III is really good, in most cases there will be a creature or planeswalker with cmc over 5, so it basically pays for itself after three turns. All three abilities provide card advantage, with I and III providing mana advantage. In most cases it is better than a 5cmc enchantment with "draw three cards. at beg. of your upkeep, put a counter, at three counters sacrifice and gain 5 mana"
Compared to Ob Nixilis Reignited, +1 and -3 are better in exchange for starting with one less loyalty.
@MTGTCG: Thank you for posting those! Those are the exact 4 cards I am planning on adding once the set drops. I am also thinking of adding Phyrexian Scriptures as a kind of delayed damnation, which could be pretty convenient because it gives you the initiative, and also removes all of your opponent's graveyards. The art on that card is also 10/10.
What do you guys think about adding Replenish? I feel like it could be super valuable in this deck, being able to bring back Humility and the Abyss is awesome (for just 4 mana!). Also, if we play more of the Planeswalker Oaths, we have more legendary permanents to trigger the new Primeval's Glorious Rebirth (Probably a must-have from now on), which also synergises with Replenish. I feel like this card is being slept on, it seems to fit right in with the goals of this deck.
At what point will adding Captain Sisay be worthwhile? I know Trav is pretty against adding creatures, but just one can't hurt, right? I feel like we might get to a point where 30%+ of the deck is legendary cards, so we could get more of a toolbox feel from playing Sisay.
I'm stoked for this set. Hopefully the new legendary permanent frame is awesome!
I see Primevals’ Glorious Rebirth, and my mind immediately goes to an all-in dredge deck that tries to Replenish ALL the planeswalkers into play. Sounds like a horrible idea but fun. I’m stoked for this set
What do you guys think about the new card Mox Amber?
Seems pretty good, about 25% of the deck turns it on. That could also be an argument against as sometimes it literally does nothing.
I've also been thinking about Tezzeret, Master of Metal. I had him in my deck when it had a lot more artifact synergy, but I think he might be pretty good with a handful of artifacts too. His +1 is "draw an artifact from your deck" which is halfway between draw a card and tutor an artifact. His main issue is that 6 CMC.
I really don't think Mox Amber is good outside of dedicated combo decks. For us, we'd be getting an extra mana on turn 3 or 4. Compared to Birds of Paradise, I don't think it is better enough to be worth a slot. Normally we want to be controlling the board, and -1ing ourselves in card advantage is definitely not worth an extra mana on turn 4 or 5 you may not have use for (say you play a planeswalker on turn 3, will you really use that 1 extra mana?).
Tezzeret also sounds pretty sweet, until you think about it as 4UB: Draw an artifact. I don't think that's worthwhile whatsoever. Planeswalkers that don't protect themselves have to be pretty damn good, and I don't think this Tezzeret makes the cut.
Yeah, I think you're right on both counts. I run Tasigur, the Golden Fang as my general so I have a more limited pool of planeswalkers, but even then at 6CMC Tezzeret seems less effective than any given Jace or just Tezzeret the Seeker.
I don't think Jodah really aligns with what our deck wants to do. You pay 4 mana to get out a fragile creature that could potentially reduce a future card's mana cost by 1 or 2, but otherwise doesn't really advance our game plan. For example, Trav's deck has an average cmc of 3.85 (pretty sure this doesn't include lands), so I don't see Jodah helping much. A cool thing you could do is curve Jodah into a 10 drop on turn 5, but I think overall something like sliver queen or sliver hivelord is much better.
I could see a cool deck idea with Replenish, Academy Rector, and Omniscience and Primeval's Glorious Rebirth (with a bunch of the planeswalker Oaths!) with Jodah at the helm, but the idea may need some more refining.
I don't think Jodah really aligns with what our deck wants to do. You pay 4 mana to get out a fragile creature that could potentially reduce a future card's mana cost by 1 or 2, but otherwise doesn't really advance our game plan. For example, Trav's deck has an average cmc of 3.85 (pretty sure this doesn't include lands), so I don't see Jodah helping much. A cool thing you could do is curve Jodah into a 10 drop on turn 5, but I think overall something like sliver queen or sliver hivelord is much better.
I could see a cool deck idea with Replenish, Academy Rector, and Omniscience and Primeval's Glorious Rebirth (with a bunch of the planeswalker Oaths!) with Jodah at the helm, but the idea may need some more refining.
This is the direction I was gonna take my deck actually and I like Jodah for it because I play a majority of the 6+ walkers. I also am currently using Urza, Academy Headmaster as the general so it will be nice to have a spare "real" general.
I was just thinking today how insane Intuition is. You can find 3 enchantments and get 2+ back with replenish, or get 3 planeswalkers and get them back with our new Primeval's Glorious Rebirth(just officially spoiled with amazing art). Dominaria has introduced a lot of reanimation effects for planeswalkers, so maybe we can start being more proactive. Play a bunch of walkers, let them die, cycle through your deck, then reanimated all of them!
Edit: We have a Quicksilver Amulet that hits planeswalkers! Besides a possible cost discount, It can smooth out your mana a little, and makes your planeswalkers uncounterable.
I managed to get my Teferi the day before they spiked in paper, just arrived along with Oath of Teferi! I really need to sit down with my list and figure out what I’m cutting. My list online has diverged a little, since I haven’t had a chance to ad the new Nicol Bolas either online. I’ll post my changes once I have them. What is everyone else doing?
I was just thinking today how insane Intuition is. You can find 3 enchantments and get 2+ back with replenish, or get 3 planeswalkers and get them back with our new Primeval's Glorious Rebirth(just officially spoiled with amazing art). Dominaria has introduced a lot of reanimation effects for planeswalkers, so maybe we can start being more proactive. Play a bunch of walkers, let them die, cycle through your deck, then reanimated all of them!
Edit: We have a Quicksilver Amulet that hits planeswalkers! Besides a possible cost discount, It can smooth out your mana a little, and makes your planeswalkers uncounterable.
Jodah doesn't make them uncounterable; he's simply an Infinity Gauntlet on a legendary creature.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I was actually referring to Thran Temporal Gateway! I'm pretty bummed I missed out on getting Teferi before the spike, but I can always pick him up later...
Very reasonable changes. Any chance you would add Primeval's Glorious Rebirth ? It seems like the card with the highest potential to shake up the deck from Dominaria, and it looks like a solid win condition.
Edit: The new partnered commanders are super cool. Will Kenrith looks very playable for us, but Rowan just seems like a wash. Which is too bad, because they tutor eachother.
Got in a game in this weekend. Oath of Teferi did serious work and changes the math on people who think they have time before ultimate.
Muldrotha with The Immortal Sun was a complete PITA, but got it removed for the right turns.
Regarding BBD, Will Kenrith actually looks decent. 6 CMC is a lot but the -2 Sol Rings all your important spells and it protects your board with the +2.
I’m still running Dovin Baan but every time I draw it, I wish it was something else. I could see cutting it from my list.
Part of me wants to cast Arena Rector into my own Lethal Vapors as a best case or a rattlesnake chump blocker at it’s worst. Unfortunately, it may just turn on all the dead Swords and Paths people are holding. I’ll test it online once it gets put into Treasure Chests
I would run Academy Rector before running Arena Rector in this deck. They both work really well with Tabernacle.
Will Kenrith is pretty excellent when combined with wraths, holding two creatures down can tide you over between board clears, and the -2 is excellent card advantage. I am really interested in trying him out, but unfortunately I don't think Rowan Kenrith will make the cut, even with the partner tutor upside.
Has anyone had any experience with Teferi, Hero of Dominaria? He looks like a slam dunk for this deck, but I'm waiting until the Standard hype dies down before purchasing.
I haven’t got Teferi yet online put he is on my short list. I have him in paper but haven’t had a chance to take the deck out. Pretty sure it will be an absolute slam dunk.
I’m assuming the Rector will be cheaper online so I may get one to play with to test. Won’t hit until 7/5 and then will have to see what’s the prices are like. Think I’ll get Will at the same time to test before committing in paper.
10 Duals
10 fetches
Ancient tomb
City of traitors
mana confluence
gemstone cavern
command tower
Urborg tomb of Yawgmoth
City of brass
7 shocks exclude (Blood Crypt/Temple Garden/Scared Foundry)
Chrome Mox
Mana Vault
mana crypt
sensei divining top
sol ring
fellwar stone
grim monolith
chromatic lantern
basalt monolith
Rings of brightearth
coalition relic
thran dynamo
Carpet of flowers
sylvan library
humility
doubling season
oath of teferi
omniscience
imperial seal
demonic tutor
nature's lore
three visits
toxic deluge
yagmoth's will
genesis wave
supreme verdict
fiery confluence
jokulhapps
primeval glorius rebirth
enlightened tutor
mystical tutor
vampric tutor
Mana Drain
arena rector
academy rector
deepglow skate
pir imaginative rascal
Dack fayden
Daretti
ral zarek
Garruk Relentless
naihri harbringer
jace the mind sculpator
jace archiet of thought
narset transcendent
tamiyo field researcher
karn scion of urza
garruk wildspeaker
chandra torch of defiance
Garruk relentless
jace reveler of secret
jaya ballard
obi nixillis
lilana vess
vraska the unseen
tezzeret the seeker
chandra flamecaller
vraska relic seeker
elspeth sunchampion
ajani unyielding
sorin grim nemesis
teferi temporal archmage
karn liberated
nico bolas god pharoh
nico bolas planeswalker
ugin spirit dragon
I took out mishra's workshop, gilded lotus and Austere command because they have too high casting cost and are easily nerfed in my meta which is heavy on prison and counterspells. Garruk relentless, pir imaginative rascal and fiery confluence are my latest inclusion and they are great so far. Relentless is a good creature tutor. I have about 15 spells which is able to kill both rectors which i feel is optimal in going off the combo. Pir imaginative rascal is so good as it makes your ral zarek and ugin ultimate 2 turns earlier.
Hey everyone, sorry I haven't been keeping up but I'm glad to see discussing is ongoing.
Want to comment on a few things:
Will Kenrith - Honestly, relooking at this card, he seems great. His first ability is exactly what this deck wants, and his second ability is not only card advantage but ramp. Pretty awesome. His ultimate is honestly mediocre, which is why I'm sort of skeptical. I'm thinking about adding him and dropping the two Gideons, so I need to look for another cheap 'walker. Maybe something from M19?
Battlebond Duals - Oh how I wish these were fetchable. These would be amazing and would replace the shocks, in my opinion.
Primevals' Glorious Rebirth - VERY interesting bomb like card. I could see running it, but it is expensive. Has anyone tested with it?
Glad to hear people are liking Teferi/Teferi's Oath. They both seemed great off the bat. I haven't had a chance to play with either, so I'm excited to see.
Do you have any thoughts about wheel of fortune? I think it may be a worthwhile inclusion, especially if we starting towards some graveyard shenanigans with Primeval's Glorious Rebirth and Replenish. You can also add Intuition to the mix and start doing cool stuff with Yawgmoth's Will and Regrowth!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
EDIT: actually i dont know about karn
III is really good, in most cases there will be a creature or planeswalker with cmc over 5, so it basically pays for itself after three turns. All three abilities provide card advantage, with I and III providing mana advantage. In most cases it is better than a 5cmc enchantment with "draw three cards. at beg. of your upkeep, put a counter, at three counters sacrifice and gain 5 mana"
Compared to Ob Nixilis Reignited, +1 and -3 are better in exchange for starting with one less loyalty.
super powerful late game
Better than The Chain Veil
What do you guys think about adding Replenish? I feel like it could be super valuable in this deck, being able to bring back Humility and the Abyss is awesome (for just 4 mana!). Also, if we play more of the Planeswalker Oaths, we have more legendary permanents to trigger the new Primeval's Glorious Rebirth (Probably a must-have from now on), which also synergises with Replenish. I feel like this card is being slept on, it seems to fit right in with the goals of this deck.
At what point will adding Captain Sisay be worthwhile? I know Trav is pretty against adding creatures, but just one can't hurt, right? I feel like we might get to a point where 30%+ of the deck is legendary cards, so we could get more of a toolbox feel from playing Sisay.
I'm stoked for this set. Hopefully the new legendary permanent frame is awesome!
G Azusa, Wherever I May Roam
UG Rashmi Simic Power
WB Kambal Life Gain Kills
URG Maelstrom Wanderer Howdy
Seems pretty good, about 25% of the deck turns it on. That could also be an argument against as sometimes it literally does nothing.
I've also been thinking about Tezzeret, Master of Metal. I had him in my deck when it had a lot more artifact synergy, but I think he might be pretty good with a handful of artifacts too. His +1 is "draw an artifact from your deck" which is halfway between draw a card and tutor an artifact. His main issue is that 6 CMC.
Tezzeret also sounds pretty sweet, until you think about it as 4UB: Draw an artifact. I don't think that's worthwhile whatsoever. Planeswalkers that don't protect themselves have to be pretty damn good, and I don't think this Tezzeret makes the cut.
I could see a cool deck idea with Replenish, Academy Rector, and Omniscience and Primeval's Glorious Rebirth (with a bunch of the planeswalker Oaths!) with Jodah at the helm, but the idea may need some more refining.
This is the direction I was gonna take my deck actually and I like Jodah for it because I play a majority of the 6+ walkers. I also am currently using Urza, Academy Headmaster as the general so it will be nice to have a spare "real" general.
I was just thinking today how insane Intuition is. You can find 3 enchantments and get 2+ back with replenish, or get 3 planeswalkers and get them back with our new Primeval's Glorious Rebirth(just officially spoiled with amazing art). Dominaria has introduced a lot of reanimation effects for planeswalkers, so maybe we can start being more proactive. Play a bunch of walkers, let them die, cycle through your deck, then reanimated all of them!
Edit: We have a Quicksilver Amulet that hits planeswalkers! Besides a possible cost discount, It can smooth out your mana a little, and makes your planeswalkers uncounterable.
G Azusa, Wherever I May Roam
UG Rashmi Simic Power
WB Kambal Life Gain Kills
URG Maelstrom Wanderer Howdy
Jodah doesn't make them uncounterable; he's simply an Infinity Gauntlet on a legendary creature.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Ob Nixilis Reignited -> Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
Oath of Gideon -> Oath of Teferi
Edit: The new partnered commanders are super cool. Will Kenrith looks very playable for us, but Rowan just seems like a wash. Which is too bad, because they tutor eachother.
Muldrotha with The Immortal Sun was a complete PITA, but got it removed for the right turns.
Regarding BBD, Will Kenrith actually looks decent. 6 CMC is a lot but the -2 Sol Rings all your important spells and it protects your board with the +2.
I’m still running Dovin Baan but every time I draw it, I wish it was something else. I could see cutting it from my list.
Part of me wants to cast Arena Rector into my own Lethal Vapors as a best case or a rattlesnake chump blocker at it’s worst. Unfortunately, it may just turn on all the dead Swords and Paths people are holding. I’ll test it online once it gets put into Treasure Chests
G Azusa, Wherever I May Roam
UG Rashmi Simic Power
WB Kambal Life Gain Kills
URG Maelstrom Wanderer Howdy
Has anyone done any testing with Arena Rector? I'm strongly considering it, but would like to hear feedback before buying one.
WUBRG Sliver Queen 5 Color Super Friend Tokens GRBUW
RRR Zada, Hedron GrinderJohnny RedRRR
Will Kenrith is pretty excellent when combined with wraths, holding two creatures down can tide you over between board clears, and the -2 is excellent card advantage. I am really interested in trying him out, but unfortunately I don't think Rowan Kenrith will make the cut, even with the partner tutor upside.
Has anyone had any experience with Teferi, Hero of Dominaria? He looks like a slam dunk for this deck, but I'm waiting until the Standard hype dies down before purchasing.
I’m assuming the Rector will be cheaper online so I may get one to play with to test. Won’t hit until 7/5 and then will have to see what’s the prices are like. Think I’ll get Will at the same time to test before committing in paper.
G Azusa, Wherever I May Roam
UG Rashmi Simic Power
WB Kambal Life Gain Kills
URG Maelstrom Wanderer Howdy
10 Duals
10 fetches
Ancient tomb
City of traitors
mana confluence
gemstone cavern
command tower
Urborg tomb of Yawgmoth
City of brass
7 shocks exclude (Blood Crypt/Temple Garden/Scared Foundry)
Chrome Mox
Mana Vault
mana crypt
sensei divining top
sol ring
fellwar stone
grim monolith
chromatic lantern
basalt monolith
Rings of brightearth
coalition relic
thran dynamo
Carpet of flowers
sylvan library
humility
doubling season
oath of teferi
omniscience
imperial seal
demonic tutor
nature's lore
three visits
toxic deluge
yagmoth's will
genesis wave
supreme verdict
fiery confluence
jokulhapps
primeval glorius rebirth
enlightened tutor
mystical tutor
vampric tutor
Mana Drain
arena rector
academy rector
deepglow skate
pir imaginative rascal
Dack fayden
Daretti
ral zarek
Garruk Relentless
naihri harbringer
jace the mind sculpator
jace archiet of thought
narset transcendent
tamiyo field researcher
karn scion of urza
garruk wildspeaker
chandra torch of defiance
Garruk relentless
jace reveler of secret
jaya ballard
obi nixillis
lilana vess
vraska the unseen
tezzeret the seeker
chandra flamecaller
vraska relic seeker
elspeth sunchampion
ajani unyielding
sorin grim nemesis
teferi temporal archmage
karn liberated
nico bolas god pharoh
nico bolas planeswalker
ugin spirit dragon
I took out mishra's workshop, gilded lotus and Austere command because they have too high casting cost and are easily nerfed in my meta which is heavy on prison and counterspells. Garruk relentless, pir imaginative rascal and fiery confluence are my latest inclusion and they are great so far. Relentless is a good creature tutor. I have about 15 spells which is able to kill both rectors which i feel is optimal in going off the combo. Pir imaginative rascal is so good as it makes your ral zarek and ugin ultimate 2 turns earlier.
Want to comment on a few things:
Will Kenrith - Honestly, relooking at this card, he seems great. His first ability is exactly what this deck wants, and his second ability is not only card advantage but ramp. Pretty awesome. His ultimate is honestly mediocre, which is why I'm sort of skeptical. I'm thinking about adding him and dropping the two Gideons, so I need to look for another cheap 'walker. Maybe something from M19?
Battlebond Duals - Oh how I wish these were fetchable. These would be amazing and would replace the shocks, in my opinion.
Arena Rector - Was never a big fan of Academy Rector and I think it's better than this card. Not a fan.
Primevals' Glorious Rebirth - VERY interesting bomb like card. I could see running it, but it is expensive. Has anyone tested with it?
Glad to hear people are liking Teferi/Teferi's Oath. They both seemed great off the bat. I haven't had a chance to play with either, so I'm excited to see.
Would love this card for the deck if the second plus didn't restrict to dragons.
Do you have any thoughts about wheel of fortune? I think it may be a worthwhile inclusion, especially if we starting towards some graveyard shenanigans with Primeval's Glorious Rebirth and Replenish. You can also add Intuition to the mix and start doing cool stuff with Yawgmoth's Will and Regrowth!