2. Doubling Season would be banned, Deepglow Skate would either be banned or never made
Okay, but why? Ya'll try to make Doubling Season sound like the Boogieman. Here is a list of every Planeswalker that could potentially ultimate immediately via Doubling Season, and their effect:
Garruk Wildspeaker - Creatures you control get +3/+3 and gain trample until end of turn.
Garruk, Apex Predator - Target opponent gets an emblem with "Whenever a creature attacks you, it gets +5/+5 and gains trample until end of turn."
Garruk, Caller of Beasts - You get an emblem with "Whenever you cast a creature spell, you may search your library for a creature card, put it onto the battlefield, then shuffle your library."
Garruk, Primal Hunter - Create a 6/6 green Wurm creature token for each land you control.
Jiang Yanggu - Until end of turn, target creature gains trample and gets +X/+X, where X is the number of lands you control.
Kiora, Master of the Depths - You get an emblem with "Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your control, you may have it fight target creature." Then create three 8/8 blue Octopus creature tokens.
Nissa, Genesis Mage - Look at the top ten cards of your library. You may put any number of creature and/or land cards from among them onto the battlefield. Put the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
Nissa, Steward of Elements** - Untap up to two target lands you control. They become 5/5 Elemental creatures with flying and haste until end of turn. They're still lands.
Nissa, Vital Force - You get an emblem with "Whenever a land enters the battlefield under your control, you may draw a card."
Samut, the Tested - Search your library for up to two creature and/or planeswalker cards, put them onto the battlefield, then shuffle your library.
Sarkhan Unbroken - Search your library for any number of Dragon creature cards and put them onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library.
Sarkhan Vol - Create five 4/4 red Dragon creature tokens with flying.
Tamiyo, Field Researcher - Draw three cards. You get an emblem with "You may cast spells from your hand without paying their mana costs."
Vivien of the Arkbow - Creatures you control get +4/+4 and gain trample until end of turn.
Vivien Reid - You get an emblem with "Creatures you control get +2/+2 and have vigilance, trample, and indestructible."
Vraska the Unseen - Create three 1/1 black Assassin creature tokens with "Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game."
Vraska, Regal Gorgon - For each creature card in your graveyard, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control.
Xenagos, the Reveler - Exile the top seven cards of your library. You may put any number of creature and/or land cards from among them onto the battlefield.
*Freyalise is already legal as a commander.
**Nissa has an X casting cost, so she can already ultimate the turn she's played with or without Doubling Season.
Forgive me if I'm not overly impressed. There are a couple that seem very powerful/obnoxious (mainly Vraska, Relic Seeker and Tamiyo, Field Researcher) and then a huge pile of "meh". Oh no, 6 different Overrun variants, the horror. Come on, people, we're better than this ridiculous knee-jerk reaction. Planeswalker generals would be fine, even with Doubling Season.
Okay, but why? Ya'll try to make Doubling Season sound like the Boogieman. Here is a list of every Planeswalker that could potentially ultimate immediately via Doubling Season, and their effect:
Garruk Wildspeaker - Creatures you control get +3/+3 and gain trample until end of turn.
Garruk, Apex Predator - Target opponent gets an emblem with "Whenever a creature attacks you, it gets +5/+5 and gains trample until end of turn."
Garruk, Caller of Beasts - You get an emblem with "Whenever you cast a creature spell, you may search your library for a creature card, put it onto the battlefield, then shuffle your library."
Garruk, Primal Hunter - Create a 6/6 green Wurm creature token for each land you control.
Jiang Yanggu - Until end of turn, target creature gains trample and gets +X/+X, where X is the number of lands you control.
Kiora, Master of the Depths - You get an emblem with "Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your control, you may have it fight target creature." Then create three 8/8 blue Octopus creature tokens.
Nissa, Genesis Mage - Look at the top ten cards of your library. You may put any number of creature and/or land cards from among them onto the battlefield. Put the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
Nissa, Steward of Elements** - Untap up to two target lands you control. They become 5/5 Elemental creatures with flying and haste until end of turn. They're still lands.
Nissa, Vital Force - You get an emblem with "Whenever a land enters the battlefield under your control, you may draw a card."
Samut, the Tested - Search your library for up to two creature and/or planeswalker cards, put them onto the battlefield, then shuffle your library.
Sarkhan Unbroken - Search your library for any number of Dragon creature cards and put them onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library.
Sarkhan Vol - Create five 4/4 red Dragon creature tokens with flying.
Tamiyo, Field Researcher - Draw three cards. You get an emblem with "You may cast spells from your hand without paying their mana costs."
Vivien of the Arkbow - Creatures you control get +4/+4 and gain trample until end of turn.
Vivien Reid - You get an emblem with "Creatures you control get +2/+2 and have vigilance, trample, and indestructible."
Vraska the Unseen - Create three 1/1 black Assassin creature tokens with "Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game."
Vraska, Regal Gorgon - For each creature card in your graveyard, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control.
Xenagos, the Reveler - Exile the top seven cards of your library. You may put any number of creature and/or land cards from among them onto the battlefield.
*Freyalise is already legal as a commander.
**Nissa has an X casting cost, so she can already ultimate the turn she's played with or without Doubling Season.
Forgive me if I'm not overly impressed. There are a couple that seem very powerful/obnoxious (mainly Vraska, Relic Seeker and Tamiyo, Field Researcher) and then a huge pile of "meh". Oh no, 6 different Overrun variants, the horror. Come on, people, we're better than this ridiculous knee-jerk reaction. Planeswalker generals would be fine, even with Doubling Season.
What are you basing your assumption on? Have you played games where they allowed this? Have you seen the kind of decks that get built?
Edit: I also count more than a couple that I would deem to be on the obnoxious side of the scale. I am also interested to know how many planeswalkers can ultimate the turn after they come into play. That is, DS gives them enough counters to ultimate after just their initial + ability the turn they come into play.
What are you basing your assumption on? Have you played games where they allowed this? Have you seen the kind of decks that get built?
Edit: I also count more than a couple that I would deem to be on the obnoxious side of the scale. I am also interested to know how many planeswalkers can ultimate the turn after they come into play. That is, DS gives them enough counters to ultimate after just their initial + ability the turn they come into play.
I'm basing it on the fact that I've played with and against both Planeswalkers and Doubling Season before, often together. I am a rational human and can do simple inductive reasoning. The majority of current PWs that could ultimate immediately with Doubling Season aren't particularly scary. Some of them could be annoying, sure, but how is that different from current generals? There are already tons of obnoxious generals. And yet the cards that combo with those generals have somehow managed to avoid being banned thus far. Weird how that works.
No one has claimed that. Doubling Season being banned would be a causality of legalizing all Planeswalkers.
That's basically just a rephrasing of my statement. There's this ridiculous assumption that Doubling Season and Planeswalker generals cannot be legal at the same time. It's absurd.
Well, to be fair, one of the RC members said that basically verbatim
I'm not sure it's busted tbh, weaker than a lot of other 2-card combos with generals (e.g. Curiosity + Niv Mizzet, Food chain+Prossh, etc).
Lower on my risk radar than proliferate in general or the repeated use of some powerful abilities creating annoying games, or even just ultimatting through persistence.
Kiora, Master of the Depths (the only time I've seen a Kiora emblem *not* take over the game was when a nearly-creatureless deck stole her just before the ult)
Nissa, Vital Force (unlike Horn of Greed, this is any landfall, not just land drops)
(That said, Nissa, Vital Force is not a very good argument around Doubling Season, considering she only needs to survive a single turn cycle unmolested anyway.)
I feel like all those effects and this is by design of how planeswalkers generally work their ultimates are just simulations of other spells (Hell most PW abilities are), so sure half the spell is your Commander but half the spell is not. I also think putting people on watch for other types of cards and being ready to have answers or decide to not have them is arguably better.
As people have stated already I find that planeswalkers already have a bullseye on them in regular games of Commander so that will not get lessened it may even become more so if this change happened.
All it feels like to me is a bunch of variant options for a lot of colors that probably need it and a lot of color combinations, and some problematic ones that are good enough to be outside the purview of the ban list. It sounds as others have said exactly like the Commander we have right now.
(Also side note, any Green PW deck that is also not part Black and White has very little ways to actually find a Doubling Season, this probably is largely irrelevant but people sure are talking about a Doubling Season as a card that will appear a lot from decks with no real way to make sure of that)
Mono green is not something I see a lot of, but maybe I'm in the minority there. The color has some serious issues that make it difficult to build particularly strong decks - and the ones that are actually powerful are fairly narrow (e.g. Yisan, Selvala). To be fair most mono colors suffer from similar issues.
The point being that if there was a UG or WG commander that say, removed artifacts/enchantments, it would be more of a concern for me in a similar way that Dack Fayden is more of a concern than Freyalise.
Well WG already opens the door to things like Aura Shards and Stony Silence and with the wealth of Token making strategies from those colors your wish has already been granted.
That's basically just a rephrasing of my statement. There's this ridiculous assumption that Doubling Season and Planeswalker generals cannot be legal at the same time. It's absurd.
Papa funk has said that in order to legalize all planeswalkers they would have to ban doubling bbc season in addition to whichever other PWs they saw fit.
I don't know the full reason for this belief, I can think of two. First, is that both DS and walkers are popular splashy EDH cards. If we go by the public statements of the RC, in order to accommodate this change you would have to ban a bu ch of cards. My opinion is that if a change starts with swinging a ban hammer then maybe the change isn't a good idea. You're free to disagree. The second reason is that DS is a niche expensive card, and if it wasn't banned then it is not unreasonable to expect it to double in price at the minimum. Based on recent comments from them, I believe that the RC pays more attention to the secondary market than they let on, in that they don't want to give the appearance of profiting from their actions. It isnt unreasonable to wonder if this could be a factor as well, beyond just how the card plays in games.
Well WG already opens the door to things like Aura Shards and Stony Silence and with the wealth of Token making strategies from those colors your wish has already been granted.
All things being equal there is a difference between having a card in your deck and having it in the command zone.
Again, not saying that's disqualifying, it's just a thing that must be considered.
That's basically just a rephrasing of my statement. There's this ridiculous assumption that Doubling Season and Planeswalker generals cannot be legal at the same time. It's absurd.
Papa funk has said that in order to legalize all planeswalkers they would have to ban doubling bbc season in addition to whichever other PWs they saw fit.
I don't know the full reason for this belief, I can think of two. First, is that both DS and walkers are popular splashy EDH cards. If we go by the public statements of the RC, in order to accommodate this change you would have to ban a bu ch of cards. My opinion is that if a change starts with swinging a ban hammer then maybe the change isn't a good idea. You're free to disagree. The second reason is that DS is a niche expensive card, and if it wasn't banned then it is not unreasonable to expect it to double in price at the minimum. Based on recent comments from them, I believe that the RC pays more attention to the secondary market than they let on, in that they don't want to give the appearance of profiting from their actions. It isnt unreasonable to wonder if this could be a factor as well, beyond just how the card plays in games.
I don't agree with the first reasoning because I really don't see what kinda bans would have to happen that would be radically different from the game we have now. The second point is something I was thinking about because a change like this would probably quadruple DS's price at this point and send some Walkers up up up as well.
I wonder about the we don't want to influence the secondary market, making a statement like that at all seems like it would have a real chilling effect on both the ban list both ways and the ability for the game to evolve not sure I like it.
Kiora, Master of the Depths (the only time I've seen a Kiora emblem *not* take over the game was when a nearly-creatureless deck stole her just before the ult)
Nissa, Vital Force (unlike Horn of Greed, this is any landfall, not just land drops)
(That said, Nissa, Vital Force is not a very good argument around Doubling Season, considering she only needs to survive a single turn cycle unmolested anyway.)
I was exaggerating when I called them all "meh" as there are clearly some powerful effects in there. One-sided Horn of Greed is obviously good. But not game-breakingly so, and definitely not after spending 10 total mana. Remember that all of these PWs cost 4 or greater, and have to be played after Doubling Season. That's either a turn cycle for someone to answer the Doubling Season or hold up a counter for the general, or it means that player has at least 9 mana to do it all in a single turn. *****, you can just straight up cast Dragonstorm for that much. Obviously Sarkhan's ultimate is better than Dragonstorm, but come on.
If someone wanted to ultimate Planeswalkers, they'd just build Superfriends right now and it would almost certainly be better than having one of these PW's as their general. This idea that having PWs as generals would instantly make Doubling Season too strong is just outright absurd to me.
Papa funk has said that in order to legalize all planeswalkers they would have to ban doubling bbc season in addition to whichever other PWs they saw fit.
I don't know the full reason for this belief, I can think of two. First, is that both DS and walkers are popular splashy EDH cards. If we go by the public statements of the RC, in order to accommodate this change you would have to ban a bu ch of cards. My opinion is that if a change starts with swinging a ban hammer then maybe the change isn't a good idea. You're free to disagree. The second reason is that DS is a niche expensive card, and if it wasn't banned then it is not unreasonable to expect it to double in price at the minimum. Based on recent comments from them, I believe that the RC pays more attention to the secondary market than they let on, in that they don't want to give the appearance of profiting from their actions. It isnt unreasonable to wonder if this could be a factor as well, beyond just how the card plays in games.
And without any reasoning or context, that statement is meaningless. To be fair, papa_funk also said T&N was weaker in EDH than other formats; I question his judgement sometimes. And if they're letting financial considerations affect their banning decisions, I don't even know what we're doing anymore. That shouldn't matter in the slightest.
If Doubling Season needed to be banned I think honestly it would have already happened by now or it will never happen regardless of the PW printed at this point.
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Papa funk has said that in order to legalize all planeswalkers they would have to ban doubling bbc season in addition to whichever other PWs they saw fit.
That's a pretty broad paraphrase. The actual quote (from http://www.starcitygames.com/article/36937_Ask-The-Commander-Rules-Committee-Other-Than-Me.html) was "We probably end up having to ban Doubling Season." as one of four reasons we aren't interested in planeswalker Commanders. That's quite possible, since Doubling Season is already pretty borderline, and this would be a pretty big bump.
That's a pretty broad paraphrase. The actual quote (from http://www.starcitygames.com/article/36937_Ask-The-Commander-Rules-Committee-Other-Than-Me.html) was "We probably end up having to ban Doubling Season." as one of four reasons we aren't interested in planeswalker Commanders. That's quite possible, since Doubling Season is already pretty borderline, and this would be a pretty big bump.
May I ask what the other 3 reasons are, broadly? Purely out of interest in discussing the issue. I'm against anyway, but it would be interesting to hear a little more as to why the issue stands where it is at present. I'm sure those on the other side of the debate would agree.
That's quite possible, since Doubling Season is already pretty borderline, and this would be a pretty big bump.
When did this happen? How is Doubling Season borderline? It is basically the face of EDH; a derpy battlecruiser card with a big, cool effect that is unreasonable to play in any other format.
Well if we want to get all nitty-gritty, T&N plays way better in EDH than regular Magic because it bypasses the singleton structure of the format by virtue of being a tutor.
Your logic is backwards. T&N is actually slightly weakened by the singleton format, as you can't get two of the same creature.
When did this happen? How is Doubling Season borderline? It is basically the face of EDH; a derpy battlecruiser card with a big, cool effect that is unreasonable to play in any other format.
It does gross things for a minimal cost, it enables a ton of combo, and it warps games and metas. Adding walkers into the mix, I can absolutely see how it would be banworthy. Even if there's a finite number of walkers it allows immediate ultimate for, there's a lot it makes significantly stronger, and it becomes a ubiquitous chase card for every walker deck running green.
Well if we want to get all nitty-gritty, T&N plays way better in EDH than regular Magic because it bypasses the singleton structure of the format by virtue of being a tutor.
Your logic is backwards. T&N is actually slightly weakened by the singleton format, as you can't get two of the same creature.
You're right! If you remove the very narrow context, use of the word "slightly", and no actual statement that it's weaker in Commander than regular Magic, it's a direct quote. You got me.
I am not sure how this is even a rebuttal? Wouldn't Paradox Engine fit into that description? And that is a card people complain about as well because of the broken stuff it enables. Even if the cost isn't "minimal", it certainly doesn't seem all that significant.
Yes, it does nothing right when it enters the battlefield, but 5 mana is nothing to EDH players (especially those already playing Green) and if it survives long enough for even *1* of the walkers that are being discussed as problematic, then it did its job. I mean, maybe there is a little too much fear over the card in the context of planeswalker commanders, and maybe it wouldn't be as problematic in the long run. But, I don't see how any green deck with a walker commander doesn't run this card. And then, since they are running it, why not run more walkers to get more advantage from it? And why not run as much as possible to protect everything? Or ways to get it out sooner? And that is on top of everything else it already does which means it is has the possibility of becoming a legitimate problem with Planeswalker Commanders.
In any case, we have plenty of options for generals now, and it seems that there are very few Planeswalkers that add anything new regarding what could be built around or cool new strategies.
I am not sure how this is even a rebuttal? Wouldn't Paradox Engine fit into that description? And that is a card people complain about as well because of the broken stuff it enables. Even if the cost isn't "minimal", it certainly doesn't seem all that significant.
Yes, it does nothing right when it enters the battlefield, but 5 mana is nothing to EDH players (especially those already playing Green) and if it survives long enough for even *1* of the walkers that are being discussed as problematic, then it did its job. I mean, maybe there is a little too much fear over the card in the context of planeswalker commanders, and maybe it wouldn't be as problematic in the long run. But, I don't see how any green deck with a walker commander doesn't run this card. And then, since they are running it, why not run more walkers to get more advantage from it? And why not run as much as possible to protect everything? Or ways to get it out sooner? And that is on top of everything else it already does which means it is has the possibility of becoming a legitimate problem with Planeswalker Commanders.
**Nissa has an X casting cost, so she can already ultimate the turn she's played with or without Doubling Season.
Forgive me if I'm not overly impressed. There are a couple that seem very powerful/obnoxious (mainly Vraska, Relic Seeker and Tamiyo, Field Researcher) and then a huge pile of "meh". Oh no, 6 different Overrun variants, the horror. Come on, people, we're better than this ridiculous knee-jerk reaction. Planeswalker generals would be fine, even with Doubling Season.
What are you basing your assumption on? Have you played games where they allowed this? Have you seen the kind of decks that get built?
Edit: I also count more than a couple that I would deem to be on the obnoxious side of the scale. I am also interested to know how many planeswalkers can ultimate the turn after they come into play. That is, DS gives them enough counters to ultimate after just their initial + ability the turn they come into play.
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Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
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UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
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I'm not sure it's busted tbh, weaker than a lot of other 2-card combos with generals (e.g. Curiosity + Niv Mizzet, Food chain+Prossh, etc).
Lower on my risk radar than proliferate in general or the repeated use of some powerful abilities creating annoying games, or even just ultimatting through persistence.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
The following from your list can straight-up win the game on the spot:
- Nissa, Genesis Mage (requires a little luck, or other cards for topdeck manipulation)
- Samut, the Tested
- Sarkhan Unbroken
- Tamiyo, Field Researcher (requires a little luck/preparation to win immediately, but you also already mentioned it as problematic)
- Xenagos, the Reveler (similar to the above Nissa, requires some luck or topdeck manipulation)
But on top of winning outright, several of your listed commanders also create absolutely ridiculous advantage which cannot be gotten rid of:- Garruk, Apex Predator (only for one opponent)
- Garruk, Caller of Beasts
- Kiora, Master of the Depths (the only time I've seen a Kiora emblem *not* take over the game was when a nearly-creatureless deck stole her just before the ult)
- Nissa, Vital Force (unlike Horn of Greed, this is any landfall, not just land drops)
(That said, Nissa, Vital Force is not a very good argument around Doubling Season, considering she only needs to survive a single turn cycle unmolested anyway.)Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
As people have stated already I find that planeswalkers already have a bullseye on them in regular games of Commander so that will not get lessened it may even become more so if this change happened.
All it feels like to me is a bunch of variant options for a lot of colors that probably need it and a lot of color combinations, and some problematic ones that are good enough to be outside the purview of the ban list. It sounds as others have said exactly like the Commander we have right now.
(Also side note, any Green PW deck that is also not part Black and White has very little ways to actually find a Doubling Season, this probably is largely irrelevant but people sure are talking about a Doubling Season as a card that will appear a lot from decks with no real way to make sure of that)
Mono green is not something I see a lot of, but maybe I'm in the minority there. The color has some serious issues that make it difficult to build particularly strong decks - and the ones that are actually powerful are fairly narrow (e.g. Yisan, Selvala). To be fair most mono colors suffer from similar issues.
The point being that if there was a UG or WG commander that say, removed artifacts/enchantments, it would be more of a concern for me in a similar way that Dack Fayden is more of a concern than Freyalise.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Papa funk has said that in order to legalize all planeswalkers they would have to ban doubling bbc season in addition to whichever other PWs they saw fit.
I don't know the full reason for this belief, I can think of two. First, is that both DS and walkers are popular splashy EDH cards. If we go by the public statements of the RC, in order to accommodate this change you would have to ban a bu ch of cards. My opinion is that if a change starts with swinging a ban hammer then maybe the change isn't a good idea. You're free to disagree. The second reason is that DS is a niche expensive card, and if it wasn't banned then it is not unreasonable to expect it to double in price at the minimum. Based on recent comments from them, I believe that the RC pays more attention to the secondary market than they let on, in that they don't want to give the appearance of profiting from their actions. It isnt unreasonable to wonder if this could be a factor as well, beyond just how the card plays in games.
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
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All things being equal there is a difference between having a card in your deck and having it in the command zone.
Again, not saying that's disqualifying, it's just a thing that must be considered.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
I don't agree with the first reasoning because I really don't see what kinda bans would have to happen that would be radically different from the game we have now. The second point is something I was thinking about because a change like this would probably quadruple DS's price at this point and send some Walkers up up up as well.
I wonder about the we don't want to influence the secondary market, making a statement like that at all seems like it would have a real chilling effect on both the ban list both ways and the ability for the game to evolve not sure I like it.
If someone wanted to ultimate Planeswalkers, they'd just build Superfriends right now and it would almost certainly be better than having one of these PW's as their general. This idea that having PWs as generals would instantly make Doubling Season too strong is just outright absurd to me. And without any reasoning or context, that statement is meaningless. To be fair, papa_funk also said T&N was weaker in EDH than other formats; I question his judgement sometimes. And if they're letting financial considerations affect their banning decisions, I don't even know what we're doing anymore. That shouldn't matter in the slightest.
It feels like a big red herring of this argument
That's a pretty broad paraphrase. The actual quote (from http://www.starcitygames.com/article/36937_Ask-The-Commander-Rules-Committee-Other-Than-Me.html) was "We probably end up having to ban Doubling Season." as one of four reasons we aren't interested in planeswalker Commanders. That's quite possible, since Doubling Season is already pretty borderline, and this would be a pretty big bump.
I suspect that's a pretty significant paraphrase too.
May I ask what the other 3 reasons are, broadly? Purely out of interest in discussing the issue. I'm against anyway, but it would be interesting to hear a little more as to why the issue stands where it is at present. I'm sure those on the other side of the debate would agree.
It does gross things for a minimal cost, it enables a ton of combo, and it warps games and metas. Adding walkers into the mix, I can absolutely see how it would be banworthy. Even if there's a finite number of walkers it allows immediate ultimate for, there's a lot it makes significantly stronger, and it becomes a ubiquitous chase card for every walker deck running green.
You're right! If you remove the very narrow context, use of the word "slightly", and no actual statement that it's weaker in Commander than regular Magic, it's a direct quote. You got me.
I linked to the article that has the answer in it. Just search for planeswalker.
Yes, it does nothing right when it enters the battlefield, but 5 mana is nothing to EDH players (especially those already playing Green) and if it survives long enough for even *1* of the walkers that are being discussed as problematic, then it did its job. I mean, maybe there is a little too much fear over the card in the context of planeswalker commanders, and maybe it wouldn't be as problematic in the long run. But, I don't see how any green deck with a walker commander doesn't run this card. And then, since they are running it, why not run more walkers to get more advantage from it? And why not run as much as possible to protect everything? Or ways to get it out sooner? And that is on top of everything else it already does which means it is has the possibility of becoming a legitimate problem with Planeswalker Commanders.
In any case, we have plenty of options for generals now, and it seems that there are very few Planeswalkers that add anything new regarding what could be built around or cool new strategies.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.