how do you guys think about polymorph+emrakul combo? seems like we can get the combo consistently with the number of tutors we have.. im gonna give it a try and see how it works.
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how do you guys think about polymorph+emrakul combo? seems like we can get the combo consistently with the number of tutors we have.. im gonna give it a try and see how it works.
I don't think we can do that. We run too many small guys like Snappy, Venser, Dragonmaster. Too many ways for the combo to whiff. You'd have to be almost creatureless to work that.
how do you guys think about polymorph+emrakul combo? seems like we can get the combo consistently with the number of tutors we have.. im gonna give it a try and see how it works.
I don't think we can do that. We run too many small guys like Snappy, Venser, Dragonmaster. Too many ways for the combo to whiff. You'd have to be almost creatureless to work that.
yeah i was thinking about that. but have you seen my list? i run more beefy creatures except for venser and snapcaster, a little tweak might do the trick. u was thinking of adding muddle the mixure what do you think?
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how do you guys think about polymorph+emrakul combo? seems like we can get the combo consistently with the number of tutors we have.. im gonna give it a try and see how it works.
I don't think we can do that. We run too many small guys like Snappy, Venser, Dragonmaster. Too many ways for the combo to whiff. You'd have to be almost creatureless to work that.
yeah i was thinking about that. but have you seen my list? i run more beefy creatures except for venser and snapcaster, a little tweak might do the trick. u was thinking of adding muddle the mixure what do you think?
I was gonna add MtM? No...not I. But I was contemplating Curse of the Swine.
Give us some update on how that combo goes. I'm interested though I think it lacks consistency - we're already a control deck, we can kill you with Jace, Pike, or in my case Stormtide/Prognostic.
Here's a thought I've been struggling with for the past couple days.
How do we deal with Thrun, the Last Troll? We can't counter it. Clone it. Steal it. Burn it. We can't even Maze it. I noticed this problem on a smaller scale with the Loxodon Smiter in the Doran match, which yeah we've got answers to him and Stag, but Thrun is much more resilient. Are we gonna Sudden Demise or Starstorm for x = 4? Seems a little unreasonable of an answer. We're not going to race that guy, either - he comes down way faster than our clocks. Even if we do Sudden Demise him, and they don't have 1G up (for w/e reason...) that's like we "got lucky".
my solution against thrun is all is dust. pretty much the only answer we had against him. also, one problem that i notice is how do we fight against akroma angel of fury. another hard commander to deal with.
i'll try to run polymorph and emrakul combo. i'll post my playtest result after i had run it.
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Order of Succession! It doesn't target so in both the Redkroma and Thrun case, we can take it from them. This works whether it's a singleton or commander. And it's permanent. Additionally, we can Mystical Tutor for it. I don't think we'll find a better answer.
I don't like the All is Dust option here Nixj03 because it is too slow and mana heavy. Even if we make it to 7 to play this, then they turn around with their eight or so mana and we get Tooth and Nail'd or [insert big dumb bomb spell here].
Teferi is a good call. I might add him in over my buddy in Prognostic Sphinx. Not quite sure because Prognostic has been there for me time and time again.
I'm curious why you cut Shackles. With the increase in basic Islands (also amazed at not even having Sulfur Falls anymore), Shackles would be even more powerful.
If the deck has redundancy in spells, you can tutor for 3 cards with similar functions, and would almost always get the card you need at instant speed too. Throw in the Think Twice, Mystic Retrieval and some other flashback cards to the list of Intuition targets, and you create lots of card advantage there.
Any thought about cerebral vortex? I feel like the deck lacks sources of card advantage if the general is dealt with.
Also the argument about not running into artifact hate seams clunky to me, since shackles is as hard to beat as dream tides (and probably even harder) and runs into the same hate (the only good card I can think of that deals with shackles and not with tides is viridian shaman, but usually any disenchant-effect will take care of either card).
Any thought about cerebral vortex? I feel like the deck lacks sources of card advantage if the general is dealt with.
*Reads commander's ability*
*Reads above statement*
*...Goes back to read commander's ability*
...I don't get it. Why are you having a problem keeping cards in your hand? I feel like this may be a playstyle issue and less a deck issue. What is it that you're doing that's causing you to have these types of problems? The only time our commander has a hard time sticking to the board is versus Griselbrand/Iname, which is poor matchups for us anyway (any MBC is bad here). Even versus Doran we don't need to rely on Nin - we find some nonbasic hate and deal with the must-answer cards.
But I like to play other cards that some people here don't like (Prognostic Sphinx :P) so don't take my word for it; ask Asimov or HipsterWhale (I'd suspect they will say something to the effect of what I've said here too). =)
I do agree with yor assesment 3drinks. Most of the time that's exactly where you are going to have problems(mbc). But if you feel you need another draw spell that is the one to use. It's a 3 mana instant divination.
Sorry on phone so I can't type a longer response.
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Currently Playing
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
I've updated the main thread. I had taken some time away from the list in order to focus on other decks and get some new thoughts on the deck, and coming back this is what im currently running with. At this moment and time i've playtested several games with keranos over nin. i wanted to play him in a hard control shell over the wildfire, ramp build in order to figure out what his strengths and weaknesses are. heres my thoughts so far. I will be working this afternoon on a keranos list based on my shell of nin, ill post it here when i get done.
My thoughts on keranos
+fights planeswalkers so you dont need as much burn
+keep mana open on early turns
+draw engine late game
+finisher
+ok to flood out
+doesnt die to removal
-need early draw to sustain yourself
-5 mana
-if exhiled or o-ringed, very hard to get back.
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Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
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This is yet to be tested, and it is very possible that the other keranos build is far better than this, i simply want to experiment with a more control focused variant, i think that eventually this list will gravitate closer to gaviro/spastika's list but i want to see if there is a good deck somewhere in the middle, somewhere in between the 3 of our designs.
Lots of big drops in your list now Whale. (ironic coming from the guy who sings the praises of Stormtide Leviathan and Prognostic Sphinx, I know )
My initial thoughts - I feel you you don't need so many nonbasics. The Temple, cycle land, Boseiju (what are you trying to force through that isn't named Ruination?), and, while I haven't felt a need for CephCol, I guess it doesn't hurt to use it? Could probably be better off in the long run with an Island though.
Future Sight is really, really goo, no doubt. Do you feel "safe" spending the five on your own turn though?
I'm not sold on the Wildfire effects. Even with the indestructible commander, I can't ever think of a time where I wouldn't mind cannibalizeing my own mana base in a control deck.
I'd love to hear more insights as to why you made such changes though.
i've noted that the card is slow, however once it lands it makes up for it. With nin, we have to tap out on turn 2 or attempt to play her on turn 4. and dont usually activate her till turn 5 on their end step. If they cast a spell we have to wait, if they have removal we lose a turn and nin costs more. the repeated cost of playing nin adds up over a game, while this may not seem like a large cost, in my testing i have noted that keranos doing what he does for free is a large benefit. in addition we are able to cut some of our burn for draw and counterspells because keranos himself takes care of things such as planeswalkers.
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Currently Playing
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
i've noted that the card is slow, however once it lands it makes up for it. With nin, we have to tap out on turn 2 or attempt to play her on turn 4. and dont usually activate her till turn 5 on their end step. If they cast a spell we have to wait, if they have removal we lose a turn and nin costs more. the repeated cost of playing nin adds up over a game, while this may not seem like a large cost, in my testing i have noted that keranos doing what he does for free is a large benefit. in addition we are able to cut some of our burn for draw and counterspells because keranos himself takes care of things such as planeswalkers.
^^ THIS ^^
Also, 3drinks, butchering your mana base doesn't hurt as much if you have mana rocks that survive most of the Wildfire effects, but then again running mana rocks is a different matter entirely (my current Keranos build emphasises tapout control over permission). The main reason Wildfire is so great is that the symmetry is immediately broken by the mere presence of Keranos on board, whose inevitability will win out in the long haul. Resetting the board slows the game to a crawl in the immediate turns following a Wildfire, but you WILL win out with the sheer card advantage and removal engine that Keranos provides (unless the opponent already has a Phyrexian Arena out, in which case good luck).
Credits to avatarz of Dissapointing signet inc. for my sig.
Duel:
Maelstrom wanderer
Narset, Enlightened Master
" A Small Price to pay, for a limitless power. -Nixj
"Happy as a meal" - Team happy meal
I don't think we can do that. We run too many small guys like Snappy, Venser, Dragonmaster. Too many ways for the combo to whiff. You'd have to be almost creatureless to work that.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
yeah i was thinking about that. but have you seen my list? i run more beefy creatures except for venser and snapcaster, a little tweak might do the trick. u was thinking of adding muddle the mixure what do you think?
Credits to avatarz of Dissapointing signet inc. for my sig.
Duel:
Maelstrom wanderer
Narset, Enlightened Master
" A Small Price to pay, for a limitless power. -Nixj
"Happy as a meal" - Team happy meal
I was gonna add MtM? No...not I. But I was contemplating Curse of the Swine.
Give us some update on how that combo goes. I'm interested though I think it lacks consistency - we're already a control deck, we can kill you with Jace, Pike, or in my case Stormtide/Prognostic.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
How do we deal with Thrun, the Last Troll? We can't counter it. Clone it. Steal it. Burn it. We can't even Maze it. I noticed this problem on a smaller scale with the Loxodon Smiter in the Doran match, which yeah we've got answers to him and Stag, but Thrun is much more resilient. Are we gonna Sudden Demise or Starstorm for x = 4? Seems a little unreasonable of an answer. We're not going to race that guy, either - he comes down way faster than our clocks. Even if we do Sudden Demise him, and they don't have 1G up (for w/e reason...) that's like we "got lucky".
What about if Thrun is the commander?
I just see so much vulnerability to this guy.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
i'll try to run polymorph and emrakul combo. i'll post my playtest result after i had run it.
Credits to avatarz of Dissapointing signet inc. for my sig.
Duel:
Maelstrom wanderer
Narset, Enlightened Master
" A Small Price to pay, for a limitless power. -Nixj
"Happy as a meal" - Team happy meal
Order of Succession! It doesn't target so in both the Redkroma and Thrun case, we can take it from them. This works whether it's a singleton or commander. And it's permanent. Additionally, we can Mystical Tutor for it. I don't think we'll find a better answer.
I don't like the All is Dust option here Nixj03 because it is too slow and mana heavy. Even if we make it to 7 to play this, then they turn around with their eight or so mana and we get Tooth and Nail'd or [insert big dumb bomb spell here].
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Also the argument about not running into artifact hate seams clunky to me, since shackles is as hard to beat as dream tides (and probably even harder) and runs into the same hate (the only good card I can think of that deals with shackles and not with tides is viridian shaman, but usually any disenchant-effect will take care of either card).
*Reads commander's ability*
*Reads above statement*
*...Goes back to read commander's ability*
...I don't get it. Why are you having a problem keeping cards in your hand? I feel like this may be a playstyle issue and less a deck issue. What is it that you're doing that's causing you to have these types of problems? The only time our commander has a hard time sticking to the board is versus Griselbrand/Iname, which is poor matchups for us anyway (any MBC is bad here). Even versus Doran we don't need to rely on Nin - we find some nonbasic hate and deal with the must-answer cards.
But I like to play other cards that some people here don't like (Prognostic Sphinx :P) so don't take my word for it; ask Asimov or HipsterWhale (I'd suspect they will say something to the effect of what I've said here too). =)
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Sorry on phone so I can't type a longer response.
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
http://www.mtgmintcard.com/spite-of-mogis-p-431693.html#.U0dcpajuJ2A
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
My thoughts on keranos
+fights planeswalkers so you dont need as much burn
+keep mana open on early turns
+draw engine late game
+finisher
+ok to flood out
+doesnt die to removal
-need early draw to sustain yourself
-5 mana
-if exhiled or o-ringed, very hard to get back.
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
1 Keranos, God of Storms
Counterspells
1 Force of Will
1 Force Spike
1 Annul
1 Spell Snare
1 Spell Pierce
1 Swan Song
1 Condescend
1 Izzet Charm
1 Counterspell
1 Negate
1 Remand
1 Mana Leak
1 Miscalculation
1 Memory Lapse
1 Counterflux
1 Forbid
1 Dissolve
1 Dismiss
1 Cryptic Command
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
Sweepers
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Sudden Demise
1 Bonfire of the Damned
Spot Removal
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Flame Slash
1 Burst Lightning
1 Repeal
1 Shattering Pulse
1 Into the Roil
1 Electrolyze
1 Smash
Card Filter/Draw
1 Gitaxian Probe
1 Peek
1 Ancestral Vision
1 Impulse
1 Cerebral Vortex
1 Fact or Fiction
Utility
1 Pithing Needle
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Young Pyromancer
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Thassa, God of the Sea
Land Destruction
1 Blood Moon
1 Ruination
1 Wildfire
1 Destructive Force
Theft
1 Gilded Drake
1 Vedalken Shackles
1 Order of Succession
1 Treachery
1 Bribery
1 Jace, the Mind sculptor
1 jace, architect of thought
1 Future Sight
1 Tamiyo, The moon Sage
Lands - 41
1 Polluted Delta
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Flooded Strand
1 Arid Mesa
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Volcanic Island
1 Steam Vents
1 Sulfur Falls
1 Temple of Epiphany
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Command Tower
1 Maze of Ith
1 Wasteland
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Boseiju, who shelters all
1 Cephalid Coliseum
1 lonely sandbar
15 Island
7 Mountain
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
My initial thoughts - I feel you you don't need so many nonbasics. The Temple, cycle land, Boseiju (what are you trying to force through that isn't named Ruination?), and, while I haven't felt a need for CephCol, I guess it doesn't hurt to use it? Could probably be better off in the long run with an Island though.
Future Sight is really, really goo, no doubt. Do you feel "safe" spending the five on your own turn though?
I'm not sold on the Wildfire effects. Even with the indestructible commander, I can't ever think of a time where I wouldn't mind cannibalizeing my own mana base in a control deck.
I'd love to hear more insights as to why you made such changes though.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
Modern
No clue
RIP Twin
MTGS Olde Name:
Hruen (apparently it was taken, probably by me about 10 years ago.........)
^^ THIS ^^
Also, 3drinks, butchering your mana base doesn't hurt as much if you have mana rocks that survive most of the Wildfire effects, but then again running mana rocks is a different matter entirely (my current Keranos build emphasises tapout control over permission). The main reason Wildfire is so great is that the symmetry is immediately broken by the mere presence of Keranos on board, whose inevitability will win out in the long haul. Resetting the board slows the game to a crawl in the immediate turns following a Wildfire, but you WILL win out with the sheer card advantage and removal engine that Keranos provides (unless the opponent already has a Phyrexian Arena out, in which case good luck).
1. Jace High Tide Control
2. 5CC Horde Scapeshift
3. Selvala Channel Emrakul
4. Selvala GW Combo
5. Keranos Wildfire
Damia (EDH)
Niv-Mizzet (EDH)
Karador the Hermit Druid (EDH)
*innocently whistles*
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.