Bring to Light seems un-good to me.
I am trying out Dimir Machinations in the slot of Bitter Ordeal, so far its rather humorous after someone Vampiric Tutors or Mystical Tutors.
..
It's been a lot like dark petition here in which has been like a slightly worse demonic tutor.
I've been able to get answers ranging from toxic deluge or gilded drake and threats via buried alive or reanimation. And the 5 mana isn't too hard
As far as dimir machinations goes I like bitter ordeal a little better because I often need to remove lab man from oloro and ad naseum from sharrum. I can remove both with just a fetch land used the same turn.
But... why? I know it's plan C (cause plan A is Jin and plan B is con sphinx) but Sire is one of the three best creatures we're able to get on board in t2/t3. I wouldn't ever consider removing it.
Most of our best graveyard fills choose the creatures. I don't see reason to put him in the grave over sphinx or Jin. And once people get enough lands on board he's pretty meh since they likely just stop playing lands. I like getting Terastodon early out way more as well.
He may come back in the future but honestly I didn't love it too much. Am I nuts here?
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
As far as dimir machinations goes I like bitter ordeal a little better because I often need to remove lab man from oloro and ad naseum from sharrum. I can remove both with just a fetch land used the same turn.
Wow.... I have played Sharuum, Ghave, and several other decks with Bitter Ordeal and never thought to use it with a fetch land, okay re-thinking.
As far as dimir machinations goes I like bitter ordeal a little better because I often need to remove lab man from oloro and ad naseum from sharrum. I can remove both with just a fetch land used the same turn.
Wow.... I have played Sharuum, Ghave, and several other decks with Bitter Ordeal and never thought to use it with a fetch land, okay re-thinking.
Also the thing with it messing with top of deck tutors is mostly invalid since most people will tutor right before their own turn and dimir machinations is a sorcery. Bitter ordeal can also take away the top card if relevant if they do it at sorcery speed (Personal, imperial seal, etc) but even if you don't want to remove it and want to take something else it shuffles that top of deck tutor away.
The only draw I see from machinations is the transmute but I feel like bitter ordeal wins this in every other way
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Well if you guys think Sire should stay in what should be cut?
I want to keep bring to light and dark petition in for more testing to see if they're worth the slot (So far I think they are.
These are my current thoughts but each of these in my opinion has been worth while.
Gilded drake (Silver bullet but useless against some decks)
Fact or fiction (Awesome card advantage but not likely on early turns)
Mental misstep (Way less good with vancouver mulls but still stops removal, tutors, and sol ring
Stubborn Denial (Worst counterspell but still pretty damn good)
Abrupt Decay (Things need to die and this cant be countered
Beast within (With the reality shift combo gone this is worse but still kills anything)
Merchant scroll (More narrow tutor as the others are better but can be done turn 1/2
Am I missing something else? Thoughts?
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Sultai Charm covers just about every problem the deck faces. There aren't too many multicolored creatures to worry about here. It makes Merchant Scroll a whole lot better
True but bring to light can do that for the same total cmc.
Dark petition can get toxic deluge for the same total cmc as well
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
On Sire of Stagnation: Draw is an awesome redundancy. He still has a niche where he's honestly a bit better than Con Sphinx against green ramp, which seems as common as blue. The exile isn't totally relevant. But that said, he isn't in the tier of some of the other all stars, and unless you ever find yourself fishing for a fatty, I think it could be cut for something with a bit more utility. All this recent change has been going in that direction anyways. My vote was in, but I know I have a subconscious bias for a UB creature that provides that much draw and has that much color in its art.
Edit: At the same time, hitting this thing early and forcing removal probably drew you some cards. He and Con Sphinx are actually really good for that. They aren't the best cards but beg for removal as if they were. If it's hard to keep a creature on board or you need to bait out removal they're great targets, especially if you're going less mass removal by keeping out Bane. They're also reasonable to cast from hand if you really need to.
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Worse than Fact or fiction but at lower cmc, we get the reanimation/tutors/counters/etc
Can't get ramp or lands if we need it though
Fact or fiction is close to the worse part of the 99 so I'm unsure on this new card but it's worth discussion.
Thoughts?
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Dominated competitive pods last night winning 5/6 games with Tasigur. Ironically I also lost a best of 3 against a 25 dollar shu yun deck. Sure it was made for 1 v 1 but I still find that funny.
Anyway, in one of the pod games my opponent played a zur's weirding which pretty much gave me the game by letting me see hands and prevent people from getting things. I discarded a winnower and reanimated it and since I was playing against shaarum, narset, and arcum they did nothing that game. I'm not suggesting adding weirding as much as I'd like to see I don't think it would be good enough but I was wondering thoughts on the card telepathy.
Turn one play that allows me to see all hands and make sure I'm safe to land jin or sphinx to combo off shortly after.
Thoughts?
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Having the info...doesn't mean you can do much with it every time. Imo it's better to just roll with any punches that come than try to telegraph them. I think you're better off with another card stopping whatever it is you want to see with Telepathy
Having the info...doesn't mean you can do much with it every time. Imo it's better to just roll with any punches that come than try to telegraph them. I think you're better off with another card stopping whatever it is you want to see with Telepathy
That's mostly what I'm thinking too but I've had a good amount of games where I land a Jin with two counterspells and he still gets path'd or whatever before my turn is over and I'm just out. I can see what you mean though.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Ended up finally getting around to putting this deck mostly together, cards are in the mail. I ended up doing some paper proxies and playing it with a couple of my friends. I love the deck, it feels dirty in the best possible way. I just need to liquidate a couple handfuls of my modern staples to get me a Bazaar now. Will be playing with an alter until that point. One question though, if you're not able to get Jin on board in the early game, is there a better Entomb/reanimation target (Outside of DEN/Palinchron). One game we played I drew a hand and had to run to the BR, so I just kept what I was a 5 land hand with Brainstorm and something else inconsequential. By the time I got a Jin on the board one of the other players had enough to start casting Maelstrom Wanderer, and the Leviathan is just not a good answer to that.
I have barely managed to play the deck considering my own meta, but I have a feeling that Void Winnower would probably be a good #2, especially if you have enough gas for a follow up. I'm guessing Mr. Bananas can help out with that.
Better because it's cheaper and you get two things of your choice rather than risk having one or more get thrown away. Will be legal in modern.
Worse because sorcery.
Slightly worse but not really because it gets only instant or sorceries, but if you like creatures or lands better, don't put it in your deck. Maybe you want creatures in your graveyard anyway, so you can keep that reanimation spell you just drew.
It's not fact or fiction, it's a completely different card and need not even be compared.
Ended up finally getting around to putting this deck mostly together, cards are in the mail. I ended up doing some paper proxies and playing it with a couple of my friends. I love the deck, it feels dirty in the best possible way. I just need to liquidate a couple handfuls of my modern staples to get me a Bazaar now. Will be playing with an alter until that point. One question though, if you're not able to get Jin on board in the early game, is there a better Entomb/reanimation target (Outside of DEN/Palinchron). One game we played I drew a hand and had to run to the BR, so I just kept what I was a 5 land hand with Brainstorm and something else inconsequential. By the time I got a Jin on the board one of the other players had enough to start casting Maelstrom Wanderer, and the Leviathan is just not a good answer to that.
It depends on what you're playing against.
If you can protect it Con Sphinx draws a ton of cards.
Against a ramp deck Sire of Stagnation is good
Against decks that have an even costed general Void Winnower
Against an early board state with a low amount of permanents (or 1 v 1) then Terastodon.
Against aggro or if you have necromancy/ enchantment reanimation then levaithan
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
As a Wanderer player, Get Rekt Leviathan is a pretty strong play at almost any point in the game, especially at instant speed. Sure, we can built a board state quickly, but having repeatable Necromancy bounce is almost impossible for us to beat.
Pure aggro decks without counters or definitive answers cannot beat levithan necromancy.
And even those have troubles because we can out value them easy with counters, phyrexian tower, and Tasigur to prevent that from ever happening. Its a soft lock for sure but damn hard for pure aggro to keep up.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
So I know this deck produces infinite mana, but how does it win? Also is there anyway you could tell me some of the combos?
Play Tasigur and activate his ability over and over until you have your library in your hand.
Now Bitter ordeal a card out of your opponents library.
Activate Tasigur, the only card for you to get back is Bitter ordeal.
Repeat until all librarys are gone and pass the turn.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
So I know this deck produces infinite mana, but how does it win? Also is there anyway you could tell me some of the combos?
Play Tasigur and activate his ability over and over until you have your library in your hand.
Now Bitter ordeal a card out of your opponents library.
Activate Tasigur, the only card for you to get back is Bitter ordeal.
Repeat until all librarys are gone and pass the turn.
No problem.
If creatures are an issue in your group I'd suggest Reality shift over bitter ordeal.
I use ordeal to kill combo decks before they can go off but if that's not an issue where you play you can play Shift.
To win with shift you do the same thing but then you reality shift one of the creatures opponents have (If they don't have any you can make one with beast within or terastodon) Then they will manifest and you get shift back and then exile the card they manifested. Now they will repeat and you can shift every card in the deck until they're all gone.
Shift is an excellent card for the deck but I cut mine because the biggest threats in my group have very very very few creatures.
That said I can see it returning in the future.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Sunday I went to a commander tournament and I thought I'd share the experience.
Round 1 against Zur and bladewing
I know that the Zur player was one of the better decks and the Bladewing player himself said he was fairly new to this so I definitely focused more on Zur.
Zur mana drain's a turn 3 necromancy on Jin and casts Zur on his turn. Cut to my turn and I frantic search to find something. I dig into gilded drake and reanimation.
Gilded drake gets countered but the reanimation goes through and now I keep Zur. The turn passes back to me, I swing with Zur to get animate dead to get Jin on board and it's all over after that.
Round 2 against Daretti and Narset
I go first and play deathrite. Daretti and narset both get sol rings.
I draw mental misstep...ugh..
Play careful study into void winnower.
Play sylvan safekeeper and reanimate Void winnower. Both players cannot play general. I start swinging at Daretti since he likely has creature wipes to kill him, and play Tasigur to hopefully get myself counters.
It doesn't really matter too much because after a while I kill Daretti and Narset never got to do anything.
Round 3 against Progenitus (What?) and Azami.
Progenitus goes for turn 3 Hermit druid and Azami taps out to counter it. Pass to my turn and I reanimate a con sphinx and start drawing cards. Progenitus gets hermit druid back to hand and cast him again. Azami plays a bounce spell on con sphinx which gets misdirected on to hermit druid.
I crack Cepheid coliseum on progenitus to draw 6 cards and combo off that turn.
Fun tourney and lots of good decks there.
Went him with a box of oath.
Which had about 30 bucks in cards in it.
Still had a blast
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
I am trying out Dimir Machinations in the slot of Bitter Ordeal, so far its rather humorous after someone Vampiric Tutors or Mystical Tutors, and almost made a Mizzix player cry when he cast Long-Term Plans.
..
Azusa - Derevi - Glissa - Mizzix - Sharuum - Wanderer - Wort
It's been a lot like dark petition here in which has been like a slightly worse demonic tutor.
I've been able to get answers ranging from toxic deluge or gilded drake and threats via buried alive or reanimation. And the 5 mana isn't too hard
As far as dimir machinations goes I like bitter ordeal a little better because I often need to remove lab man from oloro and ad naseum from sharrum. I can remove both with just a fetch land used the same turn.
Most of our best graveyard fills choose the creatures. I don't see reason to put him in the grave over sphinx or Jin. And once people get enough lands on board he's pretty meh since they likely just stop playing lands. I like getting Terastodon early out way more as well.
He may come back in the future but honestly I didn't love it too much. Am I nuts here?
Edit:
Poll added to see if I'm nuts
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Wow.... I have played Sharuum, Ghave, and several other decks with Bitter Ordeal and never thought to use it with a fetch land, okay re-thinking.
Azusa - Derevi - Glissa - Mizzix - Sharuum - Wanderer - Wort
Also the thing with it messing with top of deck tutors is mostly invalid since most people will tutor right before their own turn and dimir machinations is a sorcery. Bitter ordeal can also take away the top card if relevant if they do it at sorcery speed (Personal, imperial seal, etc) but even if you don't want to remove it and want to take something else it shuffles that top of deck tutor away.
The only draw I see from machinations is the transmute but I feel like bitter ordeal wins this in every other way
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Well if you guys think Sire should stay in what should be cut?
I want to keep bring to light and dark petition in for more testing to see if they're worth the slot (So far I think they are.
These are my current thoughts but each of these in my opinion has been worth while.
Gilded drake (Silver bullet but useless against some decks)
Fact or fiction (Awesome card advantage but not likely on early turns)
Mental misstep (Way less good with vancouver mulls but still stops removal, tutors, and sol ring
Stubborn Denial (Worst counterspell but still pretty damn good)
Abrupt Decay (Things need to die and this cant be countered
Beast within (With the reality shift combo gone this is worse but still kills anything)
Merchant scroll (More narrow tutor as the others are better but can be done turn 1/2
Am I missing something else? Thoughts?
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
Dark petition can get toxic deluge for the same total cmc as well
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Edit: At the same time, hitting this thing early and forcing removal probably drew you some cards. He and Con Sphinx are actually really good for that. They aren't the best cards but beg for removal as if they were. If it's hard to keep a creature on board or you need to bait out removal they're great targets, especially if you're going less mass removal by keeping out Bane. They're also reasonable to cast from hand if you really need to.
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
+Sire of stagnation
-Merchant scroll
Lets see where this goes
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Thoughts on pieces of the puzzle?
Worse than Fact or fiction but at lower cmc, we get the reanimation/tutors/counters/etc
Can't get ramp or lands if we need it though
Fact or fiction is close to the worse part of the 99 so I'm unsure on this new card but it's worth discussion.
Thoughts?
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Anyway, in one of the pod games my opponent played a zur's weirding which pretty much gave me the game by letting me see hands and prevent people from getting things. I discarded a winnower and reanimated it and since I was playing against shaarum, narset, and arcum they did nothing that game. I'm not suggesting adding weirding as much as I'd like to see I don't think it would be good enough but I was wondering thoughts on the card telepathy.
Turn one play that allows me to see all hands and make sure I'm safe to land jin or sphinx to combo off shortly after.
Thoughts?
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
URXSurf's Up, Mizz Magnus!XRU
URGWKynaios and Tiro's Multiplayer MenagerieWGRU
That's mostly what I'm thinking too but I've had a good amount of games where I land a Jin with two counterspells and he still gets path'd or whatever before my turn is over and I'm just out. I can see what you mean though.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
Worse because sorcery.
Slightly worse but not really because it gets only instant or sorceries, but if you like creatures or lands better, don't put it in your deck. Maybe you want creatures in your graveyard anyway, so you can keep that reanimation spell you just drew.
It's not fact or fiction, it's a completely different card and need not even be compared.
It depends on what you're playing against.
If you can protect it Con Sphinx draws a ton of cards.
Against a ramp deck Sire of Stagnation is good
Against decks that have an even costed general Void Winnower
Against an early board state with a low amount of permanents (or 1 v 1) then Terastodon.
Against aggro or if you have necromancy/ enchantment reanimation then levaithan
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
And even those have troubles because we can out value them easy with counters, phyrexian tower, and Tasigur to prevent that from ever happening. Its a soft lock for sure but damn hard for pure aggro to keep up.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Modern
UWGB 4c Snow Control BGWU
Play Tasigur and activate his ability over and over until you have your library in your hand.
Now Bitter ordeal a card out of your opponents library.
Activate Tasigur, the only card for you to get back is Bitter ordeal.
Repeat until all librarys are gone and pass the turn.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
I never would of figured that out, thanks!
Modern
UWGB 4c Snow Control BGWU
If creatures are an issue in your group I'd suggest Reality shift over bitter ordeal.
I use ordeal to kill combo decks before they can go off but if that's not an issue where you play you can play Shift.
To win with shift you do the same thing but then you reality shift one of the creatures opponents have (If they don't have any you can make one with beast within or terastodon) Then they will manifest and you get shift back and then exile the card they manifested. Now they will repeat and you can shift every card in the deck until they're all gone.
Shift is an excellent card for the deck but I cut mine because the biggest threats in my group have very very very few creatures.
That said I can see it returning in the future.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
Round 1 against Zur and bladewing
I know that the Zur player was one of the better decks and the Bladewing player himself said he was fairly new to this so I definitely focused more on Zur.
Zur mana drain's a turn 3 necromancy on Jin and casts Zur on his turn. Cut to my turn and I frantic search to find something. I dig into gilded drake and reanimation.
Gilded drake gets countered but the reanimation goes through and now I keep Zur. The turn passes back to me, I swing with Zur to get animate dead to get Jin on board and it's all over after that.
Round 2 against Daretti and Narset
I go first and play deathrite. Daretti and narset both get sol rings.
I draw mental misstep...ugh..
Play careful study into void winnower.
Play sylvan safekeeper and reanimate Void winnower. Both players cannot play general. I start swinging at Daretti since he likely has creature wipes to kill him, and play Tasigur to hopefully get myself counters.
It doesn't really matter too much because after a while I kill Daretti and Narset never got to do anything.
Round 3 against Progenitus (What?) and Azami.
Progenitus goes for turn 3 Hermit druid and Azami taps out to counter it. Pass to my turn and I reanimate a con sphinx and start drawing cards. Progenitus gets hermit druid back to hand and cast him again. Azami plays a bounce spell on con sphinx which gets misdirected on to hermit druid.
I crack Cepheid coliseum on progenitus to draw 6 cards and combo off that turn.
Fun tourney and lots of good decks there.
Went him with a box of oath.
Which had about 30 bucks in cards in it.
Still had a blast
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake