Not quite reliable enough, Argentum Armor. That's why I'm including Akroma's Memorial, ASAP. There are no decent equipment that gives flying, so I'm probably stuck playing the new Scars equipment... =\
I think Smokestack would fit this deck perfectly, I would even consider calling it a win-con. Tangle Wire has great synergy with equipment. The only danger is having too much equipment and your opponent denying you creatures, in which case Karn, Silver Golem could provide a nice way to use the equipment. You can also wrath with alot of equipment onboard and then cast him post-wrath, animate X number of equipment attaching Y-X equipment to the X equipment where X is animated equipment and Y is total number of equipment. This could provide a lethal post-wrath stratagy to the #1 wrathing color in the game. This post-wrath stratagy brings up my next topic: Wrath-Effects. Because equipment buffs creatures, you can continually whipe the board and any 1 creature you play can become epically large. This allows you to not extend many creatures onto the board at a time, allowing you to save more creatures in your hand, allowing you to wrath more often, allowing you to gain lots of CA through whiping the opponents board. If you can afford it mishra's workshop would love to be in here. I suggest you run Darksteel Forge to protect your equipment from artifact sweepers. I also suggest running about 10-15 Artifact Mana accelerants, such as Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Grim Monolith, Mana Vault, Basalt Monolith, Gilded Lotus, etc. I also suggest you run as many man-lands as possible to maximize on post-wrath-creature-with-equipment-face-bashing.
Looks like it could use some work still, but it's a pretty good first-decklist. Keep up the good work!
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Besides Urza's Factory (which I still don't see the need for) the Urza's lands probably aren't doing much for you. Same goes for Mistveil Plains, you don't need a CIPT land that doesn't do something awesome like Windbrisk Heights.
I would turn these into Plains, or run something like Weathered Wayfarer, but even then that's too much to rely on.
Also, it's a judgment call, but I feel like you're lacking some fun equipment like Fireshrieker / Grappling Hook, Cranial Plating... and I otherwise agree with most of the cards suggested so far.
WUGPhelddagrif GGGOmnath, Locus of Mana BBBXiahou Dun, the One-Eyed RRRAshling, the Pilgrim BBWTeysa, Scion of Orzhov UUUTalrand, Sky Summoner UUBVela the Night-Clad GGBVhati il-Dal RUWRuhan of the Fomori
Also, it's a judgment call, but I feel like you're lacking some fun equipment like Fireshrieker / Grappling Hook, Cranial Plating... and I otherwise agree with most of the cards suggested so far.
Cranial Plating won't work - it has B on it. But yes, there's a lot of interesting equipment that could be added to this yet; I'm working on a similar deck myself and I'm interested in how this one plays out.
I'll try to cover every comment, but I make no promises. I really appreciate all the very sound advice.
Mana Tithe - conditional counters like this just aren't that good in EDH. I wouldn't even run Mana Leak in EDH, to be honest. Sure, it's hilarious to randomly Tithe a big bomb, but it's not reliable nor does it really fit this deck.
Land Tax - I would LOVE this in here, I just haven't grabbed one yet.
Endless Horizon - I've thought about it, but have always been skeptical of it. My friend runs Lin Sivvi and never really found it as effective as it could be. I don't think i want 'Belcher in this list. I'll grab one this weekend and give it a shot.
Eternal Dragon - Another card I've thought about, but I don't feel it will do too much for the deck other than be nice with Strata Scythe. I've been contemplating pulling the Scythe completely, to be honest. All it does is buff. There are better, bombier creatures I could be running if I did not need it for the Plainscycling.
Weathered Wayfarer - Great, but I've never found a need for the acceleration it offers (outside of Strata Scythe). It could be good with the Urza lands though.
Fireshrieker - I couldn't recall the name of this one. Definitely better than Grappling Hook.
Most/All of those Colorless Lands - I have already planned on adding literally all of those lands, I just have yet to acquire them. I'm undecided on Serra Sanctum as it's obviously situational based on my enchantments, but it will likely get added since I need them for my Leyline deck anyways.
Tangle Wire - Will try that. Seems REALLY good for this deck.
Smokestack - Also seems really good. Will try to get that when i get the Tangle Wire.
Mishra's Workshop - Would SO be in here if I could afford it/had it.
Darksteel Forge - Seems a little expensive without a lot more acceleration. I traded mine away not too long ago, but I'll give it a shot if I can grab another one.
Steelshaper's Gift - Again, completely forgot the NAME of this card. Will be added as soon as I figure out what to cut.
As far as Mistveil Plains goes, I like it quite a bit. The ability to recur anything I want. I also like the Urza lands right now. They don't do THAT much since they are just colorless sources, but as the only main colorless sources they are more than adequate. When they are all assembled they are stupid and, at worst, they are just mundane colorless sources. the whole mana base will be getting a complete overhaul when I get those other lands, so we'll see how that shakes out. I agree that I could use some more artifact sources, but I'm not sure I need THAT many. The acceleration will be nice (enabling Armageddon or some such thing), but I don't want to water down the deck too much.
The thing about sweepers is, while it's very artifact driven, it's still a creature based deck. I'm not sure how I feel about most sweepers other than Austere Command in a situation like that. I've been debating whether or not to try them out, but I've been spending so much time beating face with so much protection that I've never even desired to play any kind of sweeper. We'll see how that shakes out, I'll never rule something like that out when I'm in white.
EDIT: New deck list with just about all the changes I had been meaning to make. I feel it could use an Eldrazi Monument and maybe some sweepers, but I'm still not sure how I feel about the latter.
What I believe to be the final list for the multi-man EDH tournament in which I will be playing this coming weekend. Since it will be 4-man matches, I've included Luminarch Ascension, Eldrazi Monument and some more sweepers.
The only equipment that springs to mind that I'd like to see in here is Sword of the Paruns.
Otherwise, very solid build. I've recently been working on a Kemba deck, but yours is much tighter, mine is quite abstract at this point.
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BInfect BWDeath & Taxes UBRAffinity
RBurn UBRSac Land Tendrils UBRGOops, All Spells
WUGPhelddagrif GGGOmnath, Locus of Mana BBBXiahou Dun, the One-Eyed RRRAshling, the Pilgrim BBWTeysa, Scion of Orzhov UUUTalrand, Sky Summoner UUBVela the Night-Clad GGBVhati il-Dal RUWRuhan of the Fomori
I've been thinking about going a little more mana denial-ish. The problem is cutting cards. I like Catastrophe better than Armageddon simply because I get to choose the modes and I like Winter Orb better than Dust Drinker, but they are all cards I've contemplated.
@iWumbo: I had Konda's Banner and it was actually pretty bad. It just doesn't get there anywhere near often enough to warrant inclusion.
@Herbert West: I've thought about Sword of the Paruns many times, but I just don't know what to pull nor do I think the ability is good enough to warrant inclusion over the myriad of other, better equipment included. Only equipment that makes sense to pull for Sword is Strata Scythe, but that's just way better, IMO.
Konda is WAY too high on the curve for this deck. Not to mention Worldslayer is pretty bad in this deck. I said this in the other Kemba thread, but Worldslayer is just so counter productive. Konda is also pretty bad on his own, I would MUCH rather sink that mana into a Stonehwer Giant or Shield of Kaldra.
Just wondering if you've ever had the opportunity to test out a few of the newer cards like Mentor of the Meek or Nevermore.
I personally found Mentor to be a huge boon to Kemba, particularly in the end game when you need to find something specific. But I've never been able to cut anything from my version. I've also been on the fence with Nevermore but in testing it completely hoses general-based strategies (like Edric), especially if you can tutor for it early on, but it seems a bit gimmicky.
I tore this deck apart a long time ago. Discussion has been moved over to my old primer thread. Mentor of the Meek was one of the best things to ever happen to the builds of Kemba that don't run Glorious Anthem effects.
Ah, my mistake. I assumed this thread was the more active of the two since it was getting bumped a lot these past few days. I'll migrate over there once I can get my Kemba list updated.
1 Kemba, Kha Regent
// Creatures (19)
1 Raksha Golden Cub
1 Spirit of the Hearth
1 Stonehewer Giant
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Indomitable Archangel
1 Leonin Abunas
1 Taj-Nar Swordsmith
1 Rune-Tail's Essence
1 Mirror Entity
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Leonin Shikari
1 Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
1 Mother of Runes
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Reveillark
1 Etched Champion
1 Weathered Wayfarer
1 Academy Rector
1 Karmic Guide
// Enchantments (7)
1 True Conviction
1 Land Tax
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Ghostly Prison
1 Aura of Silence
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
// Sorceries (5)
1 Steelshaper's Gift
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Austere Command
1 Catastrophe
1 All Is Dust
// Instants (5)
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Condemn
1 Path to Exile
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Tithe
// Artifacts (6)
1 Sol Ring
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Extraplannar Lens
1 Tangle Wire
1 Akroma's Memorial
1 Eldrazi Monument
// Artifacts - Equipment (18)
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Loxodon Warhammer
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Deathrender
1 General's Kabuto
1 Quietus Spike
1 Mask of Memory
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Helm of Kaldra
1 Shield of Kaldra
1 Sword of Kaldra
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Sword of Vengeance
1 Skullclamp
1 Argentum Armor
1 Fireshrieker
1 Scythe of the Wretched
28 Plains
1 Windbrisk Heights
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Kor Haven
1 Dust Bowl
1 Strip Mine
1 Tectonic Edge
1 High Market
1 Temple of the False Gods
While it is posted in 1v1, I've decided to shift the focus to 4+ man multiplayer. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
PS: Wasteland will be added as soon as my set arrives.
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That would be Steelshaper's Gift, and I agree that would be an excellent card to add into the deck. Take advantage of white's tutors when you can.
Looks like it could use some work still, but it's a pretty good first-decklist. Keep up the good work!
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I would turn these into Plains, or run something like Weathered Wayfarer, but even then that's too much to rely on.
If you want lands that produce colorless mana for your equipment or are useful, try maybe Scorched Ruins, Temple of the False God, Ancient Tomb, Dust Bowl, Kjeldoran Outpost, Kor Haven, Strip Mine, Ghost Quarter, Wasteland, Serra Sanctum.
Also, it's a judgment call, but I feel like you're lacking some fun equipment like Fireshrieker / Grappling Hook, Cranial Plating... and I otherwise agree with most of the cards suggested so far.
B Infect
BW Death & Taxes
UBR Affinity
R Burn
UBR Sac Land Tendrils
UBRG Oops, All Spells
WUG Phelddagrif
GGG Omnath, Locus of Mana
BBB Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
RRR Ashling, the Pilgrim
BBW Teysa, Scion of Orzhov
UUU Talrand, Sky Summoner
UUB Vela the Night-Clad
GGB Vhati il-Dal
RUW Ruhan of the Fomori
Cranial Plating won't work - it has B on it. But yes, there's a lot of interesting equipment that could be added to this yet; I'm working on a similar deck myself and I'm interested in how this one plays out.
Land Tax(Cooler Version), Endless Horizons, Eternal Dragon, and Weathered Wayfarer are a few of ways to try and make sure you'll have a plains to play every turn.
Mana Tithe - conditional counters like this just aren't that good in EDH. I wouldn't even run Mana Leak in EDH, to be honest. Sure, it's hilarious to randomly Tithe a big bomb, but it's not reliable nor does it really fit this deck.
Land Tax - I would LOVE this in here, I just haven't grabbed one yet.
Endless Horizon - I've thought about it, but have always been skeptical of it. My friend runs Lin Sivvi and never really found it as effective as it could be. I don't think i want 'Belcher in this list. I'll grab one this weekend and give it a shot.
Eternal Dragon - Another card I've thought about, but I don't feel it will do too much for the deck other than be nice with Strata Scythe. I've been contemplating pulling the Scythe completely, to be honest. All it does is buff. There are better, bombier creatures I could be running if I did not need it for the Plainscycling.
Weathered Wayfarer - Great, but I've never found a need for the acceleration it offers (outside of Strata Scythe). It could be good with the Urza lands though.
Fireshrieker - I couldn't recall the name of this one. Definitely better than Grappling Hook.
Most/All of those Colorless Lands - I have already planned on adding literally all of those lands, I just have yet to acquire them. I'm undecided on Serra Sanctum as it's obviously situational based on my enchantments, but it will likely get added since I need them for my Leyline deck anyways.
Tangle Wire - Will try that. Seems REALLY good for this deck.
Smokestack - Also seems really good. Will try to get that when i get the Tangle Wire.
Mishra's Workshop - Would SO be in here if I could afford it/had it.
Darksteel Forge - Seems a little expensive without a lot more acceleration. I traded mine away not too long ago, but I'll give it a shot if I can grab another one.
Steelshaper's Gift - Again, completely forgot the NAME of this card. Will be added as soon as I figure out what to cut.
As far as Mistveil Plains goes, I like it quite a bit. The ability to recur anything I want. I also like the Urza lands right now. They don't do THAT much since they are just colorless sources, but as the only main colorless sources they are more than adequate. When they are all assembled they are stupid and, at worst, they are just mundane colorless sources. the whole mana base will be getting a complete overhaul when I get those other lands, so we'll see how that shakes out. I agree that I could use some more artifact sources, but I'm not sure I need THAT many. The acceleration will be nice (enabling Armageddon or some such thing), but I don't want to water down the deck too much.
The thing about sweepers is, while it's very artifact driven, it's still a creature based deck. I'm not sure how I feel about most sweepers other than Austere Command in a situation like that. I've been debating whether or not to try them out, but I've been spending so much time beating face with so much protection that I've never even desired to play any kind of sweeper. We'll see how that shakes out, I'll never rule something like that out when I'm in white.
EDIT: New deck list with just about all the changes I had been meaning to make. I feel it could use an Eldrazi Monument and maybe some sweepers, but I'm still not sure how I feel about the latter.
1 Kemba, Kha Regent
// Creatures (15)
1 Raksha Golden Cub
1 Spirit of the Hearth
1 Stonehewer Giant
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Indomitable Archangel
1 Leonin Abunas
1 Taj-Nar Swordsmith
1 Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant
1 Mirror Entity
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Leonin Shikari
1 Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
1 Mother of Runes
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Weathered Wayfarer
// Enchantments (9)
1 Land Tax
1 Marshal's Anthem
1 True Conviction
1 Concerted Effort
1 Light from Within
1 Glorious Anthem
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Honor of the Pure
// Planeswalkers (2)
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Open the Vaults
1 Conqueror's Pledge
1 Spectral Procession
1 Spellshaper's Gift
// Instants (4)
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Condemn
1 Path to Exile
1 Enlightened Tutor
// Artifacts (6)
1 Sol Ring
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Extraplannar Lens
1 Akroma's Memorial
1 Smokestack
1 Tangle Wire
// Artifacts - Equipment (22)
1 Fireshrieker
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Loxodon Warhammer
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Quietus Spike
1 Helm of Kaldra
1 Mask of Memory
1 Magebane Armor
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Shield of Kaldra
1 Sword of Kaldra
1 Deathrender
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Skullclamp
1 Sword of Vengeance
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Argentum Armor
1 Nim Deathmantle
1 Sigil of Distinction
1 Heartseeker
1 Scythe of the Wretched
20 Plains
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Mistveil Plains
1 Mystifying Maze
1 Windbrisk Heights
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Urza's Tower
1 Urza's Power Plant
1 Urza's Mine
1 Urza's Factory
1 Dust Bowl
1 Strip Mine
1 Temple of the False Gods
1 Kor Haven
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Ancient Tomb
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1 Kemba, Kha Regent
// Creatures (19)
1 Raksha Golden Cub
1 Spirit of the Hearth
1 Stonehewer Giant
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Indomitable Archangel
1 Leonin Abunas
1 Taj-Nar Swordsmith
1 Rune-Tail's Essence
1 Mirror Entity
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Leonin Shikari
1 Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
1 Mother of Runes
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Reveillark
1 Etched Champion
1 Weathered Wayfarer
1 Academy Rector
1 Karmic Guide
// Enchantments (7)
1 True Conviction
1 Land Tax
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Ghostly Prison
1 Aura of Silence
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
// Sorceries (5)
1 Steelshaper's Gift
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Austere Command
1 Catastrophe
1 All Is Dust
// Instants (5)
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Condemn
1 Path to Exile
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Tithe
// Artifacts (6)
1 Sol Ring
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Extraplannar Lens
1 Tangle Wire
1 Akroma's Memorial
1 Eldrazi Monument
// Artifacts - Equipment (18)
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Loxodon Warhammer
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Deathrender
1 General's Kabuto
1 Quietus Spike
1 Mask of Memory
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Helm of Kaldra
1 Shield of Kaldra
1 Sword of Kaldra
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Sword of Vengeance
1 Skullclamp
1 Argentum Armor
1 Fireshrieker
1 Scythe of the Wretched
28 Plains
1 Windbrisk Heights
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Kor Haven
1 Dust Bowl
1 Strip Mine
1 Tectonic Edge
1 High Market
1 Temple of the False Gods
I need it to be more multiplayer minded, any suggestions?
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Otherwise, very solid build. I've recently been working on a Kemba deck, but yours is much tighter, mine is quite abstract at this point.
B Infect
BW Death & Taxes
UBR Affinity
R Burn
UBR Sac Land Tendrils
UBRG Oops, All Spells
WUG Phelddagrif
GGG Omnath, Locus of Mana
BBB Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
RRR Ashling, the Pilgrim
BBW Teysa, Scion of Orzhov
UUU Talrand, Sky Summoner
UUB Vela the Night-Clad
GGB Vhati il-Dal
RUW Ruhan of the Fomori
@iWumbo: I had Konda's Banner and it was actually pretty bad. It just doesn't get there anywhere near often enough to warrant inclusion.
@Herbert West: I've thought about Sword of the Paruns many times, but I just don't know what to pull nor do I think the ability is good enough to warrant inclusion over the myriad of other, better equipment included. Only equipment that makes sense to pull for Sword is Strata Scythe, but that's just way better, IMO.
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Just wondering if you've ever had the opportunity to test out a few of the newer cards like Mentor of the Meek or Nevermore.
I personally found Mentor to be a huge boon to Kemba, particularly in the end game when you need to find something specific. But I've never been able to cut anything from my version. I've also been on the fence with Nevermore but in testing it completely hoses general-based strategies (like Edric), especially if you can tutor for it early on, but it seems a bit gimmicky.
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http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=284649
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