on damage is a great way to fill the graveyard and draw new gas. However, the fact that it adds red mana to the pool is also a problem.
- Bolas's Citadel: Neat card. Probably too expensive for this deck, but it's a consideration in any deck that is heavy in black.
- Dreadhorde Invasion: One of the better cards for this deck in the set. A slightly worse Bitterblossom, but it makes zombie token(s) each turn is a very strong play on turn 2. The extra text might sometimes be relevant in this deck, but unlikely.
- God-Eternal Bontu: Also a solid candidate for testing, this guy is thankfully a zombie. Together with a deck that already makes a fair amount of tokens, this could be a decent draw engine that I can recur if necessary.
- Liliana, Dreadhorde General: This walker has it all - card draw, removal, and zombie token generation. Strange she doesn't create an army token, but that's fine with me. I think she is definitely deserving of a slot, and will probably go in to replace Liliana's Mastery.
- Liliana's Triumph: Not as good in EDH as it will be in other formats, this is still a solid piece of removal. I don't think it will win a slot in my list, but if I had more Liliana cards in the deck, this card might be more deserving of a slot.
- Spark Reaper: This card is pretty good, though I think the activated ability is a bit too pricey to actually play. The ability is very powerful in the deck though, and I wouldn't fault someone for running it.
- Vizier of the Scorpion: This gives you two bodies on turn 3, which is relevant when you want to cast Lord of Tresserhorn on turn 4 and have two dudes to sacrifice. However, the extra text of giving your zombie tokens (not just zombie ARMY tokens!) is very important and I will test this card.
- Eternal Skylord: Much like the Vizier, above, this guy is great in that he comes with two bodies and is a zombie himself. And like Vizier, this guy grants all zombie tokens a very powerful ability - flying. The 5cmc is very expensive, but the payoff might be worth it. I will test this guy.
- Angrath's Rampage: Neat removal spell. Unfortunately, it is sorcery speed and it gives the opponent the choice of creature/walker removal, so I'll generally choose Dreadbore over this.
- Dreadhorde Butcher: I think this is too little impact for EDH play, though he's aggressively-costed and would play better in some tempo version of this deck, if it exists.
- Enter the God-Eternals: Creature removal, life gain, fill your yard, and token generation in one spell is good. Even with all those boxes checked, I still am not convinced this is worth a lot at 5cmc with a restrictive mana requirement.
- Gleaming Overseer: This fella is aggressively costed for the body, and like Vizier of the Scorpion, gives you two bodies on turn 3. I still think Vizier wins out, but this would be a solid addition.
- Soul Diviner: This card was better in limited than I expected; however, unless I'm going heavily into amass (still undecided!), this will whiff pretty often in my deck. Otherwise this would be a nice source of card advantage stapled to an aggressively-costed body.
What do you think? Are there any other cards that you're excited to try in your Tresserhorn (or other zombie) build, or do you have a different opinion on some cards? Feel free to share your thoughts!Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears5/19/19:
+Liliana, Dreadhorde General, Gleaming Overseer
-Bloodchief Ascension, Karn Liberated
Why: Through testing, my list has morphed into one that doesn't look quite like my original thread. These two have been taken out for testing, and I haven't missed them. Bloodchief Ascension does nothing until it has 3 counters, and once it does, it makes you Archenemy. Karn Liberated is great removal for probably permanent types (enchantments and artifacts) but lately I haven't been facing down ones that this deck cannot simply fight through. On the other hand, Liliana, Dreadhorde General is AMAZING for the deck: the static ability should fill our hand, the plus makes fodder, the minus is amazing removal, and the ultimate should end the game. Gleaming Overseer provides evasion to all my tokens and gives me two bodies on turn 3, which can help with casting Lord of Tresserhorn early.
I also considered Eternal Taskmaster, Vizier of the Scorpion, Dreadhorde Invasion, and Eternal Skylord. After speaking to my playgroup, all people who know this deck and have played against it dozens of times, I think Gleaming Overseer provides the best perk to my tokens (menace) on an aggressively-costed body and obviously Liliana, Dreadhorde General is just an awesome card for the deck. I held off on the Vizier, Invasion, and Skylord because, as my opponents pointed out, this deck is not all about making tokens. While I often have tokens available, they aren't the focus of this deck, and therefore the token buff is almost an afterthought for me. If I want to change up the build a bit to be more focused on tokens, I'd immediately add those three cards. Eternal Taskmaster is just very mana intensive, and I already have some great recursion at a better rate.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsI really like Ikoria, but the set doesn't have much for this deck. The only card worth a look is Footfall Crater. Haste and trample are both big for Tresserhorn, and the cycling is good if I'm in a game where it's a dead card.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsI think the Commander 2020 decks are great. Below is a list of cards I think deserve some thought about being added to the deck. Let me know what you think of these cards or if you think I missed any!
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsIn (22 cards):
Out (22 cards):
Notes: I updated the mana base (temples, Lavaclaw Reaches). I had to move my one copy of Cabal Coffers to a deck where it fits better (The Gitrog Monster); when I acquire another copy (probably when it gets printed next), I'll add it back in. Since it's out for now, I took out a few other cards that focused on Coffers/Urborg: Expedition Map, Frantic Search, and Thespian's Stage. I upgraded my creature removal suite to be even more flexible (Oblivion Stone, Terminate). I added in a bunch of versatile card draw, so I removed some of the less efficient options (Skullclamp, Necromancer's Stockpile). I added in more flexible recursion options, so removed some less flexible options (Reanimate, Liliana, Death's Majesty), Removed some less steller cards in favor of some flexible cards (Lich Lord of Unx, Prized Amalgam). Finally, Blood Artist is great, but some of my additions really want the zombie creature type, so I took out any non-zombies that I thought I might be able to afford to lose.
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebears